Twice today we have not been able to get a von5 raid going, what's up?

[redoubt]

We ran a tempest spine at level on elite with 6 people. Turned to run von5 and could only get 5 people, but could not get a second str person.

Tried again tonight during prime time, got 6 people in 45 minutes, but no one who could do wisdom.

What gives?

Did everyone quit already in the wake of the balance pass announcement (or are they watching the democratic debate? lol.)

[Qhualor]

i haven't run a heroic TS or Von 5 in months. maybe closer to a year at least. during those levels im soloing and i do have the lfm panel up during those level ranges while i run from quest to quest. if i don't see something posted and see the group is filling i don't bother. that's because i don't need that xp and i don't need a group to level. ive run a handful of Reavers, but that was when the group had at least 6 players in it. sometimes they would fill, sometimes they wouldn't but you have to be willing to wait between a half hour to an hour before starting and that's if the group didnt disband by then.

here i am tonight just sitting around in the game at level 26 watching the lfm panel just because im in one of those moods. ive run 1 quest tonight and haven't seen many lfms i am interested in playing. any i see are IP and hard/norm x2 zergy zergy BYOH blah blah same popular quests again and again. not much activity on the lfm in epics and even the weekend seemed slow to me. Who tab shows plenty of people logged on and nothing out of the norm. where are they? half of the epic level players are in quests in a group or not in a group. the other half ship piking or Portable Hole or Marketplace or somewhere.

speaking of the balance pass proposal, it seems character power is being reduced overall for a couple different reasons. if quests and mobs don't change and high level content only gets its personal dev attention than would this mean less players soloing or more players needing/wanting to group? this balance pass could create a domino affect. less character power = longer to kill mobs = more swinging/casting = more healing needed = team players wanted?

[slarden]

Did everyone quit already in the wake of the balance pass announcement (or are they watching the democratic debate? lol.)

It significantly reduced my play time tonight and the rest of this week.

I wouldn't mind balance changes so much if I had any evidence the devs understand what makes builds over-powered. The thought of having to respec 6+ characters just as I am trying to get all my characters ready for eShroud is making me lose interest in the game.

[redoubt]

@ Q, I run heroic elite von 5 every life. This is the first time in years that I could not fill it. I pug almost every quest not because my normal duo can't run the quests (von5 being the only thing we really can't duo in all of heroic), I pug them out for fun, to meet new people, and to drag the occasional newbie along on a wild ride. 8P

@ Slarden, yeah, I logged off about an hour early tonight. Between not being able to get a raid going and reading the nerf page I'm just not motivated to play tonight.

[Ykt]

What gives?


A significant number of players don't stay long enough at lvl 11-12 to run von 5 (or twilight forge).

And maybe they also want their BB bonus in epics rather than heroic, to get a full level out of 1 run.

[Thalone]

Turned to run von5 and could only get 5 people, but could not get a second str person.

Tried again tonight during prime time, got 6 people in 45 minutes, but no one who could do wisdom.


Errrr... what? Was everyone on their first-life halfling DEX ranger or something?

Strength:
6 base
2 ship
6 item
2 rage
2 tome
2 remnant pot
==
20; 25 needed. Tenser's scroll (+4), base 8 STR race (+2), +3 tome (+1), Yugo pot from past life (+2).

Wisdom is -2 from rage but the breakpoint is 20.

If a single person can buff their STR to 25 and WIS to 20, they can do both the stat checks (in fact, by twitching, a single person can solo all three switches). Surely you and your duo buddy could hit the required benchmarks?

[morkahn82]

I understand that people have less incentive to play if droprates of e.g. tomes, mnemonics, hearts etc. are decreased to ridiculous numbers. That would not be a huge problem if those where low at any time. But with all the pay2win options e.g. ASAH, store tomes, ottos and additionally lowered drop rates it leaves a bitter aftertaste of greed. Additionally ASAH and low drop rates made plat currency almost useless. Who wants to play a game with broken market? With the plat cap in ah the best you get is a +2 tome. The exploits in the last two years made even more players quit. Just to be honest, ddo is not the only game on market, and that is why people leave.

