Character Builder Lite

[EllisDee37]

Character Builder Lite is designed with a minimalist philosophy -- thus the "Lite" -- and is intended to be useful for any DDO player, from new players to seasoned vets.

This thread was created early in the development of the utility, soliciting feedback and suggestions. Discussion of the most recent major version (3.0) begins in post 779.

Two companion programs are included the the download zip, as well as complete source code for all the tools in the SourceCode zip:
- Cannith Crafting Builder Lite (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/479888-Cannith-Crafting-Builder-Lite)
- Compendium Lite (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/487330-Compendium-Lite)


Downloads

Files are hosted on Google Drive. When you open one of these download links you'll see a list of the zip file contents. There's a little down-arrow button at the top of the screen for downloading.

DDO Lite Tools 2019-05-25 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1I4q1cYeX3k1Mp7iz1cI-PzDFnHO9vh5c/view?usp=sharing)

Source Code 2019-05-25 (https://drive.google.com/file/d/13Ogd_KfwrgwIbSlIzStAL6mDEaEfdLW_/view?usp=sharing) (VB6)

All Downloads (https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B8wmniFNOsaCflUxXy01VFlEa3ZadXlmWkx QUjZQVGNZWFczS09FaGUySzFJbFRyQ3lHWFE&usp=sharing#list)

NOTE: For some reason, my Windows 10 is no longer letting these programs open web links unless I set them to Run as Administrator, so if you click a link and nothing happens, try running as admin. (Right-click the exe files, choose Properties, click the Compatibility tab, then check the box at the bottom that says Run as Administrator.)


New Installation

Unzip the "DDO Lite Tools" zip anywhere under your Documents folder.

NOTE: If you save them anywhere else, you must right-click the exe files and set them to Run as Administrator, even if you're using an administrator account. Otherwise the character builder will crash when it tries to auto-save backup copies of the active build whenever you change screens.


Updating

Copy the "DDO Lite Tools" zip into the same folder where the exe files are. Then right-click the zip file and choose "Extract Here." Answer Yes to All when asked to overwrite. That's all you need to do.


Compatibility

Written in pure VB6 native code, all programs should run on any version of Windows, no installation required.

Mac and Linux users have reportedly been able to run it using Wine (http://www.howtogeek.com/263211/how-to-run-windows-programs-on-a-mac-with-wine/) with the following tweaks:

winetricks vb6run
winetricks native_oleaut32
winetricks allfonts


Source Code

There are no dependencies (references and components) of any kind used in any of the programs; just pure native VB6. if you can run VB6 you should be able to compile all programs without issue.

The source code zip also contains the many hundreds of bitmaps and icons used in all programs. (Most of them are for the crafting planner.)

[EllisDee37]

Updated May 25th, 2019



Character Builder Lite v3.1.5 complete release notes:

NEW: Tiefling
NEW: Tiefling Scoundrel
NEW: Inquisitive global tree



Compendium v1.3.1 complete release notes:

NEW: Masterminds of Sharn Quests, Sagas, and Wilderness area
Added Schism Shard Crafting links to context menus for WPM, ToEE, and Tethyamar (quests and packs)
Added Named Items link to context menu for Lost at Sea
NEW: Abbreviate columns (Tools => Options) Tools screen is a development version, not polished
Changing the font for the quests list works but is not saved



Cannith Crafting Builder Lite v3.0 release notes:

(no changes)



Descriptions updated by wiki crawler:
Aasimar Scourge Tier 3: Strike Down
Angel of Vengeance Tier 4: Intense Faith
Divine Disciple Tier 4: Prophetic Zenith
Divine Disciple Tier 5: Prophetic Zenith
Drow Tier 0: Spell Resistance
Eldritch Knight (Sorcerer) Tier 0: Eldritch Strike
Eldritch Knight (Sorcerer) Tier 0: Spellsword
Eldritch Knight (Sorcerer) Tier 2: Improved Shield
Eldritch Knight (Sorcerer) Tier 4: Force's Point
Eldritch Knight (Wizard) Tier 0: Eldritch Strike
Eldritch Knight (Wizard) Tier 1: Arcane Siphon
Eldritch Knight (Wizard) Tier 2: Improved Shield
Enlightened Spirit Tier 0: Eldritch Aura
Enlightened Spirit Tier 0: Celestial Spirit
Enlightened Spirit Tier 3: Eldritch Burst
Enlightened Spirit Tier 5: Spirit Blast
Falconry Tier 4: Deadly Instinct
Falconry Tier 5: Death from Above
Half-Orc Tier 2: Lock Bash
Harper Agent Tier 2: Know the Angles
Kensei Tier 0: Power Surge
Kensei Tier 0: One Cut
Kensei Tier 0: Alacrity
Kensei Tier 5: Deadly Strike
Knight of the Chalice Tier 0: Slayer of Evil III
Knight of the Chalice Tier 3: Vigor of Life
Knight of the Chalice Tier 4: Vigor of Life
Knight of the Chalice Tier 5: Vigor of Life
Nature's Protector Tier 5: Force of Nature
Nature's Warrior Tier 4: Ferocity
Ninja Spy Tier 0: Diversion
Occult Slayer Tier 5: Vampiric Bond
Pale Master Tier 3: Cloak of Night
Radiant Servant Tier 5: Positive Energy Aura
Renegade Mastermaker Tier 2: Converter
Sacred Defender Tier 4: Reinforced Defense
Sacred Defender Tier 4: Swift Defense
Spellsinger Tier 4: Sustaining Song
Spellsinger Tier 4: Frolic
Spellsinger Tier 4: Song of Arcane Might
Stalwart Defender Tier 0: Stalwart Defense
Stalwart Defender Tier 4: Swift Defense
Tainted Scholar Tier 1: Feigned Health
Thief-Acrobat Tier 0: Cartwheel Charge
War Soul Tier 5: Divine Vessel
War Soul Tier 5: Divine Intervention
Warchanter Tier 0: Skaldic
Warchanter Tier 0: Weapon Training
Warchanter Tier 0: Song of Heroism
Warchanter Tier 0: Fighting Spirit
Warchanter Tier 0: Victory Song
Warchanter Tier 0: Warmaster
Warchanter Tier 2: Boast
Warchanter Tier 2: Words of Encouragement
Warchanter Tier 2: Arcane Shield Chant
Warchanter Tier 3: Ironskin Chant
Warchanter Tier 3: High Spirits
Warchanter Tier 3: Frozen Fury
Warchanter Tier 4: Reckless Chant
Warchanter Tier 5: Movement Booster
Warchanter Tier 5: Chant of Power
Warchanter Tier 5: Spinning Ice
Warchanter Tier 5: Kingly Recovery
Warpriest Tier 5: Divine Vessel
Warpriest Tier 5: Divine Intervention
Water Savant Tier 0: Hypothermia
Exalted Angel Tier 4: Blood and Radiance
Exalted Angel Tier 6: Divine Wrath
Fatesinger Tier 6: Turn of the Tide
Fury of the Wild Tier 3: Ward Against Weird
Legendary Dreadnought Tier 1: Attack Boost
Legendary Dreadnought Tier 2: Damage Boost

[EllisDee37]

Here's a quick demo of both programs, essentially just showing the main screens. Forgive my cheapo freeware screen capture program; it leaves artifacts in several places, and freaks out (artifact armageddon) whenever any scrolling happens.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiQ_jp4eKzw


Here's sample output for both a character build and a gearset:


Kensei Warpriest
12/8 Fighter/Cleric
Human


Level Order

1. Fighter. . . . .6. Fighter. . . . 11. Cleric. . . . .16. Fighter
2. Fighter. . . . .7. Cleric. . . . .12. Fighter . . . .17. Fighter
3. Cleric. . . . . 8. Fighter . . . .13. Cleric . . . . 18. Fighter
4. Fighter. . . . .9. Cleric. . . . .14. Fighter . . . .19. Fighter
5. Cleric. . . . .10. Fighter . . . .15. Cleric . . . . 20. Cleric


Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt . . 32pt . . 34pt . . 36pt . . Level Up
. . . . . . . .---- . . ---- . . ---- . . ---- . . --------
Strength. . . . 16. . . .18. . . .18. . . .18. . . .4: STR
Dexterity . . . .8. . . . 8. . . . 8. . . . 8. . . .8: STR
Constitution. . 14. . . .14. . . .14. . . .16. . . 12: STR
Intelligence. . 12. . . .12. . . .12. . . .12. . . 16: STR
Wisdom. . . . . 10. . . . 8. . . .10. . . . 8. . . 20: STR
Charisma. . . . 14. . . .14. . . .14. . . .14. . . 24: STR
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: STR

Skills
. . . . . F. F. C .F .C. F. C .F .C. F. C .F .C. F. C .F .F .F .F .C
. . . . . 1. 2. 3 .4 .5. 6. 7 .8 .9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Concent . . .1 .4. . .3. 1. 1 .1 .1. 1. 1 .1 .1. 1. 1 .1 .1 .1 .1 .1. 23
Heal. . . 2. . . . . .1. . .3. . .3. . .3. . .3. . .3. . . . 1. . .3. 22
UMD . . . 2. . . . 1. . .1 . . 1. . .1 . . 1. . .1 . . 1. 1. . .1 . . 11
Jump. . . 4. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4
Balance . 1. 1. . .1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3
Tumble. . 1. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .16. 4. 4 .4 .4. 4. 4 .4 .4. 4. 4 .4 .4. 4. 4 .4 .4 .4 .4 .4


Feats

.1. . . . : Power Attack
.1 Human. : Least Dragonmark: Passage
.1 Fighter: Cleave
.2 Fighter: Stunning Blow
.3. . . . : Weapon Focus: Slashing
.3 Deity. : Follower of: Sovereign Host
.6. . . . : Great Cleave
.6 Fighter: Weapon Specialization: Slashing
.9. . . . : Empower Healing Spell
10 Fighter: Improved Critical: Slashing
12. . . . : Extend Spell
13 Deity. : Unyielding Sovereignty
14 Fighter: Greater Weapon Focus: Slashing
15. . . . : Two Handed Fighting
17 Fighter: Improved Two Handed Fighting
18. . . . : Greater Two Handed Fighting
19 Fighter: Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing
21 Epic . : Tactical Mastery
24 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Epic . : Heavy Armor Master
28 Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting
29 Destiny: Dire Charge
30 Epic . : Tactical Combatant
30 Legend : Scion of: Arborea OR Astral Plane


Spells

Cleric Cure Light Wounds, Nightshield, Remove Fear, Protection from Evil, Divine Favor, <Any>
Cure Moderate Wounds, Resist Energy, Eagle's Splendor, <Any>, <Any>
Cure Serious Wounds, Magic Circle Against Evil, Protection from Energy, Prayer, <Any>
Cure Critical Wounds, Death Ward, Freedom of Movement, <Any>

Enhancements (80 AP)

Kensei (35 AP) Kensei Focus: Axes, Spiritual Bond, Strike with No Thought, Power Surge Extra Action Boost III, Weapon Group Specialization, Haste Boost III
Tactics III, Weapon Group Specialization, Ascetic Training: Conditioning I
Weapon Group Specialization
Opportunity Attack, Weapon Group Specialization
A Good Death: Melee, Weapon Master, One with the Blade, Deadly Strike, Keen Edge
Warpriest (22 AP) Smite Foe Divine Might III, Toughness III
Smite Weakness, Wall of Steel III, Inflame III
Inflame: Energy Absorption III, Strength
Ameliorating Strike
Stalwart Defender (14 AP) Toughness, Stalwart Defense Durable Defense III, Stalwart Defensive Mastery III
Resilient Defense III
Strong Defense III
Human (9 AP) Damage Boost Dragonmark Focus: Orien I, Action Surge: Strength III, Improved Recovery
Lesser Dragonmark: Dimension Door
Leveling Guide Hum0 Damage Boost; Hum1 Dragonmark Focus: Orien I; Hum1 Improved Recovery
Ken0 Kensei Focus: Axes; Ken1 Haste Boost I, II, III
Hum1 Action Surge: Strength I; Hum2 Lesser Dragonmark: Dimension Door; War0 Smite Foe
War1 Toughness I, II; Ken1 Weapon Group Specialization
War1 Toughness III; War1 Divine Might I, II, III
War2 Smite Weakness; War2 Wall of Steel I, II
War0 Resilience of Battle; War2 Wall of Steel III; War2 Inflame I, II
War3 Strength; War2 Inflame III; War3 Inflame: Energy Absorption I
War3 Inflame: Energy Absorption II; War4 Ameliorating Strike; Ken0 Spiritual Bond
Ken2 Weapon Group Specialization; Ken2 Ascetic Training: Conditioning I; Ken0 Strike with No Thought
Ken3 Weapon Group Specialization; Ken2 Tactics I
Ken2 Tactics II, III
Ken1 Extra Action Boost I, II
Ken4 Weapon Group Specialization; Ken1 Extra Action Boost III
Ken4 Opportunity Attack; Ken2 Ascetic Training: Conditioning II; Ken5 One with the Blade
Ken5 Keen Edge; Ken5 A Good Death: Melee; Ken5 Weapon Master; Ken5 Deadly Strike
SD0 Toughness; SD1 Item Defense I; SD1 Durable Defense I, II
SD1 Durable Defense III; SD0 Stalwart Defense; SD2 Resilient Defense I, II
(Bank 4 AP)
Reset All Trees

Destiny (24 AP)

Legendary Dreadnought Legendary Tactics III, Extra Action Boost III, Strength
Momentum Swing III, Imp. Power Attack, Strength
Lay Waste, Critical Damage I
(none)
Devastating Critical
Master's Blitz, Headman's Chop
Twists of Fate (15 fate points) Sense Weakness (Tier 4 Fury)
Rejuvenation Cocoon (Tier 1 Primal)
Boulder Toss (Tier 1 Fury)

Gear

Head: ML34 Sheltering 38 Helmet of Accuracy 23 w/Ins. Fortification 79
Eyes: ML34 Wisdom 15 Goggles of True Seeing w/Ins. Seeker 7
Neck: ML34 Constitution 15 Necklace of Devotion 159 w/Ins. MRR 18
Back: ML34 Charisma 15 Cloak of Dodge Bonus 15 w/Ins. Charisma 7
Wrist: Greensteel Smoke
Hand: ML34 Melee Alacrity 15 Gloves of Deadly 12 w/Ins. Accuracy 11
Waist: ML34 Doublestrike 17 Belt of Stunning 17 w/Ins. Constitution 7
Feet: ML34 Seeker 15 Boots of Strength 15 w/Ins. Combat Mastery 6
Ring: Epic Ring of the Stalker
Ring: ML34 Wizardry 310 Ring of False Life 57 w/Ins. PRR 18
Trinket: ML34 Resistance 12 Trinket of Armor Piercing 23 w/Ins. Devotion 79
Body: ML34 Combat Mastery 12 Armor of Healing Amp 61 w/Parrying 7

[Impaqt]

I am a big fan of less is more.

This seems like a great interface and output for the more advanced ddo player/character builder.

I wish I had some good suggestions on enhancements as I'm sure that will be very difficult to get squared away. Feel free to contact me though if you need someone to do some testing.

[Stoner81]

I really like what you got going in post #3 dude :) and I am really liking the idea of having the levelling order as an optional thing so you can just list the final build AP distribution. I have no idea about how to do the enhancements the only idea I can think of is why do it something similar to how the output in post #3 is like? Other than that not a clue :(

Stoner81.

[Munkenmo]

I like how quick n easy this is to use over Ron's current version.

I know you said you wouldn't distribute it, but should you change your mind I'd love to get my mits on it (even without enhancements), it's a lot quicker than the manual spreadsheet layout I work with.

[EllisDee37]

it's a lot quicker than the manual spreadsheet layout I work with.I feel your pain. That's my main motivation; my character building folder has officially reached "spreadsheet hell" proportions, so in the long run this planner will save me endless headache.

I'm softening on the idea of distributing it, thanks mostly to Ron's encouragement. I do have some logistical issues to work out, though. Where do I host the files so people can download them? Figure 2 megabytes tops for any given download -- the current version would be a 200k download -- plus the download zip would include an exe file. Some hosting sites automatically strip out exe files for virus prevention. Ideally there'd be some kind of discussion board feature so I could post release notes, get feedback (bug reports) etc...

My price range is $0. Anyone have any ideas?

[mikarddo]

I feel your pain. That's my main motivation; my character building folder has officially reached "spreadsheet hell" proportions, so in the long run this planner will save me endless headache.

I'm softening on the idea of distributing it, thanks mostly to Ron's encouragement. I do have some logistical issues to work out, though. Where do I host the files so people can download them? Figure 2 megabytes tops for any given download -- the current version would be a 200k download -- plus the download zip would include an exe file. Some hosting sites automatically strip out exe files for virus prevention. Ideally there'd be some kind of discussion board feature so I could post release notes, get feedback (bug reports) etc...

My price range is $0. Anyone have any ideas?

This looks cool, thanks Ellis.

As for sharing files I suggest Dropbox and the Public Share link to file method. As far as I know you can handle quite large files (2 GB) for free that way.

[RD2play]

This looks cool, thanks Ellis.

As for sharing files I suggest Dropbox and the Public Share link to file method. As far as I know you can handle quite large files (2 GB) for free that way.

Nice work Ellis!

This would work great in conjunction with "Ron's" planner, make a quick plan to see if it has merit and then go to Ron's for the details!

awesome if you could share ;p

[UurlockYgmeov]

I do like the grid formatting of the output - might want to suggest that to the chargen folks. time to get out of the 1980's in visual presentation of information.

[Grailhawk]

For enhancements until you work out what you are going to do you can use this http://ddoenhancmentsplaner.weebly.com/

Its incomplete and I don't think it will ever be finished but it can get the job done and is "lite" when compared to Ron's Character planner IMO.

[Cordovan]

Very cool!

[EllisDee37]

Speaking of enhancements, I've entered the following data in my data files:

Races - Done
Classes - Done (includes spells)
Feats - Done (I think)
Destiny - six trees done, six to go
Enhancements - three trees done, a bajillion to go

It's too early to have anyone try and enter any data, but if anyone wants to volunteer to help enter enhancement trees, that'd be awesome. Destiny trees take around 10-15 minutes to enter, so I'm fine finishing those myself. Enhancement trees take a little longer, figure 20-30 minutes each, and there are just so many of them that any help would be appreciated.

Note that anyone helping out with tree entry would need to be a good speller, have good attention to detail, and also be able to identify when something will or won't work with the data file layout. (And then PM with me and we figure out if I can adapt the program to support it or just don't support it.) The trees I have done so far are swashbuckler, kensei and warpriest. Nothing in those trees was particularly problematic, but there are trees I've never even looked at, ever, (barbarian? artificer?) so who knows what issues might creep up that I haven't planned for.

[EllisDee37]

Also, I think what I'm going to do is start with a basic "pick 80 AP" approach to enhancements, designed pretty much exactly like the destiny screen, and then worry about the leveling plan (with tree resets) later. The idea being to get at least something there instead of a blank screen. I can for the most part just copy & paste the destiny screen logic, since enhancement trees and destiny trees are stored in the same data structure.

[Vargouille]

Cool stuff!


Note that anyone helping out with tree entry would need to be a good speller, have good attention to detail, and also be able to identify when something will or won't work with the data file layout. (And then PM with me and we figure out if I can adapt the program to support it or just don't support it.) The trees I have done so far are swashbuckler, kensei and warpriest. Nothing in those trees was particularly problematic, but there are trees I've never even looked at, ever, (barbarian? artificer?) so who knows what issues might creep up that I haven't planned for.
If you already support the up to 7 multiple choice enhancements with requirements (which can be feats, anti-requisites with feats, other enhancements, class levels, etc.), it's probably got most things covered. Divine Disciple, including the cores, might be one of the more complex ones, in addition to maybe Human or Half-Elf (but you got those!).

[painkiller3]

the demo looks awesome...keep up the good work. if you could find a way to port that to a tablet you could make a few bucks i bet ;)

[Seikojin]

I am surprised no one said host on sourceforge. You don't have to open it up for everyone to edit.

Also is your data manually being entered to a file the program reads? Why not make it a web app and pull from the wiki?

[EllisDee37]

If you already support the up to 7 multiple choice enhancements with requirements (which can be feats, anti-requisites with feats, other enhancements, class levels, etc.), it's probably got most things covered. Divine Disciple, including the cores, might be one of the more complex ones, in addition to maybe Human or Half-Elf (but you got those!).Yeah, currently I don't support selector prereqs, but I'm already thinking about ways to implement it. Some of the additional complexity comes from streamlining feats. For example, I made both "Skill Focus" and "Epic Skill Focus" single feats, with the list of skills as selectors. Works great for Skill Focus, but Epic Skill Focus has that "20 trained ranks in same skill" requirement, which is a bit tricky to enforce for a selector.

I have run across a few super annoying unique features, so I empathize with the complexity you guys have to deal with when changing stuff. Specifically:

Deflect Arrows
Can only be taken as a monk bonus feat, not a regular feat even if you're a monk. Every other bonus feat in the game (as opposed to class feat) can be taken as a regular feat, so this was irritating. I did manage to fully support it.

Deity Feats
You just HAD to let clerics and paladins take these as regular feats, didn't ya? Grrrr. I currently do not support that. (I don't even know what happens to deity feats if you multiclass 6/6/6 paladin/cleric/favored soul as, say, a warforged. I guess you just stop getting offered deity feat slots, since warforged only qualify for a single deity line? And what if you're human? Can you take both silver flame and sovereign host? No need to reply, I can test it in-game with iconics.)

Artificer bonus feats
You can take selector feats (improved critical, exotic proficiency, weapon focus) as artificer bonus feats, but the selector list is limited to only two choices. Gah! This is also not currently supported.

[dunklezhan]

the demo looks awesome...keep up the good work. if you could find a way to port that to a tablet you could make a few bucks i bet ;)

A smartphone/tablet app would be awesome. I'd have thought android would be most achievable but I know nothing about code or app stores. And its probably far too massive a commitment due to uncontrollable OS updates and stuff.

But if anyone from Turbine is reading this? I would definitely pay for something like that. To be fair, I'd pay for Ron's character planner on the PC (I've donated before in fact, and will do so again when the completely new version is ready). But I would also pay you, Turbine, for something like this. You have an amazing, but complicated character building approach in DDO compared to other MMOs, and it's always bewildered me how little help you give folk with that. A web app, or something, is long, long overdue. I don't really expect one, but it would be right up there on the 'if money and priorities were no object' wishlist.

Edit: also, forgot to give feedback for the OP, which was careless - thus far the interface looks really nice and clean (a benefit of not including explanations of everything I expect), easy to follow, instant output, lots of well thought out shortcuts (like level ups having an all levels option which prepopulates, but which you can thereafter tweak - that's some lovely "best of both worlds" UI management, right there). Good work. I'd recommend Ron's planner to new players, but yours is, actually, possibly maybe better if you already know the game and don't need explanations and whatnot. So I guess what I'm saying is: so far, mission goals accomplished. Good luck with the rest!

[Ancient]

I LOVE your build output format so much better than the "other" one that everyone seems to use. Easy to read, like information is grouped together!

Please keep us in the loop when this is available and I'll revamp my current build write-ups to use that format and to link to your tool.

[mna]

Deity Feats
You just HAD to let clerics and paladins take these as regular feats, didn't ya? Grrrr. I currently do not support that. (I don't even know what happens to deity feats if you multiclass 6/6/6 paladin/cleric/favored soul as, say, a warforged. I guess you just stop getting offered deity feat slots, since warforged only qualify for a single deity line? And what if you're human? Can you take both silver flame and sovereign host? No need to reply, I can test it in-game with iconics.)

It's not done as regular feats and the feat slot doesn't even exist in some cases where I'd think it should.

Cleric 6 already, take paladin 1, you don't get a class feat slot at all. I mean, it would've made more sense to me to be able to take a "child of" feat in the class slot in that case, since you're supposed to be qualified for it after cleric 3.

(Yes, I was testing with iconics. They also qualify only for a single deity line... which I do find a bit funny, especially with Shadar-Kai. I mean, we're already getting Eberron drow clerics of Vulkoor, and Vulkoor is an antagonist deity in a lot of the content...)

[Failedlegend]

I very much like your output its very easy to read and I especially like the option to show your build with everyone point buy amount without affecting your builds actual point buy but I would like to see a way for the output to show which point buy the build actually uses (if you can't do this no biggie I'll like just edit it in the forum manually)

I also noticed that you have an "Auto-max" and "Auto-max alternative" for skills...I assume the first just puts max every level...what does the alternative do...the most efficient (aka least spent points) max? (if not is that possible, I hate wasting skill points)

Oh one things I LOVE about these demos is you have everything done section by section (feats, skills, etc.) instead Level 1 choose everything, level 2 choose everything, etc. seems easier to do it that way (obviously hands on testing will allow me to confirm this)

I noticed someone asking if this would work on a cell phone or I-Pad, I'd really love if that was true (mind you my productivity would plummet at work lol)

The "lite" aspect of the builder actually makes it look very clean and since your making this assuming people have the wiki open you don't have to worry about descriptions, icons, etc. it's a nice ascetic, the only thing is in the demo there doesn't seem to be anything stopping you from taking any feat regardless whether you meet the pre-reqs,etc. is there plans to implement this? (unless it already does and I'm just seeing it wrong, in which case awesome :P)

Speaking of the feat section the "filter" is awesome, any chance of adding filters for "Bonus Feats" since those lists are specific (ie. Fighter, Arty, Monk), actually would the reverse be possible...ie. I want to see all feats except epic ones.

The option to select <Any> for spell selection is a nice touch.

Anyways I cannot wait to get my hands on this, good luck with the bjillion enhancement trees :p

Note: Sorry this post is a bit disjointed I just typed as I watched.

[EllisDee37]

Regarding the logic used for Max Ranks in the skills screen, I discuss it in this post (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/435033-Character-Planner-New-Interface-Ideas?p=5518203&viewfull=1#post5518203). It's probably worth copying it into this thread for posterity:

My first thought on how to max skill ranks was very simple: At each level, apply the max ranks allowed. Sounds so simple, right? Sure, a cross-class skill ends up with 11.5 ranks, but the user can easily just remove that last half-rank at level 20 and call it good enough. But there's a more insidious issue in play.

Consider an 18/2 Cleric/Fighter build who takes the two fighter levels at 1 and 2, followed by 18 cleric levels. Consider if you want to max out Heal. What happens when you apply max ranks at every level? Level one get 2 ranks (cross class fighter), level 2 gets a half-rank for 2.5 total, then at level 3, when it forevermore becomes a native skill, instead of being able to raise it to the full max of 6, you're limited to 5.5 ranks. In fact, you can never correct that extra half rank applied at level 2. (Well, you can do it manually, but the "Max Ranks" logic has failed in this instance.)

