Clerics and AC

[mikarddo]

Greetings

My cleric is now lvl 13 with an unbuffed AC of 35. I am wondering if thats of any value or I might as well drop the Mithral Armor for a Robe - or if the AC will still be of value for a little while longer. Please advice.

[sirgog]

I usually drop all armor on a divine around level 11.

AC becomes 'invest heavily or get nothing' around level 12.

[PNellesen]

I usually drop all armor on a divine around level 11.

AC becomes 'invest heavily or get nothing' around level 12.

I've got a Horc cleric at level 11 right now who's running around with some crafted Adamantine armor with a small guild slot. He's also got a robe with a medium guild slot that I was thinking of swapping to, but I like having that DR3/-. Does it make a difference at all at these levels, or is he losing more to the Armor Check penalty than he's gaining from the DR?

[Sarisa]

On my current TR (Clonk, which has a much easier time achieving AC than other divines), 40-45 AC was useful throughout the Sands, and is useful on normal Gianthold. It was not useful in most of Lordsmarch. It is not useful in hard or elite Gianthold.

Invulnerability is actually still useful in Gianthold (at least the normals). Many of the mobs there still don't have magic weapons, and can't bypass it.

[Alaunra2010]

I ditched the heavy armor, since it wasn't high enough to mitigate incoming attacks and the penalty to jump in heavy armor is awful.

[krackythehoodedone]

AC isnt really a big consideration with Clerics.

You shouldnt get that much aggro.

Definitely near the bottom of your priorities list

Clonks are a bit different they have a free inbuilt high AC and fight occasionaly

[Spoonwelder]

A well (or poorly) placed blade barrier can generate a ton of aggro.

Searing lights long range can get mobs to seek you out as a cleric.

Anyone not caught by your greater command will make a beeline to you.

Etc......

Clerics can get aggro aplenty - they need to be ready to mitigate it or run like the wind preferrably in circles around their blade barrier until everything is dead.

[Sarisa]

On my Clerics, I WANT aggro most of the time. I can mitigate it more easily, and it gives party members with sneak attack items or class abilities better damage.

[morticianjohn]

I wasn't trying for AC but my cleric (back when I had one) after crystal cove got epic swashbuckler, epic cove ring, and epic cavalry plate and that really helped when doing my favor runs. The AC was useful in everything up to elite vale in which the AC helped only against the lower to hit mobs like orthons. It all came out to 55-60 AC when I had the shield equipped.

[unbongwah]

I would think "Shield Mastery + some form of DR" would be a much simpler investment in cleric survivability than struggling with AC gear.

[trog_star]

I would think "Shield Mastery + some form of DR" would be a much simpler investment in cleric survivability than struggling with AC gear.

definetly :)
more DR = better

i run an AC most consider useless on my cleric.
it's the difference between mobs hitting you on a 2 or mobs hitting you on a 3.
the tower shield means i'm gonna jump/swim like a rock anyway :)
better than a poke in the eye with a blunt fish, but not by much.

[Faent]

There are some Clonks that run around with an AC that is quite useful in even Elite Amrath. If you can pull it off, it makes a huge difference to the survivability of most parties running that content. I don't think I'd want to do that, though. If you're going to grind for AC gear, I'd rather grind for it on something other than a cleric.

[raveman1000]

On my clonk I can reach 78 AC with some buffs but I invested heavily in AC gear at the cost of... well almost nothing since casters aren't as gear intensive when compared to melees. That AC is good in all non-epic content but is totally useless in epic. As mentionned before, a good crafted life shield/blood rage heavy/tower shield of superior stability with shield mastery would be more usefull in epic than all the AC I've got.

[good_ole_corwin]

On my clonk I can reach 78 AC with some buffs but I invested heavily in AC gear at the cost of... well almost nothing since casters aren't as gear intensive when compared to melees.

