New player seeking advice.

Hello, I just recently brought dungeons and dragons online and I'm seeking some help to get me started. I'm completely new to the whole dungeons and dragons scene so I have idea how anything works. I come from FFXI and chose to play a bard in this game because I play one in that game.

One thing has me nervous and thats the whole character customization with stat points. I find it exciting that you can build your character anyway you want but I don't want to screw myself over building a character and have to start over. I read in the manual that bards should focus on charisma and dexterity but I also want advice from the players since they ultimetly decide the way a class should be played and the best spec. So I was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction or should I just mess around a few times with the points? I'm waiting to get some feedback before I actually create my character and play. Thanks in advance!

You've made the right choice by coming to the forums - welcome to the game!

Hunt around, there are some stickied threads that have some useful intro information, and there are some nice beginner builds that people have put together - i'm sure some other posters with better forum-fu than me will be along soon enough with more in-depth tips & links to guides :)

First off, ignore 95% of all official class guides.. =P

A two-handed fighting spellsinger bard is going to get you the most out of your class without any expensive build options or tricky gear acquisition. Dwarf gives you bonuses to greataxe damage and to-hit (the latter being important for bards) while also helping to shore up a bard's naturally lower hitpoints.

High strength, high con, bump charisma to twelve or so. Levelups into strength.
Max perform, UMD, concentration - others are up to you.

A two-fighter splash is worth doing to make feats convenient.
Toughness
Power attack
Two handed fighting
Mental Toughness (qualifies you for spellsinger - swap it out for maximize if need be in higher levels)
Extend
Improved Two handed Fighting
Improved Critical
Empower Healing
Greater Two handed Fighting

This lets you take the whole THF line and the useful metamagics, alongside haste boost.
You want to take your fighter levels at one and after you recieve Haste at bard spell level 3.
Fighter bonus feats only include feats on the martial feat list, so plan accordingly.

Welcome to DDO - a bard is the most versatile class here, and due to their buffs, beloved by all - especially the glorious sp-regen song available only to spellsingers.

Ah, bards. A class close to my heart. That was my very first main character too.

Anyway, welcome to the game. As you note the character customization here is very flexible.

How you want to build a bard depends on you. While bards are considered jack-of-all trades, you should also preferably focus more on a few areas or you'll end up lagging in all areas behind other classes. The areas are DPS (damage per second, usually refers to melee/ranged damage ability), CC (crowd control, mostly through spells), healing, and buffing (through songs and spells.

It might be hard to pick at first since you don't really know what you want and how the game works. But if you're interested, take a look at this bard guide:
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...27s+bard+guide

These are some of the most popular bard builds:
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...ighlight=queen
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=210181

This is a newbie and gear friendly guide to character building (for many classes, not just bards). Keep this bookmarked!
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...ght=revisiting

You might have noticed by now some of these builds suggest splashing several different clasess, i.e. not taking all levels 20 in bard. That is called multiclassing as opposed to going pure. There are pros and cons to both choices, again this is one of the many customisation options in DDO. As a general hint, it might be easier to go pure on your first character and once you know more bout the game then you can try multi-classing (unless you're following a suggested multiclass builds like above).

You can find out more by going to the Class forums, then scroll all the way down and select prefix "Bard" to see only Bard-related posts.

Welcome to the game and hope you have fun!

The toughest part of leveling a character is the feats. Some feats are rather awesome while others can be lackluster, or only decent when used with a combination of others. I prefer to experiment a lot to find things that don't work rather than take someone's word for it. You get a minimum of 7 feats (some classes get more than others), choose them well :D

Some Feats have requirements needed: In order to take improved trip you have to take combat expertise, and in order to take that you have to have 13 intelligence.

Another recommendation is on your character sheet on the enhancement tab click show all enhancements. The prestige enchantments might need a certain amount of feats or other enhancements to allow you to qualify for them. It can be a little complex but well worth it.

Enhancements can be reset every few days for an amount of gold that scales with your level.

