Heroic Raid End Rewards - Vale, abbot, etc

[Astarii]

Once ran heroic raid quests that where highly ran are not ran like they used to be. Examples are everywhere (Vale, abbot, ToD, LoB), and end reward limits still exist and are high. With this there has been rewards that you must get after completing X amount. For example the "Essence of Cleansing" from vale, etc.

I would love a simple change to these. Some solutions due to lack of groups *COULD* be things such as the below

**Remember this is HEROIC not Epic - not End level items anymore

1. lowering total runs from 20 to 10 / or lower.
2. adding them to end chess loot rewards (randomly of course)
3. selling them in the DDO store.
4. carrying raid count complete over to the next life (resets after number is hit instead of on TR)
5. Unbind them. either move to BTA or even consider not bound

6. Add Collector trade in for them (ie. Shavarath Stones / Material Collector for Essence of Cleansing, etc)
7. Add raid tokens that can be turned in to vendor regardless of difficulty ie Heroic OR Epic turning for same tokens, drop quantities vary with difficulty but it is the same type

Anyone have thoughts on these?

[Mornyngstar]

Just in reference to the Seal of The Abbot, you can now get one in trade for a completed Tome or Shield from the Orchard.

[SuperNiCd]

I like 1, 2, and 4 the best. What I'd like even more is if the developers could come up with a way to revitalize these raids. Find a way to make them attractive for people to run again. IDK, maybe some of these things would do just that.

There have to be a certain percentage of players (like me) who joined after these raids were the end-game and run constantly. Players who don't have everything they could possibly need from them and more.

[Astarii]

Just in reference to the Seal of The Abbot, you can now get one in trade for a completed Tome or Shield from the Orchard.

yes, it would be nice if there was a equivalent turn in with collectors for the other the Shavarath Stones or something, ie getting a Essence of Cleansing; or the like for others

[LeoLionxxx]

I'd be happy if they just refactored all the old raids to use the raid-runes system that's been introduced in recent raids. That would make the reward system last though TR, and let players easily know how close they are to that coveted piece of loot (I myself keep forgetting exactly what command it is for showing raid completions).

[vryxnr]

I much prefer being able to slowly progress towards a goal rather than simply waiting and hoping for RNGesus to smile upon me. A combination of them both is best imo (Legendary Tempest Spine for example, named loot can drop, but you also gain runes that you can eventually trade in for the named loot at a high cost).

Something like this for the older raids would make me very happy and I'd run them a lot more frequently (due to every run being both a small chance for something nice but also a small advancement in progress towards it if it doesn't outright spawn... whereas atm it's all or nothing, and it's nothing most of the time too... which doesn't motivate me any, doesn't excite me, and in fact does the opposite for me). I'd also be more happy to do the old raids to help others as well even if I ended up getting everything I wanted. My loot desires can change and a small stockpile of trade-able runes to keep building on would keep me motivated to continue running it even if I have everything I think I want at that moment, and if/when that stockpile gets sufficiently large, I'd be happy to pass mine to party members to help them out in their goals. ATM, I instead see a raid is up, and think "nah, I don't need anything from there, and the time it will take is not worth it when I could be doing another quest that I do want to run".

I'm also more likely to burn out on games that are purely RNG based with little/no incremental progression. For the most part DDO isn't like that, but it could be (a lot) better imo.

[Gremmlynn]

I much prefer being able to slowly progress towards a goal rather than simply waiting and hoping for RNGesus to smile upon me. A combination of them both is best imo (Legendary Tempest Spine for example, named loot can drop, but you also gain runes that you can eventually trade in for the named loot at a high cost).

Something like this for the older raids would make me very happy and I'd run them a lot more frequently (due to every run being both a small chance for something nice but also a small advancement in progress towards it if it doesn't outright spawn... whereas atm it's all or nothing, and it's nothing most of the time too... which doesn't motivate me any, doesn't excite me, and in fact does the opposite for me). I'd also be more happy to do the old raids to help others as well even if I ended up getting everything I wanted. My loot desires can change and a small stockpile of trade-able runes to keep building on would keep me motivated to continue running it even if I have everything I think I want at that moment, and if/when that stockpile gets sufficiently large, I'd be happy to pass mine to party members to help them out in their goals. ATM, I instead see a raid is up, and think "nah, I don't need anything from there, and the time it will take is not worth it when I could be doing another quest that I do want to run".

