How about some dex based player help?

[Thar]

Dex based characters got the short end of the stick with this update.

There is no epic class that is beneficial for dex toons ie the dex ranger twf types.

AC got totally hosed for all dex based ac classes.

Shadowdancer got changed to not allow dex to apply to damage.

We can't hit anything close to high AC now to avoid damage but are restricted in weapon types to lower base damage weapons so fall behind other players.

I propose:

Add AC back to Dodge with the current system. A few points of dodge ac won't impact much on the heavilly armored characters since they are limited by max dex of armor. None high armor people can get to some reasonable ac but are still behind the armored turtle tank (ie stalwart)

Add speed boost for smaller finesse weapons. Smaller weapons get a 1% boost per bab with finesse. Helps level the playing field with the splash damage or broken crit (khopesh). Why? because you are sending a feat on it AND putting in stat points that don't apply directly to damage output.

Both the above apply to monks unarmed style so helps fix what hurt those toons this update.

I don't see why the damage using dex was taken from the shadowdancer. this isn't overpowering with the other changes to those classes. Take greensteel rapier vs greensteel greataxe and the axe puts out vastly higher damage on any build, now add deadly weapons and...

other ideas?

[CheeseMilk]

I read a dev post (can't remember who, sorry) in the beta forums explaining that the Shadowdancer ability was removed because it was something that really needed to be available at the start of character creation, as opposed to epic-only, and so it would be put back in with the planned enhancement revamp.

[Aesop]

I'd say Stats that add to AC should add to Dodge... but in a round about way similar to the formula for PPR.

(1-.99^x) * .25 where x equals the sum of the relevant AC adjusting Statistics.

what this means is that a Dex of 50 would generate a Dodge bonus of approximately 10% (9.8%)

a Dex of 20 would be about 4.5%

A Dexterity and Wisdom of 50 would amount to about 16% Dodge.

This obviously caps out at an unlikely 25% dodge bonus. Drop the Unarmored Dodge Cap (or raise it to 40-50%)and this could work out pretty well.

This could of course be adjusted and maybe the bonus to dodge could be broken up by categories like Stat, Item and Feat with individual caps. Or that could just move everything over to a similar concept to PRR with items stats and feats adding a certain bonus which then all pools to equal x in an equation where (1-.99^x) * .4 = Dodge Bonus.

Assuming Stat Bonuses and large benefits from the other sources like Feats and Items.
lets go with something a little odd in the way of builds to take advantage of a few bonuses
Monk 12 Rogue 8

50 Dexterity (+20)
50 Wisdom (+20)
Icy Raiments (+20)
Improved Uncanny Dodge (+50)
Monk Dodge Bonus (6% currently at level 4) (+30)
Rogue Dodge Bonus (3% at level 8) (+15)
Water Stance III (3% if it wasn't bugged) (+15)
Dodge (+10)
Mobility and Spring Attack (+5 each)

about 34.1%

of course there are other things but this gives the idea. It is a Diminishing Returns system though so the as you get closer to the top you have to put even more into it to get anything else out. For example at low levels with just a Dexterity of 20 you could have a 2% Dodge rating. But increase that by another 5 points say with a 20 Wisdom and you wouldn't end up with a 4% rating but a 3.8% rating. The happy point is still going to be around the 25% mark but getting a little higher isn't going to kill a build.

I would say that armor should have a distinctly lower bonus and maybe that is where the Armor should cap not only the Dexterity bonus but the Dodge bonus as well. Perhaps by type or by MDB. As long as MDBs can't breach the 30s the with any ease then the Unarmored still have a chance.




Additionally the Feat Weapon Finesse could grant a Double Strike Bonus of 3% with Finesse Weapons (like Rapier and other non light weapons that can benefit from the weapon finesse feat) and 5% to Light Weapons. This would be a Feat bonus.

Additionally Weapons Finesse should change the DC base for at least some of the Tactical Feats to Dexterity.

The Races with a bonus to Dexterity could also have Enhancements to improve the Double Strike chance from Weapon Finesse. Not a large bonus perhaps maybe only 1% per tier limited by the number of Racial Dexterity Enhancements taken. Total of 2% extra.


Aesop