Stone of Change - Eldritch Rituals Cookbook

[Ilandrya]

In my above examples, I do wonder about one thing though. For example:

fire/fire/fire results in one thing because you get fire/fire at second and fire/fire at third
fire/fire/air in another because you get fire/fire at second and fire/air at third
fire/air/fire in another because you get fire/air at second and fire/fire at third

In the last two examples, I wonder if the second level fire/fire has a different bonus than the third level fire/fire. Just like each altar imparts differnent things, what level you take the combo may do different things.

In other words, say for example you have earth/fire at the second tier, you get magma I.

But, at the third tier, suppose you don't have magma I, if you have the earth/fire combination for the third tier, do you get magma II, or do you get magma I? In other words, is the strength of the combo dependant upon whether it was done at tier 2 or tier 3, or is the strength of the combo dependant upon if you have the earlier form or not.

[SneakThief]

Isnt there a band name Earth Wind and Fire? And one of the quests is named after a song .... :D

[UtherSRG]

Isnt there a band name Earth Wind and Fire? And one of the quests is named after a song .... :D

Yes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth,_Wind_&_Fire).

[MysticTheurge]

And two of the quests are named after songs .... :D

Fixed. ;)

Rainbow in the Dark (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rainbow_in_the_Dark).

Running with the Devil(s) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Running_with_the_devil).

[Waterboy]

Hey I've been lurking in this thread for a while and wanted to let you all know how much I enjoy reading it and appreciate your efforts. You guys are way ahead of me on this so its great you are sharing your info with everyone.

BTW, I will sacrifice a green steel item in the adamantine ritual (once I get enough shards - 10,000?!!!) in the name of science. In any case, I'm getting close. If you want to donate shards to speed up teh process, you call mail them to Wravven on Ghallanda.

Thanks again!

[MysticTheurge]

BTW, I will sacrifice a green steel item in the adamantine ritual (once I get enough shards - 10,000?!!!) in the name of science.

It should just be the minimum level squared. So 121? 144?

[Waterboy]

It should just be the minimum level squared. So 121? 144?

To bind yes but for the admantine ritual I need the soul gems...right?

[Myrdinn]

I was wondering something, has anyone tried 3 identical (like earth + earth + earth) but with the dominion gem for the 3 of them. Just got an idea and wanted to know if it had any lead, or the same but with escalation gem all the way.

Thanks

[SneakThief]

I was wondering something, has anyone tried 3 identical (like earth + earth + earth) but with the dominion gem for the 3 of them. Just got an idea and wanted to know if it had any lead, or the same but with escalation gem all the way.

Thanks

Yes ... the only thing that seems to matter is the Focus.

[Big-Dex]

If I understand Eladrin correctly...

These hitherto undiscovered para, quasi and special upgrades can only be done at the ALTAR OF DEVESTATION (in other words, "Teir 3" upgrades). Is this correct?

The lingo is throwing me for a loopo.

Teir 1 = invasion altar, Teir 2=Subjugation altar, Teir 3=Devestation altar . Is this the lingo we are using here?

Or are we saying that Teir 1 = chest ingredients, Teir 2=manufactured ingredients, Teir 3 = shard(s) of power into weapon?

I am unsure of the terminology. It would definitely make it easier if we were all on the same page with the "TEIR" lingo! LOL

[Rallie]

Does it affect the potentcy of your item/effect if you don't use the same recipie at each level?

In other words, if you use a different combination at the tier 1 and tier 2 altars, do you get the actual 'tier 2' effect still, or do you get the tier 1 effect of whatever the 2nd recipie you used was?

[Kargon]

Does it affect the potentcy of your item/effect if you don't use the same recipie at each level?

In other words, if you use a different combination at the tier 1 and tier 2 altars, do you get the actual 'tier 2' effect still, or do you get the tier 1 effect of whatever the 2nd recipie you used was?

actuamal 'tier 2' so mix away, and find some interestaming combinimatimions for us! :D

[Garth_of_Sarlona]

+DM//EDM Khopesh:

http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/khopeshtier2.png

Nothing unexpected there. FYI you can't cast the stoneskin on other people - it's self only.

I tested the acid and holy damage. On a normal hit you get base+acid+holy as can be seen here (http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/ScreenShot00351.jpg). On a critical you get base+acid+acidburst+holy as can be seen here (http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/ScreenShot00353.jpg).

I hope this helps anyone still deciding on whether to go this route.

If anyone has any guesses what a good 3rd tier upgrade for 'mineral' (pos/earth) is then please let me know :)

Garth

[MysticTheurge]

To bind yes but for the admantine ritual I need the soul gems...right?

Oh yes. You're right, forgive my brain malfunction.


The lingo is throwing me for a loopo.

Teir 1 = invasion altar, Teir 2=Subjugation altar, Teir 3=Devestation altar . Is this the lingo we are using here?

Or are we saying that Teir 1 = chest ingredients, Teir 2=manufactured ingredients, Teir 3 = shard(s) of power into weapon?

I am unsure of the terminology. It would definitely make it easier if we were all on the same page with the "TEIR" lingo! LOL

Unfortunately, different people seem to be using those two sets of tiers interchangeably in different situations at different points in time. Mostly in this thread, though, Tier refers to the three altars.

[Borror0]

A weapon with, say, "Magma I" on it at Tier Two can be upgraded to "Magma II" at Tier Three.

Anyone thought of trying two foci at Devastation?

[MysticTheurge]

Anyone thought of trying to foci at Devastation?

Hmm like to use more than one Imbued Shard?

[Borror0]

Hmm like to use more than one Imbued Shard?

Yes... or using another focus when mixing the shard with the weapon.
Anything that mixes elementals so you can use more than one at the same time.

[Yuhjn]

Well they keep talking about 3 types of 3rd affinity combinations:

para
quasi
special


para is the combination between adjacent elements:
examples are
fire / fire / air
water / earth / water

quasi is combining an element with either positive or negative
examples are
fire / positive / fire
water / negative / negative

The devs have said plainly that "para-quasi" isnt in the game, so we dump the possibility of fire / positive / air and similar

Now we're left with special. But special cannot be para, or quasi, or para-quasi.

That means special must be opposing elements.
examples are
fire / water / fire
earth / earth / air


Now what we need is someone to try it :)

[Yuhjn]

+DM//EDM Khopesh:
If anyone has any guesses what a good 3rd tier upgrade for 'mineral' (pos/earth) is then please let me know :)
Garth


Well, you've made a "quasi-elemental" weapon, which means to continue to unlock it's full potential you need to continue to upgrade it as quasi-elemental... that gives you have 2 choices:

Earth
Positive


Anything else is going to gimp your weapon. (the devs have stated that para-quasi-elemental is not in the game)

[Waterboy]

I made a pair of Green Steel Bracers tonight and then bound/attuned them.

http://img102.imageshack.us/my.php?image=greenbracersattunedsi3.jpg

Still says tainted. When I get enough shards for soulstones I will go forward with the adamantine ritual to see if that removes the taint.

Risk: Probably low probability but there may be a chance that making them Adamantine supresses the green steel characteristics - possibly cleansing it...and also possibly preventing any additional effects on the item - since its adamantine now and not green steel. I'd be surprised if that happened but you never know.

[adamkatt]

+DM//EDM Khopesh:

http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/khopeshtier2.png

Nothing unexpected there. FYI you can't cast the stoneskin on other people - it's self only.

I tested the acid and holy damage. On a normal hit you get base+acid+holy as can be seen here (http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/ScreenShot00351.jpg). On a critical you get base+acid+acidburst+holy as can be seen here (http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/ScreenShot00353.jpg).

I hope this helps anyone still deciding on whether to go this route.

If anyone has any guesses what a good 3rd tier upgrade for 'mineral' (pos/earth) is then please let me know :)

Garth


Ohhh very nice combo! I likey!

[Snoggy]

hope this helps anyone still deciding on whether to go this route.

If anyone has any guesses what a good 3rd tier upgrade for 'mineral' (pos/earth) is then please let me know :)

Garth

Hey! I made the Longsword version of the same weapon!

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/5047/greensteel1un3.jpg

I'm either going to go positive or earth in the third tier, with the Armor Class boost. I was leaning towards positive, making it Positive + Earth + Positive. But all this para and quasi talk has confused me. Luckily, I still have a long way to go with large ingredients. So maybe by the time I get close I'll have a better grasp of what's going on with tier 3.

[Naso24]

My plan for my goggles:

Neg (blindness immune, disease immune).
Pos (+50 SP, +2 CHR skills)
??? (+100 SP, +3 ??? skills)

I'm thinking about fire or earth. Anybody else tried this? Any thoughts on if there will be a special effect on the 3rd upgrade?

[maddmatt70]

http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/6100/conskillhpgoggset1.jpg

Material + Escalation + Earth all the way




Originally Posted by Benjai View Post
Eldarin, could you confirm whether or not all combinations will have some sort of effect or do a lot of us need to become very disappointed with experimental items and need to make new items from scratch?
Every elemental combination will do something neat at Tier Two, though none reach their full potential until Tier Three.



A Tier Two recipe without a proper Tier Three addition will not unlock the full potential of the item. Saying the item is disappointing and needs to be remade from scratch may be a bit excessive - it's still a Tier Two item with an additional benefit from the Tier Three improvement.
"Raar."


It appears that the maker of these goggles which use material + Escalation + Earth did not get the full potential of the Tier Three addition which unlocks the full potential of the item or maybe there is no special earth ability. What is the difference between this example and the goggles which mavnimo made which appear to have reached the full potential with the greater disruption guard ability (
Supreme Tyrant Green Steel Bracers of Positive Energy (Mavnimo) Ethereal + Escalation + Positive x 3..)? They both have the same element all three times one is earth and the other is positive so why doesn't earth get its special ability?....

[Kraldor]

People keep saying this, but...

Doesn't that Staff of Arcane Power have multiple clickies on the same item?

Yes, but that is a spell selection window ala teleport/greater teleport rather than multiple clickies. While that might work, it might be a little strange, what with the different clickies being added onto your item at different times and all.

[digz]

Earth,Etheral,Escalation

http://mysite.verizon.net/digzpi8/wisscepter.jpg

[Drider]

Quasi-elements are already pretty obscure. Quasi-para-elements are one step beyond them. :)


Air + Air + Positive will not result in the same thing as Positive + Positive + Air.

There's still one thing that people haven't yet discovered regarding upgrading Para or Quasi elemental combinations.


Well I did an earth + earth + positive, all etheral/escalation on my goggles finished tonight, and there was nothing special on them on the end product.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg99/Evildrider/DreckosGoggles.jpg

[Endrik]

AOE/AOE
Devastation AOE is going to be a while...

http://www.ddo.fulltimenuke.net/GreatCommanderReflex.jpg

[UtherSRG]

I tested the acid and holy damage. On a normal hit you get base+acid+holy as can be seen here (http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/ScreenShot00351.jpg). On a critical you get base+acid+acidburst+holy as can be seen here (http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/ScreenShot00353.jpg).


Garth

There's no damage shown in your screenshots.

[adamkatt]

There's no damage shown in your screenshots.

Besides the red numbers above the giants heads.

[UtherSRG]

Besides the red numbers above the giants heads.

I totally couldn't see that. Sucks being colorblind. But now that you've pointed them out, I can see them. Nevermind. :D

[Venar]

I think it's fair to assume that only identical upgrades x 3 will give out a bonus.
Because they are oftyen weaker.

Take for exemple, 2 goggles.
One is HP + 45.
The other is WIZ 6, HP +35.

Obviously the first one has more potential.

Also, going X3 on an item often makes you waste an upgrade.

A weapon with fire x 3, for exemple, completely wasted the first upgrade, since the fire (1D6) from tier 1 is redundant with the fire burst effect of tier 2 (fire burst includes the base fire damage).
The same weapon going Pos+ Fire + Fire will be way better since it has an extra Holy from the tier 1. BUT, he loses the T3 synergic effect.

My 2 cents.

[SteeleTrueheart]

Excuse me if this has been said already.

I know that horns do not work as yet, but I am thinking that there is something to them or something to the 20th completion.

I find the fact that there are only 2 types of essence unusual.

D&D Cosmology (as per DMG except where noted below)

Material Plane
1) Material Plane

Transitive Planes
2) Ethereal Plane*^
3) Plane of Shadow*^
4) Astral Plane^
* Coexistent with the Material Plane in DMG 3.5 p153
^ Coexistent with the Material Plane in ECS p92

Inner Planes
5) Positive Energy Plane
6) Elemental Plane of Fire
7) Elemental Plane of Earth
8) Negative Energy Plane
9) Elemental Plane of Water
10) Elemental Plane of Air

Outer Planes
Irrelevant for this discussion

Now since the Astral Plane is described as the space between the planes it may not be given an Essence, but I can not see why a Shadow Essence does not exist. The Shadow Plane is coterminous and coexistent with the Material Plane much as the Ethereal Plane is.

[sirgog]

Also, going X3 on an item often makes you waste an upgrade.

A weapon with fire x 3, for exemple, completely wasted the first upgrade, since the fire (1D6) from tier 1 is redundant with the fire burst effect of tier 2 (fire burst includes the base fire damage).
The same weapon going Pos+ Fire + Fire will be way better since it has an extra Holy from the tier 1. BUT, he loses the T3 synergic effect.

My 2 cents.

It's flaming and fiery burst - that's 1d6 fire damage on every hit from flaming, plus 1d6 on every hit with random Crit proc on flaming burst. They stack.

[UtherSRG]

Excuse me if this has been said already.

I know that horns do not work as yet, but I am thinking that there is something to them or something to the 20th completion.

I find the fact that there are only 2 types of essence unusual.

D&D Cosmology (as per DMG except where noted below)

Material Plane
1) Material Plane

Transitive Planes
2) Ethereal Plane*^
3) Plane of Shadow*^
4) Astral Plane^
* Coexistent with the Material Plane in DMG 3.5 p153
^ Coexistent with the Material Plane in ECS p92

Inner Planes
5) Positive Energy Plane
6) Elemental Plane of Fire
7) Elemental Plane of Earth
8) Negative Energy Plane
9) Elemental Plane of Water
10) Elemental Plane of Air

Outer Planes
Irrelevant for this discussion

Now since the Astral Plane is described as the space between the planes it may not be given an Essence, but I can not see why a Shadow Essence does not exist. The Shadow Plane is coterminous and coexistent with the Material Plane much as the Ethereal Plane is.

We're in Eberron, not generic D&D. All the planar defaults are thrown out the window.

[juniorpfactors]

+DM//EDM Khopesh:

http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/khopeshtier2.png

Nothing unexpected there. FYI you can't cast the stoneskin on other people - it's self only.

I tested the acid and holy damage. On a normal hit you get base+acid+holy as can be seen here (http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/ScreenShot00351.jpg). On a critical you get base+acid+acidburst+holy as can be seen here (http://photos.phase.net/albums/ddo/ScreenShot00353.jpg).

