Optionals Check mark Request,in LFMs

[Powskier]

Kinda confusing joining parties ,as different players go for Ops ,and Some continue in Zerg mode.Why have such different playstyles in the same party? Just give us an Optionals Y or N in lfm ,so we know right from joining.I have been in alot of parties that "kinda do some ops" what a 1/2 arse way of doin stuff;as players get left behind for tryin to get breakable bonus,or smthin'.i seen less Zerg listed runs,as most elite runs are Zerg now?Relax and enjoy a run or two:)and start listing Zergs as such again;worst is the invisa -lag ,as enemies notice the one player who can be seen anyways...red alert

[Vellrad]

Some people going for opts while rest continuing quest objectives makes zerging faster and giving more XP/min.

[Blackheartox]

People in zerg groups usualy only do worthwile xp/min opts.
Knowledge of quest will provide you with information beforehand on the fact if people will do opt or no.
If you point it out, lets do opt its fast and gives ok xp, most zerg groups will do it.
People dont like wasting 10 minutes in a opt that doesnt give any decent xp, but only 2-3 chests with random generated trash

[Nayus]

People forget you don't need 6 people to complete a quest. When I join a PUG that's doing well I usually wander off and do some opts to increase our XP, the other guys finish the quest just fine.

[Rykka]

People forget you don't need 6 people to complete a quest. When I join a PUG that's doing well I usually wander off and do some opts to increase our XP, the other guys finish the quest just fine.

This. Though it helps if you actually tell the group or at least the party leader what you're doing.

[Soulfurnace]

People in zerg groups usualy only do worthwile xp/min opts.
Knowledge of quest will provide you with information beforehand on the fact if people will do opt or no.
If you point it out, lets do opt its fast and gives ok xp, most zerg groups will do it.
People dont like wasting 10 minutes in a opt that doesnt give any decent xp, but only 2-3 chests with random generated trash
Or 1/2 will run off for opts/trap boni while the rest of the group finishes the quest - more xp all around and roughly the same run times. (Assuming everyone is pretty equal in skill and can self hjealz)

[Powskier]

kinda funny; some dungeons start out like a full sweep,then turn zergy smtimes....that's why I'd like to see a lfm checkbox,to refer to.The old arguement rears its head again...to not waste time in a game ,meant to spent time in......players who say they ''enjoy'' zergin past mobs and say it is a tactic are full of ****.Sneaking in the dice game was a tactic;....in the comptuer d&d it is only a Fast Foward thru content,that is being ''enjoyed'' by not playing it?

[Talonaise]

kinda funny; some dungeons start out like a full sweep,then turn zergy smtimes....that's why I'd like to see a lfm checkbox,to refer to.The old arguement rears its head again...to not waste time in a game ,meant to spent time in......players who say they ''enjoy'' zergin past mobs and say it is a tactic are full of ****.Sneaking in the dice game was a tactic;....in the comptuer d&d it is only a Fast Foward thru content,that is being ''enjoyed'' by not playing it?

Meh, just because you don't "Enjoy" it doesn't mean other are full of ...ahem...

Personally -- I love zerging, while you are "enjoying" one quest --- I can "Enjoy" six :)

If you want to slowly make your way through a quest, then may I suggest you put up your Own runs , with that clearly listed in the LFM so that you may find like minded people. If you are not willing to run it, then suck it up and just go with the flow of whatever group you join.

Or you could whine on the forums....

[pHo3nix]

Meh, just because you don't "Enjoy" it doesn't mean other are full of ...ahem...

Personally -- I love zerging, while you are "enjoying" one quest --- I can "Enjoy" six :)

If you want to slowly make your way through a quest, then may I suggest you put up your Own runs , with that clearly listed in the LFM so that you may find like minded people. If you are not willing to run it, then suck it up and just go with the flow of whatever group you join.

Or you could whine on the forums....

^This.

If you want people to follow your rules put up your lfm. If you join a lfm you can't force people to follow your rules. Just add "no zerg" or "flower sniffing" or "need heals" to the lfm, good zergers would never click on such lfm and you could enjoy your slow-paced experience, so it's a win-win for everyone ;)

[SirValentine]

This would lead to MORE confusion. In my experience most groups try to get some of the optional objectives. But very few that I've seen go for either of NONE or ALL. So does a some-optionals group put "Yes" or "No" for the Optionals check mark? It's misleading either way.

[ChemE]

This would lead to MORE confusion. In my experience most groups try to get some of the optional objectives. But very few that I've seen go for either of NONE or ALL. So does a some-optionals group put "Yes" or "No" for the Optionals check mark? It's misleading either way.

It's so hard to put together complete groups now, if I need a full party, I'll take zergers, lever pullers, pikers, when needed, dier's, optional guys, pretty much anyone that can see over the key board. Not a time to be picky on argo.

