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Tilo,
This isn't a cleric build
No ap in any cleric tree
Come on
A half Orc rogue with dire charge
That's so gimp I'm offended...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vish
maybe - but he knows exactly how his built achieves this, going about it in a very systematic and stylish way.
you cannot say this of your average gimp cleric, and your average gimp could learn a lot from this anyways ...
also, you gotta love the meta irony...
It sounded interesting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilomere
So...really you have 15 levels that do for you what pots can do, while making little use of most of the class features, or even enhancements that Cleric has to offer?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilomere
How is this a "Cleric" build? You have an Int-based Rogue in LD. Replace those 15 Cleric with 15 anything else, and it's the same. It's like one of those past life template builds or something.
Yes, exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vish
The irony is that you've sacrificed both.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilomere
I'm not saying it's not a powerful build, or that your Int/LD/Acro/Horc combo isn't awesome. It probably is, but I have no comment on that.
However, it uses no Cleric melee features at all, and uses Cleric casting in only the most superficial way possible.
What is it they could learn from this? "Don't roll a Cleric"?Quote:
Originally Posted by Eryhn
By the time you achieve hell ball I would exchange Warpriest for divine disciple
I still prefer my INT-based cleric 15 / bard 3 / rog 2 build concept. Swashbuckler is a much more front-loaded PrE than Acrobat (which loses a lot of DPS w/out T5), allowing you to put more APs into Radiant Servant to be a "real" healer: e.g., 32 RS / 11 SB (Skirmisher or Arcane Marauder) / 12 Harper leaving 25 APs to tweak things. For LD, use handaxes or light maces to take advantage of either Headmans Chop or Pulverizer; for other EDs like Crusader, use whatever Swashbuckling weapon you prefer.
Ya I don't slight the idea,
Just that it's not a cleric build...
So now I feel challenged
A cleric with dire charge, kta, and possibly fire
So no str or cha, tho cha is needed
And no wis, maybe for min
Needs an aura, and I like the staff idea
I would say 13/4/3
Maybe 4 rogue, 3 pally, or maybe ftr.,,,
Or 13/5/2 rogue with fighter
But it's got to be a cleric, melee style
I'll put it on the drawing board
I think part of why people say this isn't a "real" cleric build is none of this is dependent on being a cleric. Your melee DPS primarily comes from Acrobat+LD; anyone can use Dire Charge or Consecrate+Sacred Ground; any INT- or CHA-based build can use Energy Burst, Hellball, and/or BoGW. Yes, you have lvl 8 cleric spells, but since no one seems to care about group buffs anymore, it'll be Heal & Mass Cures that everyone expects.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilomere
Personally I would LOL at everyone who joins you expecting you to be another Radiant Servant and is in for a rude surprise, but that's just me... :cool:
As you are not using anything that is Cleric specific, may I recommend Rogue5/Druid15.
Will give you the same result, but you get:
- 4 skill points from Druid (vs 2 if Cleric). Nice for maxing skills
- Fom+Sleet is a cheap and potent anti-melee CC/debuff
- cure/heal with "over time" part
- cheap level puller
think about **** before your roll it?Quote:
Originally Posted by SirValentine
decide on a playstyle, find appropriate class and trees, look for synergies,
dont build weird stuff that doesnt work and then complain calling builds that DO work "op"
something along those lines?
you'd be surprised to how many people this is news :D
the meta irony lies in how some people complain they cant make a hybrid cleric work and you show them ways to do it by actually applying some thought about how things work ...Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilomere
not that they arent right that cleric trees need work, after all you gotta do some bending over backwards for this concept XD but, ...it just made me chuckle after certain threads on clerics over the last months ...
Mind posting your build or a link to your build? Thanks in advance.Quote:
Originally Posted by unbongwah
Would that be sufficient to make DG PK SLA viable too?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilomere
Emphasis added.Quote:
Originally Posted by unbongwah
Exactly that, combined with the implication that this build somehow proves that the Cleric it's not dependent on is so powerful.
It wasn't just, "here's a build I used to get a Cleric past life"; nobody would object that it's not a "real" Cleric build.
It was the specific claim, "cleric is considered weak and I wanted to show a powerful cleric build is possible." But it's not a powerful Cleric build. It's a powerful build that happens to have some Cleric levels where it could just as easily have levels of something else and make little difference.
Yes and no.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilomere
It's an argument of semantics - what is the definition of "a cleric build"? Defined one way, it's one thing, and vice versa. No news here, move along.
However, it's generally accepted that a build that is "Rogue 5/X 15" is not an "X" build, but is a "Template build" for past lifes (or whatever), and the X adds X-flavored gravy to the core build. This does seem like that.
Moreover...
That last phrase does imply that you admit (at some level) that the build is something larger than the cleric part, that "the cleric version" is only 1 possible version of the build.Quote:
...but that doesn't diminish the power of the cleric version.
However, in the end that's all OT - call it a Template build, call it a (optional) Cleric build, call it Sally for all it's worth - it's a Horc Rogue b/c that's what the build revolves around, and is viewed as such.
I'm happy to grant you the benefit of the doubt that both your build here and Cetus are powerful.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilomere
Where is my standard about what is a powerful build? Back up your spurious claim about my standard, please. Of course you can't, because I made no such claim.
My "standard" is that if what's making it powerful is "X", and what it gets from "Y" is minor, it's not a "powerful Y" build. It's a powerful X build that happens to also incorporate some Y.
You say it's powerful, fine. And it has some Cleric levels, fine. But nothing you've posted is in the least bit a "powerful Cleric" build. It's just a powerful build that happens to also incorporate some Cleric.
But I've already said that. If you don't get it, you don't get it. Fair enough, because I don't get your claim, either.
Your build in your original post has zero points listed in Warpriest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilomere
That fact the someone can play in some other build before they re-spec into what you've posted...what does that say about anything?
Druid:Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilomere
- singel target DOT(s) (Creping Cold)
- AOE DOTs (Firewall, Ice storm)
- P2P
Cleric:
- Divine Punish, single target, not as practical as Creeping Cold, need to stack it 3 times), but less mobs resist light then cold damage.
- Divine Power spell. Easy, practical way to get full BAB. BAB effects your attack speed, so DPS.
- F2P
I leveled both (not *this* build, Cleric15/X, Druid15/X variant) and for me it was: better DOTs(Druid) vs better BAB(Cleric)
Tilomere
Spent downtime looking into this
Best I can come up with
Is a deep gnome shaman
I like the general rogue idea
And always wanted to look into a int cleric build
But it still falls short of my mark of a cleric
So, I'm gonna refeat vish and try out dire charge
Since that's all that's needed
Not a cleric, justa dire charge kinda thing
Sicnce anybody can use it...
Unbongwah posted his build here . . .Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragnipurake
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post5832988
Wouldn't a 5 Rogue 15 wizard palemaster version of this be far superior? Displacement, Wraithform, Tensers for full BAB, all of the wizard goodie spells, and could use neg burst and Death Auras to heal.
Are we just not going to talk about what really makes this build powerful?
No?
Okay.
Any ideas adaptable for getting cleric past lives are appreciated. I don't know what I would do with the beast lvls 15-19 though. Once 20 hits it looks very enjoyable.