So I decided that my "Max Ranks" logic would only increase a skill up to the highest full rank allowed. For this example, that means 4 points at level 1 (2 ranks), no points at level 2, 4 points at level 3 (up to 6 ranks total), then 1 rank per level after that.

This had a nice side-effect of treating permanently cross-class skill the way I prefer to do it. Consider the same build maxing UMD: 2 ranks @ 1, followed by one full rank every odd level. (3, 5, 7, etc...) This finishes with the full 11 ranks by level 19.

All happy with myself, I then started using it and immediately ran into my second "It would be nice if..." moment. Let's say I want to max two cross-class skills, say both Heal and UMD on a pure wizard. With my logic as written, I end up with four points spent on every odd level, zero points on every even level. That's not super helpful to me as a user of the utility.

So I added a second "Alternate Max" option to the middle mouse button. (Clicking the scroll wheel.) The alternate max logic is to add half the allowed ranks at level 1, then max ranks allowed at every even level, zero ranks at every odd. This ends up being a nice, user-friendly, complementary interface to work with.

To help visualize, here's a screen shot of my kensei cleric's skill screen with dummy skills listed to illustrate the points. Concentration shows what it looks like to be maxed with my first logic, just maxing it every level. Perform shows how a cross-class skill looks when maxed using my revised logic. And search shows what it looks like to use the alternate max logic:

http://s26.postimg.org/dg0rv9a2h/Skills_Screen.jpg (http://postimage.org/)
how to screenshot on windows (http://postimage.org/app.php)

You'll note the red point totals for levels 3 and 4, where we spend more points than we have. Manually clicking individual cells limits you to the points you have to spend, but I intentionally coded both "Max Ranks" logics (normal and alternate) to ignore everything else and just perfectly apply max ranks to that skill. It's much easier to work with for the end user that way.

[EllisDee37]

It's not done as regular feats and the feat slot doesn't even exist in some cases where I'd think it should.

Cleric 6 already, take paladin 1, you don't get a class feat slot at all. I mean, it would've made more sense to me to be able to take a "child of" feat in the class slot in that case, since you're supposed to be qualified for it after cleric 3.

(Yes, I was testing with iconics. They also qualify only for a single deity line... which I do find a bit funny, especially with Shadar-Kai. I mean, we're already getting Eberron drow clerics of Vulkoor, and Vulkoor is an antagonist deity in a lot of the content...)Now I'm curious what happens if you go:

1 Paladin (Follower of...)
2-7 Cleric (Follower of...skipped? But then at the 6th cleric level, do you get the appropriate level 6 deity feat? Or none at all?)
8-12 Paladin (If cleric skipped the level 6 feat, I assume paladin 6 @ 12 gets it)
13-18 Favored Soul (Do we now skip the Follower.. feat but get to pick the Child of Feat @ FVS 3?)

I'm getting a headache just thinking about it. It shouldn't be too hard to implement, but geez, talk about complexity!

[EllisDee37]

I noticed someone asking if this would work on a cell phone or I-Pad, I'd really love if that was true (mind you my productivity would plummet at work lol)Someone else is free to use the design concept to write a portable version, but I don't know how to write apps so it's overwhelmingly unlikely that I'll port it over.


the only thing is in the demo there doesn't seem to be anything stopping you from taking any feat regardless whether you meet the pre-reqs,etc. is there plans to implement this? (unless it already does and I'm just seeing it wrong, in which case awesome :P)The logic is implemented, and you can see it working in the demo. When you grab a feat, the first thing that happens is all the "hard" requirements are applied during the logic that "lights up" the drop locations. Hard requirements are minimum stats, skills, BAB, class levels, feat type (bonus feat? deity feat? etc...) and the ability to cast spells of spell level #, or the ability to cast healing spells. You'll note when I drag Empower Healing Spell and Extend that I am not allowed to drop those in the feat slots for levels 1 & 2 because I can't cast spells (or healing spells) until level 3.

Feat prereqs (where a feat requires another feat) are considered "soft" requirements, using the logic that you can easily fix it without too much trouble. (As opposed to, say, changing your class split or redoing your skills.) Early in the demo I grab Great Cleave to show the "soft" requirement effect. Because I haven't yet taken Cleave, the available drop slots show as red instead of yellow and then when I drop it, the text is red to show that there's an error. (Also note the BAB hard req prevents great cleave being dropped earlier than level 6.) At the end of the feat demo I also show how switching out Power Attack throws an error on Cleave, and because there's an error, the output no longer includes the Feats section. Output that you export only ever shows sections that are perfectly complete with no errors. (Output to the main form while actively working in a screen shows for just that screen regardless of errors.)


Speaking of the feat section the "filter" is awesome, any chance of adding filters for "Bonus Feats" since those lists are specific (ie. Fighter, Arty, Monk), actually would the reverse be possible...ie. I want to see all feats except epic ones.Reverse isn't in there, and I likely won't add it. But for your specific example, you could choose the "Heroic" filter to filter out the epic and destiny feats.

Regarding bonus feats, if you click any feat slot, the list is filtered to only those feats that can be dragged there. So clicking any fighter bonus feat slow shows only fighter bonus feats, etc... You can see me do this with deity feats and the human bonus feat at the start of the feat demo.

[Failedlegend]

Re: Feats

I rewatched the video and I see that happening, awesome...I also noticed the heroic filter...cool. Beyond that I'm glad to know clicking on a bonus feat slot filters the available feats. ( I did see the "deity" feats I just wasn't sure if it was the same for class feats)


Re: Portable

Heh no worries, I just noticed someone asked so I thought "Neat!"




Re: Skills

How would it work for this example.

Wizard18/Rogue2

Rogue taken @ 1 & 11

Most efficient is probably to let the skills lag a bit between 1 and 11 using the bonus skill points during the rogue levels to catch your trap skills up than by Lvl 12 you should have enough Int to handle it solely on Wizard levels.


Example 2.

IconicX/Rogue or Arty X


Due to the forced level of Iconics anything but Shadar-kai are completely borked for getting their trap skills since their not even a cross-class option until you take a class (Arty or Rogue) that has those skills. Same thing used to go for Perform but anyone can cross-class that skill now so this only affects iconics now (flavour reasons aside)



Example 3.

RogueX/BarbarianX/FvSX

Most ridiculous case I could think of in well 5 seconds lol, different class skills & different skill points per level

[EllisDee37]

what does the alternative do...the most efficient (aka least spent points) max? (if not is that possible, I hate wasting skill points)Ah, actually, now I see what you're asking. No, that logic isn't in there, and likely won't be. That's more of a human element kind of thing. It's up to you to stretch those skill points as far as you can! hehheh.


I very much like your output its very easy to read and I especially like the option to show your build with everyone point buy amount without affecting your builds actual point buy but I would like to see a way for the output to show which point buy the build actually uses (if you can't do this no biggie I'll like just edit it in the forum manually)That's a pretty solid idea. I'm thinking make the "preferred build points" column bold.

[Failedlegend]

Ah, actually, now I see what you're asking. No, that logic isn't in there, and likely won't be. That's more of a human element kind of thing. It's up to you to stretch those skill points as far as you can! hehheh.

Ah ok, minor issue it would just save alot of time if you could throw a formula at it lol.



That's a pretty solid idea. I'm thinking make the "preferred build points" column bold.

Pretty much what my plan was if you didn't implement it.

[Munkenmo]

Where do I host the files so people can download them? Figure 2 megabytes tops for any given download -- the current version would be a 200k download -- plus the download zip would include an exe file. Some hosting sites automatically strip out exe files for virus prevention. Ideally there'd be some kind of discussion board feature so I could post release notes, get feedback (bug reports) etc...

Mega.co.nz could take care of hosting, as for discussions not so much.

I'm still away from home for another 4 days, when I get back I can help you fill in some enhancement files, I know very little about coding but I need to pick up some skills for uni anyway so I figure this might help.

If you pm me a copy of a working enhancement file and a list of what you want done I should be able to figure it out.

[Failedlegend]

Oh and I forgot to mention that I would be very much in favour of having the enhancements section/output work similar to how you have done epic destinies....I almost never plan what enhancements to take for 1-19 its just a play it by ear thing its not to 20 that I've really figured out what works best for my character and I all that really matters is if I can fit in everything that the build needs are 20

[EllisDee37]

I'm still away from home for another 4 days, when I get back I can help you fill in some enhancement files, I know very little about coding but I need to pick up some skills for uni anyway so I figure this might help.

If you pm me a copy of a working enhancement file and a list of what you want done I should be able to figure it out.I very much appreciate this.

The enhancement files are essentially stripped down versions of Ron's data files: text files in the old-school *.ini format. You'd think I would have just used his data files, but no, I had to be a special snowflake, creating mine from scratch. On the plus side, my files are much, much smaller than his.

Ideally I'll have a functional version of the enhancement screen before I farm out help with the data files. Four days might be a bit optimistic; I'm targeting next week sometime.

[Illarvan the Legend]

I support this tool, It looks awesome, and like many others I like the simplicity of it, I've been using Excel sheets for years as I'm sure most people have :P.

For hosting the file, if you like, I can host it on my website, and can give you some space for a website to put a blog, some pages, or whatever you're comfortable using for release notes or whatever. Anything to help the DDO community out :)


Edit: First post clarification, my main forum account broke so badly that they had to make me a new one :P

[Failedlegend]

I support this tool, It looks awesome, and like many others I like the simplicity of it, I've been using Excel sheets for years as I'm sure most people have :P.

For hosting the file, if you like, I can host it on my website, and can give you some space for a website to put a blog, some pages, or whatever you're comfortable using for release notes or whatever. Anything to help the DDO community out :)


Edit: First post clarification, my main forum account broke so badly that they had to make me a new one :P

Hi Illy :D

[EllisDee37]

Quick update:

Added the ability to set a maximum number of levels for a build, like say you're making a favor or challenge farmer.
Devised a plan to change the data structure to fully support all prereqs: unique selector requirements (swashbuckling style), selectors that cost different amounts (eg: Human Fighting Styles), artificer bonus feats that only allow certain selectors, epic skill focus, magister schools, etc... All prereqs should be supported. This is designed but not yet implemented, and it kind of needs to be implemented before any further data entry for enhancements.
Devised a new data structure for feats that will support alternate feats (take "x" or "y"), feat exchanges, and even deity feats, which to be honest I thought was going to be literally impossible based on the old structure. As an added bonus, this new structure make it trivially easy to maintain your feat list even if you change out your class levels. I almost broke my brain supporting that with the old structure. Much like selector prereqs, this is designed but not implemented.
Added an Options screen, which lets you opt out of my possibly-misguided non-standard sort orders throughout the program, Also in Options, we have...
Colors! I went WAY overboard with the colors, allowing the user to customize virtually every color in the program to suit their tastes. I also made it easy to share color schemes with plain text posts. I think I was just happy to finally have something straightforward to implement so I dialed it up to 11.

Here's a quickie 2:00 demo of the colors:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckLJbYFDkL0

On deck is finishing skills (adding "max level" support) tomorrow then starting the feat/prereq overhaul. On the plus side, the prereq overhaul is mostly re-usable for destinies and enhancements. Not 100%, but mostly.

EDIT: Also, as can be seen in this demo, I implemented the suggestion to make the preferred build points column bold in the output. (28pt in this example.)

[LightBear]

I've been working on a character builder since Christmas, and it's coming along pretty well so far. Adopting a minimalist philosophy -- thus the "Lite" -- it's geared toward people with a decent working knowledge of the game. Truth be told, I envision using it with ddowiki open in another window.

Right now at this moment I'm still a week away from being able to let anyone else play around with it, but in the meantime here's a couple demo videos showing how it works:

Part 1 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5fhkDHd7NA) (Classes, Stats, Skills and Feats)

Part 2 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06dGHadwm2U) (Spells and Destiny)

Both videos are 1920x1080. You may have to manually increase the resolution if youtube defaults to lower than 1080.

Suggestions and ideas welcome. Particularly regarding enhancements, since I do not yet have a clear vision of how to implement that screen. One thing I know for sure is that I want to support enhancement resets in the middle of leveling.

Looks very slick so far.
Could use some icons of the classes to make it a bit more clear, a single letter can be confusing.
(Barbarian vs Bard, Ranger vs Rogue, Favored Soul vs Fighter)

[Stoner81]

Looks very slick so far.
Could use some icons of the classes to make it a bit more clear, a single letter can be confusing.
(Barbarian vs Bard, Ranger vs Rogue, Favored Soul vs Fighter)

That's not a bad idea at all :)

Bb = Barb
Ba = Bard
F = Fighter
FvS = Favored Soul
Ra = Ranger
Ro = Rogue
A = Artificer

I think most of the others don't have clashes that I can think of off the top of my head.

Stoner81.

[EllisDee37]

Looks very slick so far.
Could use some icons of the classes to make it a bit more clear, a single letter can be confusing.
(Barbarian vs Bard, Ranger vs Rogue, Favored Soul vs Fighter)Each class is assigned 3 letters. When you pick your classes, the primary class always gets its first choice letter. (The first letter of its name.) The second class then goes through its three letters looking for a unique one. Then the third class does the same, looking for something not picked by the first two. Here's the lists for all the classes:

Artificer: A, T, I
Barbarian: B, R, N
Bard: B, D, R
Cleric: C, E, L
Druid: D, U, R
Favored Soul: F, V, S (heh)
Fighter: F, G, T
Monk: M, O, K
Paladin: P, D, N
Ranger: R, N, G
Rogue: R, O, G
Sorcerer: S, O, C
Wizard: W, Z, I

Note that images aren't a viable solution because the forum output is formatted the same way, and can only use letters.

EDIT: I'm currently adding data integrity checks, which (attempts to) resolve all "pointers" in the data files. (Granted feats, enhancement prereqs, etc...) This is super helpful for data entry, but adding this logic is slowing me down. The logic isn't overly tough, but keeping track of all the relevant info to display to the user when errors are found is tricky.

[EllisDee37]

Not easily testable, can anyone tell me definitively:

Does Superior Weapon Focus require Greater Weapon Specialization?

Here (http://ddowiki.com/page/Superior_Weapon_Focus) it says it only requires Greater Focus. Here (http://ddowiki.com/page/Feats#Weapon_Focus_Passive_Feats) it says it requires Greater Focus and Greater Specialization.

[Michele]

thanks for the effort :)

[Failedlegend]

Each class is assigned 3 letters. When you pick your classes, the primary class always gets its first choice letter. (The first letter of its name.) The second class then goes through its three letters looking for a unique one. Then the third class does the same, looking for something not picked by the first two. Here's the lists for all the classes:

Artificer: A, T, I
Barbarian: B, R, N
Bard: B, D, R
Cleric: C, E, L
Druid: D, U, R
Favored Soul: F, V, S (heh)
Fighter: F, G, T
Monk: M, O, K
Paladin: P, D, N
Ranger: R, N, G
Rogue: R, O, G
Sorcerer: S, O, C
Wizard: W, Z, I


Is it possible to change it to 2-3 letters as this way seems to be quite confusing...so like lthis

Artficer: Ar or Art
Barbarian: Bb or Brb
Bard: Bd, Brd
Cleric: Cl. Clr
Druid: Dr. Drd
Favored Soul: FS, FvS
Fighter: Fi, Fgt
Monk: Mo, Mnk
Paladin: Pl, Pal
Ranger: Ra, Rng
Rogue: Rg, Rog
Sorcerer: Sr, Sor
Wiz: Wz, Wiz

Obviously 3 letters is far more recognizable but might not fit into your design.

[EllisDee37]

Is it possible to change it to 2-3 letters as this way seems to be quite confusing...so like lthisTwo-letters is a possibility; three would make the skills output too wide.

But could you give me an example of an actual build where the one-letter technique described might be confusing? Remember that you're not interpreting the letter in terms of all classes. Only in terms of the classes that are actually part of the build.

[Failedlegend]

Two-letters is a possibility; three would make the skills output too wide.

But could you give me an example of an actual build where the one-letter technique described might be confusing? Remember that you're not interpreting the letter in terms of all classes. Only in terms of the classes that are actually part of the build.

Well mainly trying to remember which letters represent the 2nd and 3rd class would be hard especially for people reading the output in the forums who are not familiar with the system (making giving feedback or reproducing the build hard)

The other issue is despite the 3 different letters some could still conflict ie. Rogue/Barbarian/Bard would be R R R if I'm not mistaken

There's no need to have a weird system like you have suggested just have the class show up with 2 letters, much easier to notice.

[Ayseifn]

Well mainly trying to remember which letters represent the 2nd and 3rd class would be hard especially for people reading the output in the forums who are not familiar with the system (making giving feedback or reproducing the build hard)

The other issue is despite the 3 different letters some could still conflict ie. Rogue/Barbarian/Bard would be R R R if I'm not mistaken

There's no need to have a weird system like you have suggested just have the class show up with 2 letters, much easier to notice.

Agreed, zero learning curve vs all that complexity just to save 3 characters is a little too reductive.

[EllisDee37]

Well mainly trying to remember which letters represent the 2nd and 3rd class would be hard especially for people reading the output in the forums who are not familiar with the system (making giving feedback or reproducing the build hard)

The other issue is despite the 3 different letters some could still conflict ie. Rogue/Barbarian/Bard would be R R R if I'm not mistaken

There's no need to have a weird system like you have suggested just have the class show up with 2 letters, much easier to notice.Learning curve? The Level Order section is right above the skills screen. They're also colored -- both the level order and the skills grid -- though since cleric is yellow it's probably tough to see in the sample output.

A ranger/rogue/barbarian would be:

R = Ranger (primary class is always the preferred letter)
O = Rogue (secondary class can never duplicate the first class)
B = Barbarian (nobody else is using B, so barb gets its first choice)

Would this example really be confusing?

EDIT: There's also the issue of scrolling. Because the display is forced using courier font and blackened dots, as opposed to
tags, if a line break is forced due to a narrow screen, the display is broken. There's actually a minimum forum width in place, where if you make your browser window small the post area scrolls to the right instead of redrawing smaller. I'm intentionally supporting the minimum forum width. 3 characters per column fits, while 4 characters (3 letters + space) would not.

A second letter is certainly not out of the question.

[EllisDee37]

Here's a thrown-together sample Ranger/Rogue/Barbarian build I wouldn't recommend to anybody:

Initial Test
13/5/2 Ranger/Barbarian/Rogue
Human


Level Order

1. Rogue. . . . . .6. Ranger. . . . .11. Ranger . . . . 16. Barbarian
2. Ranger . . . . .7. Rogue . . . . .12. Ranger . . . . 17. Ranger
3. Ranger . . . . .8. Barbarian . . .13. Ranger . . . . 18. Ranger
4. Ranger . . . . .9. Ranger. . . . .14. Ranger . . . . 19. Barbarian
5. Ranger . . . . 10. Ranger. . . . .15. Barbarian. . . 20. Barbarian


Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt . . 32pt. . .34pt . . 36pt . . Level Up
. . . . . . . .---- . . ----. . .---- . . ---- . . --------
Strength. . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . 10. . . .12. . . .4: DEX
Dexterity . . . 18. . . .18 . . . 18. . . .18. . . .8: DEX
Constitution. . 14. . . .16 . . . 16. . . .16. . . 12: DEX
Intelligence. . 14. . . .14 . . . 14. . . .14. . . 16: DEX
Wisdom. . . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . .8. . . . 8. . . 20: DEX
Charisma. . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . .8. . . . 8. . . 24: DEX
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: DEX

Skills
. . . . . O .R. R .R. R .R. O .B. R .R. R .R. R .R. B .B. R .R. B .B
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Disable . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Search. . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Spot. . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
UMD . . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .½. 1½ 1. 1 .1. 1 .1. ½ .½. 1½ 1½ ½ .½. 22
Open Lo . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 . . 1 .1½ 1½ 1. 1 .1. . . . 1 .1. . . . 19
Jump. . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 . . . . . . .1. 1 .1. . . . . . . . . . 13
Balance . 4 . . . . . . . . 5 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .9
Bluff . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Diplo . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Haggle. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Swim. . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .3
Tumble. . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .44 .9. 9 .9. 9 .9 11 .7. 9 .9. 9 .9. 9 .9. 7 .7. 9 .9. 7 .7

[Failedlegend]

Yes having Rogue represented by an O is extremely confusing...sure users of the program would eventually memorize that but since two letters is no issue Ro would represent rogue much better (and it would make the forum output less confusing g for people who don't use your char planner)

Not to mention its probably easier than coding the 3 different single letters per class

[EllisDee37]

Yes having Rogue represented by an O is extremely confusing...sure users of the program would eventually memorize that but since two letters is no issue Ro would represent rogue much better (and it would make the forum output less confusing g for people who don't use your char planner)

Not to mention its probably easier than coding the 3 different single letters per classI'll give the two-letter idea a shot and see if it looks okay.

I'm honestly confused by what you're saying, though. I don't understand what you mean by "memorizing." If ever you think "What's that 'O' above the '1' mean?" you only have to look up two inches at the Level Order section to see that level 1 is Rogue.

As for easier to code, no, because the single letter setup is already coded, so at this particular moment switching to two letters will take longer.

I suppose I could just remove the class line from the output. It doesn't technically add any information.

[EllisDee37]

In a happy surprise, there were no formatting changes that needed to be made to support 1-, 2- or 3-letter initials in either the output or the display screen. So I was able to play around with all variations with very little coding. My conclusions:

- Having some 1-letter and some 2-letter abbreviations (my first thought) was inelegant. It looked off kilter.
- Having all 2-letter abbreviations looks a touch busy. Not terrible, but not quite as good as I'd like.
- Using 3-letter abbreviations on the display screen was super cluttered, and actually harder to read than you might think. "Rog" and "Rgr" look very similar, especially when squished together.

So I decided to go with: (Same rules apply to both output and screen display.)

- If all classes have unique 1-letter initials, those are used.
- If any two classes share the same 1-letter initial, all classes use 2-letter abbreviations.


Artficer: Ar or Art
Barbarian: Bb or Brb
Bard: Bd, Brd
Cleric: Cl. Clr
Druid: Dr. Drd
Favored Soul: FS, FvS
Fighter: Fi, Fgt
Monk: Mo, Mnk
Paladin: Pl, Pal
Ranger: Ra, Rng
Rogue: Rg, Rog
Sorcerer: Sr, Sor
Wiz: Wz, WizI intentionally came up with my 2-letter abbreviations without referring back to your list, and now cross referencing to see if I can improve on mine:

I went with Bn for Barb to make it more different than the Bd for Bard. (Bb and Bd could bleed together.)
I considered FS for Favored Soul but opted to keep the Xx pattern so went with Fv.
I like your Mo better than my Mk for Monk.
Pa feels better for Paladin.
We both had the same idea for Sr and Wz.

Ranger and Rogue are resisting elegant solutions. Ra and Ro look pretty similar, Rg kind of bleeds down below to the level row, and Rn looks kind of squished. I'm setting them to Rn and Rg for now.

[Failedlegend]

Awesome :)

[EllisDee37]

The nightmare that is selector-specific requirements draws to a close as I (finally!) put the finishing touches on the feats screen. Nothing in the GUI has changed, but now selectors enforce their own prereqs, like for instance Exotic Weapons, where Bastard Sword & Dwarven Axe require 13 Strength and can be Artie bonus feats, but none of the other exotics have prereqs or can be artie bonus feats. This logic is now implemented and seems to be working. I can re-use that code to start on the enhancements, now, which is good because I mainly wrote that code for enhancements.

Anyway, the recent discussion made me realize that I have lots of space in the feats area, so I expanded the "source" from 1 letter to 7. I chose 7 because "Deity" doesn't shorten well, and since I'm already at 5 for Deity might as well add two more for "Destiny". It's not great to be too long, though; "Favored Soul" just leaves a huge ocean of space. ("FavSoul" is where I landed for that.)

Here's a comparison of the Feats output from the OP and how it looks now:


Old

.1 : Power Attack
.1H: Least Dragonmark of Passage
.1F: Cleave
.2F: Stunning Blow
.3 : Weapon Focus: Slashing
.3C: Follower of the Sovereign Host
.6 : Great Cleave
.6F: Weapon Specialization: Slashing
.9 : Empower Healing Spell
10F: Improved Critical: Slashing
12 : Extend Spell
13C: Unyielding Sovereignty
14F: Greater Weapon Focus: Slashing
15 : Two Handed Fighting
17F: Improved Two Handed Fighting
18 : Greater Two Handed Fighting
19F: Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing
21E: Overwhelming Critical
24E: Great Ability: Strength
26D: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27E: Blinding Speed
28D: Perfect Two Handed Fighting


New

.1. . . . : Power Attack
.1 Human. : Least Dragonmark: Passage
.1 Fighter: Cleave
.2 Fighter: Stunning Blow
.3. . . . : Weapon Focus: Slashing
.3 Deity. : Follower of: Sovereign Host
.6. . . . : Great Cleave
.6 Fighter: Weapon Specialization: Slashing
.9. . . . : Empower Healing Spell
10 Fighter: Improved Critical: Slashing
12. . . . : Extend Spell
13 Deity. : Unyielding Sovereignty
14 Fighter: Greater Weapon Focus: Slashing
15. . . . : Two Handed Fighting
17 Fighter: Improved Two Handed Fighting
18. . . . : Greater Two Handed Fighting
19 Fighter: Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing
21 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
24 Epic . : Great Ability: Strength
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Epic . : Blinding Speed
28 Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting


I took advantage of the new selector logic and wrapped all the dragonmarks into a single selector feat, as well as the deity feats into one feat per "level." Speaking of deity feats, I hammered that out to now support multiclassing deity classes. Before, if you took both paladin and cleric levels (for example), the second class to get to level 1 wouldn't be able to select any deity feat, which in turn would mean the feat screen would never be considered complete and thus would never appear in the output. That's all squared away now.

[EllisDee37]

The Enhancement screen is finished; all that's left now is the enhancements output -- which will re-use the same code used for destiny output -- and some cursory testing/bugfixes on my end. Once that's done I'll get it up somewhere where people can download it and start playing with it. Figure a day or two; I'm shooting for Monday.

I added the rest of the destinies, but the enhancement data is still unchanged at four trees so far: Kensei, Warpriest, Stalwart Defender, and Swashbuckler. I'm thinking I finish the coding and post it so people can play with it to uncover bugs while I enter the rest of the enhancement trees. Once the trees are done and bugs are fixed it should be good to go.

