An Alternative approach to Platinum ED resets

[Marshal_Lannes]

During the course of a meeting, I'm sure it was suggested that platinum could acquire some value again by tieing ED resets to the currency. And there is nothing particularly wrong with giving platinum value again. In theory, this would stimulate the auction economy. However, there are a few barriers in place that inhibit this - platinum spent on ED is "lost" in that it doesn't circulate back into the game and many (most) modern loot items are all BTA limiting products that can even be transacted.

How could this be addressed? An easy method would be to simply increase the platinum cap. The current cap has been in place for many years. Pushing it up a million wouldn't be out of line and would keep pace with inflation. I understand the reasoning behind a platinum cap - it prevents Eberron Amazon from being formed where a small number of players could acquire huge fortunes and then control the auction house. I don't think giving everyone a 20% boost to their cap would devolve into that. Another method would be to recognize that players will want to reset their EDs, perhaps quite often. Currently, players are allowed to donate platinum to their guild where it collects in a guild bank. Couldn't we have an ED bank for our characters where each of them could make deposits and then when one of them resets an ED they can take the funds out of that savings?

Having ED flexibility is something worth paying for so I understand the cost associated with it. In order to accommodate this design though, it would help out the player base if one of these methods were enacted. This would make changing EDs easier while still allowing for the cost and presumed design philosophy behind them.

[AlcoArgo]

platinum spent on ED is "lost" in that it doesn't circulate back into the game

Yes, that is the point of a platinum sink. There is far too much plat in the game right now because it is far too easy to get.


How could this be addressed? An easy method would be to simply increase the platinum cap. The current cap has been in place for many years. Pushing it up a million wouldn't be out of line and would keep pace with inflation. I understand the reasoning behind a platinum cap - it prevents Eberron Amazon from being formed where a small number of players could acquire huge fortunes and then control the auction house.

That has nothing to do with the platinum cap. There is a cap because that is the highest number an unsigned 4 byte integer can hold (or whatever data type they used - not sure which ). Plus, if I recall correctly, all money is stored as CP and then converted so in essence the plat cap is the largest number of CP you can get. That means one can't arbitrarily raise the plat cap to a bigger number without rearranging the entire code base.

[pjw]

The problem with the current ones is that they are deeply UN-FUN.

How about one or more of:


1M plat = 1 "Loot Rune"; 20 runes gets you non-raid named item of choice, for which you own the content.
1M plat = 10 Raid Runes (assuming you own the raid and have run it)
2M Plat = any sub-20 augment; 4 M plat = any non-named augment
0.5M plat = (non-store) scroll of your choice


None of these would break the game and all would be useful.

[Oxarhamar]

During the course of a meeting, I'm sure it was suggested that platinum could acquire some value again by tieing ED resets to the currency. And there is nothing particularly wrong with giving platinum value again. In theory, this would stimulate the auction economy. However, there are a few barriers in place that inhibit this - platinum spent on ED is "lost" in that it doesn't circulate back into the game and many (most) modern loot items are all BTA limiting products that can even be transacted.

How could this be addressed? An easy method would be to simply increase the platinum cap. The current cap has been in place for many years. Pushing it up a million wouldn't be out of line and would keep pace with inflation. I understand the reasoning behind a platinum cap - it prevents Eberron Amazon from being formed where a small number of players could acquire huge fortunes and then control the auction house. I don't think giving everyone a 20% boost to their cap would devolve into that. Another method would be to recognize that players will want to reset their EDs, perhaps quite often. Currently, players are allowed to donate platinum to their guild where it collects in a guild bank. Couldn't we have an ED bank for our characters where each of them could make deposits and then when one of them resets an ED they can take the funds out of that savings?

Having ED flexibility is something worth paying for so I understand the cost associated with it. In order to accommodate this design though, it would help out the player base if one of these methods were enacted. This would make changing EDs easier while still allowing for the cost and presumed design philosophy behind them.

No using platinum for ED reset doesn't give it value

Having platinum for ED reset enforcement of the use of shards to bypass that is all

[Marshal_Lannes]

No using platinum for ED reset doesn't give it value


Of course, it does. People need Plat for ED resets.

[Oxarhamar]

Of course, it does. People need Plat for ED resets.

No it doesn't matter if people need plat for ED reset

for plat to have value there needs to be a rich tradeable loot economy there are fewer and fewer tradable and more bta & btc loot which helps insure that anything tradable of value is overpriced on the AH if it's not on the shard exchange

Plat reset & plat reset increased with each each use is about shard reset

[Dejvid]

there should be no plat reset cost at all!

i watched one vid of preach regarding an interview with the wow producer and one point was about respeccing their "covenant" (i think those are some form of allegiances, but they have their own talent trees each), and he made a really valid point. a cost (wheter time or money) is just outdated and does nothing for the player but to inconvenience them. and the last thing you want is a game that is supposed to be fun to be an inconveniance. he had a much more colourfull language, but his point is spot on.
the respec cost does absolutely nothing for the player. the new destinies are to be experimented with, to buildcraft, to try things new, but the game actievely hinders me by putting in some stop sign in form of a cost in front of me. thats not fun.
and the shard cost is the main culprit why theres a platinum cost in the first place.

no amount of cap raising would change that.
player fun comes second, and mobile games monetizations creep evermore into the design philosophy.

[Marshal_Lannes]

I don't think the reset should be completely free. Then you'd run into situations where players would want to respec constantly leading to delays in gaming. I could see this happening in raids for example. Some people would use this as a workaround for twists. I think the idea to give platinum value again is a solid one and they've done that here. But tweaks could be made as suggested above. I didn't really follow the Lammania changes after the first preview because of all the unfounded doom but I wonder if this was ever brought up there? Or was the price tag to reset an 11th-hour addition?

[anticlimax]

The problem isn't completely the increasing cost, it's also the way that the respec functions.

Most respecs only involve changing a couple of points spent but always require the cost of resetting the whole tree. This leads to massive spiralling bills when in reality it should only have cost a few k plat.

Enhancements really need an edit option that tracks the change of setup so that the cost reflects the actual change rather than the somewhat arbitrary value of the entire points spend in a whole tree.

[Hawkwier]

I don't think the reset should be completely free. Then you'd run into situations where players would want to respec constantly leading to delays in gaming. I could see this happening in raids for example. Some people would use this as a workaround for twists. I think the idea to give platinum value again is a solid one and they've done that here. But tweaks could be made as suggested above. I didn't really follow the Lammania changes after the first preview because of all the unfounded doom but I wonder if this was ever brought up there? Or was the price tag to reset an 11th-hour addition?

More absolute nonsense from my perspective. Cost isn't the critical factor or barrier in on the fly changes now, time is. Nobody with much sense is going to ask everyone to hang about whilst they completely redo their destinies. 2 or 3 folks doing that would use more time than they'd spend in quests. Nobody I ran with did that before either, and they didn't have to. Whilst pre-U51 I was happy to ask for a few minutes to switch out an ED for tanking a raid or two that help the group, it simply takes too long now. Case in point this morning where we didn't have a tank for a raid, so instead ran a lower difficulty.

And even if it were the case, what is so wrong in your head with folks having a work-around for twists anyway?

Trying to recover the flexibility lost in U51 should be commended. I just wish it were more practicable, for me, at least.

Making resets free for a period until this mess has been properly patched over the next month or two would be entirely sensible. The idea that everyone will run around constantly re-speccing as a result is a chimera.

But a return of flexibility to this system would definitely be a positive. Right now, it's rubbish.

