Melee Cleric Help

[invicto15]

Hi all I need advice on salvaging a build, I am a returning player after like 2-3 years of not playing at all. I don't remember much about the game, as far as builds what's good what's not so TRed my level 30 into a Morninglord 12/6/2 Cleric/Pally/Fighter. I need to make it good through elites so i can get good xp fast, to get to level 30 and TR out of this life, i was just trying to get my cleric life out of the way, I do have a lesser stone in case i need to change feat line etc. My whole point I was trying to achieve was to do good dmg while retaining survivability through heals and armour, not sure if may be switching to a 2h build would be better at this point. But to make a long story short my build goes like this


Lawful Good Morninglord 36 point build
12/6/2 Cleric/Pally/Fighter
Past life:fighter,pally,ranger,warlock,wizard,barb,sorc ,bard,artificer.

STR 16-17 Sorry don't remember exactly what it was.
Dex 8
Con 14
Int 10
Wis 8
Cha 18 all level ups to Cha
+7 tome on all

Lvl 1. Pally-Power Attack
Lvl 2. Pally
Lvl 3. Pally-Cleave
Lvl 4. Pally
Lvl 5. Pally
Lvl 6-15 Cleric-Great Cleave, Imp Crit Bludgeoning, Shield Mastery
Lvl 16. Pally
Lvl 17. Cleric
Lvl 18. Cleric-Empower Healing
Lvl 19. Fighter-Shield Bash
Lvl 20 Fighter-Imp Shield Bash
The feats aren't necessarily in that order but those are it.

Enhancements
KotC
Ti
First 3 Cores
Divine Light III
Extra Smite II
T2
Divine Might III
Exalted Cleave III
Melee Power Boost III
T3
Exalted Smite III
Cha I
T4
Empower Smite I
Cha I
Censor Demons I
T5
Censor OUtsiders I
Holy Retribution III
Avenging Cleave III

Sacred Defender
First 2 Cores
T1
Extra Lay on Hands III
Durable Defense III
Sacred Armor Mastery III
T2
Resilient Defense III
Sacred Shield Mastery III
T3
Strong Defense III
Cha I
T4
Hardy Defense III
Cha I

Kensai
First Core-Hammers
T1
Extra Action Boost I
Weapon Group Spec I
Haste Boost III
T2
Weapon Group Spec I

Fighter Vanguard
First Core
T1
Shield Spec I

Morninglord
First Core
T1
Morninglord Weapon Training I

I'm thinking may be I spent too many points into Cha enhancements but I don't know.

Epic Destiny
I was thinking of doing LD with Shield Prowess and Legendary Shield Mastery Twisted in and Cacoon because I didnt know what else to pick, but not sure if Divine Crusader would be better. I do have all destinies maxed out right now.

This is my second post ever and I really appreciate all input from you pros, and all help I can get. Thanks!

[Vish]

Ok, couple things
You prob got the LR heart for domains
Domains are new
If melee you prob want war domain, but you only went 12 cleric,
At 14 you would get holy sword
So you prob gotta pick a domain

Now, what weapons were you using? Maces?
I see you took morninglord weapon training
With war domain you get exotic prof at 5, so you could use khopeshes

Also, need a pretty specific breakdown of class by level
Since its a morninglord, I assume cleric at 1
That will be needed to help figure out feats

Now if you had a +3 heart we could make it a 14 cleric,
But idk that part

If you want to go thf we can do that
You may not need the cleave and great cleave if you're using kotc
It's got cleaves, and pretty sure they share cooldowns

Looks like you're running a pally with a heal
But you dump stat wisdom, so small spell pool
But prob enough to cast to keep you alive
Ya that holy sword at 14 would really help for finishing epics
Otherwise you have no crit multiplier, and pretty avg dps if using maces

Also, do you have access to the falconry tree?
That is melee decent for poor tier5 classes like warpriest
It also has wisdom conversion in it, which this build may benefit from
But going cha on a cleric frame, ya you're saves may be bit higher, but you're not getting good mileage
You may turn ok tho, and have decent turns

Ok start with that, we see if we can fix it


Oh ya
From looking it over it is a shield bash fighter
But you didn't put any into vanguard
Do you like shield bashing?
I have never played that style,
And would recommend khopesh with shield mastery
Or even swf. Like I said we could go thf too

Oh I see, you were using hammers?