I hope this helps anyone still deciding on whether to go this route.

If anyone has any guesses what a good 3rd tier upgrade for 'mineral' (pos/earth) is then please let me know :)

Garth


is the sword.....green or holy animation now?

[Snoggy]

is the sword.....green or holy animation now?

After I put the acid burst on my holy longsword, it took on the green acid animation.

[apious1]

There's still one thing that people haven't yet discovered regarding upgrading Para or Quasi elemental combinations.

I reread this a few times and it occured to me that it is not the sequence (e.g. Air + Air + Positive) but the actual upgrade process he is referring to above. Maybe something to do with the horns or something else.

[juniorpfactors]

After I put the acid burst on my holy longsword, it took on the green acid animation.

are you getting all red #s in the shroud in parts 2, 4 ?

[MysticTheurge]

We're in Eberron, not generic D&D. All the planar defaults are thrown out the window.

Except what we've seen so far is actually based on traditional D&D.

That is, Eberron doesn't have para- or quasi-elemental planes, but that's still what we're seeing for tier 2 effects.

[Snoggy]

are you getting all red #s in the shroud in parts 2, 4 ?

On some of the bosses in part 2, the sword puts out all red numbers. On the riff raff in part 2, I was using my vorpal. In part 4, I snuk it out and tried it on some of the riff raff, and it was putting out red numbers on the gnolls. The devils and the pit fiend are immune to acid damage, and the pit fiend has DR that turns the first number yellow. So I switched back to my 2hander for the Pit Fiend after testing it out.

The stoneskin clicky is 16 minutes of 160 points, so that's nice. I figure I'll get some mileage out of this weapon, especially if I can upgrade it to the 4 AC boost. I just might not get as much mileage out of it in that particular raid. If I was making a weapon for the Shroud Raid, I'd probably make a maul or greatsword and go Holy + Good Burst + STR

[UtherSRG]

Except what we've seen so far is actually based on traditional D&D.

That is, Eberron doesn't have para- or quasi-elemental planes, but that's still what we're seeing for tier 2 effects.

I know. But they're only going so far, and to make the numbers work. So it doesn't matter that D&D has Astral, Ethereal, and Shadow. Turbine's decided to go with Material and Ethereal. End of story. Nothing to see here. Move along, move along.

[Venar]

It's flaming and fiery burst - that's 1d6 fire damage on every hit from flaming, plus 1d6 on every hit with random Crit proc on flaming burst. They stack



Unless someone with same elemental upgrade twice can confirm that the weapon does 2d6 base elemental damage, i don't think they stack.

[Dworkin_of_Amber]

DDO Wiki (http://ddo.enterwiki.net/page/Crafting): Updated the Altar of Devastation with the known and speculated upgrades.
Known Upgrades are Yellow for Weapons, Gold for Items
Expected Upgrades are Pink - Those that have at least 1 confirmed item in the "pattern"
No background is Suspected Upgrades.

[UtherSRG]

DDO Wiki (http://ddo.enterwiki.net/page/Crafting): Updated the Altar of Devastation with the known and speculated upgrades.
Known Upgrades are Yellow for Weapons, Gold for Items
Expected Upgrades are Pink - Those that have at least 1 confirmed item in the "pattern"
No background is Suspected Upgrades.

Sorting it by Focus is probably the least helpful sorting. Could you please sort it by Gem or Essence?

[Dworkin_of_Amber]

Sorting it by Focus is probably the least helpful sorting. Could you please sort it by Gem or Essence?

I have added a version for the Altar of Invasion sorted by Gem & Essence.
I will add similar versions later for Subjugation and Devastation... it just takes a bit of time to do that, and I wanted to focus on what is known/suspected first.

[Missing_Minds]

Sorting it by Focus is probably the least helpful sorting. Could you please sort it by Gem or Essence?

He'll have the same issues any way around. I like it sorted by Focus myself.

But here is a question for crafters.

Can you do an item in a manner such as resitance (tier 1), saves (tier 2), spell points (tier 3)? Aka jumping all over the place but still get the synergies (aka air + fire, etc.)

[UtherSRG]

I have added a version for the Altar of Invasion sorted by Gem & Essence.
I will add similar versions later for Subjugation and Devastation... it just takes a bit of time to do that, and I wanted to focus on what is known/suspected first.

Invasion: You have Blindess Immunity for EON... it should be MON. EON should be a save bonus. And you can see this difference very clearly when NOT sorted by focus.

[Kargon]

My plan for my goggles:

Neg (blindness immune, disease immune).
Pos (+50 SP, +2 CHR skills)
??? (+100 SP, +3 ??? skills)

I'm thinking about fire or earth. Anybody else tried this? Any thoughts on if there will be a special effect on the 3rd upgrade?

Kargon are plannaming a necklamace with:
Pos (+10 hp)
Neg (Tier 2 of the blind immune, disease immune... kargon see what get)
Fire (+__ hp)

Kargon let know how turn out tonight probamally at least as far as tier 1 and 2.

[UtherSRG]

Invasion: You have Blindess Immunity for EON... it should be MON. EON should be a save bonus. And you can see this difference very clearly when NOT sorted by focus.

I've fixed it.

[MysticTheurge]

Sorting it by Focus is probably the least helpful sorting. Could you please sort it by Gem or Essence?

You know the most remarkable thing about wikis...?

[Dworkin_of_Amber]

Ok, thanks for the feedback and the fix.

After looking at it more, I am beginning to agree that sorted by Gem & Essence does make more sense, and helps show the "patterns" better.

I have just swapped the view on Invasion & Subjugation to Sorted by Gem/Essence as primary, and by Element as the "Alternate View" page. There is a small possibility that any edits that happened in between might have gotten lost, so please double check (and I'll check the history too).

I did create the "New" View for Subjugation, and I'll take care of Devastation later today... kinda fried on wiki-editing for the moment.

NOTE: I will be doing all primary edits to the "Main" View (which is now sorted by Gem&Essence Types). I will try to go back every few days to update the alternate view (although I am considering dropping the Alt View completely... but I'll see what everyone wants first)

[Pecky]

I'm planning on doing a pair of goggles via air+pos+air for the +6 Cha skill boost. Has anyone tried this combo yet on an item?

[MysticTheurge]

although I am considering dropping the Alt View completely... but I'll see what everyone wants first

I'd prefer you didn't. There are advantages to sorting by focus (notably, if I want to achieve a certain combo, I can scan through what abilities are available to me while still achieving that combo).

[UtherSRG]

You know the most remarkable thing about wikis...?

Yes, I do.... I'm an admin on Wikipedia. :D I was also written up in Wired a few years back for my work on Wikipedia.


I'd prefer you didn't. There are advantages to sorting by focus (notably, if I want to achieve a certain combo, I can scan through what abilities are available to me while still achieving that combo).

Agreed... sorting by focus has a use, just not as the first sort, and especially while we are still discovering some of the patterns.

[Dworkin_of_Amber]

Ok, I'll leave it in place, and do what I can to keep it updated.
I just swapped the view on Devastation, but I forgot to backup the old version, so I'll have to fiddle around the create the Devastation Alternate View Page... and I'll try to get that done this afternoon... I really do need to go eat some lunch here at some point!


@Pecky - I don't think anyone has tried that combo yet. It should work for the +6 CHA Skills and +SP... the question is what kind of Tier 3 Effect (if any) you will get... so try it out, and let us know... the only way to learn all of this is trial and error and reporting your results... so good luck!

[Pecky]

@Pecky - I don't think anyone has tried that combo yet. It should work for the +6 CHA Skills and +SP... the question is what kind of Tier 3 Effect (if any) you will get... so try it out, and let us know... the only way to learn all of this is trial and error and reporting your results... so good luck!

It'll be a while yet. I'm still several large an some medium ingredients away but when I get it done, I'll let you know.

*edit*

BTW, Amber is my favorite fantasy series of all time.

[Garth_of_Sarlona]

I'm planning on doing a pair of goggles via air+pos+air for the +6 Cha skill boost. Has anyone tried this combo yet on an item?

No, but I'm going pos/air/pos on goggles so we can compare results :)

Garth

[Pecky]

No, but I'm going pos/air/pos on goggles so we can compare results :)

Garth
*smirk*

And you'll probably have yours done before me. I'm almost done collectin for Tier 2. Just need tier 3 stuff.

[SneakThief]

Invasion: You have Blindess Immunity for EON... it should be MON. EON should be a save bonus. And you can see this difference very clearly when NOT sorted by focus.
I find the most useful order for research is Essence/Gem/Focus ... The patterns are VERY clear at that point.

[SneakThief]

I know. But they're only going so far, and to make the numbers work. So it doesn't matter that D&D has Astral, Ethereal, and Shadow. Turbine's decided to go with Material and Ethereal. End of story. Nothing to see here. Move along, move along.

Nothing more to see for now. They are adding more raid recipies in mod 7 (More green steel blanks and more shroud recipies).

If you look at it this way. Right now there are 6 useable raid ingridients. Thats 15 unique combinations, 3 of which do nothing right now. When the recipies with horns are added, it jumps to 35 unique combinations. I suspect horns arent "supposed" to be dropping yet, and that there may be a 7th Vale raw as well (that isnt dropping yet).

[UtherSRG]

For no particular reason that to have someplace convenient for me to find it, here are my Shroud loot plans for my Wizard:


Sceptre

EEF: +6 INT (done)
EEN: +1 INT (done)
EEN: +2 INT (need ingredients and shard)


Goggles

EEN: Wiz VI, Int Skills +1 (done)
EEF: +50 sp, Int Skills +2 (done)
EEN: +100 sp, Int Skills +3 (need ingredients and shard)


Helm

MON: Blindness & Disease Immunity
MON: Proof Against Poison & Fear Immunity
MON: Deathblock/Deathward?


Belt - if the FNN Sceptre works out to be a good combo, I'll do EPP. If the NFN goggles have a good combo, I'll do PEP. Otherwise I'll do PEE, PPE, EPE, or EEP

ME[PE]: +10 hp, +1 CON skills
ME[PE]: +15 hp, +2 CON skills
ME[PE]: +20 hp, +3 CON skills

[Waterboy]

For no particular reason that to have someplace convenient for me to find it, here are my Shroud loot plans for my Wizard:


Sceptre

EEF: +6 INT (done)
EEN: +1 INT (need shard)
EEN: +2 INT


Goggles

EEN: Wiz VI, Int Skills +1 (need shard)
EEF: +50 sp, Int Skills +2
EEN: +100 sp, Int Skills +3


Helm

MON: Blindness & Disease Immunity
MON: Proof Against Poison?
MON: Deathblock/Deathward?


Belt - if the FNN Sceptre works out to be a good combo, I'll do EPP. If the NFN goggles have a good combo, I'll do PEP. Otherwise I'll do PEE, PPE, EPE, or EEP

ME[PE]: +10 hp, +1 CON skills
ME[PE]: +15 hp, +2 CON skills
ME[PE]: +20 hp, +3 CON skills


But you cannot have more than 1 item equipped at a time right?

[Pecky]

But you cannot have more than 1 item equipped at a time right?
Until we learn how to cleanse them, correct.

I think he could equip them all at the same time but I have a feeling he'd be dead in about 0.51 seconds.

[UtherSRG]

But you cannot have more than 1 item equipped at a time right?

Not without taking damage, until we learn the Ritual of Cleansing. However, that doesn't stop me from crafting them. (And weapons don't count for this, so I'll be at least able to wield the scepter and wear the goggles.)

[digz]

Well I did an earth + earth + positive, all etheral/escalation on my goggles finished tonight, and there was nothing special on them on the end product.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg99/Evildrider/DreckosGoggles.jpg

These ony had WizVI , Spell power ,Wis +1, and summon at tier2 right?

when you added positive on last alter it added Greater spell power,Wis+2 and both Cha +1 and +2 ?

[SneakThief]

These ony had WizVI , Spell power ,Wis +1, and summon at tier2 right?

when you added positive on last alter it added Greater spell power,Wis+2 and both Cha +1 and +2 ?

Level 1: Wizadry 6 and +1 Wisdom Skills
Level 2: +50 SP and +2 Wisdom Skills
Combo Earth: Summon Dense Earth Elemental (CR12)
Level 3: +100 SP and +3 Charisma Skills

[Cambo]

Hi All,
Just got back to Australia from Peurto Rico. --30 hours Travelling
Sorry for the delay in updating for a few days..Will catch up in the next 24 hours.

Cheers All

[Hendrik]

Here is my Commander Helm with second upgrade so far.

Material/Escalation/Earth then Material/Escalation/Fire

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb1/twiafu/Commander_WIZ_VI.jpg

Plan to see what Material/Escalation/Positive will do for it.

[Angelus_dead]

Unless someone with same elemental upgrade twice can confirm that the weapon does 2d6 base elemental damage, i don't think they stack.
How many times do you need them to confirm it?

[MysticTheurge]

They are adding more raid recipies in mod 7 (More green steel blanks and more shroud recipies).

Where have you seen this?


Level 1: Wizadry 6 and +1 Wisdom Skills
Level 2: +50 SP and +2 Wisdom Skills
Combo Earth: Summon Dense Earth Elemental (CR12)
Level 3: +100 SP and +3 Charisma Skills

For those who haven't noticed, item descriptions have their effects grouped in chronological order (except clickie icons) and generally end with the "affinity" or "aspect" or the like.

So the item screenshot for the above lists:

(---- Tier I -----)
Wizardy VI
+1 Wisdom Skills
Earth Affinity
(---- Tier II ----)
+50 SPs
+2 Wisdom Skills
Aspect of Earth
(---- Tier III ---)
+100 SPs
+3 Charisma Skills

[SteeleTrueheart]

We're in Eberron, not generic D&D. All the planar defaults are thrown out the window.

Quote: MysticTheurge

Except what we've seen so far is actually based on traditional D&D.

That is, Eberron doesn't have para- or quasi-elemental planes, but that's still what we're seeing for tier 2 effects.
___________________________

As per the list I put up earlier Eberron certainly does have all of the Transitive Planes that DnD core has. Also it is clear that the available upgrades are based on the six Inner Planes of DnD core and not the 13 Eberron planes. So there should be a shadow essence.

Since there is definitely 1 more ingredient (which is not currently working) so there remains possibilities of further recipes. Mod 6.1 or 7.0 seem to be a likely time for changes to be implemented.

On a side note has anyone crunched the numbers and actually shown that with the currently known combinations that there are ~1200 total possibilities?

[Yuhjn]

Here is my Commander Helm with second upgrade so far.

Material/Escalation/Earth then Material/Escalation/Fire

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb1/twiafu/Commander_WIZ_VI.jpg

Plan to see what Material/Escalation/Positive will do for it.



I wouldnt do that if I were you.

