The Auction House addiction, and ideas...

[Kawai]

I'm curious, like many i am sure, how much of your gametime is spent at your local AH's.
Myself... I'm in the rare bunch for sure, i can spend all bloody afternoon there. It generally takes me 3 months or more to go from level 1 to 20 (Main is on third life, alts are all around 8-12ish) b ecause of the amount of time spent buying low and selling high at the addiction house. Yea, usually in Market 1 in my little spot. :)
Despite the amount of time spent, I've never accumulated more than three mill. Too buzy buying more stuff! :)
(And no, i don't dabble in scrolls yet, mainly just Ings and Dragonscales and little whatnot's.) But it's a part of the game that is quite enjoyable to me, alt/tabbing from Ebay and others and back to DDO...
So my question is this... would you LIKE, or HATE to see the AH go live, like D3 and be able to use your own hard earned cash to buy and sell items? DDO would get thier cut, soim sure they are already considering it...
What about you, Completionists? What about you, random weekend players? What about you... ALL?
-Tarelyn ~Achillesia, Thelanis

[Cauthey]

The Auction House (AH) has a similar appeal that eBay does. It's a chance to speculate, get the "great deals," and occasionally move something rare or coveted for a high price. I would imagine that there are quite a few in the boat with you. Quite possibly similar-minded folks that are entrepreneur, hawker, or business/marketing types.

For you, and those that are similarly minded, turning a profit on AH speculations and endeavors is "winning." Just like completing raids for some is "winning." And just like tapping out the last bit of favor for some is "winning." Spec'ing out the perfect build, finishing that last piece of epic gear, crafting, etc. There are countless ways to "win" while playing DDO, and I count that strongly as one of the games many credits.

Not much of my gametime is spend on the AH. Less than 10% of my game time, probably. Typically, I will take all treasure I find in chests, and sort it into 1) exceptional, and it might fetch a price on the AH, and 2) vendor trash, and will be crunched down for crafting essences. When I do visit the AH, it's usually to offload accumulated exceptional pieces that I think might sell. While I'm there, I'll often "spot check" things I might be able to catch a good price on - ioun stones, Planar Girds, large materials, rare scrolls, and other stuff as I think of it.

Outside of that, I'll only visit the AH when I have a pressing need for a specific item or material, or perhaps for a blank item for crafting, etc.

[Kawai]

The Auction House (AH) has a similar appeal that eBay does. It's a chance to speculate, get the "great deals," and occasionally move something rare or coveted for a high price. I would imagine that there are quite a few in the boat with you. Quite possibly similar-minded folks that are entrepreneur, hawker, or business/marketing types.

For you, and those that are similarly minded, turning a profit on AH speculations and endeavors is "winning." Just like completing raids for some is "winning." And just like tapping out the last bit of favor for some is "winning." Spec'ing out the perfect build, finishing that last piece of epic gear, crafting, etc. There are countless ways to "win" while playing DDO, and I count that strongly as one of the games many credits.

Not much of my gametime is spend on the AH. Less than 10% of my game time, probably. Typically, I will take all treasure I find in chests, and sort it into 1) exceptional, and it might fetch a price on the AH, and 2) vendor trash, and will be crunched down for crafting essences. When I do visit the AH, it's usually to offload accumulated exceptional pieces that I think might sell. While I'm there, I'll often "spot check" things I might be able to catch a good price on - ioun stones, Planar Girds, large materials, rare scrolls, and other stuff as I think of it.

Outside of that, I'll only visit the AH when I have a pressing need for a specific item or material, or perhaps for a blank item for crafting, etc.

Thanks for the input, and you mentioned the vendor trash/crunchykrafty which has really put a dent in the available resources for the pawns and the AH itself; although there is a new market there now for crafted items that the krafteez are taking advantage of (more power to them).
But what are your thoughts on taking the AH to the world of LIVE. Using your own cash to buy and sell, like D3?
-Tarelyn

[Mastikator]

I would utterly despise it and would consider leaving DDO if it were implemented to be honest. :/

[Kawai]

I would utterly despise it and would consider leaving DDO if it were implemented to be honest. :/

Despise it? :O why?
You wouldnt be forced to use it, you can still use plat... plz explain?
-Tare

[Mastikator]

It would make gear less valid evidence of "in game accomplishment". (I consider grinding for the things you want a form of accomplishment)

[Kawai]

It would make gear less valid evidence of "in game accomplishment". (I consider grinding for the things you want a form of accomplishment)

Grinding is nice... and then you can turn around and make money/plat/points from said grind.... :)
-Tare

[Cauthey]

Thanks for the input, and you mentioned the vendor trash/crunchykrafty which has really put a dent in the available resources for the pawns and the AH itself; although there is a new market there now for crafted items that the krafteez are taking advantage of (more power to them).
But what are your thoughts on taking the AH to the world of LIVE. Using your own cash to buy and sell, like D3?
-Tarelyn

...like Diablo III, ehh?

I am rather surprised and stunned at Diablo III's implementation of a real cash based Auction House system. When they announced the news of their plan, I immediately thought that they had the wrong idea.