The last time I spend money was at shadowfell expansion +11k TP in August 2013. TP are approaching zero soon. I will think twice if I support this game further as it progressively turned into a p2w contest from MOTU update 2012.

Just my opinion, time for the company to show us more love. For sure the love will come back to the company.

[dunklezhan]

Errrr... what? Was everyone on their first-life halfling DEX ranger or something?

Strength:
6 base
2 ship
6 item
2 rage
2 tome
2 remnant pot
==
20; 25 needed. Tenser's scroll (+4), base 8 STR race (+2), +3 tome (+1), Yugo pot from past life (+2).

Wisdom is -2 from rage but the breakpoint is 20.

If a single person can buff their STR to 25 and WIS to 20, they can do both the stat checks (in fact, by twitching, a single person can solo all three switches). Surely you and your duo buddy could hit the required benchmarks?

Funny.

Been playing since 09 and I don't have access to half of that stuff. You can't assume everyone - even those with past lives - has access to tomes and ship buffs (which I do have), never mind yugo pots (which I have never, not once, had the favour to get access to) or the ability on every character to use a tensers scroll.

If that sort of thing is considered a reasonable expectation of power for a L10 PuG these days, then its no wonder Devs think Swashbuckler is a good choice for 'baseline' single target DPS and that warlocks only needed a -30 spellpower nerf.

[Certon]

We ran a tempest spine at level on elite with 6 people. Turned to run von5 and could only get 5 people, but could not get a second str person.

Tried again tonight during prime time, got 6 people in 45 minutes, but no one who could do wisdom.

What gives?

Did everyone quit already in the wake of the balance pass announcement (or are they watching the democratic debate? lol.)

The population is dwindling. The balancing they are doing will accelerate that.

[Chai]

Not only has headcount attrition occurred, but play time attrition occurred as well. A lot of the people I play with on Sarlona and Thelanis, both guild and channels, who used to play multiple hours daily are now logging in a few times per week and playing less when they are logged in. It has become tougher to synchronize available playtimes.

[FranOhmsford]

i haven't run a heroic TS or Von 5 in months. maybe closer to a year at least. during those levels im soloing and i do have the lfm panel up during those level ranges while i run from quest to quest. if i don't see something posted and see the group is filling i don't bother. that's because i don't need that xp and i don't need a group to level. ive run a handful of Reavers, but that was when the group had at least 6 players in it. sometimes they would fill, sometimes they wouldn't but you have to be willing to wait between a half hour to an hour before starting and that's if the group didnt disband by then.

here i am tonight just sitting around in the game at level 26 watching the lfm panel just because im in one of those moods. ive run 1 quest tonight and haven't seen many lfms i am interested in playing. any i see are IP and hard/norm x2 zergy zergy BYOH blah blah same popular quests again and again. not much activity on the lfm in epics and even the weekend seemed slow to me. Who tab shows plenty of people logged on and nothing out of the norm. where are they? half of the epic level players are in quests in a group or not in a group. the other half ship piking or Portable Hole or Marketplace or somewhere.

speaking of the balance pass proposal, it seems character power is being reduced overall for a couple different reasons. if quests and mobs don't change and high level content only gets its personal dev attention than would this mean less players soloing or more players needing/wanting to group? this balance pass could create a domino affect. less character power = longer to kill mobs = more swinging/casting = more healing needed = team players wanted?

If so many people are running ENs already then these changes aren't going to promote grouping up for EEs {or even EHs} - Completely the opposite in fact!

Yet more people running ENs!

You want more people running EEs then I'm sorry but you should be asking for Buffs to Players NOT Nerfs {or Nerfs to mobs :)}.

[FranOhmsford]

A significant number of players don't stay long enough at lvl 11-12 to run von 5 (or twilight forge).

Twilight Forge I'll grant you - No-one wants to wait around for a month to get that Group together!

But VoN 5 Heroic Elite Groups are pretty common considering....


And maybe they also want their BB bonus in epics rather than heroic, to get a full level out of 1 run.

This ^

I don't need the XP from VoN 5 in Heroic but that BB XP is seriously nice on Epic {And EE VoN 5 is very very common - Multiple Daily LFMs!}.


This is actually a stong reason for Epiccing Twilight Forge - Place that Raid at Lvl 22 {same as Epic VoN 5} and watch people flock to it!