Asking other players can be of use, but there might be some exaggeration as to the actual effectiveness... Did you hear the one about the 200 kobolds... :D

Welcome to DDO

Honestly, for you first few weeks/months, just play around. Don't worry about messing up. Just figure out what you like playing. There are so many roles and ways to play, you really need to find out what you like doing, otherwise you'll just get a bunch of grumpy old people on the forums yammering on about "optimal" this and "gimp" that. :P

Try out ranged combat (bows and crossbows), try out spellcasters (CC, healing, nuking, supporting), try out melees (monk, two-handed, two-weapon, sword-and-board), try out all the classes you can.

If you want to make a Bard, there's essentially a spectrum of what Bards can do:

[ Spell-based CC
Buffing
Healing & Song-based CC
Melee combat
Ranged combat ]

All Bards can heal. From there, you have to determine whether you want to go for better CC/buffs, or melee/ranged combat. If you want CC/buffing power, you want as many Bard levels as possible (all 20 preferably) and likely the Spellsinger Prestige Enhancement (PrE). If you want melee or ranged combat, you want the Warchanter PrE and you'll likely want at least 4 levels in other classes (2 Fighter/2 Rogue is the most common, which can also give you the ability to pick locks and/or disable traps). But the further you move in one direction, the weaker the aspects on the other end become. It's extremely difficult to fix both effective ranged combat and powerful buffs & CC on the same Bard. It's a lot easier to fit melee combat and maximum buffing potential, though. Regardless, you'll always be close enough to Healing to be able to do it, since healing doesn't require a huge investment. Song-based CC is the same, since all that requires is a skill point every level to be effective.

So, mess around, figure out what you like. You can't hurt yourself by rerolling characters. Well, I guess you technically could, but it probably won't. Once you've figured out what you want to play (race, class[es], playstyle), it'll be no problem for people to either direct you to a build or create one for you if you so desire. Or you could just go off on your own tanget, whatever floats your boat!

Welcome, and good luck!

A few meta-thoughts and various other thoughts :

- Think about which kind of play style you prefer. Dungeon Crawls ? Exploring Wildernesses ? Having a good challence ? Loot oriented ? Think about your preferences.

- There are several gaming philosophies around here. Make up your own !

- It's about having fun, after all, and your personal definition of fun that matters.

- If you want to buy additional adventure packs : Wait for a discount ! Discounts are coming to the DDO store every now and then. For that and for other things, monitor this sub-forum at least once in a week : http://forums.ddo.com/forumdisplay.php?f=233
Sometimes, special rebates are there for only a weekend.

- The DDO store gives away 1 thing for free, usually, per week. Often 1 per account only, but they are worth it. Check the above mentioned sub-forum for that, too.

These free items become free through the use of the "couon code" mentioned there. There is no other way for these special "free item of the week" things.
On how to see how using a Coupon Code works, look here : http://www.ddo.com/ddostorecouponguide

- Constitution is important, for some classes less, for some classes more, but in general it is important, imho.

- Long-time players often give very valuable advice, but no-one on earth is error-free. Take care of that, and rather listen to *several* voices than to one voice alone.

- If you are really, really, really new to the game, then take your steps slowly. Going through each quests slowly in the very first go gives you enough time and knowledge for later. There is no time limit, except for a few quests.

- You can do the same quests later with a harder difficulty again. Use the gained knowledge for that !

- Through redoing quests later with a higher difficulty you not only learn how to cope with higher difficulty, but you also gain what is called "Favour" for both the "Houses" of Stormreach, but also for the "STormreach Elder" in general.

- Each time you achieve a certain number of "Favour", you get additional "Turbine Points" mailed to your character. Use the "mail stations" for checking your mail.

- You don't need "Bravery Bonus" and "Elite" difficulty of quests in the beginning. Important is, imho, that you manage to get through each quests at least once alone.

- You can hire "Hirelings". They are good companions with a sometimes weak AI, who can help you in quests. Please don't consider them as your "babysitters", unless your quests is *really* that hard.