[Dejvid]

I don't think the reset should be completely free. Then you'd run into situations where players would want to respec constantly leading to delays in gaming. I could see this happening in raids for example. Some people would use this as a workaround for twists. I think the idea to give platinum value again is a solid one and they've done that here. But tweaks could be made as suggested above. I didn't really follow the Lammania changes after the first preview because of all the unfounded doom but I wonder if this was ever brought up there? Or was the price tag to reset an 11th-hour addition?

why? you cannot respec in quests/raids, so there would be no downtime or delays while playing. leaving a quest would lead to exp penalty or whatever.
right now i get a huge delay by having to farm platinum to do a respec. oh but i cannot farm effectievly in lower difficulty quests because i get chest ransack. bravo.

what we have here now is a catch22. they cannot remove the platinum cost because then the astral shard option would be pointless. and they cannot remove the astral shard option because that would cut in potentional revenue. so the cost will remain high to justify the shard option. money talks after all.
it should have never been implemented in the first place. but someone saw the potential to monetize it, now that they are giving the destinies away for "free", and another anti-consumer implementation was born.

what they should do now is scratch the whole respec cost, have it on a 30minute timer or something like that to "prevent delays in gaming", and let players just enjoy the da** game. they already made it more casual friendly, which i applaud them to, but then things like this just blow all the goodwill earned away. again...

[Oxarhamar]

I don't think the reset should be completely free. Then you'd run into situations where players would want to respec constantly leading to delays in gaming. I could see this happening in raids for example. Some people would use this as a workaround for twists. I think the idea to give platinum value again is a solid one and they've done that here. But tweaks could be made as suggested above. I didn't really follow the Lammania changes after the first preview because of all the unfounded doom but I wonder if this was ever brought up there? Or was the price tag to reset an 11th-hour addition?

Yeah you are going hyperbolic on this

Swapping old EDs and twists was completely free

players didn’t swap constantly they found a ED build that worked for them in general & swapped for the rare occasions when something different was needed

Maybe you should have followed on preview instead of guessing there has been a lot of solid feedback that you over generalize to dismiss as doom

This loss of flexibility in the EDs, twists & the high cost was just one of those issues

The idea does not give platinum value

[Wahnsinnig]

there should be no plat reset cost at all!

i watched one vid of preach regarding an interview with the wow producer and one point was about respeccing their "covenant" (i think those are some form of allegiances, but they have their own talent trees each), and he made a really valid point. a cost (wheter time or money) is just outdated and does nothing for the player but to inconvenience them. and the last thing you want is a game that is supposed to be fun to be an inconveniance. he had a much more colourfull language, but his point is spot on.
the respec cost does absolutely nothing for the player. the new destinies are to be experimented with, to buildcraft, to try things new, but the game actievely hinders me by putting in some stop sign in form of a cost in front of me. thats not fun.
and the shard cost is the main culprit why theres a platinum cost in the first place.

no amount of cap raising would change that.
player fun comes second, and mobile games monetizations creep evermore into the design philosophy.

So much this. The plat cost is just annoying and frustrating to players and ruins the fun for a player that has to reset because mistakes where made or just want to try different things in a completely new system.

SSG need to think long and hard on this and what they want the game to be. It should be fun, not annoying.

[songswrath]

yes we need plat sinks , reaper wings made plat useful again
what i would do is this unlockable vender via coin lord favor
that offers a choice of
1 random raid runes no more than stacks of 10 and make it costly or trade one rune type for a different kind of thing < this option can be iffy , 2 potions of heal, harm and resto , 3 low tier potions of renown, exp , slayer

[SpartanKiller13]

The problem isn't completely the increasing cost, it's also the way that the respec functions.

Most respecs only involve changing a couple of points spent but always require the cost of resetting the whole tree. This leads to massive spiralling bills when in reality it should only have cost a few k plat.

Enhancements really need an edit option that tracks the change of setup so that the cost reflects the actual change rather than the somewhat arbitrary value of the entire points spend in a whole tree.

This I think is the best approach.

It costs the same to empty/redo a tree vs removing one point from it. That's pretty lame when you realize you're one point short just after you finish locking everything in lol.

[erethizon]

More absolute nonsense from my perspective. Cost isn't the critical factor or barrier in on the fly changes now, time is. Nobody with much sense is going to ask everyone to hang about whilst they completely redo their destinies. 2 or 3 folks doing that would use more time than they'd spend in quests.

When I do an Epic Reincarnation it takes me less than a minute to spend 88 AP in the 4 trees I use. Redoing Epic Destinies between raids would be very easy and take almost no time once you know what your builds are. There is a certain delay between raids anyway as you wait for each person to get to the new raid (and often times replace one person with another) so the time factor would rarely be an issue at all (unless the person respeccing doesn't know their build and is slowly reading everything while they spend their points).

[Marshal_Lannes]

Case in point this morning where we didn't have a tank for a raid, so instead ran a lower difficulty.

And even if it were the case, what is so wrong in your head with folks having a work-around for twists anyway?
.

The first part I view is working as intended. People need to realize the game supports a vast array of difficulties. It's alright to lower the difficulty if you can't handle the quest. The second part is that we've moved away from twists. Those are no longer in the design philosophy. We don't need people gaming the system and creating workarounds.

Revitalizing the DDO economy is a good thing. The two most popular uses of platinum - ED resets and Reaper wings get grief on these forums because they are desirable items people want for free. Desirable items drive economies. They cost money. In this case platinum. Which you earn. It's good to see platinum have value again.

I do agree that for high-end players most ED resets involve only switching around a few points as abilities are tested out. A certain grace period for ED experimentation should have been put in but that ship has sailed unless we get a Christmas week ED free moment.

[Oxarhamar]

The first part I view is working as intended. People need to realize the game supports a vast array of difficulties. It's alright to lower the difficulty if you can't handle the quest. The second part is that we've moved away from twists. Those are no longer in the design philosophy. We don't need people gaming the system and creating workarounds.

Revitalizing the DDO economy is a good thing. The two most popular uses of platinum - ED resets and Reaper wings get grief on these forums because they are desirable items people want for free. Desirable items drive economies. They cost money. In this case platinum. Which you earn. It's good to see platinum have value again.

I do agree that for high-end players most ED resets involve only switching around a few points as abilities are tested out. A certain grace period for ED experimentation should have been put in but that ship has sailed unless we get a Christmas week ED free moment.

What drives economies is not plat sinks but tradeable loot

Having plat sinks don't make platinum have value when there is limited else to trade for it

Situational swapping of EDs and twists is not gaming the system it was a strength the more flexible design had built in

Temporarily reduced costs would be great for helping players feel out the new system but it would do nothing as a long term solution to the issue

[Dejvid]

revitalizing the ddo economy would be sunsetting the shard exchange and letting players trade in one currency, that way platinum would have a real value again and you could justify sinks like respec costs and whatnot. not this 2-class system we have right now.

but since platinum is pretty much worthless, as astral shards are the more valuable currency, all the respec cost does is add busywork for the sake of it.

its like a mobile game. go grind something to fill up that stamina bar to be able to enjoy the game again. or pay some macrotransactions.

[Certon]

It's absolutely ridiculous as it stands. ED resets should be free for the foreseeable future, as veterans need time to learn the new system and convert their characters over. I've already shelled out millions of plat for a GAME MECHANIC. Forget the real world money I've had to use to buy skill tomes because when LR'ing my characters, I screwed up on skill allocations for feats like Greater Single Weapon Fighting. Reconstructing older, incredibly nuanced characters requires more than just handing in the heart and clicking reincarnate. Stats have to be allocated correctly and feats need to be chosen at the right levels or when the right class is leveling, or you could seriously mess up everything you're trying to reconstruct because they decided to "switch things up." This legerdemain we have to perform to clean up THEIR mess is beyond the pale.