You have an earth/fire which is para-elemental.

If you try to add positive you'll be trying to make para-quasi-elemental which the devs have stated does not exist in the game.

The result, you wont get anything special from the 3rd combination table (things like disruption and earthgrab)

[UtherSRG]

I wouldnt do that if I were you.

You have an earth/fire which is para-elemental.

If you try to add positive you'll be trying to make para-quasi-elemental which the devs have stated does not exist in the game.

The result, you wont get anything special from the 3rd combination table (things like disruption and earthgrab)

Agreed.... Air or Water is what should be added to get a yet-unknown 3rd tier combo effect.

[Wizzly_Bear]

Agreed.... Air or Water is what should be added to get a yet-unknown 3rd tier combo effect.
id suggest fire myself, try to do a second combo with the earth affinity to try for "magma II"

[DNDJESS]

2nd tier item - medium material, essence, and opposition = lesser evil guard 1d6 damage per hit.

[SneakThief]

Where have you seen this?


It was in a response to a pm I sent to Eladrin. Let me find it .... (can I get points for posting a pm?) :D



Would you (could you) confirm or deny the ability to create green steel armors and/or the missing weapons?

I'm afraid I can't comment too much on what can or cannot be made... But if something were to be unable to be made right now, there's always a chance that it'll be able to be made in the future.

There's no kama or quarterstaff in the weapon lists, for instance. There will be a way to create a green steel kama or quarterstaff in M7.

So thats the blanks recipes ... And horns arent "bugged" per se, as only as items that are currently usable in a recipe are not rejected by the alters (ex: only the type of soul gem needed for the adamantine ritual is accepted by the alter currently, but we know the other types will be used at some point). Any recipe involving horns would be a new shroud recipe.

[MysticTheurge]

can I get points for posting a pm?

Sometimes. But thanks for sharing! :D ;)

[Hendrik]

Thank you for the tips everyone!!!

:)

[Kargon]

Tier 1 (Known)Materimial/ escalatimion / Positive

Tier 2 (NEW!) Materimial/ Oppositimion / Negamative = proof poison, immune fear

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y68/FusionBlast/PosNegNeck.jpg

Plan are go Material / escalatimion / fire for tier 3

[Tanka]

Huh. I wonder what the 3rd tier is for the Immunity items.

[rpasell]

I don't see this updated yet.

Material + Opposition + Negative + Goggles = Disease Immunity Green steel Goggles:

Taint
Blindness Immunity
Disease Immunity
Neg Energy Affinity

I have screen shots PM and I'll email them to you if you'd like to post them here (I don't have photo bucket et. al. and don't intend to register one)

[Angelus_dead]

Huh. I wonder what the 3rd tier is for the Immunity items.
Deathblock seems like a natural, but probably there will be something else with it.
Charm-immunity? Freedom of Movement would be grand...

[Venar]

Maybe some SR. Or Heavy Fort.


BTW, i have a tempered item (water + Fire).

I'm thinking, if something is tempered, Air would keep the balance right?

[Wutinni]

Material - Opposition - Negative (Blindness ward and Disease)
http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q130/wutinni/1stupgrade.jpg

Material - Opposition - Negative 2nd Upgrade (Poison and Fear Immunity)
http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q130/wutinni/2ndupgrade.jpg

[Tanka]

Deathblock seems like a natural, but probably there will be something else with it.
Charm-immunity? Freedom of Movement would be grand...
I'm hoping for Death Ward (as in full protection like the spell, not just protection from Death-effects) and FoM.

Considering only one item in the game has perma-FoM, and it's raid loot, I could see it happening.

[MysticTheurge]

Maybe some SR. Or Heavy Fort.

Deathblock and Heavy Fort seem like a natural combination.

With the added "flavor" advantage that it's making you more undead-like, since it is using a negative energy focus.

[Angelus_dead]

I'm hoping for Death Ward (as in full protection like the spell, not just protection from Death-effects) and FoM.
Deathward seems unlikely, since there is a separate recipe series for a percentage resistance to negative energy damage. They wouldn't kill the value of that line by allowing 100% resistance in a single step.

However, I suppose something like Negative-level immunity could go in.

[Cambo]

It appears that the maker of these goggles which use material + Escalation + Earth did not get the full potential of the Tier Three addition which unlocks the full potential of the item or maybe there is no special earth ability. What is the difference between this example and the goggles which mavnimo made which appear to have reached the full potential with the greater disruption guard ability (
Supreme Tyrant Green Steel Bracers of Positive Energy (Mavnimo) Ethereal + Escalation + Positive x 3..)? They both have the same element all three times one is earth and the other is positive so why doesn't earth get its special ability?....

I have been told by PM even though it does not show up in the description that Earth Earth Eath grants Moderate Good Guard (1d8 damage vs Evil) as seen in the wearers caombat log.

Earth Earth Earth = Moderate Good Guard/ Good Guard (Exact Description unkown) 1d8 vs Evil

[Angelus_dead]

I have been told by PM even though it does not show up in the description that Earth Earth Eath grants Moderate Good Guard (1d8 damage vs Evil) as seen in the wearers caombat log.

Earth Earth Earth = Moderate Good Guard/ Good Guard (Exact Description unkown) 1d8 vs Evil
Do you have a screenshot of the item? That sounds very suspicious, and I'd bet that this player actually put Positive on tier 3 instead.

[Ilandrya]

Referring to my earlier post, it was stated by a dev its possible to get magma "I" and magma "II"

magma is a combination of two elements. in order to get two aspects of magma, there have to be two "pairings"
there are two pairings possible:

aspect + focus2 and aspect + focus3

or

aspect + focus2 and focus2 + focus3


I suspect it's the first.

For second level bonuses your pairings have to complement each other to get a bonus.

We know that in general Aspect of Air, Aspect of Air pairings works for bonuses, so its safe to say that two of the same aspect will give you a second level bonus.

I suspect that:

element a, element b, element b will also give you a second level bonus. For example:

earth, fire, fire should be magma I and II
fire, earth, earth should also be magma I and II
earth,fire,earth would be aspect of magma and aspect of earth, which may or may not result in a second bonus
fire,earth,fire would be aspect of magma and aspect of fire, which may or may not result in a second bonus

[Borror0]

However, I suppose something like Negative-level immunity could go in.

Deathblock and Heavy Fortification then?

[Cowdenicus]

so basically what Eladrin is saying with no para-quasis and such is if you started some goggles with positive (and have yet to upgrade a second or third time) you have basically wasted a set of goggles?

[Mavnimo]

(Standard): Altar of Invasion success with Shavarath Shard Formulation! Consumed: Diluted Ethereal Essence, Inferior Focus of Negative Energy, Cloudy Gem of Opposition, Shavarath Low Energy Cell. Created: Shard of Power. Shard of Power becomes Shard of Power.

(Standard): Altar of Invasion success with Shavarath Transformation! Consumed: Shavarath Low Energy Cell, Shard of Power. Created: Green Steel Goggles. Green Steel Goggles becomes Lieutenant Green Steel Goggles of Resistance (Fortitude).

Negative, Ethereal, Opposition for first upgrade

(Standard): Altar of Subjugation success with Shavarath Shard Formulation! Consumed: Material Essence, Focus of Negative Energy, Shavarath Medium Energy Cell, Gem of Opposition. Created: Shard of Great Power. Shard of Great Power becomes Shard of Great Power.

(Standard): Altar of Subjugation success with Shavarath Transformation! Consumed: Shavarath Medium Energy Cell, Shard of Great Power. Created: Lieutenant Green Steel Goggles of Resistance (Fortitude). Lieutenant Green Steel Goggles of Resistance (Fortitude) becomes Proof against Poison Green Steel Goggles of Resistance (Fortitude).

Negative, Material, Opposition for second upgrade

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/Mavnimo/NegNeg.jpg

[UtherSRG]

so basically what Eladrin is saying with no para-quasis and such is if you started some goggles with positive (and have yet to upgrade a second or third time) you have basically wasted a set of goggles?

No. You can go PPP for the Greater Disruption Guard and the True Res clickie. I'd hardly call those wasted. And I don't think anyone has tried PNelemental yet.

[MysticTheurge]

so basically what Eladrin is saying with no para-quasis and such is if you started some goggles with positive (and have yet to upgrade a second or third time) you have basically wasted a set of goggles?


No. You can go PPP for the Greater Disruption Guard and the True Res clickie. I'd hardly call those wasted. And I don't think anyone has tried PNelemental yet.

P-N-? seem as though it's telling us it has possibilities. We just don't know what they are yet.

[UtherSRG]

P-N-? seem as though it's telling us it has possibilities. We just don't know what they are yet.

Yup. But will all PN-elemental combinations result in a third tier combo, or will only some? And do the gem and/or essence make a difference there? And how about if it is a weapon vs. a non-weapon?

[Venar]

Too bad about the immunity pairing.

Blindness + Fear Immune would have been perfect for Warforged.
Blindness + Poison would have been perfect for paladins.

Oh well.

[Eladrin]

so basically what Eladrin is saying with no para-quasis and such is if you started some goggles with positive (and have yet to upgrade a second or third time) you have basically wasted a set of goggles?
I never said that.

If you put Positive on it at stage one, you have quite a number of possibilities open to you at the end.

[Wizzly_Bear]

Too bad about the immunity pairing.

Blindness + Fear Immune would have been perfect for Warforged.
Blindness + Poison would have been perfect for paladins.

Oh well.
pretty sure thats why they did that like that :rolleyes:

[Garth_of_Sarlona]

If you put Positive on it at stage one, you have quite a number of possibilities open to you at the end.

Eladrin,

Can you confirm whether all 2nd tier para or quasi elemental combinations can be successfully upgraded into a 3rd tier 'bonus special effect', or just some of them?

Garth

[Inkblack]

Eladrin,

A couple of questions:

1) Are we on the right track by listing bonuses by focus only? Or do we need to rethink this method?

2) Does each Tier 1/Tier 2 focus combination have a bonus ability that can be unlocked at Tier 3?

3) Do the Tier 1/Tier 2 focus combinations have one and only one Tier 3 focus that unlocks a bonus ability?

4) Are the Tier 3 bonuses listed in the description of the item? Or are some missing a description like the much debated Earth-Earth-Earth in an item (non-weapon) slot giving a hidden form of good guard?

EDIT:
5) Are the Tier 3 focus required for a bonus ability different depending upon whether an item or weapon is being upgraded? On some or all of the Tier 1/Tier 2 focus combinations?

Thanks,
Ink

[Eladrin]

Can you confirm whether all 2nd tier para or quasi elemental combinations can be successfully upgraded into a 3rd tier 'bonus special effect', or just some of them?
All of them can be successfully upgraded.

I can't answer most of the other questions.


Earth-Earth-Earth in an item (non-weapon) slot giving a hidden form of good guard?
That should be showing something as a tier three Earth upgrade. It's possible the description was accidentally set to "don't display" or otherwise acting oddly, I'll have someone investigate it.

[apious1]

Eladrin,

A couple of questions:

1) Are we on the right track by listing bonuses by focus only? Or do we need to rethink this method?

2) Does each Tier 1/Tier 2 focus combination have a bonus ability that can be unlocked at Tier 3?

3) Do the Tier 1/Tier 2 focus combinations have one and only one Tier 3 focus that unlocks a bonus ability?

4) Are the Tier 3 bonuses listed in the description of the item? Or are some missing a description like the much debated Earth-Earth-Earth in an item (non-weapon) slot giving a hidden form of good guard?

Thanks,
Ink

All good questions. My only other questions would be:
1. Based on your previous comment about "special" upgrades, are these NOT based on Focus Type?

2. Why don't the Altars accept the Horns, e.g. is this intended or a bug?

I know my questions are a little too direct, but I figured I would give it a shot.

[Dane_McArdy]

Eladrin,

It would be nice to see the questions about the Horns addressed. If they are an item that was orginally intended as part of the recipes and then removed, let us know. I have to say, getting a horn that has no use, in place of a item I do need, is frustrating.

If the horns have a yet undiscovered use, say that, so we know.

However, I'm sure you are aware of the horns and the questions about them. I don't want a spoiler, but confirmation that they are intened for a yet undiscovered use, or a mistake. If it's a mistake, I forgive you already, and won't yell or scream over it, cause mistakes happen.

[Eladrin]

Eladrin,

It would be nice to see the questions about the Horns addressed. If they are an item that was orginally intended as part of the recipes and then removed, let us know. I have to say, getting a horn that has no use, in place of a item I do need, is frustrating.

If the horns have a yet undiscovered use, say that, so we know.

However, I'm sure you are aware of the horns and the questions about them. I don't want a spoiler, but confirmation that they are intened for a yet undiscovered use, or a mistake. If it's a mistake, I forgive you already, and won't yell or scream over it, cause mistakes happen.
Re: Horns

Someone was a noob and didn't take them out of the treasure tables. They'll be given a (useful) use in the future.

[mgoldb2]

At the moment am leaning toward believing that the number of third tier effects is equal to the number of second tier effect. I thing you will find for that any double element/pos/neg will give nothing for third tier unless you go triple same.

for something like

Air/fire/X
fire/air/X

Am leaning toward will have same results.

The example that the dev said was different had different second tier results. I believe that why they are not the same. Not because the order of all 3 matters in all cases.

That my theory till I see results contradicting it.

[apious1]

Re: Horns

Someone was a noob and didn't take them out of the treasure tables. They'll be given a (useful) use in the future.

Wow, finally...now I am going to sell them on the AH for a ridiculous price and get rid of them finally. J/K of course ;)

THANK YOU, VERY, VERY, VERY MUCH for the clarification!!!!!!! :) :) :)

Since you are being so generous with answers this morning, maybe I should throw in my still unanswered question...do you know where all of the Potency/Spell Pen VIII items/weapons are being hidden?

[jjflanigan]

At the moment am leaning toward believing that the number of third tier effects is equal to the number of second tier effect. I thing you will find for that any double element/pos/neg will give nothing for third tier unless you go triple same.

for something like

Air/fire/X
fire/air/X

Am leaning toward will have same results.

The example that the dev said was different had different second tier results. I believe that why they are not the same. Not because the order of all 3 matters in all cases.

That my theory till I see results contradicting it.


Well, we know for a fact that there is SOMETHING you can add to "Air/Fire" or "Fire/Air" at the third tier to give it a third tier effect. They devs already stated that you can upgrade the things like "smoke" or "magma" up to "smoke II" or "magma II"...it's just a matter of figuring out what you have to do to reach that upgraded level.

[Dane_McArdy]

Re: Horns

Someone was a noob and didn't take them out of the treasure tables. They'll be given a (useful) use in the future.

I forgive the noob his mistake.

Thanks for the answer, and an idea that I should hold onto any I get.

I don't know what use you have planned for them, but a suggestion: Wild card! you can trade a medium horn in for a small ingredient of your choice?

