Do Paralyzing Arrows still paralyze?

[redoubt]

From the release notes:

Paralyzing Arrows give 3 seconds of -10% Movement and Attack Speed on a failed Saving Throw.

[jalont]

Probably just a typo. I would assume we'd seem people complaining if this was the case on Lam. I think failed should be made.

[Vargouille]

This is probably my mistake in sending release notes to Cordovan.

This is the full description of Paralyzing Arrows as of Update 28 Patch 1.


Arcane Archer Imbue Toggle: You imbue your arrows with paralyzing force. On Hit: Target is paralyzed. (Will save vs. DC 20 + Wisdom Modifier + Enchantment Spell Bonuses) On Save: -10% Movement and Attack Speed

Passive: +1 bonus to DC of Enchantment Spells

[Thar]

This is probably my mistake in sending release notes to Cordovan.

This is the full description of Paralyzing Arrows as of Update 28 Patch 1.


Arcane Archer Imbue Toggle: You imbue your arrows with paralyzing force. On Hit: Target is paralyzed. (Will save vs. DC 20 + Wisdom Modifier + Enchantment Spell Bonuses) On Save: -10% Movement and Attack Speed

Passive: +1 bonus to DC of Enchantment Spells

So what would you need in epics for this to work? 60s?

[Hobgoblin]

So what would you need in epics for this to work? 60s?

its better then it was - but still feels like it was before - only fail on a 1.

however on my pure monk archer (wis based)

I had around a 55 ish and things were getting stopped pretty well.

[Vulkoorex]

So now Arcane Archers have to be monk or cleric (wis based) for them to be a viable build?

[JOTMON]

So what would you need in epics for this to work? 60s?

The mob to roll a '1'

[Ykt]

(Will save vs. DC 20 + Wisdom Modifier + Enchantment Spell Bonuses)

ARCANE archer ... Wisdom modifier ...

Monkchers have a clean butt now.

[grausherra]

At least people had a whole 2 days to test it on Llamania.

[FestusHood]

So what would you need in epics for this to work? 60s?

A friend of mine who plays a swashbuckler respec'd to a spellsinger to test it out. Just by changing enhancements and gear he was able to reach exactly a 60 enchantment dc. We went into epic elite stormhorns. My estimate would be that his dancing ball spell had a success rate of about 85%.

[unbongwah]

So now Arcane Archers have to be monk or cleric (wis based) for them to be a viable build?
You have to be WIS-based if you want good DCs with these imbues. But remember, you can still only have one primary imbue active at a time. So you could decide to ditch WIS and stick with the DPS imbues and ignore the CC effects entirely. It's a build choice as to what's most important to you.

Furthermore, remember before this patch Paralyzing Arrow DC capped at 26; so even if you have a modest WIS score of 22, you're still no worse off than you were before this patch. But now WIS-based AAs might actually be capable of consistent CC.

[Vulkoorex]

Gnomes are coming. Maybe they will be Wis based. So we will see a throng of Gnome Monk Arcane Archers. :p

[xberto]

The mob to roll a '1'
Do the mobs roll a save for each doubleshot arrow as well? In my mind, even if you dump wisdom, it seems like success on a 1 (5%) isn't so bad, considering the volume of arrows a dedicated archer can put in the air. With focus on the DPS side and paralyzing as a kicker, should be good fun. I'm liking the changes I'm seeing in the AA tree and can;t wait to test them in action.

[patang01]

This is probably my mistake in sending release notes to Cordovan.

This is the full description of Paralyzing Arrows as of Update 28 Patch 1.


Arcane Archer Imbue Toggle: You imbue your arrows with paralyzing force. On Hit: Target is paralyzed. (Will save vs. DC 20 + Wisdom Modifier + Enchantment Spell Bonuses) On Save: -10% Movement and Attack Speed

Passive: +1 bonus to DC of Enchantment Spells

So a paralyzing arrow will always slow regardless? Neat.

[Thar]

Do the mobs roll a save for each doubleshot arrow as well? In my mind, even if you dump wisdom, it seems like success on a 1 (5%) isn't so bad, considering the volume of arrows a dedicated archer can put in the air. With focus on the DPS side and paralyzing as a kicker, should be good fun. I'm liking the changes I'm seeing in the AA tree and can;t wait to test them in action.

the issue before was they would then save in a second or two and break the paralize. so fail on a 1 wasn't too useful. it sounds like for ranger it still isn't.

[alancarp]

...