Beyond playtesting my builds and tweaking them, I've done no actual PLAYING of the game. Just running through EE quests, seeing what works and what doesn't, resetting my ED's and sometimes Enhancements, and repeating the process.

In my opinion, they should have left the broken feats like Dire Charge in the game, but not selectable at level up, so that legacy players could enjoy it as long as they didn't Reincarnate in any form, and NOT handed out Lesser Hearts AT ALL. Then it would have just been a simple matter of redoing EDs and MOVING on.

[Oliphant]

Plat rest costs are no problem for folks with plat stockpiles but a problem for people with little to no plat like new players.

[Oxarhamar]

Plat rest costs are no problem for folks with plat stockpiles but a problem for people with little to no plat like new players.

One of the greater irony of this update since it has been indicated that it will help new players

[Marshal_Lannes]

It's absolutely ridiculous as it stands. ED resets should be free for the foreseeable future, as veterans need time to learn the new system and convert their characters over. I've already shelled out millions of plat for a GAME MECHANIC. Forget the real world money I've had to use to buy skill tomes because when LR'ing my characters, I screwed up on skill allocations for feats like Greater Single Weapon Fighting. Reconstructing older, incredibly nuanced characters requires more than just handing in the heart and clicking reincarnate. Stats have to be allocated correctly and feats need to be chosen at the right levels or when the right class is leveling, or you could seriously mess up everything you're trying to reconstruct because they decided to "switch things up." This legerdemain we have to perform to clean up THEIR mess is beyond the pale.

Beyond playtesting my builds and tweaking them, I've done no actual PLAYING of the game. Just running through EE quests, seeing what works and what doesn't, resetting my ED's and sometimes Enhancements, and repeating the process.

In my opinion, they should have left the broken feats like Dire Charge in the game, but not selectable at level up, so that legacy players could enjoy it as long as they didn't Reincarnate in any form, and NOT handed out Lesser Hearts AT ALL. Then it would have just been a simple matter of redoing EDs and MOVING on.

Your description of how you are playing indicates to me just how new player-friendly this system is and how veterans need platinum more than ever which goes back to my alternative approaches to the platinum standard. No new player goes through all that. None. Few veterans are. My characters are so powerful now what do I care if they aren't spec'd perfectly? I'll refine it in the next racial TR. If you want to fine-tune something in the manner you're describing then paying a premium fee to do so isn't out of the question. I've offered some tools that would help you in your quest for perfection.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/528266-DDO-Economy-Gold

This is an interesting thread adjacent to our topic discussing the platinum economy and the renewed need for platinum. I hear many red herrings about astral shards. The only people who use astral shards are the pinnacle of the pyramid or people loaded with real-world cash who drop it for convenience. Everyone else uses platinum. For example, since coming back to the game I've worked the shard exchange and have built up around 500 astral shards. I don't spend them on anything. I was going to buy Guild Storage chests but was able to pick them up for plat. The only astral shard purchases I've made are a few Feather Fall augments. Meanwhile, I've made and spent millions of platinum. Most players experience the economy this way. They have certain items they will shard for and the rest they platinum. Further, I don't believe platinum requires grinding. Maybe it does if you're a player who skips all chests and doesn't take loot. For me, this is a non-issue. I bought a Reaper pet this past life and still hit Plat cap again. Having more things to spend plat on is a good thing. I'm asking for some enhanced banking options to accommodate it.

[Certon]

Your description of how you are playing indicates to me just how new player-friendly this system is and how veterans need platinum more than ever which goes back to my alternative approaches to the platinum standard. No new player goes through all that. None. Few veterans are. My characters are so powerful now what do I care if they aren't spec'd perfectly? I'll refine it in the next racial TR. If you want to fine-tune something in the manner you're describing then paying a premium fee to do so isn't out of the question.

It isn't about power. All of my characters are plenty powerful. It's REALLY DIFFICULT in this system to NOT be powerful.

No, it's about combat flow and usefulness outside of combat. If I'm just holding down the attack button and waiting for everything to die, then I am playing the game wrong. OPTIONS. And options that don't step on each others' toes.

Its the tricks that get me. Powers that put Epic Strikes into a 4 second cooldown, or epic strikes that put non-epic strikes into 15 second cooldowns. I found a few.
Or abilities in the Epic Trees that put class standards to shame. Betcha not a lot of Radiant Servants are gonna be out there with the new ED healing 2x-4x as much passively.
Or that my action bar, which used to have 5-8 abilities to mash in the right situation, has become, on some characters, 3 buttons in total.

Figuring out the hidden GOTCHAs has been trial and error. But I won't report the bugs I've found. None of them are exploits, and at this point, I'm not about to pay to be someone's QA.

[Marshal_Lannes]

Fair enough. But wouldn't you then say the platinum cost was part of the R&D process?

[JOTMON]

The exponential increasing plat cost for resets is BS

Set a static low cost amount for reach reset that doesn't bankrupt players or make it cheaper to reincarnate instead of resetting destiny trees.

Especially now since U51 has eliminated hot swap twists and alt selecting trees.

Currently we cant even look at alt trees or spend points in other trees without leaving the 3rd tree empty, its a complete swing from the old system.

[SiliconScout]

... platinum spent on ED is "lost" in that it doesn't circulate back into the game and many (most) modern loot items are all BTA limiting products that can even be transacted.
....You are missing the entire point here I think. It's a platinum sink and we need more of them to control inflation. When I played the game around MOTU very few items were actually seeing for a million plat. Not even tomes and back then those +4 tomes were pretty much as good as it got.

Now everything and it's dog sells for 2M plat. The plat from ED's doesn't need to return to the economy, or if you like to think of it it this way think of it as being invested, multiplied several times over and used to purchase the platinum (or shoudl I say items) that are created from the ether every time you open a chest.

I have at least 10 million on my account alone and I rarely play and turn at least half of all my gear into essences. As is after a certain point you literally earn multiples more platinum than you can spend every quest.

You want plat to have more value then you need more items that are tradable and more (and better) platinum sinks.

Prime example is the first week or so of HCL platinum is scarce and items are selling in the ASAH that are really vendor trash in any other time because nobody has platinum to spend on them. within 2 weeks though the decent to good items are in the plat house and the ASAH is mostly the premium gear.

The game needs more platinum sinks and specifically those that are worth spending the platinum on if you want it to regain value.

Honestly if anyone needs plat for an ED reset just hit me up on Thelanis, you can have it.

[Hawkwier]

The first part I view is working as intended. People need to realize the game supports a vast array of difficulties. It's alright to lower the difficulty if you can't handle the quest. The second part is that we've moved away from twists. Those are no longer in the design philosophy. We don't need people gaming the system and creating workarounds.

Revitalizing the DDO economy is a good thing. The two most popular uses of platinum - ED resets and Reaper wings get grief on these forums because they are desirable items people want for free. Desirable items drive economies. They cost money. In this case platinum. Which you earn. It's good to see platinum have value again.

I do agree that for high-end players most ED resets involve only switching around a few points as abilities are tested out. A certain grace period for ED experimentation should have been put in but that ship has sailed unless we get a Christmas week ED free moment.

You are of course free to view it as you like.

I view the loss of flexibility as a steaming pile of [unprintable] garbage.

