Comparisons are Odious

[Rubiconn]

This will date me but back in high school my latin teacher(yes I went to a high school in the 80's where latin was taught) would tell us all the time that comparisons are odious(hateful).
I have been reading several different forums, mostly things that look interesting or play a factor in my char development but I have noticed that a lot of people want to know what does more damage, casters or melee, what is the best build,who is the worst healer. I understand the need for people to measure themselves against their peers but truth be told I never discuss the specifics of my charachters because I dont follow any build plan. A lot of veteran players will say "That will gimp your toon, or you are missing out on doing something really cool". If I am happy with my toon development and I play it to the best of my abilities and most of all if Im having fun isnt that the important thing. Actually let me correct that... its the only thing, this is a game people its supposed to be fun, investing so much time and effort into comparing yourself to others is ridiculous. I will be the first to admit I dont always know what I am doing but I hope for any of those folks on Khyber that I have run with the one thing they can say is I dont take it too seriously and they enjoyed having me in their group/guilds. I have become familiar with a lot of great people in this game and I thank each and every one of them for all the help and fun I have had over the last couple of years.
Just needed to get that off my chest I hope there are others who feel this way and if you are trolling around on Khyber and you find me posting a group or looking to join yours I wont be the most tricked out buffed up build on the planet but I will make the best of it and be a good party member.


Toons are Xirth (18 wf wiz), Xirthtrix (9 human fighter), Xirthax (5 drow paly TR)

[Lorien_the_First_One]

This will date me but back in high school my latin teacher(yes I went to a high school in the 80's where latin was taught) would tell us all the time that comparisons are odious(hateful).

I'm afraid your latin teacher wasn't very bright. Some comparisions are critical to reasoned thinking and good decision making.

Maybe thats why they had as their profession the teaching of a dying language.

[r3dl4nce]

If you want have fun and all the party you're in want to have fun in high level or epic quests, your character need to be good. Some characters are easy to make good (sorcerer, full healing cleric and so on...) some others it's better to create a build to plan how to gain every bit of advantage. But you can have fun not doing all the harder quests of the game, no problem, it's your game style

[Rubiconn]

First my latin teacher spoke 8 languages and she was a nun, and latin is not a dead language, it may not be spoken but it is the basis for all the romance languages(spanish,italian, portugese,french and romanian). but that is besides the point.

The point wasnt that all comparisons are bad I agree that comparisons are required for reason thinking but comparing yourself to others is odious. You only have to measure up to yourself and what you believe is best.
There are plenty of people who echo the same statement, the best build in bad hands makes a bad toon, an average build in the hands of a person who can play makes it much better. I would rather have a party full of competent players who know how to play and can work together vs a couple of the best builds run by people who read a forum and think they know what they are doing. The best way to learn anything is doing not reading about other people doing.

And I didnt mean to imply that I didnt plan my build I have a plan but I have things I want to do with my toons and I would rather have the enjoyment of creating something myself vs copying what someone else did. I did a lot of research and looked at different build before TRing my paly, but the best information I got was from playing and talking to other players in game, not necessarily reading the forum.

That was all my point was.
I guess I was a little tired of listening to a lvl 5 fighter grocery listing all his gear and telling my how great his toon was, if I ask go ahead and tell me but to spend 10 min in proof is in the poison telling the party what great stuff you have its time to take a break and visit reality.

[Missing_Minds]

Per contra, scientia est potentia.

[Kadran]

This is ridiculous. I can't decide if I should share how narrow minded the OP is, or if I should just grab the popcorn and wait for the regulars to do it. Popcorn it is. :-)

[Rubiconn]

What makes you say Im narrow minded?
Im allowed an opinion but if it doesnt fit into your view of the world it makes me narrow minded!

[stainer]

The real question is: Colby Jack or Cheddar cheese - which is better? Don't come in here with Velveeta either. That is not a real cheese.

[Missing_Minds]

The real question is: Colby Jack or Cheddar cheese - which is better? Don't come in here with Velveeta either. That is not a real cheese.

Depends on your mood. If you want something soft and mellow, Colby.
If you are in the mood for some stand up flavor, sharp cheddar.

[Kadran]

Ok, looks like I dragged myself into this arguement, and I was just looking forward to the popcorn. :-)

First, allow me to point out that it sounds like you have a major crush on your latin teacher.

Now that's cleared up, lets get to the point. You cannot make statements like, "all comparisons are bad" and expect me not to call you narrow minded. If you've read any of my posts, I like to think I have an ability to look at both sides of an arguement and make an unbiased, informed decision.

I understand your wanting to enjoy the game, that's why we're all here afterall. People achieve this many different ways: perma-death, raiding, PuG, guilds, etc. You just happen to choose "gimping my toons." Now, let me take this one step further. I FULLY understand your desire to play unique builds that you created yourself. I, myself, have never rolled a character build I didn't plan myself (that's not to say I didn't get inspiration from forums and friends but they are not carbon copies.) That being said, I plan them all. Start to finish. Skills, Stats, Feats, HP, Saves, the whole 9 yards. It's crucial to understand your builds strengths and weaknesses; a build plan can help you understand before you decide to take the controls. I would not want to know about a player in my party that didn't have a build plan. It makes my brain hurt...