[mgoldb2]

Well, we know for a fact that there is SOMETHING you can add to "Air/Fire" or "Fire/Air" at the third tier to give it a third tier effect. They devs already stated that you can upgrade the things like "smoke" or "magma" up to "smoke II" or "magma II"...it's just a matter of figuring out what you have to do to reach that upgraded level.

Agreed but am saying that something is the same for air/fire and fire/air.

There 21 secound tier effects. Am saying there are 21 third tier effects also. I could turn out to be completly wrong but that what am leaning toward at momment.

[jjflanigan]

Agreed but am saying that something is the same for air/fire and fire/air.

There 21 secound tier effects. Am saying there are 21 third tier effects also. I could turn out to be completly wrong but that what am leaning toward at momment.

I gotcha, I'm sorry, I misread your post and thought you were saying that there was nothing you could do with those combinations to get a bonus tier 3 effect.

[Vaarsuvius]

Eladrin,

A couple of questions:

1) Are we on the right track by listing bonuses by focus only? Or do we need to rethink this method?

Thanks,
Ink

I mentioned this earlier and got no response, it was in regards to exsistencial stalemate as to whether or not the potencial could be unlocked by switchig the etherial and matierial portions of the recipe as well as the pos/neg focus.

It would open up alot more possibilites for powers or it could be just oe of the few more difficult 3rd tier powers eladrin eluded to earlier.


V

[MysticTheurge]

I forgive the noob his mistake.

Never!

"Thou shalt not suffer a noob to make mistakes."

[apious1]

Oh yeah, one more question Eladrin, are you aware that the loot tables for the ingredients are not balanced? Currently, Sulfurous Stones and Demon Scales are MUCH rarer than any other ingredient regardless of the size (e.g. Small, Medium, or Large). I function as the guild banker for all of our ingredients and I run this raid a lot and I have heard the same from everyone else. This is how I have come to this conclusion.

Edit: To give some perspective, I currently have about 20-30 Small and Medium Bones, Chains, and Arrowheads and only 1-5 Stones or Scales.

[Dane_McArdy]

Never!

"Thou shalt not suffer a noob to make mistakes."

But I've always forgiven you, MT! Should I stop doing that?

[apious1]

I forgive the noob his mistake.

Thanks for the answer, and an idea that I should hold onto any I get.

I don't know what use you have planned for them, but a suggestion: Wild card! you can trade a medium horn in for a small ingredient of your choice?

OR...maybe they can be used to break down items/weapons into their base ingredients AFTER they have already been upgraded. I know there are plenty of us that have made items/weapons we wish we could go back and re-do. BTW, some of this stems from having to rush to build your stuff at the altars b/c everyone is standing around impatiently waiting for you to do so.

[Ilandrya]

Oh yeah, one more question Eladrin, are you aware that the loot tables for the ingredients are not balanced? Currently, Sulfurous Stones and Demon Scales are MUCH rarer than any other ingredient regardless of the size (e.g. Small, Medium, or Large). I function as the guild banker for all of our ingredients and I run this raid a lot and I have heard the same from everyone else. This is how I have come to this conclusion.

Edit: To give some perspective, I currently have about 20-30 Small and Medium Bones, Chains, and Arrowheads and only 1-5 Stones or Scales.

I've run the shroud about 5 times now, and of the six ingredients, I have more devil scales than anything else. I've pulled 1-2 a run on average. I'm not sure what the formula is for how they drop, but, that is my experience. For me, it's been scales, bones, arrowheads for the top three. The other three barely drop for me thus far... offhand, I think it's one of each.

[incubo]

I think we could trade with one another to make a nice balance :D

[Dane_McArdy]

I've run the shroud about 5 times now, and of the six ingredients, I have more devil scales than anything else. I've pulled 1-2 a run on average. I'm not sure what the formula is for how they drop, but, that is my experience. For me, it's been scales, bones, arrowheads for the top three. The other three barely drop for me thus far... offhand, I think it's one of each.

And I couldn't get any shrapnal for small, but I have tons of stones and scales left over from medium, which my friends are thankful for. That means I pulled 6 medium stones from all the runs, because I belive I only needed 2 stones for my second upgrade.

[Aranticus]

got the great commander goggles but still did not get improved regeneration, instead i have lesser good guard on it

http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc115/Aranticus/ScreenShot00141.jpg

[Garth_of_Sarlona]

got the great commander goggles but still did not get improved regeneration, instead i have lesser good guard on it

That is because you went +DM on your second upgrade rather than +OM. But it's good to get a confirmed screenshot of the stats of 2nd tier +DM anyway :)

Garth

[apious1]

I think we could trade with one another to make a nice balance :D

If you are on Ghallanda, see my thread:
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=136944

[Inkblack]

I have updated my spreadsheet to start tracking Tier 3 upgrades without bonus abilities. There are only 432 possibilities. :(

One unrelated request: can anyone confirm Arrowheads, Chains, Scale, Shrapnel is a failure? I can't seem to pull arrowheads at any level, despite being ransacked several times.

Ink

[Mad_Bombardier]

got the great commander goggles but still did not get improved regeneration, instead i have lesser good guard on it[Off topic]Aranticus, why do you have two stacks of <100 Haste and <100 CSW potions? Are you two-fisting the potions again? I think someone may need a visit to Alchemists Anonymous... :p [/Off Topic]

[UtherSRG]

I have updated my spreadsheet to start tracking Tier 3 upgrades without bonus abilities. There are only 432 possibilities. :(

One unrelated request: can anyone confirm Arrowheads, Chains, Scale, Shrapnel is a failure? I can't seem to pull arrowheads at any level, despite being ransacked several times.

Ink

I think you're due to post the link to your spreadsheet.... it's been long enough. ;)

[Kaboth]

Re: Horns


Someone was a noob and didn't take them out of the treasure tables. They'll be given a (useful) use in the future.

OK so does that mean we should KEEP the horns we get and they will be eventually be of use retroactively... Or does that mean, trash them for now only the new ones will be of use to us. We have to ask because its hard to figure out what Turbine can and can not utilize retroactively.

[Inkblack]

I think you're due to post the link to your spreadsheet.... it's been long enough. ;)

It's in my signature, but since you insist ;):

/plug
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pLaIqDL_IzJRx5CcCEpCaYg

Ink

[Aranticus]

[Off topic]Aranticus, why do you have two stacks of <100 Haste and <100 CSW potions? Are you two-fisting the potions again? I think someone may need a visit to Alchemists Anonymous... :p [/Off Topic]

i like to keep hotbared potions topped at 100, used some so i have 2 stacks of non 100 :p

but yes me pot junkie :D

[Aranticus]

That is because you went +DM on your second upgrade rather than +OM. But it's good to get a confirmed screenshot of the stats of 2nd tier +DM anyway :)

Garth

bah me noobie! lol

[Ilandrya]

got the great commander goggles but still did not get improved regeneration, instead i have lesser good guard on it

http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc115/Aranticus/ScreenShot00141.jpg


Hmmm... this is interesting. At the second upgrade you got lesser good guard, which does 1d4
so, minor guard maybe 1d2?

but

first level ele guard which is minor guard does 1d4

and

http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii213/megatonsamurai/-DM_AEM_Gloves.jpg
first level evil guard which is minor guard does 1d6


Anyone else confused? I'm thinking maybe because good affects more mobs than the others it's 1d2 at first upgrade, eles which have the next most successful 1d4, and evil, the least most successful, at 1d6. Or maybe this is an error? Nothing to indicate they stack either. Oh Eladrin.....

[Mad_Bombardier]

Hmmm... this is interesting. At the second upgrade you got lesser good guard, which does 1d4
so, minor guard maybe 1d2?

but

first level ele guard which is minor guard does 1d4

and

first level evil guard which is minor guard does 1d6

anyone else confused? I'm thinking maybe because good affects more mobs than the others it's 1d2 at first upgrade, eles which have the next most successful damage 1d4, and evil, the least most successful, at 1d6. Or maybe this is an error? Oh Eladrin.....Has to be a typo/error... Unless evil is simply more damaging.

Minor Guard 50&#37; chance of 1d4 (with an exception for Minor Evil Guard 50% 1d6?)
Lesser Guard 1d4 (as from tier2 or random loot)
Guard 1d8 (as from random loot)

[Dworkin_of_Amber]

Here is my Commander Helm with second upgrade so far.

Material/Escalation/Earth then Material/Escalation/Fire

http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb1/twiafu/Commander_WIZ_VI.jpg

Plan to see what Material/Escalation/Positive will do for it.

Just to post a correction, this upgrade must be Earth/Escalation/Ethereal then Fire/Escalation/Ethereal
Not Material. Material would have given +10 HP & +1 Con Skills at Invasion and (I believe) +15 HP & +2 Dex Skills at Subjugation.

So make sure any updates record this as EEE (Item) // FEE (Item).

[UtherSRG]

It's in my signature, but since you insist ;):

/plug
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pLaIqDL_IzJRx5CcCEpCaYg

Ink

LOL! I spaced on that. Ok, so you didn't need to post it. Ok...

From previous posts:
Earth/Earth/Positive - nothing on item
Neg/Neg/Pos - nothing on item

[Dworkin_of_Amber]

Has to be a typo/error... Unless evil is simply more damaging.

Minor Guard 50% chance of 1d4 (with an exception for Minor Evil Guard 50% 1d6?)
Lesser Guard 1d4
Guard 1d8

Does anyone have SS links for the other confirmed Minor Guards & Lesser Guards.

It appears that Mad_B is correct... Minor Guard is 50% chance of 1d4 or 1d6... Lesser Guard is 100% chance of 1d4... and Guard or Greater Guard should be 100% chance for 1d8 (or more?)

[Yuhjn]

I never said that.

If you put Positive on it at stage one, you have quite a number of possibilities open to you at the end.



If you put positive on first you can put any single element on later and it will be Quasi.

It's only para-quasi if you put positive, and then two different elements on it.

Hope this helps

[Endrik]

InkBlack,
Great work on keeping the spreadsheet updated... You're sorting through an intimidating amount of information from day to day...

In addition to validating the AOE effects for tier 2 (Insight Bonus to Reflex of +1) <-- You've already updated

I did manage to get a screen of the Air/Air effect. (3x lvl 16 Haste, which is REALLY nice when my cleric wants to get out of dodge with a pile of soul stones)

http://www.ddo.fulltimenuke.net/GreatCommanderReflex.jpg

[SneakThief]

Tier 1 (Known)Materimial/ escalatimion / Positive
Tier 2 (NEW!) Materimial/ Oppositimion / Negamative = proof poison, immune fear

Plan are go Material / escalatimion / fire for tier 3
Aww .... you should go Negative again :D No one has seen triple Negative yet :D Besides the combo, level three is looking to be pretty decent.


Deathward seems unlikely, since there is a separate recipe series for a percentage resistance to negative energy damage. They wouldn't kill the value of that line by allowing 100% resistance in a single step.

However, I suppose something like Negative-level immunity could go in.
The percent negative energy resistance is the SAME recipe, just on weapons instead of items.



Re: Horns

Someone was a noob and didn't take them out of the treasure tables. They'll be given a (useful) use in the future.
Hmmm.

When the recipies with horns are added, it jumps to 35 unique combinations. I suspect horns arent "supposed" to be dropping yet, and that there may be a 7th Vale raw as well (that isnt dropping yet).


And horns arent "bugged" per se, as only as items that are currently usable in a recipe are not rejected by the alters (ex: only the type of soul gem needed for the adamantine ritual is accepted by the alter currently, but we know the other types will be used at some point). Any recipe involving horns would be a new shroud recipe.


I have updated my spreadsheet to start tracking Tier 3 upgrades without bonus abilities. There are only 432 possibilities. :(

One unrelated request: can anyone confirm Arrowheads, Chains, Scale, Shrapnel is a failure? I can't seem to pull arrowheads at any level, despite being ransacked several times.

Ink
I wil try that one tonight for ya. Do you have a result on Bone/Chain/Shrap/Stone or Bone/Scale/Shrap/Stone?

[Inkblack]

I wil try that one tonight for ya. Do you have a result on Bone/Chain/Shrap/Stone or Bone/Scale/Shrap/Stone?

Tested both personally, they were failures.

Ink

[Venar]

Since the helm is the only part that we will see on our character avatar, has anyone made a different version then the ugly "black guard" helm?
Would be nice if helm graphic were random.

[Airie]

Hey, this has probably been covered already, but I haven't seen it. So can anyone who's crafted one of these items confirm what the stat SKILL bonuses apply to from these raid loots?

For example... Lets say hypothetically I am a cleric. I make the goggles that give me +200 sp and +6 to my wisdom-based skills. That latter bonus, the wisdom-based skills bonus, what will it affect for my hypothetical cleric?

- Spell points?
- Heal skill obviously.
- Spell DCs?
- Wisdom-based saving throws?


I am more interested in the Charisma and Intelligence items, but the wisdom makes a good example. Can anyone who's made one of these, even at the lower tiers, confirm which items in that list would benefit? Muchas Gracias

[Mad_Bombardier]

For example... Lets say hypothetically I am a cleric. I make the goggles that give me +200 sp and +6 to my wisdom-based skills. That latter bonus, the wisdom-based skills bonus, what will it affect for my hypothetical cleric?It only boosts WIS skills, which are Heal, Listen, and Spot.

[juniorpfactors]

Since the helm is the only part that we will see on our character avatar, has anyone made a different version then the ugly "black guard" helm?
Would be nice if helm graphic were random.

its the best looking helm in the game....

[UtherSRG]

Hey, this has probably been covered already, but I haven't seen it. So can anyone who's crafted one of these items confirm what the stat SKILL bonuses apply to from these raid loots?

For example... Lets say hypothetically I am a cleric. I make the goggles that give me +200 sp and +6 to my wisdom-based skills. That latter bonus, the wisdom-based skills bonus, what will it affect for my hypothetical cleric?

- Spell points?
- Heal skill obviously.
- Spell DCs?
- Wisdom-based saving throws?


I am more interested in the Charisma and Intelligence items, but the wisdom makes a good example. Can anyone who's made one of these, even at the lower tiers, confirm which items in that list would benefit? Muchas Gracias

Spell points are not a skill, so they are not boosted. Heal is a Wisdom based skill, so it is boosted; so are Listen and Spot (these three are the only WIS skills in DDO, and are explicitly called out on the upgraded item). Spell DC is not a skill so it is not boosted. Saving throws are not skills so they are not boosted.

The only things that a stat skill enhancer modifies are skills.

[Venar]

its the best looking helm in the game....

Well, tastes vary, i think it makes us look like an idiot. As a caster, i'd rather have a tiara, or better yet, a hood.