The ONLY reason the raid today was dropped in difficulty was we lacked a tank. The option was to wait for one, or to hedge it by dropping the difficulty. This was not an issue pre-U51, as I've tanked it many times before in US. Dress it up how you like. It's plainly a loss of build flexibility compared to pre-U51. That's poor, and deserves to be called out as a regressive step. Inferring loss of power is stupid. It was loss of role, not power, that was the issue. It's sad you either can't fathom, or worse seek to deliberately obfuscate that fact, just so you can pretend everything is awesome, as the song goes...

[Oxarhamar]

Your description of how you are playing indicates to me just how new player-friendly this system is and how veterans need platinum more than ever which goes back to my alternative approaches to the platinum standard. No new player goes through all that. None. Few veterans are. My characters are so powerful now what do I care if they aren't spec'd perfectly? I'll refine it in the next racial TR. If you want to fine-tune something in the manner you're describing then paying a premium fee to do so isn't out of the question. I've offered some tools that would help you in your quest for perfection.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/528266-DDO-Economy-Gold

This is an interesting thread adjacent to our topic discussing the platinum economy and the renewed need for platinum. I hear many red herrings about astral shards. The only people who use astral shards are the pinnacle of the pyramid or people loaded with real-world cash who drop it for convenience. Everyone else uses platinum. For example, since coming back to the game I've worked the shard exchange and have built up around 500 astral shards. I don't spend them on anything. I was going to buy Guild Storage chests but was able to pick them up for plat. The only astral shard purchases I've made are a few Feather Fall augments. Meanwhile, I've made and spent millions of platinum. Most players experience the economy this way. They have certain items they will shard for and the rest they platinum. Further, I don't believe platinum requires grinding. Maybe it does if you're a player who skips all chests and doesn't take loot. For me, this is a non-issue. I bought a Reaper pet this past life and still hit Plat cap again. Having more things to spend plat on is a good thing. I'm asking for some enhanced banking options to accommodate it.

You may not care if your build is speced out but that is entirely subjective

Having play since tied to ED respec is inno way new players friendly however you like to wrap it

Yes Having plat tied to respec is all about shards otherwise it would not have a shard bypass

No top tier players are not tye only ones targeted with micro transaction bypass

No most players do not experience the economy the way you describe you do not speak for most players


You aren't asking for something that is a thing we will get the devs have stated limits there and Having higher plat limits doesn't solve the issue for new players you know who this update was touted to help

[Alttab]

The problem with the current ones is that they are deeply UN-FUN.
How about one or more of:

1M plat = 1 "Loot Rune"; 20 runes gets you non-raid named item of choice, for which you own the content.
1M plat = 10 Raid Runes (assuming you own the raid and have run it)
2M Plat = any sub-20 augment; 4 M plat = any non-named augment
0.5M plat = (non-store) scroll of your choice

None of these would break the game and all would be useful.

Yes, I like that idea, maybe not exactly like that, but something like that.

[DYWYPI]

What you see and hear depends a good deal on where you are standing; it also depends on what sort of person you are.

You can also get the Topaz of Feather Falling Augment with 20 Tokens of the Twelve. Or purchase them for 8 Astral Shards from the Collectors. I assume Marshal_Lannes acquired his topazes from Kipling Vranch or Peta Flashpin. Since the ones regularly posted on ASAH tend to be over double that AS price.

Last month alone; I probably made over 1000 AS (after sales fees), just selling complete random junk on the ASAH. I deposited around 300 AS of that into our Guild account although technically we won't need it for Guild Amenities. I've never purchased any Astral Shards.

On average I probably spend well over 64,000 pp daily - that will be currency in circulation. Our members don't get VIP perks, like monthly DDO points. The only things we've purchased for real money was the first two Expansions during a sale. They weren't available for Turbine Points at that time.

If you've got any spare Platinum to donate that you have no use for, I can always use it. I've only had one of my Characters hit Platinum cap for a few days (this current year). I always loot chests and will pass most named items in raids to others.

I haven't spent anything on Epic Destiny respecifying since U51, nor would I personally use AS for that purpose. Currently five of my Characters are Epic, I did respecify once recently, during a Lesser Recantation, this week as I'd misclicked a AP spend button on Tier Four, but that wasn't ED related.

[cmecu]

Yes, that is the point of a platinum sink. There is far too much plat in the game right now because it is far too easy to get.



That has nothing to do with the platinum cap. There is a cap because that is the highest number an unsigned 4 byte integer can hold (or whatever data type they used - not sure which ). Plus, if I recall correctly, all money is stored as CP and then converted so in essence the plat cap is the largest number of CP you can get. That means one can't arbitrarily raise the plat cap to a bigger number without rearranging the entire code base.


Oh I miss my Digital Logic class, you reminded me of it when I heard unsigned bytes.. The professor I had was from Iran, and his accent when he said bits came out as "beets" I smiled every time I heard it. Also he always asked. anyone got a question? got a question? If you moved or shifted, he would call your name.. you got a question? if you scratched your nose , he thought you had a question.. got a question? It reminded me so much of Corky Romano when he accidentally broke the bag of coke, and then had to go give a presentation to a bunch of kids.. Gotta a question???
" Most significant Beet "

[Dejvid]

<snip> For me, this is a non-issue. <snip>

this is a prime example of "i have no problems, therefore noone should complain because there are no problems.". sure, people like you that nolife ddo do not need to grind tens of thousands of platinum to reset their destiny trees. a friend of mine and me had to do exactly this while testing. oh sure, we just spend half an hour rushing trough borderland chain to have enough for the first test, but nonetheless, why is there an inconvenience in the first place?

and that so called "red herring" astral shards? guess what.. he was tempted to spend the few he bought a while ago just to not grind platinum after a while.

[Junk]

It was suggested in a earlier thread they need to just make it so you can save three epic destiny layouts. Then you can switch between them depending on the group make up.

[TFerguson]

It was suggested in a earlier thread they need to just make it so you can save three epic destiny layouts. Then you can switch between them depending on the group make up.

This would go a great deal to getting me to stop hating this game.

Do the same for Heroic ENH as well.

[Marshal_Lannes]

With platinum making such a big comeback opportunities abound for a tongue-in-cheek haggle enhancing item for the DDO anniversary event.

[Oxarhamar]

With platinum making such a big comeback opportunities abound for a tongue-in-cheek haggle enhancing item for the DDO anniversary event.

Platinum has not made a comeback

[Hawkwier]

It was suggested in a earlier thread they need to just make it so you can save three epic destiny layouts. Then you can switch between them depending on the group make up.

This has been suggested/requested from pretty much first preview of U51. Not sure they are going to do it any time soon though.

[Weemadarthur]

Platinum has not made a comeback

Simply put plat now is a necessity. For those that have it this is a minor inconvenience, for those that don't its a potential deal breaker. You are incorrect that it hasn't made a comeback but are 100% correct it still holds no value. For it to have value it would have to be usable for things that the players want. What we have here is just a bigger divide between the haves and have nots. Those that have spare plat to waste will barely notice how important it is while those that don't will be pushed even further back down the DDO food chain.

A player that has plat overflowing that ends up in a broken or non synergistic destiny can easily respec and move on in a few minutes. For a new player or one that's just low on plat that same issue can quickly become a major problem. This is not a plat sink its a wall placed to max inconvenience to induce shard sales. Plat sinks should always be optional and reward the player for using them. They should not be mandatory and used to buy your way out of what the devs released in a broken update.

