Reconstruct

[davidolson22]

Recently Heal and Mass heal were assigned to only take half power from enhancement and items to prevent them being overpowered. But The spell Reconstruct is essentially the same as Heal, it is not affected by Maximize or Empower. So when U14 struck, this spell got a huge buff because now enhancements are hitting it for 125 spell power instead of 50% and items are hitting it for over 100 spell power instead of the old max of 60%. This spell is now hitting for 150*(1+1.25+0.8)=457 instead of 150*1.5*1.6=360.

I believe nerfing this spell as you did Heal and Mass Heal would go a long way to appeasing people who feel that Heal has been unfairly nerfed.

Also consider nerfing Meteor swarm. This spell is being hit by items more now than before the update, and is therefore overpowered. (I believe this is your reasoning for nerfing the 2 Heal spells, and therefore this logic shoudl be applied uniformly)

[tasebro]

...The spell Reconstruct...I believe nerfing this spell as you did Heal and Mass Heal would go a long way to appeasing people who feel that Heal has been unfairly nerfed...
This is meant to balkanize?
If so, then you believe wrongly.
Its not about recon; never was. Recon is fine, leave it alone. Ditto that for meteor.
What it is about is that all divine casting and spell like ability took a 50% nerf on output. This was not nerfed to prevent them being overpowered, it was nerfed to pull the rug out from under divine casting, to force burning more resources for the same result, thus by default boosting sales of DDO Store bought Bypasses: spellpoint pots, and Heal pots.

[davidolson22]

Not sure what balkanized means at this moment, but it was meant to either balance the classes/spells or provide turbine with another option. If this option seems absurd, perhaps nerfing Heal was also absurd. But, I don't make the final decisions, so it's out of my hands to decide what the "correct" solution here is.

[301]

While i can see your point, remember that you can use healing amp to increase the amount of hp restored by healing spells. No such thing exists for repair spells. With some decent healing amp, healing spells are still more effective.

I'm not sure why you think meteor swarm has been improved by the update though. If anything i would say it has been nerfed, or at least nerfed relative to the other spells, since an increase to caster level or maximum caster level makes no difference.

[varusso]

Recently Heal and Mass heal were assigned to only take half power from enhancement and items to prevent them being overpowered. But The spell Reconstruct is essentially the same as Heal, it is not affected by Maximize or Empower. So when U14 struck, this spell got a huge buff because now enhancements are hitting it for 125 spell power instead of 50% and items are hitting it for over 100 spell power instead of the old max of 60%. This spell is now hitting for 150*(1+1.25+0.8)=457 instead of 150*1.5*1.6=360.

I believe nerfing this spell as you did Heal and Mass Heal would go a long way to appeasing people who feel that Heal has been unfairly nerfed.

Also consider nerfing Meteor swarm. This spell is being hit by items more now than before the update, and is therefore overpowered. (I believe this is your reasoning for nerfing the 2 Heal spells, and therefore this logic shoudl be applied uniformly)

Stop calling for additional nerfs to make yourself feel better. Recon ONLY works on WF, whereas Heal works on ALL toons who are not actually immune to positive energy. Recon is already limited to specific use. This is in addition to the lack of "repair amp". If you want a change, lobby for them to give you back your sPOW on divines, not nerf arcanes. Even in a snarky, sarcastic manner that may or may not be meant to be taken as a serious request. This sort of nonsense does NOT help.

[davidolson22]

What does healing amp have to do with anything? That was in before the update, and it's in after. Nothing changed in the update to make healing amp better or worse.

[varusso]

What does healing amp have to do with anything? That was in before the update, and it's in after. Nothing changed in the update to make healing amp better or worse.

