Old airship amenities that are still useful to have in cargo hold

[AdamSmith]

This is a list of old airship amenities that are still useful to have along with the new amenities.

Sonic/Electric/Cold/Acid/Fire Resist +30
Guild Chests
Stone of Change
Altar of Epic Rituals
Device Workstation - currently Missing from Trapsmith's Workshop and Collegium of the Twelve
Banker/Mailbox/Auctioneer/Barkeep/Navigator/Twelve Planescaller (just for convenience)
House Deneith Defender (DR 1/-, stacking natural AC +1)
House Kundarak Battlemaster Contract (+1 stacking natural AC, +5 enhancement bonus to balance/haggle)
Darguun Hobgoblin Warrior (+4 stacking saves vs. fear, +2 competence bonus damage to your physical attacks, doesn't stack with competence bonus from items (link))
House Phiarlan Entertainer (+1 morale bonus to all skills, +1 morale bonus* to DCs on enchantments/illusions that you cast)
Clan Gnashtooth Kobold Shaman (Grants a +1 Sacred bonus to saves, a +1 Profane bonus to attack rolls, and a +1 stacking bonus to Natural Armor)



And here are some of the old ones I think we can toss out for good but if I'm wrong, please correct me:

Silver Flame Priest - heard it was bugged/useless
House Jorasco Healer (Stacking bonus to incoming healing +10%) - covered by Bath House
Training Dummy Blueprints (+2 stacking attack bonus for 1 hour, persistent except death). - covered by Tactical Training Room
Scholar of the Twelve (+1 non-stacking* spell penetration, +1 non-stacking* DC on evocations/conjurations that you cast) - covered by Arcane Sanctum and Archwizard
and any of the other old amenities I did not list like the old +2 stat shrines or XP shrines I believe we can toss out as well.

[droid327]

So far I only added altar of epic rituals and that was only because I couldn't find the one in the twelve. If it moved, I have no idea where it is now.

Its just outside the entrance to the Tower of the Twelve, just to the east.

[FestusHood]

The hobgoblin buff was changed to a guild bonus so now it does stack with items.

[droid327]

The hobgoblin buff was changed to a guild bonus so now it does stack with items.

but then it doesn't stack with the new guild buff version, does it?

[Bolo_Grubb]

If you do not spend astral shards on the new xp shrine, then the old xp shrine is still good to have.

So far our guild has not spent any astral shards on the ship amenities and we have been pretty happy with just the ones you can get for plat.

[Sisma]

and any of the other old amenities I did not list like the old +2 stat shrines or XP shrines I believe we can toss out as well.

Just one question: why?

[dunklezhan]

We still need/use our planescaller, we had to make some tough choices on the new buffs. I'll be honest though that I simply don't both with any of the others anymore, beyond the resist shrines and then only if I'm heading into an epic/elite or something as it saves on someone's (likely my own) SP at the start of the dungeon.

[Rykka]

Our ship only has the 3 Attribute buff rooms and the consolidated large resistance amenity, so the only things that are "useless" are the old Attribute Shrines and then only because we didn't have +3 shrines.

My understanding is that, among the many changes coming with U22.2 , new amenities will start dropping. And supposedly that would mean that the ability to buy old Amenities would be shut down.

So stock up your amenity bank toons.

[Krelar]

My understanding is that, among the many changes coming with U22.2 , new amenities will start dropping. And supposedly that would mean that the ability to buy old Amenities would be shut down.

So stock up your amenity bank toons.

You will be able to purchase old amenities until U23. (Previous stated by a dev but I'm too lazy to look up thee quote right now.)

[Rykka]

You will be able to purchase old amenities until U23. (Previous stated by a dev but I'm too lazy to look up thee quote right now.)

I see that U22.2 should be tomorrow and I haven't seen anything declarative myself. So I'm stocking up because, well, Turbine. If you're right I'm just jumping the gun and I'm just out Plat. No biggie.

[Violith]

Just one question: why?

exp shrine bugs the new one, or atleast it did, either way they dont stack. and there are new buffs that give +2 to stats, which dont stack with the old ones, so the old ones are useless.

[GreataxeUser]

All chests

[hunzi2010]

Hey guys,

on my ship I have all the resist shrines and all the people. i dont have the dummy or the stats or the teleporters, as we dont need them with the new buffs and captain.
but my question is if update 22.3 or when every they implement removing the availability of these shrines. what is the cargo hold going to be utilized for?
ok at the moment its holding the old buffs, and i believe everyone is enjoying the old buffs, so what will it be used for????
empty space????
i dont think those buffs are really effecting the game tooooo badly id say just leave them there.......

just my thought.

