Warhammer

[noxx007]

So I am looking for a 1h Warhammer build using SWF. And I was looking for suggestions? I like the Warhammer and the idea of fast heavy attacks, but I'm not sure what class combos would be best for it. A kensai/monk? a fighter/barb? I havent played in a long time so I don't know what currently is good/isn't. I have mediocre gear but can farm for some stuff. I would PREFER Dwarf (I think dwarves can do Con instead of Str for hit/damage?) If so that would be great, b/c I'd like to be survivable and possibly even be able to heal. Not worried about trapping or anything like that. Any suggestions on a route to go for this? Not opposed to hybrids or anything just really don't know what the best route to take is for this weapon path. thanks for any input

[Tlorrd]

so one interesting way to go if you like an arcane warrior dwarf would be to do 18/2 wiz/(fighter or warlock) ... go eldritch knight/harper/archmage transmutation to get flesh to stone SLA ... use improved sunder, taint blood, shattering, shattermantle, and consume to reduce fortitude saves and spell resistance if needed ... turn them to stone, and then use Earthshatter warhammer to smite them to dust. Use Int as your attack/damage from harper tree and thus it also boosts your spell DC for flesh to stone SLA. You could also be undead to get better ability stats and have self healing ... also there are other ways to reduce fort saves such as from draconic incarnation T4 black dragon acid spells will have 15% chance to reduce fort saves by 5, thus cast any AOE acid spell (acid rain, cloudkill, acid fog) to get that to proc and thus make your flesh to stone SLA work better. Also Earthshatter warhammer works in epics.

[Nandos]

If you have access to Sun Elf, you could make a fighter/cleric build utilizing pick/hammer focus in Kensei and Morninglord weapon training line. Since you want to single weapon fight, you can hold a orb in your off hand. Sun Elves get a free orb with their starter gear at level 15.

[Phil7]

define good

some might argue that good=fast -> faster past lives
that is dance of death melee toons and warlocks at the moment. Maybe THF barbarians aswell

or good=LE raiding
that is something that can survive and deal good damage.
A pure Kensei Fighter with good gear and some PLs can do that for example.
So can a Fury Shuriken build.
But their quest completion speed is uncomparable to a dance of death melee split

[slarden]

I would look at bard (swashbuckler tree) which has the best support for swf of any class. I like using a buckler myself, but you can get some damage and doublestrike bonuses instead if you don't want to use a shield for cosmetic/role play reasons.

Even though tempest is intended for twf many of the bonuses work with swf so some bard ranger hybrid could also work although twf probably has better damage output for ranger.

[duntduntduuun]

the OP wants warhammers, swash is great but for handaxe or light pick + buckler + kensei + Stunning shield and Dire charge could then cosmetic a warhammer. dis would be the more optimal path to take.

for actual warhammer tho
5 to 6 barb + 12 or more fighter in legendary dred with cleric splash t5 Rav maybe a 6th barb level to get the Rav core but costs you a fighter feat in the case of a 14 5 1 split.

those who know will understand, those who don't will post comments proving they don't know. none of this is tree powerful but for those that dont liek to be rooted in quicksand or have every alt be a pew pew, its very solid melee.

[Coyopa]

so one interesting way to go if you like an arcane warrior dwarf would be to do 18/2 wiz/(fighter or warlock) ... go eldritch knight/harper/archmage transmutation to get flesh to stone SLA ... use improved sunder, taint blood, shattering, shattermantle, and consume to reduce fortitude saves and spell resistance if needed ... turn them to stone, and then use Earthshatter warhammer to smite them to dust. Use Int as your attack/damage from harper tree and thus it also boosts your spell DC for flesh to stone SLA. You could also be undead to get better ability stats and have self healing ... also there are other ways to reduce fort saves such as from draconic incarnation T4 black dragon acid spells will have 15% chance to reduce fort saves by 5, thus cast any AOE acid spell (acid rain, cloudkill, acid fog) to get that to proc and thus make your flesh to stone SLA work better. Also Earthshatter warhammer works in epics.

That sounds a lot like putting all your eggs in one basket to me. Plus, the Earthshatter Warhammer is like ML17 or somesuch. A long time to wait for your perfect weapon, only to have it get stale within about 6 levels. Don't get me wrong: I always wanted to use that warhammer (and warhammers in general). Just seems like a lot of sacrifice to get to the point you're describing.

[Sarzor]

I would look at bard (swashbuckler tree) which has the best support for swf of any class. I like using a buckler myself, but you can get some damage and doublestrike bonuses instead if you don't want to use a shield for cosmetic/role play reasons.