Though, after considering it further, their step into the cash-based in-game transactions was a bold one. And, quite possibly... it had to be made. Someone was eventually going to make the step. Why not they do it with their Diablo III baby.

I won't play Diablo III for a couple of reasons, though the primary one is that my gaming needs are more than sufficiently satisfied by DDO at the present. I also have a tendency to stick to games I know and like, and often don't mind replaying content. If I were to play Diablo III, I can tell you know that I would not partake in any cash-based purchases. Though, admittedly, I might dabble with cash-based sales. I can't remember how it works though... can you actually get Blizzard to send you a check for your virtual goods brokering net gains?

Frankly, I think that DDO's AH system is fine the way it is. I don't believe that there would be sufficient "gain" to the game experience if Turbine added a cash-based auction system like what Diablo III has. I don't believe that a majority of the DDO player base would support such a change.

However, if they did support the change, and rallied for and asked for it until Turbine added it, I would likely suffer the change, and would still not make cash-based purchases. The same holds true that if I got a nifty piece of random loot that I thought might be cash-worthy, I might try offering it for sale on the cash-based system.

[Cauthey]

It would make gear less valid evidence of "in game accomplishment". (I consider grinding for the things you want a form of accomplishment)

Even if they did implement cash-style, I don't think that you'd be able to sell the standard BtC type raid gear, which is most of the "in game accomplishment" kind of loot. Nonetheless, an item that has been worked for / earned / ground for out to be regarded higher than something that was merely pay to win.

[Kawai]

[QUOTE=Cauthey;4491200...I won't play Diablo III for a couple of reasons, though the primary one is that my gaming needs are more than sufficiently satisfied by DDO at the present. QUOTE]

I won't play D3 either... DDO is meh thingy. I would just like to see the added option, and yes i think it would require more BTA/BTC items being flagged to do biz with.
-Tare

[LordMond63]

While I don't think that I would ever avail myself of it, if Turbine introduced a real currency AH into DDO it wouldn't bother me one bit.

As DDO is a cooperative rather than competitive game, I'm not impacted negatively by someone else being able to buy an in-game advantage. In fact, their advantage can become my advantage because, if I am grouped with them and they have an easier time completing whatever the challenge happens to be, then I benefit from that ease as well. Sounds like a win-win to me.

[PinkDragonJr]

in this i am neutral. as long as i can still buy and sell on the AH for plat and not only cash i cannot think of any valid reasons for or against it. if it was there i might give it a go just to see, but i have little interest in that kind of thing. though i can easily appreciate that my goals in this game are not shared by others so i do not begrudge the people that want to enhance their experience, by adding in real money.

in regards to the Diablo version of this i often wondered how they would handle the money side of it. weather it be a direct transaction between players through a hub or all of the money handling being done by blizzard so they can take most of it. then there are thing like fluctuation exchange rates to think about.

what Turbine could consider would be doing a trial of this with turbine points, though many will disagree with this since these are non liquifiable assets which is what i senses they want to see. if money could be made off this then those that treat MMO's like a second job can really make it a job.

maybe selecting how you want to auction: be it in game platinum, to be paid as fees and then received as payment.
or as turbine points to be paid as fees and then received as payment, though that would limit the market even more now that i think about it, not expand it. i guess, paying fees as plat and then letting a customer decide if they are going to pay turbine points or plat for it.

i suspect this was a long term plan form turbine anyway. with the auctioneers percentage fee for auctions on successful sale. i have always wondered why they bothered charging a fee with nonexistent currency that they don't need, but it makes sense if they are training the players to accept fee charges when they moved over to real money.

[Xynot2]

Rule #1 Never suggest that DDO put a RL $ amount on anything to help them make money or you will incur the wrath of those who think it's paying to win.

To the pay 2 win naysayers: 1) You dotn win DDO. 2) if you suck, buying uber gear doesnt make you better. 3) you play your way let others play theirs.

I personally think that EVERYthing should be able to be bought in DDO store. Frankly, after a gazillion ToD runs I would just rather buy a ring cuz Im REALLY getting tired of that run (on the toon in question) and the devs dont seem interested in cutting some slack and putting it in the 20 runs end rewards statically.

A) I put a lot of RL $$ into the game... I'm not leaving
B) I'm never going to get so bored I quit DDO
C) I genuinely like the game
D) Dont think you threatening to leave is going to make me run scared that the game will die. Gotta play what you think is fun so cya and good luck.

To the OP.
I wouldn't do it but I know others who would. Not a grand idea but an acceptable one.

/signed

[Kawai]

Rule #1 Never suggest that DDO put a RL $ amount on anything to help them make money or you will incur the wrath of those who think it's paying to win.

To the pay 2 win naysayers: 1) You dotn win DDO. 2) if you suck, buying uber gear doesnt make you better. 3) you play your way let others play theirs.

I personally think that EVERYthing should be able to be bought in DDO store. Frankly, after a gazillion ToD runs I would just rather buy a ring cuz Im REALLY getting tired of that run (on the toon in question) and the devs dont seem interested in cutting some slack and putting it in the 20 runs end rewards statically.