- Don't be afraid of failing a quest. You can redo it any time. Everyone here has - I think - failed a quest at least once (in groups this is called a "wipe" when *evryone* dies - that's not uncommon).

- Don't let yourself be tainted from "eliticist" behaviour and comments. This game is important to YOU alone !

- And last : Please check out the "New Player Guids & Advice" sub-forum and use the forum's search function if needed ! - The DDO Wiki is also a great resource of knowledge ! But beware : It is easy to get spoiled there, too !

- Edit : This thread is valuable, too (at least I think so) : http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=277362

A good post. I would like to add some of my own comments.

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Originally Posted by Alrik_Fassbauer

A few meta-thoughts and various other thoughts :

- Think about which kind of play style you prefer. Dungeon Crawls ? Exploring Wildernesses ? Having a good challence ? Loot oriented ? Think about your preferences.
- There are several gaming philosophies around here. Make up your own !
A lot of long-time players (vets)have been playing for years and like to "zerg" (rush) through the low-level plays. As a new player it would be quite difficult for you to keep up or learn anything about the dungeon,mobs or your character's abilities.

At the same time, when looking through the LFM panel (Look for More, under the Social-->Group section of the game) be aware that a lot of vets may put this in the LFM:
IP - In Progress. The leader/party are already in the dungeon and started the quest. You are expected to make your own way there (no help offered on how to get there or clear the mobs on the way) and keep up with the party.

BYOH - Bring your own heals; SS-self sufficent
Regardless of your character/build, you are expected to be able to heal yourself or at least survive and contribute to the quest. If you are a non-healer, you will have to make through with things like potions or items or spells that enables you to survive. Don't depend on other players to help you out.

TR only - True Reincarnate players only; Know it
TRs are folks who've levelled to 20 and "reincarnated", starting at lvl 1 again with stronger abilities. The expectations are some knowledge of the quest, probably zerging the quest, and usually death is not tolerated (less XP gained). TRs need more XP to level up, and any party member dying usually annoy them.

- It's about having fun, after all, and your personal definition of fun that matters.
Yep. You might consider putting up LFMs like "new to game, let's explore together/ all welcome/ " etc.

- Constitution is important, for some classes less, for some classes more, but in general it is important, imho.
I'd say keep Constitution at a minimum of 12, preferably 14. 16 if you can afford it.

- Long-time players often give very valuable advice, but no-one on earth is error-free. Take care of that, and rather listen to *several* voices than to one voice alone.
Also be aware that many long-time players come up with builds that are focused on the "end-game", mostly raids at lvl 20. Lvl 1-19 is a breeze for them with their accumulated gear and money. This builds also probably include the use of +2,+3 tomes - things which drop rarely and might be difficult to obtain for a new player.

However, for some folks the fun is in the levelling process and not rushing towards end game. So the builds might be different so that your characters can be optimal at the appropriate levels.

- If you are really, really, really new to the game, then take your steps slowly. Going through each quests slowly in the very first go gives you enough time and knowledge for later. There is no time limit, except for a few quests.
- You don't need "Bravery Bonus" and "Elite" difficulty of quests in the beginning. Important is, imho, that you manage to get through each quests at least once alone.
For a new player, there is more than enough XP to level up. Usually only TRs or vets who care about this bravery bonus to gain more XP. Running elite as a new player with little knowledge or gear can be rather difficult.

- You can hire "Hirelings". They are good companions with a sometimes weak AI, who can help you in quests. Please don't consider them as your "babysitters", unless your quests is *really* that hard.

- Don't be afraid of failing a quest. You can redo it any time. Everyone here has - I think - failed a quest at least once (in groups this is called a "wipe" when *evryone* dies - that's not uncommon).
- Don't let yourself be tainted from "eliticist" behaviour and comments. This game is important to YOU alone !
Yes. Good to remember.

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Comments in red.