[Basura_Grande]

My last ETR was awful, getting groups going is the hardest it's been.

best advice I can give is TR with a leveling partner or 5.

[KevinMullins]

Been so sad about upcoming changes that now on all my toons I am running Anomynous, will not join any lfm or create an lfm for the near future . This is very painful to me as I was helping a new person to ddo did not even know about ddowiki.

[changelingamuck]

Did everyone quit already in the wake of the balance pass announcement (or are they watching the democratic debate? lol.)

The democratic debate apparently got a huge viewership--more than the RNC debates which also got a huge viewership. So, maybe? Not sure why you're lol-ing. Presidential debates are kind of a big deal. And certainly more important than big sports events where roided up mutants throw around balls, kick things, hit things with sticks, and/or run into one another.

[Shavron]

yah i did stop playing.
my 2 characters paladin and barb had been nerfed.

And this isn't a competitive game at all.
good luck for you all it's been a real pleasure knowing you and every one ho helped me max my 2 characters in the past 4 months.
was really a good time and friendly people and very good world design.

[FranOhmsford]

yah i did stop playing.
my 2 characters paladin and barb had been nerfed.

And this isn't a competitive game at all.
good luck for you all it's been a real pleasure knowing you and every one ho helped me max my 2 characters in the past 4 months.
was really a good time and friendly people and very good world design.

Have the nerfs already gone Live then?

I thought we were just being given a Heads Up of nerfs to come with possibility that they may be changed/toned down before going Live?

But even if they have gone Live - Is it really worth quitting over? You've only been playing 4 months and you say you like the game so why not stick it out for a bit and adapt?


P.S. I've just checked my Warlock and her Eldritch Burst and Spirit Blast still say 120% {No Nerf there.}.

[Sarzor]

But even if they have gone Live - Is it really worth quitting over? You've only been playing 4 months and you say you like the game so why not stick it out for a bit and adapt?.

New players are less invested in a game. The activation energy to go play something else is far, far lower. If there's something you don't like, you don't have years of building up an interest in the game.

And that's why sweeping game changes, even if potentially positive (which I don't think this is) rarely go over well.

[Vellrad]

Maybe more and more people realize that there's already much too much XP in heroics, and save von5 for easy 300k in epics.

[sk3l3t0r]

Maybe more and more people realize that there's already much too much XP in heroics, and save von5 for easy 300k in epics.

This is why I skip it in Heroics..even if I do see the LFM up I ignore it because I am still soloing most content in this level range as well as others. However I will never pass up any Titan raid, at level or above...because it's just to good to pass up the favor. I only really start to group around Lordsmarch once and done (level 13-14 BB range), and GH (2 x Elite sagas). and also now with u27-28 in the low teens for Heroics, I am debating if it's worth keeping Wheloon for Epics for BB instead of running it in heroics.

[der_kluge]

I always try to get a Von5/6 in every life. But as I don't actually know how to lead it, I rely on people to post LFMs. I gave up this life. I couldn't find anyone running it. Last life we 5-manned it, which was really hard - we had to get creative on the levers, and the PL managed to get the left side on his own.

But alas we lacked the right kind of DPS to successfully do VoN6.

[hp1055cm]

On Thelanis heroic Von 5 has been a 50/50 event for me for awhile now; probably 50% of the time I cap at 12 without running it. Population has been dwindling for a long time so I suppose it is just a sign of the times that once popular heroic raids are dying.
Soloing heroic levels seems to be the Modus operandi for the game these days.

[Wipey]

I'd save Von series ( and most of Eberron quests with epic versions ) for epic - EE Vons 1 -4 and Spies and you are 23.

By the time you get those 6 people, you could have done Shadowcrypt 6 - 7 times and be in Sands already. Heroics offer no challenge whatsoever so I guess it's all about xp now - joining a heroic raid pug, and then waiting for godknowshowlong is not really inviting when you have hour or two to play some ddo at the evening.

And really low population compared to past.

[redoubt]

Its not a question of not knowing how to boost a stat or saving xp for epic etc... its a concern over the population.

My friend and I typically go from 1-28 in about a month. We run everything once and done to cap and then TR into something different. So we understand the mechanics of the game. But I've never had trouble getting such a popular quest to fill before.

