Gnomes for Update 30

[The_Human_Cypher]

Cordovan mentioned on Friday's live stream that Gnomes could appear as a playable race as early as Update 30, at the beginning of 2016. Nothing is set but this means that Gnomes will definitely happen at some point and that they should appear sometime next year, if not in the next six months.

Excited? I hope that the svirfneblin (deep gnomes) are an option in addition to garden variety gnomes. Severlin mentioned during a past gnome discussion that he would use his pull to include svirfneblin with any addition of gnomes to DDO.

http://cdn.blogs.sheknows.com/gardening.sheknows.com/2011/03/garden-gnomes.jpg

[AbyssalMage]

Cordovan mentioned on Friday's live stream that Gnomes could appear as a playable race as early as Update 30, at the beginning of 2016. Nothing is set but these means that Gnomes will definitely happen at some point and that they should appear sometime next year, if not in the next six months.
Does anyone know at approx. what time he mentions the possibility of Gnomes? Don't feel like listening to the entire thing this weekend.

And yes, I am excited if this happens in the next year.

[Inanout]

Make them expensive. That way they are unique. For those who wish gnomes before bug fixes. Really I am for gnomes if we all spend more, Care of 28 beer ( i live in Canada ), take out food , bills ect. DDO is cheap. Our game survives.

[The_Human_Cypher]

Does anyone know at approx. what time he mentions the possibility of Gnomes?

Cordovan mentions The Gnomeageddon starting at the 1 hour, seven minute mark:

https://youtu.be/SvSpfmPZBi0?t=4046

[SoulDuster]

Expensive yeah only way to acquire them is 6k favor

[UurlockYgmeov]

Cordovan mentioned on Friday's live stream that Gnomes could appear as a playable race as early as Update 30, at the beginning of 2016. Nothing is set but this means that Gnomes will definitely happen at some point and that they should appear sometime next year, if not in the next six months.

Excited? I hope that the svirfneblin (deep gnomes) are an option in addition to garden variety gnomes. Severlin mentioned during a past gnome discussion that he would use his pull to include svirfneblin with any addition of gnomes to DDO.

As the person who asked Cordovan the question in question, I take full responsibility for this April Fool's Joke. :eek::cool:

All kidding aside, that would be great, and yes - Deep Dark Gnomes as well!

U30 has something new to look forward to eh? ;p

[The_Human_Cypher]

U30 has something new to look forward to eh? ;p

U 30 should be the classic D&D module for 2016, so I am not sure if they would also fit gnomes into that update. Gnomes should get its own release with some Gnome-related adventures, like the Warlock class. :rolleyes:

[Gralhota]

Cordovan mentioned on Friday's live stream that Gnomes could appear as a playable race as early as Update 30, at the beginning of 2016. Nothing is set but this means that Gnomes will definitely happen at some point and that they should appear sometime next year, if not in the next six months.

Excited? I hope that the svirfneblin (deep gnomes) are an option in addition to garden variety gnomes. Severlin mentioned during a past gnome discussion that he would use his pull to include svirfneblin with any addition of gnomes to DDO.

http://cdn.blogs.sheknows.com/gardening.sheknows.com/2011/03/garden-gnomes.jpg



No !!!!!


Spend time and resources to fix the Wizard DC first or at least the tree EK ( worst tree forever ).

[bartharok]

No !!!!!


Spend time and resources to fix the Wizard DC first or at least the tree EK ( worst tree forever ).

Ek is not bad if you have a toon that gets some use from it. If your toon cant use it, yes it can be bad. But that goes for most trees.

[Gralhota]

Ek is not bad if you have a toon that gets some use from it. If your toon cant use it, yes it can be bad. But that goes for most trees.


I had one BattleMage

Spend 30 AP, Tier 5 for :

Tenser toogle ? Any can have Scroll

Eldritch Tempest ? Weak damage, big CD and 6 AP ? Its a JOKE

Eldritch Shield : Really, its a TIER 5 ?

I ill stop here

[Sianys]

No !!!!!


Spend time and resources to fix the Wizard DC first or at least the tree EK ( worst tree forever ).

I think it would be great if they did both - reading some Eberron novels, apparently gnomes are really excellent illusionists. If we get gnomes, we should get a wizard class fix as well if wizard is truly their favored class. It just makes sense.

[Deadlock]

No !!!!!


Spend time and resources to fix the Wizard DC first or at least the tree EK ( worst tree forever ).

Which particular fix or set of fixes are you hoping for? Please be as specific as possible.

[gaffneyks]

I agree they need to fix the Wizard DC problem....but

Gnomes= yes please.....that is something I would spend my VIP TP on.

:)


Dark Gnomes as a new Iconic would be cool also.

[Gralhota]

Which particular fix or set of fixes are you hoping for? Please be as specific as possible.



Magister ED, Caster DMG etc... Just read forum( I know you read ) .

But if Wizard DC is fine for you, just ignore.

[Gralhota]

I think it would be great if they did both - reading some Eberron novels, apparently gnomes are really excellent illusionists. If we get gnomes, we should get a wizard class fix as well if wizard is truly their favored class. It just makes sense.



Svirfneblin : –2 Strength, +2 Dexterity, +2 Wisdom, –4 Charisma.

They can change to +2 INT ? Yes but for what ? PK Spell ?

I feel that they will make a new Warlock with unique spells to Gnome and not the casters. I ill pass.

[Livmo]

I would pay $20 just for this 1 quest in game that featured Gnomes:



https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/39/CM4_CM4_Earthshaker.jpg (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthshaker!)

[Livmo]

I would pay $20 just for this 1 quest in game that featured Gnomes:



https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/39/CM4_CM4_Earthshaker.jpg (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthshaker!)

Quote myself. Make this is a Gnome expansion pack and break it into several quests with a raid inside the Earthshaker (think Pit), and I will drop $60 on this in a heartbeat. Even if I have to dumpster dive in the rain for cans to get the money.

[FranOhmsford]

Svirfneblin : –2 Strength, +2 Dexterity, +2 Wisdom, –4 Charisma.

They can change to +2 INT ? Yes but for what ? PK Spell ?

I feel that they will make a new Warlock with unique spells to Gnome and not the casters. I ill pass.


If those are the 3rd Ed. Stats they're similar to 2nd Ed. Svirfneblin which were +1 Wis, +1 Dex, -1 Int, -2 Cha back before they changed stats to make odd stats pointless!