One extra note about hirelings - although people complain about the AI, they're often not all THAT bad really, and more importantly, especially for newbies, is that a single hireling contract costs a fraction of the price of the stacks of healing & curative potions that you might otherwise end up using.

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Originally Posted by Shaadjd

Hello, I just recently brought dungeons and dragons online and I'm seeking some help to get me started. I'm completely new to the whole dungeons and dragons scene so I have idea how anything works. I come from FFXI and chose to play a bard in this game because I play one in that game.

One thing has me nervous and thats the whole character customization with stat points. I find it exciting that you can build your character anyway you want but I don't want to screw myself over building a character and have to start over. I read in the manual that bards should focus on charisma and dexterity but I also want advice from the players since they ultimetly decide the way a class should be played and the best spec. So I was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction or should I just mess around a few times with the points? I'm waiting to get some feedback before I actually create my character and play. Thanks in advance!

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Hi welcome to the game, was that you who sent me that tell in house K while I was on Eavy my bard?

Could you tell us what kind of bard you would like to play?

Most people dont put too much points into dex and charisma on their bard builds, normally they only put enough dexterity 15 if they want to go the two weapon fighting route or if they want to go archery with AA.

Charisma they normally dont put too much into it unless they want to shoot for CC and healing but CC from bard spells hasn't gotten much love esp when they nerfed the duration of disco balls.

I would say to concentrate on constitution and strength with maybe a 12 or 14 charisma, if your going warchanter. Take a look at the prestige ehancements on DDO wiki and think about which you would like to play, they have preregs that you need to qualify for.

eavy is my 2handed fighting warchanter and suavai is my CC/healing spellsinger.

Everyone will have their own ideas, but spellsinger doesnt have to be completely CC/healing specced you can go for melee or ranged as a spell singer. The extra sp from vigor might be invaluable for a new player so you can keep your buffs up and have SP for heals, because wands and scrolls will be more expensive with your limmited cash.

you can ask for build advice in the class sections as well, specialist for bards.

Fuzzy ducks is right about the hirelings.

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Originally Posted by Shaadjd

Hello, I just recently brought dungeons and dragons online and I'm seeking some help to get me started. I'm completely new to the whole dungeons and dragons scene so I have idea how anything works. I come from FFXI and chose to play a bard in this game because I play one in that game.

One thing has me nervous and thats the whole character customization with stat points. I find it exciting that you can build your character anyway you want but I don't want to screw myself over building a character and have to start over. I read in the manual that bards should focus on charisma and dexterity but I also want advice from the players since they ultimetly decide the way a class should be played and the best spec. So I was wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction or should I just mess around a few times with the points? I'm waiting to get some feedback before I actually create my character and play. Thanks in advance!

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I not sure if been posted before but:

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=275472

this is all you have to know in order to start playing bard.

just like in the matrix movie ( the first one) when Neo is doing his first jump, he falls and crashes.

all first characters in DDO are learning characters.
read the post I have linked, start your bard, see if you like it, then when you have more experience TR your bard to your uberbuild you want.

personal advice: as a bard dont try to do everything at once... either go melee as warchanter with combat feats and invest str, or go spell/healing oriented bard and invest in charisma and spell feats. dont go both at the same time....

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Originally Posted by FrozenNova

First off, ignore 95% of all official class guides.. =P

A two-handed fighting spellsinger bard is going to get you the most out of your class without any expensive build options or tricky gear acquisition. Dwarf gives you bonuses to greataxe damage and to-hit (the latter being important for bards) while also helping to shore up a bard's naturally lower hitpoints.

High strength, high con, bump charisma to twelve or so. Levelups into strength.
Max perform, UMD, concentration - others are up to you.

A two-fighter splash is worth doing to make feats convenient.
Toughness
Power attack
Two handed fighting
Maximize (taken early to qualify for spellsinger)
Extend
Improved Two handed Fighting
Improved Critical
Empower Healing
Greater Two handed Fighting

This lets you take the whole THF line and the useful metamagics, alongside haste boost.
You want to take your fighter levels at one and after you recieve Haste at bard spell level 3.
Fighter bonus feats only include feats on the martial feat list, so plan accordingly.

