[Suggestion needed] Cleric 17/Monk 3 Hin

[mjalkar87ita]

Hi there guys, i'm pretty new to the game and this is my first thread on the boards, so hi !

Let's start saying that actually i'm at work so I don't have the Char Planner. I will try to write some infos about what I would like to build with my toon.

I play this game let's say 3-4 hours max everyday, always grouped with my GF (Finesse Monk). I would like to build a Cleric 17/Monk 3 but I can't seem to decide if He's gonna be an Offensive caster with evasion (So i would revert 18/2 for spell penetration issues) or a finesse-kind melee healer with emp. heal for Haling Ki 1.

As we duo 99% of the times i'm starting with something hybrd that would change at CAP with a LR or a feat swap.

ATM i'm level 3 Halfling cleric with those starting stats

STR 12
dex 16
con 14
wis 17
int 9
cha 8

level up : WIS

Feats :
1) Extend
3) TWF

Now I'm about to DING level 4 and take first level as a monk and I was thinking about W. Finesse.

So let's say :

1- Extend
3- TWF
4 (Monk) W.finesse

From now on i'm completely lost. First thing first, now that I am cleric 3 should I take 3 Monk levels being 3/3 at Char level 6 and gimping/slowing my spellcasting ? Or It should be wiser to take level 4 monk then wait for BB / HEAL and only then take other 2 monk levels ?

Also, Should take melee-like route with (not in order and considering a +1 DEX tome)

- Extend
- TWF
- W.finesse
- ITWF
- GTWF (for increased ki generation)
- Emp. Heal (I heard that works with Healing ki)
- Quicken
- Maximize
- Toughness

Would this setup be useful to something other than breaking crates ?

Or should i take a more spellcasting route, removing 1 monk level for :

- Extend
- TWF (Swap - > Ment. Toughness or Spell focus Or Heighten)
- W.Finesse (Swap - > Imp. Ment. Toughness , as above )
- Empower
- Quicken
- Maximize
- Spell Penetration
- Gr. Spell penetration
- Toughness

Thank you for your time / help .. and sorry for my "noob"ness but that's like my first build ever ^^" ..

[JollySwagMan]

Hello there!

Monk finishers and multiclassing/metamagics are an odd one. Empower Healing (or any other metamagic feat) does *not* appear to affect Healing Ki, however your Life Magic enhancements,and item-based spell boosting items will help. Of particular note are Superior Ardour potions - extensive testing with Healing amplification builds has revealed that Superior Ardour I potions actually give 75% boost instead of 50%.

Note that Healing Ki and fire finisher count character level instead of Monk level (in spite of description).

As to taking a Monk or Cleric level for level 4 - I would lean towards having the Monk level, but you might not need Finesse yet. Toughness, or Power Attack (with a +1 str tome, or level up point) may help more, as you should have plenty of to-hit bonus available for the enemies you are facing.

As to the second level of Monk - it is a question of whether Evasion is worth having to invest in scrolls pretty early on. If you know the quests then you can probably make it through any traps you might find up to level 12. However if playing with random groups odds are you will need Evasion sooner.

If mostly duo-ing with your GF then you need not worry about a 3rd level of Monk (at least put off such a choice until after Cleric 11) as you can rely on her to bust out the light buffs .

If you are ultimately planning 3 Monk, I *really* recommend putting a point into Str from somewhere, because Power Attack will help make sure you are getting Ki from your hits. Stunning Fist might also be worth considering, though eventually it becomes ineffective.

Unfortunately specializing for Spell-Penetration on a Cleric-Monk can be difficult - not just due to the level gap, but because the items most commonly imbued with Spell Penetration (sceptres, daggers etc.) would break your monk stance. You can use a quarterstaff, but would have to be constantly switching between your spellcasting weapon and melee weapon. Spell Penetration Kamas do happpen, but spellcasting Kamas are relatively rare (in my experience). Shattermantle Monk weapons are more common - combine one of those with a Cursespewing kama and you can rock out some un-Heightened Soundbursts...

So on your spellcasting path I would consider swapping Spell Penetration feats (or the TWF/Finesse feats) for double focus in Evocation, or one of the Spellpoint feats and Heighten.

On your melee path, I would drop Extend for Power Attack.

[mjalkar87ita]

Hello there!