[Gremmlynn]

kinda funny; some dungeons start out like a full sweep,then turn zergy smtimes....that's why I'd like to see a lfm checkbox,to refer to.The old arguement rears its head again...to not waste time in a game ,meant to spent time in......players who say they ''enjoy'' zergin past mobs and say it is a tactic are full of ****.Sneaking in the dice game was a tactic;....in the comptuer d&d it is only a Fast Foward thru content,that is being ''enjoyed'' by not playing it?You likely wont get to far with this position here. As most of those who see video games as something to do, rather than something to get done, see video game forums as having little or no value at all.

[JOTMON]

Meh, just because you don't "Enjoy" it doesn't mean other are full of ...ahem...

Personally -- I love zerging, while you are "enjoying" one quest --- I can "Enjoy" six :)

If you want to slowly make your way through a quest, then may I suggest you put up your Own runs , with that clearly listed in the LFM so that you may find like minded people. If you are not willing to run it, then suck it up and just go with the flow of whatever group you join.

Or you could whine on the forums....

go go go..Pots are on Timer..

Wait wait wait.. theres a chest over here... or is it a mimic... nah its gotta be a chest a mimic wouldn't just sit here in the open with nothing around it...oops....

[Paleus]

I'm a little confused. Is this actually a request to add a checkbox function to an LFM specifically for "optionals." What exactly would be the difference between having that function from say, just writing it in the description of the LFM or speaking to players when they join and letting them know how you roll?

If this is not a request for a check-box, but rather a request that people mention that in their LFMs, it might be a little helpful, but won't have a black and white response. People interpret optionals differently. Do you mean quest objective optionals, or XP increases (i.e. ransack)? And as others have mentioned, if you take the same person and put them in two different quests they'll likely chase after optionals differently because certain quests have easy to get optionals and others have optionals that you could re-run the whole quest getting more XP in the time it takes you to pursue the optional. In the end, regardless of a checkbox or LFM statement people will always play the game differently than others and the only way to really guarantee a consistent experience is to group with people you know, which is admittedly limiting.

[Powskier]

players are not listing their runs as ""full,complete"' or ''zerg '' or''ops inc'' much ,anymore.As a party coordinates inthis fast pased scene,gameplan gets overlooked alot.A ops checkbox will eliminate confusin smtimes .....you Zergers want a Full party ,but Don't want players to see it is a Zerg run!You know alot of players will avoid joining if listed as 'Zerg"!....super funny how the "zergin'' gets so defended in forums.Guess you have some free time to post ,since you ran by most the enemies in the game.

[pHo3nix]

players are not listing their runs as ""full,complete"' or ''zerg '' or''ops inc'' much ,anymore.As a party coordinates inthis fast pased scene,gameplan gets overlooked alot.A ops checkbox will eliminate confusin smtimes .....you Zergers want a Full party ,but Don't want players to see it is a Zerg run!You know alot of players will avoid joining if listed as 'Zerg"!....super funny how the "zergin'' gets so defended in forums.Guess you have some free time to post ,since you ran by most the enemies in the game.

I wish adding "zerg" to my lfm would keep away people that cannot kill a single EE mob or that have no way to cast invisibility in epic levels, sadly it doesn't work :(

[TrinityTurtle]

Okay, this is going to be a completely radical idea, but take a minute and send a tell to the party leader and...ask him/her.

[Paleus]

players are not listing their runs as ""full,complete"' or ''zerg '' or''ops inc'' much ,anymore.As a party coordinates inthis fast pased scene,gameplan gets overlooked alot.A ops checkbox will eliminate confusin smtimes .....you Zergers want a Full party ,but Don't want players to see it is a Zerg run!You know alot of players will avoid joining if listed as 'Zerg"!....super funny how the "zergin'' gets so defended in forums.Guess you have some free time to post ,since you ran by most the enemies in the game.

So, to sum up the logic of this request. Players are not posting descriptions of their runs in their LFMs, but if given a checkbox with options, those same players would spend the time checking the boxes. I see a flaw in that logic.

There is honestly no way Turbine could program a solution to the problem you have encountered that would be more elegant or effective than simply sending a tell to the party leader or talking to them once joining. Or possibly just posting your own LFM where you take a moment to write out your requests for playstyle. Just because others aren't doing it, doesn't mean you cant.

[Seikojin]

People forget you don't need 6 people to complete a quest. When I join a PUG that's doing well I usually wander off and do some opts to increase our XP, the other guys finish the quest just fine.

This pretty much, but I typically let them know I am so if they don't want alerts or whatnot, they can pipe up on it.

Also, I think higher difficulties should have higher chances to spawn optionals.