Even though tempest is intended for twf many of the bonuses work with swf so some bard ranger hybrid could also work although twf probably has better damage output for ranger.

Bards can't swashbuckle warhammers.

[slarden]

Bards can't swashbuckle warhammers.

They can swash light hammers which look good on a dwarf. Wanted to make sure op knew of that option.

[vyvy3369]

Bards can't swashbuckle warhammers.
OP wanted to SWF with Warhammers though, he didn't ask for swashbuckling specifically. The tier 3 swashbuckler enhancement Skirmisher allows you to use bucklers while SWFing with any weapon, which sounds very similar to what the OP is looking for. You do not gain the dodge bonus unless swashbuckling. Based on comma placement and how it works in-game it seems to be working as intended. I've been running 16 Fighter/3 Bard/1 Rogue for a while now, SWF with Khopesh & Buckler in heavy armor, and the general idea should work fine for Warhammers (or any other non-swashbuckling weapon of your preference).

[Coyopa]

OP wanted to SWF with Warhammers though, he didn't ask for swashbuckling specifically. The tier 3 swashbuckler enhancement Skirmisher allows you to use bucklers while SWFing with any weapon, which sounds very similar to what the OP is looking for. You do not gain the dodge bonus unless swashbuckling. Based on comma placement and how it works in-game it seems to be working as intended. I've been running 16 Fighter/3 Bard/1 Rogue for a while now, SWF with Khopesh & Buckler in heavy armor, and the general idea should work fine for Warhammers (or any other non-swashbuckling weapon of your preference).

Except that you cannot use a buckler while Single Weapon Fighting unless you're swashbuckling. From the wiki:


Skirmisher: While Swashbuckling with a Buckler in your off hand, you gain 10% Dodge, and you may use a Buckler and still benefit from the Single Weapon Fighting line of feats.

[vyvy3369]

Except that you cannot use a buckler while Single Weapon Fighting unless you're swashbuckling. From the wiki:
This is the fun of English. I read it as two separate bonuses.


Skirmisher: While Swashbuckling with a Buckler in your off hand, you gain 10% Dodge, and you may use a Buckler and still benefit from the Single Weapon Fighting line of feats.

If instead the enhancement had removed the comma after "Dodge" it would been:


Skirmisher: While Swashbuckling with a Buckler in your off hand, you gain 10% Dodge and you may use a Buckler and still benefit from the Single Weapon Fighting line of feats.

See the difference? Comma placement is important. Between that and how it was implemented, my take on it is that it's working as intended.

[Coyopa]

See the difference? Comma placement is important. Between that and how it was implemented, my take on it is that it's working as intended.

Wow. Your whole position depends on a comma? In a game where they can't spell even simple words ("Baffoun" instead of "buffoon") correctly? And they can't even be bothered to check how to spell it. And spoken dialogue doesn't agree with the NPC's speech bubble, which also doesn't agree with the text put into the chat box (and this also doesn't agree with the spoken dialogue). And you're going to base your build on the placement of a comma? Yikes! All I can say is I'm glad it's worked out for you so far.

[duntduntduuun]

That sounds a lot like putting all your eggs in one basket to me. Plus, the Earthshatter Warhammer is like ML17 or somesuch. A long time to wait for your perfect weapon, only to have it get stale within about 6 levels. Don't get me wrong: I always wanted to use that warhammer (and warhammers in general). Just seems like a lot of sacrifice to get to the point you're describing.

also not forget flesh to stone must pass spell penn check, might as well go necro + pk build at that point and skip the middle man.

[01000010]

As you say coyopa, they screw up a lot on wording, all you can do is play the game as it is and hope it wont change and that the thing you are doing is wai, in this case the wording made total sense to me, but i can certainly see how someone might view otherwise. Fact is turbine has taken enhancements that were very specific about what they did and altered them to do the opposite later(a few of these times i got really ****ed off about it since it destroyed some builds id been working on for months).

Anyhow, the most fun thing to do with swf/buckler wether swashbuckling or not ive found is use cleaves and any other melee aoe options(there are many) with guardbreaking, the higher youre crit range the better, mass daze is a blast.

[Coyopa]

I should say that if it is working as intended, I think that's great. I just hadn't expected that since so much stuff in that tree is dependent upon having an active swashbuckling stance. However, I hope it is working as intended because that opens up some neat build choices.