If youre maxing out your AC without sacrificing any spellcasting ability, then youre probably sacrificing HPs. I dont see having an archmage item (might be able to swap it out if youre a heavy buffer, but...), GS SP item, (greater) arcane lore item, +6 or +7 spellcasting stat item, +3 exceptional stat item and 2-4 greater focus items, high concentration item if at all possible - the difference in maxing out your melee DPS or spellcasting ability isnt that big gear-wise, both requires sizeable commitment. On top of that standard stuff like GFL, +6 con and heavy fort - and of course youd also want a GS HPs item, +3 exceptional con item, toughness item, striding and Im possibly still forgetting something. I cant imagine fitting in all the dodges, dexterities, inherent and w/e else Im forgetting without sacrificing something significant from the above list... Theres always a trade-off. Just saying :)

[Kmnh]

If you are heavily on the "caster" side you can use heavy armor, a heavy shield and a green steel "heightened awareness" stick.

10 base
1+2+3 dodge (crafted trinket, crafted goggles, bracers of wind)
+6 deflection (from a crafted "superior stability" armor or shield)
+5 natural armor (crystal cove)
+4 green steel heightened awareness
+13 crafted mithral full plate
+7 crafted shield
+5 dex (3 max from armor, +2 from mobility trinket)
+2 rituals
+2 ship buffs

60 is playable, right? This is doable at level 14.

A dwarf can get more Dex. Humans and Helves have an AC boost for bosses and the like.

[Roburn]

My cleric just wears robes. Shield Mastery, Positive Energy Aura and a Conc Op item and he does pretty good without any A/C

[good_ole_corwin]

If you are heavily on the "caster" side you can use heavy armor, a heavy shield and a green steel "heightened awareness" stick.

10 base
1+2+3 dodge (crafted trinket, crafted goggles, bracers of wind)
+6 deflection (from a crafted "superior stability" armor or shield)
+5 natural armor (crystal cove)
+4 green steel heightened awareness
+13 crafted mithral full plate
+7 crafted shield
+5 dex (3 max from armor, +2 from mobility trinket)
+2 rituals
+2 ship buffs

60 is playable, right? This is doable at level 14.

A dwarf can get more Dex. Humans and Helves have an AC boost for bosses and the like.

Thanks for kinda proving my point - so you have helm, armor, weapon, trinket,bracers and goggles dedicated to items that do very little for spellcasting ability and youre nowhere near the advertised 78 AC.
Also, on that gear setup:
Only source of spell pen IX that I know of would be epic Hruvayahs medallion (spelling), since you cant slot goggles, bracers, trinkets or weapons.
You cant slot a toughness item until epics, since you have helmet and bracers taken.
You will be hard pressed to slot exceptional stat bonuses and greater focus items at the same time, so will probably have to settle for +3 exceptional on wis (if casting is priority) and 1 greater focus (possibly 2, if you want to sacrifice some combat-useful prefix on a shield).
Heavy fort or GFL could be on the crafted ring with a greater focus, but we are still left with just neck, belt, boots and cloak for at the minimum:
GS SPs item, GS HPs item (one of them conc-opp with +6 wis I would assume), GFL or heavy fort, +6 con, +6 cha, striding, +13 or +15 concentration (maybe Shintao necklace with both constitution and concentration) and come to think of it, there are no items in those slots with (greater) arcane lore at all, are there?

That said, Im not attacking clonks aiming for extreme ACs, since thats most likely heavy dex-invested builds, they will have reasonable saves and evasion, altogether highly survivable characters. But theres always a trade-off, cant have "ultimate" values in both AC and spellcasting abilities, just as ultra AC melees will have to sacrifice DPS.

[Kmnh]

snip

AC doesn't work on epics anyway, that equipment is about getting from 14 to 20.

At level 20, you can wear the abishai set for 3 more, get the tower shield feat and an epic alchemical shield for 4 , consolidate some of the gear with the "crafting +3" on cannith items, and so on. Take levels 19 and 20 as monk and you can have insane AC.