[Powskier]

I always try to communicate...lotta reasons why communication isnt workin . Quest not started as a party; no ears on some; some talk way quiet or r to far from mic to hear them; I seen alot of quests start out like a smash everything ,just to evolve to a zerg run as party proceeds;weird......probbly no complete solution to playstyle differences...if a player asks about an Op,I always will go 4 it ,if possable.If I'm in another's party ,I ask leader what the preference.The Leader really has the most say .I think it comes down to time.Players don't have time ,but wanna finish more runs...they zerg and call it tactics.The Leaders Need to Step up and Say what they are doing!...alot of times I go in a run and they just invis and run off,without saying squat!!!!the General needs to take command of his troops,or Chaos ensues on the frontlines!!!

[Qhualor]

Its the party leaders responsibility to not only put it in the lfm notes, but to communicate to the group how he/she wants to run the quest so there shouldn't be any confusion. Party members can also ask the leader if they are not sure. Unfortunately, I don't see or hear much communication in these groups I join.

[golruul]

LFM panel needs some work, but I wouldn't want Turbine wasting time doing this.

This can be 100% resolved today by posting your own groups with your own criteria. Why aren't you doing this?

If you notice elite runs tend to be zergs and you don't like zerging, why are you joining these (elite run) groups? Why aren't you sending a tell to the leader to ask them if they (explicitly or not) zerg?

This topic screams "Why aren't other people doing everything they can to accommodate ME?".

Posting your own group solves these issues. And for what it's worth, I have a non-standard criteria that I post in my LFMs: "grab quest before joining". My groups fill up fine.

[Vellrad]

I always try to communicate...lotta reasons why communication isnt workin . Quest not started as a party; no ears on some; some talk way quiet or r to far from mic to hear them; I seen alot of quests start out like a smash everything ,just to evolve to a zerg run as party proceeds;weird......probbly no complete solution to playstyle differences...if a player asks about an Op,I always will go 4 it ,if possable.If I'm in another's party ,I ask leader what the preference.The Leader really has the most say .I think it comes down to time.Players don't have time ,but wanna finish more runs...they zerg and call it tactics.The Leaders Need to Step up and Say what they are doing!...alot of times I go in a run and they just invis and run off,without saying squat!!!!the General needs to take command of his troops,or Chaos ensues on the frontlines!!!

Unfortnately, command 'hold the line at all cost, don't flee blindly after taking a one hit, your life is worth less than this postion' is always ignored :/

Noobs always break formation and run after mob reduces their HP by 50% after 1 blow. They won't fight in earthquakes, they wont just move few feets to use healing or displacement clicky, what's more they don't even have such basic things. They usually run away after agroing trash, mobs chase them, leave spot that is filled with shiradi earthquakes, ice storms, acid rains, solid fogs, and whatever, so melees and casters can't just continue AoEing enemies.

I'm just cleaving warpriest, and it annoys me, if I were druid or enchanter, I'd rip my hair in frustration after such behavior. :D

[Talonaise]

go go go..Pots are on Timer..

Wait wait wait.. theres a chest over here... or is it a mimic... nah its gotta be a chest a mimic wouldn't just sit here in the open with nothing around it...oops....

Oh dear Jot, I do luv ya, but you are killing my completion time :D....

[Talonaise]

players are not listing their runs as ""full,complete"' or ''zerg '' or''ops inc'' much ,anymore.As a party coordinates inthis fast pased scene,gameplan gets overlooked alot.A ops checkbox will eliminate confusin smtimes .....you Zergers want a Full party ,but Don't want players to see it is a Zerg run!You know alot of players will avoid joining if listed as 'Zerg"!....super funny how the "zergin'' gets so defended in forums.Guess you have some free time to post ,since you ran by most the enemies in the game.

This is hilarious! We "zergers" do not "want" or need a full party. We solo, and two man almost all game content. I put up LFMs and Channel invites just to be nice in case anyone else needs the completion and to possibly meet some new people. Maybe someone leveling or doing Epic TRs on a toon that is more of a support role and could use being with a party. I am trying to be nice... I do not list Zerg, I usually list the chain, and then write IP (In progress) in other words, we are doing it with or without you, but you are welcome to tag along. People seem happy with the fast and efficient runs, I never get "**** you for not slowing down!" but I do get lots of "great runs Thanks!" Truly we are not trying to hide that it is a zerg run. Trust me, I doubt I would want anyone in my party that was afraid of a little speed.

It is a game, if you join up and don't like the party.. leave. There is no reason for it to become a big drama fest.

I think the only one who is name calling and defensive is you... So you like your game different, great no one is belittling you for your likes, but yours is not the only way to play this game, grow up and be more considerate of other people's play styles.

