Devs or players, please convince me that KOTC and other changes are good.

[Malusny]

Dear Developers and players,

Please convince me that the KOTC changes are going to make the it better for paladins. I've read the suggested changes but please enlighten me and tell me precisely (give me and example) what is going to get better...

I will give someone 10$ if someone points out a clearly beneficial change.

No joke.

I mean, if someone tells me and explains and convinces me, I can even pay more.

HP nerfed, Divine Might nerfed and no benefits for those paladins who are using S$B.

So please convince me.

I challenge you, especially Devs to explain to me because maybe after 10 years of playing DDO I am so dumb that I don't see the benefit?


Cheers.

Ps. Yes, I am salty as hell but I have a good reasons.

[Azerraak]

They're not. They're just "different". This long awaited update was supposed to boost pallies and even the playing field but they'll still end up being **** and 90% of the server will continue playing casters/ranged characters.

The glancing blow changes are going to suck for people on low population servers that rely on soloing with a hireling while waiting for their LFM to fill. The second the hireling casts a heal, it's dead, especially on those fights where 5-6 taunt-immune mobs attack.

Don't worry though! When you hit level 26 and have also filled out your primal destiny tree which happens to be on the opposite side of the divine one, you can pick up perfect two-handed fighting! This will let you hit two whole mobs with a chance at a 3rd one! Isn't that an incredible buff?

But seriously, they need to look at the class and ask themselves if anyone would actually play it AS THEIR MAIN. Compare the class' overall power to the overall power available to other classes (That includes alchemists, arti's, sorcs and all their other favored classes).

So far this update is pulling a "lipstick on a pig" move. I'm hoping the new versions of the patch will be better.

[shores11]

I think the first question Paladin lovers need to ask is why am I playing a Paladin?

Let me first state that my main character of choice is a Paladin and it has always been. My Paladin is a Sword & Board pure level 30 with Aps in both Vanguard and Knight of the Chalice, KotC is my Tier 5 tree. I know that in the D&D world and in DDO that a Paladin is at best a really good support melee fighter, minor healer, minor buffs, lessor than cleric effective undead turning. FOR ME; a Paladin should be able to provide good melee DPS (I crit. for 3k to 7k), better defense than a fighter or barbarian and general good survivability.

A Paladin is not meant to be able to hit on the same level as a barbarian, fighter or caster that is his/her role. I welcome changes to Paladins as long as they can continue to operate within roles to which they are given. A Paladin in no way should ever be a top level damage dealer that barbarians and fighters are designed to be.

I love playing a Paladin thanks SSG.

[Xgya]

The changes to Holy Retribution are very welcome.

I'll gladly accept a longer cooldown on the ability if it means I get to oneshot enemies come high heroics or epics with a DC that scales with tactics boosting equipment and enhancements and no longer uses turn undead charges. (though now i gotta find a use for those)

Letting Silver Flame paladins use Smite Evil and other special attacks at a range is welcome, but probably won't come into play for anyone playing iconic paladins.
I know I might try using Holy Sword on a repeater-using Paladin again, I liked the build, I'll love the build now that the crossbow smites evil.

[Malusny]

I think the first question Paladin lovers need to ask is why am I playing a Paladin?

Let me first state that my main character of choice is a Paladin and it has always been. My Paladin is a Sword & Board pure level 30 with Aps in both Vanguard and Knight of the Chalice, KotC is my Tier 5 tree. I know that in the D&D world and in DDO that a Paladin is at best a really good support melee fighter, minor healer, minor buffs, lessor than cleric effective undead turning. FOR ME; a Paladin should be able to provide good melee DPS (I crit. for 3k to 7k), better defense than a fighter or barbarian and general good survivability.

A Paladin is not meant to be able to hit on the same level as a barbarian, fighter or caster that is his/her role. I welcome changes to Paladins as long as they can continue to operate within roles to which they are given. A Paladin in no way should ever be a top level damage dealer that barbarians and fighters are designed to be.

I love playing a Paladin thanks SSG.

I know who you are and you do not play a paladin for a long time now.

[Malusny]

The changes to Holy Retribution are very welcome.

I'll gladly accept a longer cooldown on the ability if it means I get to oneshot enemies come high heroics or epics with a DC that scales with tactics boosting equipment and enhancements and no longer uses turn undead charges. (though now i gotta find a use for those)

Letting Silver Flame paladins use Smite Evil and other special attacks at a range is welcome, but probably won't come into play for anyone playing iconic paladins.
I know I might try using Holy Sword on a repeater-using Paladin again, I liked the build, I'll love the build now that the crossbow smites evil.