[Tanka]

For those curious as to which stat skill boosts will increase what, I give you the following:

Strength
Jump
Swim

Dexterity
Balance
Hide
Move Silently
Open Lock
Tumble

Constitution
Concentration

Intelligence
Disable Device
Repair
Search

Wisdom
Heal
Listen
Spot

Charisma
Bluff
Diplomacy
Haggle
Intimidate
Perform
Use Magic Device

[Dworkin_of_Amber]

Another Simple Way to describe the effect.

The +Skills effect *ONLY* increases the numbers found on your Character Sheet --> Skills Tab. That is it. Period. End of Sentence.

[Wulf_Ratbane]

Tested both personally, they were failures.

Ink

Hey Ink-- First off, thx for your hard work. Your spreadsheet is a great resource and great fun.

Can you tell me what the red background color through the Tier2 combination of Earth/Water is for?

I hope it just means "Unknown."

For the record, following the revealed cosmology so far, I would expect it to be an Aspect of Ooze.

(If you have time, a key for each of the colors you use would be helpful.)

[juniorpfactors]

Well, tastes vary, i think it makes us look like an idiot. As a caster, i'd rather have a tiara, or better yet, a hood.

a tiara.....lol tiara= showhelmetoff lmao
hood ok i guess

[Kargon]

Aww .... you should go Negative again :D No one has seen triple Negative yet :D Besides the combo, level three is looking to be pretty decent.


How would Posimitive / negamative / negamative be 'triple negamative'? ;)

Besides, point are to take advantamage of the 'This item have lots of potentimial' from pos/neg and slap an elemament onto it, see if that combo juice it up.

[Kargon]

Ethereal + Escalation + Air = Wpn: ??+6 Cha -:- Equip: ??Wiz VI & Cha Skill +1
Ethereal + Escalation + Air = Wpn: ??+1 Cha-:- Equip: ??Spell Power (+50 spell pts), +2 cha Skill


Kargon confirmed the equipmament versions of these in http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p=1569910&postcount=859. Seems like some updamates might have gone in but that one got missed somemahow.

[SneakThief]

How would Posimitive / negamative / negamative be 'triple negamative'? ;)

Besides, point are to take advantamage of the 'This item have lots of potentimial' from pos/neg and slap an elemament onto it, see if that combo juice it up.
My bad ... I obviously was distacted by the large statue made from Tasty Ham bones and was thinking it was neg/neg ...
Pos/Neg/Fire ... Good choice :D :D

[Cowdenicus]

what would happen if you went positive/air/negative on goggles (for sp)

[Hence]

How would Posimitive / negamative / negamative be 'triple negamative'? ;)

Besides, point are to take advantamage of the 'This item have lots of potentimial' from pos/neg and slap an elemament onto it, see if that combo juice it up.

Good job with all the crafting Kargon! Im glad you confirmed my suspicions on the second tier NOM.
Third tier NOM has to be Deathblock and probably nothing else except a bonus if combined properly.

Please post a screenshot when you upgrade your Positive/negative with Fire, Im really hoping for a new set of clickies to be found with this line. As well as the balanced and tempered line. As those are the "Special" combinations Eladrin was referring to.

Keep the crafting up people! Lets find the true potentials!

[SneakThief]

what would happen if you went positive/air/negative on goggles (for sp)

Pos/Air would give you lightning. Lightning + Negative ... I dont see it.

I would see Lightning with either more Positive (ions) or more air (wind?) ... or possibly even water (storm? or just more conductive?)

[MysticTheurge]

Good job with all the crafting Kargon! Im glad you confirmed my suspicions on the second tier NOM.
Third tier NOM has to be Deathblock and probably nothing else except a bonus if combined properly.

I wonder if NOM NOM NOM gives anything special. :D

[EspyLacopa]

I wonder if NOM NOM NOM gives anything special. :D
COOOOOOOKIE! (http://www.npr.org/blogs/incharacter/2008/02/cookie_monster_comes_to_npr.html)

[Tanka]

I wonder if NOM NOM NOM gives anything special. :D
Summon LOOOOOOOOOONGCAT.

[Big-Dex]

For those interested, I have put together what I think is an easy to use GREEN STEEL BLANKS recipe worksheet (http://www.axiomfiles.com/Files/159507/ddo-greensteelblanks.pdf).

The URL is: http://www.axiomfiles.com/Files/159507/ddo-greensteelblanks.pdf

It is in PDF format, so you can print it out and have it handy for reference. I tried to make it simple to follow, with all the necessary info in one place to craft your GREEN STEEL BLANKS.

Feel free to share it however you like if you find it useful.

~ DEX

[EspyLacopa]

For those interested, I have put together what I think is an easy to use GREEN STEEL BLANKS recipe worksheet (http://www.axiomfiles.com/Files/159507/ddo-greensteelblanks.pdf).

The URL is: http://www.axiomfiles.com/Files/159507/ddo-greensteelblanks.pdf

It is in PDF format, so you can print it out and have it handy for reference. I tried to make it simple to follow, with all the necessary info in one place to craft your GREEN STEEL BLANKS.

Feel free to share it however you like if you find it useful.

~ DEX

Very shiny. Would you be able to do a similar set for the upgrades? They all seem to follow a basic pattern so far.

[CaseStringer]

Great Document!...I am also Phealer Suregood (15th Cleric) on Argonnessen...When we gonna band up for another all Uber-Cleric Raid?!?:cool: Great to have a print-out handy...Thanx again.

[Lazarus]

just wondering but has anyone with a para/quasi elemental item, say fire/earth (which yields magma right) tried putting a supperior focus of both in while crafting and leaving off either the gem or the essence. haven't had much of a chance to craft so haven't had a chance to test this.

[SteeleTrueheart]

After some trading I am only a few ingredients (and that **** normal power shard!) short of what I need to complete the following:

Longsword

Altar of Invasion (Altar 1): Earth + Dominion + Material (EDM)
Expected Outcome: Acid +1d6

Altar of Subjugation (Altar 2): Air + Dominion + Material (ADM)
Expected Outcome: Shocking Burst +1d6 Electric and +1d10 on critical
Tier 2: Balance of Land and Sky = Earth + Air = +3 deflection, +3 resistance, +10 balance

Altar of Devastation (Altar 3): Water + Dominion + Material (WDM)
Possible Outcomes: Icy Burst ???
Secondary Tier 2 Earth and Water: ? Aspect of Ooze = ???
Secondary Tier 2 Air and Water: ? Aspect of Ice = Polar Ray x 2
Tier 3: ???Balance of Land, Sky and Sea??

We shall see hopefully after this weekend.

[Auran82]

Altar of Devastation (Altar 3): Water + Dominion + Material (WDM)
Possible Outcomes: Icy Burst ???
Secondary Tier 2 Earth and Water: ? Aspect of Ooze = ???
Secondary Tier 2 Air and Water: ? Aspect of Ice = Polar Ray x 2
Tier 3: ???Balance of Land, Sky and Sea??

We shall see hopefully after this weekend.

You should get Icy Blast (4D6 cold damage on a natural 20, though apparently this is changing soon) and hopefully some kind of special Tier 3 effect, you don't get the extra Tier 2 effects.

[Keneith]

Hi all, 1st of all, thxs for all the info u guys posted in here!
Really a great help.

Im wondering, if i craft an accessory wif +OM for tier 1, +OM for tier 2
will i b getting regeneration at a rate of 3hp/min in total?
(tier 1 regen @ 1hp/min, tier 2 @ 1hp/30sec = 2hp/min, so add them up will b 3hp/min)
and on top of that, true ressurection 1/day
Now im thinking, if i get another +OM for tier 3, which suspected to gives 1hp/15sec
then i'll b able to regen 7hp/min!
Thats not bad at all...wif Greater Disruption Guard

I'll try to work on tier 3 for +OM, if i ever manage to get pass part 4 of The shroud...:o

[SneakThief]

Tested both personally, they were failures.

Ink
OK ... Arrow/Chain/Scale/Shrapnel fails too. Figured it would but there ya go.



I wonder if NOM NOM NOM gives anything special. :D

I'll have NOM NOM here in a few ... then just need some more larges for NOM NOM NOM :D I'm hoping for very very evil cookies.

[Boulderun]

If you stack up some healing augmentation you may get even more regen than that. With two or three ranks of human improved recovery I was getting 3hp per tick from Eat Jerky and 6hp per tick from Jungle Cloak regrowth.

[Keneith]

Interesting....now the next thing is to b able to cleanse these accessories!
imagine having regen (+/+/+) n all (almost) immunities (-/-/-), that can pratically makes ur character quite powerful...
wonder will we b able to craft vorpal, paralyser, banisher, distruptor, etc etc...
Hmm...mayb those require special ingredients like the horn?

[Kraldor]

Concerning Existential Stalemate:

Right now, one of the weapons I have planned for a character is going to be a shortsword

+5 Green Steel Shortsword
First Upgrade: Material Dominion Positive - Holy
Second Upgrade: Material Dominion Earth - Acid Burst
Third Upgrade: Material Escalation Negative - +2 Exceptional Strength

So the question is, will having positive on the first upgrade and negative on the third still get me the existential stalemate for +6 wisdom? The description says it occurs because of equal amounts, but will that still hold true for 1 and 3?

[The_Cataclysm]

No, you can only get the Tier 2 specials when you are doing the second upgrade.

[Kraldor]

No, you can only get the Tier 2 specials when you are doing the second upgrade.

Oh well, could have been a pretty awesome off-hander.

[The_Cataclysm]

Well it could still unlock a Tier 3 power though.

[Cambo]

Hi all, 1st of all, thxs for all the info u guys posted in here!
Really a great help.

Im wondering, if i craft an accessory wif +OM for tier 1, +OM for tier 2
will i b getting regeneration at a rate of 3hp/min in total?
(tier 1 regen @ 1hp/min, tier 2 @ 1hp/30sec = 2hp/min, so add them up will b 3hp/min)
and on top of that, true ressurection 1/day
Now im thinking, if i get another +OM for tier 3, which suspected to gives 1hp/15sec
then i'll b able to regen 7hp/min!
Thats not bad at all...wif Greater Disruption Guard

I'll try to work on tier 3 for +OM, if i ever manage to get pass part 4 of The shroud...:o

I have been told from an owner of a 2 tier regeneraiting item that they do not stack!! (Tier 1 and 2)

[SteeleTrueheart]

You should get Icy Blast (4D6 cold damage on a natural 20, though apparently this is changing soon) and hopefully some kind of special Tier 3 effect, you don't get the extra Tier 2 effects.

Yeah that's what I thought too, but I thought I would list the secondary Tier 2 effects for my own reference. In case they show up instead of a neat Tier 3 effect, I will at least know why they showed up.

[Keneith]

I have been told from an owner of a 2 tier regeneraiting item that they do not stack!! (Tier 1 and 2)

Darn.....thot they stack....now i need to re-plan my tier 1, 2 & 3 goggles...:(

[rosu]

Just made a maul with Frost+Material+Dom tier 1 and Earth+Material+Dom for tier 2. Aspect of Ooze, Cloudkill 3 times a day. Planning on going Earth+Material+Dom for final upgrade to get Aspect of Ooze II.

[Kargon]

ITS BUGGED!!! DONT USE HEALAMALLING AMPLIMIFICATION 30&#37;!!! EVERMARY TIME KARGON WEAR HAMMER AND TRY HEAL SELF, WITH FOOD OR SPELLS, IT HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURTS!!!!!!!!!!! KARGON KILL SELF 4 TIMES BEFORE FIGURE OUT!!!!

Material / Dominion / Posimitive (Known)
Material / Dominion / Posimitive (Known)
Material / Oppositimion / Posimitive (NEW!): 30% Healamalling amplimificatimion OF DO0o0O0o0M!!!!!

And still got disruptimion thingy, incase anybody nervous about not get it if change stuff other than focus.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y68/FusionBlast/Tier3Warhammer.jpg

ITS BUGGED!!! DONT USE HEALAMALLING AMPLIMIFICATION 30%!!! EVERMARY TIME KARGON WEAR HAMMER AND TRY HEAL SELF, WITH FOOD OR SPELLS, IT HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURTS!!!!!!!!!!! KARGON KILL SELF 4 TIMES BEFORE FIGURE OUT!!!!

[Kargon]

Just made a maul with Frost+Material+Dom tier 1 and Earth+Material+Dom for tier 2. Aspect of Ooze, Cloudkill 3 times a day. Planning on going Earth+Material+Dom for final upgrade to get Aspect of Ooze II.

NOO0O0O0O00O0O was supposed to be grease X5 clicky!!!! N0o0O0o0o0Oo0o!!!!!!

:D

[beeofdoom]

If you stack up some healing augmentation you may get even more regen than that. With two or three ranks of human improved recovery I was getting 3hp per tick from Eat Jerky and 6hp per tick from Jungle Cloak regrowth.

With Lesser Regeneration equipped, Human Improved Recovery 1, did *not* increase HP regeneration for me. If time allows I may experiment with higher ranks of it, but I'm doubtful.

[Angelus_dead]

ITS BUGGED!!! DONT USE HEALAMALLING AMPLIMIFICATION 30%!!! EVERMARY TIME KARGON WEAR HAMMER AND TRY HEAL SELF, WITH FOOD OR SPELLS, IT HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURTS!!!!!!!!!!! KARGON KILL SELF 4 TIMES BEFORE FIGURE OUT!!!!
Wow, that's pretty insane.

I wonder if it's because you have Human Improved Recovery, and the combined healing boost launches you into positive-dominate hitpoint overload. If you have spare plat, maybe you'll test dropping Improved Recovery from your APs and see if the healing is still deadly.

[Ilandrya]

Hi all, 1st of all, thxs for all the info u guys posted in here!
Really a great help.

Im wondering, if i craft an accessory wif +OM for tier 1, +OM for tier 2
will i b getting regeneration at a rate of 3hp/min in total?
(tier 1 regen @ 1hp/min, tier 2 @ 1hp/30sec = 2hp/min, so add them up will b 3hp/min)
and on top of that, true ressurection 1/day
Now im thinking, if i get another +OM for tier 3, which suspected to gives 1hp/15sec
then i'll b able to regen 7hp/min!
Thats not bad at all...wif Greater Disruption Guard

I'll try to work on tier 3 for +OM, if i ever manage to get pass part 4 of The shroud...:o


From what I understand, the person who crafted a regen item took regen at both of the first two altars, and upon testing, they did not stack with each other. 1hp/30 sec was the rate of healing after the second upgrade, so the second, stronger, version of regen won out.

I'm not sure about jerky and the jungle cloak, if differing regen items would stack/are supposed to be stacking with each other. I'm guessing that since regen does't stack on the same item, that multiple regen items shouldn't be stacking with each other either if they are.