For DDO I could easily see the Devs go with +2 Wis/Dex, -2 Int/Cha {I wouldn't go for a minus to Str as Svirfneblin are Stoneworkers who won't be low on Strength!


2nd Ed also had the Basic Rock Gnome which was +1 Int, -1 Wis or in DDO terms +2 Int, -2 Wis.
That's your Gnome Illusionist

Then there's the Tinker Gnome of Dragonlance fame which was +2 Dex, -1 Str, -1 Wis that has no bonus or penalty to Int. {And Dex was the Illusionists main stat - Could be no lower than 16! - in 2nd Ed. NOT Int}.

And the Eberron "Zilargo" Gnome.

Me...If I was in charge of placing Gnomes in DDO I'd choose Svirfneblin {DDO's 1st Wis Race} and Zilargo {Int Based}.


Oh and Svirfneblin also have an affinity with Earth Elementals so the Devs could add in an Earth Elemental Stance for Deep Gnome Druids at the same time.

[Gralhota]

If those are the 3rd Ed. Stats they're similar to 2nd Ed. Svirfneblin which were +1 Wis, +1 Dex, -1 Int, -2 Cha back before they changed stats to make odd stats pointless!

For DDO I could easily see the Devs go with +2 Wis/Dex, -2 Int/Cha {I wouldn't go for a minus to Str as Svirfneblin are Stoneworkers who won't be low on Strength!


2nd Ed also had the Basic Rock Gnome which was +1 Int, -1 Wis or in DDO terms +2 Int, -2 Wis.
That's your Gnome Illusionist

Then there's the Tinker Gnome of Dragonlance fame which was +2 Dex, -1 Str, -1 Wis that has no bonus or penalty to Int.

And the Eberron "Zilargo" Gnome.

Me...If I was in charge of placing Gnomes in DDO I'd choose Svirfneblin {DDO's 1st Wis Race} and Zilargo {Int Based}.


Oh and Svirfneblin also have an affinity with Earth Elementals so the Devs could add in an Earth Elemental Stance for Deep Gnome Druids at the same time.

Stats can be change as Devs wishs, no problem here.

The point is : Where are the illusion spells ?

Just 7 Spell, now lets see :

Blur = nobody cares easily accessible for items

Displacement = nobody cares accessible for item

Hypnotic Pattern = Crushing Despair is better

Invisibility and Mass Inv = nobody cares easily accessible for items

Phantasmal Killer = Cooldown: 8 seconds (Wiz), 6 seconds (Sor). For one button proposal is a terrible idea.

Shadow Walk = useless



So

´´Warlock`` proposal comming again.

[HastyPudding]

He talks about it for a brief moment in passing while preoccupied and playing, giving a very vague answer and you make a whole thread about it? It's been 'on the table' for years, now. Personally, I don't see the big deal with gnomes. I mean, I get it with Eberron lore and such, they're inquisitive inventors and overly-clever explorers; good candidates for artificers, wizards, and maybe even rogues. It just doesn't seem like they really have much of a place or point in DDO (illusion spells, for one thing, are largely readily available on items or much weaker than enchantment and conjuration spells). There are much more interesting races to bring into play rather than stubby inventors that talk so fast they choke over their own tongues.



No !!!!!


Spend time and resources to fix the Wizard DC first or at least the tree EK ( worst tree forever ).

Henshin Mystic is by far the worst tree ever. The tree lacks power in every way possible, except for giving negative levels to your party. They're completely overshadowed by thief acrobats, their magic damage is appalling and lacking in DC's to even be of much use beyond level 15, their unique ki abilities are interesting but largely weak and useless, not to mention they are ill-befitting DDO's mechanics and fast-action combat, and their stats are spread far too thin, making them poor hybrids that don't do much of anything; you either need to be pure and pump up your wisdom over everything else and still have terrible ki abilities or act like a weak thief acrobat. Henshin is nothing more than a splash tree for multiclass stick builds and other monk builds.

Don't get me wrong, nobody was more excited to see Henshin Mystics in DDO than me (it was the very first class build I played when the new enhancements went live). The tree just needs a total rework.

[FranOhmsford]

It just doesn't seem like they really have much of a place or point in DDO. There are much more interesting races to bring into play rather than stubby inventors that talk so fast they choke over their own tongues.

That's Tinker Gnomes!

Dragonlance has done a huge disservice to Gnomes in general by advancing this specific sub-race to a point where so many people think that's all that Gnomes are!


Svirfneblin are Deep Gnomes, Mortal Enemies of the Drow, Stoneworkers, Earth Druids and a WISDOM based Race {Something DDO doesn't have!}.

Rock Gnomes are your consummate Gnome Illusionists - The Basic D&D Gnome!

Zilargo {Ebberon} Gnomes I don't know all that much about but they seem to be closer in feel to Tinkers without the off-putting nature of that Sub-race!


Then there's Forest Gnomes - Another Wis based Gnome Subrace but these are more Fey and heavily into Illusion magic - Remember that in D&D a Wizard's Int could be as low as 9!
Dex was the main Stat of an Illusionist!


Actually - Here's a way to make Illusionist work in DDO {as well as adding new spells of course} -
Give Gnomes a Dex to DC Enhancement {Core 1} for Illusion Spells.
Also create an Illusionist Tree specific from Archmage that also gives Dex to DC.

Gnome Thief/Illusionist - Core Iconic D&D Multiclass!

[Gralhota]

He talks about it for a brief moment in passing while preoccupied and playing, giving a very vague answer and you make a whole thread about it? It's been 'on the table' for years, now. Personally, I don't see the big deal with gnomes. I mean, I get it with Eberron lore and such, they're inquisitive inventors and overly-clever explorers; good candidates for artificers, wizards, and maybe even rogues. It just doesn't seem like they really have much of a place or point in DDO (illusion spells, for one thing, are largely readily available on items or much weaker than enchantment and conjuration spells). There are much more interesting races to bring into play rather than stubby inventors that talk so fast they choke over their own tongues.




Henshin Mystic is by far the worst tree ever. The tree lacks power in every way possible, except for giving negative levels to your party. They're completely overshadowed by thief acrobats, their magic damage is appalling and lacking in DC's to even be of much use beyond level 15, their unique ki abilities are interesting but largely weak and useless, not to mention they are ill-befitting DDO's mechanics and fast-action combat, and their stats are spread far too thin, making them poor hybrids that don't do much of anything; you either need to be pure and pump up your wisdom over everything else and still have terrible ki abilities or act like a weak thief acrobat. Henshin is nothing more than a splash tree for multiclass stick builds and other monk builds.