Monk finishers and multiclassing/metamagics are an odd one. Empower Healing (or any other metamagic feat) does *not* appear to affect Healing Ki, however your Life Magic enhancements,and item-based spell boosting items will help. Of particular note are Superior Ardour potions - extensive testing with Healing amplification builds has revealed that Superior Ardour I potions actually give 75% boost instead of 50%.

Note that Healing Ki and fire finisher count character level instead of Monk level (in spite of description).

As to taking a Monk or Cleric level for level 4 - I would lean towards having the Monk level, but you might not need Finesse yet. Toughness, or Power Attack (with a +1 str tome, or level up point) may help more, as you should have plenty of to-hit bonus available for the enemies you are facing.

As to the second level of Monk - it is a question of whether Evasion is worth having to invest in scrolls pretty early on. If you know the quests then you can probably make it through any traps you might find up to level 12. However if playing with random groups odds are you will need Evasion sooner.

If mostly duo-ing with your GF then you need not worry about a 3rd level of Monk (at least put off such a choice until after Cleric 11) as you can rely on her to bust out the light buffs .

If you are ultimately planning 3 Monk, I *really* recommend putting a point into Str from somewhere, because Power Attack will help make sure you are getting Ki from your hits. Stunning Fist might also be worth considering, though eventually it becomes ineffective.

Unfortunately specializing for Spell-Penetration on a Cleric-Monk can be difficult - not just due to the level gap, but because the items most commonly imbued with Spell Penetration (sceptres, daggers etc.) would break your monk stance. You can use a quarterstaff, but would have to be constantly switching between your spellcasting weapon and melee weapon. Spell Penetration Kamas do happpen, but spellcasting Kamas are relatively rare (in my experience). Shattermantle Monk weapons are more common - combine one of those with a Cursespewing kama and you can rock out some un-Heightened Soundbursts...

So on your spellcasting path I would consider swapping Spell Penetration feats (or the TWF/Finesse feats) for double focus in Evocation, or one of the Spellpoint feats and Heighten.

On your melee path, I would drop Extend for Power Attack.

Hi there and thanks for your replies . Finally I've made my mind and took weapon finesse on 4th level monk, with some stance-dancing (Fire/Water) and with guile/cunning Enhancement i can make up for my lack of str for "helping" in tough situation (Walk the butcher path on elite was duo-ed thanks to soundburst + free sneak attack on the nasty shaman while she was kick some serious asses to everyone) . I do realize, however, that this situation will not last long and eventually I will face enemy that will treat my punches/kama as cute tickles. And here kicks-in my doubts about 3 level Monk, however being able to costantly Align the Heaven me for the 25% reduced SP is really teasing me towards that choice. Taked for granted that from now on i will continue level up cleric portion of my build until at least char level 10 for evasion (or maybe wait 'till BB & Heal) .

If i shall continue walking the melee path (3/17) :

power attack
thf
ithf
gtwf
toughness
finesse
emp. heal (or maybe empower spell?)
maximize
quicken

Would this setup grant me some kind of utility ? (I'm not looking at DPS here) Ki building for AtH - Healing Ki - occasion Bladebarrier / CrowdControl and Heals

Or Should be better for me staying 2/18 and swapping power attack for Mental Toughnees - Twf for Evocation focus ?

Or should I "fuse" both of those settings with something like 3/18 , removing ITHF / GTHF for ment. toughness or some other casting feat?

Thanks kindly for your reply ^^

[JollySwagMan]

In my previous post I neglected to mention how much fun I'm having on my current halfling Clonk, who operates mostly by Soundburst/Holy Smite making groups of enemies vulnerable to sneak attack. Currently at level 9 with the second Monk level taken early after grouping a trap-hungry barbarian. My experience with this one has made me eager to finally make my rogue-splashed Clonk, if only for the sneak attack damage and some UMD - I don't like using tomes on my characters.

If taking Maximise, I would recommend Empower Heal instead of Empower spell - Empower Heal works on the Heal spell, while other metamagics do not.

On a more caster-oriented Clonk I have taken 3 levels of Monk to see how it worked for maxed/quickened/extended Blade Barriers - and was very pleased. However that guy has Lightning Reflexes instead of Power Attack as I was mostly concerned with being trap-proof for content that I had not encountered before. Instead of Power Attack I relied upon party members to stun/paralyse stuff for my Ki generation.

