Swashbuckler Weapon

[Loromir]

Which do you think is the better choice. Celestia or Mutineer's Blade"


On the surface...seems to be a no brainer (Celestia), but Mutnineer's blade has expanded Crit range (17-20 vs 19-20). I'm still thinking Celestia, but a little torn.

[nivarch]

Which do you think is the better choice. Celestia or Mutineer's Blade"


On the surface...seems to be a no brainer (Celestia), but Mutnineer's blade has expanded Crit range (17-20 vs 19-20). I'm still thinking Celestia, but a little torn.

You are looking for an undead beater I guess.
Celestia is broken by swashbuckler so mutineer's blade

[TeacherSyn]

Which do you think is the better choice. Celestia or Mutineer's Blade"


On the surface...seems to be a no brainer (Celestia), but Mutnineer's blade has expanded Crit range (17-20 vs 19-20). I'm still thinking Celestia, but a little torn.

It depends on what you're trying to kill. I'm presuming you're using it against undead.

In which case, it looks like the Mutineer's Blade's many undead-hating properties edges out the Celestia in taking out the trash, but Celestia's higher base damage makes it a better choice against bosses.

EDIT: the first reply may be right. Because Celestia is a literal light blade, the Swashbuckler's innate abilities cause the Celestia to not work properly.

[Loromir]

Not necessarily looking for an undead beater. They have good qualities beyond vs. undead. I think both make decent trash beater weapons. Aside from those two, what else would u suggest for a swashbuckler weapon (I know Thunderforged Rapier is a good choice too).

[TeacherSyn]

Not necessarily looking for an undead beater. They have good qualities beyond vs. undead. I think both make decent trash beater weapons. Aside from those two, what else would u suggest for a swashbuckler weapon (I know Thunderforged Rapier is a good choice too).

Quite true. Many things just aren't protected against heavy light/fire damage.

You probably have a Turbulent Epee, a great general-purpose DR-busting weapon that's easily farmed, almost foregoing the need to make a Green Steel Mineral II, save its higher base damage I would guess.

Surprisingly, the Mutineer's Blade seems one of the few named Epic weapons out there. I've made a L16 Cormyrean crafted rapier that's not bad and plan to make L20 and L24 versions with this semi-random device from Eveningstar Challenges ingredients, which can churn out really good weapons with effects such as Improved Destruction, Corrosive Salt and Improved Paralyzing.

Harder to get would be a Drow Rapier of the Weapon Master.

As my character is rapidly approaching Epic on her first life, you make a good question and, aside from the weapons mentioned, this is an important problem that I can't answer to my own satisfaction. I think the Eveningstar weapons may be more helpful initially. But I have to remind myself that (depending on race) the Swashbuckler is not limited to rapiers alone, opening up options like the Elemental Fury shortsword that comes in many levels of power. I can use Sickles with my halfling, and the Devourer's Reaping (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Devourer%27s_Reaping) caught my eye with an incredible 14% Doublestrike and Greater Vorpal on it.

Similarly, Master's Riposte (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Master%27s_Riposte_(Level_26)), a longsword out of a Storm Horns quest, makes the Elemental Fury look like a Korthos Ember weapon in comparison.

[Jhaeran]

I am mostly undergeared but find myself using:

Sacrificial dagger - de-level/stat
High Priestestess' dagger - paralyze/stat/potency
Mutineers Blade rapier - undead and a good amount of others
Envenomed blade - shortsword - paralyze/poison

As my 4 primary weapons with a smiter, turbulent epee for specifics.

Saving up my TF ingots, not sure what I'm going to make.

[Seikojin]

I am mostly undergeared but find myself using:

Sacrificial dagger - de-level/stat
High Priestestess' dagger - paralyze/stat/potency
Mutineers Blade rapier - undead and a good amount of others
Envenomed blade - shortsword - paralyze/poison

As my 4 primary weapons with a smiter, turbulent epee for specifics.

Saving up my TF ingots, not sure what I'm going to make.

If you don't have a place to slot spellpower, potency is always nice. And reinvigoration stuff as well.

However, in the long run, you have to decide, trash or boss. I would utilize celestia for trash because exploit weakness and perfect single weapon fighting turn that sword into a light show. For a boss beater, you want less utility because they will have protection against it.

[unbongwah]

You probably have a Turbulent Epee, a great general-purpose DR-busting weapon that's easily farmed, almost foregoing the need to make a Green Steel Mineral II, save its higher base damage I would guess.
Min2 is better DPS and is ML:12 instead of 14, but as you say an Epee is a lot easier to acquire. Another option for CE mobs would be the Invaders (http://ddowiki.com/page/Invaders!)! weapons, in particular Tharkuul's Bane (http://ddowiki.com/page/Tharkuul%27s_Bane): the crit profile become 17-20 x3 w/Swashbuckling and you can use the red slot for Spellpower or silver augment.