EDIT: Enhancement output is finished. Now doing my own bug hunt before posting it, hopefully tomorrow morning if I can figure out how/where to post it.

[EllisDee37]

Added the Human tree so I could finish off my test build, then ran into some issues with exclusive selector logic. Exclusive selectors are ones where you can't select the same one twice, like Action Surge. The Human tree is chock full of em. Anyway, I think I have that squared away now. Testing the output:

Kensei Warpriest
12/8 Fighter/Cleric
Chaotic Good Human


Level Order

1. Fighter. . . . .6. Fighter . . . .11. Cleric . . . . 16. Fighter
2. Fighter. . . . .7. Cleric. . . . .12. Fighter. . . . 17. Fighter
3. Cleric . . . . .8. Fighter . . . .13. Cleric . . . . 18. Fighter
4. Fighter. . . . .9. Cleric. . . . .14. Fighter. . . . 19. Fighter
5. Cleric . . . . 10. Fighter . . . .15. Cleric . . . . 20. Cleric


Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt. . .32pt . . 34pt. . .36pt . . Level Up
. . . . . . . .----. . .---- . . ----. . .---- . . --------
Strength. . . . 16 . . . 18. . . .18 . . . 18. . . .4: STR
Dexterity . . . .8 . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . .8. . . .8: STR
Constitution. . 14 . . . 14. . . .14 . . . 16. . . 12: STR
Intelligence. . 12 . . . 12. . . .12 . . . 12. . . 16: STR
Wisdom. . . . . 10 . . . .8. . . .10 . . . .8. . . 20: STR
Charisma. . . . 14 . . . 14. . . .14 . . . 14. . . 24: STR
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: STR

Skills
. . . . . F .F. C .F. C .F. C .F. C .F. C .F. C .F. C .F. F .F. F .C
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Concent . . .1. 4 . . 3 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Heal. . . 2 . . . . . 1 . . 3 . . 3 . . 3 . . 3 . . 3 . . . .1. . .3. 22
UMD . . . 2 . . . .1. . .1. . .1. . .1. . .1. . .1. . .1. 1 . . 1 . . 11
Jump. . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Balance . 1 .1. . .1. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .3
Tumble. . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .16 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4


Feats

.1. . . . : Power Attack
.1 Human. : Least Dragonmark: Passage
.1 Fighter: Cleave
.2 Fighter: Stunning Blow
.3. . . . : Weapon Focus: Slashing
.3 Deity. : Follower of: Sovereign Host
.6. . . . : Great Cleave
.6 Fighter: Weapon Specialization: Slashing
.9. . . . : Empower Healing Spell
10 Fighter: Improved Critical: Slashing
12. . . . : Extend Spell
13 Deity. : Unyielding Sovereignty
14 Fighter: Greater Weapon Focus: Slashing
15. . . . : Two Handed Fighting
17 Fighter: Improved Two Handed Fighting
18. . . . : Greater Two Handed Fighting
19 Fighter: Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing
21 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
24 Epic . : Great Ability: Strength
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Epic . : Blinding Speed
28 Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting


Spells

Cure Light Wounds, Nightshield, Protection From Evil, Remove Fear, Divine Favor, <Any>
Cure Moderate Wounds, Resist Energy, Eagle's Splendor, <Any>, <Any>
Cure Serious Wounds, Magic Circle Against Evil, Protection from Energy, Prayer, <Any>
Cure Critical Wounds, Death Ward, Freedom of Movement, <Any>

Enhancements

Kensei (32 AP)
Kensei Focus: Axes, Spiritual Bond, Strike with No Thought, Power Surge
Extra Action Boost III, Weapon Group Specialization, Haste Boost III
Tactics III, Weapon Group Specialization
Weapon Group Specialization, Strength
Weapon Group Specialization, Strength
Keen Edge

Warpriest (24 AP)
Smite Foe, Resilience of Battle
Divine Might III, Toughness III
Smite Weakness, Wall of Steel III, Inflame III
Inflame: Energy Absorption II, Strength
Ameliorating Strike, Strength

Stalwart Defender (15 AP)
Toughness, Stalwart Defense
Item Defense II, Durable Defense III
Resilient Defense III
Strong Defense III, Strength

Human (9 AP)
Damage Boost, Strength
Dragonmark Focus: Orien II, Improved Recovery
Lesser Dragonmark: Orien

Destiny

Legendary Dreadnought
Legendary Tactics III, Extra Action Boost III, Strength
Momentum Swing III, Imp. Power Attack, Strength
Lay Waste
Anvil of Thunder
Devastating Critical
Master's Blitz, Headman's Chop

Twists of Fate (15 fate points)
Sense Weakness (Tier 4 Fury)
Rejuvenation Cocoon (Tier 1 Primal)
Brace for Impact (Tier 1 Sentinel)

[EllisDee37]

Everything seems to check out, so here's a link for you guys to download it and play around. I'm using MediaFire to host it. Logging out of MediaFire to test, I had to temporarily disable AdBlocker in Firefox to make it download, but then it worked fine.

CharacterBuilderLitev0.9.zip (http://www.mediafire.com/download/oni5o3m55dgkabp/CharacterBuilderLitev0.9.zip)

To install, unzip to anywhere under your documents folder. It will run natively on any Windows version post-Windows 2000, no installation necessary. Double-click the exe to run it, or create a shortcut if you like.

The zip is a svelte 277k. The only files in it are the exe, the data files, one save file (the trusty Kensei Warpriest sample build), and a half-dozen or so color scheme files. Builds (*.bld) and color schemes (*.clr) go in the \Save folder beneath the program folder. Data files go in \Data. The only file in the program folder is the exe, plus a config file (CharacterBuilderLite.cfg) gets created automatically when you run the program. The cfg file stores your settings.

All data is in except for enhancements. Play around with it to see if you can find any bugs, or if it doesn't look right. I'm particularly interested in how it looks in 1024x768, since it's designed for 1920x1080. I have no idea how it will scale down. Maybe not terribly? Who knows. If you can find any examples of text getting squished or not lining up properly, let me know. Screenshots welcome. EDIT: The group filters are currently disabled for enhancements.

Any runtime errors will terminate the program. If you can find one, and can post the steps to reproduce it, I can fix it quickly. If you can't reproduce it consistently, just give me the general idea of what you were doing and I'll take a look to see if I can find it.

I figure several days to enter the enhancements. Help me out by testing it during the next few days, then hopefully I can get you the first official release with all the enhancement data by this weekend.

[Ancient]

This tool is looking amazing! Thank you for all your hard work.

[Theolin]

I like it so far,
get an error when going from the skills page to the feats page

run time error '308':
Invalid property value

-crashes the whole program

happens when i click the "next' button to go to the feats page
doesn't matter if I select skills or leave them blank

[Yeww2]

Hi Ellis - great work, thanks for all the effort you've put into this. I'm not getting the bug Theolin is reporting. I'm on Windows 8.1.

[EllisDee37]

I dispatched a couple PMs to the early bug reports. I'm crossing my fingers that it's a data problem with some class/race combination I never tested as opposed to a core problem that I can't reproduce on my end.

First thing to check is if you get the same error when loading the Kensei Warpriest sample build. If so, bummer, I'll need to try and guess the problem to fix. If the Kensei Warpriest build works fine, though, then it should be fairly straightforward figuring out the problem with the builds being tried.

[EllisDee37]

Early reports on that bug point to the drag & drop ability slots used in the feats, spells, enhancements, destinies and options (color demo) screens. That's a custom control I wrote, but just being a custom control isn't in and of itself a problem because there's custom controls all over the first three screens and those don't appear to have any issues. The "max levels" spinner, the stat allocation controls and every checkbox is a custom control. (The checkboxes in the stat allocation area are custom controls inside custom controls, actually.)

As an aside, I'm not thrilled with how the checkboxes ended up looking, but lacking even an ounce of artistic ability that was the best I could do to make it so that the colors could change.

Anyway, for people experiencing the Invalid Property bug, I'm hoping to get a debugging version posted tomorrow that you can download, run, and hopefully help pinpoint where the error is coming from.

EDIT: I opted for lots and lots of custom controls for two reasons: First and foremost, they're pure native code, meaning there's no installation required. A secondary reason was to allow customizing the colors.

[ValariusK]

I assume all the enhancements aren't in yet---wasn't given the option on a ranger-2/fighter-9/druid-9 for any trees other than PDK, Stalwart Defender, and Kensei

Also, the natural fighting feats are either not there or hard to find.

Really looking forward to when harper works also

[EllisDee37]

Also, the natural fighting feats are either not there or hard to find.Yeah the enhancements aren't in yet, but feats should be all done. What are the natural fighting feats? I may have missed them, having no knowledge of druids.

[EllisDee37]

I tossed together a debug version for people experiencing the Invalid Property bug:

Debug1 (http://www.mediafire.com/download/3elwfq32bk319fu/Debug1.zip)

This is the same as the regular program, but includes a "Debug" option in the Tools menu below Options. That screen has two buttons for testing. They send the calls out to a textbox as they're being made, plus I added error handling (which I don't normally do, obviously) so if/when it throws an error it shouldn't crash the program. If you can't open the Feats/Spells/Enhancements/Destinies/Options screen, post the text from both tests to help me pinpoint the problem.

There's a chance that the Debug screen may throw an error before it even loads. Let me know if it doesn't even load.

[ValariusK]

Yeah the enhancements aren't in yet, but feats should be all done. What are the natural fighting feats? I may have missed them, having no knowledge of druids.

Requires druid level 9, 6% doublestrike when in animal form, can be taken up to 3x

[Failedlegend]

I've downloaded it, gonna see what I can break for ya :D

[colgatsch]

Hello everyone

I was in dialog with EllisDee37 about the error 380. After a few pms he metioned that he used the fonts

Wingdings
Wingdings 2
Wingdings 3

which i noticed were missing on my pc (i don't have microsoft office).

After i hunted down the missing fonts i tried the tool again and behold it was working like a charm.
So if you get 380 error when clicking on options or on feat selection this might fix your problem.

Thank you Ellis for your fast and professional bugfixing skills :)

I am off now and dive into the wonderful world of theory crafting and character generation.

Best Regards

[Theolin]

Hello everyone

I was in dialog with EllisDee37 about the error 380. After a few pms he metioned that he used the fonts

Wingdings
Wingdings 2
Wingdings 3

which i noticed were missing on my pc (i don't have microsoft office).

After i hunted down the missing fonts i tried the tool again and behold it was working like a charm.
So if you get 380 error when clicking on options or on feat selection this might fix your problem.

Thank you Ellis for your fast and professional bugfixing skills :)

I am off now and dive into the wonderful world of theory crafting and character generation.

Best Regards

Yep installing wingdings 2 & 3 fixed my issue as well

[Theolin]

couple of feats missing

master of forms
grand master of forms

[EllisDee37]

Regarding the Wingdings fonts, I'll change the code to no longer use them. I mistakenly thought they came with all Windows. It's not hard to pull them out.


couple of feats missing

master of forms
grand master of formsGood catch, I'll add those. I'm not even autogranting those for monks. Doh!

Also, I now see the Druid natural fighting feats, which I'll add. Sadly, I need to add additional logic to support "Repeat, but only 3 times." Shouldn't be too difficult, but a bit of a bummer that after all the feats I added I'm still uncovering new rules. hehheh.

I'd ask everyone to help check that I got all the feats in there. Feats that I almost certainly missed will have the following features:

- Limited to a single class, or maybe a couple
- Taken as a regular feat, not a bonus feat

EDIT: Got the natural fighting and monk forms feats into the data file, and set monk to autogrant the forms. For now I'm setting natural fighting as a standard "repeat" feat like toughness, not enforcing the 3x rule. I expect to add the repeat 3x code soon, but would rather focus on enhancement trees for the time being. I've added it to the exceptions log so I won't forget.. (Tools => Exceptions.) Look for an updated version with these feats plus a handful of new trees by the morning, plus hopefully removing wingdings 3 from the program.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Ozymoronic Barbarian
11/7/2 Barbarian/Wizard/Rogue
Chaotic Good Shadar-Kai




Level Order


1. Rogue. . . . . .6. Barbarian . . .11. Wizard . . . . 16. Barbarian
2. Barbarian. . . .7. Wizard. . . . .12. Barbarian. . . 17. Barbarian
3. Wizard . . . . .8. Wizard. . . . .13. Wizard . . . . 18. Barbarian
4. Barbarian. . . .9. Wizard. . . . .14. Barbarian. . . 19. Barbarian
5. Wizard . . . . 10. Barbarian . . .15. Rogue. . . . . 20. Barbarian




Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt. . .34pt . . 36pt. . .Tome . . Level Up
. . . . . . . .----. . .---- . . ----. . .---- . . --------
Strength. . . . 13 . . . 15. . . .15 . . . +6. . . .4: INT
Dexterity . . . 10 . . . 10. . . .12 . . . +6. . . .8: INT
Constitution. . 17 . . . 17. . . .17 . . . +6. . . 12: INT
Intelligence. . 16 . . . 17. . . .17 . . . +6. . . 16: INT
Wisdom. . . . . .8 . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . +6. . . 20: INT
Charisma. . . . .6 . . . .6. . . . 6 . . . +6. . . 24: INT
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: INT


Skills
. . . . . R .B. W .B. W .B. W .W. W .B. W .B. W .B. R .B. B .B. B .B
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Spot. . . 4 .1. 1 .½. ½ .½. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
UMD . . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Repair. . 4 . . . . . 1 . . 1 .1. 2 .½. . .1. 1 .1. 1 .1½ 1½ 1½ 1½ 1½ 21
Disable . 4 .½. ½ .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. ½ .1. ½ .1. ½ .1. 3 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 21
Search. . 4 .1. . .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 20
Open Lo . 4 . . . .½. . .½. . .½. . . . . . . . . . 4 . . . . . . .½. 10
Listen. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Balance . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Jump. . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Haggle. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Bluff . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .3
Tumble. . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .44 .7. 5 .8. 6 .8. 6 .7. 7 .9. 7 10. 8 10 14 11 11 11 11 12




Feats


.1. . . . : Power Attack
.3. . . . : Cleave
.3 Wizard : Empower Spell
.6. . . . : Great Cleave
.9. . . . : Two Handed Fighting
.9 Wizard : Mental Toughness
12. . . . : Improved Critical: Slashing
15. . . . : Insightful Reflexes
18. . . . : Improved Two Handed Fighting
21 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
24 Epic . : Greater Two Handed Fighting
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting
27 Epic . : Maximize Spell
28 Destiny: Mass Frog




Spells




Expeditious Retreat, Jump, Shield, Sonic Blast, Grease
Electric Loop, Lesser Death Aura, Web, Blur
Displacement, Haste, Rage
Dimension Door, Death Aura

[EllisDee37]

Very cool!

I'm curious about the extra blank lines between sections. Did you add those manually? If so, all good, no worries. If that's how it defaulted, though, I'll need to take a look to see what's going on.


Quick note that alignment is optional. I would generally recommend not specifying one unless there is a specific reason to, like say you recommend being chaotic good so you can natively wield True Chaos and Pure Good weapons without a UMD check. (That's the reasoning behind the Kensei Warpriest being Chaotic Good.) If your build only allows a single alignment, like a Paladin or a Drunk, that alignment is automatically specified.

[EllisDee37]

As I polish up the existing enhancement trees to add groups and apply selector-specific prereqs, one issue I'm noticing is that rank-specific prereqs are starting to pile up. I may or may not add support to enforce those.

The example you can already see in Tools => Exceptions is that Unyielding Sentinel ability that requires Shield Mastery on rank 2 and Improved Shield Master on rank 3. I just ran into a second instance of it with Swashbuckler, where Tier 2 Fighting Style (orb) requires Magical Training or an enhancement version of Magical Training. The enhancement versions (Spellsinger, Arcane Archer) don't grant the feat until rank III, but the best my prereq logic can currently enforce is rank I.

It's much easier to enforce a rank than it is to enforce different feats based on what rank you want to take, so I may do the easy fix and and leave that Unyielding Sentinel issue as an exception.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Very cool!

I'm curious about the extra blank lines between sections. Did you add those manually? If so, all good, no worries. If that's how it defaulted, though, I'll need to take a look to see what's going on.


Quick note that alignment is optional. I would generally recommend not specifying one unless there is a specific reason to, like say you recommend being chaotic good so you can natively wield True Chaos and Pure Good weapons without a UMD check. (That's the reasoning behind the Kensei Warpriest being Chaotic Good.) If your build only allows a single alignment, like a Paladin or a Drunk, that alignment is automatically specified.

the build output I posted is directly from the export - was wondering the same.

Agree on the alignment - this one (for the Ozyomoronic Barbarian) requires Chaotic for the Barbarian part.


As I polish up the existing enhancement trees to add groups and apply selector-specific prereqs, one issue I'm noticing is that rank-specific prereqs are starting to pile up. I may or may not add support to enforce those.

The example you can already see in Tools => Exceptions is that Unyielding Sentinel ability that requires Shield Mastery on rank 2 and Improved Shield Master on rank 3. I just ran into a second instance of it with Swashbuckler, where Tier 2 Fighting Style (orb) requires Magical Training or an enhancement version of Magical Training. The enhancement versions (Spellsinger, Arcane Archer) don't grant the feat until rank III, but the best my prereq logic can currently enforce is rank I.

It's much easier to enforce a rank than it is to enforce different feats based on what rank you want to take, so I may do the easy fix and and leave that Unyielding Sentinel issue as an exception.

you've stated that your guiding design principle was KISS or minimalist - so this keeps with that.

[General_Gronker]

Spiffy. I don't see a way to add Grandmaster of Forms though. I understand you may have it applied as an autogrant, but for example, I"m building a character that will have 6 Monk levels. So he won't get it automatically, and I'll have to take it at 18 as my lvl 18 feat. This is pretty common for monkcher builds. I fully admit I may just be missing something though.

[EllisDee37]

Spiffy. I don't see a way to add Grandmaster of Forms though. I understand you may have it applied as an autogrant, but for example, I"m building a character that will have 6 Monk levels. So he won't get it automatically, and I'll have to take it at 18 as my lvl 18 feat. This is pretty common for monkcher builds. I fully admit I may just be missing something though.I forgot to include form feats. They're in there now, but I won't be posting an update until later this morning.




Just added three more trees: Tempest, Arcane Archer, and Deepwood Stalker. I chose those because I'm going in order of trees that cross-reference each other, and Swashbuckler cross-references both Tempest and Arcane Archer, and at that point I decided to just finish off Ranger.

On a side note, holy cow does Deepwood Stalker suck, and suck hard. Everything in it is way overpriced and way over-prereqed. And even if you lowered the prices and removed the abundance of prereqs, the abilities themselves are pretty weak. Just bad all around.

Next on deck are the other two bard trees, and Half-Elf. (Stalwart Defender cross-references Half-Elf.) I'd like to get Harper in tonight but not sure I'll be able to do that many trees in a row without going insane. Harper cross-references Warpriest (already in) and KotC, so I might have to do KotC as well.

[AtomicMew]

This is a very nice and intuitive interface. Great job man. If you don't mind, I would really appreciate if you could open source it and host it on github or google code or something.

[skorpeon]

I forgot to include form feats. They're in there now, but I won't be posting an update until later this morning.

Just added three more trees: Tempest, Arcane Archer, and Deepwood Stalker. I chose those because I'm going in order of trees that cross-reference each other, and Swashbuckler cross-references both Tempest and Arcane Archer, and at that point I decided to just finish off Ranger.

On a side note, holy cow does Deepwood Stalker suck, and suck hard. Everything in it is way overpriced and way over-prereqed. And even if you lowered the prices and removed the abundance of prereqs, the abilities themselves are pretty weak. Just bad all around.

Next on deck are the other two bard trees, and Half-Elf. (Stalwart Defender cross-references Half-Elf.) I'd like to get Harper in tonight but not sure I'll be able to do that many trees in a row without going insane. Harper cross-references Warpriest (already in) and KotC, so I might have to do KotC as well.

Nice job I am looking forward to playing with the tool, just wondering if can use it on my Mac? guessing not as yet.

[EllisDee37]

wondering if can use it on my Mac? guessing not as yet.It won't run natively on a Mac, but other people are having success running it under Bootcamp. (Did I say that right? I know nothing of Macs.)

One Mac user encountered the error from not having the Wingdings 3 font, but I'm planning to correct that before this morning's update.


This is a very nice and intuitive interface. Great job man. If you don't mind, I would really appreciate if you could open source it and host it on github or google code or something.I may post the complete source code once I get to the official 1.0 release version. Fair warning that's it's written in caveman paintings, otherwise known as VB6. I chose VB6 for two reasons: I can code it really fast, and it requires literally zero installation for any Windows after Windows 2000. (XP, Vista, 7, 8, 8.1) VB6 runtimes are part of all Windows installations, and I use nothing but pure native VB6 code so there's nothing to install. Also, Microsoft pretty much has to keep supporting it because it's still the language Microsoft Office macros are written in, even today. So it's highly likely it will be still be supported for years to come.




Two more trees are in: Spellsinger and Warchanter. Looks like it's around 30 minutes per tree. Only *mumble mumble* trees left...*cries*.

[skorpeon]

It won't run natively on a Mac, but other people are having success running it under Bootcamp. (Did I say that right? I know nothing of Macs.)

One Mac user encountered the error from not having the Wingdings 3 font, but I'm planning to correct that before this morning's update.

I may post the complete source code once I get to the official 1.0 release version. Fair warning that's it's written in caveman paintings, otherwise known as VB6. I chose VB6 for two reasons: I can code it really fast, and it requires literally zero installation for any Windows after Windows 2000. (XP, Vista, 7, 8, 8.1) VB6 runtimes are part of all Windows installations, and I use nothing but pure native VB6 code so there's nothing to install. Also, Microsoft pretty much has to keep supporting it because it's still the language Microsoft Office macros are written in, even today. So it's highly likely it will be still be supported for years to come.




Two more trees are in: Spellsinger and Warchanter. Looks like it's around 30 minutes per tree. Only *mumble mumble* trees left...*cries*.

I will install on my home `pc, but I tend to play the game in my limited time on that PC. Theory crafting etc is a thing for my lunch times.

hats off on this project mate!

[Theolin]

It won't run natively on a Mac, but other people are having success running it under Bootcamp. (Did I say that right? I know nothing of Macs.)

One Mac user encountered the error from not having the Wingdings 3 font, but I'm planning to correct that before this morning's update.

To run winders programs on a mac there are basically 3 ways (there are a couple of more but ....)

crossover / wine

do not need winders
can install some extra stuff you may need for an app
not sure on fonts
cheap
performance can be slow (this is a wild card here)


Virtual Machine

need to get a copy of winders
performance can be slow
should be able to install anything you need for an app


Boot camp

easiest to set up
have to re-boot to switch operating systems
runs winders as fast as can be run on your machine
file sharing is one way unless you have a 2nd drive set up correctly



I listed them from weakest to most robust

[EllisDee37]

Here's a new version:

CharacterBuilderLite0.9.1.zip (http://www.mediafire.com/download/gkaqae6j5eaokxa/CharacterBuilderLite0.9.1.zip)

Changes:

Wingdings 3 fonts have been removed from the program. The Up/Down arrows in drop slots have been changed to userdrawn arrows, and the Left/Right arrows to expand/reduce the Details window in various screens have changed to ">>" and "<<".
The five new trees mentioned upthread were added.
Added monk form feats and the druid natural fighting feat.
Added a note to Destinies help window that twists can be reordered by dragging.
Added Tools => Trees List to make it easy to see what trees are done and what trees are not. 10 down, 38 to go.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Here's a new version:

CharacterBuilderLite0.9.1.zip (http://www.mediafire.com/download/gkaqae6j5eaokxa/CharacterBuilderLite0.9.1.zip)

Changes:


Wingdings 3 fonts have been removed from the program. The Up/Down arrows in drop slots have been changed to userdrawn arrows, and the Left/Right arrows to expand/reduce the Details window in various screens have changed to ">>" and "<<".
The five new trees mentioned upthread were added.
Added monk form feats and the druid natural fighting feat.
Added a note to Destinies help window that twists can be reordered by dragging.
Added Tools => Trees List to make it easy to see what trees are done and what trees are not. 10 down, 38 to go.



two thumbs up!

[ChicagoChris]

Here's a new version:

CharacterBuilderLite0.9.1.zip (http://www.mediafire.com/download/gkaqae6j5eaokxa/CharacterBuilderLite0.9.1.zip)

Changes:

Wingdings 3 fonts have been removed from the program. The Up/Down arrows in drop slots have been changed to userdrawn arrows, and the Left/Right arrows to expand/reduce the Details window in various screens have changed to ">>" and "<<".
The five new trees mentioned upthread were added.
Added monk form feats and the druid natural fighting feat.
Added a note to Destinies help window that twists can be reordered by dragging.
Added Tools => Trees List to make it easy to see what trees are done and what trees are not. 10 down, 38 to go.


Thanks for all the work!

Feats that can be only taken 3 times are allowed to be taken much more than that - Might need a new flag:

FeatName: Natural Fighting
Group: Heroic, Melee
Class: Druid 9
Flags: Repeat, *Max3*

or even

Flags: Repeat3

[TPICKRELL]

I spent a few minutes throwing up an existing build. I really like your data entry scheme, its very easy to enter the basic data.

A couple of possible minor issues:



Don't see Improved Martial Arts in the feat list
Isn't Stunning Fist restricted to the Monk Special feat slots?
Doesn't Vorpal strikes have a monk level requirement


Thanks for this!

Grubbby of Khyber

[Theolin]

Thanks for all the work!

Feats that can be only taken 3 times are allowed to be taken much more than that - Might need a new flag:

FeatName: Natural Fighting
Group: Heroic, Melee
Class: Druid 9
Flags: Repeat, *Max3*

or even

Flags: Repeat3

Or to make it easy
natrual fighting 1
natrual fighting 2
natrual fighting 3

and make the previous one required to take the next :)
cheezie I know ... but simple

[Ancient]

Here's a new version:

CharacterBuilderLite0.9.1.zip (http://www.mediafire.com/download/gkaqae6j5eaokxa/CharacterBuilderLite0.9.1.zip)

Changes:

Wingdings 3 fonts have been removed from the program. The Up/Down arrows in drop slots have been changed to userdrawn arrows, and the Left/Right arrows to expand/reduce the Details window in various screens have changed to ">>" and "<<".
The five new trees mentioned upthread were added.
Added monk form feats and the druid natural fighting feat.
Added a note to Destinies help window that twists can be reordered by dragging.
Added Tools => Trees List to make it easy to see what trees are done and what trees are not. 10 down, 38 to go.