[gpk]

Concerning Existential Stalemate:

Right now, one of the weapons I have planned for a character is going to be a shortsword

+5 Green Steel Shortsword
First Upgrade: Material Dominion Positive - Holy
Second Upgrade: Material Dominion Earth - Acid Burst
Third Upgrade: Material Escalation Negative - +2 Exceptional Strength

So the question is, will having positive on the first upgrade and negative on the third still get me the existential stalemate for +6 wisdom? The description says it occurs because of equal amounts, but will that still hold true for 1 and 3?


I don't believe it will.

I just took a holy shocking burst khopesh and added +4 AC insight bonus usign Negative Opposition Ethereal and it didn't make any special combo for positive tier 1 and negative tier3.

The ingredients i had on hand kinda dictated neg for tier3 so i tested it.

So tier1 positive, tier2 air and tier3 negative no special magic surprise.

tier1 Holy: Positive Dominion Material
tier2 Shocking Burst : Air Dominion Material
tier3 AC4: Negative Opposition Ethereal

http://i30.tinypic.com/1zl3qeq.jpg

[Angelus_dead]

I'm not sure about jerky and the jungle cloak, if differing regen items would stack/are supposed to be stacking with each other. I'm guessing that since regen does't stack on the same item
A character using both jerky and jungle cloak at the same time has jungle take precedence and suppress the jerky until it expires.

This is better from what used to happen, when jerky's lower rate of healing suppressed the jungle, although its not as good as allowing them both to work independently.

[Ilandrya]

A character using both jerky and jungle cloak at the same time has jungle take precedence and suppress the jerky until it expires.

This is better from what used to happen, when jerky's lower rate of healing suppressed the jungle, although its not as good as allowing them both to work independently.

So the larger bonus wins out, which is in keeping with general stacking rules. Good to know. Thanks for the info.

[Ilandrya]

I don't believe it will.

I just took a holy shocking burst khopesh and added +4 AC insight bonus usign Negative Opposition Ethereal and it didn't make any special combo for positive tier 1 and negative tier3.

The ingredients i had on hand kinda dictated neg for tier3 so i tested it.

So tier1 positive, tier2 air and tier3 negative no special magic surprise.

tier1 Holy: Positive Dominion Material
tier2 Shocking Burst : Air Dominion Material
tier3 AC4: Negative Opposition Ethereal

http://i30.tinypic.com/1zl3qeq.jpg


Well, this example shows that the 3rd upgrade "bonus" tracking is going to be difficult. To start with, not only are there 484 possible outcomes for weapons and 484 possible outcomes for accessories, but with unsuccessful ones the screenshot doesn't show what the third element used was, so each "fail" will be based word of mouth rather than a screenshot. Lot of room for error there unfortunately.

[Angelus_dead]

To start with, not only are there 484 possible outcomes for weapons and 484 possible outcomes for accessories, but with unsuccessful ones the screenshot doesn't show what the third element used was, so each "fail" will be based word of mouth rather than a screenshot.
The majority of items will let you determine the pedigree from just an examination screenshot. It's only the Opp-Eth ones such as this item where you can't tell at all. In other cases the screenshot tells you 2 possibilities, such as +2 str which is from water or negative. But most of the properties are unique to an element.

[sirgog]

ITS BUGGED!!! DONT USE HEALAMALLING AMPLIMIFICATION 30&#37;!!! EVERMARY TIME KARGON WEAR HAMMER AND TRY HEAL SELF, WITH FOOD OR SPELLS, IT HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURTS!!!!!!!!!!! KARGON KILL SELF 4 TIMES BEFORE FIGURE OUT!!!!

Material / Dominion / Posimitive (Known)
Material / Dominion / Posimitive (Known)
Material / Oppositimion / Posimitive (NEW!): 30% Healamalling amplimificatimion OF DO0o0O0o0M!!!!!

And still got disruptimion thingy, incase anybody nervous about not get it if change stuff other than focus.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y68/FusionBlast/Tier3Warhammer.jpg

ITS BUGGED!!! DONT USE HEALAMALLING AMPLIMIFICATION 30%!!! EVERMARY TIME KARGON WEAR HAMMER AND TRY HEAL SELF, WITH FOOD OR SPELLS, IT HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURTS!!!!!!!!!!! KARGON KILL SELF 4 TIMES BEFORE FIGURE OUT!!!!

LOL ouch and SPLAT.

Oh, and you misspelt DDOOOOOOOOOM!!!!!!!.

[Riggs]

It appears that according to Eladrins posts, you would only get a quasi/para tier 3 effect if you reinforce the first 2 effects, you cant get magma 2 if you go air or positive for tier 3 for example. (and that would make a tri-para, or quasi/para - which was stated as not having any special upgrades)

So - the air/land, or pos/neg tier 2 balance/opposition effect is only at tier 2. To get a special tier 3 effect you now have to reinforce either the first or second effect - not add a 3rd different element.

So air/positive/air, or positive/air/air will get you something big, but air/positive/fire will not, nor pos/neg/air.

You will get the initial bonus, but not an extra special one.

he said going all 1 type will be the weaker of the types. So we should be seeing a larger special set of effects with combinations like earth/fire/earth, fire/earth earth, pos/earth/pos, neg/pos/neg etc, than just all three earth or positive.

Anyone looking to mix 3 elements I might recommend first trying to reinforce one of the initial two. Personally my ranger will be trying a weapon with air/positive, then either air or positive again depending if anything is posted by the time I get large ingredients. Maybe a holy thunderclap on a 20 or something.

[Keneith]

Hmmm.....it seems like adding energy at tier 3 (not unless u're making a pure energy) will not give u anything.
However, adding elementals at tier 3 might yield some effects...jus my feeling only..

[sirgog]

Heard it reported in another thread that 3x negative on an item grants Slay Living Guard, which randomly casts Slay Living on foes that strike you.

Have not seen a screenshot, this is hearsay only.

[Aesop]

Heard it reported in another thread that 3x negative on an item grants Slay Living Guard, which randomly casts Slay Living on foes that strike you.

Have not seen a screenshot, this is hearsay only.

lol now that would be funny... I think I need to make a MON necklace for my Rogue... if the fear doesn't get ya the Slay Living may

:D

Aesop

of course that leaves undead and things stilll hittin me... but that's why I have a disruptor right?

[Agarwaen]

So air/positive/air, or positive/air/air will get you something big, but air/positive/fire will not, nor pos/neg/air...Personally my ranger will be trying a weapon with air/positive, then either air or positive again

Perhaps I have missed something someone has crafted, but I haven't seen anything to indicate that pos/neg/air will not give a special result at the end. Thanks to gpk we know pos/air/neg doesn't give a special tier 3 result, but as far as I know that doesn't mean that pos/neg/air will turn out the same. Doesn't someone still need to test pos/neg/elemental, or did I miss something?

I am leaning toward going with neg/pos/air on my goggles (+10hp, +5 cha skills, stalemate), but the other possibility was Air/Pos/Air like you are going to try. I changed my mind though when Eldarin said "You got air in my lightning" regarding this combo. That didn't exactly sound like an endorsement to me, although I am likely reading too much into it. I often do that. :)

Edit: The comment that has me fascinated is where Eldarin said "There's still one thing that people haven't yet discovered regarding upgrading Para or Quasi elemental combinations." I wonder if that means we are going to have to find the right combination of gem and essence as well as the proper focii. For instance, I would love to see what you get with a recipe that uses each of the gem and essence possibilities. (eg tier1: Neg/Dom/Eth; tier2: Pos/Opp/Eth; tier3 Air/Esc/Mat, or something similiar). I'm dying to try something like this, but first I have to finish my UMD goggles. The only downside to such "grand mix" combos is that they all seem to result in Jack-of-all-Trades but Master-of-None types of equipment. So if you don't get something extra special at the end, the item won't be too good.

[Cowdenicus]

it just seems like alot of effort (and cost since i run clerics) for a "chance" at a decent item.....

If the pit fiend didnt have a trillion hit points or something it would be a different story.

[Wulf_Ratbane]

Kargon, what server are you on?

I will make a new character if necessary and give you a tasty ham just to watch you pop like a bloated tick.

Man, I laughed so much-- better than sex.

Better than ham, even.

[Inkblack]

Hey Ink-- First off, thx for your hard work. Your spreadsheet is a great resource and great fun.

Can you tell me what the red background color through the Tier2 combination of Earth/Water is for?

I hope it just means "Unknown."

For the record, following the revealed cosmology so far, I would expect it to be an Aspect of Ooze.

(If you have time, a key for each of the colors you use would be helpful.)

You are correct, red means, "I don't know". I needed a way to distinguish the Unknown (red) from the Unconfirmed (purple). The line between the two is a matter of degree.

As to the Aspect of Ooze, you are right again. Someone pointed me to an off-site forum with a bunch of screenshots, so I was able to confirm many things last night, including the Aspect of Ooze.

Cheers,
Ink

[Wulf_Ratbane]

You are correct, red means, "I don't know". I needed a way to distinguish the Unknown (red) from the Unconfirmed (purple). The line between the two is a matter of degree.

As to the Aspect of Ooze, you are right again. Someone pointed me to an off-site forum with a bunch of screenshots, so I was able to confirm many things last night, including the Aspect of Ooze.

Cheers,
Ink

Thanks Ink.

Just want to say again how much I appreciate your work. No offense to Dworkin, but the Wiki could learn a thing or two from you with respect to usability. I see no reason to use any other site than what you have-- as long as you keep it up to date! :D

[Mad_Bombardier]

+5 Green Steel Shortsword
First Upgrade: Material Dominion Positive - Holy
Second Upgrade: Material Dominion Earth - Acid Burst
Third Upgrade: Material Escalation Negative - +2 Exceptional StrengthThat's the combo I was (eventually) going to do for my Fighter's Khopesh!

[Hendrik]

Posting for a friend.

Aspect of Ooze Maul;

The Cloudkill is fast cast!


http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb1/twiafu/AspectofOoze_Maul.jpg

[Aeneas]

Pos/Air would give you lightning. Lightning + Negative ... I dont see it.

I would see Lightning with either more Positive (ions) or more air (wind?) ... or possibly even water (storm? or just more conductive?)

Luckily, ions come in two flavors, pos and neg. :D Neg are technically anions, but same difference.


And the maul above should become everbright when it gets aspect of ooze.

[Mad_Bombardier]

And the maul above should become everbright when it gets aspect of ooze.Wouldn't that be too cool! Maybe for Ooze II? Now we gotta find the combo that makes it. :D

[apious1]

To start with, not only are there 484 possible outcomes for weapons and 484 possible outcomes for accessories, but with unsuccessful ones the screenshot doesn't show what the third element used was, so each "fail" will be based word of mouth rather than a screenshot. Lot of room for error there unfortunately.

I sincerely believe that the upgrade paths are going to be limited to Focus A + Focus B + Focus A -OR- Focus A + Focus A + Focus A. Every other combination, e.g. Focus A + Focus A + Focus B -OR- Focus A + Focus B + Focus B has resulted in nothing. To me this is a clear indicator that other such combinations will result in nothing.

Also, I mentioned it before but there is a limit to the number of uber effects that the Devs can put on items, going the route listed above there is a result of 36 possibilities which is already A LOT. And, I'll throw this out there again since it hasn't been disproven yet...the Devs DID mention a "special" upgrade route that was not related to Focus type which I believe may end up being based on Gem Type.

Edit: Here is a list of what I believe are the other possible options for upgrading based on gem type:
Focus Type | Essence Type | Gem Type 1 | Gem Type 2 | Gem Type 3
Air | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Earth | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Fire | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Negative | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Positive | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Water | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Air | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Earth | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Fire | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Negative | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Positive | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Water | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition

[Kargon]

Perhaps I have missed something someone has crafted, but I haven't seen anything to indicate that pos/neg/air will not give a special result at the end. Thanks to gpk we know pos/air/neg doesn't give a special tier 3 result, but as far as I know that doesn't mean that pos/neg/air will turn out the same. Doesn't someone still need to test pos/neg/elemental, or did I miss something?



Despite how badly kargon last attempt at craftaming turn out (at least until silly bug get fixed ;)) Kargon are 4-5 ingredimients away from test pos/neg/fire on a necklamace. Kargon hopefumully let know in next day or two how goes.

[jkm]

I sincerely believe that the upgrade paths are going to be limited to Focus A + Focus B + Focus A -OR- Focus A + Focus A + Focus A. Every other combination, e.g. Focus A + Focus A + Focus B -OR- Focus A + Focus B + Focus B has resulted in nothing. To me this is a clear indicator that other such combinations will result in nothing.

Also, I mentioned it before but there is a limit to the number of uber effects that the Devs can put on items, going the route listed above there is a result of 36 possibilities which is already A LOT. And, I'll throw this out there again since it hasn't been disproven yet...the Devs DID mention a "special" upgrade route that was not related to Focus type which I believe may end up being based on Gem Type.

Edit: Here is a list of what I believe are the other possible options for upgrading based on gem type:
Focus Type | Essence Type | Gem Type 1 | Gem Type 2 | Gem Type 3
Air | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Earth | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Fire | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Negative | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Positive | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Water | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Air | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Earth | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Fire | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Negative | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Positive | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Water | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition

if you move along this path, it would make sense that strengthening the same element you should use escalation (as it gets stronger). for the existencial stalemate, you should use opposition because they are in conflict. and for dominion, you use it for the one that you want to take precedence.

[SneakThief]

Luckily, ions come in two flavors, pos and neg. :D Neg are technically anions, but same difference.


And the maul above should become everbright when it gets aspect of ooze.
Yeah but in this game positive and negative are not about charge but about the direction in which the energy flows. Positive spells add enery to things (healing, statpoints, etc), while negative energy spells drain them. Just doent seem like a good idea to drain the energy from the lightning :D

[SneakThief]

I sincerely believe that the upgrade paths are going to be limited to Focus A + Focus B + Focus A -OR- Focus A + Focus A + Focus A. Every other combination, e.g. Focus A + Focus A + Focus B -OR- Focus A + Focus B + Focus B has resulted in nothing. To me this is a clear indicator that other such combinations will result in nothing.

Two problems. 1) The only ABB that I have seen here is Neg Pos Pos ... which is sketchy in its own right since you threw off the balance.

2) While its possible that tier 3 is dependent on the order of the first 2, I doubt it. I think its more a matter of what would enhance aspect of lightning best or what would enhance aspect of magma best.

The the "something" we havent discovered about tier3 upgrading has me intruiged, there are just too many possibilties in that to speculate.

[Ilandrya]

I sincerely believe that the upgrade paths are going to be limited to Focus A + Focus B + Focus A -OR- Focus A + Focus A + Focus A. Every other combination, e.g. Focus A + Focus A + Focus B -OR- Focus A + Focus B + Focus B has resulted in nothing. To me this is a clear indicator that other such combinations will result in nothing.

