Can't believe I just saw this.

[Tajuh]

So I'm running through elite WW for the favor. Normal PUGishness, but the Monk kept getting beat up. Due to party members drawing kaggro, we had to disband. Curious about his fragility as a human monk, I asked what his con was.

This is the result.
http://i1226.photobucket.com/albums/ee403/TajuhDDO/ScreenShot00001-1.jpg
http://i1226.photobucket.com/albums/ee403/TajuhDDO/ScreenShot00002-1.jpg
http://i1226.photobucket.com/albums/ee403/TajuhDDO/ScreenShot00003-1.jpg
http://i1226.photobucket.com/albums/ee403/TajuhDDO/ScreenShot00004-1.jpg

He is level 5.

[Gempoult]

yeah, too bad for the bag, but really for lvl 5 28 point build he should re-roll rather than try to lesser. really positive thing is he took advice and seems he is gonna listen and improve ;) cause a lot of those people usually don't.

[Tajuh]

He was a 32 point build.

[Ilindith]

In before the lock, warning, infraction, etc.

[Thrudh]

So I'm running through elite WW for the favor. Normal PUGishness, but the Monk kept getting beat up. Due to party members drawing kaggro, we had to disband.

What I can't believe is that you can't handle elite WW even with a low hp monk in the group and you guys had to disband.

[WielderofGigantus]

In before the lock, warning, infraction, etc.
Why would there be any of those? He blanked out the name.

[Gawna]

What I can't believe is that you can't handle elite WW even with a low hp monk in the group and you guys had to disband.

He clearly said that they had to disband due to irl issues. What does that have to do with not being able to handle the quest?

[Arshan]

Not beating the lvl 7 46 HP rogue on his 5th life i pugged for elite necro 1 once. "ROgues dont need HP because they have AC" !
And btw he couldnt take the traps...

[Thrudh]

He clearly said that they had to disband due to irl issues. What does that have to do with not being able to handle the quest?

Ah, kaggro means kid aggro.... I thought it meant kobold aggro... :)

Never mind then! :)

[Gawna]

Ah, kaggro means kid aggro.... I thought it meant kobold aggro... :)

Never mind then! :)

HA! That was pretty funny, but I can see how it can be read that way. Those kobolds are tricksy with their aggro patterns!

[Ilindith]

Why would there be any of those? He blanked out the name.

You'd be as surprised as I was last time I did that.

[BladeTricks]

That doesn't sound very surprising to me. I'm sure plenty of people start with 8 CON. The other stats are just a lot more attractive when you don't know there's such a big emphasis on hit points in this game.

The newbie then:
* didn't take Toughness feat, because it's all the way at the bottom and there's attractive feats before it on the list.
* doesn't have a false life item
* doesn't have a +X CON item (up to +6 apparently as U11 can drop no ML +6 stat rings)
* doesn't have +10 HP Crystal Cove trinket
* doesn't have +2 CON shrine on guild airship

Elite difficulty is just not meant for characters like that. I hope he can stick to Normal and have fun playing this game.

[mudfud]

So this is what I get from this thread.
You want someone to play the way you want. Check.
When I build another dump con assassin you won't want to play with him, cause it doesn't fit into your prescribed build. Check.
When my lvl 7 rogue elf who will start with 6 con goes to 4 con when I equip my bloodrage symbiot, I will once again be reminded you won't approve of that. Check
But wait, I understand you will be paying my subscription so then you will be allowed to tell me how to play my characters. Check

[Tajuh]

Looks like he did reroll, seeing as an ingame mail sent to him bounced back due to toon deletion. I hope to see him around again with better hp, because he wasn't that bad outside the fubared build.

[Llewndyn]

What I can't believe is that you can't handle elite WW even with a low hp monk in the group and you guys had to disband.

It's because I wasn't there.

[jwdaniels]

What was he planning on doing with a large gem bag? Did you at least explain that gems are basically nothing more than vendor trash?

[wax_on_wax_off]

So this is what I get from this thread.
You want someone to play the way you want. Check.
When I build another dump con assassin you won't want to play with him, cause it doesn't fit into your prescribed build. Check.
When my lvl 7 rogue elf who will start with 6 con goes to 4 con when I equip my bloodrage symbiot, I will once again be reminded you won't approve of that. Check
But wait, I understand you will be paying my subscription so then you will be allowed to tell me how to play my characters. Check

Play your characters however you want, just don't join my elite/epic groups.

[Rosze]

Well thats just too low for most cases. Usually no mater what class i have i can hit about 100hp at lvl 4 its kinda like a good standard and not too hard to hit with playing with the enchantments.

[mudfud]

Play your characters however you want, just don't join my elite/epic groups.

Isn't that a double standard. If I have your permission to play my characters how I want, and I want to join your epic/elite groups how am I do to that since in that same sentence you are telling me to not play my characters how I want?
More like you should have been saying. I've only been playing for less then 2 years. I'm going to follow the masses and believe that every character who plays ddo on elite or epic needs a certain amount of hitpoints.
See that's the type of thinking that breaks this game. It's time for you and others like you to open yourself up to something not of the norm. Now I do realize that there are all different types of players, and some can pull off the con dump easily, while others can't. But to say that someone shouldn't join your groups because of it is simple-minded-ness.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Isn't that a double standard. If I have your permission to play my characters how I want, and I want to join your epic/elite groups how am I do to that since in that same sentence you are telling me to not play my characters how I want?
More like you should have been saying. I've only been playing for less then 2 years. I'm going to follow the masses and believe that every character who plays ddo on elite or epic needs a certain amount of hitpoints.
See that's the type of thinking that breaks this game. It's time for you and others like you to open yourself up to something not of the norm. Now I do realize that there are all different types of players, and some can pull off the con dump easily, while others can't. But to say that someone shouldn't join your groups because of it is simple-minded-ness.

No, it's me playing the game how I want to play. Our right to play the game how we want only extends so far as to playing with people who accept our style of play, no one has the right to negatively impact the enjoyment of people around them.

Play how you like but if our playstyles aren't compatible then we shouldn't group, it's simple really. Put up your own LFM if you like.

I see to outcomes from low HP characters in my group:
A. They die a lot (not fun for me)
B. They play a minimalist style and prioritize not dying over contributing (which creates more work for others and is hence not fun for me)

I'm quite flexible with my approach to HP. While leveling my rogue I had very low HP scores as I was lacking GFL, Minos or a +6 con item as all slots were taken by AC gear. I was only hit 5% of the time even by elite red names and had effective defenses vs spells so my HP was fine. However, if a pugger joined my group and had *less* HP than me; something must be really wrong with their character (and they usually got the boot).