You DO know that healing amp increases the amount of HP you receive from an incoming positive cure spell right? That means that the sPOW-nerfed curative spells STILL benefit from healing amp once they are cast on the target. Hence monks, PL-Pallies and other folks who work on their HA will receive even more HP than your sPOW gives to the spell. This is undoubtedly taken into account by the devs -- once HA is fixed again. Repair has no such coutnerpart. Whatever the outgoing sPOW is on the spell -- thats all there is. It doesnt get any better based on the target's efforts. Curative spell effectiveness is a synergy of the two, and benefits from both.

[davidolson22]

Y Curative spell effectiveness is a synergy of the two, and benefits from both.

Obviously, but you fail to comment on how healing amp was there before the update, and as such doesn't really explain why Heal must therefore be nerfed more than Reconstruct, at least you didn't explain that. Unless you are trying to say there is more healing amp availble now then there had been before? If so, please list examples that lead to someone having more healing amp than was possible before.

[davidolson22]

Anyway, I'm not calling for a nerf. Just a reblanacing so recon doesn't become more powerful than it was before the update. (Which I believe is the logic behind the nerf to Heal, to keep it from being more powerful than it was before the update).

[varusso]

Obviously, but you fail to comment on how healing amp was there before the update, and as such doesn't really explain why Heal must therefore be nerfed more than Reconstruct, at least you didn't explain that. Unless you are trying to say there is more healing amp availble now then there had been before? If so, please list examples that lead to someone having more healing amp than was possible before.

You would have to ask TURBINE why this change is necessary. They did not consult me before making it. Still doesnt change the fact that the target CAN up the amount of healing they receive through their own efforts, whereas the target of recons cannot; curative spells were already getting a boost on top of any spell-boosting effects, which carried over post-update. Perhaps TURBINE saw this fact as an imbalance and decided to level it out.

I dont need to comment on the fact that HA was there before the update, as it is a given. Just as I should not HAVE TO comment on the fact that calling for a nerf to recon is NOT proportional to the healing nerf, and it only smacks of spitefulness, now matter how you try to dress it up.

[davidolson22]

Wait a second. How is it a nerf? Shade told me that healing spells were buffed. By that reasoning, Reconstruct would also be buffed with my suggestion. It's just a milder buff than they got in u14.

[301]

The spell Reconstruct is essentially the same as Heal

I wouldn't agree with this. The ability to use healing amp made divine healing superior and it is still superior if you have decent healing amp. I would also argue that increasing your healing amp is much easier now with such as the 30% healing available from just turning in some commendations or healing amp being available on loot gen items.

I don't think repair spells were changed because they were inferior and still are to divine healing.


Anyway, I'm not calling for a nerf. Just a reblanacing so recon doesn't become more powerful than it was before the update

Isn't making something weaker than it was before the definition of a nerf?

[varusso]

Wait a second. How is it a nerf? Shade told me that healing spells were buffed. By that reasoning, Reconstruct would also be buffed with my suggestion. It's just a milder buff than they got in u14.

Youve just removed all doubt that you are just trolling, so have fun rabble rousing. Bye.

[301]

I believe nerfing this spell as you did Heal and Mass Heal would go a long way to appeasing people who feel that Heal has been unfairly nerfed.

Also, how would this make healers feel better? The arcanes, who were taking care of themselves and often use their sp to buff the group and kill and CC mobs so i don't have to heal as much, now need to use more of their sp to heal themselves and in some cases may need me to heal them as well.

[Quetzacoala]

What does healing amp have to do with anything? That was in before the update, and it's in after. Nothing changed in the update to make healing amp better or worse.

You do not seem to understand just how potent healing amplification affects are. The fact that repair spells do not benefit from such a powerful ability is more than enough reason to not weaken repair spells.

For example, I have recently been leveling my half-elf paladin monk; I took the two ranks of Human Healing Amplification which granted 10% and 20% additional healing amplification respectively, and at level eight I took the Hunter of the Dead prestige for another 10%. This means that at level eight, without any rare gear, I almost had 150% healing amplification. Well, to be precise it was 145.2%, but you get the idea.

This means that if a heal spell would normally heal me for 500 hit points, it would instead heal me for 750... well, less, but rounding. This is a big deal. Repair gets nothing even close to this, so cut it and reconstruct some slack.