Don't get me wrong, nobody was more excited to see Henshin Mystics in DDO than me (it was the very first class build I played when the new enhancements went live). The tree just needs a total rework.


Excited? This is a question and I gave my answer , simple.



A bad tree does not make all the other good. We can have 2 worst tree forever, np for me.


There is a huge list of things that need fixing in this game. Add a new class does not help and may even increase the list .

[HastyPudding]

That's Tinker Gnomes!

Dragonlance has done a huge disservice to Gnomes in general by advancing this specific sub-race to a point where so many people think that's all that Gnomes are!


Svirfneblin are Deep Gnomes, Mortal Enemies of the Drow, Stoneworkers, Earth Druids and a WISDOM based Race {Something DDO doesn't have!}.

Rock Gnomes are your consummate Gnome Illusionists - The Basic D&D Gnome!

Zilargo {Ebberon} Gnomes I don't know all that much about but they seem to be closer in feel to Tinkers without the off-putting nature of that Sub-race!


Then there's Forest Gnomes - Another Wis based Gnome Subrace but these are more Fey and heavily into Illusion magic - Remember that in D&D a Wizard's Int could be as low as 9!
Dex was the main Stat of an Illusionist!


Actually - Here's a way to make Illusionist work in DDO {as well as adding new spells of course} -
Give Gnomes a Dex to DC Enhancement {Core 1} for Illusion Spells.
Also create an Illusionist Tree specific from Archmage that also gives Dex to DC.

Gnome Thief/Illusionist - Core Iconic D&D Multiclass!

I would definitely dislike the de facto cleric/fvs/druid caster race to be a fat halfling-like gnome. There are far better choices for a +2 wisdom race; aasimar and kalashtar come to mind, instantly, both of which fit into DDO's mechanics and story/lore. Yes, we don't have psionics which are innate for kalashtar, but by the same token neither do we have the illusion spells that warrant a gnome-like race. I would LOVE to see a big dreaming dark/quori update and adding kalashtar as a race.


Excited? This is a question and I gave my answer , simple.



A bad tree does not make all the other good. We can have 2 worst tree forever, np for me.


There is a huge list of things that need fixing in this game. Add a new class does not help and may even increase the list .

Nobody's talking about a new class, it's a new race. And DDO hasn't had a new one in a long time (half-elves/half-orcs were the last actual races added). And I agree, there's a lot of things that need to be fixed, first. But, you have to balance fixing the old with adding new content and shiny stuff to keep the customers happy.

[Livmo]

Gnome Artificers!

[Gralhota]

I would definitely dislike the de facto cleric/fvs/druid caster race to be a fat halfling-like gnome. There are far better choices for a +2 wisdom race; aasimar and kalashtar come to mind, instantly, both of which fit into DDO's mechanics and story/lore. Yes, we don't have psionics which are innate for kalashtar, but by the same token neither do we have the illusion spells that warrant a gnome-like race. I would LOVE to see a big dreaming dark/quori update and adding kalashtar as a race.



Nobody's talking about a new class, it's a new race. And DDO hasn't had a new one in a long time (half-elves/half-orcs were the last actual races added). And I agree, there's a lot of things that need to be fixed, first. But, you have to balance fixing the old with adding new content and shiny stuff to keep the customers happy.

But new Race or class dont matter for me. This new content played on a broken system , I do not see how this can improve the game.

The last contents do not improve my experience with the product. If you like, great for you i cant say the same.

[bartharok]

I had one BattleMage

Spend 30 AP, Tier 5 for :

Tenser toogle ? Any can have Scroll

Eldritch Tempest ? Weak damage, big CD and 6 AP ? Its a JOKE

Eldritch Shield : Really, its a TIER 5 ?

I ill stop here

I used it on a multiclassed rogue/wizard/monk. Was quite useful.

[FranOhmsford]

I would definitely dislike the de facto cleric/fvs/druid caster race to be a fat halfling-like gnome. There are far better choices for a +2 wisdom race; aasimar and kalashtar come to mind, instantly, both of which fit into DDO's mechanics and story/lore. Yes, we don't have psionics which are innate for kalashtar, but by the same token neither do we have the illusion spells that warrant a gnome-like race. I would LOVE to see a big dreaming dark/quori update and adding kalashtar as a race.



Nobody's talking about a new class, it's a new race. And DDO hasn't had a new one in a long time (half-elves/half-orcs were the last actual races added). And I agree, there's a lot of things that need to be fixed, first. But, you have to balance fixing the old with adding new content and shiny stuff to keep the customers happy.

I think Kalashtar AND Psionics should be added after Gnome {and Kobold:)}.

But Aasimar like Tiefling or Shifter = Munchkin! These are NOT a Player Character Race and should never be a Player Character Race!

Also after Gnome and Kobold I'd like to see Sub-Races for Dwarves {Mountain Dwarves, Duergar}, The final Elf Sub-Race {Sylvan} and Hobgoblin added {We already have H-Orc which makes Orc pointless but Hobgoblin would fit the Stormreach theme.
After that - Either Gnoll: Flind or Lupin {Mystara}.

[RD2play]

Iconic Gnome Artificer, in Battle-Suit !

http://i.imgur.com/ak5HI0o.jpg?2

edit: have been looking for a better pick but no luck so far.

[nibel]

I only wish they take the addition to gnome to add more illusion spells on the game. Open-ended spells like Silent Image might be impossible to code, but ghost sound (think like noisemakers in spell form), Weird (Mass PK), [Greater] Shadow Conjuration/Evocation, Shades (with a sub-spell list each), Veil (Works like invisibility, but also makes no sound. Enemies make a will save to "break" the disguise), etc.

I would also beg them to make the race off the mold of 3e. The only reason they are +Con instead of +Int is because 3e designers thought giving out mental stats would be overpowered (No PHB race have mental stat bonus). Except by 3e, Gnomes always were a +Int race, and should give out +Int as well. I know we lack a Wis race as well, but gnome do not fit this mold (Svirfneblin might, but I think this one should be an iconic).


Zilargo {Ebberon} Gnomes I don't know all that much about but they seem to be closer in feel to Tinkers without the off-putting nature of that Sub-race!

