manyshot on artie?

[Singular]

At level 24, I'm about to dump "augment summon" and, based on recent discussions, was thinking about picking up manyshot on my artie. I know I won't be able to max dps with it, but it synchronizes well with all the feats arties have, and it might be a good to have between EF cooldowns. Yes, I know I'd have to carry a bow and, briefly, switch out the rune arm as well.

What do you think? Waste of time?

For feats, I've got all the useful ranged ones + the spell focuses, and toughness. Augment summoning is becoming more and more useless as the doggie becomes increasingly useless in higher, harder content.

My other thought was to take mobility.

[cdbd3rd]

My opinion?

By the time you switch out the bow, then switch out the ammo, then fire up your Many Shot, you'd have put more repeater bolts down-range than what your multi-arrows will make up for.
And you lose the imbue from your rune arm, as well.


I wouldn't.

[honkuimushi]

I wouldn't do it. Yeah, a lot of your feats would work, but I don't believe you can use Insightful Damage with a bow and that means you have no bonus damage from abilities unless you have Bow Strength for some reason. And don't forget that in addition to your bows, you'll have to carry arrows. I suppose you could use wands of Flame Arrow, but Conjure Bolts won't work. Also, Arrows and Bolt's don't play well together. You'll have to switch between them manually when you switch weapons.

The only time I'd consider it is if I had an Artificer with at least 6 Ranger levels. Mobility doesn't really add that much either, though. If you use hirelings or the panther at all, it might still be worth keeping Augment Summons. But it's hard to make a recommendation without knowing what other feats you have. With Power Critical now adding to crit damage, that might be worth the slot.

[Singular]

Fantastic answers!

Great point. The rune arm won't be charging! Duuuuh, don't know why I didn't consider that.

So, power critical is like a seeker bonus +4? I guess that will be useful; it would make to hitting 17-20 +8 to damage and make Needle +12.

Like I said, I have the usual: pba, rapid shot, precision, precise shot, improved precise shot, improved critical (ranged)l, toughness, spell focus: evocation, greater spell focus, augment summoning (which I plan on keeping until I'm done with challenges - I don't usually solo) and heavy armor. Yes, I know, heavy armor is not super useful on an artie, but I took it so for the +3 to damage from the Purple Dragon Armor (extra con, superior false life, etc) and will be dropping it when I get Needle + Planar focus: prowess.

Edit: forgot maximize, empower, quicken

My epic feats: +1 to int, Combat Archery. The +1 to int is equal to Epic spell focus in that it gives me a +1 DC at this point, so no reason to swap it out. Combat archery isn't working beyond the dodge, so I may also swap it out.

So, I was thinking about swapping to Mobility for the +2 Dex bonus to armor (and dodge bonus) and Spring Attack (dodge bonus, elimination of moving penalty), since I move all the time to maximize IPS damage, unless I'm fighting bosses (shot on the run is not working atm).

I want to run EE's and the dog simply gets in the way there. He's dying a lot of the time right now, so I'm going to respec it as a sneak attacker, with maxed out trip, and likely keep it in its box most of the time, as I do with raids anyways.

[fco-karatekid]

Once in the mid-higher levels (say, starting around 15-16), I personally don't see the value of any seeker boni. My thought process is I have to roll a natural 20 to begin with for it to even come into play, and starting around those levels, I have never seen me NOT confirm. Not to mention crit-immunes also coming into play.

When to hit was extremely hard to build, yah - now - meh - I hardly ever see a "miss" any more. Caveat: Shes not started running EE content yet.

[Mercureal]

Once in the mid-higher levels (say, starting around 15-16), I personally don't see the value of any seeker boni. My thought process is I have to roll a natural 20 to begin with for it to even come into play, and starting around those levels, I have never seen me NOT confirm. Not to mention crit-immunes also coming into play.

When to hit was extremely hard to build, yah - now - meh - I hardly ever see a "miss" any more. Caveat: Shes not started running EE content yet.

I assume you're just talking about the bonus to confirm criticals here, rather than saying you don't see the value of the damage bonus? Although even that's a bit of an academic point since they almost always come as a package.

[Singular]

Once in the mid-higher levels (say, starting around 15-16), I personally don't see the value of any seeker boni. My thought process is I have to roll a natural 20 to begin with for it to even come into play, and starting around those levels, I have never seen me NOT confirm. Not to mention crit-immunes also coming into play.