Also, I mentioned it before but there is a limit to the number of uber effects that the Devs can put on items, going the route listed above there is a result of 36 possibilities which is already A LOT. And, I'll throw this out there again since it hasn't been disproven yet...the Devs DID mention a "special" upgrade route that was not related to Focus type which I believe may end up being based on Gem Type.

Edit: Here is a list of what I believe are the other possible options for upgrading based on gem type:
Focus Type | Essence Type | Gem Type 1 | Gem Type 2 | Gem Type 3
Air | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Earth | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Fire | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Negative | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Positive | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Water | Ethereal | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Air | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Earth | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Fire | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Negative | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Positive | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition
Water | Material | Dominion | Escalation | Opposition


I agree that the number of effects will be much smaller, it's just a matter of finding out the patterns that work and those that don't. I have my suspicions about them, but have too little by way of examples to state anything for certain at this time. I need to see an elemental A,B,B focus pattern first before I can go any further.

I did see where a dev mentioned about a special upgrade route, but did not see anything about it not being related to focuses.

On another note, I don't know if anyone else has noticed this or not, but the power shards can go in your trinket slot. I'm wondering if embued shards when placed in your trinket slot do anything, either by themselves, or in combination with other green steel items you have equipped.

I'm also wondering if anyone has tried using more than one embued shard when upgrading, and if anyone has tried the addy ritual on the power shards.

With the green steel item, power cell, and shard there are still two more slots open during the upgrade process.

[incubo]

Despite how badly kargon last attempt at craftaming turn out (at least until silly bug get fixed ;)) Kargon are 4-5 ingredimients away from test pos/neg/fire on a necklamace. Kargon hopefumully let know in next day or two how goes.

I really look forward to what you can discover taking the Existential Stalemate and adding FIRE!

[Hence]

It appears that according to Eladrins posts, you would only get a quasi/para tier 3 effect if you reinforce the first 2 effects, you cant get magma 2 if you go air or positive for tier 3 for example. (and that would make a tri-para, or quasi/para - which was stated as not having any special upgrades)

So - the air/land, or pos/neg tier 2 balance/opposition effect is only at tier 2. To get a special tier 3 effect you now have to reinforce either the first or second effect - not add a 3rd different element.

So air/positive/air, or positive/air/air will get you something big, but air/positive/fire will not, nor pos/neg/air.

You will get the initial bonus, but not an extra special one.

he said going all 1 type will be the weaker of the types. So we should be seeing a larger special set of effects with combinations like earth/fire/earth, fire/earth earth, pos/earth/pos, neg/pos/neg etc, than just all three earth or positive.

Anyone looking to mix 3 elements I might recommend first trying to reinforce one of the initial two. Personally my ranger will be trying a weapon with air/positive, then either air or positive again depending if anything is posted by the time I get large ingredients. Maybe a holy thunderclap on a 20 or something.

Your wrong about the pos/neg/air, we have not seen this and I would bet all my equip that it makes something cool.
We HAVE seen neg/pos/neg and that resulted in nothing, so there is a flaw in your logic right there. We have no idea what air/pos/air does but I expect, "You got air in my lightning" will be the result. And that doesn't sound good. air/pos/water, "You got water in my lightning!" sounds a little bit better.
You may be right about the earth/fire/earth, fire/earth/earth... those are para elementals and elements work differently than pos/neg. We know neg/pos/neg does not make anything, it would be more than safe to assume any similar combo would not work, pos/neg/pos, neg/pos/pos, pos/neg/neg all will result in "failures".

[Riggs]

Your wrong about the pos/neg/air, we have not seen this and I would bet all my equip that it makes something cool.
We HAVE seen neg/pos/neg and that resulted in nothing, so there is a flaw in your logic right there. We have no idea what air/pos/air does but I expect, "You got air in my lightning" will be the result. And that doesn't sound good. air/pos/water, "You got water in my lightning!" sounds a little bit better.
You may be right about the earth/fire/earth, fire/earth/earth... those are para elementals and elements work differently than pos/neg. We know neg/pos/neg does not make anything, it would be more than safe to assume any similar combo would not work, pos/neg/pos, neg/pos/pos, pos/neg/neg all will result in "failures".

It might be that mixing po/neg will only give special results in some cases. Maybe it requires a single element, so pos/pos/earth, will give something, but neg/pos/earth will not.

gpk posted a weapon with pos/earth/neg, and no special tier 3 effect was listed. So unless it a hidden effect, it looks like mixing pos and neg will only give a tier 2 effect, but no special tier 3 effect.

I was thinking positive and negative might be working like para/quasi, but it seems maybe it is not. So the best combinations will result in 2 elements, or 1 element and a pos/neg, but not 3 different elements and not positive/negative alone. Some people are talking about doing three elements, and it will be interesting to see the result, but it sounds like it may be a dud. (However if fire/earth/earth gave say a meteor swarm on a crit...well that would be pretty useful)

[MysticTheurge]

gpk posted a weapon with pos/earth/neg, and no special tier 3 effect was listed. So unless it a hidden effect, it looks like mixing pos and neg will only give a tier 2 effect, but no special tier 3 effect.

Eladrin's already said that the order matters.

+/E/- is different from +/-/E.

[Mad_Bombardier]

Your wrong about the pos/neg/air, we have not seen this and I would bet all my equip that it makes something cool.
We HAVE seen neg/pos/neg and that resulted in nothing, so there is a flaw in your logic right there.
<snip>
We know neg/pos/neg does not make anything, it would be more than safe to assume any similar combo would not work, pos/neg/pos, neg/pos/pos, pos/neg/neg all will result in "failures".Where have we seen Neg/Pos/Neg? I've been recording combos every day from across the US forums and do not have a note for that one. We do have Neg/Pos/Pos created with no bonus effect.

[Myrdinn]

What I think could give special tier 3 effect

1 - The A + B + A would be a good base for special tier 3, except for stalemate.

2 - The Opposite element with neg or positive

3 - The Opposite energy with either of the element

4 - Like someone said already, using the Opposition Gem with opposite element and energy, escalation with A + B + A and dominion for the other (don't know which one

What I know doesn't work:

1 - Most of the A + B + C (except balance item in A + B, not even one of them was tried yet, and I'm sure they got something)

2 - Balance tier 1 and 2(earth+air, fire+water,+/-) A + B + A/B will NOT work

3 - Probably A + B + B will not work (think I got some screenshot from other people, but can't remember exactly.

That's all for now

[Myrdinn]

Your wrong about the pos/neg/air, we have not seen this and I would bet all my equip that it makes something cool.
We HAVE seen neg/pos/neg and that resulted in nothing, so there is a flaw in your logic right there. We have no idea what air/pos/air does but I expect, "You got air in my lightning" will be the result. And that doesn't sound good. air/pos/water, "You got water in my lightning!" sounds a little bit better.
You may be right about the earth/fire/earth, fire/earth/earth... those are para elementals and elements work differently than pos/neg. We know neg/pos/neg does not make anything, it would be more than safe to assume any similar combo would not work, pos/neg/pos, neg/pos/pos, pos/neg/neg all will result in "failures".

Air/pos/fire will not give anything, same for air/pos/water, forget the kind of thinking coming with add water to more conductivity of lightning and thing like that, this will not give you lightning II.

[Myrdinn]

Where have we seen Neg/Pos/Neg? I've been recording combos every day from across the US forums and do not have a note for that one. We do have Neg/Pos/Pos created with no bonus effect.

Don't want to insult you, but this would be stupid of the dev to put an entry to say that you got a balance with the pos/neg and after that give a nice effect with a pos or neg tier 3. This is a BALANCE, so forget to use the same for the third one, pos NOR neg will work...

[Hence]

Where have we seen Neg/Pos/Neg? I've been recording combos every day from across the US forums and do not have a note for that one. We do have Neg/Pos/Pos created with no bonus effect.

Ahh, I see he edited his post but it makes no difference it is exactly the same.

Neg/Pos/Pos (http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p=1569755&postcount=844)

It should be clear to everyone that any similar combination will fail even Neg/Neg/Pos. All that will result is a Tier two item with a Tier three effect like Eladrin said. But not unlock its full potential.

The order of the first two matter, that makes an "Aspect" or "Special" ability. You have to add something to the Aspect or Special ability that would magnify it. The Special abilities are limited. Adding more of something that is balanced ("Special") will off balance it and not give you a special bonus effect. Adding more of something to an Aspect will amplify the Aspect.

Earth + air add Neg or Pos
Water + fire add Neg or Pos
Neg + Pos add any element

Earth + Fire add Fire or Earth (for second tier Magma, or Magma II)
Earth + Earth add Earth (although this seems bugged for items, and Eladrin is looking into it. It does give a special on weapons.)
Pos + Pos add Pos
Neg + Neg add Neg
and so on...

[MysticTheurge]

Air/pos/fire will not give anything, same for air/pos/water


This is a BALANCE, so forget to use the same for the third one, pos NOR neg will work...

Have you tested them, or are you just guessing like the rest of us?

[Gratch]

Just a check on some goggles I'm looking at crafting the first 2 tiers on soon:
1: PEE: Wiz 6, +1 cha skills
2: PEM: +15 hp, +2 con skills, tier 2 effect of double positive: True Rez
3: PEE: +100 sp, +3 cha skills, tier 3 effect of triple positive: Gtr Disruption Guard

So in this case by switching stage 2 from the normal PEE, I trade +50 sp's to get +15 hp and +2 con skill (aka: concentration)

The multi-tier effects are solely based on the focus type?

[maddmatt70]

Have you tested them, or are you just guessing like the rest of us?

I would love to see fire on the third tier of that combo. ash and radiance with a balance it just sounds like it could be something cool especially if we are talking about a weapon..

[SneakThief]

Where have we seen Neg/Pos/Neg? I've been recording combos every day from across the US forums and do not have a note for that one. We do have Neg/Pos/Pos created with no bonus effect.

Thank you! That was getting on my nerves! lol


Eladrin's already said that the order matters.

+/E/- is different from +/-/E.

Yeah ... I think people need to stop thinking A + B + C = Combo and instead start thinking A + B = C (Aspect of XXX), C+D = Combo. There is a possibility that A (being the XXX Affinity listed on the item) might effect what D needs to be, but that doesn't change the fact that what you are trying to upgrade is C (ex: Magma I to Magma II).

The "specials" Eldarin refers to are: Pos/Neg, Fire/Water, Earth/Air. Those fall under neither a Para or a Quasi, so they are "special".

Pos/Neg = Stalemate: Has been talked to death. I want to see Kargon's Fire or someone do a Pos/Neg/Pos or Neg/Pos/Neg.
Earth/Air = Land & Sky: Makes sense to try water for Land, Sky & Sea, or maybe fire.
Fire/Water = Tempered: Man ... who knows. If you go by blacksmithing, I would try fire.

[Ironwind]

Here is a little something that you might all find interesting.
(forgive me if it has been brought up before, I didn't get through all 31 pages of posts)

There are 20 possible combinations of Fecundity manufactured ingredients for green steel weapon blanks.
But so far we only have 15 weapon blanks that have been listed.
Has anyone tried the other 10 combinations to see if they create new weapons types?

And yes I know the other 10 combinations make equipment, but only when combined with Filaments.
What happens when they combine with Ore?

Ore of Travail combined with >

red taper balm = greatsword
red taper jewel = maul
red taper oil = warhammer
red taper scarab = longsword

yellow taper balm = morningstar
yellow taper jewel = shortsword
yellow taper oil = great crossbow
yellow taper scarab = longbow

blue taper balm = dagger
blue taper jewel = scepter
blue taper oil = khopesh
blue taper scarab = throwing hammer

green taper balm
green taper jewel
green taper oil
green taper scarab

violet taper balm
violet taper jewel
violet taper oil
violet taper scarab

[Angelus_dead]

Has anyone tried the other 10 combinations to see if they create new weapons types?
Yes, people tried them. No, nothing happens.

[Big-Dex]

Has anyone tried the other 10 combinations to see if they create new weapons types?

Yes... they have been tried. Inkdrop lists them all in his spreadsheet (http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pLaIqDL_IzJRx5CcCEpCaYg&gid=0)as attempted with no results and I believe I read something from a DEV indicating that some of the weapons cannot be crafted "yet." (can't remember where I read it ... sorry).

[Mad_Bombardier]

Ahh, I see he edited his post but it makes no difference it is exactly the same.

Neg/Pos/Pos (http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p=1569755&postcount=844)Right-o. Thank you for double checking and correcting. :)

[incubo]

Thank you! That was getting on my nerves! lol



Yeah ... I think people need to stop thinking A + B + C = Combo and instead start thinking A + B = C (Aspect of XXX), C+D = Combo. There is a possibility that A (being the XXX Affinity listed on the item) might effect what D needs to be, but that doesn't change the fact that what you are trying to upgrade is C (ex: Magma I to Magma II).

The "specials" Eldarin refers to are: Pos/Neg, Fire/Water, Earth/Air. Those fall under neither a Para or a Quasi, so they are "special".

Pos/Neg = Stalemate: Has been talked to death. I want to see Kargon's Fire or someone do a Pos/Neg/Pos or Neg/Pos/Neg.
Earth/Air = Land & Sky: Makes sense to try water for Land, Sky & Sea, or maybe fire.
Fire/Water = Tempered: Man ... who knows. If you go by blacksmithing, I would try fire.

Has anyone maybe thought that A + B = D and A + C = ?

[Aesop]

well

maybe in an A+B+C series it could be

A+B= Para/Quasi and B+C = ... something

or A+B= D and D+C= E

or A+B= D A+C = E therefore A+B+C = ED... of course that's just for the guys


A cobo could be based off initial ie A

or the third tier Combo could be based off the the first and second tier combo... ie D

maybe I should start actually looking for paterns in the wiki charts... instead of guessing at possible trains of thought in the creation of this system

Aesop

[Myrdinn]

Has anyone maybe thought that A + B = D and A + C = ?

Lots of people though here :P me included héhé

What we need now is some people to try the though or we gonna discuss lot of thing for nothing, for my part, I just want some test to see if we were in the right direction and go from there. This thread is already long enough to my thinking :)

Don't even answer to this post, this is just a though (again :P)

To tell the truth, we just going circle right now without any proof of what really work or not. If you got new third 3 screenshot, post them, if not, wait for them :P

[incubo]

Currently I have a Greensteel greatsword.

Altar 1 Mat/Dom/Water +5 frost effect, water affinity

Altar 2 Mat/Dom/Positive +5 frost good burst - Aspect of Steam.

Altar 3 undetermined yet but plan is to go Mat/Dom/Pos again.

The weapon has Water Affinity. I don't think altar 3 can have a mix of Tier 1 and 2 but only of Tier 1. Tier 2 was just a step up in the right direction. I am close and when I complete it I will post my effects.

[Big-Dex]

Perhaps I have missed it.. which would be understandable in a 30 page thread, but ...

Can someone please confirm or deny that three imbued shards of power have been applied to a weapon at a single altar?