Amazing stuff!

I don't see the armor and shield proficiency feats such as heavy armor. My apologies if this has already been mentioned.

[EllisDee37]

Thanks for all the work!

Feats that can be only taken 3 times are allowed to be taken much more than that - Might need a new flag:

FeatName: Natural Fighting
Group: Heroic, Melee
Class: Druid 9
Flags: Repeat, *Max3*

or even

Flags: Repeat3Flags are just for boolean values. I'm thinking I'll pull it out into its own field:

Repeat: 0 (repeats forever, like toughness, great ability, skill mastery, etc...)
Repeat: 3 (repeats up to three times)

(EDIT: Actually, I'll probably set unlimited repeat feats to 99 or something just to make the coding simpler.)

As a long-time database programmer, I must say that it is quite nice working with these ini files. Since the internal data the program uses is never saved to disk -- it's re-processed from the raw ini files each time the program starts -- I can change the underlying data structure without a care in the world. Such a luxury!


Don't see Improved Martial Arts in the feat list
Isn't Stunning Fist restricted to the Monk Special feat slots?
Doesn't Vorpal strikes have a monk level requirementHmmm, solid questions....

Improved martial arts is in there, currently set as requiring 12 monk levels and 21 character levels. Part of groups Epic and Melee. Let me know if you should be able to select it but can't.

Stunning Fist can be taken as a regular feat, yes. You may be thinking of Fists of Light/Darkness, which can only be taken as a monk class feat on level 3. If you're not mixing them up, stunning fist is just a regular bonus feat. Deflect Arrows is the special case, a bonus feat that can't be taken as a regular feat. (See the note at the bottom of this page (http://ddowiki.com/page/Martial_arts_feats).)

Good catch on Vorpal Strikes, thanks much. Just now added the Monk 12 prereq.


I don't see the armor and shield proficiency feats such as heavy armor. My apologies if this has already been mentioned.Those are selectors of the feat named "Proficiency." The proficiency feat is kind of kludged in terms of weapons, but the armor and shield aspects should be working properly.

The problem with martial weapon proficiency is that there are a ridiculous number of individual weapons. Assigning each one individually as a granted feat is prohibitively inelegant, but I don't currently support "take all selectors" logic in the feats file. Meaning I can't easily give fighters all martial proficiencies while giving other classes just a few. My solution was to code Proficiency: Martial Weapon as a single thing, and then auto-grant that one entry to the appropriate classes. For other classes, my thinking is that odds are if you're spending a feat on a martial proficiency, you're only spending ONE feat on martial proficiency. So just pick the generic feat and manually add in the weapon type in the output. That's the thought process, anyway. If that becomes untenable I may be able to just use selector 0 as "all." (Selector lists start at 1.)

EDIT: Now that I've written that out, I can't think of any reason that "selector 0" can't work as a "counts as all selectors" flag. So that's good. Look for Martial Weapon proficiency to get pulled out of the Proficiency feat and made into its own feat with a proper list of selectors in a later version. That's a fairly low priority, but it's on the list.

[TPICKRELL]

...
Improved martial arts is in there, currently set as requiring 12 monk levels and 21 character levels. Part of groups Epic and Melee. Let me know if you should be able to select it but can't.
...

Thanks, the build I used is one variant of a generic past life grinding build that I use. This variant is 8 Rogue/6 Monk/6 Fighter, so Improved Martial Arts isn't a valid feat for the build. The Show All checkbox (as opposed to the show all filter) does show it in the list.

But, if the "Show All" filtered list is supposed to be filtered down to the ones the build qualifies for, then their are some additional issues. For example:


The list that doesn't show Improved Martial arts does show all the casting meta feats like Empower Healing, Empower, Extend... And without the appropriate class levels, I don't qualify for those either.

[EllisDee37]

But, if the "Show All" filtered list is supposed to be filtered down to the ones the build qualifies for, then their are some additional issues. For example:


The list that doesn't show Improved Martial arts does show all the casting meta feats like Empower Healing, Empower, Extend... And without the appropriate class levels, I don't qualify for those either.
That sounds like a bug; the "can cast spells" logic is in the same hard-req code as required class levels: can't be dropped anywhere (as opposed to drops with errors), and won't show up unless you click the Show All checkbox.

What happens when you try to drag one of the metamagics? Do any drop slots light up?

EDIT: Oops, I do see a bug throwing together a quickie 8/6/6 rogue/fighter/monk: When I set the Show All checkbox to checked, I can see tmetamagics as expected, but it actually lets me drag them into slots without even showing an error drop, like with a feat missing a feat req. That's clearly not right. I guess for the time being, treat the Show All checkbox as a reference only; don't drag anything when it's checked TRUE. For some reason it appears to disable quite a bit of error checking.

Thanks much for the head's up.

[TPICKRELL]

That sounds like a bug; the "can cast spells" logic is in the same hard-req code as required class levels: can't be dropped anywhere (as opposed to drops with errors), and won't show up unless you click the Show All checkbox.

What happens when you try to drag one of the metamagics? Do any drop slots light up?

Out of curiosity, did the build at any point have spellcasting class levels? The logic underneath the hood on how to handle changes to the classes in the overview screen is fairly complex, and could easily have bugs. So like if you started with, say, artificer levels, then switched it out to all non-casting classes, I wouldn't be surprised if there's some lingering "can cast spells" flags left over.

If I drag empower healing, all of the general class feat slots open up and I was able to drop it on the level 6 general feat slot.

And no. I selected Rogue/Monk/Fighter as my 3 classes first then played around with the leveling order, but I never selected any other classes.

The meta feats also persist across sessions, so closing down the planner and restarting it then loading the file still shows the meta feats.

[EllisDee37]

I've never played a Half-Elf, and don't even own Half-Elf so I can't test in-game. What do the racial core selectors look like when you first click on them to choose something? The "Elven Dexterity or Human Adaptability" ones, and the "Elven Accuracy or Human Versatility" ones?

Looking at wiki they appear to be a two-level selector, which would be unique in all the trees. Can someone post a screen shot of what pops up when you click on them before you actually make the choice?

[Ayseifn]

Works well under Wine too, just need to install vb6run and smooth sailing.

It's great to finally have a program to make builds with so thank you very much for the work.

[Vargouille]

Cool stuff, still!


Two more trees are in: Spellsinger and Warchanter. Looks like it's around 30 minutes per tree.

Such jealousy. ;)


Only *mumble mumble* trees left...*cries*.

Ah, memories.

[EllisDee37]

Works well under Wine too, just need to install vb6run and smooth sailing.That's awesome. I know next to nothing about Linux, and had never even heard of Wine. So it's pretty cool that it works.

[Ctype]

Looks very good - thank you for your effort.

Im very happy to see that the one thing that annoyed me in the other builder works in yours.

That is skillpoints when tome is applied. If you start with even int you should get a skillpoint extra att lvl 7 when +2 tome kicks in and another one at 15 when +4 tome kicks in. Never worked in the other builder but it does in this one. I have only tested the program for a few minutes and i will be back with more feedback when i find something else.

Keep up the good work.

[mna]

That's awesome. I know next to nothing about Linux, and had never even heard of Wine. So it's pretty cool that it works.

Oh yes, starts and seems to work after installing vb6run. Though, crashed with "subscript out of range" when I tried to take Graceful Death on a Tempest/Warpriest (using my 12/7/1 build to test this, Ubuntu 12.04 / Wine 1.6.1). Does that happen on Windows too?

Still much better than Ron's planner, been annoying to have to find Windows somewhere just to use that.


I can't seem to take a lesser dragonmark, either. When I load your kensei warpriest file which already has that, it is there initially, but if I remove it I can't get it back.

[Failedlegend]

Still much better than Ron's planner, been annoying to have to find Windows somewhere just to use that.


Please don't disrespect Ron, even if LSDs planner turns out to be 1000x better Ron was and always will be worthy of thanks and praise of the entire DDO Community & Staff. Beside IIRC LSD said Ron helped her (to what degree I can't remember)

[EllisDee37]

Please don't disrespect Ron, even if LSDs planner turns out to be 1000x better Ron was and always will be worthy of thanks and praise of the entire DDO Community & Staff. Beside IIRC LSD said Ron helped her (to what degree I can't remember)To clarify, he's not saying Ron's planner is bad. He's saying he couldn't run Ron's planner at all because it doesn't run on Wine.

The "much better" part isn't referring to the planners themselves, it's referring to the idea that mine will run on his computer. To run Ron's planner he has to find another computer to use that has Windows installed.

To your larger point, I strongly agree. No disrespect to Ron's planner or the team behind it. They've consistently done great work and I look forward to version 5.

[EllisDee37]

Oh yes, starts and seems to work after installing vb6run. Though, crashed with "subscript out of range" when I tried to take Graceful Death on a Tempest/Warpriest (using my 12/7/1 build to test this, Ubuntu 12.04 / Wine 1.6.1). Does that happen on Windows too?That's a bug for everyone, not just you.

Right now, any abilities that point to other trees will throw a "subscript out of range" error if the tree it's pointing to isn't part of your build. In this example, Deflect Arrows (which is the next core after Graceful Death, and gets verified once you add Graceful Death) points to the Swashbuckler tree, which isn't part of your build. So it throws the error.

To fix it yourself for the time being, search Enhancements.txt for "Graceful Death", then in the Deflect Arrows entry right after it, delete the line that looks something like:

None: Swashbuckler Tier 2: Deflect Arrows


I can't seem to take a lesser dragonmark, either. When I load your kensei warpriest file which already has that, it is there initially, but if I remove it I can't get it back.If you mean the feat, it's named Least Dragonmark, and will have selectors based on your race. One thing to try to see if it appears for you is to click on the feat slot where you want to put it, which filters the list to show feats that go in that slot. If it still doesn't appear, try checking the Show All checkbox.

[EllisDee37]

That "foreign tree" bug is all fixed now, not sure when I'll upload a new version. I wasn't planning to for a couple days, after I had added a bunch more trees, but that bug will infect quite a few trees so sooner is probably better than later. Figure tomorrow morning, or maybe early afternoon. I wanna see how many trees I can get done.

In the meantime, any time you run into one of those Subscript out of Range errors when enhancements point to other trees, you can patch it yourself by deleting the foreign tree pointer out of Enhancements.txt.

[TPICKRELL]

Looks very good - thank you for your effort.

Im very happy to see that the one thing that annoyed me in the other builder works in yours.

That is skillpoints when tome is applied. If you start with even int you should get a skillpoint extra att lvl 7 when +2 tome kicks in and another one at 15 when +4 tome kicks in. Never worked in the other builder but it does in this one. I have only tested the program for a few minutes and i will be back with more feedback when i find something else.

Keep up the good work.

Just a point of clarification. Tomes work differently on the life you first eat the tome from when they are auto applied in a subsequent life.

Ron's planner works properly for the life in which you eat the tome, as the tome has a min level that requires you to have taken that level before you can eat the tome. On subsequent lives the tome is auto applied by the system at the beginning of the leveling process, so you can get an extra skill point when the INT tome kicks in and makes your INT even.

While auto-applied tomes are the norm now days, they were not possible for most of the life of Ron's planner, because you lost all of your tomes when you TR'd...

Also, there is a fairly easy work around for this. If you are going to get the tome benefits from an auto applied tome from a previous life, just tell Ron's planner that you ate the tome one level earlier. IE tell it that you ate auto-applied tomes at levels 2/6/10/14 and/or 18 instead of 3/7/11/15/19.

[EllisDee37]

As I enter the Divine Disciple tree, what rules should I enforce for efficient metamagics? Should I make them anti-reqs with all other trees' versions of the same? Or just ignore foreign trees?

I think there's a couple that still stack with each other in-game.

[Ctype]

Just a point of clarification. Tomes work differently on the life you first eat the tome from when they are auto applied in a subsequent life.

Ron's planner works properly for the life in which you eat the tome, as the tome has a min level that requires you to have taken that level before you can eat the tome. On subsequent lives the tome is auto applied by the system at the beginning of the leveling process, so you can get an extra skill point when the INT tome kicks in and makes your INT even.

While auto-applied tomes are the norm now days, they were not possible for most of the life of Ron's planner, because you lost all of your tomes when you TR'd...

Also, there is a fairly easy work around for this. If you are going to get the tome benefits from an auto applied tome from a previous life, just tell Ron's planner that you ate the tome one level earlier. IE tell it that you ate auto-applied tomes at levels 2/6/10/14 and/or 18 instead of 3/7/11/15/19.

You are absolutely correct ofc. Good clarification. And its not that hard to handle 2 extra skillpoints over 20 levels - just a little thing that was annoying for me. And I should also say that i love Rons planner - no critic there - its awesome. But with every thing you love there is always something small that irks you hehe.

I also lovet that there finally is an alternative that look nice.

[UurlockYgmeov]

As I enter the Divine Disciple tree, what rules should I enforce for efficient metamagics? Should I make them anti-reqs with all other trees' versions of the same? Or just ignore foreign trees?

I think there's a couple that still stack with each other in-game.

KISS - minimalist design approach.

[Xionanx]

Like the way that video looks. Looking forward to using this.

[EllisDee37]

Quick update on trees, have recently entered:

Harper Agent
Halfling (was connected to Harper)
Vanguard
Knight of the Chalice
Sacred Defender
Divine Disciple
Radiant Servant

[skorpeon]

Quick update on trees, have recently entered:

Harper Agent
Halfling (was connected to Harper)
Vanguard
Knight of the Chalice
Sacred Defender
Divine Disciple
Radiant Servant

good work, now would probably a good time to download this and do some testing.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Quick update on trees, have recently entered:

Harper Agent
Halfling (was connected to Harper)
Vanguard
Knight of the Chalice
Sacred Defender
Divine Disciple
Radiant Servant
+7!!!


good work, now would probably a good time to download this and do some testing.
patience grasshopper!

[MagicalDad]

I've been working on a character builder since Christmas, and it's coming along pretty well so far. Adopting a minimalist philosophy -- thus the "Lite" -- it's geared toward people with a decent working knowledge of the game. Truth be told, I envision using it with ddowiki open in another window.

That looks great - would love to give it a spin. Hmm, could integrate w/ DDOWiki - instead of having to cache all the feat/ability descriptions, just include a DDOWiki link (page#section), and could pop a small HTML preview window on hover that would fetch from DDOWiki? Just a thought.

[UurlockYgmeov]

That looks great - would love to give it a spin. Hmm, could integrate w/ DDOWiki - instead of having to cache all the feat/ability descriptions, just include a DDOWiki link (page#section), and could pop a small HTML preview window on hover that would fetch from DDOWiki? Just a thought.

interesting idea.

[EllisDee37]

Hmm, could integrate w/ DDOWiki - instead of having to cache all the feat/ability descriptions, just include a DDOWiki link (page#section), and could pop a small HTML preview window on hover that would fetch from DDOWiki? Just a thought.That's not a bad idea. At very least I could offer links to the feat/spell/tree/destiny page of whatever ability you clicked on. Maybe add a link to the details window.

[Alkusoittow]

That's not a bad idea. At very least I could offer links to the feat/spell/tree/destiny page of whatever ability you clicked on. Maybe add a link to the details window.

If you want a beta tester or want some developmental help, let me know. I'd be happy to look at it and provide feedback. I was a programmer before I decided to go back to school (current a grad student), and this looks like a nice, fun departure from the norm during spring break (next week). Let me know!

[mna]

Please don't disrespect Ron, even if LSDs planner turns out to be 1000x better Ron was and always will be worthy of thanks and praise of the entire DDO Community & Staff. Beside IIRC LSD said Ron helped her (to what degree I can't remember)

Oh, I've used it, and it is a very good tool - as long as you have a Windows system to run it on.


To clarify, he's not saying Ron's planner is bad. He's saying he couldn't run Ron's planner at all because it doesn't run on Wine.

The "much better" part isn't referring to the planners themselves, it's referring to the idea that mine will run on his computer. To run Ron's planner he has to find another computer to use that has Windows installed.

To your larger point, I strongly agree. No disrespect to Ron's planner or the team behind it. They've consistently done great work and I look forward to version 5.

Yes, I'm looking forward to that one too - two of the kids' "games PCs" do still have Windows on them (even though at least one of them runs, DDO included, much better on Linux than on Windows), and they've been using Ron's planner by themselves already. So it's not like I wouldn't have access to it when really needed, in fact... but a lot of the rest of the DDO-on-Linux crowd don't.



(Lesser Dragonmark problem when running on Wine)


If you mean the feat, it's named Least Dragonmark, and will have selectors based on your race. One thing to try to see if it appears for you is to click on the feat slot where you want to put it, which filters the list to show feats that go in that slot. If it still doesn't appear, try checking the Show All checkbox.

No, the feat is just fine, and racial tier 1 Dragonmark Focus enhancement seems to be fine too, and the Greater Dragonmark too actually but...

I just can't take the Lesser Dragonmark enhancement. Doesn't give a list of dragonmarks in the "Selectors" box at all, unlike DM Focus and Greater DM where I can see a list of the four that are available for humans. Show All doesn't help. (Well, except that I had to use it to check the Greater DM.)


Sort of funny if that ends up being a Wine bug.

Cannot usefully compare to the previous version (0.9) due to the font thing.

[mna]

(Lesser Dragonmark problem when running on Wine)


No, the feat is just fine, and racial tier 1 Dragonmark Focus enhancement seems to be fine too, and the Greater Dragonmark too actually but...

I just can't take the Lesser Dragonmark enhancement. Doesn't give a list of dragonmarks in the "Selectors" box at all, unlike DM Focus and Greater DM where I can see a list of the four that are available for humans. Show All doesn't help. (Well, except that I had to use it to check the Greater DM.)


Sort of funny if that ends up being a Wine bug.

Cannot usefully compare to the previous version (0.9) due to the font thing.

... anyone else test this?

Since, well, I tweaked things a bit and got it to work...

I added a single space on line 427 in Data/Enhancements.txt.



~/.wine/drive_c/Program Files/CharacterBuilderLite/Data$ rcsdiff ./Enhancements.txt
================================================== =================
RCS file: ./RCS/Enhancements.txt,v
retrieving revision 1.1
diff -r1.1 ./Enhancements.txt
427c427
< SharedSelector: Tier 1: Dragonmark Focus
---
> Shared Selector: Tier 1: Dragonmark Focus


I note that Data/ReadMe.txt says the version without the space is correct, and it occurs several times in Data/Feats.txt too and works there, so there might be something funny going on in here.

[EllisDee37]

Technically, what's happening is that the space between "Shared" and "Selector" makes it an unrecognized line, and thus ignored. You aren't supposed to be able to choose from all four; you can only choose options where you actually took the dragonmark feat, and then you are locked into a single line from there. So the greater dragonmark (which had the incorrect space between words) is incorrectly showing all four options when it should only be showing the single option that corresponds with the choices you made in tier 1 and 2.

I'm much more of a programmer than a data entry guy, so it's unsurprising to see errors in the data file. There have been countless times I typed in "Shared Selector" only to realize afterward that I accidentally put in the space.

[EllisDee37]

I got four more trees in, totaling 21, but I'm trying to get a "View Data" screen in place to make it easier to verify data, as opposed to having to create a legitimate build before you can see the trees. So likely tomorrow for the next update.

[UurlockYgmeov]

I got four more trees in, totaling 21, but I'm trying to get a "View Data" screen in place to make it easier to verify data, as opposed to having to create a legitimate build before you can see the trees. So likely tomorrow for the next update.


sweet!

[Failedlegend]

That looks great - would love to give it a spin. Hmm, could integrate w/ DDOWiki - instead of having to cache all the feat/ability descriptions, just include a DDOWiki link (page#section), and could pop a small HTML preview window on hover that would fetch from DDOWiki? Just a thought.


That's not a bad idea. At very least I could offer links to the feat/spell/tree/destiny page of whatever ability you clicked on. Maybe add a link to the details window.

This would actually be really cool but what would it do if your not connected to the net? (I often use Ron's Planner at my buddy's cottage or at say the bus stop)

If the answer is nothing than thats cool, the issue is if it crashes or something.

[mna]

Technically, what's happening is that the space between "Shared" and "Selector" makes it an unrecognized line, and thus ignored. You aren't supposed to be able to choose from all four; you can only choose options where you actually took the dragonmark feat, and then you are locked into a single line from there. So the greater dragonmark (which had the incorrect space between words) is incorrectly showing all four options when it should only be showing the single option that corresponds with the choices you made in tier 1 and 2.

I'm much more of a programmer than a data entry guy, so it's unsurprising to see errors in the data file. There have been countless times I typed in "Shared Selector" only to realize afterward that I accidentally put in the space.


... I find showing all of them to be more useful than showing none, anyway. (The greater DM also shows none if I remove the space. That I tried first, actually.)
The correct functionality, showing exactly one SLA for both lesser and greater DM, I haven't seen yet. Did that part work correctly on Windows in the uploaded 0.9.1 version?



I did get it to display exactly one lesser and greater dragonmark each, by house names but not the SLAs they grant, by removing the erroneous space and then dropping the override name lines completely from both lesser and greater DMs.


Therefore it looks like there might be something funny in how this thing parses the "override" Selector: line in a SharedSelector: context.


Edit: I edited the Deflect Arrows reference out of Swashbuckler so I can test that tree too, and it looks like it may have the same issue. Swashbuckling Style 2 does not offer any selectors at all.

In this version at least... waiting for the next version to be tested. ;-)

[EllisDee37]

Hmmm, that could very well be an issue with selector overrides. Swashbuckling Style II is the poster child for the functionality: A selector list that is determined by what you chose in another ability's selector list (Swashbuckling Style I) but which has its own, unique selector names. I'll take a look at that before I post the next update.

View data is coming along well enough that I'm tossing in a quickie search functionality. The idea being you type in some text, and it gives you a list of all feats/enhancements/destinies that contain that text, either in the name, the abbreviation, or in any of its selectors. That way, for instance, if you wanted to know if martial weapon proficiency is in there, you could type in "martial" and it would give you the following list:

Feat: Improved Martial Arts
Feat: Proficiency: Martial Weapon
Fatesinger Tier 4: Echoes: Martial
Kensei Tier 0: Kensei Focus: Martial Arts

[Ancient]

Hmmm, that could very well be an issue with selector overrides. Swashbuckling Style II is the poster child for the functionality: A selector list that is determined by what you chose in another ability's selector list (Swashbuckling Style I) but which has its own, unique selector names. I'll take a look at that before I post the next update.

View data is coming along well enough that I'm tossing in a quickie search functionality. The idea being you type in some text, and it gives you a list of all feats/enhancements/destinies that contain that text, either in the name, the abbreviation, or in any of its selectors. That way, for instance, if you wanted to know if martial weapon proficiency is in there, you could type in "martial" and it would give you the following list:

Feat: Improved Martial Arts
Feat: Proficiency: Martial Weapon
Fatesinger Tier 4: Echoes: Martial
Kensei Tier 0: Kensei Focus: Martial Arts

This is sounding awesome! I have a new(ish) build I'd like to write up using this. Any chance you could put a link in the first post of the thread to your latest version?

[EllisDee37]

Any chance you could put a link in the first post of the thread to your latest version?I've been thinking of cannibalizing the OP to just make this the full release thread instead of starting a new one. This forum moves so slowly* that it seems pointless to spend two threads on the front page on this. Once we get to the first full release with all data entered I'll ask the mods to remove the (in development) part of the title, but in the meantime I see no harm in revamping the OP sooner than that.

I expect to post the next new version within the next few hours; I'll update the OP then.

*Right now, the oldest thread on the first page is five months old.

[Ancient]

Once we get to the first full release with all data entered I'll ask the mods to remove the (in development) part of the title

1. Edit Post
2. Go Advanced
3. Profit??? (or just edit the title)

[EllisDee37]

1. Edit Post
2. Go Advanced
3. Profit??? (or just edit the title)We can't edit thread titles; only mods can.

[mna]

We can't edit thread titles; only mods can.

Indeed, including that one embarrassing misspelling of mine from 2013... I can edit the post title just fine but the changes don't seem to be propagated to thread title.

[Ancient]

Indeed, including that one embarrassing misspelling of mine from 2013... I can edit the post title just fine but the changes don't seem to be propagated to thread title.

One of my best threads... was all about a typo in the title... BYOU :) Yeah, I'm easily amused.

[UurlockYgmeov]

We can't edit thread titles; only mods can.

EllisDee37 - would you add a link to the latest version in your signature?

[EllisDee37]

EllisDee37 - would you add a link to the latest version in your signature?I'll redo my signature once we get to 1.0.


Apologies for the delay; I completely fell down the rabbit hole with the View Data screen. Testing the screen kept turning up minor errors in the datafile, which I corrected but for a solid couple hours I don't know if I was testing the screen or actually just checking the data. heh.

The main delay was that it did uncover a pretty serious error in how pointers are processed, particularly apparent with shared and exclusive selectors. That's all squared away now. I'd like to get in 3 more trees before uploading to get it to 50%. Currently it stands at 21 entered, 27 to go.

[EllisDee37]

New version is up. All links and release notes are now edited into the OP, and going forward that's where I'll manage all official updates.

Tools => View Data is super helpful for identifying any problems in the datafile. I encourage people to look closely at any trees you use and let me know of any errors in the data, large or small. Misspellings, missing prereqs, wrong cost; whatever. All data error reports are welcome. In some cases I may have chosen a name that doesn't seem right; suggestions welcome. (I particularly dislike the names I bizarrely chose for Fatesinger Echoes abilities. Those will change.)


24 trees done, woohoo!

[EllisDee37]

Note on Harper Agent:

I don't currently support any kind of class tree except standard ones. This means the program will think Harper is a native class for whichever class has the most levels in your build. Right now this mostly applies to the core abilities; if you're multiclass, you won't be able to take the capstone, etc...

This will change when I add support for the Elf - AA tree. Adding the two new tree types won't be particularly difficult, but for now I'm trying to stay focused on tree entry.

[UurlockYgmeov]

I'll redo my signature once we get to 1.0.


Apologies for the delay; I completely fell down the rabbit hole with the View Data screen. Testing the screen kept turning up minor errors in the datafile, which I corrected but for a solid couple hours I don't know if I was testing the screen or actually just checking the data. heh.

The main delay was that it did uncover a pretty serious error in how pointers are processed, particularly apparent with shared and exclusive selectors. That's all squared away now. I'd like to get in 3 more trees before uploading to get it to 50%. Currently it stands at 21 entered, 27 to go.