[blerkington]

This is a list of old airship amenities that are still useful to have along with the new amenities.

Sonic/Electric/Cold/Acid/Fire Resist +30
Guild Chests
Stone of Change
Altar of Epic Rituals
Device Workstation - currently Missing from Trapsmith's Workshop and Collegium of the Twelve
Banker/Mailbox/Auctioneer/Barkeep/Navigator/Twelve Planescaller (just for convenience)
House Deneith Defender (DR 1/-, stacking natural AC +1)
House Kundarak Battlemaster Contract (+1 stacking natural AC, +5 enhancement bonus to balance/haggle)
Darguun Hobgoblin Warrior (+4 stacking saves vs. fear, +2 competence bonus damage to your physical attacks, doesn't stack with competence bonus from items (link))
House Phiarlan Entertainer (+1 morale bonus to all skills, +1 morale bonus* to DCs on enchantments/illusions that you cast)
Clan Gnashtooth Kobold Shaman (Grants a +1 Sacred bonus to saves, a +1 Profane bonus to attack rolls, and a +1 stacking bonus to Natural Armor)



And here are some of the old ones I think we can toss out for good but if I'm wrong, please correct me:

Silver Flame Priest - heard it was bugged/useless
House Jorasco Healer (Stacking bonus to incoming healing +10%) - covered by Bath House
Training Dummy Blueprints (+2 stacking attack bonus for 1 hour, persistent except death). - covered by Tactical Training Room
Scholar of the Twelve (+1 non-stacking* spell penetration, +1 non-stacking* DC on evocations/conjurations that you cast) - covered by Arcane Sanctum and Archwizard
and any of the other old amenities I did not list like the old +2 stat shrines or XP shrines I believe we can toss out as well.

Hi,

In your 'toss out' list, you have included some amenities which smaller guilds may still be using because of the fewer hookpoints available to them (eg, Jorasco Healer, whose replacement takes a full large room slot under the new system), or by anyone because of a disinclination to pay AS for amenities which were previously available for plat (such as experience shrines).

I'm not sure whether the purpose of your post is just to help people see what might still be useful from the legacy list, or was to recommend that some legacy amenities be kept and some abolished, but I don't think your assessment of what can be kept and what can be tossed applies equally well to everyone.

Thanks.

[MindCakes]

Hi,

In your 'toss out' list, you have included some amenities which smaller guilds may still be using because of the fewer hookpoints available to them (eg, Jorasco Healer, whose replacement takes a full large room slot under the new system), or by anyone because of a disinclination to pay AS for amenities which were previously available for plat (such as experience shrines).

I'm not sure whether the purpose of your post is just to help people see what might still be useful from the legacy list, or was to recommend that some legacy amenities be kept and some abolished, but I don't think your assessment of what can be kept and what can be tossed applies equally well to everyone.

Thanks.
I thought the purpose was pretty clear. List the items to stock up on because soon they'll be irreplaceable/ inconvenient to replace.

So for example, a +2 STR buff is not one, because you can easily buy a room that provides it; Kundarak Battlemaster is one because new guild buff only adds up to +3 to skills.
Though you do raise a nice point, because Jorasco healer does pack the punch of a much larger amenity in significantly smaller package... but on the list there are navigator, banker, etc. that technically can be replaced* but it's more convenient not to, so maybe Jorasco healer should be there too...

*For example, classic navigator is IMHO better, because you go to the cargo hold, get resists and xp, then navigate to target, instead of needing to port to top deck and run to captain.

Also, the list is just suggestions. If for example the purple glow of puzzle room gives you epilepsy, by all means go stock up on INT/WIS shrines.

[SirValentine]

The XP shrine. Why? Because I can still buy the old 5% XP shrine for a few thousand plat, instead of forking over 1500+ A$tral $hard$.

[Chilldude]

I'm not sure whether the purpose of your post...


Several years ago Turbine created one of its largest mistakes ever, and that's saying a lot because they've had some doozies!, guild levels. Over the course of the next several years players earned the right to place significantly powerful buffs on their respective ships, with more and better buffs being available to higher level guilds. Once the majority of guilds attained a sufficient level as to obtain the majority of buffs Turbine decided to take away the buffs that guilds had already earned and sell back to them lesser, but longer lasting buffs.

