Ranged Weapons - Basic

[Angelus_dead]

1. Up to what level ranged attacks are usefull? 10th? That would be good.

According to your perspective, sure level 10.

2. Is the Arcane Archer good? I mean, +20 on attack, 1d8+1d6(force)+1d6(fire) would be good for a mage!

The mage would be casting Polar Ray for 800+ damage with no attack roll needed. Arcane Archer isn't too good comparatively.

3. What is a better build? Ranger 2 / Mage 18, Ranger 1 / Mage 19 or Mage 20? Of course, I'll get the AA through Elf.

Going AA on a mage is a bad idea. If you're going to do it, I guess taking Ranger 1 or 2 would be better, as that gets you feats that you'd otherwise have to spend slots on.

PS. DDO includes separate Wizard and Sorcerer classes, either of which can be described as a "mage".

[QuintellaRosa]

What you mean by "800+ Polar Ray"? How someone achieve that amount??? Not only by rolling dices, I'm sure...

Well, anyway, I hadn't explained myself clear by asking if +20 attack would be good. SURE a mage will deal much more damage on higher levels, but also it's going to spend SPs.

A better question would be: an AA (Ranger 1 / Wizard 11), for instance, would benefit itself by using a bow? Because it seems that even with a bad BAB, the +20 from True Strike would hit any monster. And the damage of 1d8 + 1d6 + 1d6 + (+5 Str) + (+3 Magic Bow) would, at least, take away some HP, so tanks could just finish it.

I hope that, by using a bow, I can save some SPs.

Again, thanks. I'm playing my first character on DDO and I'm just level 5.

(Sorry, my English is very rusty and I can't figure out if I made myself clear...)

[Lehmund]

Here's my take real quick based on my experience with my Ranged Ranger. Rangers get feats for both melee DPS and range DPS. I use ranged combat in groups to get to mobs that the melee characters cannot get easily or as quickly. For example, casters or archers on ledges or sitting in the back of a group of mobs. Improved Precise shot and other abilities native to the Ranger are great for that. I also use the bow with manyshot and deepwood sniper to tag as quickly as possible the boss of a group to bring him down quicker.

To be honest sometimes these "special targets" in encounters are just harder to get to with melee because of obstacles and other mobs rushing at you. So as a ranged ranger, I do what I consider my Job and do those things in those situations. In other cases where its just a bunch of melee mobs running at me or the group, I take out my TWF skills and hack away because that's most efficient. I do this also when I get aggroed by some melee mobs while I'm trying to do my "job" in a special case and find it best to destroy my assailant before he makes me keel over. I'm no good to the party dead or dying.

So in short, I think the ranged options are not lacking at all. They are great in those circumstances where you need them, and if you are a specialist, you can take that spot in the party to make the lives of your team easier by doing things the others will have a harder time to do. The rest of the time, you want to max DPS so use the best tools for that job when you get to it.

I mean we can even take a page of the real history books to see that this is logical and not broken design at all: warriors often had both range and melee capabilities. They would sometimes shoot or throw when circumstances dictated it would best hurt the enemy, then when that window closed, they would rush in with melee weapons etc... Specialized ranged units would focus on destroying what was out of reach of the melee combatants, or what they could take down and was harder for footmen (like incoming cavalry, as an example).

I love when I can use my throwing axe with my dwarven barb to shoot an opponent, but its only on a rare occasion, but I'm glad I can do even mediocre damage there when circumstance dictates. If I wanted the char to be a big range damage-dealer, I would have built him into a Fighter or a Ranger, where feats can do a better job to give the character decent ranged abilities and a ranged specialty of some kind.

Anyway, that's my 2 cents. I say just play the game and use the tools you have to win. Its all good to me.

[FuzzyDuck81]

I enjoy playing a ranged character - they are far cheaper to equip than many melee builds & there's very little DR that a ranged character with only 2 or 3 halfway decent bows & access to house D ammo can't bypass (just make sure you know what to use for what enemies), meaning that though your DPS wont be amazing except for short bursts while using manyshot (plus extra elemental or bane ammo if you're using it), you'll always be doing a nice steady baseline.

One of my current builds is an elven arcane archer longbow kensai - only level 8 at the moment but working on levelling her & she's coming along quite nicely (she's mostly STR based & melee capable with 2handers to capitalise on that, but primarily a ranged build) and is a lot of fun to play.

The trick with ranged is to play smart - let others grab aggro so you dont pull them & end up kiting all over the place (if you do pull them, either stay still & keep shooting or switch out to melee), focus on priority targets like casters & make use of secondary effects like ability drain, destruction, paralysing, cursespewing etc. - you're a combat support character, so make use of your skills to support your party.

[QuintellaRosa]

Could someone please explain a non-native English speaker what "let others grab aggro" mean? Also, "end up kiting all over the place."
This is no particular complaint against FuzzyDuck81; I've seen the expressions before, but I couldn't translate them to my language.

[Xionanx]

Could someone please explain a non-native English speaker what "let others grab aggro" mean? Also, "end up kiting all over the place."
This is no particular complaint against FuzzyDuck81; I've seen the expressions before, but I couldn't translate them to my language.

Aggro = Is a shortend version of Aggravaite and traces it origins back to Everquest. The concept of "Grabbing Aggro" is when a character does some action which results in him becoming the the monsters primary target.

Kiting = A shortend version of "Fly a Kite" and also traces its origins back to Everquest. The concept is to "Run Away" from a monster while continueing to damage the monster so you always stay out of range of the monster while you are doing it. There it somewhat resembles the act of "Flying a Kite".

So in the context referenced:

When a "Ranger" grabs "Aggro" and begins to "Kite" a monster it becomes difficult for other party members to damage the monster. This results in a NET loss of DPS as the other party members are no longer effective.

Single mob kiting is generally frowned upon in almost ALL MMO's while in a party except for a small number of unique situations where it becomes a usefull tactic. This is why most MMO's have a "Tank" class or some equivalent class that is capable of "Taunting" a monster and then standing still and absorbing the damage through mitigation.

The closest thing DDO has to such a class would be an Intimidate Spec Barbarian with high DR who could retain Aggro while the other party members continue to DPS the target and not draw aggro.

[dunklezhan]

Yes, that is an exploit which was added long after this thread was written.

Just looking for someone to confirm the above (which is in relation to shooting at monsters outside of their spot range, so they don't know where you are). Is it really an exploit or was it an intended change?

Its only useful in a few places where you actually have the range to be outside spot (so outdoor zones and certain large dungeons), so its not a major exploit if so. Personally I think its far worse that monsters would automatically know where you were shooting from, which seems to have been the situtation previously. Certainly there are occasions as a player when I'm getting shot at and I have to scan around looking for the source, and if my spot isn't high enough I just have to run for cover. So on that basis, it seems likely that this was an intended change rather than an unintended consequence.

However I do think the fact that the monsters will just stand there while you whittle them down from extreme range is poor. I'd rather they did the same as a player - ran for cover if you're outside spot range. Or if the AI is too hard to programme to know what 'cover' is, maybe monsters should have some kind of counter where they figure out where you are eventually (say, they have a d20 roll where they figure out where you are on a 19/20, and get +1 to that roll for each shot that hits them - they might die before they figure it out, or they may come running, and bring all their friends with them).

Anyway. Is it *really* an exploit still genuinely unfixed? Anyone?