Is New Gear Worth The Grind

[BillyBlaze]

I was excited about update 32 because I thought all my guildies would log in and run the new quests. My guild has been a ghost town for the last few months. I thought they would all log in once they heard of the new quests and loot.

I was wrong. They all said, the gear sounds good but it is not needed we can already do everything on the hardest difficulty. There is know incentive to grind for it.

Which I couldn't argue with because it's true.

Looks like I will be soloing LE new quests with LFM up in progress.


How Sad.

[Baktiotha]

Looks like I will be soloing LE new quests with LFM up in progress.

First, I would like to have some of the new gear -- both named and crafted items. Second, even multiboxing 6 characters it will take significant effort to gather enough materials for even one item. Third, the gear is nice but just not that essential so can probably be skipped entirely. Fourth, there appear to be several others who agree that final result is not worth the grind.

If this were a table-top game and I were the DM players would farm the ingredients and craft the items because they would become essential to success in the next major event in the story. But the problem in DDO is that the gear looks good when described but then it doesn't actually work out with the gear set a character has. And, it isn't so significantly better than random loot that it justifies a complete reworking of gear.

A 5 piece set bonus might seem like a good idea but how many characters actually have 5 locations free to fit in the set bonus? More importantly, how many can give up the benefits they already have on gear that is filling those 5 slots? Head, eyes, neck, trinket, cloak, armor, belt, bracers, gloves, boots, left hand shield/orb/weapon, right hand weapon, left and right rings -- 14 slots and the gear can only fit in 7 of those. The named gear even competes with some of those 7 locations instead of covering the 7 that cannot be crafted.

Now look at the amount of ingredients needed to craft the 7 craftable items and how many of the named items can be integrated to make set bonuses and the ingredients needed for those. While it is easy to be excited and hopeful that people will return to the game with the new content the magnitude of the grind and the challenge of making the individual items (not to mention the difficulty of working out how to fit in a set bonus) all combines to point to one conclusion: your guildies are correct, the loot is not worth it.

Now consider that it will be obsolete with the next update. I expect that many people will not find the crafted or named loot a compelling reason to play the new content.

[kmoustakas]

What he said.

There seems to be crazy powercreep with every single update. I feel as if grinding for end game ("end game") gear is a waste of time unless you really enjoy that particular quest/raid.

[Cantor]

What he said.

There seems to be crazy powercreep with every single update. I feel as if grinding for end game ("end game") gear is a waste of time unless you really enjoy that particular quest/raid.

I'm focusing on a heroic setup. Not likely to be outclassed so quickly. Also not required though

[Saekee]

First, I would like to have some of the new gear -- both named and crafted items. Second, even multiboxing 6 characters it will take significant effort to gather enough materials for even one item. Third, the gear is nice but just not that essential so can probably be skipped entirely. Fourth, there appear to be several others who agree that final result is not worth the grind.

If this were a table-top game and I were the DM players would farm the ingredients and craft the items because they would become essential to success in the next major event in the story. But the problem in DDO is that the gear looks good when described but then it doesn't actually work out with the gear set a character has. And, it isn't so significantly better than random loot that it justifies a complete reworking of gear.

A 5 piece set bonus might seem like a good idea but how many characters actually have 5 locations free to fit in the set bonus? More importantly, how many can give up the benefits they already have on gear that is filling those 5 slots? Head, eyes, neck, trinket, cloak, armor, belt, bracers, gloves, boots, left hand shield/orb/weapon, right hand weapon, left and right rings -- 14 slots and the gear can only fit in 7 of those. The named gear even competes with some of those 7 locations instead of covering the 7 that cannot be crafted.

Now look at the amount of ingredients needed to craft the 7 craftable items and how many of the named items can be integrated to make set bonuses and the ingredients needed for those. While it is easy to be excited and hopeful that people will return to the game with the new content the magnitude of the grind and the challenge of making the individual items (not to mention the difficulty of working out how to fit in a set bonus) all combines to point to one conclusion: your guildies are correct, the loot is not worth it.