Arcane Archer Imbue Toggle: You imbue your arrows with paralyzing force. On Hit: Target is paralyzed. (Will save vs. DC 20 + Wisdom Modifier + Enchantment Spell Bonuses) On Save: -10% Movement and Attack Speed

Passive: +1 bonus to DC of Enchantment Spells

Boy, I know it's never been this way, but it so much _feels_ like that oughta be a Dexterity-based DC score instead of Wisdom.

[xberto]

the issue before was they would then save in a second or two and break the paralize. so fail on a 1 wasn't too useful. it sounds like for ranger it still isn't.

Fortunately for me, there is enough fine players on Sarlona that a second or 2 is all it take for that paralyzed mob to be dead :)

[Ykt]

Boy, I know it's never been this way, but it so much _feels_ like that oughta be a Dexterity-based DC score instead of Wisdom.

Deepwood Sniper is the Dex-based tree.
Arcane Archer should be Wis & Int -based. It's arcane.

[redoubt]

Deepwood Sniper is the Dex-based tree.
Arcane Archer should be Wis & Int -based. It's arcane.

If you get AA from ranger it should use Wisdom.

If you get AA from elf it should use INT or CHA.

[Bluenoser]

If you get AA from ranger it should use Wisdom.

If you get AA from elf it should use INT or CHA.

I'd rather see a multiselector for Wis/Int regardless of your race, to allow this tree to work for someone other than monkchers or divine-based archers. God knows, no pure ranger (let alone a ranger-rogue) would ever put that much investment into Wis, especially with the Harper tree's Know the Angles as an option.

[FranOhmsford]

You have to be WIS-based if you want good DCs with these imbues. But remember, you can still only have one primary imbue active at a time. So you could decide to ditch WIS and stick with the DPS imbues and ignore the CC effects entirely. It's a build choice as to what's most important to you.

Furthermore, remember before this patch Paralyzing Arrow DC capped at 26; so even if you have a modest WIS score of 22, you're still no worse off than you were before this patch. But now WIS-based AAs might actually be capable of consistent CC.

You can get Paralyzing Arrows at around Lvl 10 - How many AAs will have a Wis of 22 by that point?

Paralyzing Arrows were always pretty much "Need the mob to roll a 1" in Epics - Now they're "Need the mob to roll a 1" EVERYWHERE!

This change isn't going to help Rangers in Epics {Except those few who go full on Wis build} and will make Paralying Arrows much weaker in Heroics!


BTW - Yes I know full well that 12 Base, +6 Masterful Wis Item min Lvl 9, +2 Tome and +2 Ship Buff = 22 but that's pretty much where we were pre update when Paralyzing Arrows were dumped at Lvl 20.
Let's say we now start going 14 Wis base and grab a +8 Wis item asap. Let's say we also have a +4 tome. That's +3 to DC!

Yeah - That's gonna work on anything other than a 1 in EEs!

[Grailhawk]

You can get Paralyzing Arrows at around Lvl 10 - How many AAs will have a Wis of 22 by that point?

Paralyzing Arrows were always pretty much "Need the mob to roll a 1" in Epics - Now they're "Need the mob to roll a 1" EVERYWHERE!

This change isn't going to help Rangers in Epics {Except those few who go full on Wis build} and will make Paralying Arrows much weaker in Heroics!


BTW - Yes I know full well that 12 Base, +6 Masterful Wis Item min Lvl 9, +2 Tome and +2 Ship Buff = 22 but that's pretty much where we were pre update when Paralyzing Arrows were dumped at Lvl 20.
Let's say we now start going 14 Wis base and grab a +8 Wis item asap. Let's say we also have a +4 tome. That's +3 to DC!

Yeah - That's gonna work on anything other than a 1 in EEs!

Your missing his point.
Paralyzing Arrows are a build choice if you want them to work you build a CC (Wisdom ranger who takes enchantment dc boosts). If you want a DPS Ranger you use elemental imbues and slot a spell power item some where.

Not every ranger should use paralyzing arrows, and those who do will come out a head of where they were by a good deal.

[Kadrios]

You can get Paralyzing Arrows at around Lvl 10 - How many AAs will have a Wis of 22 by that point?

Paralyzing Arrows were always pretty much "Need the mob to roll a 1" in Epics - Now they're "Need the mob to roll a 1" EVERYWHERE!

This change isn't going to help Rangers in Epics {Except those few who go full on Wis build} and will make Paralying Arrows much weaker in Heroics!


BTW - Yes I know full well that 12 Base, +6 Masterful Wis Item min Lvl 9, +2 Tome and +2 Ship Buff = 22 but that's pretty much where we were pre update when Paralyzing Arrows were dumped at Lvl 20.
Let's say we now start going 14 Wis base and grab a +8 Wis item asap. Let's say we also have a +4 tome. That's +3 to DC!