I'm also more likely to burn out on games that are purely RNG based with little/no incremental progression. For the most part DDO isn't like that, but it could be (a lot) better imo.A little of each IMO, as I'm the polar opposite.

I'm much more likely to run a raid if I have even a small chance of pulling something than one I know will require some degree of grinding it to get anything. I'm also much more likely to burn out if I try to grind those completions than if I just run it when mood and opportunity intersect.

[Cantor]

I'd be happy if they just refactored all the old raids to use the raid-runes system that's been introduced in recent raids. That would make the reward system last though TR, and let players easily know how close they are to that coveted piece of loot (I myself keep forgetting exactly what command it is for showing raid completions).

Why haven't they done this yet? it seems a no-brainer that this is the way to go when you encourage TRing.

[Qhualor]

I'd be happy if they just refactored all the old raids to use the raid-runes system that's been introduced in recent raids. That would make the reward system last though TR, and let players easily know how close they are to that coveted piece of loot (I myself keep forgetting exactly what command it is for showing raid completions).

I actually hate this system. with a set reward list you know how many runes you need to get it. you figure out how many runs on whatever difficulty you need to get enough to turn in with higher difficulties dropping higher amounts. if you don't pull it in the raid by the time you have enough and given that they are BTA so you can use alts to farm the raid, you can actually get what you want in much less than 20 completions. not to mention speeding up the process with bypass timers which of course did happen a lot in the beginning. LTS and LHound were pretty popular when they first came out, but now not so much anymore with LTS more for loot runs and items are constantly up for roll with a lot of them nobody wants since they already have it.

I actually hope the devs scrap this idea for future raids.

[zehnvhex]

I actually hate this system. with a set reward list you know how many runes you need to get it. you figure out how many runs on whatever difficulty you need to get enough to turn in with higher difficulties dropping higher amounts. if you don't pull it in the raid by the time you have enough and given that they are BTA so you can use alts to farm the raid, you can actually get what you want in much less than 20 completions. not to mention speeding up the process with bypass timers which of course did happen a lot in the beginning. LTS and LHound were pretty popular when they first came out, but now not so much anymore with LTS more for loot runs and items are constantly up for roll with a lot of them nobody wants since they already have it.

I actually hope the devs scrap this idea for future raids.

The token system is basically the same thing with the added benefit that you can TR without losing your completions process. I mean prior to it you had either the choice of TR'ing and losing progress towards a 20th run, just not TR'ing or spamming raid reset timers.

With the token system the TR issue never comes up so you can completely forego spamming raid timer resets with peace of mind.

Not only that but people can pass their tokens. You can't pass a raid completion along. I regularly give my hox/ts away since I have nothing out of there that I want/need.

Personally I'd rather they switch to a one-size fits all system and instead of having LS, LTS, LHOX, etc...runes, they all just use the same ones. Put a cap of 2000 on it, any given item costs 1500 or whatever so you can't stockpile, new raids are 'locked out' for a content cycle and there you go.

Feel free to divy it up by heroic/epic/legendary but I would have no problem after u36 drops people using tokens they've farmed from shroud to buy an item from Storm raid. It would not bother me in the slightest. For what it's worth the ones you buy with tokens don't come with mythic/reaper anyways (is reaper even working for raid items yet or is that still broken?).

That might just be me though. I'm for anything that encourages people to run any and all content instead of just hammering one specific raid with reset timers till they get what they want and then forever forget about it.

[KoobTheProud]

Raids? What are Raids?!

I'll venture that the average current DDO player has never set foot in a raid group at this point. The system was designed for groups but has devolved into soloing for advancement over the years. It's possible that the average player *has* raided but if that is the case then the pop is a lot lower than it looks and it doesn't look that overwhelming at the moment.

[Astarii]

ok, I will add one more to the list, a Token system where the tokens can be turned in for Heroic OR Epic items at some vendor. therefor allowing you to do any difficulty and earning some type of reward.

[Cantor]

Raids? What are Raids?!

I'll venture that the average current DDO player has never set foot in a raid group at this point. The system was designed for groups but has devolved into soloing for advancement over the years. It's possible that the average player *has* raided but if that is the case then the pop is a lot lower than it looks and it doesn't look that overwhelming at the moment.

I imagine most have run raids, but probably never run a raid that had a chance of failure. Or run without someone who knew exactly where to go and what to do.