Sweet!

Been there done that. Once went on a two week limited sleep Chopin+Red Bull+Absinthe power programing bing - don't remember anything - but certainly was the tightest code I've ever seen. :D

+21!


New version is up. All links and release notes are now edited into the OP, and going forward that's where I'll manage all official updates.

Tools => View Data is super helpful for identifying any problems in the datafile. I encourage people to look closely at any trees you use and let me know of any errors in the data, large or small. Misspellings, missing prereqs, wrong cost; whatever. All data error reports are welcome. In some cases I may have chosen a name that doesn't seem right; suggestions welcome. (I particularly dislike the names I bizarrely chose for Fatesinger Echoes abilities. Those will change.)


24 trees done, woohoo!

Bizarre names seldom change (hidden ones at that) - they have a habit of becoming easter eggs. :D


Note on Harper Agent:

I don't currently support any kind of class tree except standard ones. This means the program will think Harper is a native class for whichever class has the most levels in your build. Right now this mostly applies to the core abilities; if you're multiclass, you won't be able to take the capstone, etc...

This will change when I add support for the Elf - AA tree. Adding the two new tree types won't be particularly difficult, but for now I'm trying to stay focused on tree entry.

sweet! keep on the excellent work!

[EllisDee37]

Nobody has mentioned anything about display issues. If the program doesn't look like it does in the demo videos, or if there's any squished/cut off/blocked text, let me know.

I'm also still quite curious how it looks in 1024x768. Do the dialogs fill the screen? Can you even see the output on the main window when a dialog is open? Or are the windows smaller, and if so, is the text super tiny? Screenshots welcome.

[mna]

Nobody has mentioned anything about display issues. If the program doesn't look like it does in the demo videos, or if there's any squished/cut off/blocked text, let me know.

I'm also still quite curious how it looks in 1024x768. Do the dialogs fill the screen? Can you even see the output on the main window when a dialog is open? Or are the windows smaller, and if so, is the text super tiny? Screenshots welcome.

I suppose I'll need to watch the demo videos then... but I just tried it in 1024x768 and it was usable, though crowded with multiple dialogs open.

I'll email you a couple of screenshots... not sure how valid they'll be for the typical Windows case but anyway.


Haven't had much time to test this new version yet, but at least the human dragonmark and swashbuckler style work now.

[Musashiclaw]

I just used it.

Worked Great.
Missing some Enhancement lines but no biggie there.

Now to find an equipment builder!
So I can build out what equipment to use.

[EllisDee37]

I'll email you a couple of screenshots... not sure how valid they'll be for the typical Windows case but anyway.Thanks much. Based on your screenshots, it doesn't look too terrible in 1024x768. As for having multiple windows open at once, yeah, that probably won't work very well on a smaller resolution.

It's worth pointing out that I've devoted no effort to make having multiple dialogs open functional, and in many cases it likely won't be. Each screen refreshes the data it uses only when it opens. So, for example, if you open the overview screen and feat screen at the same time, then change your class split in a way that changes your feats, the feat screen won't be aware of those changes.

EDIT: I found another bug in foreign tree pointers. I corrected it but am hoping to finish the trees before uploading a new version. (3 down, 21 to go.) You can see it clear as day with the Kensei Warpriest build: Go to enhancements and click the slot that has the "Tactics" ability. That points to the Half-Elf tree, but does so incorrectly and thus throws a runtime error, crashing the program. The bug won't always throw an error, but may sometimes just point to a seemingly random ability in the other tree.

[EllisDee37]

According to wiki:

Nature's Warrior Tier 4: Essence of the Turtle
Requires Killer

What's Killer?

EDIT: And geez, I need a dictionary for this tree. Shrike? Celerity?

[mna]

According to wiki:

Nature's Warrior Tier 4: Essence of the Turtle
Requires Killer

What's Killer?

Error in the wiki, in this case.

Essence of the Turtle doesn't seem to have any "extra" requirements beyond Druid 4 and 20 points in tree, on live.


EDIT: And geez, I need a dictionary for this tree. Shrike? Celerity?


]

Shrike \Shrike\, n. [Akin to Icel. skr[imac]kja a shrieker, the
shrike, and E. shriek; cf. AS. scr[imac]c a thrush. See
{Shriek}, v. i.] (Zool.)
Any one of numerous species of oscinine birds of the family
{Laniidae}, having a strong hooked bill, toothed at the tip.
Most shrikes are insectivorous, but the common European gray
shrike ({Lanius excubitor}), the great northern shrike
({Lanius borealis}), and several others, kill mice, small
birds, etc., and often impale them on thorns, and are, on
that account called also {butcher birds}. See under
{Butcher}.
[1913 Webster]
...



]

Celerity \Ce*ler"i*ty\, n. [L. celeritas, from celer swiftm
speedy: sf. F. c['e]l['e]rit['e].]
Rapidity of motion; quickness; swiftness.
[1913 Webster]

Time, with all its celerity, moves slowly to him whose
whole employment is to watch its flight. --Johnson.
[1913 Webster]


No idea where to find a Windows package of this thing, it "just works" for me from the Linux command prompt ;-)

[EllisDee37]

Boy, those sorcerer savant trees just flew by. Copy and paste was never so useful.

Now that I'm up to Eldritch Knight, I notice that sorcerer and wizard technically have different versions of Eldritch Knight. (Sorcerer version offers Str, Dex and Cha, Wizard offers Str, Dex and Int.) Does that mean they're actually different trees, like a 10/10 wizard/sorc could take them both and double up on everything in the tree? Or do they lock each other out?

If they lock each other out, my inclination is to just make them a single tree and have the stat options be Str, Dex, Int and Cha.

(EDIT: 12 trees done today, 12 to go!)

[LeslieWest_GuitarGod]

EllisDee what great work! Will definitely load up when I find some time and throw some builds at it.

[EllisDee37]

All trees are in, woohoo! I even added the Elf-AA tree, but now I have to finish the logic to handle global trees, racial class trees, and tree lockouts. (Savants, Elf-AA.) Was hoping to get something uploaded tonight, but looks like tomorrow.

I'm also going to take a look at the Show All bug, where if you check it you can take feats that you shouldn't be able to. Hopefully that doesn't turn into a major ordeal. Assuming all goes well, I'm hoping to upload a tentatively complete version -- barring the inevitable bugs -- tomorrow (Monday) afternoon or evening.

[UurlockYgmeov]

awesome.

looking forward to the next update!

[bucyrus]

Great tool - absolutely love it.

Chasing data errors - it looks like the Sacred Defender Tree is missing the T1 Extra Lay on Hands

[Samones]

Boy, those sorcerer savant trees just flew by. Copy and paste was never so useful.

Now that I'm up to Eldritch Knight, I notice that sorcerer and wizard technically have different versions of Eldritch Knight. (Sorcerer version offers Str, Dex and Cha, Wizard offers Str, Dex and Int.) Does that mean they're actually different trees, like a 10/10 wizard/sorc could take them both and double up on everything in the tree? Or do they lock each other out?

If they lock each other out, my inclination is to just make them a single tree and have the stat options be Str, Dex, Int and Cha.

(EDIT: 12 trees done today, 12 to go!)

I just rolled up a character and they do lock each other out.

[EllisDee37]

I just rolled up a character and they do lock each other out.Sweet, thanks much for testing that for me.

The single unified Eldritch Knight tree is a go, then, offering Strength, Dexterity, Intelligence and Charisma as the stat choices. I'll add an exception noting Int is only from the wizard tree and Cha from the Sorc tree and call it good enough.


Chasing data errors - it looks like the Sacred Defender Tree is missing the T1 Extra Lay on HandsThanks much, all data error reports appreciated. It was indeed missing, so I added it.

[EllisDee37]

Version 0.9.3 is up.

It's possible that existing paladin builds might throw an error when you try to load it due to getting a new enhancement (extra lay on hands) in the sacred defender tree. I will be adding error checking to handle this kind of thing automatically, but it's not in there yet.

My advice is to edit any existing paladin builds to reset the sacred defender tree before downloading the new version, or you might have to recreate the entire build from scratch. Of course, you can always revert to 0.9.2 to fix it via the "All Downloads" link in the OP.

[Ancient]

Under the destiny feats, where do I find epic skill focus spellcraft? Or any epic skill focus for that matter?

(I'm not assuming it isn't there... but I was not able to find it).

---------

Edit: Also, the enhancements are not showing up in the build export until I spend all 80 points. I had hoped to spend 77 and indicate the last 3 could be spent however.

Edit: Edit: I'm also not seeing my spells. I only had 15 levels of wizard, I wonder if this is because I don't have "all" my spells assigned?

Edit: Edit: Edit: When I didn't pick a destiny feat, it left my feats out of the export. I'm noticing a pattern.

[UurlockYgmeov]

just posted first rough build on forums using this...

awesome. some slight edits (spaces *insert raspberry here* and had to manually add twists)

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php/457067-Ozymoronic-Barbarian

[Failedlegend]

just posted first rough build on forums using this...


Yours seems alot more messy than LSDs...did you change settings olr something


Here's the actual output from the demos:

Kensei Warpriest
12/8 Fighter/Cleric
Chaotic Good Human


Level Order

1. Fighter. . . . .6. Fighter . . . .11. Cleric . . . . 16. Fighter
2. Fighter. . . . .7. Cleric. . . . .12. Fighter. . . . 17. Fighter
3. Cleric . . . . .8. Fighter . . . .13. Cleric . . . . 18. Fighter
4. Fighter. . . . .9. Cleric. . . . .14. Fighter. . . . 19. Fighter
5. Cleric . . . . 10. Fighter . . . .15. Cleric . . . . 20. Cleric. . . . .


Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt . . 32pt. . .34pt . . 36pt. . .Level Up
. . . . . . . .---- . . ----. . .---- . . ----. . .--------
Strength. . . . 16. . . .18 . . . 18. . . .18 . . . 4: STR
Dexterity . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . 8: STR
Constitution. . 14. . . .14 . . . 14. . . .16 . . .12: STR
Intelligence. . 12. . . .12 . . . 12. . . .12 . . .16: STR
Wisdom. . . . . 10. . . . 8 . . . 10. . . . 8 . . .20: STR
Charisma. . . . 14. . . .14 . . . 14. . . .14 . . .24: STR
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: STR

Skills
. . . . . F .F. C .F. C .F. C .F. C .F. C .F. C .F. C .F. F .F. F .C
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Concent . . .1. 4 . . 3 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Heal. . . 2 . . . . . 1 . . 3 . . 3 . . 3 . . 3 . . 3 . . . .1. . .3. 22
UMD . . . 2 . . . .1. . .1. . .1. . .1. . .1. . .1. . .1. 1 . . 1 . . 11
Jump. . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Balance . 1 .1. . .1. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .3
Tumble. . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .16 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4. 4 .4


Feats

.1 : Power Attack
.1H: Least Dragonmark of Passage
.1F: Cleave
.2F: Stunning Blow
.3 : Weapon Focus: Slashing
.3C: Follower of the Sovereign Host
.6 : Great Cleave
.6F: Weapon Specialization: Slashing
.9 : Empower Healing Spell
10F: Improved Critical: Slashing
12 : Extend Spell
13C: Unyielding Sovereignty
14F: Greater Weapon Focus: Slashing
15 : Two Handed Fighting
17F: Improved Two Handed Fighting
18 : Greater Two Handed Fighting
19F: Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing
21E: Overwhelming Critical
24E: Great Ability: Strength
26D: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27E: Blinding Speed
28D: Perfect Two Handed Fighting


Spells

Cure Light Wounds, Nightshield, Protection From Evil, Divine Favor, <Any>, <Any>
Cure Moderate Wounds, Resist Energy, Eagle's Splendor, <Any>, <Any>
Cure Serious Wounds, Magic Circle Against Evil, Protection from Energy, Prayer, <Any>
Cure Critical Wounds, Death Ward, Freedom of Movement, Divine Power

Destiny

Legendary Dreadnought
Legendary Tactics III, Extra Action Boost III, Strength
Momentum Swing III, Imp. Power Attack, Strength
Lay Waste
Volcano's Edge
Devastating Critical
Master's Blitz, Headman's Chop
Twists of Fate (15 fate points)
Sense Weakness (Tier 4 Fury)
Rejuvenation Cocoon (Tier 1 Primal)
Brace for Impact (Tier 1 Sentinel)





Oxymoronic Barbarian11/7/2 Barbarian/Wizard/Rogue
Chaotic Good Shadar-kai


Level Order
1. Rogue. . . . . .6. Barbarian . . .11. Wizard . . . . 16. Barbarian
2. Barbarian. . . .7. Wizard. . . . .12. Barbarian. . . 17. Barbarian
3. Wizard . . . . .8. Wizard. . . . .13. Wizard . . . . 18. Barbarian
4. Barbarian. . . .9. Wizard. . . . .14. Barbarian. . . 19. Barbarian
5. Wizard . . . . 10. Barbarian . . .15. Rogue. . . . . 20. Barbarian


Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt . . 34pt. . .36pt . . Tome. . .Level Up
. . . . . . . .---- . . ----. . .---- . . ----. . .--------
Strength. . . . 13. . . .15 . . . 15. . . .+6 . . . 4: INT
Dexterity . . . 10. . . .10 . . . 12. . . .+6 . . . 8: INT
Constitution. . 17. . . .17 . . . 17. . . .+6 . . .12: INT
Intelligence. . 16. . . .17 . . . 17. . . .+6 . . .16: INT
Wisdom. . . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . .8. . . .+6 . . .20: INT
Charisma. . . . .6. . . . 6 . . . .6. . . .+6 . . .24: INT
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: INT


Skills
. . . . . R .B. W .B. W .B. W .W. W .B. W .B. W .B. R .B. B .B. B .B
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Spot. . . 4 .1. 1 .½. ½ .½. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
UMD . . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Repair. . 4 . . . . . 1 . . 1 .1. 2 .½. . .1. 1 .1. 1 .1½ 1½ 1½ 1½ 1½ 21
Disable . 4 .½. ½ .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. ½ .1. ½ .1. ½ .1. 3 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 21
Search. . 4 .1. . .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 20
Open Lo . 4 . . . .½. . .½. . .½. . . . . . . . . . 4 . . . . . . .½. 10
Listen. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Balance . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Jump. . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Haggle. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Bluff . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .3
Tumble. . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .44 .7. 5 .8. 6 .8. 6 .7. 7 .9. 7 10. 8 10 14 11 11 11 11 12


Feats
.1. . . . : Power Attack
.3. . . . : Cleave
.3 Wizard : Empower Spell
.6. . . . : Great Cleave
.9. . . . : Two Handed Fighting
.9 Wizard : Mental Toughness
12. . . . : Improved Critical: Slashing
15. . . . : Insightful Reflexes
18. . . . : Improved Two Handed Fighting
21 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
24 Epic . : Greater Two Handed Fighting
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting
27 Epic . : Maximize Spell
28 Destiny: Mass Frog


Spells
. .1. Expeditious Retreat, Jump, Shield, Sonic Blast, Grease
. .2. Electric Loop, Lesser Death Aura(swap out later), Web, Blur
. .3. Displacement, Haste, Rage
. .4. Dimension Door, Death Aura (swap out later)


Enhancements
Occult Slayer (7 AP)
. . • Weapon Bond
. . . . .1. Extend Rage III, Ear Smash III


Archmage (11 AP)
. . • Invisibility, Blur, Displacement
. . . . .1. Energy of the Scholar III, Wand and Scroll Mastery II


Eldritch Knight (1 AP)
. . • Eldritch Strike


Ravager (38 AP)
. . • Furious Rage, Pain Touch, Demoralizing Success
. . . . .1. Ritual Scarring III, Hate III, Do You Like Pain? III, Barbarian Power Attack III, Hardy Rage III
. . . . .2. I Like Pain III, Melee Power Boost III
. . . . .3. Slaughter III
. . . . .4. Laughter, I Hit Back! III
. . . . .5. Blood Strength, Critical Rage II


Harper Agent (23 AP)
. . • Agent of Good I, Intelligence
. . . . .1. Harper Enchantment, Strategic Combat
. . . . .2. Versatile Adept III, Know the Angles I
. . . . .3. Highly Skilled III, Versatile Adept III, Strategic Combat, Intelligence
. . . . .4. Intelligence


Twists of Fate
1. Volcano's Edge
2. Lay Waste
3. Momentum Swing
5 Rejuvenation Cocoon

[Ancient]

I just posted an update to NovaSoul on the latest variant I was playing. Your utility made it a lot more fun and easy to throw a readable build up without spending a huge amount of time trying to get the formatting right. Not only is it less time... it looks better.

Amazing work! Thank you.

I added a 15 wiz/3 fighter/2 FVS variant I call the Warthog. (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5518704#post5518704)

[UurlockYgmeov]

Yours seems alot more messy than LSDs...did you change settings olr something.

*doh* forgot to use the bbcode version - fixed.

[EllisDee37]

Under the destiny feats, where do I find epic skill focus spellcraft? Or any epic skill focus for that matter?Epic Skill Focus is in the group "Destiny", as a single feat with each skill (except UMD) as a selector. Note that it requires 20 trained ranks in the skill to take the feat for that skill.

I do see that it's missing some skills, including spellcraft and heal. I'll add those in.


Edit: Also, the enhancements are not showing up in the build export until I spend all 80 points. I had hoped to spend 77 and indicate the last 3 could be spent however.

Edit: Edit: I'm also not seeing my spells. I only had 15 levels of wizard, I wonder if this is because I don't have "all" my spells assigned?

Edit: Edit: Edit: When I didn't pick a destiny feat, it left my feats out of the export. I'm noticing a pattern.Yep, those are all by design. The idea is that any section that isn't complete or has errors isn't included in the output.

Should that change, do you think?

[EllisDee37]

had to manually add twistsIs the twist screen not working? It's the second "tab" of the destiny screen.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Is the twist screen not working? It's the second "tab" of the destiny screen.

one never knows with WinX. :P

[Munkenmo]

Just started using this (with linux Mint) absolutely love it Ellis. I can easily foresee my spreadsheet folder getting abandoned.

[EllisDee37]

Epic Skill Focus was inexplicably missing Heal and Spellcraft, but no others. Very weird. That alone isn't enough to warrant a whole new update, but since it's kind of a pain to add them in manually, here's the corrected Epic Skill Focus entry if you'd like to copy & paste it over the existing one in your Feats.txt file:



FeatName: Epic Skill Focus
Group: Destiny, Misc
Level: 26
Selector: Balance, Bluff, Concentration, Diplomacy, Disable Device, Haggle, Heal, Hide, Intimidate, Jump, Listen, Move Silently, Open Lock, Perform, Repair, Search, Spellcraft, Spot, Swim, Tumble
SelectorName: Balance
Skill: Balance 20
SelectorName: Bluff
Skill: Bluff 20
SelectorName: Concentration
Skill: Concentration 20
SelectorName: Diplomacy
Skill: Diplomacy 20
SelectorName: Disable Device
Skill: Disable Device 20
SelectorName: Haggle
Skill: Haggle 20
SelectorName: Heal
Skill: Heal 20
SelectorName: Hide
Skill: Hide 20
SelectorName: Intimidate
Skill: Intimidate 20
SelectorName: Jump
Skill: Jump 20
SelectorName: Listen
Skill: Listen 20
SelectorName: Move Silently
Skill: Move Silently 20
SelectorName: Open Lock
Skill: Open Lock 20
SelectorName: Perform
Skill: Perform 20
SelectorName: Repair
Skill: Repair 20
SelectorName: Search
Skill: Search 20
SelectorName: Spellcraft
Skill: Spellcraft 20
SelectorName: Spot
Skill: Spot 20
SelectorName: Swim
Skill: Swim 20
SelectorName: Tumble
Skill: Tumble 20

[EllisDee37]

Feats

.1. . . . : Insightful Reflexes
.1 Purple : ToughnessHa! Not sure what I was thinking; perhaps I was giddy with the idea of having seven letters to play with, but "Purple"?! Yeah, changing that to "PDK" as I type this...

Aha, I see what happened. When I was writing the code for racial bonus feats, I didn't realize at the time that PDKs get a bonus feat. I thought it was only human and half-elf. So it's trying to write the full "Purple Dragon Knight" but the output code enforces a hard 7-character limit.

I'm going to go ahead and pull that out of the code and put the abbreviations in the data file where they belong.

EDIT: I also see in testing that "Purple Dragon Knight" doesn't play nice with the "Source" column on the feats screen. Fixing that as well.

EDIT 2: All fixed. Not sure when I'm uploading the next version. Maybe this weekend.

[EllisDee37]

had to manually add twistsAha, I see the issue. The entire destiny section including twists is suppressed in output becase you don't have a complete and error-free destiny set up.

[Ancient]

Aha, I see the issue. The entire destiny section including twists is suppressed in output becase you don't have a complete and error-free destiny set up.

Could you have an option to output incomplete/error sections and just put a message in the output?

[EllisDee37]

Could you have an option to output incomplete/error sections and just put a message in the output?Any way we want to make it work is fine by me, and shouldn't be hard to implement. I'm open to any suggestions. You think a single (global) checkbox would suffice? Or maybe should enhancements and destinies always output incomplete (but not error) regardless of the checkbox? And should the checkbox be for incomplete, error, or both?


On an unrelated note, tonight for the first time I used the planner as a user to actually plan a build, and there's a lot I like about it. I particularly like the spell screen telling me which levels I get which spell slots. But I have encountered several minor bugs that I either corrected or put on the to do list. Buggy buggy buggy! Heh. Here's my list so far:

- Enhancement tree reordering doesn't deactivate drop slots on cancel
- Dragging enhancements is inelegant when they extend far enough to scroll
- Draconic Tier 4: Secondary not showing "None" for opposing element
- Closing spells screen doesn't re-generate output (fixed)

[Ancient]

Any way we want to make it work is fine by me, and shouldn't be hard to implement. I'm open to any suggestions. You think a single (global) checkbox would suffice? Or maybe should enhancements and destinies always output incomplete (but not error) regardless of the checkbox? And should the checkbox be for incomplete, error, or both?

My preference would be to either have a single checkbox to include incomplete sections OR have some type of warning when you export. In my case, I exported a build and was not aware I was missing sections until after I had posted it. A minor thing, but I've seen others doing it too. The big issue is thinking the export was complete when it was not. However you address that, will be fine with me.

[mna]

Any way we want to make it work is fine by me, and shouldn't be hard to implement. I'm open to any suggestions. You think a single (global) checkbox would suffice? Or maybe should enhancements and destinies always output incomplete (but not error) regardless of the checkbox? And should the checkbox be for incomplete, error, or both?

I'd think, would be nice to have separate checkboxes for incomplete and errors, and default to output yes on incomplete, no on errors.

And in any case, both always generating a notification line in the output would make sense.

I mean, having incomplete destinies planned when reincarnating should be a valid use-case; same with enhancements when doing up builds for general audience where the remainder will depend on available gear and such. But yes, I know it's feature creep...

[Grailhawk]

If this is already asked and answered just ignore it but is there anyway you can add a button (far right maybe) for each skill that just maxes it at each level? e.g. I know all my toons will just max UMD each and every level regardless of how many skill points it takes.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Aha, I see the issue. The entire destiny section including twists is suppressed in output becase you don't have a complete and error-free destiny set up.

thought as much - so yes - would be nice to be able to include (manually) those sections.

[EllisDee37]

If this is already asked and answered just ignore it but is there anyway you can add a button (far right maybe) for each skill that just maxes it at each level? e.g. I know all my toons will just max UMD each and every level regardless of how many skill points it takes.You can click the skill name to max ranks in that skill. See the help for that screen for more details.

[EllisDee37]

It's very quick and easy to turn output on or off for each section, so it's a trivial matter in terms of development time.

The more I think about it, the more I think that enhancements and destinies should always display even when incomplete. (Unless no points are spent at all, of course.) The idea being to include an AP total with the section header which would make it clear at a glance whether it's complete or incomplete. So, like:

Enhancements (80 AP)

Destiny (24 AP)

I see no harm is giving twists their own check, so that you can still output twists even if you didn't specify anything for your destiny. (Or it has errors.)

Feats can also be included when incomplete because it's readily apparent when feats aren't specified; they show up as a blank slot in the output.

I'm thinking stats should only be displayed if complete.

For skills I'm kind of on the fence. Any thoughts on incomplete skills? I can see reasons for going either way. EDIT: Actually, I could see a way to have it both ways for skills, too. For incomplete skills I could include the second totals row for "points available", which I suppress in the output now because it's all the same values as the "points spent" row. If you see only one totals row, that means skills are complete. If you see two totals rows, you'll be able to see at a glance which levels haven't had all their points spent.

That means the default behavior would be:

Overview - must be complete (can't even go to other screen without a class split)
Stats - must be complete
Skills - incomplete okay, but no errors
Feats - incomplete okay, but no errors
Enhancements - incomplete okay, but no errors
Destiny - incomplete okay, but no errors
Twists - included if any twists are specified

I could also include two global checkboxes, something like "Must be complete" and "Include errors".

How does that sound? Tweaks, suggestions, improvements welcome.

[UurlockYgmeov]

sounds spiffy!

[blerkington]

Hi,

This seems like a nice utility for the community. Thank you for providing it.

The first time I ran it, my antivirus (Avira) gave me a warning. It told me that the executable contained the program 'HEUR/APC (Cloud)', which was blocked because it was a virus or unwanted program.

I'm assuming this is a false positive. Perhaps there's something you can do about it.

Take care.

[mna]

The first time I ran it, my antivirus (Avira) gave me a warning. It told me that the executable contained the program 'HEUR/APC (Cloud)', which was blocked because it was a virus or unwanted program.

I'm assuming this is a false positive. Perhaps there's something you can do about it.


Cannot really do much about an antivirus software's heuristics guessing that something might be an unwanted program. Well, other than going to all the trouble of setting up commercial-grade distribution systems, and even that might not help...

The appropriate thing would be to verify the executable somehow (MD5 hash maybe? Or some other cryptographic verification system) and then mark as trusted.


(Actually, any "packed" .exe will likely cause warnings nowadays.)

[ChicagoChris]

Some updates

AbilityName: Flight
Group: Defense
Tier: 2
Ranks: 3

*** Doesn't require Extra Wild Empathy


AbilityName: Critical Damage
Group: Melee, Range
Tier: 4
Ranks: 3
Cost: 1
All: Tier 3: Critical Accuracy


Cost is 1, not 2

[EllisDee37]

Some updates

AbilityName: Flight
Group: Defense
Tier: 2
Ranks: 3

*** Doesn't require Extra Wild Empathy


AbilityName: Critical Damage
Group: Melee, Range
Tier: 4
Ranks: 3
Cost: 1
All: Tier 3: Critical Accuracy


Cost is 1, not 2Thanks much, updated both in the datafile. Also updated wiki entry for Flight.