Now consider that it will be obsolete with the next update. I expect that many people will not find the crafted or named loot a compelling reason to play the new content.
Just a note--the set bonuses can include the named items. So if you are able to run it at high difficulties, and grind ingredients, I suppose you will pull some of the named items along the way. I can't imagine someone doing the five set without including the named items.

The gear is very good and the grind is just a way to make it earned.

[BigErkyKid]

No, it is not. I recommend you do it slowly, with caution. Don't burn out on it. Do a few runs to craft one or two items (should be achieved in ~20 LE runs) spacing them oner time. Say you do 4-5 runs a week. You should get a bunch of named too from doing this.

Then if in a few months much better items come out you will not feel cheated of your time.

[slarden]

The way to win ddo is to do what you enjoy. I will be trying to get a lot of gear from there - I like the chain and am goal-oriented by nature. I do it because I enjoy it first and foremost.

ymmv.

[Taimasan]

For my build?? Maybe to replace a ring slot? But all in all, I am not looking forward to a grind that will be a marginal difference. And I most likely won't be buying the pack or running the content anytime soon.

But for new players the grind and the gear will be worth it to help close the gap between the vets and the new players.

So is the gear worth it??

Depends on the power level of the current toon.

[Brandall]

No, it is not. I recommend you do it slowly, with caution. Don't burn out on it. Do a few runs to craft one or two items (should be achieved in ~20 LE runs) spacing them oner time. Say you do 4-5 runs a week. You should get a bunch of named too from doing this.

Then if in a few months much better items come out you will not feel cheated of your time.

I'm not a big fan of shroud crafting, never have been. The handful of items from heroic shroud I crafted were stressful to make as I felt I was combining a bunch of seemingly random ingredients to make random essenses and using to the essenses to imbue an item. The entire process is shrouded in mystery and the panic of "did I remember that recipe correctly?". I feel the same way about legendary shroud crafting.

That being said, I like slavers crafting a lot, especially items that can be used in more than one slot allowing them to be useful on multiple builds. It is simple and seemingly difficult to screw up. Here is my item, here is the stat I want on it, powerful, but no secret effects to worry about. The grind is real, I ransacked last night at nearly 3/4 of the way to 400 of the main Ings. Any creep in power helps me gear towards the hopefully eventual reaper difficulty, besides I was wearing a few items just for 1 or 2 effects, this allows great customization.

So for me the verdict is still out, I am 3/4 to my first of three items I plan on crafting.

[kmoustakas]

I'm focusing on a heroic setup. Not likely to be outclassed so quickly. Also not required though

That's what I'm doing with TOEE. I'm doing a full rare run once a week on heroic searching for that +4 mushroom or a +4 mythic version of a named item. Along the way I acquire tons of ings. Then again I really like TOEE for some reason.

[JOTMON]

I was excited about update 32 because I thought all my guildies would log in and run the new quests. My guild has been a ghost town for the last few months. I thought they would all log in once they heard of the new quests and loot.

I was wrong. They all said, the gear sounds good but it is not needed we can already do everything on the hardest difficulty. There is know incentive to grind for it.

Which I couldn't argue with because it's true.

Looks like I will be soloing LE new quests with LFM up in progress.


How Sad.


Its a grind, but I think it will be worth it.. for the Epic version..
The heroic version sucks and is completely worthless, not comparable to randomgens or basic cannith crafting to be worth any effort as far as I am concerned...
...Seriously +5 stats, only 70% fortification, for heroic with the farm required.. pft.. garbage...I don't see myself even even bothering to run that chain in heroic levels
only possibly useful as a heroic parked toon used for collectible farming who has noting else to do with the ingredients ...but even then... meh....
Heroic needs a boost to be worthy of grinding/farming these to craft..

