Long over due

[fatherpirate]

How many PURE casters do not have a scroll vendor
selling scrolls from their class?

>1< just one

Druids have been singled out for this unnecessary 'nerf'
for YEARS

If is time that the developers put a druid scroll vendor in the
druid grove and also let druid scrolls drop in the loot table.

nuf said.

[Oxarhamar]

How many PURE casters do not have a scroll vendor
selling scrolls from their class?

>1< just one

Druids have been singled out for this unnecessary 'nerf'
for YEARS

If is time that the developers put a druid scroll vendor in the
druid grove and also let druid scrolls drop in the loot table.

nuf said.

You know I don't think that druid spells are intended to be cast by other than Druid

YW

[droid327]

I never understand what Druid spells people actually want scrolls of, though....

Half their spells are already on the Divine and Arcane list, and they either have scrolls on the vendor, or they're rare scrolls

Then you have the Wild Shape specific spells, where there's no point in having them available to other classes, and they're not really "spells" in that sense anyway

Then you have the Druid-specific DPS spells, which are as pointless as scrolling any DPS spell. Same for the Vigor line, since they wont scale with your Positive spellpower and will only have mediocre casting level anyway

So that just leaves a small handful of Druid-specific buff spells that you might want to scroll on yourself. And are you really getting up in arms about Spiderskin scrolls? You couldnt even use a Shillelagh scroll with Qstaves :D

[Xgya]

I never understand what Druid spells people actually want scrolls of, though....

So that just leaves a small handful of Druid-specific buff spells that you might want to scroll on yourself. And are you really getting up in arms about Spiderskin scrolls? You couldnt even use a Shillelagh scroll with Qstaves :D

I, for one, would love Regenerate scrolls. I'd probably trade out Heal for those, though both can be useful in their own way.
I'd switch my Raise Dead scrolls to Reincarnate INSTANTLY. Both because I find the reincarnation effects hilarious, and because getting 50% HP back for the same cost as a Raise Dead scroll sounds a lot more powerful than what I currently have access to.

[LightBear]

Imho any spell should be available on a scroll.
I also think a Vendor for such knickknacks should be available.


I'd also love to have clickies of these spells.

[fatherpirate]

Druid scrolls on the loot table are not rare, they are not on the table at all.

Common druid scrolls that some folks would like, flameblade, summon natures ally series (if your not into
summon monster) various regens and such, ram's might stacks with bulls, spiderskin is decent and reincarnate as said earlier.

so it is not like there would be no interest in the spells

not suggesting this to make something OP just looking to even out the table a bit.
Give some UMD users more options, rangers could benefit and half-elves with Druid as a dil.
Arties might get some use as well.

[fatherpirate]

You know I don't think that druid spells are intended to be cast by other than Druid

YW

same as arty spells and alchemist spells and pally spells
but you can still get scrolls of those.

so, that really is not a thing in the game.

[Oxarhamar]

same as arty spells and alchemist spells and pally spells
but you can still get scrolls of those.

so, that really is not a thing in the game.

But it is a thing in the game for Druids

You can't get Paladin spells either only divine spells Paladin specific spells like Holysword no

I do believe that this is WAI something to do with Druids casting coming from nature I'm not going digging into the forum when Druid was released for the Dev quotes



Ranger also has Rams and giving that to every melee with a bit of umd is probably why there's no scrolls for it

Flameblade I can see wanting it but it's restricted to Druid for a reason & if you really want it you can get it from Druid Pastlife I've used it & it's really nice

[droid327]

Common druid scrolls that some folks would like, flameblade, summon natures ally series (if your not into
summon monster) various regens and such, ram's might stacks with bulls, spiderskin is decent and reincarnate as said earlier.

so it is not like there would be no interest in the spells


How do you summon a Flame Blade when you have a scroll in your mainhand? They disappear if they're unequipped, but they cant be equipped if you're holding a scroll :) Besides, I dont think anyone really wants a non-scaling flame blade - the scroll version would always be caster level 3

I dont think anyone wants Summon Ally either. Summons are pretty junky in general, and the Summon Spell ones are the worst since you cant even control them at all

HOTs wouldnt scale on your Positive SP, so they wouldnt give you much healing, and they cant be spammed on CD like Cure scrolls either. Greater Vigor would give you 37.5 base healing over 10 secs = 3.75 HPS. Cure Crit (which is a lower level spell, btw) is 28 HP, but can be scrolled every 3(?) secs = 9.3 HPS

Ram's Might is a special feature for Primal classes and the belt from Feywild. Its not something they want to just give away to every STR build for essentially no opportunity cost

Reincarnate may be OK but I dont think they need to add a new Druid scroll vendor just to sell Reincarnate scrolls :)

[Bjond]

If is time that the developers put a druid scroll vendor in the
druid grove and also let druid scrolls drop in the loot table
Sure, but UMD should have extra high DC for alignments outside true-neutral or using in a non-wilderness area.