[blerkington]

Hi,

I submitted your program to Avira and they confirmed that it was a false positive.

Below is an excerpt of the e-mail I received (with identifying information deleted).

Thanks.

---

Avira Virus Lab Response Team <noreply@avira.com>

Mar 13 (2 days ago)

Dear Sir or Madam,

Thank you for your email to Avira's virus lab.
Tracking number: XXXXXXXX

A listing of files alongside their results can be found below:
File ID Filename Size (Byte) Result
28450586 CharacterBuilderLite.exe 796 KB FALSE POSITIVE


Please find a detailed report concerning each individual sample below:
Filename Result
CharacterBuilderLite.exe FALSE POSITIVE

The file 'CharacterBuilderLite.exe' has been determined to be 'FALSE POSITIVE'. In particular this means that this file is not malicious but a false alarm. Detection will be removed from our virus definition file (VDF) with one of the next updates.

Please note: If you have specific questions, please visit our website http://www.avira.com/en/support for further details.

Kind regards
Avira Virus Lab

[EllisDee37]

Holy ****, that's awesome. I didn't realize how simple it was, thank you so much!


Quick update, I took a break from the program this week, figuring it would give you guys time to uncover bugs. I do hope to post 0.9.4 sometime tonight -- mostly minor changes -- and then when U25 goes live and I update the rogue trees, post the official 1.0 release version.

[Munkenmo]

I'm running into an export issue with an 11druid/5ranger/4fighter (taking advantage of swf/twf)

When editing the skills or feats sections, the skills / feats appear in the overview list (but only when working on that particular section. [ie. when switching from skills to feats, skills dissappear from overview and are replaced with feats])

So far I've only completed the build order > Stats > Skills > Feats sections. I haven't gone further, as this is all the data I need to export for the person requesting the build.

Here's the .bld file11-5-4.bld (https://www.dropbox.com/s/rzaliys8q8ffq8l/11-5-4.bld?dl=0)


Additionally, when selecting spells, it'd be nice if I could just double click, (or middle mouse, or ctrl click) on a spell and have it populate the first available spell slot.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Holy ****, that's awesome. I didn't realize how simple it was, thank you so much!


Quick update, I took a break from the program this week, figuring it would give you guys time to uncover bugs. I do hope to post 0.9.4 sometime tonight -- mostly minor changes -- and then when U25 goes live and I update the rogue trees, post the official 1.0 release version.

Awesome!

Just remember to beware the Ides of March!

[EllisDee37]

I'm running into an export issue with an 11druid/5ranger/4fighter (taking advantage of swf/twf)

When editing the skills or feats sections, the skills / feats appear in the overview list (but only when working on that particular section. [ie. when switching from skills to feats, skills dissappear from overview and are replaced with feats])That's no doubt due to errors in those sections. After mulling it over for the past few days, I think my original vision of only exporting error-free and complete sections was flawed. It's unnecessarily confusing, counter-intuitive, and worst of all, it's not readily apparent what's happening when you actually generate and post your output.

To fix it once and for all, I'm redoing the output logic to output ALL sections regardless of errors or being incomplete. The only way a section won't be included in output is if that section is completely blank.

The one nod I'm adding to the previous design is to include "(Errors)" in any section header that contains errors. So, for example, if you set up your feats such that one of them is missing a prereq, the feats section header will appear as:

Feats (Errors)

Hold tight for a bit and I'll get the new version finished, tested and uploaded. Still hoping for tonight.



Additionally, when selecting spells, it'd be nice if I could just double click, (or middle mouse, or ctrl click) on a spell and have it populate the first available spell slot.That was part of the original design, but I found that it didn't play nice with the way I implemented dragging and dropping -- so much flashing as valid drop slots fire on and off during the double-clicks.

After analyzing how Microsoft handles it I realize that the drag operation shouldn't start until the mouse actually moves. It's possible to change the drag operations in the program to adopt that behavior, but it will be a bit of a headache. Initializing the drag the way I do now -- when the mouse is first pressed -- is easier.

All that to say I may or may not add double-click back in, but I don't plan to for 1.0.

[UurlockYgmeov]

That's no doubt due to errors in those sections. After mulling it over for the past few days, I think my original vision of only exporting error-free and complete sections was flawed. It's unnecessarily confusing, counter-intuitive, and worst of all, it's not readily apparent when you actually generate and post your output.

To fix it once and for all, I'm redoing the output logic to output ALL sections regardless of errors or being incomplete. The only way a section won't be included in output is if that section is completely blank.

The one nod I'm adding to the previous design is to include "(Errors)" in any section header that contains errors. So, for example, if you set up your feats such that one of them is missing a prereq, the feats section header will appear as:

Feats (Errors)

Hold tight for a bit and I'll get the new version finished, tested and uploaded. Still hoping for tonight.

go-go-gadgetmobile!

[Munkenmo]

That's no doubt due to errors in those sections.

I'm fairly certain the feats section has no errors. I'm curious if it's due to the logic you've used for swf / twf.

[EllisDee37]

I'm fairly certain the feats section has no errors. I'm curious if it's due to the logic you've used for swf / twf.Ah, yes, quite likely.

[EllisDee37]

I'm fairly certain the feats section has no errors. I'm curious if it's due to the logic you've used for swf / twf.Actually, your feats aren't displaying in the output in version 0.9.3 because they are incomplete. If you include the druid wild shape feats and the ranger favored enemies, it should show up. Easiest way to find them is to click on the feat slots to filter the list for just that slot.

The program isn't showing any errors in the feat section when I add those in, so it doesn't appear to be a swf / twf issue.



The update got sidetracked last night; Sunday night TV is just too good. Hopefully today.

[UurlockYgmeov]

The update got sidetracked last night; Sunday night TV is just too good. Hopefully today.
Just
Keep
Walking....

[Ancient]

This utility is great, keep up the good work!

[Munkenmo]

Actually, your feats aren't displaying in the output in version 0.9.3 because they are incomplete. If you include the druid wild shape feats and the ranger favored enemies, it should show up. Easiest way to find them is to click on the feat slots to filter the list for just that slot..

Oh I didn't realise that would stop feats from displaying. I've got to admit, I'd much prefer it if completing a section wasn't required.

Some choices are subjective and I'd prefer to leave people to make those decisions for themselves. Skills, favored enemies, spells are good examples where personal choice can be a deciding factor.

I'd like to be able to use it to output a basic skill outline (eg. with umd and heal), basic feats (eg not taking favored enemies) and basic spells. Leaving the end user a good guide line but not a fully completed build.

[EllisDee37]

Oh I didn't realise that would stop feats from displaying. I've got to admit, I'd much prefer it if completing a section wasn't required.

Some choices are subjective and I'd prefer to leave people to make those decisions for themselves. Skills, favored enemies, spells are good examples where personal choice can be a deciding factor.

I'd like to be able to use it to output a basic skill outline (eg. with umd and heal), basic feats (eg not taking favored enemies) and basic spells. Leaving the end user a good guide line but not a fully completed build.Yep, totally agreed. I've changed my opinion so fully that I don't even really understand what I was thinking with the original design. The "always output everything" version is just about ready for release.

[EllisDee37]

0.9.4 is up, details in OP.

Other than new bug reports going forward, this is what 1.0 will be. There are only two planned changes for 1.0 yet to be implemented, and they are both behind-the-scenes changes:

First, when you start the program, there is a two-step process to load the data files:
1) Physically load the data into the internal data structures in memory ("Load")
2) Resolve all "pointers", including all/one/none reqs and shared/exclusive selector lists ("Process")
The "process" code has a spiffy error log that tracks any issues and gracefully makes note of any errors in an error log you can refer to. This helped me quite a bit in development to ensure that all "pointers" in all data files are valid. (They are.) By contrast, the "load" code has no error log, or error handling of any kind. The smallest formatting error will either cause the line to be ignored completely, or (more likely) will crash the entire program. I plan to add the graceful error log functionality from the process code to the load code.

Second, when data files inevitably change -- like with the upcoming rogue tree pass -- right now the program would crash at any point it tries to refer to an ability (or feat or spell) that no longer exists. This isn't an issue yet because no datafiles have changed in any meaningful way. I plan to add an automatic check on loading a build to gracefully degrade the build data if the data changes. As an example, if you set up a rogue now, after the rogue pass it's fairly likely that when you load an old rogue build, the program will tell you something like "It appears the Mechanic tree has changed, and will be reset for this build." At least that's the concept.

Neither of these changes will impact the normal use of the program, so what you see in 0.9.4 is basically what you'll get with 1.0.

As always, bug reports, comments and suggestions welcome.

[UurlockYgmeov]

excellent Mr. Smithers!

[EllisDee37]

Grr, already found a bug in the point totaling logic in the enhancements section. As I put together a Count of Monte Cristo build, after entering the swashbuckler tree it says:

Enhancements (215 of 80 AP) - Errors

Swashbuckler (43 AP)
Confidence, Swashbuckling, Uncanny Dodge, Panache, Roll with the Punches, Evasive Maneuvers
On Your Toes III, Tavern Shanties I
Fast Movement, Double Strike Boost III
Skirmisher, Resonant Arms III, Smooth Flourishes, Charisma
Low Blow, Charisma
Thread the Needle, Second Skin III, Exploit Weakness, Coup de Grace: Melee


That's clearly not right. heh. (EDIT: It seemed to resolve itself once I spent all 80 AP, but still, I'll get that fixed for 1.0.)

[Behoram]

Fantastic!!

[UurlockYgmeov]

Grr, already found a bug in the point totaling logic in the enhancements section. As I put together a Count of Monte Cristo build, after entering the swashbuckler tree it says:

Enhancements (215 of 80 AP) - Errors

Swashbuckler (43 AP)

Confidence, Swashbuckling, Uncanny Dodge, Panache, Roll with the Punches, Evasive Maneuvers

On Your Toes III, Tavern Shanties I
Fast Movement, Double Strike Boost III
Skirmisher, Resonant Arms III, Smooth Flourishes, Charisma
Low Blow, Charisma
Thread the Needle, Second Skin III, Exploit Weakness, Coup de Grace: Melee



That's clearly not right. heh. (EDIT: It seemed to resolve itself once I spent all 80 AP, but still, I'll get that fixed for 1.0.)

Don't feel bad - often the actual game seems to misplace 4 action points until you hit level 20. :D

Any way to build in an import feature? Ron's planner allowed easy sharing of build because the save file was just plain text. Now I wouldn't want you to change the .bld format - just a simple way to import .bld from forum posts.

Yes, Kobold still challenge you. :P

[EllisDee37]

Ideally I'd like to add an import feature that imports the format actually sent to the forums, so you could theoretically just copy & paste a posted build (the displayed text, not the BBCodes version you get if you click the Reply button) into an import screen and have the build ready to go. It shouldn't be too difficult; the biggest challenge would be the dots, which may or may not be there depending on which forum you're importing from.

Also that there's no clear delimiter saying "the build starts here." One possibility is to use the "Stats" section header as the key term to search for, then work backwards to get the build name, alignment, race and classes. Best I can figure, every build will always have a stats section.


On a semi-related note, I'm wondering if a "build pack" would be a worthwhile download, assembling many of the name builds from the forums into a zip people could download: Count of Monte Cristo, Dubbel O'Seven, Shuricannon (original + 2.0), possibly Cetus' original centered kensei, Andoris' pale master, shirardi sorc, Unbongwah's builds, my new player builds, etc... Maybe even add in some common but never officially solidified builds, like monkcher, plus some older builds for flavor like a clonk.

My biggest concern with a build pack would be crediting people. There's no "author" field in the build files, and there's also no link to easily open the build thread on the forums. So I'm not sure what my thoughts are on this. The only thing I do know is that creating the various forum builds in the planner is an excellent way to test the planner and its data files for bugs, so I'm likely to end up with a bunch of these build files regardless.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Ideally I'd like to add an import feature that imports the format actually sent to the forums, so you could theoretically just copy & paste a posted build (the displayed text, not the BBCodes version you get if you click the Reply button) into an import screen and have the build ready to go. It shouldn't be too difficult; the biggest challenge would be the dots, which may or may not be there depending on which forum you're importing from.

Also that there's no clear delimiter saying "the build starts here." One possibility is to use the "Stats" section header as the key term to search for, then work backwards to get the build name, alignment, race and classes. Best I can figure, every build will always have a stats section.


On a semi-related note, I'm wondering if a "build pack" would be a worthwhile download, assembling many of the name builds from the forums into a zip people could download: Count of Monte Cristo, Dubbel O'Seven, Shuricannon (original + 2.0), possibly Cetus' original centered kensei, Andoris' pale master, shirardi sorc, Unbongwah's builds, my new player builds, etc... Maybe even add in some common but never officially solidified builds, like monkcher, plus some older builds for flavor like a clonk.

My biggest concern with a build pack would be crediting people. There's no "author" field in the build files, and there's also no link to easily open the build thread on the forums. So I'm not sure what my thoughts are on this. The only thing I do know is that creating the various forum builds in the planner is an excellent way to test the planner and its data files for bugs, so I'm likely to end up with a bunch of these build files regardless.

Yes.

Yes.

And Yes there is - just name the build ... XXXX by YYYY.

(eg "Bard - The Count of Monte Cristo by CThruTheEgo.bld")

but yes, in the FUTURE would be nice to include brief description/goals - author - link space (link to forum post)

[Vargouille]

Yep, totally agreed. I've changed my opinion so fully that I don't even really understand what I was thinking with the original design.

This is just one example, but I feel like you're getting a great experience of what it's really like to design games in some ways. =)

[UurlockYgmeov]

This is just one example, but I feel like you're getting a great experience of what it's really like to design games in some ways. =)

;p

[LordTigerDawn]

Ideally I'd like to add an import feature that imports the format actually sent to the forums, so you could theoretically just copy & paste a posted build (the displayed text, not the BBCodes version you get if you click the Reply button) into an import screen and have the build ready to go. It shouldn't be too difficult; the biggest challenge would be the dots, which may or may not be there depending on which forum you're importing from.

Also that there's no clear delimiter saying "the build starts here." One possibility is to use the "Stats" section header as the key term to search for, then work backwards to get the build name, alignment, race and classes. Best I can figure, every build will always have a stats section.


On a semi-related note, I'm wondering if a "build pack" would be a worthwhile download, assembling many of the name builds from the forums into a zip people could download: Count of Monte Cristo, Dubbel O'Seven, Shuricannon (original + 2.0), possibly Cetus' original centered kensei, Andoris' pale master, shirardi sorc, Unbongwah's builds, my new player builds, etc... Maybe even add in some common but never officially solidified builds, like monkcher, plus some older builds for flavor like a clonk.

My biggest concern with a build pack would be crediting people. There's no "author" field in the build files, and there's also no link to easily open the build thread on the forums. So I'm not sure what my thoughts are on this. The only thing I do know is that creating the various forum builds in the planner is an excellent way to test the planner and its data files for bugs, so I'm likely to end up with a bunch of these build files regardless.

One of the issues that newer developers have is separating what is in the current version and what should be out in the next version. Your build files are a great idea, and correct citations for the builds should be implemented but I would concentrate on main functionality right now and keep in mind a generic way to create and cite builds to make the user world implement their builds and submit them themselves...

If you try and micro-manage everything you will eventually get bogged down and not have enough resources to just update the software for the amount of changes Turbine developers are giving us each update.

If it is more for education than management, go full throttle in whatever direction you want... Learning gets you a career in the end.

Thanks for making this a reality...

[Seikojin]

Ideally I'd like to add an import feature that imports the format actually sent to the forums, so you could theoretically just copy & paste a posted build (the displayed text, not the BBCodes version you get if you click the Reply button) into an import screen and have the build ready to go. It shouldn't be too difficult; the biggest challenge would be the dots, which may or may not be there depending on which forum you're importing from.

Also that there's no clear delimiter saying "the build starts here." One possibility is to use the "Stats" section header as the key term to search for, then work backwards to get the build name, alignment, race and classes. Best I can figure, every build will always have a stats section.


On a semi-related note, I'm wondering if a "build pack" would be a worthwhile download, assembling many of the name builds from the forums into a zip people could download: Count of Monte Cristo, Dubbel O'Seven, Shuricannon (original + 2.0), possibly Cetus' original centered kensei, Andoris' pale master, shirardi sorc, Unbongwah's builds, my new player builds, etc... Maybe even add in some common but never officially solidified builds, like monkcher, plus some older builds for flavor like a clonk.

My biggest concern with a build pack would be crediting people. There's no "author" field in the build files, and there's also no link to easily open the build thread on the forums. So I'm not sure what my thoughts are on this. The only thing I do know is that creating the various forum builds in the planner is an excellent way to test the planner and its data files for bugs, so I'm likely to end up with a bunch of these build files regardless.

It would be difficult to scan a body of text for keywords (like str or strength) because they will be used multiple times in the body of text. You can do some tricks like looking for a keyword and accepting it for that value or slot if and only if it is trailed by a space and up to 3 numbers (just in case we get triple digits). However if the body of text contains more, it will get confused. You could have it do that and prompt the user to select which they want.

Actually, you could make a import feature that begins a table preview that allows the user to move data from one cell to the next. Then you compress that table into keyword, value formats and pipe it into your programs format and render to the UI.

I think including a pack of builds is fine too. You could even turn them into templates.

[Ancient]

A planner for the game city-of-heroes included a block of text at the end of a build post that could be cut/paste into the planner as an import. It wasn't human readable, but it did the job just fine.

[mna]

A planner for the game city-of-heroes included a block of text at the end of a build post that could be cut/paste into the planner as an import. It wasn't human readable, but it did the job just fine.

Hm, does uuencode work cleanly in a "code" block in here?

Let's see... is that actually allowed in the forum usage terms?

[Ancient]

Just in case there was any interest, I dug up an example build post (took some effort considering it was a community support program for a now-dead MMORPG).

Please note, this is not a DDO build... the point is to provide an example of how a code block can be included at the bottom.



Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.621
http://www.cohplanner.com/

Smorgasborg: Level 50 Technology Blaster
Primary Power Set: Dual Pistols
Secondary Power Set: Mental Manipulation
Power Pool: Fitness
Ancillary Pool: Electrical Mastery

Hero Profile:
------------
Level 1: Pistols Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(5), EndRdx-I(5), Dmg-I(21), Dmg-I(21)
Level 1: Subdual Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(3), EndRdx-I(3), EndRdx-I(7), Dmg-I(23), Dmg-I(23)
Level 2: Dual Wield Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(7), EndRdx-I(9), Dmg-I(27), Dmg-I(27)
Level 4: Mind Probe Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(9), EndRdx-I(11), EndRdx-I(13), Dmg-I(33), Dmg-I(33)
Level 6: Swap Ammo
Level 8: Telekinetic Thrust Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(11), EndRdx-I(13), Dmg-I(46), Dmg-I(46)
Level 10: Empty Clips Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(15), EndRdx-I(15), Dmg-I(43), Dmg-I(43)
Level 12: Psychic Scream Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(17), EndRdx-I(17), Dmg-I(37), Dmg-I(37)
Level 14: Swift Run-I(A)
Level 16: Bullet Rain Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(19), EndRdx-I(19), Dmg-I(40), Dmg-I(40)
Level 18: Health Heal-I(A), Heal-I(37), Heal-I(39)
Level 20: Stamina EndMod-I(A), EndMod-I(39), EndMod-I(40)
Level 22: Concentration RechRdx-I(A)
Level 24: Executioner's Shot Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(25), EndRdx-I(25), Dmg-I(29), Dmg-I(31)
Level 26: Drain Psyche Acc-I(A)
Level 28: Suppressive Fire Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(29), Dmg-I(48), Dmg-I(48)
Level 30: Piercing Rounds Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(31), EndRdx-I(31), Dmg-I(36), Dmg-I(36)
Level 32: Hail of Bullets Acc-I(A), RechRdx-I(33), RechRdx-I(34), Dmg-I(34), Dmg-I(34), Dmg-I(36)
Level 35: World of Confusion Acc-I(A)
Level 38: Scare Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(39)
Level 41: Psychic Shockwave Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(42), Dmg-I(42), Dmg-I(42), RechRdx-I(43)
Level 44: Shocking Bolt Acc-I(A), EndRdx-I(45), EndRdx-I(45), Dmg-I(45), Dmg-I(46)
Level 47: Charged Armor ResDam-I(A), ResDam-I(48)
Level 49: Surge of Power RechRdx-I(A), ResDam-I(50), ResDam-I(50), RechRdx-I(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest Empty(A)
Level 1: Defiance
Level 2: Ninja Run
Level 6: Chemical Ammunition
Level 6: Cryo Ammunition
Level 6: Incendiary Ammunition



| Do not modify anything below this line! |
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|
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|1A2BFA70157A8|
|-------------------------------------------------------------------|

[HungarianRhapsody]

This is just one example, but I feel like you're getting a great experience of what it's really like to design games in some ways. =)

To follow up, I'd like to point out that the Character Builder Lite is made of poo and the person who designed it should be ashamed of themselves.

(Now you *really* have the experience of what it's like to design games! ;) )

...in all seriousness, thanks EllisDee37. It's awesome to have add ons like this to help with more complicated parts of the game.

[mna]

Hm, does uuencode work cleanly in a "code" block in here?

Let's see... is that actually allowed in the forum usage terms?

I looked (I suppose the "Forum Guidelines" from 2006 are still current?) and looks like it'd be allowed, as long as it's my own stuff I'm posting and not someone else's...

And Base64 is certainly forum-safe even if "traditional" uuencode isn't.

So. This build:


Tempest Warpriest trapper
12/7/1 Ranger/Cleric/Rogue
Human


Level Order

1. Rogue. . . . . .6. Cleric. . . . .11. Ranger . . . . 16. Ranger
2. Cleric . . . . .7. Ranger. . . . .12. Cleric . . . . 17. Ranger
3. Ranger . . . . .8. Cleric. . . . .13. Ranger . . . . 18. Ranger
4. Cleric . . . . .9. Ranger. . . . .14. Cleric . . . . 19. Ranger
5. Ranger . . . . 10. Cleric. . . . .15. Ranger . . . . 20. Ranger


Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt. . .32pt . . 34pt. . .36pt . . Level Up
. . . . . . . .----. . .---- . . ----. . .---- . . --------
Strength. . . . 16 . . . 16. . . .16 . . . 16. . . .4: STR
Dexterity . . . 11 . . . 12. . . .13 . . . 12. . . .8: STR
Constitution. . 14 . . . 14. . . .15 . . . 16. . . 12: STR
Intelligence. . 14 . . . 14. . . .14 . . . 14. . . 16: STR
Wisdom. . . . . .8 . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . .8. . . 20: STR
Charisma. . . . 11 . . . 14. . . .13 . . . 14. . . 24: STR
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: STR

Skills
. . . . .Rg Cl Rn Cl Rn Cl Rn Cl Rn Cl Rn Cl Rn Cl Rn Rn Rn Rn Rn Rn
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Concent . 2 .1. 3 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Disable . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Search. . 4 . . 2 . . 2 . . 2 . . 2 . . 2 . . 2 . . 2 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Spot. . . 4 . . . . . 2 . . 2 . . 2 . . 2 . . 2 . . 2 .3. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
UMD . . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Balance . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1 .1. 1 .1. .8
Open Lo . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Bluff . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Jump. . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Move Si . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Hide. . . 2 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .2
Tumble. . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1
Perform . ½ . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .½
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .44 .5. 9 .5. 9 .5. 9 .5. 9 .5. 9 .5. 9 .5. 9 .9. 9 .9. 9 .9


Feats

.1. . . . : Power Attack
.1. . . . : Least Dragonmark: Passage
.2 Deity. : Follower of: Sovereign Host
.3. . . . : Cleave
.3 Ranger : Favored Enemy: Undead
.6. . . . : Great Cleave
.9. . . . : Empower Healing Spell
11 Ranger : Favored Enemy: Construct
12. . . . : Improved Critical: Slashing
12 Deity. : Unyielding Sovereignty
15. . . . : Improved Critical: Ranged
18. . . . : Point Blank Shot
18 Ranger : Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
21 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
24 Epic . : Quicken Spell
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Epic . : Blinding Speed
28 Destiny: Doubleshot


Spells

Ranger
Ram's Might, Jump
Barkskin, Protection from Energy
Neutralize Poison, Wild Instincts
Cleric
Cure Light Wounds, Nightshield, Protection From Evil, Divine Favor, Shield of Faith, Remove Fear
Cure Moderate Wounds, Find Traps, Lesser Restoration, Remove Paralysis, Resist Energy
Cure Serious Wounds, Remove Curse, Remove Disease, Prayer
Cure Critical Wounds, Death Ward, Freedom of Movement

Enhancements (80 AP)

Human (7 AP)
Damage Boost
Dragonmark Focus: Orien I, Skill Focus: Nimble Fingers I, Improved Recovery
Lesser Dragonmark: Dimension Door

Tempest (39 AP)
Shield of Whirling Steel, Tempest, Graceful Death, Deflect Arrows
Improved Reaction III, Improved Defense III, Whirling Blades
Bleed Them Out III, Whirling Blades, Haste Boost III
<none>
Elaborate Parry III, The Growing Storm I
Evasive Dance III, Dance of Death III

Warpriest (22 AP)
Smite Foe, Resilience of Battle
Divine Might III, Toughness III, Awareness III
Smite Weakness, Wall of Steel III, Inflame II, Inflame: Saving Throws II
<none>
Ameliorating Strike

Deepwood Stalker (12 AP)
Far Shot, Sneak Attack, Sniper Shot
Increased Empathy III, Versatile Empathy II
Skill Boost II

Destiny (24 AP)

Fury of the Wild
Tunnel Vision I, Primal Scream III, Strength
Unstoppable Fury III, Acute Instincts III
<none>
Gird Against Demons I, Sense Weakness III, Overwhelming Force III
Fury Eternal
Unbridled Fury

Twists of Fate (3 fate points)
Rejuvenation Cocoon (Tier 1 Primal)
Technician (Tier 1 Shadowdancer)



... the ENTIRE .bld file Base64-encodes to:


begin-base64 664 Tempest Warpriest trapper.bld
cjgLAAEZAFRlbXBlc3QgV2FycHJpZXN0IHRyYXBwZXIBABwGAw cHAwYDBgMG
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ExMUFBUVHCAiJAoKCgoDBAUEBgYICgYGBgYAAAAAAwYFBgABAQ EBAQEBAQEB
AQEAAAAAAAAABAQEAAQAAAIABAAEBAEABAAEAAEEAAABAAIAAA AAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAAACAAADAAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAgAAAAACAAABAAIAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAA
AAACAAABAAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAgACAAACAAABAAIAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAC
AAABAAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAgACAAACAAABAAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAACAAAB
AAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAgACAAACAAABAAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA ACAAABAAIA
AAAAAAAAAAAAAgACAAACAAABAAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACAA ABAAIAAAAA
AAAAAAAAAgACAAACAAABAAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACAAABAA IAAAAAAAAA
AAAAAgACAAACAAABAAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAQADAAACAgABAAIAAA AAAAAAAAAA
AQABAAACAgABAAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAQABAAACAgABAAIAAAAAAA AAAAAAAQAB
AAACAgABAAIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAQABAAACAQAJAAAAAAAAAAEAEg AAAAEAAAAE
AAEACwBQcm9maWNpZW5jeQQAAAQAAQAMAFNuZWFrIEF0dGFjaw AAAAQAAgAL
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AAQFYwoAAAAAAAQFYw0AAAAAAAQFYxAAAAAAAAQFYxMAAAAAAA QBAAQAAAAB
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DQBEZWl0eSBBYmlsaXR5BAAABAAAAAAAAAICBgoOAAAAAAABAA IAAAABAAAA
BgwDAQADAAAAAQAAAAEAAgAAAAEAAAALAFJhbSdzIE1pZ2h0BA BKdW1wAgEA
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IFdpbGQDAAABAAoAAAABAAAAAQEBAAECAwABBQEBAgIDAAIDAw AEAQEABAMD
AAQEAwAFAgEABgEBAAoBAAIAAAABAAAADQBQcmltYWwgQXZhdG FyAQIADABT
aGFkb3dkYW5jZXIBBAAC
====


The Base64-encoded .bld is less than a third of the size of the export with bbcodes, heh. Though, the straight .bld is even smaller.