Welcome to DDO - a bard is the most versatile class here, and due to their buffs, beloved by all - especially the glorious sp-regen song available only to spellsingers.

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Pretty good advice here really - Dwarf is usually safe choice for newer players with the consitution and great-axe bonuses....

Welcome to the wonderful world of DDO, Shaadjd! Glad to have you with us.

This game is huge, expansive and can be most intimidating to new players with or without experience in traditional D&D. The best advice I can give to a starting player is to take it slow and learn the basics. I've linked a few resource for you that are indispensable for new or veteran players.

Best of luck and I hope you have a wonderful time.

Official DDO Game Manual (PDF) - Somewhat dated but still useful.

Ron Hiler's Character Creator - Simply the best way to not gimp your character.

DDOWiki - The source for all DDO-related information.

This means you only have two character slots.

A bard is nice to have high charisma and when you have 400 favor, you get DROW for free and all of my bards are all DROW. Why? because a drow can make their charisma start at 20.

My advice, make a DWARF ranger. Learn the game, and be survivable. Any character can solo Korthos, but a dwarf ranger can solo Korthos, Harbor, and Marketplace. Irestone Inlet in Harbor don't solo that one on elite and Proof is in the Poison in Marketplace do not solo that one on elite. You can do those but be over level to do it.

When you join a party, it is your option if you feel comfortable in telling them it is your first time. A good party or a good leader will gladly welcome you. Do not be surprised if the party you join does zero communication and tells you absolutely nothing.

Once you understand the game, and sort of know the quests and you have the drow unlocked, then make a bard.

Or, just dive in, learn the game, and don't sweat that your first character is an atrocity.

I still play my first 28 point build cleric, who is built completely wrong. Guess what? Absolutely no one has ever accused me of being a bad cleric because I am not built right. But I have been accused of being a bad cleric because some players are mana sponges and eventually I refuse to waste any more heals and raise deads on them. My limit is ten deaths and I will no longer raise you(More than likely all of your gear is broken anyway and you will only die again)

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Originally Posted by DeadlyPoison

A bard is nice to have high charisma and when you have 400 favor, you get DROW for free and all of my bards are all DROW. Why? because a drow can make their charisma start at 20.

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This is if you want to play a DC-based casting bard.
You do not want to play a DC-based casting bard - they're far outclassed by real casters and a real pain to level.
All charisma does for conventional bards is give them boosts to perform and umd (and haggle!) and bestowing an insignificantly small number of bonus spellpoints.

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Originally Posted by DeadlyPoison

A bard is nice to have high charisma and when you have 400 favor, you get DROW for free and all of my bards are all DROW. Why? because a drow can make their charisma start at 20.

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Originally Posted by FrozenNova

This is if you want to play a DC-based casting bard.
You do not want to play a DC-based casting bard - they're far outclassed by real casters and a real pain to level.
All charisma does for conventional bards is give them boosts to perform and umd (and haggle!) and bestowing an insignificantly small number of bonus spellpoints.

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The downside of customisation - people will disagree on how to build a bard, or anything at all in DDO. The upside is as you note, it is very customisable. And you can easily get overwhelmed by the sheer information and options.

I would say to take any advice (especially build advice) with a large plate of salt. When someone say, "a human cleric" or a "halfling barbarian" is good etc, what they're really trying to say is it was good for them.

E.g. for example on dwarf rangers - they might be excellent, I dunno. But I like my rangers to be human, elves, or half-elves. Call me traditional, but that's what I like. It might not be the "zomg uber ranger", but I don't have trouble getting into groups. Also, my main is an elf bard (lvl 20 pure bard spellsinger) who CCed/buffed and healed his way to lvl 2. No problems getting in groups and I really enjoyed playing him.