A) I put a lot of RL $$ into the game... I'm not leaving
B) I'm never going to get so bored I quit DDO
C) I genuinely like the game
D) Dont think you threatening to leave is going to make me run scared that the game will die. Gotta play what you think is fun so cya and good luck.

To the OP.
I wouldn't do it but I know others who would. Not a grand idea but an acceptable one.

/signed

Very good points all around. Gear doesnt make you win, thats up to the player.
And I, too, have spent a great deal of money in the past, usually on stuff i dont really even need... new hairstyle each week etc etc
Oh, and for /signing, you get a big fatty +1 to you :)
-Tarelyn

[InsanityIsYourFriend]

i believe its a good idea, if someone wants to pay to win let them, i personally would be farming things dry to make some money that i could turn around and buy more content with, main things that i could see selling on real money AH would be ingredients, large stacks of essences, plat, dragon scales, very rare items (like BBs GS blanks rare alchemical blanks) and epic scrolls
all of which someone could farm for or get bored farming for

i personally spend very little time on AH but i would like real $!

[Kawai]

i believe its a good idea, if someone wants to pay to win let them, i personally would be farming things dry to make some money that i could turn around and buy more content with, main things that i could see selling on real money AH would be ingredients, large stacks of essences, plat, dragon scales, very rare items (like BBs GS blanks rare alchemical blanks) and epic scrolls
all of which someone could farm for or get bored farming for

i personally spend very little time on AH but i would like real $!

:) ...and a +1 ChokkyChip cookie for you!
-Tarelyn

[SiliconScout]

NOT signed.

Look if you want to allow real cash into the AH then if you think the "gold" spammers used to be bad, look out because now they can legitimately sell their "stuffs" for money. Additionally you are going to have a lot of farming accounts in the game then who aren't interested in grouping or helping they are just looking for those items they can easily turn into hard cash. I saw enough of that in Diablo II to be honest, it's better if we just avoid that in my never to be humble opinion.

If the idea is to allow you to use real money to buy things in the AH then I say the way to do that is the turbine store.

Allow TP to purchase Plat and then you have that problem solved without having to allow any more of that **** in.

The problem here is that they will then lose their ability to have any real control on the value of Plat in the game and we then have the very real possibility for runaway inflation.

In the end there is already enough ways to buy the things you need in the game I don't see the need for a real cash AH.

If I wanted to play Diablo then I would play Diablo.

[Kawai]

...If the idea is to allow you to use real money to buy things in the AH then I say the way to do that is the turbine store.

Allow TP to purchase Plat and then you have that problem solved without having to allow any more of that **** in.



Thanks for the input, and i mean that. Neither do i like the idea of playing Diablo3. But my own issue to the above recommendation of using TPS is that i seriously want the ability to attempt to make actual money via buying and selling, it's that simple. And purchasing plat is just a very very bad idea imo... it's like a nuke. :(
-Tarelyn

[phalaeo]

I'm the same as the OP- I can spend an hour or two just at the AH. The weird thing is that I'm not a shopper IRL... I hate researching before making big purchases, I hate going to stores, and I never saw any mall as being "shopping therapy".

I could honestly just log on and play the game "Argonnessen AH".... it's the secondary addiction to actually playing.

[Kawai]

I'm the same as the OP- I can spend an hour or two just at the AH. The weird thing is that I'm not a shopper IRL... I hate researching before making big purchases, I hate going to stores, and I never saw any mall as being "shopping therapy".

I could honestly just log on and play the game "Argonnessen AH".... it's the secondary addiction to actually playing.

i know right? my booty is usually parked at mkt1 front and center of the AH. :D Like i think ive said before it takes me months to go 1-20... shameful.
And oh, your sooo wrong about the mall. it IS shopping therapy, especially the shoe stores. :)
But alas, you get my last +1 of the day. Cheers, luv.
-Tarelyn

[SiliconScout]

.... But my own issue to the above recommendation of using TPS is that i seriously want the ability to attempt to make actual money via buying and selling, it's that simple. ...

But that is exactly my problem, see you and I would like to make some actual money buying and selling things as a little added perk.

But you know there is some guy who never leaves Mom's basement that will try to make it his "job" and let's not even think about the 2000 Korean's who will have this as their job.

From there things just go screwy because "plat farmers" aren't doing anything wrong, heck what they are doing is sanctioned by Turbine.

I don't know if you were around much in the earier days but honestly I couldn't go ANYWHERE that wasn't instanced without spam in every channel trying to hawk Plat or Items for cash.

Turbine spent a lot of time and energy shutting those guys down to the point that it wasn't profitable for them to bother and it's more or less gone away. I hated those days, hated them with a passion.

This wouldn't crack the door open for them, it would remove the front wall entirely.

I understand where you are coming from but allowing this will have no positive impact at all. The only reason it's in Diablo III is because rather than try to fight it (which they did previous) they are willing to allow it to happen and just take their cut. And their player base is happier because they don't have to leave the game to go to eBay all the time.

I get it, I really really do, but I still think it's impact would be overwhelmingly negative.