[invicto15]

Ok, couple things
You prob got the LR heart for domains
Domains are new
If melee you prob want war domain, but you only went 12 cleric,
At 14 you would get holy sword
So you prob gotta pick a domain

Now, what weapons were you using? Maces?
I see you took morninglord weapon training
With war domain you get exotic prof at 5, so you could use khopeshes

Also, need a pretty specific breakdown of class by level
Since its a morninglord, I assume cleric at 1
That will be needed to help figure out feats

Now if you had a +3 heart we could make it a 14 cleric,
But idk that part

If you want to go thf we can do that
You may not need the cleave and great cleave if you're using kotc
It's got cleaves, and pretty sure they share cooldowns

Looks like you're running a pally with a heal
But you dump stat wisdom, so small spell pool
But prob enough to cast to keep you alive
Ya that holy sword at 14 would really help for finishing epics
Otherwise you have no crit multiplier, and pretty avg dps if using maces

Also, do you have access to the falconry tree?
That is melee decent for poor tier5 classes like warpriest
It also has wisdom conversion in it, which this build may benefit from
But going cha on a cleric frame, ya you're saves may be bit higher, but you're not getting good mileage
You may turn ok tho, and have decent turns

Ok start with that, we see if we can fix it


Oh ya
From looking it over it is a shield bash fighter
But you didn't put any into vanguard
Do you like shield bashing?
I have never played that style,
And would recommend khopesh with shield mastery
Or even swf. Like I said we could go thf too

Oh I see, you were using hammers?


The level breakdown is as is listed I actually used a +1 to get the pally level first, the 2 fighter levels I only took for extra feats and haste boos from Kensai, the cleave feats are prereqs for LD cleaves and, and I took the STR domain, didn't know the war domain gave me exotic khopesh, I only took the hammer to benefit from the morning lord training but I can dump it since it is only one level of it plus I do like Khopeshes better, only reason I went with 1h and shield is for the extra defenses I can get by spending points in enhancements but I can also go THF to get more dmg out, I was just worried a bit about my survivability, I do have the falconry tree, if I was to go THF, how would you suggest I do it, or I can also go khopsh with a buckler? I can also get a +2 heart if needed and just forgo the 2 levels of fighter and add in the 2 extra cleric, how should I spend my stat spread? should I go full STR then split WIS and CHA? cha helps with saves and divine might no? Also should I spend less points into CHA enhancements?

[Vish]

Cleric fix
Morninglord
Str 13 5
Dex 8 0
Con 14 10
Int 10 0
Wis 18 16 +7
Cha 13 5
+7 tomes

1 pally power attack
3 pally cleave
6 pally thf
9 cleric quicken
12 cleric ic slashing
15 shield mastery
18 improved shield mastery
19 ftr ithf or cleric
20 ftr gthf or cleric

21 oc
24 great cleave
26 pthf or PTWF
27 blinding speed
28 mass frog
29 dire charge
30 Celestia
Completionist

Ap
41 bird man
24 sacred d
15 radiant

Notes
Ok this is feated as is built. Just needs a LR.
I built it with the fighter levels to show what can be done.
But best course of action is to LR+2 the fighter levels and take cleric. So go war domain and get holy sword at 20.
I assume you're 20.
That will lose two feats. So you can drop the ithf and gthf. Tho at 26 you prob want PTWF for the doublestrike.
Ok I remade it a wisdom build. That way you only have to 3 stat, wis con cha. And go tier5 core6 in bird man. And tier4 in sacred d, and 15 into radiant for destroy undead and burst. You don't get anything out of morninglord. So you have some offense, some good defenses, and holy sword. Otherwise the fighter split will be less dps.
And if you go war domain for hs, then this build is versatile and you can thf and shield with khopesh.
The radiant ap is kinda slosh fund, you could put some into vanguard if running a shield, or into radiant for turning undead.
Since its a wisdom build, you get mass frog at 28. So you fit the meta. And dire charge and I take Celestia on all my clerics.
Anyways, I hate to burn a heart. But if this is your main, and you want to get it up to speed, I'd add the cleric levels and go war domain.