Stat-wise, Eberron gnomes are not a sub-race. They use basic gnome stats (+2 con, -1 str on 3e; +2 Int, +2 Dex or Cha on 4e).

Lore wise, they basically control the press (thanks to their fey nature on finding secrets, and the Mark of Scribing allowing them mass communication powers) and have a monopoly in elemental binding (with a secret police that "deal" with anyone trying to copy their techniques). Zilargo gnomes are terrific allies and terrifying enemies. During the Last war, they declared independence from Breland very early on the conflict, but stand as neutral ground, not allying themselves with any of the five nations (think real-world Switzerland).

You can read more on the Eberron Wiki (http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Gnome), that have a really detailed Gnome article.


I would definitely dislike the de facto cleric/fvs/druid caster race to be a fat halfling-like gnome.

Since 3e, gnomes are not fat. You are thinking Dwarf.

http://41.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9g336n9Gd1rdy3s5o1_1280.png

[FranOhmsford]

I only wish they take the addition to gnome to add more illusion spells on the game. Open-ended spells like Silent Image might be impossible to code, but ghost sound (think like noisemakers in spell form), Weird (Mass PK), [Greater] Shadow Conjuration/Evocation, Shades (with a sub-spell list each), Veil (Works like invisibility, but also makes no sound. Enemies make a will save to "break" the disguise), etc.

I would also beg them to make the race off the mold of 3e. The only reason they are +Con instead of +Int is because 3e designers thought giving out mental stats would be overpowered (No PHB race have mental stat bonus). Except by 3e, Gnomes always were a +Int race, and should give out +Int as well. I know we lack a Wis race as well, but gnome do not fit this mold (Svirfneblin might, but I think this one should be an iconic).



Stat-wise, Eberron gnomes are not a sub-race. They use basic gnome stats (+2 con, -1 str on 3e; +2 Int, +2 Dex or Cha on 4e).

Lore wise, they basically control the press (thanks to their fey nature on finding secrets, and the Mark of Scribing allowing them mass communication powers) and have a monopoly in elemental binding (with a secret police that "deal" with anyone trying to copy their techniques). Zilargo gnomes are terrific allies and terrifying enemies. During the Last war, they declared independence from Breland very early on the conflict, but stand as neutral ground, not allying themselves with any of the five nations (think real-world Switzerland).

You can read more on the Eberron Wiki (http://eberron.wikia.com/wiki/Gnome), that have a really detailed Gnome article.

The 3rd Ed. stats are an abomination!

4th Ed. seems to have gone back closer to AD&D stats:
+2 Int = Rock Gnome - Your Basic Gnome {Was actually +1 at the time but would need to be +2 in DDO}
+2 Dex = Tinker Gnome - Dragonlance {Illusionist was also a Dex main stat Class!}
+2 Dex also = BOTH Forest and Svirfneblin {Again it was +1 at the time but BOTH got +1 Wis/Dex}
And I'll say again - It only required 9 Int to be a Wizard! {18 if you wanted to be able to cast 9th Lvl Spells - Which in DDO terms translates to base 10, +2 tome and +6 item}.

If Illusionist is added as a Wizard Enhancement Tree {or offshoot of Archmage} it's DCs should be based on Dex!


And yes we should have more Illusion Spells added:
Lvl 1
Phantasmal Force

Lvl 2
Improved Phantasmal Force
Mirror Image

Lvl 3
Spectral Force {another upgrade on Phantasmal Force}
Wraithform {Similar to Shadow Walk but different enough}.

Lvl 4
Illusionary Wall {For when you've got a tonne of mobs chasing you and you need time to heal up}.
Improved Invis {Could be OP}
Rainbow Pattern

Lvl 5
Demi-Shadow Monsters {Merging the Lvl 4 Shadow Monsters with the Lvl 5 Demi-Shadow Monsters}
Shadow Magic {Yet another upgrade on Phantasmal Force - Allows Illusionary Fireballs, Acid Blasts etc. Lvl 1-3 Evocations}

Lvl 6
Demi-Shadow Magic {Allows Illusionary Cones of Cold, Ball Lightnings, Firewalls, Ice Storms Lvl 4-5 Evocations}
Eyebite
Mislead {Creates an Illusionary double while making the Caster invisible}
Programmed Illusion {Delayed Blast}
Project Image {Nice way to lead mobs away from sneaky players}
Shades {Upgrade on Demi-Shadow Monsters}

Lvl 9
Weird

I've ignored the Illusion Spells that wouldn't fit into DDO {Though the Lvl 7 Spells - Sequester and Simulacrum have potential}.

There is a lack of good Lvl 7-9 Illusion Spells but the Devs could up the levels of some of the lower level Illusions {especially with all those upgraded versions of the same spell} to fit in.
Lvl 6 has a large number of possibilities too and Eyebite & Shades could easily be moved up to Lvl 7.

[FranOhmsford]

Since 3e, gnomes are not fat. You are thinking Dwarf.

http://41.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m9g336n9Gd1rdy3s5o1_1280.png

Lol - What artist who knows nothing about Gnomes rendered that picture of an Elf and a Halfling?

And why does he think Gnome women are at least a foot and possibly two foot taller than Gnome Men? {Yes I know there's a step involved but that doesn't make up the difference!}.

[Ganak]

Cordovan mentions The Gnomeageddon starting at the 1 hour, seven minute mark:


As having witnessed Drowageddon, Monkageddon, Halforcageddon, Artyageddon, and recently Warlockageddon, I warn everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!






GNOMES!



Hide yo kids, hide yo wife, cause Gnomes be tinkerin everywhere up in here.....soon.




Arty pass at the same time?

[Ganak]

Actually - Here's a way to make Illusionist work in DDO {as well as adding new spells of course} -
Give Gnomes a Dex to DC Enhancement {Core 1} for Illusion Spells.
Also create an Illusionist Tree specific from Archmage that also gives Dex to DC.

Gnome Thief/Illusionist - Core Iconic D&D Multiclass!

THIS!



Plus new Illusion spells, from D&D, fit to DDO...


Project Image or Persistent Image or Simulacrum - Similar to the effect of Monk Ninja Shadow Veil , with a SP cost.

Zone of Silence - Mobs fail a listen check on a fail against dc..

Weird - Improved or mass PK.