Check out general guides etc and just go on and build what you like. It's ok to make mistakes, even optimal builds change over time with changes to the game etc. While the forum posters might be very critical of less than optimal builds, a lot of players in the game are quite open. Just let them know you're new and as you play and explore the game, you will learn more and discover what you like or don't like.

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All charisma does for conventional bards is give them boosts to perform and umd (and haggle!) and bestowing an insignificantly small number of bonus spellpoints.

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And it does make your CC stronger, even if your main focus is something else. It will still be better than fascinate for levelling (which doesn't work well in pugs and has random dc making it a bit unreliable at early levels)

Would not suggest to dump charisma, if you are not really certain you don't want to use any spell-CC ever.

Wouldn't max it either.


Look up Divas bard thread that was linked already several times. It is nice and has a lot of builds.

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Originally Posted by DeadlyPoison

This means you only have two character slots.

A bard is nice to have high charisma and when you have 400 favor, you get DROW for free and all of my bards are all DROW. Why? because a drow can make their charisma start at 20.

My advice, make a DWARF ranger.

....

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Dwarf rangers are a pretty good choice and have some decent buffs also.

But a Drow bard for a new player is somewhat iffy. The Drow's bonuses to INT and DEX don't really help that much since you you probably want to be two-handed fighting anyway, and bards get a lot of skill points per level. However, the -2 constitution, compared to a dwarf bard does hurt your HP a lot. Dwarfs start with +2 CON, and can get an extra 2 CON and two additional toughness from enhancements for a total of 80HP more, which is a huge deal for a new player. Not saying Drow bards are bad, but for newer players, Dwarf (or even Human) is a more solid choice.

My first character to pass ten was a bard too -- a 12 con elf with a longsword and buckler but a bard nonetheless!

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Originally Posted by Satinavian

And it does make your CC stronger, even if your main focus is something else. It will still be better than fascinate for levelling (which doesn't work well in pugs and has random dc making it a bit unreliable at early levels)

Would not suggest to dump charisma, if you are not really certain you don't want to use any spell-CC ever.

Wouldn't max it either.

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Careful here, this is likely to cause you stress. Spell DC's are essentially an all or nothing affair - since if you don't max charisma, the chances that you'll ever actually land a spell become increasingly dim as you level up, to the point where at high end content your charisma must be literally pushing the possible boundaries to remain effective. If you choose not to max it and instead half-ass it so you can use spells at low level, all those points will be wasted at high level. Moreover, bard CC is weighted towards the end. You don't get dancing sphere or mass charm until the higher levels, by which time they'll be useless. Sure, if you spend eight build points in charisma you can hypnotize some hobgoblins - but that's really not going to help in the long run compared to more con or str. Irresistable dance and Fascinate are both fantastic forms of crowd control that a bard can use without regards to charisma.

You don't want to leave it at 8, for sure - it's an effective boost to skills and fascinate while the cost is low - but spending enough build points to make DC-based spells worth casting in the mid levels would be a mistake, as they're meaningless by the end.

If you're new to DnD as well as DDO, I recommend checking out the mechanics threads in my signiture so you have some idea of what does what.

I took a minute to compile a dwarven thf spellsinger in the builder for you:

Code:

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Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.09.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Spoony The bard
Level 20 True Neutral Dwarf Male
(2 Fighter \ 18 Bard)
Hit Points: 280
Spell Points: 867
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 13
Reflex: 10
Will: 10

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(28 Point)      (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Strength            16                    22
Dexterity            8                    8
Constitution        18                    19
Intelligence        10                    10
Wisdom                8                    8
Charisma            12                    12

Level 1 (Fighter)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Bard)
Skill: Perform (+5)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Spell (1): Cure Light Wounds


Level 3 (Bard)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+3)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell
Spell (1): Expeditious Retreat


Level 4 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Concentration (+4)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Spell (1): Focusing Chant


Level 5 (Bard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+3)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Spell (2): Cure Moderate Wounds
Spell (2): Rage


Level 6 (Bard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+3)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
Spell (1): Merfolk's Blessing
Spell (2): Invisibility