So I do see both sides of your arguement. I just feel that you're "all comparisons are bad" mantra (that you stole from your latin teacher because of sentance #2) is horribly narrow minded. I feel that it is YOU, sir (or maddam), who is not making the effort to see both sides to this confrontation. To you I say, "Good day!"


Cool sort-of relatable side story: I was in a guild once called Getting Into Multiclass Project, or GIMP. Your character was literally random. You rolled, in front of others, your race and classES. Every character HAD to have 3 classes, and once those 3 were determined, you then had to roll randomly EVERY level to determine what you would take. It made planning your character nearly impossible, and you had to rely mostly on player skill over character abilities. It was a blast, and I recommend it to anyone, but there were not many in the guild and I quickly got tired of soloing with a sub-par character (as you could only group with other guild members.)

[Bufo_Alvarius]

Now that's cleared up, lets get to the point. You cannot make statements like, "all comparisons are bad" and expect me not to call you narrow minded. If you've read any of my posts, I like to think I have an ability to look at both sides of an arguement and make an unbiased, informed decision.

The point wasnt that all comparisons are bad I agree that comparisons are required for reason thinking but comparing yourself to others is odious. You only have to measure up to yourself and what you believe is best.

Can i call you illiterate Kadran?

[stainer]

Can i call you illiterate Kadran?

You may have pointed out a fallacy in the argument.

[Rubiconn]

Its looks to me that you read something into my post that was not there. Please cut and paste where in my post it stated that "All" comparisons are bad. I didnt say that I even followed it up with a clarification that was not my intention.
So your supposition is that if you have respect for someone who made an impression on you that constitutes a crush. Then so be it I have a crush on my former latin teacher.

If you read further I clarified that I do plan my builds but you obviously picked a couple of things out of the original post and cant get past it.

I can see both sides of the issue I was just posting an impression, opinion, view whatever you want to call it. You have decided to become the crusader and decide who is right and wrong and who is open minded and narrow minded. You must think mighty big of yourself to believe that you are the end all be all of information and opinion in this game. To you I say "Good Day"

And as far as cheese goes Baby swiss, gouda, ementaler(sp)

[Chai]

Its not comparisons that are odious.

Its the min maxing + absolutism combination that sucks. Min maxing by itself is fine because people like to have strong characters, but when people run around talking like there is one formula for success and everything else is gimped, this type of absolutism is laughable.

Then they try to act like you dont understand how the mechanics of building work because you didnt make a specific choice **cough khopesh cough, and then you gotta go all Homer Simpson on their sorry selves.

"Just because I dont caaaare, doesnt mean I dont understaaaaaand!"

[Rubiconn]

Thank you Chai for stating it this way I was trying to make a similar point. That really was the aim of my original post is the feeling I get from other players and the sense from some of the forum posts that if you dont build a toon just like is laid out by others that there is going to be something wrong with it.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

The point wasnt that all comparisons are bad I agree that comparisons are required for reason thinking but comparing yourself to others is odious. You only have to measure up to yourself and what you believe is best.

Sorry, that's not true in real life. If you are charged with murder, do you want the best lawyer, or the one who believes they are best they can be? Do you think employers want the best employees relative to other candidates, or just the person who gosh darn it is happy with how good they are?

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Its looks to me that you read something into my post that was not there. Please cut and paste where in my post it stated that "All" comparisons are bad. I didnt say that I even followed it up with a clarification that was not my intention.

Here you go...

This will date me but back in high school my latin teacher(yes I went to a high school in the 80's where latin was taught) would tell us all the time that comparisons are odious(hateful).

See... no limiting clauses. You are clearly at least inferring that all comparisions are hateful. If that wasn't what you were inferring then you OP makes even less sense.

[Rubiconn]

You are correct there were no limiting statements but there were also no statements of degree i.e. all comparisons are odious. Perhaps I should have colored the picture in with more context from my school days but I was quoting something a person said 25+ years ago. Sorry if I didnt make it totally clear to people who are so intelligent to completely look at all sides of an argument, and the fact that I was posting this in a DDO forum would probably limit the context of the discussion to DDO not murder charges or getting a job.(Wow talk about reading too much into a post)

Its time to take a break and go out and enjoy the sunshine.

[Missing_Minds]

the person who gosh darn it is happy with how good they are?

These people seem to be the ones most often hired.

Regardless, I'm off to see if I can't figure out this.. "ementaler" cheese the op mentioned. I don't recognize it.

[stainer]

Sorry, that's not true in real life. If you are charged with murder, do you want the best lawyer, or the one who believes they are best they can be? Do you think employers want the best employees relative to other candidates, or just the person who gosh darn it is happy with how good they are?

These people seem to be the ones most often hired.

Regardless, I'm off to see if I can't figure out this.. "ementaler" cheese the op mentioned. I don't recognize it.

Happy cows make good cheese!

There. This thread has been neatly tied up.