[Kawai]

But that is exactly my problem, see you and I would like to make some actual money buying and selling things as a little added perk.

But you know there is some guy who never leaves Mom's basement that will try to make it his "job" and let's not even think about the 2000 Korean's who will have this as their job.

From there things just go screwy because "plat farmers" aren't doing anything wrong, heck what they are doing is sanctioned by Turbine.

I don't know if you were around much in the earier days but honestly I couldn't go ANYWHERE that wasn't instanced without spam in every channel trying to hawk Plat or Items for cash.

Turbine spent a lot of time and energy shutting those guys down to the point that it wasn't profitable for them to bother and it's more or less gone away. I hated those days, hated them with a passion.

This wouldn't crack the door open for them, it would remove the front wall entirely.

I understand where you are coming from but allowing this will have no positive impact at all. The only reason it's in Diablo III is because rather than try to fight it (which they did previous) they are willing to allow it to happen and just take their cut. And their player base is happier because they don't have to leave the game to go to eBay all the time.

I get it, I really really do, but I still think it's impact would be overwhelmingly negative.


Hrmm. You mentined earlier about farming... this is the point where i get thrown off. (im eazily confuzed)
Target... say... LDS, LRDS, etc... they're already farmed, and used. How would the monetary system make it any different? Farming is farming... it requires time and patience. If i have like 7 LDS, and want to deff keep 6 of them, why not be able to sell that 7th for a few realworld dollars?
If i'm still not getting it... (more than likely, but the blonde is only bleach), then plz explain? :)
-Tarelyn

[SiliconScout]

A let me first apologize for the coming wall of text ;-)

Picture 2000 guys working in an office, each with access to a couple hundred toons. They spend all day every day running say Shrouds. They only run the raids with members of their "guild", say the "Co-Rean Farmers" guild, and the hand all the loot to one toon to make transactions easier. Now in reality they will probably cycle accounts and raids/quests so that you have a team of "shroud" guys and they run through all the accounts every 3 days and these same accounts run ToD's and VoN's and all the rest as well each with a different team.

In 2 weeks they build up say 2 billion Plat and hundreds of RDS and FRDS. They then place these on the AH for real cash. (payoff for their investment).

But wait the AH allows you to use real case or Platinum (they have millions of this that they want to sell as well so that is no good for them). So they start spamming the Trade, General and Advice channels barking about how you can get 10 LDS for only $20 from them, cheaper than the AH prices!!!

Yes they are farmed already, but they are only good for other virtual items. This harder to acquire digital piece of data can be traded for other harder to acquire digital pieces of data.

The minute you all these digital pieces of data to be traded for real hard world currency you will have people and places start entire companies who do this for a living. India and Korea have traditionally been the 2 largest sources of these.

For Example in India things cost about the same as they do in Canada or the US however the price is in their Rupee's. Thus a 2 dollar bottle of pop would be about 2 rupee's in India.

However they get 55 Rupee's to the dollar right now so selling those 10 LDS which took the "guild" something like 10 minutes to farm (due to the massive repetition they are doing) nets them about $1,100 in their economy.

This can become very lucrative for them due to the imbalance in size of the economies.

This isn't hypothetical either, it's as real as real gets I personally know 2 people who worked in one of these companies farming Diablo II items. In their case it was even worse because they could run bots to farm for them most of the time. This is much harder to do in DDO due to the quest structure. Sure they got caught repeatedly and their Key's were banned but they just bought more copies. They were profiting several thousand dollars per copy of Diablo II purchased so it was MORE than worth it for them.

This is the nightmare that we need to avoid because were this to happen you are eating up a TON of server resources to service a segment of the community that is going to be running a lot of quests and raids but not providing anything to the community.

Sure they may be making it easier to get $$ and items but that really doesn't help us, it really really doesn't.

Why?

In this scenario Turbine spends a lot of time, energy and system resources to keep everything running smoothly but doesn't get paid a dime for all the extra work and server load. In the end that means their income is stagnant (perhaps even decreasing) while their costs keep increasing. They can't stay in business and offer the same kind of game in that scenario.

That is why I said if you are looking for the "make money" button it shouldn't be there. If you are using the "let me just buy it" button then Turbine should either sell Plat in the store or allow all items to be sold in the store.

Personally I would prefer if it was just all left as it is. It's got a good balance and is obviously making them enough money to keep us entertained.

[Kawai]

That was pretty exhaustive, and explanatory... so, to counter, i believe it could be regulated and monitored with a little forethought. Should also do a little wait and see on how D3 is turning out...
-Tare

[Cauthey]

Personally I would prefer if it was just all left as it is. It's got a good balance and is obviously making them enough money to keep us entertained.

I wholeheartedly agree. DDO is fine the way it is.

Not to mention, do support a game that turns the blind eye or rewards gold/plat farmers is to support that particular industry. I have heard horror stories about poor working conditions and have read articles about "gaming addiction" in Korea. Supporting this industry is not doing any good for the world.

Silicon, thank you for the education on how gold/plat farming works. +1.