And, if you're wearing metal armor or shield when reading, you end up cursed to spend your remaining days as a squirrel (at least until you find a shrine). Squirrels have a hard time wearing armor and helmets and rings and such. So, all your gear falls to the ground. It's too big to pickup as a squirrel, too.

Go nuts.

[fatherpirate]

How do you summon a Flame Blade when you have a scroll in your mainhand? They disappear if they're unequipped, but they cant be equipped if you're holding a scroll :) Besides, I dont think anyone really wants a non-scaling flame blade - the scroll version would always be caster level 3

I dont think anyone wants Summon Ally either. Summons are pretty junky in general, and the Summon Spell ones are the worst since you cant even control them at all

HOTs wouldnt scale on your Positive SP, so they wouldnt give you much healing, and they cant be spammed on CD like Cure scrolls either. Greater Vigor would give you 37.5 base healing over 10 secs = 3.75 HPS. Cure Crit (which is a lower level spell, btw) is 28 HP, but can be scrolled every 3(?) secs = 9.3 HPS

Ram's Might is a special feature for Primal classes and the belt from Feywild. Its not something they want to just give away to every STR build for essentially no opportunity cost

Reincarnate may be OK but I dont think they need to add a new Druid scroll vendor just to sell Reincarnate scrolls :)

[last time I checked] you summon a pair, that leaves you one in your off hand ... you used to be able to grab it from the off hand and manually
switch it to the main hand in the inventory window (not sure if you can still do that)

[fatherpirate]

one of the things many people do that I am not fond of is they 'cherry pick' rules
from PnP to support their debate ... but totally ignore all the rest of the PnP rules when they do
not support their position.

Let us be honest ... DDO does not follow PnP D&D rules ... at all.
Not even close.
case in point - can you make a LG palemaster? (you can not do it if your good in PnP)
how many animals can a druid turn into in PnP ?
how many hp does a Kobalt have in PnP ?
How many hp does a lvl 1 player have in PnP ?
Where are Reapers in PnP ?
or Enhancement trees ?
and so on and so on.

so can we stop with the PnP referencing?

[jskinner937]

How many PURE casters do not have a scroll vendor
selling scrolls from their class?

>1< just one

Druids have been singled out for this unnecessary 'nerf'
for YEARS

If is time that the developers put a druid scroll vendor in the
druid grove and also let druid scrolls drop in the loot table.

nuf said.

Druids do not inscribe scrolls unlike arcanes, why do they need a vendor? Druids get a lot of spells unlike FVS, which is the main reason there is a divine scroll vendor. Just do not see a point other than to abuse using a stack of vigor scrolls at the beginning of a raid to exploit.

[Oxarhamar]

one of the things many people do that I am not fond of is they 'cherry pick' rules
from PnP to support their debate ... but totally ignore all the rest of the PnP rules when they do
not support their position.

Let us be honest ... DDO does not follow PnP D&D rules ... at all.
Not even close.
case in point - can you make a LG palemaster? (you can not do it if your good in PnP)
how many animals can a druid turn into in PnP ?
how many hp does a Kobalt have in PnP ?
How many hp does a lvl 1 player have in PnP ?
Where are Reapers in PnP ?
or Enhancement trees ?
and so on and so on.

so can we stop with the PnP referencing?


Yes indeed Reapers comes from the deck of many things btw that's why Reaper difficulty has skulls.

DDO is based on pnp converted to a video game the Devs make choices for the rules to implement just as any other version of D&D

However not referencing pnp at all in previous response purely speaking on DDO YW

See: nature magic
https://www.ddo.com/en/game/classes/druid

[fatherpirate]

Druids do not inscribe scrolls unlike arcanes, why do they need a vendor? Druids get a lot of spells unlike FVS, which is the main reason there is a divine scroll vendor. Just do not see a point other than to abuse using a stack of vigor scrolls at the beginning of a raid to exploit.

neither do clerics, or favored souls, or warlocks
but they still have scroll vendors ..... so your point?

[Oxarhamar]

neither do clerics, or favored souls, or warlocks
but they still have scroll vendors ..... so your point?

Unless they added one Warlocks don’t have scroll vendors.

Clerics & Favored Souls are divine not nature magic

[Yokido]

Druids are tree huggers so maybe they take offense to scrolls because they're made of paper.

[fatherpirate]

Druids are tree huggers so maybe they take offense to scrolls because they're made of paper.

so I guess you think they should all be nude as well?
Using animal skins for leather armor has to be far worse ...

And maybe they should not eat?
I mean if hurting a log is bad them eating some other plant would have to be worse right?

in other words, "Don't you have better things to do?"

[fatherpirate]

Unless they added one Warlocks don’t have scroll vendors.