Misdirection - Ally/Self Target receives +1 sneak attach die

[Livmo]

Iconic Gnome Artificer, in Battle-Suit !

http://i.imgur.com/ak5HI0o.jpg?2

edit: have been looking for a better pick but no luck so far.

Is AWESOME!

After Gnomes, we need mounts. Start with Gnome mounts first, them maybe a Griffin.

[nibel]

Lol - What artist who knows nothing about Gnomes rendered that picture of an Elf and a Halfling?

4e and 5e gnomes have fey origin (like elves), so it makes sense for them to have some similarities.

About the size, it is a trick your eyes are playing on you. Both are around the same size (http://imgur.com/h2GATI9).

[evilgardengnome]

Cordovan mentioned on Friday's live stream that Gnomes could appear as a playable race as early as Update 30, at the beginning of 2016. Nothing is set but this means that Gnomes will definitely happen at some point and that they should appear sometime next year, if not in the next six months.

Excited? I hope that the svirfneblin (deep gnomes) are an option in addition to garden variety gnomes. Severlin mentioned during a past gnome discussion that he would use his pull to include svirfneblin with any addition of gnomes to DDO.

http://cdn.blogs.sheknows.com/gardening.sheknows.com/2011/03/garden-gnomes.jpg

I approve this message.

[FranOhmsford]

4e and 5e gnomes have fey origin (like elves), so it makes sense for them to have some similarities.

Forest Gnomes are fey in origin and have never looked anything like Elves!


About the size, it is a trick your eyes are playing on you. Both are around the same size (http://imgur.com/h2GATI9).

No sorry...Her feet start at his ankle height whereas his head doesn't reach her.....Chest!

They may take up the same amount of space on the paper {or screen if you like} but the picture clearly shows her as much taller than him!

[UurlockYgmeov]

Gnome Artificers!

http://contenidos.enter.co/custom/uploads/2013/03/Shut-Up-And-Take-My-Rupees.jpg

[Livmo]

http://contenidos.enter.co/custom/uploads/2013/03/Shut-Up-And-Take-My-Rupees.jpg

Nice! Why you make me laugh with hot coffee in my cup! Gonna have to save some of the shinies for screen cleaner : ) )

[Enderoc]

Svirfneblin : –2 Strength, +2 Dexterity, +2 Wisdom, –4 Charisma.

They can change to +2 INT ? Yes but for what ? PK Spell ?

I feel that they will make a new Warlock with unique spells to Gnome and not the casters. I ill pass.
Gnomes would be the monks of Choice then....

[FranOhmsford]

Gnomes would be the monks of Choice then....

Why not make Gnomes the only race that can't be Lawful then?

We have Classes that can't be Lawful and Gnomes are pretty Chaotic in D&D Lore so why not?

Apart from Illusionist and Thief Illusionist the most played Class for Gnome in PnP is surely Bard?

Also - Paladin and Monk do seem the least likely classes for a Gnome to me and a simple Alignment requirement of non-lawful would fix that.

[Enderoc]

Lol - What artist who knows nothing about Gnomes rendered that picture of an Elf and a Halfling?

And why does he think Gnome women are at least a foot and possibly two foot taller than Gnome Men? {Yes I know there's a step involved but that doesn't make up the difference!}.

Gnomes aren't so primordial centric to the fact they can grow facial hair like dwarves are. Gnomes have evolved to be more like a cross between elves and halflings with an almost dwarfish culture of crafting but focusing on modernization of sciences and illusion rather than crafting from the Earth, at least in the last couple decades. They are like the renaissance demi-humans....except they tend to overdo it to the point of mistake.

They are more inquisitive and mischievously adventurous more so than other races. Like in the way curiosity may have killed the cat, it also made the map, so its worth the risk, even if the cat died 7 times before... there is another chance. Besides that is what the cat is made for.

Now Tinker Gnomes (adaptive with a racial tree that benefits artificer) with a new crafting system with a drawing in of a Dragonlance campaign setting would be grand indeed. Or create a couple of varieties for each world. There is already an overpopulation of different breeds of elves as is. I would suggest only making the Dark Gnomes of the realms iconic making them more or less like the Historic Gnomes from last century....having a fondness for throwing darts and illusions. (perhaps even dipping the quills in a solution which induces sleep or other types of drugs and poisons)

[FranOhmsford]

Gnomes aren't so primordial centric to the fact they can grow facial hair like dwarves are. Gnomes have evolved to be more like a cross between elves and halflings with an almost dwarfish culture of crafting but focusing on modernization of sciences and illusion rather than crafting from the Earth, at least in the last couple decades.

In the last couple of decades?

So 2,000 years of Mythology and almost 30 years of Dungeons & Dragons Lore means nothing?

Gnomes are Gnomes - They're not Dwarves and they're not Halflings. They're certainly not Elfin!

Svirfnebli and Rock Gnomes are very Dwarven - Both living in proximity to Dwarves and sharing similar features.
Forest Gnomes however despite living in proximity to and having friendly relationships {well when they interact at all} with Sylvan Elves share absolutely no similarities with said species!
Tinker Gnomes are very much an offshoot of Rock Gnomes with a Dragonlance specific lifestyle and are quite mad.

[nibel]

No sorry...Her feet start at his ankle height whereas his head doesn't reach her.....Chest!

You start measuring height from the ankle, not the tip of the feet. Also, you are comparing his back leg (that is on the movement of being raised). Both left legs are somewhere on the same angle when compared to their columns, and that is where I made the cut on the comparative image.

Anyway, this is me digressing into anatomy classes. Ignore the rant and let's go back to speculate which version of gnome DDO will use.

[UurlockYgmeov]

I think I found this weekends popcorn thread!

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_y2-kG_WvCNQ/TUsqIvoUinI/AAAAAAAAAM0/s1RQRYcMMQc/s240/ranking.jpg

[Nonesuch2008]

All this thread needs now is a rallying cry ;)

(It's just a quick sound bite)

Gnomes! (http://wowimg.zamimg.com/hearthhead/sounds/VO_GVG_098_Attack_02.mp3)

[Saekee]

That's Tinker Gnomes!

Dragonlance has done a huge disservice to Gnomes in general by advancing this specific sub-race to a point where so many people think that's all that Gnomes are!


Svirfneblin are Deep Gnomes, Mortal Enemies of the Drow, Stoneworkers, Earth Druids and a WISDOM based Race {Something DDO doesn't have!}.

Rock Gnomes are your consummate Gnome Illusionists - The Basic D&D Gnome!

