Bluff/Improved Feint + Sunder/Trip

[Feralthyrtiaq]

Alrighty a question for all you rogues that may have tried the Improved Feint Feat.

A little background first.

I typically use the elfin 'ell outta Bluff. And since I am playing a Half-Elven rogue atm I have a second Bluff on separate cool-down.

I use Bluff on target then almost immediatedly use Sunder to interrupt the absurdly long Bluff animation and get some faster SA action.

When faced with multiple targets I'll use the Helf Bluff (with a longer CD) followed by Trip to interrupt the absurdly long Bluff animation then move on to next target with Shorter CD regular Bluff+ Sunder.

Has anyone out there taken the Improved Feint Feat and used Sunder/Trip (or anything else) to interrupt the (rumored) absurdly long Improved Feint animation?

I've read some posts mentioning that there is a pronounced pause (ie ABSURDLY LONG) animation for Improve Feint.

I would give Improved Feint a try but taking CE and Improved Feint eats up 2 feat slots and I really don't want to splash Fighter.

[unbongwah]

Post-U15, Imp Feint doesn't have an "absurdly long" animation - it looks just like a normal atk AFAICT - but there seems to be a delay between when you use IF and when the Bluff effect procs; and unfortunately, it also seems like if you attack before it procs, you interrupt the feint and no Bluff effect happens. :( So what I have to do is hit Imp Feint, wait for the Bluff effect to proc (you'll see the icon show up over your targets' heads), then attack; haven't figured out exactly how long it takes for the effect to proc, though.

That said, I can't see adding CE+IF to the average pure rogue build because of the feat cost. The rogue I'm using it on is actually a staff-wielding Ninja / Acrobat; I'm using IF so I can get SAs on my Cleaves vs mobs.

[Feralthyrtiaq]

IF definitely seems more useful on a stick-build with the Cleaves. Monstrous with SA on glances and such.

I *could* work it in and live with the results but just don't want to make the feat sacrifice AND be disappointed with the outcome.

So far I've taken (@9 Helf Rogue with Barb Dille) TWF, PL:Barb, Precision, ITWF leaves me with 4 Feat Slots (will make it to 21 for sure before TR agn, 24 highly unlikely)

Max Dex Build with all level ups in Dex.

I qualify for PA <3 Precision ALOT.
I hit just perfectly w/o Weapon Finesse but have a Feat Slot kinda reserved if it becomes needed as a prereq or my to hit w/ aggro suffers too much.

So that leaves me with...

GTWF, IC: Pierce, (Weapon Finesse), and idk SF UMD or w/e.

[Arlathen]

Post-U15, Imp Feint doesn't have an "absurdly long" animation - it looks just like a normal atk AFAICT - but there seems to be a delay between when you use IF and when the Bluff effect procs; and unfortunately, it also seems like if you attack before it procs, you interrupt the feint and no Bluff effect happens. :( So what I have to do is hit Imp Feint, wait for the Bluff effect to proc (you'll see the icon show up over your targets' heads), then attack; haven't figured out exactly how long it takes for the effect to proc, though.

That said, I can't see adding CE+IF to the average pure rogue build because of the feat cost. The rogue I'm using it on is actually a staff-wielding Ninja / Acrobat; I'm using IF so I can get SAs on my Cleaves vs mobs.

Exactly my experience :(

Do you actually have the patience to let the IF Bluff proc ?!...

Oh, forgot the obligatory. Arrrr.

[unbongwah]

IF definitely seems more useful on a stick-build with the Cleaves. Monstrous with SA on glances and such.
Glancing blows do not proc sneak atks or crits; cleaves do. Hence why I added IF+CL+GC to my stick build.

Do you actually have the patience to let the IF Bluff proc ?!...
It's a key tactic for my staff build when I'm soloing; otherwise I don't get my sneak atks vs mobs. Feint -> AoE Bluff proc -> Great Cleave -> Cleave In PUGs I usually let someone else draw aggro first so I can skip using IF entirely.

Still need to perfect my timing: too often I either attack too soon and the Bluff doesn't proc; or I wait too long and don't get both Cleaves in before the effect wears off.

One nice thing about IF is it's on a separate cooldown timer from Bluff/Diplo/Intim; so I can use IF, then follow up with a Bluff or Diplo if I need to before IF resets.

[Feralthyrtiaq]

I am 100% positively getting sneak attack damage with my glancing blows while TWF....

[unbongwah]

I am 100% positively getting sneak attack damage with my glancing blows while TWF....
Since when did TWFing get glancing blows? :confused: You sure you're not getting, say, double-strikes instead?

[Feralthyrtiaq]

I have no sources of double strike at the moment and took imp evasion at 10. Make no mistake I am seeing SA on my glances with Twf and Gtwf.

At level 10 my feats are Twf, Precision, Pl:Barb, Gtwf, Rogue Improved Evasion.

Base Strength is 14, base Dex is 21 (17, 2 tome, 2 lvls) 30 with gear, ship, enhs.

I don't have weapon finesse yet, strength is 21 with gear and ship and I am seeing how long I can by without weapon finesse under the new combat calc. While I hit most of the time while standing still, I do tend to move around the battle a lot at times and at those moments I notice the misses and glances more and I am probably shooting myself in the foot but I am definitely getting SA on glancing blows. In BB Elite VON 3 last night vs the red named beholder Whoziwhatzis....registered at least a dozen glances with SA while chasing him as he attack the fleeing sorcerers.

[unbongwah]

Those aren't glancing blows (http://ddowiki.com/page/Glancing_blow), those are grazing hits (http://ddowiki.com/page/Grazing_hit). Currently SAs apply to the latter.

[Feralthyrtiaq]

I was aware of a change but hadn't noticed the differentiation between the two glancing/grazing whatever.

But, was happy to notice the SA damage on my "Grazes"

And REALLY especially happy to be able to take advantage of this NON-WAI game mechanic for as long as possible.

What I DON'T understand is WHY the game hasn't be shut down to hot-fix it? I mean it is directly beneficial to my character....

It may not be putting 500kabillion plat in my coffers like the challenge mat plat selling spree I was un-aware of (and I am fairly confident last Saturday's downtime f(ix)ed) amd couldn't/didn't take advantage of.

It REALLY would have helped too especially with guild ship wipes...and a blank spot on my login screen where the "If your amenties disappear just wait" message ssupposedly appeared and the GD 170k plat I dropped so my guildies didn't go without.



Lolthin Elfers

Anywhoo...thanks for the heads up...doesn't really change anything for me as I will continue to enjoy this very beneficial game mechanic....till they F(ix) it :)