Clerics & Favored Souls are divine not nature magic

If I am not mistaken, ALL warlock spells (lvl 1-6) are already covered by arcane and divine vendors
so yes they do.
Nature magic is not a D&D casting category, it is part of the Divine category.
Druids even worship that same Gods as the Clerics do. They just specialize
with animals and have an oath against wearing metal (that they can break)
Just like Clerics with a 'favored weapon'
ect.

[magaiti]

"Never" doesn't have and overdue date.

[Xgya]

If I am not mistaken, ALL warlock spells (lvl 1-6) are already covered by arcane and divine vendors
so yes they do.


You're mistaken then. You should play more Warlocks, they get a few nifty unique spells you won't find anywhere.
If you've ever been in a party with one, you might have noticed one turning into a swarm of bats, or making a pool of tentacles that hold enemies in place. I can assure you you'll find no vendor holding such spells.

By the standard you've set, there are already Druid scroll vendors, since all spells that aren't unique to Druids (or Rangers, that are also lacking a vendor) are covered by vendors of other spell categories.

[Oxarhamar]

If I am not mistaken, ALL warlock spells (lvl 1-6) are already covered by arcane and divine vendors
so yes they do.
Nature magic is not a D&D casting category, it is part of the Divine category.
Druids even worship that same Gods as the Clerics do. They just specialize
with animals and have an oath against wearing metal (that they can break)
Just like Clerics with a 'favored weapon'
ect.

Now you are the one talking pnp I am still talking DDO

Yea Druids are divine however they have nature magic as per DDO lore

You are mistaken about Warlock as pointed out already

[Syrrah]

so I guess you think they should all be nude as well?
Using animal skins for leather armor has to be far worse ...

Hm, strictly speaking they are allowed to kill animals if it is to preserve the balance of nature.

For the same reason they would be allowed to chop trees. But chopping a tree to make paper so non-druids could use druid scrolls would be crossing the border big time.

Then again, if the paper was made from trees that died from natural cause (or from recycled paper) then they should be ok with it.

One thing is certain though: **** treehuggers, burn 'em all!

[fatherpirate]

Hm, strictly speaking they are allowed to kill animals if it is to preserve the balance of nature.

For the same reason they would be allowed to chop trees. But chopping a tree to make paper so non-druids could use druid scrolls would be crossing the border big time.

Then again, if the paper was made from trees that died from natural cause (or from recycled paper) then they should be ok with it.

One thing is certain though: **** treehuggers, burn 'em all!

so you don't like druids ... got it.
you know, I don't like alchemists, don't play them at all.
but I don't wander the forums looking for alchemist suggestions just so I can shoot them down either.
just saying.

[Oxarhamar]

so you don't like druids ... got it.
you know, I don't like alchemists, don't play them at all.
but I don't wander the forums looking for alchemist suggestions just so I can shoot them down either.
just saying.

It just doesn't work with the lore of Druid in DDO

In your OP you talk about PURE casters & scrolls but, then you expand upon that idea asking for all the spells which are more Meleecentric Druid.

[fatherpirate]

'druid lore' is different depending on the Campaign setting
and if you go back to the Original D&D anyone with the
write scroll skill could make a scroll of any spell they could cast.

folks tend to cherry pick stuff from all kinds of references to
include non-game fictional lore to back up their opinion on stuff.

My suggestion is just clearly from a MMO Game perspective.
This is an MMORPG game.
It does not exclusively follow any particular set of
D&D rules (ie. LG Pale Masters )
They follow some rules and totally break others.
and that is ok. It is their game.
Don't expect me to accept a 'D&D specific reference'
for a game play balance suggestion.
My suggestions has absolutely nothing to do with D&D,
it is a game play balance suggestion to make things equal
between various classes .... that is all.

[Oxarhamar]

'druid lore' is different depending on the Campaign setting
and if you go back to the Original D&D anyone with the
write scroll skill could make a scroll of any spell they could cast.

folks tend to cherry pick stuff from all kinds of references to
include non-game fictional lore to back up their opinion on stuff.

My suggestion is just clearly from a MMO Game perspective.
This is an MMORPG game.
It does not exclusively follow any particular set of
D&D rules (ie. LG Pale Masters )
They follow some rules and totally break others.
and that is ok. It is their game.
Don't expect me to accept a 'D&D specific reference'
for a game play balance suggestion.
My suggestions has absolutely nothing to do with D&D,
it is a game play balance suggestion to make things equal
between various classes .... that is all.

The Druid lore being referred to again is strictly DDO lore

Not sure you insist on cherry picking pnp to make your point when it doesn’t apply here I previously linked the DDO Druids lore

Druids draw their magic from nature in DDO that is why there are no scrolls

Not only that but giving those meleecentric spells you picked and giving them to any umd class is just powercreep

DDO is D&D Online btw it has a lot to do with it