[invicto15]

Cleric fix
Morninglord
Str 13 5
Dex 8 0
Con 14 10
Int 10 0
Wis 18 16 +7
Cha 13 5
+7 tomes

1 pally power attack
3 pally cleave
6 pally thf
9 cleric quicken
12 cleric ic slashing
15 shield mastery
18 improved shield mastery
19 ftr ithf or cleric
20 ftr gthf or cleric

21 oc
24 great cleave
26 pthf or PTWF
27 blinding speed
28 mass frog
29 dire charge
30 Celestia
Completionist

Ap
41 bird man
24 sacred d
15 radiant

Notes
Ok this is feated as is built. Just needs a LR.
I built it with the fighter levels to show what can be done.
But best course of action is to LR+2 the fighter levels and take cleric. So go war domain and get holy sword at 20.
I assume you're 20.
That will lose two feats. So you can drop the ithf and gthf. Tho at 26 you prob want PTWF for the doublestrike.
Ok I remade it a wisdom build. That way you only have to 3 stat, wis con cha. And go tier5 core6 in bird man. And tier4 in sacred d, and 15 into radiant for destroy undead and burst. You don't get anything out of morninglord. So you have some offense, some good defenses, and holy sword. Otherwise the fighter split will be less dps.
And if you go war domain for hs, then this build is versatile and you can thf and shield with khopesh.
The radiant ap is kinda slosh fund, you could put some into vanguard if running a shield, or into radiant for turning undead.
Since its a wisdom build, you get mass frog at 28. So you fit the meta. And dire charge and I take Celestia on all my clerics.
Anyways, I hate to burn a heart. But if this is your main, and you want to get it up to speed, I'd add the cleric levels and go war domain.

Thanks a lot for all your input Vish, I think I will pick up a +2 Heart and try the khopesh build I always liked that weapon, question do you think putting points into Warchanter or KotC, will get me more dps?, for the last 15 points, or are my Turns going to be powerful enough with this build, that it makes it worth putting points into improving turning?

Oh yeah you said I can THF with a khopesh and a shield, does a Khopesh count as a THF weapon even when you sword and board?

[Vish]

Thanks a lot for all your input Vish, I think I will pick up a +2 Heart and try the khopesh build I always liked that weapon, question do you think putting points into Warchanter or KotC, will get me more dps?, for the last 15 points, or are my Turns going to be powerful enough with this build, that it makes it worth putting points into improving turning?

Oh yeah you said I can THF with a khopesh and a shield, does a Khopesh count as a THF weapon even when you sword and board?

Well, for turning, if you know the quest you can reset ap. that just costs plat.
For real, build the build and experiment with the ap. this is just a guideline. What I would go with as a baseline. If you're going kotc then you just shoulda been a paladin. I don't think that tree is good dps. But it's been long time since I played paladin.
The sacred d is good spent ap. so you have some left over to tailor your playstyle. With 14 cleric, but decent cha, you should be able to turn some undead. But I'd only respect it if like you were doing ravenloft. Lotta undead there.
What I meant by thf OR shield and khopesh. But the build is feated, with the fighter levels and thf, to be able to thf. But it's also got shield mastery feats, so you can be tanker, and go sword and board. Just makes it versatile. But if you add the cleric levels, you lose the two feats, so thf won't be as powerful. But still, you got thf at 6, so you can use a two hander.
But switch it to wisdom and add the two cleric levels for holy sword, and go war domain, and you should be doing decent damage. And have heals.
Good luck
Let me know how it turned out, I'm running a bird man build myself.

[invicto15]

Let me know how it turned out, I'm running a bird man build myself.

Hey Vish just wanted to give you an update I'm still level 20 but i can see a difference, it works a lot smoother, thanks a lot for the help, I'll update you as I progress in the epic levels.

Wanted to pick your brain once again, what do you suggest I get for the 41 points in the Bird enhancement tree, just so I can compare to what I spent points into.