When to hit was extremely hard to build, yah - now - meh - I hardly ever see a "miss" any more. Caveat: Shes not started running EE content yet.

First, insecurities: Uhm...I have run EE before, just not this life.

Second, honkuimushi wrote that Power Critical was adding to damage, too. If that's true, then it would be like having a +4 seeker that stacks with seeker and exceptional seeker. That would be useful with Needle, and ok useful with other stuff.

But anyways, what feats do you suggest instead? I always thought that Power Crit was to be avoided (but now that it does damage, too, maybe not), and was going to go mobility + spring attack (since it works with ranged and melee and shot on the run is borked).

[FooWonk]

I'd go for more DPS with:


Combat Archery --------> Epic SF: Evocation
Augment Summoning --> Maximize
Heavy Armor -----------> Power Critical

or if you're the dodgy sort:


Augment Summoning --> Dodge
Heavy Armor -----------> Mobiility
Combat Archery --------> Spring Attack

[MartinusWyllt]

Your ammo will swap automatically, unless that has changed.

Overall, though, I agree that it might not really pay to do so.

[fco-karatekid]

I assume you're just talking about the bonus to confirm criticals here, rather than saying you don't see the value of the damage bonus? Although even that's a bit of an academic point since they almost always come as a package.

Correct - the damage bonus is nice, but I am already hitting between 50-120 per bolt (edit: then crits on top of that), and any time I have something of more utility (say added elemental damage or more survivability, etc), I choose that over seeker.

[fco-karatekid]

I'd go for more DPS with:


Combat Archery --------> Epic SF: Evocation
Augment Summoning --> Maximize
Heavy Armor -----------> Power Critical

or if you're the dodgy sort:


Augment Summoning --> Dodge
Heavy Armor -----------> Mobiility
Combat Archery --------> Spring Attack

I lean toward the latter.

[droid327]

Another minor annoyance is youd have to prebuff your bow with insightful damage and deadly weapons, or if you forgot, waste time doing it in combat...

But yeah repeater autoattack + runearm > bow with manyshot

[toaf]

buffing while mid manyshot isnt that big of a deal, changing from xbow to bow, does take more free space in your inventory. i love my rangerficers. endless fusilage is a perfect time killer while waiting for manyshots cooldown

[ka0t1c1sm]

...and Spring Attack (dodge bonus, elimination of moving penalty), since I move all the time to maximize IPS damage, unless I'm fighting bosses (shot on the run is not working atm).

IIRC, Spring Attack negates the -4 penalty for melee attacks so you'd only be getting the dodge bonus.

[unbongwah]

Firefox just ate my reply. :( Rather than retype it, the short version: have a look at the Juggernaut (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=404822)for one creative way of incorporating Manyshot into an arty build.

[Singular]

IIRC, Spring Attack negates the -4 penalty for melee attacks so you'd only be getting the dodge bonus.

Shot on the run is supposed to work for ranged, but is bugged and doesn't remove the penalty, but Spring Attack is equally bugged and works on ranged atm.

[Singular]

I'd go for more DPS with:


Combat Archery --------> Epic SF: Evocation
Augment Summoning --> Maximize
Heavy Armor -----------> Power Critical

or if you're the dodgy sort:


Augment Summoning --> Dodge
Heavy Armor -----------> Mobiility
Combat Archery --------> Spring Attack

Thanks for that! I totally forgot to write that I have empower/maximize/quicken. Find them very useful on with the artie's slow casting speed.

Yeah, with combat archery borked, I suppose Epic SF: evocation might be a good idea. I agree with your other choices.

@unbongwah that's a good suggestion but I don't want a melee artie. Thanks for it, though.

[ka0t1c1sm]

Shot on the run is supposed to work for ranged, but is bugged and doesn't remove the penalty, but Spring Attack is equally bugged and works on ranged atm.

Didn't know that. Thanks for the info! :)

[unbongwah]

Don't bother w/SotR or Spring Atk unless you really want those Dodge bonuses; with the AC changes, Precision should add all the extra to-hit you require, boost your DPS vs. high-Fort targets, and only takes 1 feat instead of 3.