Do I have to do LESS damage?

[SirAggravator]

I used to run around jumping and kiting with firewall but recently I just stopped and blocked because of the crit bug in
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=295272&

If your firewall is hot enough and you get crits then most stuff generally dies quickly anyway

[dunklezhan]

I could be wrong here - but I've seen a lot of advice to web and FW so I have my own question. I thought fire spells burned webs away (including your own)?

[donfilibuster]

Indeed, just as one would yell 'shamans first', the monsters will try to kill your caster.
The threat is so big they would rather run trough the firewall than risk walking around it exposing their asses.
Or that's the expected part

The other part is where you kite, block or cc them and otherwise stay alive while the melees finish them out.
The melees might very well be part of the problem if they can't help kill the monsters caught in the fires.
One thing is sure, con isn't a dump stat.

[Cartheron]

Well, I agree with most of advices here, to sum it up:

1. drop aggro reducing enchantments

2. swap 1 3rd lev spell to displacement

3. get some self healing

4. never take off your heavy fort item

5. get some dr - robe of invulnerability, bloodrage symbiont, whatever

6. grab some nice +5 tower shield

7. when you decide to throw a fw, accept the fact that aggro and kills are yours. If melees want to kill something, they may use intimidate if they want.

8. Decide if it is worth to cast fw, or just nuke the trash with insta aoe spells (or just pike and let melees have some fun)

9. Displacement and jump are your best friends, learn to lee them

10. you can place web next to fw (not on top of eachother) and catch mobs inside web and burn them.

11. Red named, orange named, Amrath - everything not purple named is usually better off agroed on a caster than on anyone else - great means of damage mitigation, usually good or great self healing and (hopefully) high hp lets you deal with aggro better than anyone, excluding really good AC tanks.

[transtemporal]

OK, so how do I contain the critters in such a way that the melees can actually hit them? Paralyzers and stuns work like a charm, but I don't see many players in pugs with those.

Drop a heightened Web on them, pop an ice storm on it and throw as many ball lightnings and cones of cold as you can into them. (These spells don't destroy a web so blast away)

Red-names aren't affected by it so you can have your melees drag all the trash through your web, then draw the boss away to fight separately.

[transtemporal]

I could be wrong here - but I've seen a lot of advice to web and FW so I have my own question. I thought fire spells burned webs away (including your own)?

No, if you position it right, you can firewall without destroying the web. If you're sketchy about it, just use icestorm instead.

[PopeJual]

No, if you position it right, you can firewall without destroying the web. If you're sketchy about it, just use icestorm instead.

I've also noticed that casting Wall of Fire on a Web will destroy the Web, but that casting a Web on a Wall of Fire doesn't seem to hurt the Web at all.

Similarly, casting fire spells at a Grease spot ignites the Grease, but casting Grease on a Wall of Fire doesn't ignite the Grease at all.


I haven't done extensive testing to confirm all the ways in which those spells interact, but I figure I probably will do so eventually.

[Cam_Neely]

In many situations, FW is the best CC in the game.

Learn it, know it, embrace it!


Burn baby

[Sholia]

I know the conversation has already moved on but I'm still not convinced that Blur and Displacement aren't rolled separately. No, they don't stack, so their bonuses don't add to 70%, but I'm sure that I've seen Blur procs while I've been displaced, which can only happen if it is checked after the Displacement fails. If it was only checking on the most powerful, I would never see a Blur proc while displaced since it is the weaker of the two and would be superseded by the other.

I know I've read that if one doesn't activate, the other might, but now I'm going to have to test it to make sure I actually am seeing those Blurs popping up when Displacement is active. Is there any other reason why both would be activating while they are up together, if not because they are being rolled separately?

[SimCat]

Too many pages to read all through all of it. I did browse though.

I make sure I'm running with a full compliment of buffs and if you're a fleshbag you might want to scroll/wand/pot heal yourself as you're kiting cuz you're gonna get hit. If you're a WF you can easily heal thyself whilst kiting.