Level 7 (Bard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+3)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 8 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Spell (2): Blur
Spell (3): Haste
Spell (3): Displacement


Level 9 (Fighter)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Two Handed Fighting


Level 10 (Bard)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)
Spell (3): Cure Serious Wounds


Level 11 (Bard)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+2)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 12 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
Spell (3): Good Hope
Spell (4): Freedom of Movement
Spell (4): Cure Critical Wounds


Level 13 (Bard)
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Spell (4): Dimension Door


Level 14 (Bard)
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 15 (Bard)
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Handed Fighting
Spell (4): Otto's Sphere of Dancing
Spell (5): Mass Cure Light Wounds
Spell (5): Greater Heroism


Level 16 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Spell (5): Shadow Walk


Level 17 (Bard)
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 18 (Bard)
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Handed Fighting
Spell (1): Grease
Spell (6): Otto's Irresistable Dance
Spell (6): Mass Cure Moderate Wounds
Spell (5): Greater Dispel Magic


Level 19 (Bard)
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Spell (6): Heroes Feast
Spell (2): Hypnotic Pattern


Level 20 (Bard)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Haggle (+1)
Skill: Perform (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Spell (3): Crushing Despair
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack III
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage II
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage III
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song II
Enhancement: Bard Spellsinger I
Enhancement: Bard Spellsinger II
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Attack I
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Attack II
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage I
Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage II
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Improved Concentration I
Enhancement: Improved Concentration II
Enhancement: Improved Perform I
Enhancement: Improved Perform II
Enhancement: Bard Lyric of Song I
Enhancement: Bard Lyric of Song II
Enhancement: Bard Song Magic I
Enhancement: Bard Song Magic II
Enhancement: Bard Song Magic III
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music I
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music II
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music III
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery I
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery II
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery III
Enhancement: Bard Wand and Scroll Mastery IV

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Every bard is a spoony bard.
True Neutral is optimal: through UMD, bards can easily ignore all alignment restrictions on gear, and other alignments may cause additional damage from some sources.

I put mental toughness in there at 6 to qualify for spellsinger on the grounds that taking maximize at that level would be a waste while mental toughness does at least something. As you approach cap, however, you'll want to swap it out (every character gets one free feat swap) for maximize to boost your healing.

The most awkward part of multiclassing are the skills, due to the way class skills interact. Fundamentally, you'll be able to max perform, umd, and concentration, with two bard skills left to pick from (one only close to maxed), if you stick to the choices in the build layout. In this build I chose balance and haggle, as they're fairly conventional choices. However, you may like to pick Hide and Move silently instead (Bards make excellent sneaky characters since they can cast invisibility and use fascinate to freeze foes to let them open doors or pull levers without being interrupted. Indeed, they can even use fascinate while sneaking and invisible!). The only downside is that unless you're a rogue or a monk, your movespeed while sneaking is severely lowered. Still, it makes for some interesting solo runs.

The spells are in there to give you an idea of what you want, and when.
Merfolk's blessing and Hypnotic sphere are 100% mandatory, and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. =P In truth, bards have more spellslots than they need.

Enhancements are usually personal preference, but I've listed them at 20 to make it easy to grab. Enhancements can be reset every three days for a tiny fee at your class trainer, so don't worry about them too much.

Spellsinger vs warchanter vs Virtuoso.
All are good, and you can pick any as this build. Spellsinger requires either maximize or mental toughness, while warchanter requires weapon focus - so swap them out as need be. Virtuoso can be unlocked without feats.
Spellsinger: +200 sp. Boost to umd. Songs that help casters. SP-regen song represents a huge boost for your group.
Warchanter: Stronger melee buff songs.
Virtuoso: Strong song crowd control.