Sure but I am talking about melee builds. I am not talking about ranged unless you want to call them Palathrowers instead of Paladins.

[shores11]

I know who you are and you do not play a paladin for a long time now.

I'm glad you know me but unfortunately I do not know you.

My Paladin is on the Khyber server and his name is Fizikal. I play on my Paladin almost every day and have done so for 14 plus years. If you do not know that then my friend you DO NOT know me.

[Xgya]

Sure but I am talking about melee builds. I am not talking about ranged unless you want to call them Palathrowers instead of Paladins.

That's why I also mentioned Holy Retribution changes.

I'm an AWFUL melee player, so my experience playing them beyond swashbuffler Bards is somewhat limited, but I can understand how a Tier 5 ability that's an AoE Assassinate, even if it only works a third of the time in high Epics, is still very much welcome.

[Malusny]

I'm glad you know me but unfortunately I do not know you.

My Paladin is on the Khyber server and his name is Fizikal. I play on my Paladin almost every day and have done so for 14 plus years. If you do not know that then my friend you DO NOT know me.


Haha... This game hasn't been on for 14 years yet. Besides I know only one person in game who used to have a Founder's Helmet, she was one of the players to play from early times. You are a liar... please don't post here if you don't contribute to the topic. cheers.

[shores11]

Haha... This game hasn't been on for 14 years yet. Besides I know only one person in game who used to have a Founder's Helmet, she was one of the players to play from early times. You are a liar... please don't post here if you don't contribute to the topic. cheers.

My friend please no need to personally insult me.

I began playing in February of 2006 on a 10-day pretrial account. This was launched 10 days prior to the DDO going live. Now I am no mathematician but I believe 2006 to 2020 equals 14 years. Can someone else please confirm this to be true. I do have a Founders Helmet and I get it again every time I TR my character(s).

Now my original post was very much on point in this discussion my friend. You are the one who took it off topic with the insults. I will not return the favor and just continue to call you my friend whom I do not know thank you.

[capsela]

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/511735-Divine-Might-NERF

This thread explains why the changes to divine might are healthy.




The problem was current DM + new THF would be OP. Not just that it'd be OP for splashes, but would be OP for every single STR THF build, *even* just as a splash.

Why would you play a Wis or Cha pal if STR offered literally 3x the bonus? They want all three stats to be equally served by trances.

So now you don't have to be STR based. It opens up more build options, isn't that an improvement? Strikethrough will surely raise the overall DPS. Not sure why you pali lovers are raging.

[Chai]

From what I am seeing Paladin will be more powerful with a ranged kit than with a melee kit.

[Chai]

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/511735-Divine-Might-NERF

This thread explains why the changes to divine might are healthy.



So now you don't have to be STR based. It opens up more build options, isn't that an improvement? Strikethrough will surely raise the overall DPS. Not sure why you pali lovers are raging.

DM nerf when preview 1 makes THF use 2X str is justified as DM on top of that would be OP.

Preview 2 makes THF use 3x str...

Seems legit. :D

[Malusny]

DM nerf when preview 1 makes THF use 2X str is justified as DM on top of that would be OP.

Preview 2 makes THF use 3x str...

Seems legit. :D

All those changes that you are writng about are for THF only. Those who use S&B or SWF will lose a lot.

[J-mann]

All those changes that you are writng about are for THF only. Those who use S&B or SWF will lose a lot.

Not really. They gain far more than they lose. The question is if it is enough to bring pallies into the proverbial light and I'm not sure it is. Also the change back on stalwart is just dumb, not sure why they listened to the one person whining about losing 5 temp hp vs gaining 1 mp per level.

[shores11]

Not really. They gain far more than they lose. The question is if it is enough to bring pallies into the proverbial light and I'm not sure it is. Also the change back on stalwart is just dumb, not sure why they listened to the one person whining about losing 5 temp hp vs gaining 1 mp per level.

I play a Vanguard (sword & board) style Paladin that actually spends most of it's APs in KotC for all of it's DPS. I am looking forward to the changes and hope it is at least on the same level or better then he currently is.

[droid327]

The changes to favored weapons in the tree, granting KT, etc. will give you more damage than before and open up more options for weapon use...it's an improvement, but not a very exciting one and I expected more creativity and bigger boosts to KotC. It's not enough IMO.

Don't lump in the THF or Trance nerfs into the KotC overhaul though. Those are separate changes that are bad ideas for more than just Pal. Bsword ArtI, e.g., gets nerfed both from HaH getting shafted and KTA getting nerfed too.