[Cauthey]

That was pretty exhaustive, and explanatory... so, to counter, i believe it could be regulated and monitored with a little forethought. Should also do a little wait and see on how D3 is turning out...
-Tare

I disagree. You'll always be one step behind the gold/plat farmers, no matter how much forethought. And even if you catch them (as SiliconScout suggested), they still win. They are much more motivated to "re-roll" their farmers than you or anyone has infrastructure to monitor/police/policy them.

[Kawai]

I disagree. You'll always be one step behind the gold/plat farmers, no matter how much forethought. And even if you catch them (as SiliconScout suggested), they still win. They are much more motivated to "re-roll" their farmers than you or anyone has infrastructure to monitor/police/policy them.

Good point... I concede. Thanks all for the input...
...broken dreams are hard to swallow :(
-Tarelyn

[SiliconScout]

I agree there, it's too bad really because it would be kinda neat.

The good news though is that you can trade those ingredients often for some pretty cool stuff.

[phalaeo]

i know right? my booty is usually parked at mkt1 front and center of the AH. :D Like i think ive said before it takes me months to go 1-20... shameful.
And oh, your sooo wrong about the mall. it IS shopping therapy, especially the shoe stores. :)
But alas, you get my last +1 of the day. Cheers, luv.
-Tarelyn

I wear a Women's 9.5 EEE. The shoe stores are the special hell for this Halfling. ;)

[wax_on_wax_off]

I'd much rather see the AH be accessible outside of the game like an iPhone app or other such thing, would be great fun to interact in this way with the game when you can't otherwise play.

[Kawai]

I'd much rather see the AH be accessible outside of the game like an iPhone app or other such thing, would be great fun to interact in this way with the game when you can't otherwise play.

Heck yeaaa! Even if we could just access it from outside the mmo itself would b nice. I'd be laptopping it at work :D

[Kawai]

I wear a Women's 9.5 EEE. The shoe stores are the special hell for this Halfling. ;)

Hmmm, off topic, but we DO need to be able to change the color of our shoes... that would rock! :cool:

[Zyerz]

Me? No time whatsoever. The AH has become way too overpriced I dont really bother with it. Occasionally I might look for a GS ingredient (if its at a decent price) or a weapon for a lowbie (but most of the time good low min lv weapons go for insane prices). So my time in the AH is minimal.

[Kawai]

Me? No time whatsoever. The AH has become way too overpriced I dont really bother with it. Occasionally I might look for a GS ingredient (if its at a decent price) or a weapon for a lowbie (but most of the time good low min lv weapons go for insane prices). So my time in the AH is minimal.

I'm sorry you've had bad experiences with it...
GS ings usually fluxuate, they've been a lot lower recently (past few months) as the drops have increased...
As for Low Level or lowbie weapons, they can draw the highest of prices simply because of what they are.... you can't craft GS until you get up there, and if you can find something particularly useful with the Frost-Burst Kit attatched to it, it can bring a very high price...
Anyway, it NEVER hurts to check it every so often, if you browse long enough you can usually find a great bargain! (Which is the cause of me addiction ;)

[Tshober]

i have always wondered why they bothered charging a fee with nonexistent currency that they don't need, but it makes sense if they are training the players to accept fee charges when they moved over to real money.

The reason is inflation. DDO is a closed economy. But as you quest and raid away you are constantly adding money to that economy in the form of loot. When you open a chest you add money to the economy that did not exist before. When you sell junk loot to the vendors, you add money to the economy that did not exist before. Econ 101 taught us that when a closed economy keeps adding money and never removing any, very shortly that money becomes essentially worthless and everything costs incredible amounts of money because everyone HAS incredible amounts of money. Inflation. You have to remove money from the economy somehow to slow down inflation. Some MMO's do it with huge gold sinks like player housing. DDO does it mostly with AH fees and airship buff rentals.

[Kawai]

The reason is inflation. DDO is a closed economy. But as you quest and raid away you are constantly adding money to that economy in the form of loot. When you open a chest you add money to the economy that did not exist before. When you sell junk loot to the vendors, you add money to the economy that did not exist before. Econ 101 taught us that when a closed economy keeps adding money and never removing any, very shortly that money becomes essentially worthless and everything costs incredible amounts of money because everyone HAS incredible amounts of money. Inflation. You have to remove money from the economy somehow to slow down inflation. Some MMO's do it with huge gold sinks like player housing. DDO does it mostly with AH fees and airship buff rentals.

Agree... however with the addition of the crafting halls, finding lower level good loot has become much harder and more expensive for the young newbs (non-TRs).
Not saying it's broken, but... hmmm... yea, it's broken. :rolleyes:
....have you hugged a newb lately? (they likey hugz and nice gear in a trade window)

OH! and I wanna House! :D

[Xynot2]

I wasnt referring to players making real money. I was eluding to buyers being able to use real money.

[justagame]

I used to spend more time at the AH, but crafting has probably reduced that a bit.

Additional web-based ways to access it might be nice, but given how myddo works (or doesn't), I'm not sure I would trust it.

And I absolutely oppose allowing real cash to be used in AH transactions.