Yeah - That's gonna work on anything other than a 1 in EEs!

Ok, so under the old system the DC was capped at 26 if you had all three ranks.

As it stands now, you will hit DC 26 with little to no effort by the point you are able to buy paralysing arrows (base 20 + 2 enhancement + 4 wisdom mod). A wisdom of 18 (for the +4 mod) should be trivially easy to achieve by level 6 as a first lifer, unless you completely dumped wis, but even then, it doesn't require much more work.

For non-first lifers, it should be even easier.

[Ed_Conn]

Hello,

I'm having a hard time understanding how this is calculated. With my archer I see four enhancements that have a passive of +1 dc enhancement bonus: paralyzing, terror, etc.

The release notes indicate say : Each enhancement grants +1 DC with Enchantment Spells (Ar first thought this meant every enhancement - which would have been nice)

Should I assume that just those four enhancements grant that bonus? If so, then am I correct that dc 20 + Wisdom Modifier (+4 with wis at 18 ) + enchantment bonus (another +4 ) = 28. For my Dex based, that's still 2 higher than it was.

Ed

[kyostal]

Hello,

I'm having a hard time understanding how this is calculated. With my archer I see four enhancements that have a passive of +1 dc enhancement bonus: paralyzing, terror, etc.

The release notes indicate say : Each enhancement grants +1 DC with Enchantment Spells (Ar first thought this meant every enhancement - which would have been nice)

Should I assume that just those four enhancements grant that bonus? If so, then am I correct that dc 20 + Wisdom Modifier (+4 with wis at 18 ) + enchantment bonus (another +4 ) = 28. For my Dex based, that's still 2 higher than it was.

Ed

Pretty much, even ona wis dumbstat archer, the DC should be higher now than it was before. So anything you were paralyzing before, will be again. There were a few people on lama that claimed it lasted for a much shorter time, and they couldnt keep the mobs paralyzed. I grabbed my good ol stars, walked into EE WGU, and kept everything i threw them at paralyzed, so not entirely sure what they were talking about.

[redoubt]

I'd rather see a multiselector for Wis/Int regardless of your race, to allow this tree to work for someone other than monkchers or divine-based archers. God knows, no pure ranger (let alone a ranger-rogue) would ever put that much investment into Wis, especially with the Harper tree's Know the Angles as an option.

I could be convinced by a WIS/INT option for the ranger version. (DEX just makes no sense to me as a casting stat.)

[Aletys]

You have to be WIS-based if you want good DCs with these imbues. But remember, you can still only have one primary imbue active at a time. So you could decide to ditch WIS and stick with the DPS imbues and ignore the CC effects entirely. It's a build choice as to what's most important to you.

Furthermore, remember before this patch Paralyzing Arrow DC capped at 26; so even if you have a modest WIS score of 22, you're still no worse off than you were before this patch. But now WIS-based AAs might actually be capable of consistent CC.

Well, yes, but this was supposed to be the pass to improve AA's, not monks. But, apparently the devs think that AA's are monks, who are wisdom based, instead of rangers, who are not. Monkchers will not have to make this choice, they just go with Zen archery, and guess what? They get to do both DPS & CC. Rangers apparently don't.

[Aletys]

I could be convinced by a WIS/INT option for the ranger version. (DEX just makes no sense to me as a casting stat.)

Where did the idea get started that AA's are casters? Has anyone even bothered to look at the 3.5 dnd rules? There's absolutely nothing in them about AA's needing spellpower or their imbues being spells. Of course, perhaps I missed that section, but I don't think so.

Perhaps rogues poison attacks should now be counted as spells and require spellpower also? It makes about as much sense.

[Kadrios]

well, going by the 3.5e rules, you require the ability to cast at least 1st level arcane spells (that's where the 'arcane' part of the name comes from). Concepts like spellpower don't exist in D&D, they are purely a construct of DDO, so we'll leave that aside.

Finally, their main low-level ability was to imbue a spell into their arrows which would then take effect centered on wherever the arrow landed.

In general they were intended characters with at least a few levels of arcane spells (otherwise burning hands would pretty much the be only spell they could imbue).

The arcane archer tree as presented in DDO takes a slightly different approach (something more compatible with the game style), and gives you a variety of magical abilities that you can do with your bow.

and on the wisdom and rangers subject, rangers are at least slightly a divine casting class, so (certainly in PnP) wisdom was usually at least a secondary stat. Of course, in DDO and the world of min-maxers it is often taken as a dump stat (hence all the complaints about rangers not being wisdom based.