Something happened somewhere and they were for some reason unable to promptly take away the good buffs players had earned as they had originally planned. (Go figure, Turbine mess up!?) They came up with the cargo hold for the interim while they fix whatever they messed up. Therefore, we currently have access to the old and the new, yet there are a few new buffs that do indeed replace the old with equivalent value.

The purpose of this thread is to highlight the old buffs that have actually been replaced by new buffs of equal value, thus making them redundant and a waste of time to maintain, use, and stock up on before it's too late.

[AdamSmith]

Just a note. This list assumes you or your guild is willing to purchase all the astral shard amenities (eventually). It might also be possible to obtain them as quest rewards with today's update. I'm not sure if the astral shard amenities are on the loot tables though.

[AdamSmith]

Also why aren't there NEW stone of change and altar of epic rituals (and device workstation amenities). Were these 3 overlooked or do you think they were intentionally omitted from the list of new amenities.

[The_Human_Cypher]

I was looking into the Cargo Hold buffs on the airships and found this old thread. Is the information here accurate? Airships could use one more pass to add a Class Trainers stateroom and also add more amenities to obviate the old Cargo Hold buffs so that Guilds don't have to maintain them.

/necro

[Cantor]

I was looking into the Cargo Hold buffs on the airships and found this old thread. Is the information here accurate? Airships could use one more pass to add a Class Trainers stateroom and also add more amenities to obviate the old Cargo Hold buffs so that Guilds don't have to maintain them.

/necro

they planned to just poof the old ones. enough people like them that they didn't good enough.

I agree that those empty state rooms need something, trainers would be nice and LGS altars.

[The_Human_Cypher]

they planned to just poof the old ones. enough people like them that they didn't good enough.

I agree that those empty state rooms need something, trainers would be nice and LGS altars.

Which of the old amenities are still useful? I am not sure if everything in the above list is accurate.

Also, which amenities could still be added that are obvious omissions such as the Class Trainers or Legendary Green Steel altars? There is definitely room for one more pass on the airships to add new amenities to fill out the empty hold space on the Kraken line, add additional airship cosmetics, and to consolidate the Cargo Hold buffs into new amenities or merge their effects into existing ones. The airship pass could even be part of a new House Lyrandar-themed adventure pack, with some quests involving House Lyrandar, airships battles, and related content.

[EllisDee37]

The ship buffs I keep in my guild's cargo hold, from right to left around the ring next to the entrance ramp:

House Kundarak
House Phiarlan
House Deneith
Kobold Shaman
Hobgoblin
Silver Flame
Scholar of the Twelve
Mind Flayer

Then behind the large amenities:

Training Dummy
Planescaller


The training dummy legitimately does nothing in terms of buffs, but sometimes you want to punch something to test stuff or even just a quickie dps check in low level heroics.

Other than the training dummy, I believe (but haven't confirmed in a while) that after taking the buff bar up top, hitting the listed amenities add icons to your buff bar, meaning they aren't fully duplicated by the new style buffs.

[Eelpout]

The ship buffs I keep in my guild's cargo hold, from right to left around the ring next to the entrance ramp:

House Kundarak
House Phiarlan
House Deneith
Kobold Shaman
Hobgoblin
Silver Flame
Scholar of the Twelve
Mind Flayer

Then behind the large amenities:

Training Dummy
Planescaller


The training dummy legitimately does nothing in terms of buffs, but sometimes you want to punch something to test stuff or even just a quickie dps check in low level heroics.

Other than the training dummy, I believe (but haven't confirmed in a while) that after taking the buff bar up top, hitting the listed amenities add icons to your buff bar, meaning they aren't fully duplicated by the new style buffs.

We keep all the same on our ship as well. I will add that we also keep all the elemental resist shrines, the xp shrine to save on Astral Shards, and the Large Guild Chest for some extra storage space. These can be a decent plat dump, but what else are you going to spend it on?

[EllisDee37]

We keep all the same on our ship as well. I will add that we also keep all the elemental resist shrines, the xp shrine to save on Astral Shards, and the Large Guild Chest for some extra storage space. These can be a decent plat dump, but what else are you going to spend it on?Oh, yeah, I meant to say those are the crew I maintain. In addition to those crewmen, I put the energy resists along the left wall (when first porting in they're on the left), the epic altar and stone of change behind the crew ring, and the NPCs along the right wall: tavern, auction, mail, bank.

We maxed out the astral amenities. Other than not wasting shards on combo resists and stats, we have recently finished upgrading all shard amenities, woohoo! (The last one we did was maxing guild storage.)