[PinkDragonJr]

Agree... however with the addition of the crafting halls, finding lower level good loot has become much harder and more expensive for the young newbs (non-TRs).
Not saying it's broken, but... hmmm... yea, it's broken. :rolleyes:
....have you hugged a newb lately? (they likey hugz and nice gear in a trade window)

OH! and I wanna House! :D

and raise a family.
wait i just realized. where are the kids?! why are there no children playing in the streets of Stormreach. are all people born in other cities and then immigrate to Stormreach to become celibate!
i mean really. Turbine we have a serious problem here.

in other news authorities have renounced the rumors that kobolds are kidnapping the cities youngsters to worship as their reincarnated gods.

back to the AH debacle: i mentioned earlier that i have no real preference to it either way. but i would also have to admit that i had not considered now seriously some would take it as a professional career. as far as i was concerned it would be just a few people making some extra cash to justify their gaming habits. but then i play Diablo 2 offline exclusively and never paid any attention to the account frauds that plague WoW.

that being said, I really think that the 'pay to win' club has no foot stand on here. i mean items have been available for purchase at the DDO store for at least the last four years that i have been playing it. being based-ish (Very -ish) on the 3.5 ruleset there are no easy buttons for equipment or other salable items in DDO. the minimum level on items sees to that. actually i'm rather surprised at how few Career Crafters i see, but that may just be the server i'm on. all said it's nothing not like social pages like facebook where it's blindingly obvious who pays of the short cuts and who plays for free.

and yes, yes i do hug newbs all the time. it makes them uncomfortable which is priceless. plus afterwards they ask how i did it and a lesson on the emote command ensues.

[Kawai]

...wait i just realized. where are the kids?! why are there no children playing in the streets of Stormreach?

Children as "pets" would be sweet. :) (Hmmmm, gonna get flamed for that one :rolleyes: )


and yes, yes i do hug newbs all the time. it makes them uncomfortable which is priceless. plus afterwards they ask how i did it and a lesson on the emote command ensues.

I know, right? We used to go hang out on Korthos and give stuff out -until we realized that most of them were TRs... hehe... the trick is to examine them and make sure that the toon is listed as a LvL-1+ Adventurer...

[PinkDragonJr]

I know, right? We used to go hang out on Korthos and give stuff out -until we realized that most of them were TRs... hehe... the trick is to examine them and make sure that the toon is listed as a LvL-1+ Adventurer...

The easiest way is to see if they are wearing the battleworn armor and have no 'wings' on their name. this means that they are not TR's and probably don't have other toons to feed them better unleveled equipment. which means they are probably new to the game. or at least the server.

[Xynot2]

By way of looking at current prices in the AH for items you can buy in DDO store, you can lay out a worth equality of x amount of plat = x amount of TP and vsv. For example, On thelanis, Major SP pots = 20k.. Look at how much the SP pots cost in the DDO store and there's your baseline. So if tubine ever does add the ability to use TPs in the AH, Player A wants to buy (item) from the AH but doesnt have the plat. So he uses TP by using the afore mentioned formula and buys the item using TPs (plus a few extra TPs for the service) Player who auctioned the item would receive the buyout price in platinum, again using the afore mentioned formula.

#1- This allows a player to spend cash that helps turbine keep the game running.
#2- Prevents people from making real $$ on the game (other than turbine)
#3- Adds a new dimension to the game

You would have to restrict TP use in the AH to buyout price only but as you see, you can make it work without it causing problems.

[Kawai]

By way of looking at current prices in the AH for items you can buy in DDO store, you can lay out a worth equality of x amount of plat = x amount of TP and vsv. For example, On thelanis, Major SP pots = 20k.. Look at how much the SP pots cost in the DDO store and there's your baseline. So if tubine ever does add the ability to use TPs in the AH, Player A wants to buy (item) from the AH but doesnt have the plat. So he uses TP by using the afore mentioned formula and buys the item using TPs (plus a few extra TPs for the service) Player who auctioned the item would receive the buyout price in platinum, again using the afore mentioned formula.

#1- This allows a player to spend cash that helps turbine keep the game running.
#2- Prevents people from making real $$ on the game (other than turbine)
#3- Adds a new dimension to the game

You would have to restrict TP use in the AH to buyout price only but as you see, you can make it work without it causing problems.

I'm open to that... or anything related actually. Anything to make it more worthwhile. I spend a lot of time parked in mkt1Pawn... would LUV to make some money while doing it... ~still just say'n... :rolleyes:

[PinkDragonJr]

being a free to player character i would really not mind earning turbine points through this instead of just by Favor or purchase. i also acknowledge that if a player does not have enough plat but absolutely has to have the item right now, then they would be either VIP's or otherwise have a large amount of burnable points, so the instances of people buying with points would be small anyway. i suppose a strategy here would be to have the item for 100,000 plat or 10 TP.

[Kawai]

being a free to player character i would really not mind earning turbine points through this instead of just by Favor or purchase. i also acknowledge that if a player does not have enough plat but absolutely has to have the item right now, then they would be either VIP's or otherwise have a large amount of burnable points, so the instances of people buying with points would be small anyway. i suppose a strategy here would be to have the item for 100,000 plat or 10 TP.