Harder to get would be a Drow Rapier of the Weapon Master.
Swashbuckling's crit bonuses mean you can afford to think outside the box; consider the drow dagger or light mace (http://ddowiki.com/page/Drow_Light_Mace_of_the_Weapon_Master) instead, which usually sell for a lot less and the latter makes a nice complement to a Skullsmasher (http://ddowiki.com/page/Skullsmasher).

I can use Sickles with my halfling, and the Devourer's Reaping (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Devourer%27s_Reaping) caught my eye with an incredible 14% Doublestrike and Greater Vorpal on it.
That one caught my eye too. Seems like it was custom-made for Swashbucklers. :)

Similarly, Master's Riposte (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Master%27s_Riposte_(Level_26)), a longsword out of a Storm Horns quest, makes the Elemental Fury look like a Korthos Ember weapon in comparison.
And since when are longswords Finesseable? ;)

[redoubt]

You are looking for an undead beater I guess.
Celestia is broken by swashbuckler so mutineer's blade

To clarify... are you saying that part of the swashbuckler enhancements are retyping Celestia to something other that damage type "light"? If yes, which one(s)?

Thank you.

[unbongwah]

Celestia is broken by swashbuckler so mutineer's blade
Lemme guess: another instance where Celestia's light DPS is overridden and so it loses its DR bypass?

[Rull]

My weapon of choice:

4-11: Sky pirate's dagger
12-22: Skullsmasher
23-25: Ballizarde
26-28: Thunderforged light pick

switching IC: blugeoning to IC: Piercing at level24 @fred (skydagger and balizarde are keen)

[unbongwah]

Razorend (http://ddowiki.com/page/Razorend) is a viable alternative / complement to Skullsmasher: base dmg is almost the same; 13-20 x3 vs 15-20 x4 crits (presuming IC:Blunt w/Skullsmasher); and it's keen so it lets you skip / backload Imp Crit if you're feat-starved.

[ArcaneArcher52689]

To clarify... are you saying that part of the swashbuckler enhancements are retyping Celestia to something other that damage type "light"? If yes, which one(s)?

Thank you.

By increasing the enhancement bonus, it adds the "magic" damage type, which breaks Celestia




As for weapons, my current favorites are:
4-12: tiefling assassin's blade- because a 13-20/x3 that deals 1 con 40% of the time never gets old.
12-16: elemental rapier of air-so many procs that it's fun to watch
14-: turbulent Epee is my go to for DR breaking-not the best dps, but still good
16-20: envenomed blade- with a 45% bonus to attack speed, that 5% chance of paralyzing pays off
20+ Epic envenomed blade

[RoguemcStabby]

I would think for trash, maybe bosses, at lvl 23+ Balizarde would be a no brainer until you can craft a tier 3 TF rapier w- mortal fear....
Prior to that, I would think Razorend from Necropolis or some type of GS rapier (lit2?). Would be sufficient.


- Base 2.5(1d8)
- expanded threat range (if you don't have IC: Pierce)
- +8% dodge, +2 Good Luck, Parrying 8 (+4 insightful bonus to saves and AC) (for a total of +6 stacking saves on top of a normal resistance item)
- Phlebotomizing (3d8/hit)
- Crit Multiplier x3


ofc, the mutineer's blade has it's place..

[Rull]

Razorend is a viable alternative / complement to Skullsmasher: base dmg is almost the same; 13-20 x3 vs 15-20 x4 crits (presuming IC:Blunt w/Skullsmasher); and it's keen so it lets you skip / backload Imp Crit if you're feat-starved.

I think you are hugely overestimating 13/x3 compared to 15/x4.

When you factor in exploit weakness:
15/x4 means 40.9% of the time, which sums up to 122.7% crit damage.
13/x3 means critting 48.5% of the time, which sums up to 97% crit damage.
(compared to years ago, a regular (keen) greataxe had 20%, a khopesh 40% and what i considered crit-heavy, an eSOS had 60% crit danage... we've come a long way)

Put into perspective, a 13/x3 weapon with somehow twice the Overwhelming Critical epic feat still has a worse crit profile than a 15/x4 with none.

And Skullsmasher's 50 damage from ribcracker, 40.9% of the time for an average of 20 dmg per swing makes razorend's average 9 extra damage from 2d8 Hemorrhaging look insignificant.