Zilargo {Ebberon} Gnomes I don't know all that much about but they seem to be closer in feel to Tinkers without the off-putting nature of that Sub-race!


Then there's Forest Gnomes - Another Wis based Gnome Subrace but these are more Fey and heavily into Illusion magic - Remember that in D&D a Wizard's Int could be as low as 9!
Dex was the main Stat of an Illusionist!


Actually - Here's a way to make Illusionist work in DDO {as well as adding new spells of course} -
Give Gnomes a Dex to DC Enhancement {Core 1} for Illusion Spells.
Also create an Illusionist Tree specific from Archmage that also gives Dex to DC.

Gnome Thief/Illusionist - Core Iconic D&D Multiclass!

gnome thief illusionist, way cool!

[Saekee]

Lol - What artist who knows nothing about Gnomes rendered that picture of an Elf and a Halfling?

And why does he think Gnome women are at least a foot and possibly two foot taller than Gnome Men? {Yes I know there's a step involved but that doesn't make up the difference!}.

I think that artist once did covers for Harlequin romances featuring Fabio

[Saekee]

Will gnomes be coded in DDO to be the same size as halflings? I do not want any competition for our favorite butt of jokes here. Honestly I have no idea of their size.

[Vellrad]

I haven't seen a single D&D game where gnomes are anything more than comic relief and bring anything interesting to the game.

[Jetrule]

Gnomes would just be halflings with beards. Without the flexibility of Pen and paper D&D to craft and think through illusions, satisfying illusion spells, and illusionist play are left out of DDO. At best we might add wierd, which is a lvl9 mass phantasmal killer. Perhaps some shadow magic variant of evocation spells that are rendered useless by true seeing, and a possible additional will save to "disbelieve" the illusion. Or make true seeing even more watered down. We already have "illusionist" House phiarlan and they mostly just use displace and invis. So a eberron gnome would in ddo likely have a racial tree useful to artificers? And the dragon mark is beyond useless with the ability to send tells, use chat channels, orien mail etc.

The only benefit would be to have the ability to put a beard on a male halfling. The Gnome race in general is characterized by elements not reproducible in a video game outside of appearance. Atleast not in any way halflings don't already cover.

[Jetrule]

Will gnomes be coded in DDO to be the same size as halflings? I do not want any competition for our favorite butt of jokes here. Honestly I have no idea of their size.

Yes Gnomes and halflings are almost Identical in size in D&D. They each have some subrace variants that vary in size but they all overlap.

[Jetrule]

I haven't seen a single D&D game where gnomes are anything more than comic relief and bring anything interesting to the game.

I am trying to recall which D&D video game had a evil gnome cleric/illusionist who wore a top hat and old fashioned formal wear, and was a psychopath. His ambition was to imbue illusions with the life force stolen from living creatures via his evil gods magic and thereby create "real" living illusions. Eventually he wanted a empire full of people and illusionary creatures he had created to suit his own desire. You could pick him up as a party member and was pretty interesting story wise.

I DM'ed a campaign some time ago where a player played a excellent gnome illusionist. I won't say the gnome part was as excellent as the illusionist part but he did try for some mad scientist of the arcane effect. I don't think they have to be comedy. But they certainly tend to go that way.

[The_Human_Cypher]

I haven't seen a single D&D game where gnomes are anything more than comic relief and bring anything interesting to the game.

Gnomes are the last core race to be added to DDO, so they should be included just for the sake of completeness. Some people are really keen on gnomes and I would at least like to try them out.

For the record: gnomes are larger than halflings in most D&D campaign worlds.

http://community.wizards.com/content/forum-topic/3540131

"Gnomes aren't actually generally smaller than halflings; in 3.5, they're actually significantly larger; 3.5 gnomes are a full four inches taller than 3.5 halflings. 2e gnomes average 3'6/3'4, making them an inch taller than 2e halflings (although they have a much, much narrower range of heights; the shortest 2e halflings are five inches shorter than the shortest gnomes, while the tallest halflings are four inches taller than the tallest gnomes.) 4e gnomes are shorter than 4e halflings, "rarely exceeding four feet" (4e halfling average four feet), but 4e halflings are taller to begin with."

Since DDO is based on the 3.5 edition rules set for the most part, DDO Gnomes could be larger than halflings.

[IronClan]

Whats wrong with humor in a D&D game?

One of my favorite moments in all the years I've played computer games was a guy who came into a close nit NWN RP persistent world with a Gnome named "Griznizit Da Gnizome, from the plane of funk" the guy RP'd the character to the hilt (refered to his staff as his pimp cane), yes it ticked some people off... mostly people who wanted to RP with yee, and thou, and Hark, hither and yon, i.e. bastard Shakespeare. For me I guess I got the Zifnab vibe he was going for (Deathgate Cycle).

Gnomes are a core race and I have at least one toon that will be TR'd into a Gnome the day they make them available.

The only issue I have is that Gnomes racial tree is liable to be better (more powerful) than any other, and is also probably going to be costed lower due to the common view (that I agree with) that race trees are too costly to be worth investing in.

On the down side I probably will no longer be seemingly the only person (that I've seen anyway) in the game that realizes just how sweet Archmage Phantasmal Killer SLA is if you specialize for illusion.

[FranOhmsford]

Gnomes are the last core race to be added to DDO, so they should be included just for the sake of completeness. Some people are really keen on gnomes and I would at least like to try them out.

For the record: gnomes are larger than halflings in most D&D campaign worlds.

http://community.wizards.com/content/forum-topic/3540131

"Gnomes aren't actually generally smaller than halflings; in 3.5, they're actually significantly larger; 3.5 gnomes are a full four inches taller than 3.5 halflings. 2e gnomes average 3'6/3'4, making them an inch taller than 2e halflings (although they have a much, much narrower range of heights; the shortest 2e halflings are five inches shorter than the shortest gnomes, while the tallest halflings are four inches taller than the tallest gnomes.) 4e gnomes are shorter than 4e halflings, "rarely exceeding four feet" (4e halfling average four feet), but 4e halflings are taller to begin with."

Since DDO is based on the 3.5 edition rules set for the most part, DDO Gnomes could be larger than halflings.

2nd Ed. Gnomes:
Rock Gnomes average 3'6"
Svirfneblin range from 3' to 3'6
Forest Gnomes range from just 2' to 2'6"
I can't find a Height reference for Tinkers but believe them to be similar in size to Rock Gnomes.