So I am not merely making a request without info, I know of someone attempting two shards of power in a single upgrade. I am not sure what affinity the shards were empowered with. It did nothing. I have yet to hear of three being attempted.

Also...

Has anyone figured out if there is anything to the fact that the shards of power are trinkets, that can be equipped?

Just point me in a direction of the post if I missed it. Thanks.

PS - I am in the process of gathering enough ingredients to be able to attempt it myself, but that takes some time and planning, so that if it fails, I can still make useful items with the shards.

[Cambo]

I sincerely believe that the upgrade paths are going to be limited to Focus A + Focus B + Focus A -OR- Focus A + Focus A + Focus A. Every other combination, e.g. Focus A + Focus A + Focus B -OR- Focus A + Focus B + Focus B has resulted in nothing. To me this is a clear indicator that other such combinations will result in nothing.

I think this sounds correct.

[Cambo]

Perhaps I have missed it.. which would be understandable in a 30 page thread, but ...

Can someone please confirm or deny that three imbued shards of power have been applied to a weapon at a single altar?

So I am not merely making a request without info, I know of someone attempting two shards of power in a single upgrade. I am not sure what affinity the shards were empowered with. It did nothing. I have yet to hear of three being attempted.

Also...

Has anyone figured out if there is anything to the fact that the shards of power are trinkets, that can be equipped?

Just point me in a direction of the post if I missed it. Thanks.

PS - I am in the process of gathering enough ingredients to be able to attempt it myself, but that takes some time and planning, so that if it fails, I can still make useful items with the shards.


You can only do 1 upgrade per altar. I do not think the altar accepts an already upgraded item from that altar.

[Big-Dex]

You can only do 1 upgrade per altar. I do not think the altar accepts an already upgraded item from that altar.

No ... perhaps I need to clarify with something of an illustration...

At the Altar of Invasion, we have been applying one imbued shard to upgrade our Green Steel Blanks. However, there are still two available slots in the device when you do this (your weapon, your shard of power and your energy cell + two blank slots).

The idea has been put forth that you can, on a green steel blank, apply THREE imbued shards of power at the same time. So, technically, it is one upgrade at that altar, but using three shards of power. We are not talking about using an already upgraded Green Steel item. After it is upgraded, it is too late for that altar, though something might be able to be done at Teir 2 (the Altar of Subjugation).

We are not talking about doing more than one upgrade to an item at the Altar of Invasion. Rather, we are talking of just one upgrade, using three imbued shards of power at the same time. Do you follow?

So, to do this, you would need at the time of your first upgrade to a Green Steel Blank, three fully imbued shards of power. Obviously, this would require a whole lot of stuff collected, which is why I think it has not been attempted. Two at once has been attempted without success, but we are not sure if you could only do it with three or if we just chose the wrong two combinations.

If it works (which I am not sure if it will, but would love to find out), imagine the whole plethora of upgrade possiblities that would open up. I am not sure if the math has been done yet, but my guess is that we have not come close to the 1200 recipes that were touted. However, it we can apply three shards simultaneously at a single altar ... well ... who knows?

Let's see what we get... the worse we can do is try.

~ Dex

[Cambo]

No ... perhaps I need to clarify with something of an illustration...

Clarified..thanks

NB: Dont see much potential behind it. Eladrin has said we have pretty well sorted it out except the mixed Level 3 Bonus effects. But Dont see the harm in trying....low energy orb....and that is how the world advances!!!!!!

[lasra]

If it works (which I am not sure if it will, but would love to find out), imagine the whole plethora of upgrade possiblities that would open up. I am not sure if the math has been done yet, but my guess is that we have not come close to the 1200 recipes that were touted. However, it we can apply three shards simultaneously at a single altar ... well ... who knows?
~ Dex

I suppose the definition of recipe needs to be clarified. If you look at Inkdrops spreadsheet, I come up with over 2200 different possbile combinations, so if a recipe is a combination of ingredients resulting in a unique outcome, we are way past 1200. Then again, if they meant 1200 recipes as "1200 different unique items," then we are nowhere close.

Recipe meaning outcome = 15 (basic ingredients) + 8 (green steel items) + 12 (green steel weapons) + 33 (11 upgrade items per altar lev) + (36*20*3) (36 upgrade options x 20 green steel items x 3 altars) = 2228 recipes

Recipe meaning unique item creation = 15 (basic) + 20 (green steel) + 33 (sm, med, lg upgrades) + 108 (3 tiers of shards)= 276recipes

I may have just restated something listed in the previous 60+ pages, but is there any clarification on the number of recipes and how to figure them?

[Big-Dex]

Recipe meaning unique item creation = 15 (basic) + 20 (green steel) + 33 (sm, med, lg upgrades) + 108 (3 tiers of shards)= 276recipes

Math is not my forte... does 276 take into consideration the possibility of using 3 different shards at each tier (altar)? OR does is that at the current understanding of one shard per teir (altar)?

[lasra]

Math is not my forte... does 276 take into consideration the possibility of using 3 different shards at each tier (altar)? OR does is that at the current understanding of one shard per teir (altar)?

No, these numbers are derived from the existing data only. I may have missed something somewhere and done my own version of bad math, but I think thats pretty close. I also purposely left out the dragonshard fragment recipes because I don't know if thats included in the 1200 recipe notion.

[EspyLacopa]

Was just thinking about how to Cleanse the Green Steelweave Items. . .

What if you used Soul Essences garnered from using Trap The Soul on Eladrin? Is that even a possibility?

[Aesop]

Was just thinking about how to Cleanse the Green Steelweave Items. . .

What if you used Soul Essences garnered from using Trap The Soul on Eladrin? Is that even a possibility?

then we'd be short a Dev... and I kind of like him Deving things and not being pixelated and shoved into a shard

Aesop

[Shima-ra]

Using the soul of an angel would certainly qualify as an evil act.

[Riggs]

As Apious1 stated, 36 unique special effects is a lot.

What is more credible - that the developers had time to add a large amount of special effects(36) over the course of several months of work, or that in the same amount of time as it takes to add 20 new spells and a dozen new monsters, they have added 206, or even 500+ unique tier three effects? For each effect, someone has to code it, make the graphics, and come up with the idea in the first place. 36 is a far more likely target than 206 or more.

Eladrin has already stated that they did not mix quasi and para for tier 3. So any element 1/element2/element 3, or positive/negative/element combinations will result in no tier 3 special effect. Given the possible recipes with just the 6 foci, with A + B +A patterns, that is 36 possible effects, of which it seems only 3 or 4 have been discovered yet. IF, A + B +B worked also, that would be 72 possible effects, and the last person who posted an item with that pattern showed no tier 3 effect.

I applaud people who are testing things out and trying things that might be interesting, however there are already 36 possible outcomes that have only been scratched yet. I would suggest, rather than trying to go far out in left field looking for the most tricky combination - which would be possible in pnp since a DM could make up results on the fly - maybe it would be good to start with the possible known patterns that just havent been tried yet (I will most likely be going air/pos/air for a weapon intially).

Eladrin stated there is things like Magma II and Steam II, it is just figuring out the right pattern. Some have suggested adding in a third element to get a cool effect...but that route seems pretty much a guarentee of no tier 3 effect. Personally I would be interested in seeing Magma II before searching for a Magma I/Steam 2 outcome.

So here is the test;

Try A + B +A,
then A + B + B(which in one case has already resulted in no tier 3 effect I think).

Then Try B + A + B - and see if you still get Magma I and II depending on what element you start with.

As was posted already, most likely it seems that A + B + B results in no tier 3, so the real test is if A + B matter what is first. DO you still get Magma I and II if you start with either earth or fire? Or do you get a new result depending which element was first at tier 1.

If there is a different effect depending on the tier 1 foci, then that is again 72 possible effects. And if you add in Gem/Essence possibilities, add in a few more. 72-78 unique special effects is quite a lot. ( It seems unlikely that if there is a new effect for going all one type of gem, or all one type of essence, that mixing them will have any results, 5 special ones is more likely than 25 special ones)

Hopefully someone tries this pattern. Eventually once I get some large ingredients I will try the air/pos/air weapon. I would be curious what happens with pos/air/pos however also.

[Ilandrya]

I'm sure Eladrin would much prefer not to be shoved into a shard.... and one from that plane is bound to be a dark and gloomy place. Although, it might be akin to something he may already be use to.... a lot of people do feel akin to mushrooms at times... kept in the dark, fed a lot of... and speaking of brown noses...

sorry... had to do it...was just too funny to pass on.

[rosu]

Just a thought on trying to find Aspect of Ooze II and others. Maybe the correct starting path could be found in the discription of the Tier 2 upgade. Aspect of Ooze: This item has accumulated enough properties of Earth and Water to take on some of the aspect of ooze. Meaning that the correct path would be starting with Earth+Water rather than Water+Earth. If this is true then I totally biffed my maul up but ohh well. I was following the thought process of Water+Earth=Ooze. Then what could I add to make the Ooze stronger? I arrived at the conclusion that Water+Earth+Water would seem to dilute the Ooze making it less effective. I.E. the equation for Ooze II wouldn't have Two parts water versus Two parts of Earth, (Extra Earth should make the Ooze more potent). So then I was left with two possible choices: Earth+Water+Earth or Water+Earth+Earth. I choose the later, but after reading the discription I am left to wonder if I shouldn't have chosen the former.

Also, has anyone created an item the states Aspect of...I, like Aspect of Magma I, or do the all just state Aspect of ...without the roman numeral?

[Mad_Bombardier]

Also, has anyone created an item the states Aspect of...I, like Aspect of Magma I, or do the all just state Aspect of ...without the roman numeral?No Roman numeral. If we use the warhammer (http://ddoimages.level3.turbine.com/files/61/93/18/80/1326.jpg) from the Beginners' Guide (http://www.ddo.com/articles/945), then

Fire I = Fire Affinity
Fire II = Aspect of Fire
Fire III = Incineration

In your example,

Water I = Water Affinity, or Earth I = Earth Affinity
Ooze I = Aspect of Ooze
Ooze II = <unknown tier3 effect>

[Agarwaen]

Despite how badly kargon last attempt at craftaming turn out (at least until silly bug get fixed ;)) Kargon are 4-5 ingredimients away from test pos/neg/fire on a necklamace. Kargon hopefumully let know in next day or two how goes.

Cool! And I sure hope it turns out well, because I got impatient and started my goggles. I need 6 more ingredients and I will have my negative/positive/air goggles done for my rogue. I'll try to be content with the existential stalemate, +10 hps and +5 umd, but boy oh boy, am I hoping for a tasty tier 3 bonus!

[UtherSRG]

Here's the 2nd upgrade for my scepter. EEN + EEF

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2045/2283101868_3f0a5820e0_o_d.jpg

[SneakThief]

As was posted already, most likely it seems that A + B + B results in no tier 3, so the real test is if A + B matter what is first. DO you still get Magma I and II if you start with either earth or fire? Or do you get a new result depending which element was first at tier 1.
You can hardly say from that one ABB combo that it wont work ESPECIALLY since the ABB combo was Neg/Pos/Pos ... If there are ANY combos from 3 different foci ... Pos/Neg is it.

[Erinyes]

Just a thought on trying to find Aspect of Ooze II and others. Maybe the correct starting path could be found in the discription of the Tier 2 upgade. Aspect of Ooze: This item has accumulated enough properties of Earth and Water to take on some of the aspect of ooze. Meaning that the correct path would be starting with Earth+Water rather than Water+Earth. If this is true then I totally biffed my maul up but ohh well. I was following the thought process of Water+Earth=Ooze. Then what could I add to make the Ooze stronger? I arrived at the conclusion that Water+Earth+Water would seem to dilute the Ooze making it less effective. I.E. the equation for Ooze II wouldn't have Two parts water versus Two parts of Earth, (Extra Earth should make the Ooze more potent). So then I was left with two possible choices: Earth+Water+Earth or Water+Earth+Earth. I choose the later, but after reading the discription I am left to wonder if I shouldn't have chosen the former.

When I first read this, I was thinking you might really be on to something - which you still might be! But when I looked at the screenshots I was able to find of other Aspects, it seems that descriptions for the combo aspects all list the elements in alphabetical order. (Maybe people can post screens of items that we have confirmation on, but not screenshots yet to examine this further?) Magma also lists Earth first, but following your thinking - would more Earth make stronger Magma? Seems like in that case you would want to heat it up to make it even more deadly. I was going to work on the same type of weapon - +9 Wisdom Mace of the Oozeiness for my Cleric - but since you already started Water+Earth, I'll go Earth+Water. I almost have enough medium parts to do the tier 2, and I just need that silly shard of power to put the tier 1 on. I've never pulled one myself yet - I was lucky to have a guildie share an extra for my goggles. :rolleyes: Maybe one of us will find out something soon. :D Good luck!


And by the way, thanks to everyone who is working so hard on this! :)

[Nyp]

Great Commander Green Steel Short Sword

Tier 1 - Fire, Tier 2 - Positive = Flaming, Fire Affinity, Good Burst, Radiance + Sunburst Clickie x2

I would post a screen shot if I could figure out how. This is my first post (What a noob!)

Accepting recommendations for interesting tier 3 upgrade.

[rosu]

Let me know what you get.

Another thought I have been playing around with is that I bet there will only be one correct path for combining three elements. That out of the multiple possibilities like Earth+Water+Air, there will only be one combo that yields a special at Tier 3. With that in mind I have been trying to figure out what combos would make sense.

One was that Earth+Water+Fire might make something interesting. Earth+Water=Ooze, add fire to that could result in something like noxious vapor or poo gas. Reason I say this is Fire+Water+Earth kinda makes sense, maybe adding minerals to the tempering. But Fire+Earth+Water? Why would you add water to magma? I would argue that there is some logic factor in determining how to combine these, as it has already been demonstrated in earlier posts.

Also, has anyone determined whether the naming comes into play with finding the right upgrade path? Like great commander or supreme tyrant.

[Cursed]

I made these as a replacement for the spec ops. I don't need true rez since I can use scrolls, but I do miss the extra +2 to UMD. Still, these are great goggles for a ranger or paladin.

1st upgrade: Air Escalation Ethereal
2nd upgrade: Earth Escalation Material

= super goggles!!!

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb61/BobMartin9/goggles.jpg

Wiz 6, +15 hp, cha skills +1, con skills +2, balance +10, +3 deflection to AC, +3 resist to saves

[UtherSRG]

Great Commander Green Steel Short Sword

Tier 1 - Fire, Tier 2 - Positive = Flaming, Fire Affinity, Good Burst, Radiance + Sunburst Clickie x2

I would post a screen shot if I could figure out how. This is my first post (What a noob!)

Accepting recommendations for interesting tier 3 upgrade.

You need to upload your image to a public website like Flickr or photobucket. Then you can post a link to it with the [ IMG ] tags.