[Oxarhamar]

Simply put plat now is a necessity. For those that have it this is a minor inconvenience, for those that don't its a potential deal breaker. You are incorrect that it hasn't made a comeback but are 100% correct it still holds no value. For it to have value it would have to be usable for things that the players want. What we have here is just a bigger divide between the haves and have nots. Those that have spare plat to waste will barely notice how important it is while those that don't will be pushed even further back down the DDO food chain.

A player that has plat overflowing that ends up in a broken or non synergistic destiny can easily respec and move on in a few minutes. For a new player or one that's just low on plat that same issue can quickly become a major problem. This is not a plat sink its a wall placed to max inconvenience to induce shard sales. Plat sinks should always be optional and reward the player for using them. They should not be mandatory and used to buy your way out of what the devs released in a broken update.

For it to make a comeback we would need to have tradable loot economy having a large play sink doesn’t bring plays value back you are right about the haves and the have nots

Looking at the AH shows the symptoms of how broken the plat economy is

[Marshal_Lannes]

Simply put plat now is a necessity. For those that have it this is a minor inconvenience, for those that don't its a potential deal breaker. You are incorrect that it hasn't made a comeback but are 100% correct it still holds no value. For it to have value it would have to be usable for things that the players want. What we have here is just a bigger divide between the haves and have nots. Those that have spare plat to waste will barely notice how important it is while those that don't will be pushed even further back down the DDO food chain.

A player that has plat overflowing that ends up in a broken or non synergistic destiny can easily respec and move on in a few minutes. For a new player or one that's just low on plat that same issue can quickly become a major problem. This is not a plat sink its a wall placed to max inconvenience to induce shard sales. Plat sinks should always be optional and reward the player for using them. They should not be mandatory and used to buy your way out of what the devs released in a broken update.

He knows it's back he just can't accept that I'm right. Same as I was about characters being more powerful than ever after U51. As to your last sentence, Plat is not mandatory. An excellent example was made above where two players were farming Borderlands for items to sell and one considered just buying shards. That demonstrates exactly the options players have. And while you are correct that this is but a minor inconvenience for me, shouldn't it be? I've spent a lot of game time accumulating my plat wealth. I'm glad it actually serves a purpose now instead of having to blow 500K on a filigree just to get away from the cap.

[Oxarhamar]

He knows it's back he just can't accept that I'm right. Same as I was about characters being more powerful than ever after U51. As to your last sentence, Plat is not mandatory. An excellent example was made above where two players were farming Borderlands for items to sell and one considered just buying shards. That demonstrates exactly the options players have. And while you are correct that this is but a minor inconvenience for me, shouldn't it be? I've spent a lot of game time accumulating my plat wealth. I'm glad it actually serves a purpose now instead of having to blow 500K on a filigree just to get away from the cap.

Saying that doesn't make it true platinum is not back it's still a broken economy

Characters have not been made more powerful monsters have been nerfed the is a distinction

Selling shards is a option? That's the entire point to advance the micro transaction bypass thanks for finally acknowledged that

[erethizon]

Last month alone; I probably made over 1000 AS (after sales fees), just selling complete random junk on the ASAH.

What do you classify as "complete random junk"? I'm surprised anything like that sells with any regularity.

[Weemadarthur]

And while you are correct that this is but a minor inconvenience for me, shouldn't it be? I've spent a lot of game time accumulating my plat wealth.

I just have to sit back and laugh at this inconsistent statement lol. So players that have spent time grinding out past lives, reaper points, etc are to be ignored despite the time they spent obtaining them as it doesn't feed into your current diatribe (and yes you have spent a lot of time posting disparaging statements on how unbalanced those are) but as this one works in your favor plat is perfectly ok to have spent time accumulating?

It becomes very hard to take you seriously when your only consistency is based on whether it effects you or not. Reaper is evil until you get enough reaper points to be ahead now R6 is the norm, past lives are the worst until you have enough now they are part of the game, plat would be evil if you didn't have enough but as you do its now great. Being an elitist jerk is wrong and now you have officially become one so congratz?

As one of those posting continuously previous to the U51 launch how this was to the benefit of new players your true double standards are really showing when you then fall back on an excuse (I earned it) that you personally have been very disparaging of in the past. Like the vast majority of your posts they are just self serving drivel where you try and pull down anyone above you at the cost of those below. You seem to use the excuse of it will be better for new players only when you think it will actually be better for yourself.

As for the great power increase please take note here. Atm you are only powerful because everything was nerfed in a very bad job of balancing. The result of this is it has negated every thing done since reaper was introduced. The challenge difficulty has now gone. So what happens next. If you have been paying attention over the last year or so you will have heard the devs state that reapers are balanced off of elite and that is why they were unable to reduce the elite diff pre U51 as it would have made reapers too easy. Now the challenge difficulty has gone what do you think the next balancing step will be? So before you start making exuberant claims about how much more powerful you are I would wait until U51 is finished 1st and then judge. Atm you are judging the game when in short it should still be on lamm being tested and balanced. You are not playing the finished product yet.

[Weemadarthur]

What do you classify as "complete random junk"? I'm surprised anything like that sells with any regularity.

I can't speak for DYWYPI here but I can say what I get most of my AS from on the AH. Collectibles always sell reasonably well (I sell in stacks of 15,10 or 5 depending on rarity and get anywhere between 5-50AS per stack depending on type. Dual slot items for crafting always go for at least 10 shards a pop (certain items can go for a lot more) and rare filigrees or augments can be worth a small fortune. When playing the ASAH game I can generally make about 200-300 AS over a weekend so I don't find 1k per month to be completely unbelievable.

The part that these posters tend to ignore though is the vast majority of those shards are still paid for. Just because I don't buy shards doesn't mean no one else does. If no one was buying shards and everyone was to play the AH game we would run out pretty **** fast. Its exactly the same argument as saying duping isnt a problem as i don't dupe while still buying duped items.

[Marshal_Lannes]

So players that have spent time grinding out past lives, reaper points, etc are to be ignored despite the time they spent obtaining them as it doesn't feed into your current diatribe (and yes you have spent a lot of time posting disparaging statements on how unbalanced those are) but as this one works in your favor plat is perfectly ok to have spent time accumulating?
.

Apples to oranges. I've already pointed out above that new players are not spending hundreds of thousands of plat to reset trees. Why? Because they don't have a lot of points first of all and second they are picking whatever looks good and sticking with it. They aren't running through and looking for every advantage in the margins. I have long, long consistently advocated for a catchup mechanic in PLs and Reaper points even though it would no longer benefit me as I have over the 50 reaper point threshold I talked about and have a completionist. Just because I don't benefit doesn't mean I've changed my belief that the game needs a catch-up mechanic. You seem to be self-projecting onto me.

Post after post on this forum you read examples of where alts or new players no longer have to labor under the yoke of the old ED system. They don't have thousands of views but they are all over here. In every way, this update benefits new players. U51 is a resounding success. With the tweaks I've mentioned above and how they've made platinum relevant again that will continue to improve the game. The only negatives are from people who don't like change or already hate the game and would pick it apart even if they gave you free bitcoins (they already gave you all the quests for free!). Oh and the meld crowd. My build won't work because I don't have meld! Sure it still works, lower the difficulty you run on.

Anyone who has even a modicum of game experience knows that characters are more powerful after U51 (unless you had a flavor build that relied on meld). You or whoever can make up any excuse you want to justify that all the grief and words spent on these boards dooming U51. Those projections were flat-out wrong. So you can talk about bugs or platinum costs for elite players needing a fourth try at Shiradi or whatever. The fact is characters are more powerful and U51, for the majority of players, is a resounding success.

