TR wizard - wizard

[BuyerSeller]

Would I gain anything besides 34 point build from doing a True reincarnate on my wizard into a wizard? right now he is only L14 and 28 point build, I also have 32 point build now and I was thinking of re-rolling him, but I might just wait to reincarnate him instead if it is worth it.

[issiana]

you'll gain a passive past life feat that grants +2 to spell penetration, that imo is huge.

[Crazyfruit]

Mine went wizard wizard. The extra DC to wands was surprisingly useful as well (low-mid levels)

And of course you can take the awesome Past Life: Arcane Initiate feat, which gives you a bunch of free magic missiles & +1 dc to all spells

[BuyerSeller]

But to take these new feats would I have to give up other feats on my wizard? or are these past life feats free? or what?

I was also thinking of doing a multi-class when I reincarnate and do maybe a Warforged 2 rogue/18 wiz - any thoughts?

[ddoer]

Think in this way, with one wiz past life, you get +2 in spell penetration and you could skip greater spell penetration and free one feat slot.

The purchasable wiz past life is a must if you have the option to buy it. It's just like getting spell focus feat on every school, say, assume only evocation, necromancy, enchantment and conjuration are useful, it is 4 feats. Or you could imagine it is a feat that give you +2 Int.

Both the passive and purchasable feats are uber.

[sephiroth1084]

But to take these new feats would I have to give up other feats on my wizard? or are these past life feats free? or what?

I was also thinking of doing a multi-class when I reincarnate and do maybe a Warforged 2 rogue/18 wiz - any thoughts?

TRing into the multiclass would actually be pretty solid, as you could make up for your -2 spell penetration from losing wizard levels with the passive past life ability, and could sort of make up for losing the capstone by taking the Past Life feat.

Whether you do that, or go pure is up to you. Personally, I am TRing my wizard into another pure wizard, ditching Greater Spell Pen., picking up Toughness, some more Con, and the Wizard Past Life feat for a max DC caster.

Meanwhile, I am also leveling an 18/2 WF Wiz/Rog (currently lvl 13). Whether I TR this guy will depend upon how much of a grind I find TRing to be.

[BuyerSeller]

Well, I just tested it with my vet status and 32 P build and I started with 2 levels of rogue first and then 2 levels of wizard. I am very disappointed that once I start going wizard with 18 int I only get 6 skill points and training in rogue skills still counts cross training so it takes more. All those nice rogue skills across the board and only a few can be trained now. This is making me re-think the entire process now /cry

[sephiroth1084]

Well, I just tested it with my vet status and 32 P build and I started with 2 levels of rogue first and then 2 levels of wizard. I am very disappointed that once I start going wizard with 18 int I only get 6 skill points and training in rogue skills still counts cross training so it takes more. All those nice rogue skills across the board and only a few can be trained now. This is making me re-think the entire process now /cry

The key to doing this is to take rogue at 1, and then take your second rogue level further on (preferably after level 7, so you can get the most out of a +2 Int tome and 2 level-ups into Int). How late you take it depends on your playstyle and preference. Some folks put it off for a long time, gaining evasion just for end game stuff, but I liked the idea of taking it earlier, and ended up grabbing it after acquiring firewall.

Also, half ranks in Search, Disable, Open Lock, Hide and Move Silently on your wizard levels will yield excellent results due to your exceptionally high Int. For reference's sake, I just ran Maze of Madness and Foundation of Discord on elite on my WF Wiz 11/Rog 2, and managed to get the traps with just a few buffs and +7 Search/Disable goggles (except the lightning trap in Foundation, which I blew--wouldn't have if I hadn't been a putz and forgotten to go grab +13 goggles).

Use the rogue level later to boost any skills that are lagging behind.

[BuyerSeller]

Yes, I obviously did it incorrectly starting with 2 levels of rogue. I will start 1 rogue then level until level 7 spells and then go 1 more rogue after that and then the rest wizard! I understand now about waiting, plus getting more Int with levels and tomes.

[sephiroth1084]

Yes, I obviously did it incorrectly starting with 2 levels of rogue. I will start 1 rogue then level until level 7 spells and then go 1 more rogue after that and then the rest wizard! I understand now about waiting, plus getting more Int with levels and tomes.

Yeah. I made the same mistake with another character. You can take the second rogue level earlier or later--it's really a matter of preference. I had initially intended to take it after I got second level spells, but felt that I wasn't strong enough to contribute meaningfully yet, and was going to wait until I go Haste and Fireball, but still felt like I was spending too much time in quests with nothing to do.

Firewall is kind of the watershed point for casters, as it is so tremendously mana-efficient! It's the first (and really only) spell that really allows you to contribute in every encounter and really feel like you're doing something. That's my feeling anyway.

Different people enjoy different aspects of being a caster. I know some people who have done this combo and taken the rogue levels immediately, others who took rogue 2 at various levels from 5 to 20.

Like I said, though, my feeling is that FW represents the point at which you really come into your own power-wise, and waiting longer is just less time spent evading stuff! Still, if you're doing the rogue-skills thing, it's tough waiting until after things like the fire trap room in STK for Evasion.

I say, choose a point at which you want to take it before you start, but then see how you feel while you're leveling. If you feel like you're really contributing meaningfully from a caster standpoint, but getting frustrated with traps (or dying to AoE spells), maybe you wanna take it earlier. If you feel that you really want Cone of Cold NOW (or any other spell) and that you haven't encountered many situations where you need evasion, you can put it off.

Also, though this didn't come up, make sure you take at least a 14 Con! Higher if possible. No matter what, you're still going to be a weakling caster with mostly d4 hit dice, and you need as much HP as you can possibly get! Also, I'd recommend acquiring Insightful Reflexes by the time (or at the time) that you acquire Evasion. Evasion without IR is kind of pointless. On that same note, don't sink too many points into Dex. A starting 12 or 14 is sufficient for all of your skill needs.

[Raelg14]

Also, though this didn't come up, make sure you take at least a 14 Con! Higher if possible. No matter what, you're still going to be a weakling caster with mostly d4 hit dice, and you need as much HP as you can possibly get!

Somewhere Vlhad is smiling.

[sephiroth1084]

Somewhere Vlhad is smiling.

Huh?

[Raelg14]

There was another thread where Vhlad was making a point about Low Con Sorcs and Wizards. He got into it with several others. Endgame 14 should be the minimum Con for Casters.

[ddoer]

There was another thread where Vhlad was making a point about Low Con Sorcs and Wizards. He got into it with several others. Endgame 14 should be the minimum Con for Casters.

according to vhlad, all casters should be WF.

[Raelg14]

LOL Well knowing Vhlad, yeah he would say that and I dont disagree with him to much, having a WF Wizzy myself. But I think you can still play a good NON-WF Wizard or Sorc at Endgame.

[sephiroth1084]

Can definitely play a good non-WF wizard at endgame.