This is similar to Xynot's post, with the addition of TP being recieved for an item, am i correct in assuming thats what you implied?
I'd b game for that... TPs for a premie are hard to come by... :( so yea, good idea.

[Xynot2]

This is similar to Xynot's post, with the addition of TP being recieved for an item, am i correct in assuming thats what you implied?
I'd b game for that... TPs for a premie are hard to come by... :( so yea, good idea.

No. The seller would receive plat. My suggestion makes it an ease for the buyer and earns Turbine some real money. There is no incentive for turbine if you just transfer TPs from one player to the other.

[Kawai]

No. The seller would receive plat. My suggestion makes it an ease for the buyer and earns Turbine some real money. There is no incentive for turbine if you just transfer TPs from one player to the other.

Hey, if we're out there doing the buying/selling... that would make us a small DDO workforce... temps :D
I would agree to a 50/50 split.
ok, ok, ok... 60/40... :p

[Xynot2]

The idea of being able to buy AH items with TPs is a player convenience. You will notice that items in convenience stores cost more than other stores. I dont mind throwing down some extra $$ for the convenience of being able to buyout with TP. But giving the seller the TPs is counter productive to Turbine making money.

I know people that make a real living (as in it's the way they make a living) on WoW by creating accounts, leveling them up and then selling them at places like Ebay. I dont want to see Turbine turn into WoW EVER!!! Or anything remotely close, for that matter. I want to see better gameplay, etc, etc, etc. It's what enticed me from being a F2P player to a Premium player. I purchased all of the content to date (classes, races, adpax, xpac and 16 toon slots) so I dont mind plunking down a bit of $$ for conveniences.

But having been a business owner, free samples are just that... free samples. Players get enough TPs just by grinding for favor. They dont need to be given TPs from other players. I stand with my original suggestion that "x"plat is = to "y" TP's and buyout with TP= plat to the seller.

[Kawai]

...Players get enough TPs just by grinding for favor....

Oooh puhhh! :mad: Grinding for the around weekly or sometimes *monthly 25 points doesnt quite do it when you need a lot of points to purchase stuff you really really want.
Besides, they could easily put a limit as to how much.... again, ~just say'n.

*as stated earlier, i spend the majority of my time at the AH... not levelling like most of you power gamerboyz out there.... :o

[Alrik_Fassbauer]

As a side-note : What i REALLY don't like is when I put things into the AH for beginners - reading : first-life Newbies - I charge only very few Plat for that, because I blieve that Newbies won't have that man plat, but could use the item - and THEN someone buys that item for that few Plat coins and re-sells it for several ten- or hundreds of thousands of plat again !

I believe there should be actually TWO Auction Houses : One for first-life Newbies ONLY, and one for the rest.

Just to protect Newbies from those who would like to snatch everything from them to sell it to the highest bidder big time.

My impüression is that the argument "but that is how a market works !" is brought forward ONLY by those who exploit Newbies. It is never brought forward by those Newbies themselves or by those who would want to help them.

This is similar to the supposedly existing Harbour scam of someone telling a Newbie to buy a rare item for let's say 10.000 Plat - and THEN re-selling it for 100.000 elsewhere !

The argument "but that's how any market works" is never used by the exploited people. It is only used by exploiters.

And this is true to Real Life as well. If someone argues "but that's how the market works !", then I immideately become cautious and the person's reputation drops into the cellar.

[Kawai]

...I believe there should be actually TWO Auction Houses : One for first-life Newbies ONLY, and one for the rest.

I can whole-heartedly agree to this... there should b a small halfling auctioneer on Korthos Island. Kind of... an introduction to the AH sort of thingy. :)
But my god... can you imagine the price of say... a Masterwork Greataxe? :eek:
They'd figure it out quickly and have lots'a copper in thier little pockets. :D
...they're so cute at that age. :rolleyes:

[Xynot2]

Oooh puhhh! :mad: Grinding for the around weekly or sometimes *monthly 25 points doesnt quite do it when you need a lot of points to purchase stuff you really really want.
Besides, they could easily put a limit as to how much.... again, ~just say'n.

*as stated earlier, i spend the majority of my time at the AH... not levelling like most of you power gamerboyz out there.... :o

Im no PGer either. In 4 years, I have 3 toons that made it to 20 and 2 TRs- 1 iis 16 (ty XP stone) and the other is 9. So I feel your pain. With as much as I would love extra TPs, I understand the biz end of things and have to side with Turbine. Were I the owner, I wouldn't feel the motivation to give away more TPs than is already being given away.

[Kawai]

...and I have to side with Turbine.

It's k.
Velah joined me.
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ly019tldce1r81zo5o1_250.jpg

...says we'll get started in a minute. ;)
-Just waiting on her guildee, Arraetrikos. :eek:

...and a healer, of course. :p
But you know what that means... will be waiting a while... Harry will want to get started and more than likely zerg right to you. :mad:

[LordMond63]

Harry will want to get started and more than likely zerg right to you.