[Oxarhamar]

Apples to oranges. I've already pointed out above that new players are not spending hundreds of thousands of plat to reset trees. Why? Because they don't have a lot of points first of all and second they are picking whatever looks good and sticking with it. They aren't running through and looking for every advantage in the margins. I have long, long consistently advocated for a catchup mechanic in PLs and Reaper points even though it would no longer benefit me as I have over the 50 reaper point threshold I talked about and have a completionist. Just because I don't benefit doesn't mean I've changed my belief that the game needs a catch-up mechanic. You seem to be self-projecting onto me.

Post after post on this forum you read examples of where alts or new players no longer have to labor under the yoke of the old ED system. They don't have thousands of views but they are all over here. In every way, this update benefits new players. U51 is a resounding success. With the tweaks I've mentioned above and how they've made platinum relevant again that will continue to improve the game. The only negatives are from people who don't like change or already hate the game and would pick it apart even if they gave you free bitcoins (they already gave you all the quests for free!). Oh and the meld crowd. My build won't work because I don't have meld! Sure it still works, lower the difficulty you run on.

Anyone who has even a modicum of game experience knows that characters are more powerful after U51 (unless you had a flavor build that relied on meld). You or whoever can make up any excuse you want to justify that all the grief and words spent on these boards dooming U51. Those projections were flat-out wrong. So you can talk about bugs or platinum costs for elite players needing a fourth try at Shiradi or whatever. The fact is characters are more powerful and U51, for the majority of players, is a resounding success.

And yet now they are jit with the reset cost which makes it a poor system for new players

Nerfing mobs is not the same as having more power

Maybe you should have tried the old Shiradi

[Weemadarthur]

Apples to oranges. I've already pointed out above that new players are not spending hundreds of thousands of plat to reset trees. Why? Because they don't have a lot of points first of all and second they are picking whatever looks good and sticking with it. They aren't running through and looking for every advantage in the margins. I have long, long consistently advocated for a catchup mechanic in PLs and Reaper points even though it would no longer benefit me as I have over the 50 reaper point threshold I talked about and have a completionist. Just because I don't benefit doesn't mean I've changed my belief that the game needs a catch-up mechanic. You seem to be self-projecting onto me.

Post after post on this forum you read examples of where alts or new players no longer have to labor under the yoke of the old ED system. They don't have thousands of views but they are all over here. In every way, this update benefits new players. U51 is a resounding success. With the tweaks I've mentioned above and how they've made platinum relevant again that will continue to improve the game. The only negatives are from people who don't like change or already hate the game and would pick it apart even if they gave you free bitcoins (they already gave you all the quests for free!). Oh and the meld crowd. My build won't work because I don't have meld! Sure it still works, lower the difficulty you run on.

Anyone who has even a modicum of game experience knows that characters are more powerful after U51 (unless you had a flavor build that relied on meld). You or whoever can make up any excuse you want to justify that all the grief and words spent on these boards dooming U51. Those projections were flat-out wrong. So you can talk about bugs or platinum costs for elite players needing a fourth try at Shiradi or whatever. The fact is characters are more powerful and U51, for the majority of players, is a resounding success.

Just rofl. Broken destinies, broken balance and bugs galore = people hate the game or dislike change? Loss of meld only effected flavor builds? The fact that negative posts outweigh positive posts about U51 by a 3 to 1 margin = resounding success for the majority?

Everything you have posted here is just your projecting what you think on the game and playerbase. None of it (as per usual) has any basis in facts.

Just for reference my projection for U51 previous to the update was that it needed at least another pass on lamm or it would be released as an unbalanced, bug riddled mess. Game balance is way off (I specifically stated that if they went too far toward easy that would be as big if not a bigger problem than leaving it as it was) and with 15 pages in the bug thread I think its safe to say there are too many bugs. I think my projections were actually spot on.

[Weemadarthur]

Just rofl. Broken destinies, broken balance and bugs galore = people hate the game or dislike change? Loss of meld only effected flavor builds? The fact that negative posts outweigh positive posts about U51 by a 3 to 1 margin = resounding success for the majority?

Everything you have posted here is just your projecting what you think on the game and playerbase. None of it (as per usual) has any basis in facts.

Just for reference my projection for U51 previous to the update was that it needed at least another pass on lamm or it would be released as an unbalanced, bug riddled mess. Game balance is way off (I specifically stated that if they went too far toward easy that would be as big if not a bigger problem than leaving it as it was) and with 15 pages in the bug thread I think its safe to say there are too many bugs. I think my projections were actually spot on.

Quick edit to point out that the bug thread has now hit 19 pages from the 15 last time I looked. yup that really looks like a well balanced and bug free update.

[Alttab]

I just hit level 30 and I had to reset my destinies just to try two new skills, it cost me 500k+ platinum, this is not very user friendly. The old destiny system was free to reset, they should have at least kept that part.

[Marshal_Lannes]

The fact that negative posts outweigh positive posts about U51 by a 3 to 1 margin = resounding success for the majority?
.

I've already addressed this. People don't like change. Further, negative posts garner quadruple the support that positive posts have because people gravitate toward the negative. And these negative posts are all coming from the same disgruntled circle that is negative about anything DDO related. Finally, message board negativity isn't a reflection of anything. It's like thinking that Twitter is the real world. It's not. The majority of people don't think like that. In game - I haven't met a single player on Orien that doesn't like U51. I haven't seen this many epic LFMs in years. So yes, the vast majority is speaking. Some people simply cannot get over that they were so wrong about U51 so they take it out here on the boards. We listen to them, we rationally try to point out all the benefits of U51 but some have chosen to die on the hill that DDO sucks. You aren't one of those, are you?

[Oxarhamar]

I've already addressed this. People don't like change. Further, negative posts garner quadruple the support that positive posts have because people gravitate toward the negative. And these negative posts are all coming from the same disgruntled circle that is negative about anything DDO related. Finally, message board negativity isn't a reflection of anything. It's like thinking that Twitter is the real world. It's not. The majority of people don't think like that. In game - I haven't met a single player on Orien that doesn't like U51. I haven't seen this many epic LFMs in years. So yes, the vast majority is speaking. Some people simply cannot get over that they were so wrong about U51 so they take it out here on the boards. We listen to them, we rationally try to point out all the benefits of U51 but some have chosen to die on the hill that DDO sucks. You aren't one of those, are you?

You can try to minimize all feedback to people don’t like change all you want that doesn’t change the legit feedback and issues with the update

Maybe if the changes was good then more would like it

Guess what Twitter existence is in the real world and has real world effects

[Weemadarthur]

I've already addressed this. People don't like change. Further, negative posts garner quadruple the support that positive posts have because people gravitate toward the negative. And these negative posts are all coming from the same disgruntled circle that is negative about anything DDO related. Finally, message board negativity isn't a reflection of anything. It's like thinking that Twitter is the real world. It's not. The majority of people don't think like that. In game - I haven't met a single player on Orien that doesn't like U51. I haven't seen this many epic LFMs in years. So yes, the vast majority is speaking. Some people simply cannot get over that they were so wrong about U51 so they take it out here on the boards. We listen to them, we rationally try to point out all the benefits of U51 but some have chosen to die on the hill that DDO sucks. You aren't one of those, are you?

Sorry but as stated previously my complaints against U51 were completely valid and proved to be 100% accurate. Nothing I have ever posted has been about change or power loss (unless in response to others). I have not stated that DDO sucks (although that is how you keep interpreting it). I have not at any point given a verdict for or against the U51 changes outside of how they effect game balance and quality.