[unbongwah]

So I am looking for a 1h Warhammer build using SWF. And I was looking for suggestions? I like the Warhammer and the idea of fast heavy attacks, but I'm not sure what class combos would be best for it. A kensai/monk? a fighter/barb? I havent played in a long time so I don't know what currently is good/isn't. I have mediocre gear but can farm for some stuff. I would PREFER Dwarf (I think dwarves can do Con instead of Str for hit/damage?)
Unless you have a specific build goal in MCing, I would stick with pure builds: either barb, ftr, or pally - all three have good-to-great capstones, IMO. Pally would have the best survivability, ftr would (probably) be the best DPS, barb splits the difference.

If you want CON-based dwarf, that's doable but it's a flavor choice, since it chews up 18 APs (limiting your other options) and most DCs are still STR-based (so not a good idea if you wanted a tactics-oriented build). I would prefer barb or ftr in that case, since pally is still a STR+CHA-oriented class.

For an example of a CON-based barb build, see my Kundarak Krasher thread; I went w/greataxes, but adapting to SWF w/hammers is a straightforward enough conversion. Let's look at what a TYWA Kensei might look like...

Kundarak Kensei (Hammer TIME!)
Fighter 20
True Neutral Dwarf


Stats
36pt Tome Level Up
---- ---- --------
Strength 12 +6 4: CON
Dexterity 8 +6 8: CON
Constitution 20 +6 12: CON
Intelligence 18 +6 16: CON
Wisdom 8 +6 20: CON
Charisma 6 +6 24: CON
28: CON

Skills
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
------------------------------------------------------------
Intim 4 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 23
Heal 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 11
Spellcr 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 11
Search 2 ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ 1 1 1 1 1 1 11
Spot 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 11
UMD 2 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 11
Balance 2 1 1 1 1 1 ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ 10
Jump 1 1 2
Swim 1 1
Tumble 1 1
------------------------------------------------------------
24 6 6 6 6 6 7 7 7 7 7 7 7 7 8 8 8 8 8 8


Feats

1 : Insightful Reflexes
1 Fighter: Single Weapon Fighting
2 Fighter: Weapon Focus: Bludgeoning
3 : Power Attack
4 Fighter: Cleave
6 : Improved Single Weapon Fighting
6 Fighter: Great Cleave
8 Fighter: Improved Critical: Bludgeoning
9 : Toughness
10 Fighter: Weapon Specialization: Bludgeoning
12 : Greater Single Weapon Fighting
12 Fighter: Greater Weapon Focus: Bludgeoning
14 Fighter: Heavy Armor Champion
15 :
16 Fighter: Tactical Supremacy
18 :
18 Fighter: Heavy Armor Master
20 Fighter: Precision
21 Epic : Overwhelming Critical
24 Epic : Epic Toughness
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Epic : Blinding Speed
28 Destiny: Perfect Single Weapon Fighting OR Elusive Target
29 Destiny: Dire Charge
30 Epic : Epic Damage Reduction
30 Legend : Scion of: Plane of Earth


Enhancements (80 AP)

Kensei (41 AP)


Kensei Focus: Picks and Hammers, Spiritual Bond, Strike with No Thought, Power Surge, One Cut, Alacrity

Extra Action Boost III, Weapon Group Specialization, Haste Boost III
Weapon Group Specialization, Ascetic Training: Conditioning III
Critical Mastery III, Weapon Group Specialization, Shattering Strike I
Weapon Group Specialization, Strike at the Heart, Opportunity Attack, Liquid Courage
A Good Death: Melee, Weapon Master, One with the Blade, Deadly Strike, Keen Edge



Dwarf (18 AP)


Dwarven Toughness, Dwarven Constitution, Dwarven Toughness II, Dwarven Constitution II

Iron Stomach III, Pick and Hammer Training
Pick and Hammer Training
Pick and Hammer Training
Pick and Hammer Training, Throw Your Weight Around



Stalwart Defender (13 AP)


Toughness, Stalwart Defense

Item Defense I, Durable Defense III
Resilient Defense III, Instinctive Defense I
Tenacious Defense III



Harper Agent (8 AP)