Fundamentally the melee spellsinger is better at healing and sustaining the group through higher spellpoints and spellpoint regen, while also bestowing decent buffs on your casters. The umd boost makes it that much easier to reach Heal scrolls.
Warchanters make your group deal more physical damage, but the lack of bonus spellpoints or maximize means they fall behind in healing.
Virtuosos can use their song of capering to lock down single enemies, and enthrallment to turn large fights into a laugh. Not exactly a wide range of CC options, but song CC has an incredibly high difficulty check based on your perform skill, making it very reliable.

I find that melee spellsingers represent the best versatility for levelling due to the huge spellpoint bonuses. Swapping to warchanter for raiding purposes when you know you'll have a dedicated healer is certainly an option, however.

A few play tips -
Bards can use healing wands - these will really stretch your spellpoints in low levels. They're expensive though, with each tier being drastically more expensive than the last but only progressing linearly in effectiveness. As such, to save coin stock up on Cure light wounds wands and use them to heal up out of combat, since they're dirt cheap.

In addition, try to make sure that you carry a good supply of utility wands around with you. Checklist:
Neautralize poison
Remove disease
Remove curse
Remove blindness
Detect secret doors
Lesser Restoration
Waterbreathing
Stoneskin
Repair (heal spells work at half effectiveness on warforged, so repair wands are more efficient).
These will become usable in varying degrees as your umd / character level / typical income increases, but represent a big part of your versatility. They're all available from vendors - check http://ddowiki.com/page/Category:Wands to find them.
Also make sure you're carrying raise dead scrolls as soon as you can use them - same with Heal scrolls, though those can be expensive.

Bards can't cast resist energy by themselves. This is a real shame - they are the only blue bar that can't. Finding yourself a guild with resist 30 shrines on their airship will help out a lot. If not, you'll want to invest in hotswappable gear (cloaks, usually) of resist energy - all five elements. That way you can swap them in on a hotbar when needed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrozenNova

Careful here, this is likely to cause you stress. Spell DC's are essentially an all or nothing affair - since if you don't max charisma, the chances that you'll ever actually land a spell become increasingly dim as you level up, to the point where at high end content your charisma must be literally pushing the possible boundaries to remain effective. If you choose not to max it and instead half-ass it so you can use spells at low level, all those points will be wasted at high level. Moreover, bard CC is weighted towards the end. You don't get dancing sphere or mass charm until the higher levels, by which time they'll be useless. Sure, if you spend eight build points in charisma you can hypnotize some hobgoblins - but that's really not going to help in the long run compared to more con or str. Irresistable dance and Fascinate are both fantastic forms of crowd control that a bard can use without regards to charisma.

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I simply don't agree.

Even with moderate DCs, mass CC will usually land on some targets through pretty much the whole level progression. At the early levels you will even be able to benefit from single-target spell cc which is then more reliable than song cc. At high-level range you get Irresistible dance for single targets (which is a ridiculous powerful spell). But against groups of weak mobs you will still use disco balls and mass charms, both of which are worth their sp, even if only some targets fail the save.

How far will you be behing for not maxing it ? You will still use Cha-gear (eventually trying for +7+ exceptional+ inherent+ enhancements, maybe even profane), still use spellfocus feats/+2 DC items, you might loose 1-2 points from not investing full 16 build points in cha. That's far less difference than the capstone alone. Even if you don't have the capstone and no max cha, you will still lose only around 20% chance of success of your mass spells per target. If those would be good enough to be a primary tool for a cc bard when maxed, they will still be good enough as situational secondary tool for a bard with specialisation somewhere else

On the other hand if you dump it and take barely only enough items/enhancements to be able to cast spells at all and don't bother with feats/gear for DCs, then they might really become useless.

And fascinate... works only if your puggers pay attention. And don't freely use thf/aoe spells. Which will probably only happen in some rare quests where fascinating somehow managed to slip in as standart tactic. Especcially i am no fan of advertising fascinate as primary source of cc on thf-build-bards. You can't even freely kill them one by one, if they are close together using your main weapon.

That said, the dwarf bard is nice. And more points in Cha on a dwarf thf bard would indeed be not wise.

Agree with statements regarding PrEs and gear. Especcially the part about resists is really important.