[Failedlegend]

Yep, totally agreed. I've changed my opinion so fully that I don't even really understand what I was thinking with the original design. The "always output everything" version is just about ready for release.


This is just one example, but I feel like you're getting a great experience of what it's really like to design games in some ways. =)

It's not quite the same but I've made several RPG Maker games (of varying quality, mostly for friends) and the final product is never the same as the original idea w/ stuff you wanted to do not just working out, the game being much longer or shorter than originally planned, a cool random idea popping in your head whilst coding, or even just a happy accident that does a cool thing and of course the "WHY DOESN'T THIS WORK!!!!" moments.

[EllisDee37]

I'm unhappy with the current bugs. I was hoping the next version released would be 1.0, but now with the current bugs ("Human" doesn't show up as the source for human bonus feats, enhancement totals are way screwy, an extra blank line is needed before the destiny output) I think I might do a 0.9.5 before 1.0. At this point in development I'm not thrilled with spamming you guys with so many updates before getting to a stable version, but I'd really like 1.0 to be a stable release I don't need to update with 1.0.1 three days later.

So reluctantly I'll say expect 0.9.5 some time this weekend.


The Base64-encoded .bld is less than a third of the size of the export with bbcodes, heh. Though, the straight .bld is even smaller.I kind of went a little nuts in terms of keeping the build files small. The very first original design, back when the planner only included classes, stats, skills and feats, was around 10k per build file. Using the same techniques I estimated a final build file with spells, enhancements and destinies could approach 100k, and that felt way too big to me. As a clear overreaction I went the other way to the nth degree. The Count of Monte Cristo build (which I put together a couple days ago for testing purposes) ended up being 2128 bytes. heh.


It would be difficult to scan a body of text for keywords (like str or strength) because they will be used multiple times in the body of text. You can do some tricks like looking for a keyword and accepting it for that value or slot if and only if it is trailed by a space and up to 3 numbers (just in case we get triple digits). However if the body of text contains more, it will get confused. You could have it do that and prompt the user to select which they want.The builder output is predictable, and as such should not be particularly difficult to parse.

[Rhysem]

I'm unhappy with the current bugs.

One more if you don't have it; deselecting base stat categories doesn't auto-kick the preferred build points off of them. (forex: deselect adventurer, but pbp stays adventruer and now 'skills >' doesn't work, telling you to allocate the hidden stat.)

[EllisDee37]

One more if you don't have it; deselecting base stat categories doesn't auto-kick the preferred build points off of them. (forex: deselect adventurer, but pbp stays adventruer and now 'skills >' doesn't work, telling you to allocate the hidden stat.)Great catch. Love those easy-to-fix esoteric bugs; I'll add that to the list.

Speaking of screen navigation, I've put very little time or effort into verifying that the navigation logic is proper. This is probably more of an issue with the Edit menu than the navigation links since you can use the Edit menu to jump directly to any screen. So if anyone finds that you can go to a screen you probably shouldn't be able to yet, let me know. ("Shouldn't be able to" as in something like going to skills before allocating stats.)

Which reminds me: There is absolutely no requirement beyond "Max Levels" being 20+ to go to the destiny screen. So I may have to rethink my original idea for the import logic that the "Stats" section would be part of any build. The destiny screen stands alone in that you don't even need a class split to define your destiny.

[mna]

I'm unhappy with the current bugs. I was hoping the next version released would be 1.0, but now with the current bugs ("Human" doesn't show up as the source for human bonus feats, enhancement totals are way screwy, an extra blank line is needed before the destiny output) I think I might do a 0.9.5 before 1.0. At this point in development I'm not thrilled with spamming you guys with so many updates before getting to a stable version, but I'd really like 1.0 to be a stable release I don't need to update with 1.0.1 three days later.

So reluctantly I'll say expect 0.9.5 some time this weekend.


Oh, a couple of things...

1) I managed to get a "subscript out of range" error clicking back and forth between the Destiny and Twists screens. Not immediately obivous what causes it, still haven't narrowed down exact conditions and having problems reproducing this reliably.
I think I did have full stats, skills, feats and enhancements I believe...

2) Trying to save (and not exit) and accidentally not giving a file name causes an exit without saving. So, a feature request to get a safety check there?


The latter could be a Wine library bug, but I don't think that very likely for the former.

[EllisDee37]

2) Trying to save (and not exit) and accidentally not giving a file name causes an exit without saving. So, a feature request to get a safety check there?I'll look into that.

I'll also take a quick look at switching between destiny & twists to see if I can duplicate that runtime error. (My initial guess is that it might involve clearing some abilities with right-click.)


This morning I remembered that I actually wrote a full-fledged print w/print preview functionality for a VB6 program years and years ago. If I can find it and it's easy to adapt, would a printing function be useful? Right now you can just copy plain text to notepad and print that way, but I figure if it's easily adapted it might be nice to have a preview. (EDIT: I found the code; it's adaptable without too much trouble, but it wouldn't be overly quick so I may just put it on the wish list for after 1.0.)

[EllisDee37]

2) Trying to save (and not exit) and accidentally not giving a file name causes an exit without saving. So, a feature request to get a safety check there?I'm unable to duplicate (or possibly understand) this one.

When I create a new build and make it "dirty" by choosing a race, when I then close the whole program I get a "Save build? Yes/No/Cancel" prompt. If I choose yes and blank out the save file name, clicking the "Save" button in the dialog does nothing; doesn't close the dialog, doesn't close the program. It continues to wait for a filename. If I choose "Cancel" in the save file dialog, the dialog closes and I'm returned to the program with the previous close command having been cancelled.

All of that is WAI, with no possibility for accidental close without saving unless you specifically choose "No" when it asks if you'd like to save. Is this different than the behavior you see? Am I misunderstanding?

EDIT: Regarding the runtime error in the destiny screen going back and forth between destiny and twists, yesterday I did find and fix a similar "Subscript out of range" error in the enhancement screen when switching from trees to enhancements. Is it possible you ran into the bug in enhancements, not destiny? (The error was when deleting a tree, if that tree was set as your Tier 5 tree it threw an error going from trees to enhancements. The fix was to have the program clear the Tier 5 entry if you delete the Tier 5 tree.)

[mna]

I'm unable to duplicate (or possibly understand) this one.

When I create a new build and make it "dirty" by choosing a race, when I then close the whole program I get a "Save build? Yes/No/Cancel" prompt. If I choose yes and blank out the save file name, clicking the "Save" button in the dialog does nothing; doesn't close the dialog, doesn't close the program. It continues to wait for a filename. If I choose "Cancel" in the save file dialog, the dialog closes and I'm returned to the program with the previous close command having been cancelled.

All of that is WAI, with no possibility for accidental close without saving unless you specifically choose "No" when it asks if you'd like to save. Is this different than the behavior you see? Am I misunderstanding?

Like I said, this one could well be a Wine bug, just tell me it works right on Windows and I'll leave it at that.


In the standard file dialog that pops up when trying to save in any case, if I just go on and click the default "Save" button (localized in my case, too) without touching the file name field at all, I get a stack dump termination, which obivously loses all unsaved data in the application.

If I blank out the file name it behaves as you described, and if I write something there it does use that as the filename just fine.


Now, the file name field looks like it's filled with "selected" space characters when the save dialog opens, so there might be something funny going on in that. On closer inspection, it seems that there's a suggestion based on the build name before the long string of spaces.

Are you by chance passing it a long field padded with spaces? Windows probably just drops strings of trailing spaces from filenames or something... reminds me of the time when one of my coworkers managed to make a file that was named <linefeed><bell><pagefeed>, three ASCII control characters...



wine: Unhandled page fault on write access to 0x00000260 at address 0x200022 (thread 0009), starting debugger...
Unhandled exception: page fault on write access to 0x00000260 in 32-bit code (0x00200022).
Register dump:
...

[EllisDee37]

Are you by chance passing it a long field padded with spaces? I am indeed. As far as I can tell, that's how it needs to be sent for Windows. Under the hood what I'm doing is loading up a TypeDef structure with the appropriate values and sending that structure to an API call. So it's largely a black box kind of thing from my end.

I can play around with it a little, but as a general rule I'm not a huge fan of randomly changing API calls for testing. Makes me nervous. It does appear that in this particular instance I'm sending both a string (padded with spaces) and a length, so I can certainly try changing that length to the length of the actual string I'm sending.

EDIT: Actually, looking more closely, those extra spaces appear to provide the room if you change the filename (or path) to something larger. The API both receives and returns a very long string, set to the length MAX_PATH. I may not want to mess with it too much. Me no likey API calls. I wrote the wrapper code for these API calls over a decade ago.

[UurlockYgmeov]

So did the Ozymoronic Barbarian build on Lamannia today. Besides the fact that rage makes the wizard part basically useless - the build achieved most of its goals.

However, during the leveling process noted the following issues between live and the planner:


level 3 - game says 6 skill points - planner says 5level 3 - game says 6 spells (initial) planer says 3
level 7 - games says 7 skill points - planner says 6
level 11 - games says 9 skill points - planner says 8
level 15 - games says 15 skill points - planner says 14
level 19 - games says 12 skill points - planner says 11

other than that - spot on. :D

[EllisDee37]

So did the Ozymoronic Barbarian build on Lamannia today. Besides the fact that rage makes the wizard part basically useless - the build achieved most of its goals.

However, during the leveling process noted the following issues between live and the planner:


level 3 - game says 6 skill points - planner says 5
level 3 - game says 6 spells (initial) planer says 3
level 7 - games says 7 skill points - planner says 6
level 11 - games says 9 skill points - planner says 8
level 15 - games says 15 skill points - planner says 14
level 19 - games says 12 skill points - planner says 11

other than that - spot on. :DFor the skills, looks like the builder thinks you're a first life character using tomes as you level, but the game indicates you're a TR who used an int tome in a previous life. The builder determines which way to go based on what you choose for Preferred Build Points in the Stats screen. (Can't have tomes from a previous life if you're 28pt or 32pt because that's a first life build.) EDIT: Yep, I see the build file has a +6 int tome but is listed as 28pt for preferred build points.

Regarding spells, on lammania you're choosing 6 spells to inscribe. The builder ignores spell inscription entirely. The three spell slots you get at level 3 are the spells you can actively slot and cast. EDIT: For example, you have 7 wizard levels so can inscribe spells 7 different times as you level, but the builder only lists four spell lines because you can only cast level 4 spells. The idea would be you get to the inscription screen in the game and choose the five spells you list for level 1 spells, then any other spell at random which you never slot.

[UurlockYgmeov]

For the skills, looks like the builder thinks you're a first life character using tomes as you level, but the game indicates you're a TR who used an int tome in a previous life. The builder determines which way to go based on what you choose for Preferred Build Points in the Stats screen. (Can't have tomes from a previous life if you're 28pt or 32pt because that's a first life build.) EDIT: Yep, I see the build file has a +6 int tome but is listed as 28pt for preferred build points.

Regarding spells, on lammania you're choosing 6 spells to inscribe. The builder ignores spell inscription entirely. The three spell slots you get at level 3 are the spells you can actively slot and cast. EDIT: For example, you have 7 wizard levels so can inscribe spells 7 different times as you level, but the builder only lists four spell lines because you can only cast level 4 spells. The idea would be you get to the inscription screen in the game and choose the five spells you list for level 1 spells, then any other spell at random which you never slot.

yep that fixed the skills - had 'adventurer' selected.

spells - makes sense. :D

[EllisDee37]

EDIT: Actually, looking more closely, those extra spaces appear to provide the room if you change the filename (or path) to something larger. The API both receives and returns a very long string, set to the length MAX_PATH. I may not want to mess with it too much. Me no likey API calls. I wrote the wrapper code for these API calls over a decade ago.The old VB6 board I used to frequent is still alive and kicking, so I asked about this over there.

[mna]

For the skills, looks like the builder thinks you're a first life character using tomes as you level, but the game indicates you're a TR who used an int tome in a previous life. The builder determines which way to go based on what you choose for Preferred Build Points in the Stats screen. (Can't have tomes from a previous life if you're 28pt or 32pt because that's a first life build.) EDIT: Yep, I see the build file has a +6 int tome but is listed as 28pt for preferred build points.

Except, well... you can actually have tomes from a "previous life" on a 28/32 pt character, of sorts - this routinely happens with Lesser and Epic Reincarnation, and yes, it does behave exactly that way there. And is actually a valid usage case for the planner, too.

I was sort of disappointed that my 28pt drow didn't get any more build points when epic-reincarnating.

[EllisDee37]

Except, well... you can actually have tomes from a "previous life" on a 28/32 pt character, of sorts - this routinely happens with Lesser and Epic Reincarnation, and yes, it does behave exactly that way there. And is actually a valid usage case for the planner, too.

I was sort of disappointed that my 28pt drow didn't get any more build points when epic-reincarnating.Hmmm. Not entirely sure what to do about that.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Hmmm. Not entirely sure what to do about that.

maybe include check box - apply tomes because of reincarnation...

[EllisDee37]

maybe include check box - apply tomes because of reincarnation...I'm not sure if it's worth it, to be honest.

On a side note, I'm guessing you're still getting all the extra linefeeds even with 0.9.4?

[Tesrali]

Did one of my builds. Looks awesome!!! TY!





18/2 Paladin/Fighter
Lawful Good Purple Dragon Knight


Level Order

1. Fighter 6. Paladin 11. Paladin 16. Paladin
2. Paladin 7. Paladin 12. Paladin 17. Paladin
3. Paladin 8. Paladin 13. Paladin 18. Paladin
4. Paladin 9. Paladin 14. Paladin 19. Paladin
5. Paladin 10. Paladin 15. Fighter 20. Paladin


Stats
28pt 32pt 34pt 36pt Tome Level Up
---- ---- ---- ---- ---- --------
Strength 16 16 16 16 +6 4: CHA
Dexterity 8 8 8 8 +6 8: CHA
Constitution 13 14 15 16 +6 12: CHA
Intelligence 13 14 14 14 +6 16: CHA
Wisdom 8 8 8 8 +6 20: CHA
Charisma 15 16 16 16 +6 24: CHA
28: CHA

Skills
F P P P P P P P P P P P P P F P P P P P
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
------------------------------------------------------------
Balance 2 ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ ½ 11
------------------------------------------------------------
4 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 0
20 5 5 5 5 5 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 7 7 7 7 7 7


Feats

1 : Single Weapon Fighting
1 PDK : Cleave
1 Fighter: Power Attack
2 Deity : Follower of: Amaunator
3 : Completionist
6 : Great Cleave
7 Deity : Amaunator's Brilliance
9 : Improved Single Weapon Fighting
12 : Greater Single Weapon Fighting
15 : Improved Critical: Piercing
15 Fighter: Shield Mastery
18 : Improved Shield Mastery
21 Epic : Overwhelming Critical
24 Epic : Precision
26 Destiny: Perfect Single Weapon Fighting
27 Epic : Epic Fortitude
28 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting


Spells

1. Bless, Lesser Restoration, Lionheart, Divine Favor
2. Angelskin, Resist Energy, Remove Paralysis
3. Remove Curse, Magic Circle Against Evil
4. Holy Sword, Zeal

Enhancements (65 of 80 AP)

Purple Dragon Knight (1 AP)
• Damage Boost

Knight of the Chalice (39 AP)
• Slayer of Evil, Courage of Heaven, Slayer of Evil II, Improved Courage of Heaven, Slayer of Evil III
1. Extra Turning III, Extra Smite II
2. Divine Might III, Exalted Cleave III
3. Exalted Smite III, Charisma
4. Censure Demons, Empowered Smite, Charisma
5. Censure Outsiders, Holy Retribution I, Avenging Cleave III, Sealed Life

Harper Agent (5 AP)
• Agent of Good I
1. Weathered Traveler I, Traveler's Toughness III

Kensei (10 AP)
• Kensei Focus: Picks and Hammers
1. Extra Action Boost III, Haste Boost III

Destiny (24 AP)

Fury of the Wild
1. Primal Scream III, Fast Healing II, Strength
2. Acute Instincts III, Strength
3. Strength
4. Sense Weakness III, Overwhelming Force III
5. Fury Eternal
6. Unbridled Fury

Twists of Fate (22 fate points)
1. Grim Precision (Tier 3 Shadowdancer)
2. Sacred Ground (Tier 3 Crusader)
3. Consecration (Tier 2 Crusader)

[Vasax]

Release the source on GitHub = Win.

[UurlockYgmeov]

I'm not sure if it's worth it, to be honest.

On a side note, I'm guessing you're still getting all the extra linefeeds even with 0.9.4?

a - agree. KISS is best. Elegance is often expressed in simplisity.

b - shhh.... I blame msoft and winX.

[mna]

(checkbox to apply "previous life" tomes due to LR/ER on 28/32 point builds too)

I'm not sure if it's worth it, to be honest.

Well. Really a question of target audience here - you and I don't need it, but those who are less experienced might. But then I get the idea that you mostly expect that segment to use Ron's planner instead?


Skill points is really quite minor compared to using tomes for feat prerequisites in this, anyway.

Hm... well, on the other hand, +4 is the only stat tome to coincide with a standard feat level, right? So mostly affects bonus feat slots.


I'd probably put the checkbox in there anyway, and make it apply regardless of build points. I mean, you *can* be a second life without any significant tomes already... (my oldest son managed to farm 20 tokens and TR one of his characters without finding any tomes, and before getting Epic Destinies too. Also with less than 1750 favor total.)

[EllisDee37]

Did one of my builds. Looks awesome!!! TY!Very cool.

Don't forget to check the BBCodes checkbox in the output screen for posting to the forums.

[kanordog]

Tried the builder with using my last PL and I found it really good.
Clean and quick just as I like it.

Thank You for putting (lot of) work into this project!

[UurlockYgmeov]

error/change of note:

Ravager tree:

tier 5 - Bully now costs 1 AP per level instead of 2.

other than that - :D

Oxymoronic Barbarian mk IV
18/2 Barbarian/Rogue
Chaotic Good Shadar-kai


Level Order


1. Rogue. . . . . .6. Barbarian . . .11. Barbarian. . . 16. Barbarian
2. Barbarian. . . .7. Barbarian . . .12. Barbarian. . . 17. Barbarian
3. Barbarian. . . .8. Barbarian . . .13. Barbarian. . . 18. Barbarian
4. Barbarian. . . .9. Barbarian . . .14. Barbarian. . . 19. Barbarian
5. Barbarian. . . 10. Barbarian . . .15. Rogue. . . . . 20. Barbarian


Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt . . 34pt. . .36pt. . .Tome . . Level Up
. . . . . . . .---- . . ----. . .----. . .---- . . --------
Strength. . . . 11. . . .14 . . . 14 . . . +6. . . .4: INT
Dexterity . . . 12. . . .12 . . . 14 . . . +6. . . .8: INT
Constitution. . 17. . . .17 . . . 17 . . . +6. . . 12: INT
Intelligence. . 16. . . .17 . . . 17 . . . +6. . . 16: INT
Wisdom. . . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . .8 . . . +6. . . 20: INT
Charisma. . . . .6. . . . 6 . . . .6 . . . +6. . . 24: INT
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: INT


Skills
. . . . . R .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. R .B. B .B. B .B
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Disable . 4 .½. 1 .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. 1 .1. ½ .1. ½ .1. 3 .1½ 1½ 1. 1 .1. 23
Search. . 4 .1. . .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .2. 2 .2. 23
Spot. . . 4 .1. 1 .½. ½ .½. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
UMD . . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Open Lo . 4 . . . .½. 1 .½. 1 .1. 1 .½. 1 .1. 1½ 1. 4 .1. 1 .½. ½ .1. 22
Heal. . . 2 . . 1 . . ½ . . 1 .1. ½ . . ½ . . . . . 1 . . . . . ½ . . .8
Bluff . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Balance . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Jump. . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Tumble. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Haggle. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .44 .7. 8 .8. 8 .8. 9 .9. 9 .9 10 10 10 10 15 11 11 11 12 12


Feats


.1. . . . : Power Attack
.3. . . . : Cleave
.6. . . . : Great Cleave
.9. . . . : Improved Critical: Piercing
12. . . . : Two Weapon Fighting
15. . . . : Insightful Reflexes
18. . . . : Improved Two Weapon Fighting
21 Epic . : Greater Two Weapon Fighting
24 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Epic . : Blinding Speed
28 Destiny: Holy Strike


Enhancements (83 of 80 AP) - Errors


Ravager (45 AP)


Furious Rage, Pain Touch, Demoralizing Success, Pain Touch II, Subsiding Fury


Ritual Scarring III, Hate III, Do You Like Pain? III, Barbarian Power Attack III
I Like Pain III, Melee Power Boost III
Slaughter III
Laughter, I Hit Back! III
Blood Strength, Bully III, Uncanny Balance, Critical Rage II



Harper Agent (14 AP)


Agent of Good I, Intelligence


Harper Enchantment, Strategic Combat, Awareness III
<none>
Strategic Combat, Intelligence



Occult Slayer (22 AP)


Weapon Bond, Resistance, Elemental Defense, Blank Thoughts


Extend Rage III, Ear Smash III, Parrying Bond III, Uncanny Dodger III
Guarding Bond III
Arcane Encumberance III



Frenzied Berserker (2 AP)


Die Hard


Extra Rage I



Destiny (24 AP)


Divine Crusader


Bane of Undeath, Interrogation, Purge the Wicked
Consecration III, Flames of Purity I
Sacred Ground, Blessed Blades
No Regret, Crusade
Castigation, Heavenly Presence, Celestial Champion
Strike Down


Twists of Fate (26 fate points) - Error


Volcano's Edge (Tier 4 Dreadnought)
Lay Waste (Tier 3 Dreadnought)
Technician (Tier 1 Shadowdancer)
Fast Healing (Tier 1 Fury)

[EllisDee37]

Very cool.


Ravager tree:

tier 5 - Bully now costs 1 AP per level instead of 2.Thanks much, I'll get that updated.

You may be happy to know that I'm steadily making progress on the Import feature, having finished the header, level order, stats and skills part of importing. Still to go are feats, spells, enhancements and destinies. It's pretty slow going, but I've not run into any unsurmountable issues as of yet.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Very cool.

Thanks much, I'll get that updated.

You may be happy to know that I'm steadily making progress on the Import feature, having finished the header, level order, stats and skills part of importing. Still to go are feats, spells, enhancements and destinies. It's pretty slow going, but I've not run into any unsurmountable issues as of yet.

awesome!

Now trying out the build with FotW. :D

[EllisDee37]

Like I said, this one could well be a Wine bug, just tell me it works right on Windows and I'll leave it at that.
[...]
Are you by chance passing it a long field padded with spaces?

The old VB6 board I used to frequent is still alive and kicking, so I asked about this over there.They seem fairly hopeful that padding with null characters (ASC code 0) instead of spaces should correct the problem for you, and testing shows that it has no ill-effects for me on Windows 7. More accurately, they said I should have been padding with null characters anyway, regardless of any Wine issues, so I'm hopeful this will get you sorted out. That's a particularly nasty bug, in that if you're tired or distracted you could lose an entire build fairly easily. I'm hopeful 0.9.5 will get you squared away.



Feat import is done, now on to spells. (And I just added logic to suppress spell output if your build has cleric levels but you never set any spells. Clerics automatically get cure spells in their spell list so 0.9.4 will think you actually set those manually and thus output the spells section even when you leave it "blank".)

[EllisDee37]

The forums annoyingly add extra spaces to the start of every line if you copy & paste a preview, so the only way I can test the import is with actually posted builds. I've been using the Kensei Warpriest, Count of Monte Cristo, and Oxymoronic Barbarian for testing but some edge cases require specialty builds to fully test. This will be my testing post.


Spell Test
16/4 Wizard/Favored Soul
Drow


Level Order

1. Wizard . . . . .6. Wizard. . . . .11. Wizard . . . . 16. Wizard
2. Wizard . . . . .7. Favored Soul. .12. Favored Soul . 17. Wizard
3. Wizard . . . . .8. Wizard. . . . .13. Wizard . . . . 18. Wizard
4. Favored Soul . .9. Favored Soul. .14. Wizard . . . . 19. Wizard
5. Wizard . . . . 10. Wizard. . . . .15. Wizard . . . . 20. Wizard


Stats
. . . . . . . .30pt
. . . . . . . .----
Strength. . . . 18
Dexterity . . . 18
Constitution. . 10
Intelligence. . 10
Wisdom. . . . . .8
Charisma. . . . 10. . .