For the Epic version..lots of goodies that can be mix/match crafted to custom suit any build..
http://ddowiki.com/page/Slave_Lords_Crafting

[Atheok]

Its a grind, but I think it will be worth it.. for the Epic version..
..lots of goodies that can be mix/match crafted to custom suit any build..
http://ddowiki.com/page/Slave_Lords_Crafting

Yes, I think the same. And I don't mind the grind, even tho it seems you will have to do it for each specific build at a time. I would like to see a deconstruction system for this, but I doubt that will happen.



The heroic version sucks and is completely worthless, not comparable to randomgens or basic cannith crafting to be worth any effort as far as I am concerned...
...Seriously +5 stats, only 70% fortification, for heroic with the farm required.. pft.. garbage...I don't see myself even even bothering to run that chain in heroic levels
only possibly useful as a heroic parked toon used for collectible farming who has noting else to do with the ingredients ...but even then... meh....
Heroic needs a boost to be worthy of grinding/farming these to craft..
http://ddowiki.com/page/Slave_Lords_Crafting

The heroic set doesn't look that bad. I feel that for a 3 or 5 piece set from named items only, not crafting, the grind is not as bad. What else is there until ML:13-14? Cannith Challanges, Shroud gear, Toee maybe... But then again, it's heroics and some ppl will just run naked until 14-15 :)

[Mr_Helmet]

Run it once or twice a day and you'll be able to get the gear you want/need shortly before Turbine releases new stuff that makes it out dated garbage.

[Qezuzu]

For my Druid caster, who is quite undergeared, the named items and the crafted items are quite good. Being able to slot +17 WIS, +27 Cold crit, and +22 Spellcraft in one item is really nice. I can do some +17 CON/+14 Resistance/etc. defensive item, something else for a third crafted item, and then use a couple of the named items (the ring and the staff) to get the five-piece bonus.

So for casters it's very good but mostly because +5 DC's is insane. For my melee character I don't really see any room to put anything in, but then against I haven't really updated its gear in a couple updates so some consolidation might be possible.

At any rate, I do believe the crafting system is worth it. "Is it necessary" is another question with the current difficulty level of the game, but if you go by that logic there has never really been a **need** to get anything for over a year. At the very least, I do actually enjoy the new quests, so the "grind" won't be too bad.

[Baktiotha]

Just a note--the set bonuses can include the named items.

I did not mean to ignore that aspect of it. It is why I mentioned that some of the named items overlap with gear slots. Which do you equip, Legendary Five Rings or Legendary Spinneret and/or Legendary Ring of Power and/or Legendary Symbol of the Slave Lords?

Is the armor, shield, cloak, orb, helm or staff (the only weapon in the group) really better than other top end gear? Are the set bonuses so much better that people will downgrade any of those items in order to get the set bonus?

I meant to suggest in my previous post that I see this as improbable. Certainly some builds would benefit but I suspect that many more would not make the sacrifice as the cost is too high for too little benefit. Why grind if in the end you are only marginally better. Why grind if your current gear is enough to succeed in the grind anyway.

IMO, and I would hope it is an opinion that would grow in frequency and become the opinion of others (producer and developers included), the only reason to work for new gear is if it has a future application where it is almost essential for success. Think Boots of Anchoring. Yes, you could succeed in the quest without them. OTOH, you could end up ported back to the prime material plane after reaching the end fight and wasting all that time and effort. Completely worthless outside of that quest, completely valuable (some felt they were required) in the quest.

That's what these items should be like. Build something that is of negligible or no value in current game but that will end up being of immense value in the next major update. I think that provides a better model for quest loot and I hope others will come to that same way of thinking.

[Enderoc]

If you seen the hide helm you would need to change your underwear. It's a real long chain though. Almost a campaign in itself if you hit all the optionals. Worth it though.

[Taimasan]

If you seen the hide helm you would need to change your underwear. It's a real long chain though. Almost a campaign in itself if you hit all the optionals. Worth it though.


At first glance, but when you have a end gear loadout changes tend to cascade then you weigh the net worth of all that work. And most of us say "Meh, not worth it."