2nd Ed. Halflings:
Hairfoot and Stout average 3'
Athasian Halflings of Dark Sun average 3'3"
Kender average 3'7"
Tallfellows can top 4'

So on the whole Halflings are slightly taller than Gnomes.

The most populous sub-races on the two major D&D Worlds {Oerth and Toril} however {Hairfoot for Halfling and Rock Gnomes for Gnomes} could give the impression that Gnomes are generally taller than Halflings.
On Krynn however Kender are definitely taller than Tinkers!

Oh and Gnomes don't exist on Athas - They were exterminated by a Halfling!

[The_Human_Cypher]

When gnomes are introduced, DDO should offer them as a 3 sub-race pack: Gnomes, Svirfneblin, and perhaps an Iconic Tinker gnome. That would be cool. :cool:

[Saekee]

2nd Ed. Gnomes:
Rock Gnomes average 3'6"
Svirfneblin range from 3' to 3'6
Forest Gnomes range from just 2' to 2'6"
I can't find a Height reference for Tinkers but believe them to be similar in size to Rock Gnomes.

2nd Ed. Halflings:
Hairfoot and Stout average 3'
Athasian Halflings of Dark Sun average 3'3"
Kender average 3'7"
Tallfellows can top 4'

So on the whole Halflings are slightly taller than Gnomes.

The most populous sub-races on the two major D&D Worlds {Oerth and Toril} however {Hairfoot for Halfling and Rock Gnomes for Gnomes} could give the impression that Gnomes are generally taller than Halflings.
On Krynn however Kender are definitely taller than Tinkers!

Oh and Gnomes don't exist on Athas - They were exterminated by a Halfling!

Maybe a crossing with Orc will boost the two stocks

[UurlockYgmeov]

When gnomes are introduced, DDO should offer them as a 3 sub-race pack: Gnomes, Svirfneblin, and perhaps an Iconic Tinker gnome. That would be cool. :cool:

agree... Iconic Tinker Gnome Arti? Am sure SteelStar is jumping up and down enthusiastically right now!

http://static.tumblr.com/70eeadbbc64097f4ea388747ab2d5f30/nwdk0mw/M3Fnpfxiv/tumblr_static_dzoxeu6z51wsgsco84wsk4sc8.gif


or a more appropriate one for time of year:
http://content.presentermedia.com/files/animsp/00000000/154/pumpkin_jumping_md_wm.gif

But Sven wins:
http://24.media.tumblr.com/2d1d63bfeceb832416fadaf2b471a667/tumblr_mu62khrLy41rd0rbzo1_500.gif

[Grandern_Marn]

Cordovan mentioned on Friday's live stream that Gnomes could appear as a playable race as early as Update 30, at the beginning of 2016...

PLENTY of qualifiers in that comment by Cordovan (maybe, perhaps, odds are low, they'll be ready when they're ready etc.). Looking forward to them but not getting all excited over it, losing sleep and such. We have heard word on gnomes before, as far as I'm concerned they remain 'on the horizon'.



...I hope that the svirfneblin (deep gnomes) are an option in addition to garden variety gnomes. Severlin mentioned during a past gnome discussion that he would use his pull to include svirfneblin with any addition of gnomes to DDO.

Severlin's handle is suspiciously similar to the word 'svirfneblin', you may think it looks like an illuminati style conspiricy theory but I'm thinking he's a secret gnome. Before he was design manager we heard nothing about gnomes despite years of requests. Since he's taken the design lead there has been an increasing number of hints dropped regarding the 'Gnomageddon'.

In summary:
Excited? - No
Severlin's a gnome? - Yes

[UurlockYgmeov]

Severlin's a gnome? - Yes

Hmm.... interesting theory.... we need a new thread to explore this theory in depth! :p

[The_Human_Cypher]

Hmm.... interesting theory.... we need a new thread to explore this theory in depth! :p

He's right, Severlin has gnome like qualities. Watch the beginning of the recent TOEE preview video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaeNrCAUfDM

[Dandonk]

I'm not particularly excited about gnomes as such (gimme thri-kreen :p), but new races always give new build options, so that's nice.

And plenty of other people here on the forums want them, so that's nice for them as well :)

[Grandern_Marn]

He's right, Severlin has gnome like qualities. Watch the beginning of the recent TOEE preview video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaeNrCAUfDM

Intriguing find Cypher.

I figure when the advent of the gnome has run it's course we will see a change in design head to someone called 'Gnofoblin' who will introduce a mob race challenging the predominance of the kobold in Xen'drik.

[Deadlock]

gimme thri-kreen :p

Can't argue with you on that one :)

https://thestormreachcampaign.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/thri3.jpg

[fatherpirate]

The game is barely functional, why should anyone pay for new content when the current content doesn't work ?

What update 30 SHOULD be

New server machines

New game engine with updated graphics and tech.

[Mindos]

I am trying to recall which D&D video game had a evil gnome cleric/illusionist who wore a top hat and old fashioned formal wear, and was a psychopath. His ambition was to imbue illusions with the life force stolen from living creatures via his evil gods magic and thereby create "real" living illusions. Eventually he wanted a empire full of people and illusionary creatures he had created to suit his own desire. You could pick him up as a party member and was pretty interesting story wise.

I DM'ed a campaign some time ago where a player played a excellent gnome illusionist. I won't say the gnome part was as excellent as the illusionist part but he did try for some mad scientist of the arcane effect. I don't think they have to be comedy. But they certainly tend to go that way.

http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Tiax

TIAX RULES!

[bartharok]

The game is barely functional, why should anyone pay for new content when the current content doesn't work ?

What update 30 SHOULD be

New server machines

New game engine with updated graphics and tech.

Hyperbole wont get you what you want.

[The_Human_Cypher]

Since we have learned that Gnomes as well as Deep Gnomes could make an appearance with Update 30 in early 2016, does this tell us anything about the upcoming classic module? I believe that Update 30 should be the classic module update if the release dates for Haunted Halls and TOEE are anything to go by. What are some pencil and paper D&D modules that include Svirfneblin? :p

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svirfneblin

[PsychoBlonde]

Cordovan mentioned on Friday's live stream that Gnomes could appear as a playable race as early as Update 30, at the beginning of 2016. Nothing is set but this means that Gnomes will definitely happen at some point and that they should appear sometime next year, if not in the next six months.