My concern is where the heck did everyone go?

[Shavron]

Have the nerfs already gone Live then?

I thought we were just being given a Heads Up of nerfs to come with possibility that they may be changed/toned down before going Live?

But even if they have gone Live - Is it really worth quitting over? You've only been playing 4 months and you say you like the game so why not stick it out for a bit and adapt?


P.S. I've just checked my Warlock and her Eldritch Burst and Spirit Blast still say 120% {No Nerf there.}.

Yah man i like the game and all but what's the point in playing my toons knowing that they will get nerfed?
I don't see a single reason for these nerfs...it's not a competitive game at all and my fun doesn't affect any one else.

this is sad news indeed.

[redoubt]

Have the nerfs already gone Live then?

I thought we were just being given a Heads Up of nerfs to come with possibility that they may be changed/toned down before going Live?

But even if they have gone Live - Is it really worth quitting over? You've only been playing 4 months and you say you like the game so why not stick it out for a bit and adapt?


P.S. I've just checked my Warlock and her Eldritch Burst and Spirit Blast still say 120% {No Nerf there.}.

Nope, not live yet. Yes a preview.

Yes they are saying that it is not set in stone, but go watch the Wednesday video and watch Varg's body language and listen to how he struggles for words when someone asks if the changes are set in stone.

Compare the dev comments in the Balance thread to their comments in the assassin thread. In the Assassin thread they were changing numbers and talking about alternatives. In the balance thread they are repeating their justification for the changes and citing "data from multiple sources." I like the new crew and I like their communication, but I don't think they will change anything before it goes live. Then, they will be working on the next update, so maybe in 3 or 4 updates they will come back around to the stuff altered by this balance pass.

On warlock they are "adjusting" across the board, when only heroic needs adjusting. Boss dps by a warlock is not overpowered in EE.

[Raynebowdragon]

Have the nerfs already gone Live then?

I thought we were just being given a Heads Up of nerfs to come with possibility that they may be changed/toned down before going Live?

But even if they have gone Live - Is it really worth quitting over? You've only been playing 4 months and you say you like the game so why not stick it out for a bit and adapt?


P.S. I've just checked my Warlock and her Eldritch Burst and Spirit Blast still say 120% {No Nerf there.}.

Can you blame him? He just spent the best part of four months grinding two toons to max them out, only to reach max and see a post from a Dev saying your four months of smashing out quests, trs, etrs, and the like, is now utterly pointless. Because we just nerfed the two characters you spent all that time maxing.

Hell I just spent a month working on a Ranger I trd because her stats didn't suit the changes to the tree... Now I am a bit p****d because the tr and the month I spent working on her new build was pointless.

Why the hell introduce tree changes get people excited about the new possibilities of what was a weak class, then nerf the exact things you just updated to improve, the very next month before anyone has had a chance to enjoy the new changes.

I don't blame him 4 months of wasted money and time... I run a pure Barb, I run a Pally and I run a pure Ranger... I'm not happy either!

It's not like the tree made them that friggin overpowered cause it didn't, they are good... much better than they were... But there is NO justification in nerfing a class you have just made improvements to...

My Barb is self healing but they are only small heals, why the hell nerf that...
Do they even realise how friggin hard it is to get someone with a bar full of sp and heal spells to actually throw a heal on someone these days???? I guess not!

Same with the Pally.. A paladin only has so many LoH and sp but because they have them, healers totally ignore them while yelling get these mobs off me... You get the mobs off with your intimi and they run off leaving you with five mobs while they go cast a dot on a single friggin ranger on the other side of the dungeon, leaving you with THEIR mob on you....

I really do wonder what they are trying to achieve by nerfing the only thing that keeps a Barb on its feet, the only things that give Pallys a little dps and defense (while other scream get this stuff off me) and to add insult to injury they nerf a class they have finally improved after 3 years of stagnancy!

If I didn't have a strong Guild, a large guild ship full of buffs and money invested in guild and 12 toons, I wouldn't be too far behind him, believe me!

Starting to wonder if these nerfs are to get people who have paid out good money to build their toons and guilds, to do it allover again to the same friggin toons...