[varusso]

You do not seem to understand just how potent healing amplification affects are. The fact that repair spells do not benefit from such a powerful ability is more than enough reason to not weaken repair spells.

For example, I have recently been leveling my half-elf paladin monk; I took the two ranks of Human Healing Amplification which granted 10% and 20% additional healing amplification respectively, and at level eight I took the Hunter of the Dead prestige for another 10%. This means that at level eight, without any rare gear, I almost had 150% healing amplification. Well, to be precise it was 145.2%, but you get the idea.

This means that if a heal spell would normally heal me for 500 hit points, it would instead heal me for 750... well, less, but rounding. This is a big deal. Repair gets nothing even close to this, so cut it and reconstruct some slack.

AND Recon also does not remove any debuffs, whereas Heal removes all kinds of trash. The best Recon does is give you a little haste-like buff. And how often do you actually use THAT when you spend most of your time with haste overwriting it? If anything, Recon should be given the same debuff removals ad Heal -- since WF can now be affected by pois and dis :rolleyes:

[Quetzacoala]

AND Recon also does not remove any debuffs, whereas Heal removes all kinds of trash. The best Recon does is give you a little haste-like buff. And how often do you actually use THAT when you spend most of your time with haste overwriting it? If anything, Recon should be given the same debuff removals ad Heal -- since WF can now be affected by pois and dis :rolleyes:

Good call, completely forgot to mention that. Got to caught up in explaining the importance of healing amplification I suppose.

[davidolson22]

If anything, Recon should be given the same debuff removals ad Heal -- since WF can now be affected by pois and dis

I'll agree with that. No reason why it shouldn't in the current rules. I'm just asking for a tiny bit of equality and fairness in the rules, and having recon do the same side benefits as heal is definitely in line with that.

I'm also not against them adding recon amp to the game. I don't get why it's not there already.

[Quetzacoala]

I'll agree with that. No reason why it shouldn't in the current rules. I'm just asking for a tiny bit of equality and fairness in the rules, and having recon do the same side benefits as heal is definitely in line with that.

I'm also not against them adding recon amp to the game. I don't get why it's not there already.

True equality would involve introducing a form of healing amplification for repair effects.

[varusso]

I'll agree with that. No reason why it shouldn't in the current rules. I'm just asking for a tiny bit of equality and fairness in the rules, and having recon do the same side benefits as heal is definitely in line with that.

I'm also not against them adding recon amp to the game. I don't get why it's not there already.

Because if they leave it alone, it works fine. Tinkering with it only requires taking away something else to swing it back into balance. In addition, players who play WF already have to work alot on HA just to be properly healable by divines - adding RA (and then having to rebalance Repair boosting sPOW effects to compensate) would mean the WF would have to work on BOTH amps to be viably healable by both.

To coin a phrase, If it aint broke, dont fix it. I am reserving judgement on the divine healing changes for now, to see if a happy medium is struck with sPOW boosts and HA to achieve a reasonable amount of healing for a reasonable amount of effort. All *I* want out of it is more honest and open communication from Turbine about the changes -- as my sig indicates. And fewer reactionary posts from players calling for nerfs across the board as retaliation against other players who had nothing to do with the divine changes -- under the guise of "fairness" when in reality it is nothing of the sort. Repairs and Heals work differently, so a universal vanilla change to both affects them differently.

[tasebro]

...I'm just asking for a tiny bit of equality and fairness in the rules....
You are *not* asking for equity, you *are* asking for more pointless nerfage to satisfy a sense of *revenge*...your motivation for doing this is to prop up your bud Shade and his trolling? --Shade clearly has an agenda, he refuses to even admit there is a nerf, them he denies anyone who points out the nerf, or its consequences, and then he makes counteraccusations to derail discussions of same.
Could it be that some players enjoy nerfs as a form of proxy griefing? Clearly the answer is yes.