On my current Clonk I plan on taking the full TWF line, I cannot say whether it is a better investment than spellcasting feats though.

I think you mentioned that this is your first Cleric-Monk combo? If so I think spellcasting is a safer bet than enhancing your melee capabilities, because playing a combat-first Clonk involves a *lot* of twitchy hotbar use. I think the combat-oriented one is a little more fun (I like hitting a whole bunch of hotkeys!), but don't think I could make it work without having tried out a lot of builds and establishing an effective casting style that complements the Monk splash

What does this boil down to? I am recommending that you keep it 18/2, drop the ITWF and GTWF feats for spellcasting ones, or possibly TWF and Power attack as well for the spell point feats. I don't like advising someone to pick up spellpoint feats (at high levels you can get gear that regenerates your SP when attacked, thus making the Create Undead spell useful for something other than padding your kill count). But if you are testing out a build it can help. Alternately you can consider a Dwarf, as they have an enhancement line that grants extra SP in addition to the Cleric one. But then your Reflex save wouldn't be quite so obscene

Hopefully all that didn't contradict itself too much - whichever path you choose, playtesting a Clonk is too much fun to pass up

[mjalkar87ita]

In my previous post I neglected to mention how much fun I'm having on my current halfling Clonk, who operates mostly by Soundburst/Holy Smite making groups of enemies vulnerable to sneak attack. Currently at level 9 with the second Monk level taken early after grouping a trap-hungry barbarian. My experience with this one has made me eager to finally make my rogue-splashed Clonk, if only for the sneak attack damage and some UMD - I don't like using tomes on my characters.

If taking Maximise, I would recommend Empower Heal instead of Empower spell - Empower Heal works on the Heal spell, while other metamagics do not.

On a more caster-oriented Clonk I have taken 3 levels of Monk to see how it worked for maxed/quickened/extended Blade Barriers - and was very pleased. However that guy has Lightning Reflexes instead of Power Attack as I was mostly concerned with being trap-proof for content that I had not encountered before. Instead of Power Attack I relied upon party members to stun/paralyse stuff for my Ki generation.

On my current Clonk I plan on taking the full TWF line, I cannot say whether it is a better investment than spellcasting feats though.

I think you mentioned that this is your first Cleric-Monk combo? If so I think spellcasting is a safer bet than enhancing your melee capabilities, because playing a combat-first Clonk involves a *lot* of twitchy hotbar use. I think the combat-oriented one is a little more fun (I like hitting a whole bunch of hotkeys!), but don't think I could make it work without having tried out a lot of builds and establishing an effective casting style that complements the Monk splash

What does this boil down to? I am recommending that you keep it 18/2, drop the ITWF and GTWF feats for spellcasting ones, or possibly TWF and Power attack as well for the spell point feats. I don't like advising someone to pick up spellpoint feats (at high levels you can get gear that regenerates your SP when attacked, thus making the Create Undead spell useful for something other than padding your kill count). But if you are testing out a build it can help. Alternately you can consider a Dwarf, as they have an enhancement line that grants extra SP in addition to the Cleric one. But then your Reflex save wouldn't be quite so obscene

Hopefully all that didn't contradict itself too much - whichever path you choose, playtesting a Clonk is too much fun to pass up

I've found a lvl 4 dragonshard so I tried to swap extend for power attack with a +1 STR tome and I can already feel the improvement in the gameplay. I was sp-starved (300 sp with wiz I at lvl 4) so extended resist energy would have drained my sp by half just for buffing me and my gf monk. Stance dancing i can now sit at 16 str 18 dex 18 wis with fire and 14 18 22 with water and i'm able to soundburst / melee quite easily. I suspect that I will carry the melee build until CAP and then I'll consider LR (if I'm correct with a +1 wood heart I can swap 3 monk for 1 additional cleric level and revert to 2/18).

I'm leaning towards melee for now becuase of the fun style and I love hotbar-ing everything lol. So thank you for your time and I'll let you know how I'm going with my test ^^ I'll go for emp. heal at lvl 6 then max 9 quick 12 and then I'll consider investing more levels in monk for Evasion & Aligning the Heaven.