Agent of Good I

Harper Enchantment, Strategic Combat
Know the Angles III



Leveling Guide


Ken0 Kensei Focus: Picks and Hammers; Ken1 Weapon Group Specialization; Ken1 Haste Boost I
Ken1 Haste Boost II, III; Ken2 Weapon Group Specialization
Ken0 Spiritual Bond; Ken2 Ascetic Training: Conditioning I; Dwf0 Dwarven Toughness
Dwf1 Pick and Hammer Training; Dwf0 Dwarven Constitution
Dwf2 Pick and Hammer Training; Dwf1 Iron Stomach I, II, III
Ken0 Strike with No Thought; Dwf3 Pick and Hammer Training; Ken3 Shattering Strike I
Ken2 Ascetic Training: Conditioning II, III; Ken1 Extra Action Boost I
Ken1 Extra Action Boost II, III
Ken4 Strike at the Heart; Ken4 Opportunity Attack
Ken3 Weapon Group Specialization; Ken4 Liquid Courage
Dwf0 Dwarven Toughness II; Dwf0 Dwarven Constitution II
Dwf4 Pick and Hammer Training; Dwf4 Throw Your Weight Around; Ken0 Power Surge
Ken4 Weapon Group Specialization; Ken5 One with the Blade; Ken5 Keen Edge; Ken5 Weapon Master
Ken5 Deadly Strike; Ken5 A Good Death: Melee; SD0 Toughness; SD1 Durable Defense I
SD1 Durable Defense II, III; SD1 Item Defense I; SD0 Stalwart Defense
SD2 Resilient Defense I, II, III; SD2 Instinctive Defense I
SD3 Tenacious Defense I, II, III; Hrp0 Agent of Good I
Ken0 One Cut; Hrp1 Harper Enchantment
Hrp1 Strategic Combat; Ken3 Critical Mastery I, II, III
Ken0 Alacrity; Hrp2 Know the Angles I, II, III



Destiny (24 AP)

Legendary Dreadnought


Legendary Tactics III, Extra Action Boost III, Constitution
Momentum Swing III, Imp. Power Attack
Lay Waste
Anvil of Thunder
Advancing Blows, Devastating Critical
Master's Blitz, Pulverizer


Twists of Fate (31 fate points)


Grim Precision (Tier 3 Shadowdancer)
Sacred Ground (Tier 3 Crusader)
Consecration (Tier 2 Crusader)
Rejuvenation Cocoon (Tier 1 Primal)
Brace for Impact (Tier 1 Sentinel)


Listed tomes are a best-case scenario; you could do this build on a first life with a +1 STR tome (and dropping Precision). If you don't have Harper, I'd put those APs into Stalwart D to pick up Swift Defense (+10% runspeed).

[Sarzor]

OP wanted to SWF with Warhammers though, he didn't ask for swashbuckling specifically. The tier 3 swashbuckler enhancement Skirmisher allows you to use bucklers while SWFing with any weapon, which sounds very similar to what the OP is looking for. You do not gain the dodge bonus unless swashbuckling. Based on comma placement and how it works in-game it seems to be working as intended. I've been running 16 Fighter/3 Bard/1 Rogue for a while now, SWF with Khopesh & Buckler in heavy armor, and the general idea should work fine for Warhammers (or any other non-swashbuckling weapon of your preference).

If you had read what my comment was directed to, it was Slarden's misnomer that you could swashbuckle with a warhammer. I was correcting his mistake. Nothing more, nothing less.

Remember kids, context is important.

https://media0.giphy.com/media/Y2nbrJyAR6RiM/200_s.gif

[vyvy3369]

If you had read what my comment was directed to, it was Slarden's misnomer that you could swashbuckle with a warhammer. I was correcting his mistake. Nothing more, nothing less.

Remember kids, context is important.

https://media0.giphy.com/media/Y2nbrJyAR6RiM/200_s.gif
I agree, context is important. Did you re-read Slarden's comment? He never actually mentioned swashbuckling, just the swashbuckler tree.


I would look at bard (swashbuckler tree) which has the best support for swf of any class. I like using a buckler myself, but you can get some damage and doublestrike bonuses instead if you don't want to use a shield for cosmetic/role play reasons.

Even though tempest is intended for twf many of the bonuses work with swf so some bard ranger hybrid could also work although twf probably has better damage output for ranger.

Bards can't swashbuckle warhammers.


OP wanted to SWF with Warhammers though, he didn't ask for swashbuckling specifically. The tier 3 swashbuckler enhancement Skirmisher allows you to use bucklers while SWFing with any weapon, which sounds very similar to what the OP is looking for. You do not gain the dodge bonus unless swashbuckling. Based on comma placement and how it works in-game it seems to be working as intended. I've been running 16 Fighter/3 Bard/1 Rogue for a while now, SWF with Khopesh & Buckler in heavy armor, and the general idea should work fine for Warhammers (or any other non-swashbuckling weapon of your preference).