[Erdrique]

I would have to agree, that if you are concerned with completing optionals, you should list in your description in the LFM. Communication is also important. One thing I have noticed lately in the few groups that I have been up able to start, is that I have been the only one with voice, which does make it hard to coordinate groups.

[TheLegendOfAra]

"**** you for not slowing down!"

**** you Az! You finished the chain while I was in that loading screen. ;p

[Powskier]

same thing again,not communicating... joined a group 3 min in, that had players wanderin different areas right away,xcept leader was invis and snuk to the end...dead player left behind too,one player typin 'help'....I song sleep about 20 enemies that were skipped ,just to have leader watch me die as he stayed invisable, the one red name left there got me by suprise a bit.Is all party play out the window ????now this was a late night,prob anything goes run;but obvious the leader never communicated at all(he was only one who even touched end chest, and recalled after watchin me fail in battlle against the red name he pised off)I'm sure it wasnt personall,so I'm not mad...but basic communication could make things better...good leaders who can invis a quick end ,and will tell others what's up,if that is the plan.

[myliftkk_v2]

Is this really that big of a problem?

If I pull "invis/charm" past everything, I'll tell players the minute they join the LFM they need invis to get to me. On rare occaision they drop, and more commonly they get to me fine. Then on occasion you've got the few that think if they just run fast enough nothing will see them... which I then have to clean up behind. Killing for conquest at high speed and zerging are not exactly the same thing. I run everything fast, but only if it's a slog to kill do I skip rooms of mobs. Frankly there aren't many of those, and really only when you get to the highest Epic levels does it make sense (given how OP more players are who join pugs now).

I'm all for a better LFM panel, but if you don't like the speed the leader is going, thank them for the xp/completion/loot, and drop group when you're done. It's easy. And for pete's sakes, be able to scroll invis on demand once you hit 20.

[Gremmlynn]

I'm all for a better LFM panel, but if you don't like the speed the leader is going, thank them for the xp/completion/loot, and drop group when you're done. It's easy. And for pete's sakes, be able to scroll invis on demand once you hit 20.Heh, I find I loot way more invis pots than I've ever felt I've needed, so no real need for scrolls.

[Powskier]

people don't read b4 commenting... , ..the Leaders Are Not Communicating information.It's like a benny hill episode if you mix newbs in.

[Powskier]

Is this really that big of a problem?

If I pull "invis/charm" past everything, I'll tell players the minute they join the LFM they need invis to get to me. On rare occaision they drop, and more commonly they get to me fine. Then on occasion you've got the few that think if they just run fast enough nothing will see them... which I then have to clean up behind. Killing for conquest at high speed and zerging are not exactly the same thing. I run everything fast, but only if it's a slog to kill do I skip rooms of mobs. Frankly there aren't many of those, and really only when you get to the highest Epic levels does it make sense (given how OP more players are who join pugs now).

I'm all for a better LFM panel, but if you don't like the speed the leader is going, thank them for the xp/completion/loot, and drop group when you're done. It's easy. And for pete's sakes, be able to scroll invis on demand once you hit 20.

Yea; telling the party that's the plan is courteous at the least. I'm used to this stuff,but Im way tired of seeing newer players dead and left forgotten.If you dont care to work together,put that in your lfm...''i'm goin in ,you're on your own''or put in the clasic''no noobs''

[Paleus]

people don't read b4 commenting... , ..the Leaders Are Not Communicating information.It's like a benny hill episode if you mix newbs in.

I think the problem is this theead was originally posted as a request to add a check-box to the LFM panel. In my opinion, most people will agree with you that communication is vital in a group. It is understandable that you get upset when you join a party where the leader hasn't written anything in the LFM, doesnt say anything to you, and you are basically rolling the dice to find out if they've cleared stuff, left stuff at Red Alert with mob clusters at chokepoints, or anything else in between. Personally, I think if an LFM leader can't take the time to write comments in their LFM or in chat (talk or type) letting other people know what is going on, then that leader should really just be soloing. They aren't doing anyone a real service. Same goes for the pug that joins, talking to the leader is important.

Where people are drawing the distinction on this thread is the request to update the LFM panel to address the issue. No amount of check boxes can cure bad ettiquette. The same people who couldnt be bothered to say something more substantial than Hi, IP arent going to bother with check boxes. And similarly, the people that join who cant be bothered to say something more than, Hi, OMW arent going to bother to pay attention to those check boxes.

Also, sidenote. It sounds like you play on a bard. Invis is a level 2 spell. I highly recommend getting it if you dont have it for situatiions like this if you're unwilling to drop group. You can also fascinate while invised. This is not offered as an excuse for the behavior of others, just as a tip since you mentioned song-sleeping some mobs that someone else had invised past when you got caught out in the open and killed. It might help a little (though finding a guild or friends to roll with, admittedly harder these days, might help more).