I tend to jump back and forth and make the mobs stay in the FW as much as possible. OR I Shield block and keep the mobs in the FW until they expire in a most grisly manner. Once you get the proper gear this is even a better way to do it. With my torc and con opp item I rarely kite unless it's a big boss anymore and I just weapon block.

If you're gonna grab aggro you could make sure your wearing some guards so if you do get hit at least you're killin them quicker.

If I have a good enough area I tend to kite while running backwards and jump casting additional spells if needed. ?But I also try to make sure I kite the mobs back into melee. Runnin with an intim melee is always helpful in this fashion.

[transtemporal]

I've also noticed that casting Wall of Fire on a Web will destroy the Web, but that casting a Web on a Wall of Fire doesn't seem to hurt the Web at all.

Similarly, casting fire spells at a Grease spot ignites the Grease, but casting Grease on a Wall of Fire doesn't ignite the Grease at all.

Yeah, the spells interact in weird ways. I usually like to throw the web down first so I can catch them in it before I cook em. I take less damage that way.

[sephiroth1084]

If you're having a big problem, there are a few solutions:
-Change to crowd control over nuking/firewalling.
-Learn to deal with the aggro effectively either by kiting or shield blocking.
-Group with better melees.

In any case, I'd drop the Subtle Spellcasting line.

[Four20]

I have never had an issue with web and firewall. . .and I used this tactic even at lvl 20 today.

I can do either way. Cast a Web, and put a FW on top of it. Or cast a FW and put a Web in it. Either way it doesn't burn the web away.

However, a Fireball, will 'blow away' or 'burn up' a web. . .even one cast by your teammate. The same thing happens with flamestrike(the big nuke type spell that can burn up grease?) and web. it will just burn it up.

But again, NEVER had an issue with web and firewall specifically(even in conjunction with a teammates' web/firewall)

[mystafyi]

I used to run around jumping and kiting with firewall but recently I just stopped and blocked because of the crit bug in
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=295272&

^^^ This, This, 1000 times This ^^^ Thankfully a dev commented on it so it might be fixed within 6 months

[sephiroth1084]

I have never had an issue with web and firewall. . .and I used this tactic even at lvl 20 today.

I can do either way. Cast a Web, and put a FW on top of it. Or cast a FW and put a Web in it. Either way it doesn't burn the web away.

However, a Fireball, will 'blow away' or 'burn up' a web. . .even one cast by your teammate. The same thing happens with flamestrike(the big nuke type spell that can burn up grease?) and web. it will just burn it up.

But again, NEVER had an issue with web and firewall specifically(even in conjunction with a teammates' web/firewall)

This is kind of new. For a long time firewall would burn away Web unless you placed them just right. You couldn't place a firewall right on top of a Web previously. I don't know when this changed, but it's always felt kind of cheesy, and I still find myself placing the two the way I used to most of the time anyway.

[Postumus]

If you're having a big problem, there are a few solutions:
-Change to crowd control over nuking/firewalling.
-Learn to deal with the aggro effectively either by kiting or shield blocking.
-Group with better melees.

In any case, I'd drop the Subtle Spellcasting line.

I dropped the subtle spellcasting altogether.


I'm getting better at kiting, the jump/blur/stoneskin combo helps immeasurably, now that I'm 13th level, I'm going to swap out prot from element for displacement.


It makes combat a lot easier for me to expect to get the aggro and learn how to control it rather than hoping the melees can grab it and maintain it. Obviously it's situational, but having the confidence to just take the aggro and ride it out when the melees can't do enough damage has improved my survivability and success rate immensely.


I also don't just rely on firewall. With acid blast, chain lightning, and cone of cold I can burn 'em and nuke 'em dead.


I obtained a shield of reflection, and when my SPs get low, or I know I'm going to take multiple hits in an enclosed area, I equip it with the wand of blasting (or fireballs or whatever I have atm) and sit in the firewall shield blocking and blasting. That shield has saved my skin many times over now - if nothing else, by buying me the time to drink some heal pots if running with a overwhelmed, clueless, or dead cleric.


I can't thank all of you enough for the great advice. It has made playing this class so much more fun!