[The_Human_Cypher]

The ship buffs I keep in my guild's cargo hold, from right to left around the ring next to the entrance ramp:

House Kundarak
House Phiarlan
House Deneith
Kobold Shaman
Hobgoblin
Silver Flame
Scholar of the Twelve

Is the House Jorasco Healer redundant with the Bath House amenity? I don't see it on your list.

[EllisDee37]

Is the House Jorasco Healer redundant with the Bath House amenity? I don't see it on your list.As far as I could tell, yes it is.

[The_Human_Cypher]

As far as I could tell, yes it is.

I added the House Jorasco Healer crew member to our ship's Cargo Hold and tested it. When I click on the Healer, I receive no visible buff so this amenity is most likely redundant with the Bath House. I do receive a buff from the Silver Flame Priest, however, so that crew member doesn't seem bugged as indicated at the top of the thread.

[Cantor]

I tested all the crew when the amenities were first added and used to run only ones that did something. In the long run its just easier to keep them all up than worry if it's redundant. I had guild members asking why we didn't have xxxx and it's just easier to have them all than explain once a month why.

[SirValentine]

Silver Flame


Silver Flame adds a buff to buff bar, but many years ago was known to be bugged; the buff didn't actually do anything. Have they fixed it? I hadn't heard.

[The_Human_Cypher]

Let's hope Guild airships get one final pass and all of the Cargo Hold buffs that are still useful are merged with or replaced by amenities within the new system.

[AbyssalMage]

Let's hope Guild airships get one final pass and all of the Cargo Hold buffs that are still useful are merged with or replaced by amenities within the new system.
I doubt they will ever give us +30 elemental resists at lvl 1. That was one reason why they wanted to remove the legacy buffs. The new system was intended to scale as you level. Not sure if that just fell through or not though.

[Standal]

I doubt they will ever give us +30 elemental resists at lvl 1. That was one reason why they wanted to remove the legacy buffs. The new system was intended to scale as you level. Not sure if that just fell through or not though.

There was a lot of complaints about old plat buffs being replaced by shard buffs. So the devs caved and let the old buffs stay in the game. The resist shrines are the worst example of this. The newer resist + absorption buff is pretty powerful. Add the 30 resist from the cargo hold and it's just ridiculous.

[EllisDee37]

Silver Flame adds a buff to buff bar, but many years ago was known to be bugged; the buff didn't actually do anything. Have they fixed it? I hadn't heard.I was aware it was bugged a while ago, and have never heard of it being fixed.

Once the guild pass went live, I did the test of using the buff bar and then seeing what cargo hold buffs still gave me an icon. Any that gave me an icon in the buff bar got included in my ring of crew buffs. (Plus training dummy, because punching is fun!)

At the time my thinking was that even though the silver flame dude never did anything -- it certainly doesn't protect you from Command* like the spell does -- but it gave me an icon so I kept him active just on principle. I figured if they ever did fix him we'd already be in the habit. Of course they never fixed him, but oh well.

Note that it is technically possible that the silver flame buff gives +1 to saves and AC vs evil, which would be very difficult to verify one way or the other.


*Just Command, not Greater Command. Magic Circle Against Evil grants immunity to Greater Command.

[peng]

Pretty sure scholar of the 12 is covered by new-style buffs.

[EllisDee37]

Pretty sure scholar of the 12 is covered by new-style buffs.Testing now, I get a buff bar icon from the scholar. If I switch to my effects tab, I see the following messages when I refresh the scholar:

(Effects): You have multiple effects granting a Guild bonus to Evocation Focus that do not stack. ( Archwizard and Lore of the Twelve )
(Effects): You have multiple effects granting a Guild bonus to Conjuration Focus that do not stack. ( Archwizard and Lore of the Twelve )

There is no mention of the spell pen, so I assume the spell pen portion of it actually works and that's why you get a buff icon from the scholar.

[peng]

Arcane sanctum gives +1 guild bonus to spell pen. Scholar of the twelve *says* it's a guild bonus to spell pen. Just tested with a lvl 1 cleric vs a drow. D20 +2 without scholar (1 cleric + 1 sanctum), d20 + 3 with scholar. I guess it does stack, even if it shouldn't.

[EllisDee37]

Arcane sanctum gives +1 guild bonus to spell pen. Scholar of the twelve *says* it's a guild bonus to spell pen. Just tested with a lvl 1 cleric vs a drow. D20 +2 without scholar (1 cleric + 1 sanctum), d20 + 3 with scholar. I guess it does stack, even if it shouldn't.I vaguely recall that they all used to be non-stacking equipment bonus, but then during the guild pass they were supposed to be changed to a guild bonus. So maybe the spell pen is just a non-stacking equipment bonus.