Excited? I hope that the svirfneblin (deep gnomes) are an option in addition to garden variety gnomes. Severlin mentioned during a past gnome discussion that he would use his pull to include svirfneblin with any addition of gnomes to DDO.

Svirfneblin could make a *great* new iconic.

But, yes, definitely excited to gnome the place up.

[PsychoBlonde]

Since we have learned that Gnomes as well as Deep Gnomes could make an appearance with Update 30 in early 2016, does this tell us anything about the upcoming classic module? I believe that Update 30 should be the classic module update if the release dates for Haunted Halls and TOEE are anything to go by. What are some pencil and paper D&D modules that include Svirfneblin? :p

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svirfneblin

Undermountain? They could stand to do some more with the Underdark. That explore area is sadly underused, most people just run through it on their way to Sschyndylryn.

[Vellrad]

How about making current races not suck before coming up with a new one?

[Uska]

Make them expensive. That way they are unique. For those who wish gnomes before bug fixes. Really I am for gnomes if we all spend more, Care of 28 beer ( i live in Canada ), take out food , bills ect. DDO is cheap. Our game survives.

No they should be free

[Oxarhamar]

No they should be free

no reason to add them for free, there are plenty of free races already & if the Devs are going to invest time in this then I'd wager they want a return on that time.

[Alisonique]

Bring on the Gnomes!

[mobilemuppet]

Why bother creating a new race when you can't make the current ones work.

6 months in we will have outrage and calls for Gnome nerfs as they are OP. And in the fix they will break something else.

Still want them though :)

[patang01]

Cordovan mentioned on Friday's live stream that Gnomes could appear as a playable race as early as Update 30, at the beginning of 2016. Nothing is set but this means that Gnomes will definitely happen at some point and that they should appear sometime next year, if not in the next six months.

Excited? I hope that the svirfneblin (deep gnomes) are an option in addition to garden variety gnomes. Severlin mentioned during a past gnome discussion that he would use his pull to include svirfneblin with any addition of gnomes to DDO.

http://cdn.blogs.sheknows.com/gardening.sheknows.com/2011/03/garden-gnomes.jpg

Sounds interesting but given the constant nerfing of Warlock, a paid for class, I wouldn't consider playing it unless it was free for VIP.

[Dandonk]

Can't argue with you on that one :)

Nice pic :)

[Kuttamia]

Cordovan mentioned on Friday's live stream that Gnomes could appear as a playable race as early as Update 30, at the beginning of 2016. Nothing is set but this means that Gnomes will definitely happen at some point and that they should appear sometime next year, if not in the next six months.

Excited? I hope that the svirfneblin (deep gnomes) are an option in addition to garden variety gnomes. Severlin mentioned during a past gnome discussion that he would use his pull to include svirfneblin with any addition of gnomes to DDO.

http://cdn.blogs.sheknows.com/gardening.sheknows.com/2011/03/garden-gnomes.jpg

Disgusting, i dont want to see those ugly gnomes.

[changelingamuck]

Sounds interesting but given the constant nerfing of Warlock, a paid for class, I wouldn't consider playing it unless it was free for VIP.

Yes, we paid for what was intended to be a balanced class (because it's been very obvious that the devs strive for balanced classes). So, if we got an OP class, then nerfing it was giving us our money's worth.

If gnomes were introduced with some design flaws that made them an OP race, then a nerf that balanced them better would also be fixing a defect in our purchase.

[patang01]

Yes, we paid for what was intended to be a balanced class (because it's been very obvious that the devs strive for balanced classes). So, if we got an OP class, then nerfing it was giving us our money's worth.

If gnomes were introduced with some design flaws that made them an OP race, then a nerf that balanced them better would also be fixing a defect in our purchase.

Silly argument, what sold people on it was their experience on Lam and such. It's bait and switch and you know it. No one bought it because they thought it was balanced and then went

'Hmm, this is too much power for my money - make it less powerful please'. Seriously. Shame on you for trying to sell such nostrum.

[Uska]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=We-8utU1kHo

[changelingamuck]

Silly argument, what sold people on it was their experience on Lam and such. It's bait and switch and you know it. No one bought it because they thought it was balanced and then went

'Hmm, this is too much power for my money - make it less powerful please'. Seriously. Shame on you for trying to sell such nostrum.

You really think that a sizable portion of the player population of DDO tests things out on Lamannia? And my argument is silly?

In general, the players who play this game are concerned about balance. That concern underlies their continued purchases of everything in the store because it's a basic element of their satisfaction with the game. Therefore, yes, people did buy the warlock class with the desire that it be balanced. And clearly, Turbine's research must show that a large enough majority of players are concerned with balance that it's in the best interests of the company to reduce the power of warlocks.

I have much to be ashamed of; but I'm fairly sure that making an argument about DDO on a discussion forum ranks pretty low on that list.

[hunzi2010]

Apologies, im just throwing this out threw........

Isnt the warlock class supposed to be for the gnome race?
now with the nefs coming will this not be, um lets just say not as good???
I was under the understanding that the gnome was to be a warlock.
just saying.

[Daine]

GNOMES!!!

It's throwing me right back to the 80's, I want to turn off my mp3 player and listen to a mixed tape instead while pushing a slinky down the stairs wondering what a Gnome could do with a whole slinky army and a big enough staircase!

Whoa, too excited, I better tear the sides off some tractor feed paper to calm down...

...nope...

...GNOMES!!!

[Tahkhesis]

I hope Tinker Gnomes are in the mix. Moreso...I hope this opens the door for Kenders, because they'd be walking potions of wonder and it would rule.

[patang01]

And clearly, Turbine's research must show that a large enough majority of players are concerned with balance that it's in the best interests of the company to reduce the power of warlocks.

And here I thought the concern they had was the numbers they ran and how prolific the ES users were for the change in numbers as suppose to players concern with balance, primarily from people who don't even use Warlocks. You live to learn new things. Or maybe you're right - considering that the actual DPS of Warlocks are way below a fair amount of classes.

So clearly they should have run more numbers about what it actually shows than listening to very vocal voices against something that that person most likely don't play.

[drathdragon]

the future question will be : ''how do you nerf a gnome ? ''

[The_Human_Cypher]

the future question will be : ''how do you nerf a gnome ? ''

You take away his spoon.

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/$(KGrHqJ,!j!E1Mj,S8oHBN,B7gvgD!~~_35.JPG