Asking for a quality product does not mean I dislike the game or think it sucks. Asking for a balanced game doesn't mean I dislike it or think it sucks. If for one minute you were capable of actually looking at what people say outside of your own bias you would see that 90% of these "negative" posts are people (like myself) who enjoy the game but are unhappy with the direction it has taken (here I mean in quality and balance so nothing to do with power or change).

You have repeatedly made the claim to dismiss any post you deem negative that people just don't like change. This is not the case as I have said many many times before. People do expect at least an iota of quality though. If this update had been delayed by just one month we could have had a far better balanced game with a huge reduction in bugs. Most of the current issues could have been resolved in that time. A delay of 2 months could have given us a well balanced and almost bug free update that had been properly tested and the majority would have been happy with. Instead we got a bug ridden unbalanced mess of an update and no amount of pompom waving will reduce that amount of bugs or sloppy workmanship. This is the problem not change.

That awesome power you keep harping on about isn't a good thing its the complete lack of balance showing. While you are happy with your newfound power those that were already playing the top end of the spectrum have had all challenge removed and are now back where they were before reaper was added. Slowly they will start dropping out again just as they did before we got reaper. This wont be a mass exodus overnight but a slow trickle over the next few months as players start to get bored.

Some players just can't admit that anything is wrong with this game. They then in a misguided attempt to be positive dismiss all complaints valid or otherwise. They actually get in the way of people trying to get bugs fixed or the game improved. No matter how carefully or politely anything is explained to them they will just dismiss anything that doesn't conform to their view. You are one of those aren't you?

[Marshal_Lannes]

Since U51 has made DDO the best it's ever been why would we want to delay the release of such a groundbreaking effort? We've already had posts stating that it is SOP for software to patch and release. As I've said this paragraph upon paragraph of misdirection boils down I don't like change (in the game). What players who have already won DDO do isn't my concern. I've said a dozen times here that it's about the journey, not the destination. Enhanced character power from U51 has democratized Reaper in ways that were onerous before. I've not met one person on Orien who doesn't like it. Are there some? Sure. You can't please everyone. Best of luck with the windmills.

[Oxarhamar]

Since U51 has made DDO the best it's ever been why would we want to delay the release of such a groundbreaking effort? We've already had posts stating that it is SOP for software to patch and release. As I've said this paragraph upon paragraph of misdirection boils down I don't like change (in the game). What players who have already won DDO do isn't my concern. I've said a dozen times here that it's about the journey, not the destination. Enhanced character power from U51 has democratized Reaper in ways that were onerous before. I've not met one person on Orien who doesn't like it. Are there some? Sure. You can't please everyone. Best of luck with the windmills.

You can again state that all feedbakc is just resistance to change but that won't make it any less untrue

only one fighting windmills here

U51 may have made DDO the most bugs & unbalanced it's even been in one update alone

[Hawkwier]

Since U51 has made DDO the best it's ever been why would we want to delay the release of such a groundbreaking effort? We've already had posts stating that it is SOP for software to patch and release. As I've said this paragraph upon paragraph of misdirection boils down I don't like change (in the game). What players who have already won DDO do isn't my concern. I've said a dozen times here that it's about the journey, not the destination. Enhanced character power from U51 has democratized Reaper in ways that were onerous before. I've not met one person on Orien who doesn't like it. Are there some? Sure. You can't please everyone. Best of luck with the windmills.

Best it's ever been? O. M. G. What a joke.

Moar Power does not equal better. Balance has been spun out of kilter, both between toons and mobs and across builds and playstyles. Build flexibility is in the dumpster. There is a bugs thread 19 pages long, which doesn't even include the ones the Devs know about. Quests have been closed. Live is currently effectively Lam.

We have you proclaiming all is perfect because you can now solo R4 when you couldn't before, telling us our builds are flavour if we're not happy so our opinions don't count, yet strangely enough, on these very same "flavour" builds we were soloing R4, and more, before this change, when your perfect builds apparently couldn't. How does that work?

We have folks also telling us that R needs beefed up as it's now too easy. If everything is the best it's ever been, why would any rebalance be necessary? Oh, and how do you think the Devs will seek to balance your new-found power? When the nerfs hit will things still be the best they've ever been, or worse? Will you ever, ever be in a position to provide objective criticism of change? Because if not, why would anyone take you seriously?

Arthur has a point. I can recall you getting pelters, being called a socialist by some (which though intended as an insult by them, I personally considered a badge of honour for you at the time). I was impressed you were arguing for equality. Now though, it's like you have some sort of compulsion to praise every Dev-driven infallibility, which overrides any other consideration, and as long as you're happy in your brave new world of R4, everyone else must comply without complaint. It's literally incredible to read. At least Animal Farm was a good read!

U51 was supposed to be a change to improve EDs for a smoother Epic levelling experience. No more, no less. Many nerfs were introduced. Many buffs too. Many folks were naturally concerned about the nerfs. The balance between nerfs and buffs varies with build and also with playstyle. That's to be expected in a complex system. For those that came out ahead, good luck to them, and it seems that is the majority, particularly for ranged and casters. Even those who didn't see as much of a bump in power, the nerfs largely seem to have been offset - for many that may be due to the mob-side nerfs, but however achieved, at least that aspect of the car crash has been mitigated. That's a good thing - for now. I'd also say that if the changes help epic progression then that is good imo. My perspective here is from cap. Which you apparently don't care about, but a sizeable bunch of folks play at.

But none of that. Nerf nor buff, was the intent of U51. Success imo would have looked like broadly zero balance impact (much like was achieved in U50 imo). That intent has failed, and I some cases by a big margin. For now. Does anyone think adjustments are not coming though? Or aren't necessary? I don't believe we will see U51 stabilised until way more patches and c.Jan, but I can say it's definitely not perfect or the best ever right now. And I'm certain the Devs believe the same - or patches and quest closures would self-evidently be unnecessary.

But yeah, we're supposed to shut up and get in line because DDO is, right now, the best it's ever been.

If we'd adopted that dogma on 1st preview, we'd likely still have builder-spender. And I have to say I doubt your tune would be missing a note regardless. Because bad as it was, it's only coz we just don't like change.

All together now: "Everything is awesome..."

What a joke.

Laugh? I very nearly started!

[Weemadarthur]

Since U51 has made DDO the best it's ever been why would we want to delay the release of such a groundbreaking effort? We've already had posts stating that it is SOP for software to patch and release. As I've said this paragraph upon paragraph of misdirection boils down I don't like change (in the game). What players who have already won DDO do isn't my concern. I've said a dozen times here that it's about the journey, not the destination. Enhanced character power from U51 has democratized Reaper in ways that were onerous before. I've not met one person on Orien who doesn't like it. Are there some? Sure. You can't please everyone. Best of luck with the windmills.

I said it before so will say it again.

Some players just can't admit that anything is wrong with this game. They then in a misguided attempt to be positive dismiss all complaints valid or otherwise. They actually get in the way of people trying to get bugs fixed or the game improved. No matter how carefully or politely anything is explained to them they will just dismiss anything that doesn't conform to their view. You are one of those aren't you?

[Marshal_Lannes]

Best it's ever been? O. M. G. What a joke.

Moar Power does not equal better. Balance has been spun out of kilter, both between toons and mobs and across builds and playstyles. Build flexibility is in the dumpster. There is a bugs thread 19 pages long, which doesn't even include the ones the Devs know about. Quests have been closed. Live is currently effectively Lam.

We have you proclaiming all is perfect because you can now solo R4 when you couldn't before, telling us our builds are flavour if we're not happy so our opinions don't count, yet strangely enough, on these very same "flavour" builds we were soloing R4, and more, before this change, when your perfect builds apparently couldn't. How does that work?