Even still, that can be helpful for low level casters who might still be wearing old-style cannith crafted stuff, one effect per slot. eg: ML7 Belt of Greater False Life, etc... You can quickly run out of slots when you're only getting one effect per item, and spell pen is way down the list of priorities in early heroics.

So technically not completely useless, but not altogether useful. Still, if it gives you an icon, I put it in my cargo hold. The scholar and the priest can battle it out for most useless.

[bracelet]

The list in the first post is 100% correct. If you have the full complement of new amenities, then the ones the OP listed are the only ones left that do anything useful. I spent quite a bit of time testing these last year. I wish I had seen this list beforehand. It is identical to the one I came up with.

[The_Human_Cypher]

There was a lot of complaints about old plat buffs being replaced by shard buffs. So the devs caved and let the old buffs stay in the game. The resist shrines are the worst example of this. The newer resist + absorption buff is pretty powerful. Add the 30 resist from the cargo hold and it's just ridiculous.

As evidenced by the comments in this thread, the current airship amenity/buff system is somewhat messy and confusing with a number of obsolete buffs. One more airship pass would be a chance to fix these outstanding issues, fill in the gaps concerning amenities, and add some new amenities and features.

[bracelet]

As of update 41.3 the Phiarlan Entertainer cargo bay buff no longer stacks with the new amenities. It can be dropped if you already have the matching DC and skill amenities.

[peng]

As of update 41.3 the Phiarlan Entertainer cargo bay buff no longer stacks with the new amenities. It can be dropped if you already have the matching DC and skill amenities.

The skill buff actually seems to stack with new-style ship buffs, and now stacks with heroism too.

[bracelet]

The skill buff actually seems to stack with new-style ship buffs, and now stacks with heroism too.

My testing directly contradicts this. They are both guild buffs now and they do not stack. The Phiarlan entertainer used to be morale buffs which is what heroism grants. I was very careful in how I tested this. Maybe go back and check your results. Based on what you are claiming, I think it is highly likely that you do not have some or all of the skill amenities on your ship.

[peng]

https://i.imgur.com/yA4z8sCh.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/qjEbqRKh.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/sUkLCl5h.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/sA5kQe3h.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/zszLGeGh.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/G7raKbzh.jpg
Pretty sure that's all the ship skill buffs. Every skill goes up by exactly 1 (except the n/a because not a trapper). Seems to stack with bard song (music), focusing chant (circumstance), gh (morale), competence, insightful, quality, exceptional, and luck bonuses to skills.

[yfernbottom]

Stacks with profane (the drow mask) as well if I'm not mistaken. Can't double check right now.

[NemesisAlien]

Let's hope Guild airships get one final pass and all of the Cargo Hold buffs that are still useful are merged with or replaced by amenities within the new system.

Please dont remove my bewbs... I mean chest... i mean oh never mind...

[bracelet]

I will have to eat some humble pie here. I must have got it wrong every time yesterday. On three different toons, with no cargo bay buffs at all, the Phiarlan entertainer did absolutely nothing. Today however, the entertainer guild bonus is stacking with the amenity guild bonus. I can't explain it. I am embarrassed but glad I got it wrong.

I don't suppose you can verify whether spell DCs are changing? The tests yesterday and today show that they do not change when applying the entertainer buff. But now I don't trust myself.

[Lil_Mischif]

... One more airship pass would be a chance to fix these outstanding issues, fill in the gaps concerning amenities, and add some new amenities and features.

Not a bad idea and well-intentioned to be certain. But I'm sure everyone represented here already knows how things "work" with Turbine. So just be careful what you wish for! :eek:
As bad as things are, there is no such thing as "... can't get any worse!"

And BTW, all you DPSers and punch-bots out there, the Proving Ground has a couple of FREE Training Dummies.

[The_Human_Cypher]

Not a bad idea and well-intentioned to be certain. But I'm sure everyone represented here already knows how things "work" with Turbine. So just be careful what you wish for! :eek:
As bad as things are, there is no such thing as "... can't get any worse!"

And BTW, all you DPSers and punch-bots out there, the Proving Ground has a couple of FREE Training Dummies.

Turbine? During the most recent DDOcast "Ask the Devs" interview with SSG, Torc et al. indicated that they don't have room in their schedule at moment for a Guild airship pass. Let's hope that we get a final airship pass sometime during 2021-2022, however.

[Cordovan]

Closing as /necro.