Skills
. . . . . W .W. W .F. W .W. F .W. F .W. W .F. W .W. W .W. W .W. W .W
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Concent . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Spellcr . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . . 8 .2. 2 .2. 2 .2. 2 .2. 2 .2. 2 .2. 2 .2. 2 .2. 2 .2. 2 .2


Feats (Errors)

.1. . . . : Augment Summoning
.1 Wizard : Enlarge Spell
.3. . . . : Brutal Throw
.4 Deity. : Follower of: Sovereign Host
.6. . . . : Combat Casting
.6 Wizard : Extend Spell
.9. . . . : Dodge
.9 Deity. : Child of: Sovereign Host
12. . . . : Discipline
14 Wizard : Eschew Material
15. . . . : Empower Healing Spell
18. . . . : Mental Toughness
19 Wizard : Spell Focus: Illusion


Spells

Wizard
Charm Person, Detect Secret Doors, Expeditious Retreat, Mage Armor, Master's Touch
Bull's Strength, Eagle's Splendor, False Life, Glitterdust, Hypnotic Pattern
Displacement, Fireball, Haste, Halt Undead, <Any>
Crushing Despair, Dimension Door, Fire Shield, <Any>, <Any>
Cyclonic Blast, Dominate Person, Hold Monster, Mass Repair Light Damage, Mind Fog
Disintegrate, Globe of Invulnerability, Mass Bear's Endurance, Mass Eagle's Splendor
Mass Protection from Elements, <Any>, <Any>, <Any>
<Any>, <Any>, <Any>
Favored Soul
Cause Fear, Divine Favor, Nightshield, Nimbus of Light
Cure Moderate Wounds

[EllisDee37]

It'll be another day or two before I get 0.9.5 posted.

I went ahead and added the "Apply tomes early?" checkbox to the build file, and am in the process of adding it to the tomes section of the stats screen. This will also impact the import logic. Speaking of import, I added spells as well, so now all that's left are enhancements and destiny+twists.

I also added Author and Link fields to the build file and default Author to the options screen. Author is mostly pointless, but I'm already quite enjoying the Link feature. From the overview screen you can click the Open Link button to open up the forum thread for that build. (You have to manually supply the link, of course.)

Existing build files (as well as your settings) will be automatically converted to the new file structures when you open them.

[UurlockYgmeov]

It'll be another day or two before I get 0.9.5 posted.

I went ahead and added the "Apply tomes early?" checkbox to the build file, and am in the process of adding it to the tomes section of the stats screen. This will also impact the import logic. Speaking of import, I added spells as well, so now all that's left are enhancements and destiny+twists.

I also added Author and Link fields to the build file and default Author to the options screen. Author is mostly pointless, but I'm already quite enjoying the Link feature. From the overview screen you can click the Open Link button to open up the forum thread for that build. (You have to manually supply the link, of course.)

Existing build files (as well as your settings) will be automatically converted to the new file structures when you open them.

I am Groot! (sorry young Groot in a pot has been on my mind since... well spoilers)

[nibel]

Minor bug: Mobility can be put into a Fighter bonus feat slot, although they can't be chosen as a Fighter bonus feat in the game. Easily checked by building a 1st level fighter, and putting Dodge in the normal feat slot.

Need to check if Spring Attack and Shot on the Run are also non-fighter bonus feats. The wiki says they are, but the wiki was wrong about Mobility (I just edited the entry).

[Ayseifn]

Not sure if it's been mentioned but the monk 3rd level feat lets you take any monk bonus feat and not just light/dark paths.

[EllisDee37]

Minor bug: Mobility can be put into a Fighter bonus feat slot, although they can't be chosen as a Fighter bonus feat in the game. Easily checked by building a 1st level fighter, and putting Dodge in the normal feat slot.

Need to check if Spring Attack and Shot on the Run are also non-fighter bonus feats. The wiki says they are, but the wiki was wrong about Mobility (I just edited the entry).Mobility updated. Let me know of any more fixes to be done. (I based most of my data on wiki.)


Not sure if it's been mentioned but the monk 3rd level feat lets you take any monk bonus feat and not just light/dark paths.Ah, yeah, I know what's going on there. I'll get that fixed.

[EllisDee37]

The import logic is sturdy in that it mostly doesn't care what browser you're using. The one exception is lists; each browser seems to handle lists differently when you copy them to the clipboard.

If you use a browser not listed below, (like, say, Safari?), you can test for yourself to see if I need to add additional logic to support it. Check by copying the following lists to the clipboard and pasting it into notepad. If your results look different than the results in code tags below, and the posted logic wouldn't work, let me know.

Copy the following text from dashes to dashes (no need to include the dashes) and paste it into notepad:

-----------------------------------------------------

Tree with numbers
Core enhancements
Tier one
Tier two
Tree without numbers
Core enhancements
Tier one
Tier two
-----------------------------------------------------

Here's the results from the various browsers I've tested to see if yours matches:


Firefox 36.0.4

Tree with numbers

Core enhancements
Tier one
Tier two


Tree without numbers

Core enhancements
Tier one
Tier two


Chrome 41.0.blah blah blah

Tree with numbers
Core enhancements
Tier one
Tier two

Tree without numbers
Core enhancements
Tier one
Tier two


IE11

Tree with numbers
•Core enhancements
1.Tier one
2.Tier two


Tree without numbers
•Core enhancements
•Tier one
•Tier two



I do not check browser versions; the import logic is "one size fits all." Here's the logic for handling list lines:

1) Ignore blank lines
2) Trim() leading and trailing spaces
3) If the first character is "•", strip it out
4) If the first character is a digit (1-9) and the second character is a period (.), strip both out
5) Trim() leading and trailing spaces one last time

If you get different results from the ones posted, and the logic outlined won't support your results, post them (with code tags) to the thread and I'll add support for you. The import is trying to make all list lines straight unformatted text, like the chrome output. (Ignoring the blank line between trees, of course.)

EDIT: Also, enhancements are now done, only destiny/twists to go.

[Ancient]

Just a suggestion:

In the skill builder, it is possible to clear a row by right clicking on the skill. What about clearing a column by right clicking on the level?

Great tool, I really like it.

[EllisDee37]

In the skill builder, it is possible to clear a row by right clicking on the skill. What about clearing a column by right clicking on the level?Sure, I don't see why not. It'll probably take longer to update the help screen than to actually implement the functionality. (Maybe like 10 and 5 minutes, respectively.)


Since I'm changing the build file data structure for this next update, is there anything else you guys would like to store in there? The two possibilities that jump to mind would be a memo-style notes field and a "style" dropdown. I was thinking style being a choice of:

THF Melee
TWF Melee
SWF Melee
S&B Melee
Unarmed
Quarterstaff
Thrower
Range
Repeater
DC Caster
Nuker

The downside of a style dropdown is that there is currently, and likely won't be for a while, any way to actually use the field in a meaningful way. Ideally it would be involved a filter/sort option when opening builds, but the open file dialog is an operating system feature I can't modify. I'm not sure I want to bother writing a homegrown file open dialog. Even ignoring that, it might be a useful tidbit to include in the build header for output.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Sure, I don't see why not. It'll probably take longer to update the help screen than to actually implement the functionality. (Maybe like 10 and 5 minutes, respectively.)


Since I'm changing the build file data structure for this next update, is there anything else you guys would like to store in there? The two possibilities that jump to mind would be a memo-style notes field and a "style" dropdown. I was thinking style being a choice of:

THF Melee
TWF Melee
SWF Melee
S&B Melee
Unarmed
Quarterstaff
Thrower
Range
Repeater
DC Caster
Nuker

The downside of a style dropdown is that there is currently, and likely won't be for a while, any way to actually use the field in a meaningful way. Ideally it would be involved a filter/sort option when opening builds, but the open file dialog is an operating system feature I can't modify. I'm not sure I want to bother writing a homegrown file open dialog. Even ignoring that, it might be a useful tidbit to include in the build header for output.

like it. now for the 'what-if' functionality.

SO here's the primary build; but here is the alternative (ED/Twist) version. :P

[mna]

Just a suggestion:

In the skill builder, it is possible to clear a row by right clicking on the skill. What about clearing a column by right clicking on the level?



Sure, I don't see why not. It'll probably take longer to update the help screen than to actually implement the functionality. (Maybe like 10 and 5 minutes, respectively.)

Oh hey, speaking of the skill builder... there's the option of assigning points on alternate levels, but is there a way to switch that between odd/even levels? (I tried a couple of times and always had it put the points on even-numbered levels when I tried that on my tempest/warpriest trapper, which gets a lot more skill points and useful class skills on odd-numbered levels.)


And what would be useful probably a lot of extra work to implement (and in no way essential), would be to have a system that'd auto-fill skill ranks only where it finds free points, using class-skill levels first.


Since I'm changing the build file data structure for this next update, is there anything else you guys would like to store in there? The two possibilities that jump to mind would be a memo-style notes field and a "style" dropdown. I was thinking style being a choice of:

THF Melee
TWF Melee
SWF Melee
S&B Melee
Unarmed
Quarterstaff
Thrower
Range
Repeater
DC Caster
Nuker

A notes field would be a good idea, especially if there's also the author and version/date metadata for sharing builds. (I'd suggest author, date, build name, build variant, version number, forum link, and notes.)

Style list isn't a bad idea but not something that I'd consider essential, especially if a human-readable version of that data could be easily included in a notes or variant field, as freeform text, and I expect that a lot of people might include something relevant in the build name already.

Other suggestions to the list if you're making one anyway:

+ Wolf form
+ Bear form
+ healbot
+ utility/special/"other" (category for hagglers, crafters, chestblessers, swimmers, challenge / event farmers and such)
+ hybrid

I kind of like hybrid builds myself for tactical flexibility, but that's just me.

I'd probably default-suggest race in the variant field if it doesn't default to blank.



The clickable forum link might be a problem in some situations, but I agree that it'd be a nice convenience feature.

[EllisDee37]

Forgive the output testing:

UurlockYgmeov, when I copy and paste the contents of that text file, this is what goes to the forums:

Oxymoronic Barbarian mk IV
18/2 Barbarian/Rogue
Chaotic Good Shadar-kai


Level Order

1. Rogue. . . . . .6. Barbarian . . .11. Barbarian. . . 16. Barbarian
2. Barbarian. . . .7. Barbarian . . .12. Barbarian. . . 17. Barbarian
3. Barbarian. . . .8. Barbarian . . .13. Barbarian. . . 18. Barbarian
4. Barbarian. . . .9. Barbarian . . .14. Barbarian. . . 19. Barbarian
5. Barbarian. . . 10. Barbarian . . .15. Rogue. . . . . 20. Barbarian


Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt . . 34pt. . .36pt. . .Tome . . Level Up
. . . . . . . .---- . . ----. . .----. . .---- . . --------
Strength. . . . 11. . . .14 . . . 14 . . . +6. . . .4: INT
Dexterity . . . 12. . . .12 . . . 14 . . . +6. . . .8: INT
Constitution. . 17. . . .17 . . . 17 . . . +6. . . 12: INT
Intelligence. . 16. . . .17 . . . 17 . . . +6. . . 16: INT
Wisdom. . . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . .8 . . . +6. . . 20: INT
Charisma. . . . .6. . . . 6 . . . .6 . . . +6. . . 24: INT
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: INT

Skills
. . . . . R .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. R .B. B .B. B .B
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Disable . 4 .½. 1 .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. 1 .1. ½ .1. ½ .1. 3 .1½ 1½ 1. 1 .1. 23
Search. . 4 .1. . .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .2. 2 .2. 23
Spot. . . 4 .1. 1 .½. ½ .½. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
UMD . . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Open Lo . 4 . . . .½. 1 .½. 1 .1. 1 .½. 1 .1. 1½ 1. 4 .1. 1 .½. ½ .1. 22
Heal. . . 2 . . 1 . . ½ . . 1 .1. ½ . . ½ . . . . . 1 . . . . . ½ . . .8
Bluff . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Balance . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Jump. . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Tumble. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Haggle. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .44 .7. 8 .8. 8 .8. 9 .9. 9 .9 10 10 10 10 15 11 11 11 12 12


Feats

.1. . . . : Power Attack
.3. . . . : Cleave
.6. . . . : Great Cleave
.9. . . . : Improved Critical: Piercing
12. . . . : Two Weapon Fighting
15. . . . : Insightful Reflexes
18. . . . : Improved Two Weapon Fighting
21 Epic . : Greater Two Weapon Fighting
24 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Epic . : Blinding Speed
28 Destiny: Holy Strike


Enhancements (83 of 80 AP) - Errors

Ravager (45 AP)
Furious Rage, Pain Touch, Demoralizing Success, Pain Touch II, Subsiding Fury
Ritual Scarring III, Hate III, Do You Like Pain? III, Barbarian Power Attack III
I Like Pain III, Melee Power Boost III
Slaughter III
Laughter, I Hit Back! III
Blood Strength, Bully III, Uncanny Balance, Critical Rage II

Harper Agent (14 AP)
Agent of Good I, Intelligence
Harper Enchantment, Strategic Combat, Awareness III
<none>
Strategic Combat, Intelligence

Occult Slayer (22 AP)
Weapon Bond, Resistance, Elemental Defense, Blank Thoughts
Extend Rage III, Ear Smash III, Parrying Bond III, Uncanny Dodger III
Guarding Bond III
Arcane Encumberance III

Frenzied Berserker (2 AP)
Die Hard
Extra Rage I

Destiny (24 AP)

Divine Crusader
Bane of Undeath, Interrogation, Purge the Wicked
Consecration III, Flames of Purity I
Sacred Ground, Blessed Blades
No Regret, Crusade
Castigation, Heavenly Presence, Celestial Champion
Strike Down

Twists of Fate (26 fate points) - Error
Volcano's Edge (Tier 4 Dreadnought)
Lay Waste (Tier 3 Dreadnought)
Technician (Tier 1 Shadowdancer)
Fast Healing (Tier 1 Fury)


I see no extra blank lines, or any unexpected issues at all. Could you copy and paste the contents of the text file you emailed me to the thread for comparison?

[mna]

They seem fairly hopeful that padding with null characters (ASC code 0) instead of spaces should correct the problem for you, and testing shows that it has no ill-effects for me on Windows 7. More accurately, they said I should have been padding with null characters anyway, regardless of any Wine issues, so I'm hopeful this will get you sorted out. That's a particularly nasty bug, in that if you're tired or distracted you could lose an entire build fairly easily. I'm hopeful 0.9.5 will get you squared away.


Oh well, no change in the dialog behaviour in this 0.9.5 zip I downloaded...

The "Open Link" button works fine at least. Though I'd have expected to see the author and link fields in the export too?

[EllisDee37]

0.9.5 is up. Lots and lots of changes; just about every screen and section got a change of some kind. Details in the OP. Pretty much all changes discussed in thread are implemented.



Oh well, no change in the dialog behaviour in this 0.9.5 zip I downloaded...Bummer.


The "Open Link" button works fine at least. Though I'd have expected to see the author and link fields in the export too?Conceptually I don't think they apply to output.


Quick note that the 0.9.5 you snagged (very quickly!) has a minor bug in the import feature when importing a build with points spent in the Spellsinger tree. It sees a line start with "Spells" and tries to start the spells section again. heh. True to my cavalier nature regarding error checking, this bug crashes the entire program. I've already corrected and refreshed the 0.9.5 download, so that bug is fixed for anyone downloading 0.9.5 from now on.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Looking good!

One bit of change. NoWorries announced today (via forums) the EE ToEE part two will have a chance of dropping +7 tomes. Builder only supports +6. :P

[UurlockYgmeov]

Forgive the output testing:

UurlockYgmeov, when I copy and paste the contents of that text file, this is what goes to the forums:

Oxymoronic Barbarian mk IV
18/2 Barbarian/Rogue
Chaotic Good Shadar-kai


Level Order

1. Rogue. . . . . .6. Barbarian . . .11. Barbarian. . . 16. Barbarian
2. Barbarian. . . .7. Barbarian . . .12. Barbarian. . . 17. Barbarian
3. Barbarian. . . .8. Barbarian . . .13. Barbarian. . . 18. Barbarian
4. Barbarian. . . .9. Barbarian . . .14. Barbarian. . . 19. Barbarian
5. Barbarian. . . 10. Barbarian . . .15. Rogue. . . . . 20. Barbarian


Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt . . 34pt. . .36pt. . .Tome . . Level Up
. . . . . . . .---- . . ----. . .----. . .---- . . --------
Strength. . . . 11. . . .14 . . . 14 . . . +6. . . .4: INT
Dexterity . . . 12. . . .12 . . . 14 . . . +6. . . .8: INT
Constitution. . 17. . . .17 . . . 17 . . . +6. . . 12: INT
Intelligence. . 16. . . .17 . . . 17 . . . +6. . . 16: INT
Wisdom. . . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . .8 . . . +6. . . 20: INT
Charisma. . . . .6. . . . 6 . . . .6 . . . +6. . . 24: INT
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: INT

Skills
. . . . . R .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. R .B. B .B. B .B
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Disable . 4 .½. 1 .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. 1 .1. ½ .1. ½ .1. 3 .1½ 1½ 1. 1 .1. 23
Search. . 4 .1. . .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .2. 2 .2. 23
Spot. . . 4 .1. 1 .½. ½ .½. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
UMD . . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Open Lo . 4 . . . .½. 1 .½. 1 .1. 1 .½. 1 .1. 1½ 1. 4 .1. 1 .½. ½ .1. 22
Heal. . . 2 . . 1 . . ½ . . 1 .1. ½ . . ½ . . . . . 1 . . . . . ½ . . .8
Bluff . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Balance . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Jump. . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Tumble. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Haggle. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .44 .7. 8 .8. 8 .8. 9 .9. 9 .9 10 10 10 10 15 11 11 11 12 12


Feats

.1. . . . : Power Attack
.3. . . . : Cleave
.6. . . . : Great Cleave
.9. . . . : Improved Critical: Piercing
12. . . . : Two Weapon Fighting
15. . . . : Insightful Reflexes
18. . . . : Improved Two Weapon Fighting
21 Epic . : Greater Two Weapon Fighting
24 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Epic . : Blinding Speed
28 Destiny: Holy Strike


Enhancements (83 of 80 AP) - Errors

Ravager (45 AP)

Furious Rage, Pain Touch, Demoralizing Success, Pain Touch II, Subsiding Fury

Ritual Scarring III, Hate III, Do You Like Pain? III, Barbarian Power Attack III
I Like Pain III, Melee Power Boost III
Slaughter III
Laughter, I Hit Back! III
Blood Strength, Bully III, Uncanny Balance, Critical Rage II


Harper Agent (14 AP)

Agent of Good I, Intelligence

Harper Enchantment, Strategic Combat, Awareness III
<none>
Strategic Combat, Intelligence


Occult Slayer (22 AP)

Weapon Bond, Resistance, Elemental Defense, Blank Thoughts

Extend Rage III, Ear Smash III, Parrying Bond III, Uncanny Dodger III
Guarding Bond III
Arcane Encumberance III


Frenzied Berserker (2 AP)

Die Hard

Extra Rage I


Destiny (24 AP)

Divine Crusader

Bane of Undeath, Interrogation, Purge the Wicked
Consecration III, Flames of Purity I
Sacred Ground, Blessed Blades
No Regret, Crusade
Castigation, Heavenly Presence, Celestial Champion
Strike Down

Twists of Fate (26 fate points) - Error

Volcano's Edge (Tier 4 Dreadnought)
Lay Waste (Tier 3 Dreadnought)
Technician (Tier 1 Shadowdancer)
Fast Healing (Tier 1 Fury)


I see no extra blank lines, or any unexpected issues at all. Could you copy and paste the contents of the text file you emailed me to the thread for comparison?

Yeppers:

Oxymoronic Barbarian mk IV
18/2 Barbarian/Rogue
Chaotic Good Shadar-kai




Level Order


1. Rogue. . . . . .6. Barbarian . . .11. Barbarian. . . 16. Barbarian
2. Barbarian. . . .7. Barbarian . . .12. Barbarian. . . 17. Barbarian
3. Barbarian. . . .8. Barbarian . . .13. Barbarian. . . 18. Barbarian
4. Barbarian. . . .9. Barbarian . . .14. Barbarian. . . 19. Barbarian
5. Barbarian. . . 10. Barbarian . . .15. Rogue. . . . . 20. Barbarian




Stats
. . . . . . . .28pt . . 34pt. . .36pt. . .Tome . . Level Up
. . . . . . . .---- . . ----. . .----. . .---- . . --------
Strength. . . . 11. . . .14 . . . 14 . . . +6. . . .4: INT
Dexterity . . . 12. . . .12 . . . 14 . . . +6. . . .8: INT
Constitution. . 17. . . .17 . . . 17 . . . +6. . . 12: INT
Intelligence. . 16. . . .17 . . . 17 . . . +6. . . 16: INT
Wisdom. . . . . .8. . . . 8 . . . .8 . . . +6. . . 20: INT
Charisma. . . . .6. . . . 6 . . . .6 . . . +6. . . 24: INT
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: INT


Skills
. . . . . R .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. R .B. B .B. B .B
. . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Disable . 4 .½. 1 .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. 1 .1. ½ .1. ½ .1. 3 .1½ 1½ 1. 1 .1. 23
Search. . 4 .1. . .1. ½ .1. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .2. 2 .2. 23
Spot. . . 4 .1. 1 .½. ½ .½. ½ .½. ½ .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
UMD . . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
Open Lo . 4 . . . .½. 1 .½. 1 .1. 1 .½. 1 .1. 1½ 1. 4 .1. 1 .½. ½ .1. 22
Heal. . . 2 . . 1 . . ½ . . 1 .1. ½ . . ½ . . . . . 1 . . . . . ½ . . .8
Bluff . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Balance . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Jump. . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Tumble. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
Haggle. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .44 .7. 8 .8. 8 .8. 9 .9. 9 .9 10 10 10 10 15 11 11 11 12 12




Feats


.1. . . . : Power Attack
.3. . . . : Cleave
.6. . . . : Great Cleave
.9. . . . : Improved Critical: Piercing
12. . . . : Two Weapon Fighting
15. . . . : Insightful Reflexes
18. . . . : Improved Two Weapon Fighting
21 Epic . : Greater Two Weapon Fighting
24 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Epic . : Blinding Speed
28 Destiny: Holy Strike




Enhancements (83 of 80 AP) - Errors


Ravager (45 AP)


Furious Rage, Pain Touch, Demoralizing Success, Pain Touch II, Subsiding Fury


Ritual Scarring III, Hate III, Do You Like Pain? III, Barbarian Power Attack III
I Like Pain III, Melee Power Boost III
Slaughter III
Laughter, I Hit Back! III
Blood Strength, Bully III, Uncanny Balance, Critical Rage II



Harper Agent (14 AP)


Agent of Good I, Intelligence


Harper Enchantment, Strategic Combat, Awareness III
<none>
Strategic Combat, Intelligence



Occult Slayer (22 AP)


Weapon Bond, Resistance, Elemental Defense, Blank Thoughts


Extend Rage III, Ear Smash III, Parrying Bond III, Uncanny Dodger III
Guarding Bond III
Arcane Encumberance III



Frenzied Berserker (2 AP)


Die Hard


Extra Rage I



Destiny (24 AP)


Divine Crusader


Bane of Undeath, Interrogation, Purge the Wicked
Consecration III, Flames of Purity I
Sacred Ground, Blessed Blades
No Regret, Crusade
Castigation, Heavenly Presence, Celestial Champion
Strike Down


Twists of Fate (26 fate points) - Error


Volcano's Edge (Tier 4 Dreadnought)
Lay Waste (Tier 3 Dreadnought)
Technician (Tier 1 Shadowdancer)
Fast Healing (Tier 1 Fury)

[EllisDee37]

If that's how copying and pasting the text file ends up, I think it might be a browser issue unrelated to the builder.



One bit of change. NoWorries announced today (via forums) the EE ToEE part two will have a chance of dropping +7 tomes. Builder only supports +6. :PThanks for the head's up. I'll make that change when I update the rogue trees when U25 goes live.

[UurlockYgmeov]

If that's how copying and pasting the text file ends up, I think it might be a browser issue unrelated to the builder.


Thanks for the head's up. I'll make that change when I update the rogue trees when U25 goes live.

I suspected as much.

yw. the only unknown (even though can be extrapolated through empirical / existing data) is the ML.

[EllisDee37]

yw. the only unknown (even though can be extrapolated through empirical / existing data) is the ML.I'll be surprised and more than a little annoyed if it isn't ML27.

[UurlockYgmeov]

I'll be surprised and more than a little annoyed if it isn't ML27.

agree with all the above statements. :D

[EllisDee37]

I posted the complete source code (linked in OP) if anyone would like to play around with it. Fair warning that Visual Basic 6.0 is fairly tough to find nowadays, but what the heck, I figured I'd post it anyway. The project clocks in at right around 15,000 lines of code, plus another 2500 lines in generic helper functions.

I did take a look at some online version control services like SourceForge and GitHub, but I'm not really in the mood to mess with that. VB6 source code includes binary files, so it doesn't play well with others. Not that it can't be done, just more effort than I'm into right at this moment. If someone else wants to get the ball rolling on that, by all means go for it.

[Sisma]

Tried it out, pretty nice and complete... Just have to know pretty well enhances for all classes, as there's no description for them (you did warn us, tho...)
Maybe it's a stupid question, and I just didn't notice, but I can't find where to apply skill tomes... happened when I tried to build a KotC SWF Pally...

[UurlockYgmeov]

Tried it out, pretty nice and complete... Just have to know pretty well enhances for all classes, as there's no description for them (you did warn us, tho...)
Maybe it's a stupid question, and I just didn't notice, but I can't find where to apply skill tomes... happened when I tried to build a KotC SWF Pally...

no ability to apply skill tomes was included - was thought to be irrelevant to core idea of 'lite' design.

[EllisDee37]

I can't find where to apply skill tomes... happened when I tried to build a KotC SWF Pally...My understanding is that skill tomes don't help qualify for feats; only trained ranks meet prereqs. Is that not correct?

[Sisma]

My understanding is that skill tomes don't help qualify for feats; only trained ranks meet prereqs. Is that not correct?

Actually, as stat tomes do count for prerequisite purpose, skill tomes do the same... I'm just thinking about Single Weapon Fighting and Balance Skill points...

[EllisDee37]

Actually, as stat tomes do count for prerequisite purpose, skill tomes do the same... I'm just thinking about Single Weapon Fighting and Balance Skill points...Have you confirmed in-game that skill tomes satisfy feat prereqs? I think skill prereqs work differently than stat prereqs due to having "trained ranks." If skill tomes worked, then stat mod probably should too, and stat mod does not.

I haven't tested it in-game, though.