What does that mean when you say balance has been spun out of kilter? Power has nothing to do with better it's the way the game plays. We are no longer confronted with bloated mobs of HPs which almost no one liked. There is no longer a need for having an entire shopping cart full of past lives and reaper points to succeed at reaper questing. Abilities your character had in heroics are no longer useless in epics. These are the things that have made the game better - best it's ever been. I would actually argue that the game now is balanced exactly as it always should have been.

I've already addressed the bugs. They will patch as we move on. None of them interfere with my enjoyment of the game except the two raids being down. But it is an inconvenience at most. I've also already addressed builds that relied exclusively on meld to get them through reaper. Finally, you're taking out of context what I said about R4. I said R4 is the new elite (which it is). I have no opinions on solo play except to say what I always have - DDO is a group game.




We have folks also telling us that R needs beefed up as it's now too easy. If everything is the best it's ever been, why would any rebalance be necessary? Oh, and how do you think the Devs will seek to balance your new-found power? When the nerfs hit will things still be the best they've ever been, or worse? Will you ever, ever be in a position to provide objective criticism of change? Because if not, why would anyone take you seriously?

You cannot challenge players who have already won the game. R10 was too easy for them before as well, they simply dominated it while they carried the other 4 players in the group. Part of this is that those other four players can now contribute and honestly some of the elites egos can't handle it. U51 has democratized mid/high-level reaper play. Of course, there will be ED balancing going forward. We've already had our first nerf Shiradi post. Nerfs come and go and most of us shrug our shoulders and adapt. You've never heard me go ballistic over a nerf. They went through a series of nerfs or proxy nerfs on Paladin, a class I played a lot. I've never felt the need to make disparaging remarks about the game or threaten to quit over it. It's a game, I enjoy playing it, I move on.


Arthur has a point. I can recall you getting pelters, being called a socialist by some (which though intended as an insult by them, I personally considered a badge of honour for you at the time). I was impressed you were arguing for equality. Now though, it's like you have some sort of compulsion to praise every Dev-driven infallibility, which overrides any other consideration, and as long as you're happy in your brave new world of R4, everyone else must comply without complaint. It's literally incredible to read. At least Animal Farm was a good read!

Again, I feel you're self-projecting here. I've addressed in a previous post that I have many issues with the game and have offered numerous examples where I don't agree with the decisions that the Devs have taken. I started this very post calling for changes to the way we interact with platinum since it is once again an important factor for our characters. Most recently DDOQUESTS2021 came out. I was against this unless they enhanced what was given to VIPs. But I never made posts yelling at the game about it. I have faith that they will address VIP value. I've already stated that U51 has opened up reaper play to virtually everyone. You can decide whether or not how that translates into socio-economic systems.


U51 was supposed to be a change to improve EDs for a smoother Epic levelling experience. No more, no less. Many nerfs were introduced. Many buffs too. Many folks were naturally concerned about the nerfs. The balance between nerfs and buffs varies with build and also with playstyle. That's to be expected in a complex system. For those that came out ahead, good luck to them, and it seems that is the majority, particularly for ranged and casters. Even those who didn't see as much of a bump in power, the nerfs largely seem to have been offset - for many that may be due to the mob-side nerfs, but however achieved, at least that aspect of the car crash has been mitigated. That's a good thing - for now. I'd also say that if the changes help epic progression then that is good imo. My perspective here is from cap. Which you apparently don't care about, but a sizeable bunch of folks play at.

But none of that. Nerf nor buff, was the intent of U51. Success imo would have looked like broadly zero balance impact (much like was achieved in U50 imo). That intent has failed, and I some cases by a big margin. For now. Does anyone think adjustments are not coming though? Or aren't necessary? I don't believe we will see U51 stabilised until way more patches and c.Jan, but I can say it's definitely not perfect or the best ever right now. And I'm certain the Devs believe the same - or patches and quest closures would self-evidently be unnecessary.
!

Where was that the stated goal? U51 was always going to create massive changes in the game as it amped up to move toward an increased level cap. Do you actually believe no changes would happen when there were completely redoing nearly every ability associated with Epic questing? We have disagreement on balance - I don't feel the game was balanced before. Now, the game feels so much better. You no longer have a situation where everyone is zooming along in heroics then they hit 20 and half their abilities don't work but the characters who have 5 twists and fully loaded EDs can suddenly destroy epic quests while everyone else labors over killing a 13K HP rat. That no longer exists and the game is far better off for it.

Hopefully these comments have answered your questions.

[Aelonwy]

With platinum making such a big comeback opportunities abound for a tongue-in-cheek haggle enhancing item for the DDO anniversary event.

They've already anticipated this joke:
https://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Cheap_Shot_(level_30)

[myliftkk_v2]

Waste of time responding to someone who got called on their technical knowledge gap in the very first response and kept chugging along like Wile E. over the cliff.

You're not going to make the OP look down, because as long as they don't they can keep running to infinity.

Charging for something you used to get for free (ED resets) is SOP for this game. They're going to nickel-n-dime most of the players to death, literally.

[Oxarhamar]

Waste of time responding to someone who got called on their technical knowledge gap in the very first response and kept chugging along like Wile E. over the cliff.

You're not going to make the OP look down, because as long as they don't they can keep running to infinity.

Charging for something you used to get for free (ED resets) is SOP for this game. They're going to nickel-n-dime most of the players to death, literally.

Indeed

[Marshal_Lannes]

You're not going to make the OP look down, because as long as they don't they can keep running to infinity.

Charging for something you used to get for free (ED resets) is SOP for this game. They're going to nickel-n-dime most of the players to death, literally.

Taylor already taught me long ago that haters are gonna hate, hate, hate, hate. I don't listen to them or respond to them. Truth triggers some people and I'm a DDO truth broker. I suggest you look up what the word literally means.

[dredre9987]

I have yet to spend over 20k plat to reset a tree. Granted I'm only lvl 26 atm

[Valerianus]

Taylor already taught me long ago that haters are gonna hate, hate, hate, hate. I don't listen to them or respond to them. Truth triggers some people and I'm a DDO truth broker. I suggest you look up what the word literally means.


signature worthy

[Oxarhamar]

Taylor already taught me long ago that haters are gonna hate, hate, hate, hate. I don't listen to them or respond to them. Truth triggers some people and I'm a DDO truth broker. I suggest you look up what the word literally means.

If only that were true

You say don't listen don't respond in a post that is a response to a so called hater so that already you have proven to be untrue

[Dejvid]

Taylor already taught me long ago that haters are gonna hate, hate, hate, hate. I don't listen to them or respond to them. Truth triggers some people and I'm a DDO truth broker. I suggest you look up what the word literally means.

well at least this gave me a good chuckle.

[Oliphant]

Most recently DDOQUESTS2021 came out. I was against this unless they enhanced what was given to VIPs.

https://media4.giphy.com/media/HAx8k1165YkWQ/giphy.gif?cid=ecf05e47s4w3k60hyx1iaestkxhpzmqqnhtq mea8ex1b19oo&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g

[Alttab]

If someone does not have enough platinum to reset epic destinies and is not level 30 yet and he made a lot of bad choices, does he just have to continue with crappy destinies like the old system was requiring with Karma?

[Mininin67]

If someone does not have enough platinum to reset epic destinies and is not level 30 yet and he made a lot of bad choices, does he just have to continue with crappy destinies like the old system was requiring with Karma?

The answer to this is yes, but the new system is so much more flexible it should not bother you :D