Arretreikos Jenkins?

[oskar581]

I wish there was a favor break that reduced this I mean really all you do take money from hard working farmers.

Maybe a favor break down to 15% then some money is taken I mean really nobody eats, drinks, sleeps or re leaves themselves in stormreach unless the are hurt, out of sp, under a spell, or ... well we just don't do that. we have sewers but no potties in our inns, if the amount of money the average auctioneer in stormreach made per month were calculated then compared to the actually costs of running an auction house then can we notice it's not like the coin lords are doing that much for keeping things clean or maintaining giant cracks the lead to other planes of existence.

In closing let us get a discount on the Auction house's take

[Kawai]

Arretreikos Jenkins?

yep, that's the one! :rolleyes:

[PinkDragonJr]

So then what incentive does a player have to Auction an item with a TP buyout if they get nothing more than what they would get from a regular auction? you say turbine wouldn't want to give something for nothing, that goes more so for the average player.
And i doubt turbine would even bother with the effort of coding something that would not generate a predictable player interest base.
Also, even with the current auction system it would no be a straight transfer of points, just like the Auctioner does not receive all of the plat paid in the current system.
If a player buys something for 10 TP, 10 TP have to be purchase from turbine, during the auction transaction 3 points are kept by Turbine as an auction fee and 7 are paid to the Auctioner , who then uses them to buy something else. 2 are then keep by turbine and 5 are sent to that seller. Idea here is; for points to be used they must first be purchased from turbine, and eventually will all be returned to turbine due to this fee.
This generates a increased rate at which TP are purchased and expended overall, increasing the flow of TP that turbine both sells and eventually receives back.
Free is not free. Free is incentive.

And as a businessman you must understand that a persistent flow of cash is more important that the perception of value. Turbine will making making cash out of this.

[Kawai]

so then what incentive does a player have to put out an item with a TP buyout of they get nothing more than what they would get from a regular auction? you say turbine wouldn't want to give something for nothing, that goes more so for the average player.
and i doubt turbine would even bother with the effort of coding something that would not generate a player interest a predictable player interest base.
and it would no be a straight transfer of points just like the transfer of plat is not done now.
if a player buys something for 10 TP 10 TP have purchase from turbine, 3 are kept and 7 transferred to the receiver, who then uses them to buy something else. 2 are keep and 5 are sent to that seller. the point is for points to be use they must first be purchased and then then replenish due to fee bleed. this generates a increased rate at which TP are purchased and expended, increasing the flow of TP that turbine both sells and eventually receive them back.
Free is not free. Free is incentive.

and as a businessman you must understand that a persistent flow of cash is more important that the perception of value. Turbine will making making cash out of this.

I had to read this three times before some of it made sense... more confused than a noob in the Shroud. :rolleyes:

[PinkDragonJr]

I had to read this three times before some of it made sense... more confused than a noob in the Shroud. :rolleyes:


Yeah. Sorry.
Reworded in some places, hopefully a little easier to read the lines and punctuation added.
Also, that noob would be me. Hard to think that I've played this game for three years and still haven't done a shroud run...

..one day...one day...

[Xynot2]

So then what incentive does a player have to Auction an item with a TP buyout if they get nothing more than what they would get from a regular auction? you say turbine wouldn't want to give something for nothing, that goes more so for the average player.
And i doubt turbine would even bother with the effort of coding something that would not generate a predictable player interest base.
Also, even with the current auction system it would no be a straight transfer of points, just like the Auctioner does not receive all of the plat paid in the current system.

The convenience isnt for the seller. It's for the buyer. People always want more plat so they are either putting stuff on AH or standing around the Harbor or Marketplace and linking items to trade chat to sell them.


If a player buys something for 10 TP, 10 TP have to be purchase from turbine, during the auction transaction 3 points are kept by Turbine as an auction fee and 7 are paid to the Auctioner , who then uses them to buy something else. 2 are then keep by turbine and 5 are sent to that seller. Idea here is; for points to be used they must first be purchased from turbine, and eventually will all be returned to turbine due to this fee.
This generates a increased rate at which TP are purchased and expended overall, increasing the flow of TP that turbine both sells and eventually receives back.
Free is not free. Free is incentive.

And as a businessman you must understand that a persistent flow of cash is more important that the perception of value. Turbine will making making cash out of this.

Again- gold spammers would be rampant and people would also try to make a living off DDO. No thanks. Turbine is the only one who needs to make money off this game.

Thinking about this idea, I can see the value of things like passes going up in plat price. But To keep the cost of TP from the steady increase we have been seeing, I think it would benefit Turbine financially much more than they expect and give us another convenience.

[Kawai]

...Again- gold spammers would be rampant and people would also try to make a living off DDO. No thanks. Turbine is the only one who needs to make money off this game.

Dunno about the spamming... so cant articulate... however, what exactly is wrong with making a little shiny while playing? I mean c'mon, Im a waitress and can barely afford to play this game at all, let alone buy all the pretties i want. An alternative would be most appreciated! ;)
(me likey points) :D