Oh, and the Magewright's Spectacles have spell pen IX. They are easy to farm. Don't waste your neck slot :D

You can build an alchemical weapon with heightened awareness 4, alchemical wisdom +2 and greater spell pen IX if you are attemptng an endgame build.

[Khellendros13]

You can build an alchemical weapon with heightened awareness 4, alchemical wisdom +2 and greater spell pen IX if you are attemptng an endgame build.

On handwraps and take SF too if you want.

[good_ole_corwin]

Oh, and the Magewright's Spectacles have spell pen IX. They are easy to farm. Don't waste your neck slot :D

Yes, if only he wasnt using goggles for his AC equipment, if only both posts mentioned that... Oh wait.

Good point about the spell pen from alchemicals for endgame though, forgot you can slot both awareness and spell pen on them. Being a casting clonk and wanting to stay in stance I would probably argue for dual-wielding alchemical kamas or handaxes (or maybe take the feat and make them long swords? Probably not worth it on a feat starved build) rather than wraps - to get wisdom, constitution, spell pen, greater evocation and conjuration focuses (as well as efficient meta II for both emp and max). Enjoy the epic lob grind though :D

As for a greater abishai set, yes, thats another +3 AC, but also 3 gearslots taken. I guess you could do helm (+GFL), boots (+heavy fort, +6 stat) and maybe bracers (+toughness) for the +8 armor, or if you can slot that somewhere else (DT robe maybe for only +6 armor, but more options such as striding, healing amp and maybe natural armor +4), cloak (+toughness) because +7 con is just so nice to have... In any case you will be hard pressed for the two GS items again (since you will need most likely belt for archmagi, youre left with just necklace and either goggles -sacrificing a crafted dodge bonus- or bracers -can you slot a dodge +3 elsewhere?- or cloak -forcing you to finish the abishai set with either gloves -not having enough blue slots to get both toughness and heavy fort- or bracers -losing that dodge +3 again-). One ring has to be taken for the +3 exceptional wis (unless you sacrifice the crafted dodge on goggles and get epic Time-sensing), the other should be crafted with a greater necro bonus and maybe concentration and all thats left is a trinket, that needs to be a crafted mobile of dodge to max AC. The gearset is already compromising in AC (no icy raiments for dodge +4, no superior stability for protection +6), still doesnt have greater arcane lore (and come to think of it, greater enchantment focus neither) making compromises in spellcasting ability as well and has no space for exceptional con +2 (+1 could possibly fit into one of the epic slots) and resistance +5... And if youre lucky enough to get all the right buffs in the group, that would get you somewhere to the region of low-mid 80s in AC, which is still not enough for epics AFAIK.

I am fairly sure theres room for improvement there and if you really maxed your AC as a priority, you could get it to cross 90 which, well, might be enough for epic trash to miss you sometimes, epic LOB might even need to roll a 3 to hit you if you completely and utterly debuff him :-D All in all not worth the grind for that gearset.

On your way to cap, if you already have monk levels, havent dumped dex and really try to get the right equipment, yes, you can postpone AC not mattering till level 15-ish, maybe all the way to cap in normal or even hard content sometimes, but if youre planning to stay at cap, play elite raids and epics, just build for whatever works on cap. Maxing your HPs, DR and spellcasting ability can be achieved at the same time, truly maxing your AC means not maxing anything else (IMHO).

[maverik99]

Ac works Perfectly with 90+ in epics.

Some people like fighters pala or rarely monks can arrive to this value.
My monk for now have 75 unbuffed but with epics item i will arrive easy to 90.

For your cleric the best ac that you can take is or with 2 monks lv, or if you choise half elf with dilettante monk... that give you ac with wisd mod.

I make a build 18 cleric/2 monk "archer" with zen archery and 2 monk tr for a little dps....
He arrive to 60-65 ac unbuffed... and hight attack bonus ;)

[ThePrincipal]

I find DR more important than AC on my cleric. I'll often fight and heal from the front, but if things get hurty I'll turtle up behind a shield (using madstone atm) and aura/burst heal taking little to no damage.