Paladin AA

[Clemeit]

Big revisions from my last try at this build, dropped a lot of arbitrary feats and gained some better ones.

I'm fairly new to multiclassing and probably missed some things so bear with me.

Taking Defender of Siberys for stances
Took 6 ranger for the free feats (TWF, iTWF, Manyshot, Bow Damage)

My Plans: Self healing for solo play. TWF because I already have a barb who swings his large axe all over the place, and even in the Shroud that gets old. Dual khopeshes. Evasion and high saves so I can run through traps while soloing. DoS for stances. Can pull out a Lit II with manyshot + slaying arrows. So basically a medium paced soloer who can still party. Someone who isn't GREAT at anything, but is 'good' at everything.

(Bow style with full TWF line for backup.)

Currently in-game level 18 (10 pal / 6 rng / 2 mnk)
Working out great, love the build. The beginning levels (1-9) were hell, but then the build started holding its own.
HP: 435 stanced
SP: 342
AC: Up to ~60
Saves: 33/38/22 unbuffed
Bow base damage of ~45-50's with a +4 bow (not greensteel obviously)
Gear: Very minimal, no GS, no raid gear, just looted and still working fine.
Fighting with two weapons works fine when manyshot is on cooldown.
All-in-all, not "ZOMG THE BEST!!!" but it's fun and good, and that's what games are about.


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.12.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Izamine
Level 20 Lawful Good Elf Female
(12 Paladin \ 2 Monk \ 6 Ranger)
Hit Points: 353
Spell Points: 355
BAB: 19\19\24\29\29
Fortitude: 24
Reflex: 23
Will: 14

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 16 23
Dexterity 17 19
Constitution 14 16
Intelligence 8 10
Wisdom 8 10
Charisma 12 14

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 20)
Balance 7 24
Bluff 1 2
Concentration 6 27
Diplomacy 1 2
Disable Device n/a n/a
Haggle 1 2
Heal -1 0
Hide 3 4
Intimidate 1 2
Jump 7 22
Listen -1 2
Move Silently 3 4
Open Lock n/a n/a
Perform n/a n/a
Repair -1 0
Search -1 2
Spot -1 2
Swim 3 6
Tumble n/a 5.5
Use Magic Device n/a n/a

Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 2 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead


Level 3 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot


Level 4 (Paladin)


Level 5 (Ranger)


Level 6 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot


Level 7 (Paladin)


Level 8 (Paladin)


Level 9 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness


Level 10 (Paladin)


Level 11 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Paladin Armor Class Boost I
Enhancement: Paladin Attack Boost I
Enhancement: Paladin Saves Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Elven Enchantment Resistance I
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Attack I
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage I
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage II
Enhancement: Silver Flame Exorcism
Enhancement: Follower of the Silver Flame
Enhancement: Paladin Courage of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Focus of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Focus of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Righteousness I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
Enhancement: Paladin Defender of Siberys I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Paladin Devotion I
Enhancement: Paladin Devotion II
Enhancement: Paladin Energy of the Templar I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness II
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Might I


Level 12 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Power Attack
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons


Level 13 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: ? <- what should i put here?


Level 14 (Ranger)


Level 15 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting


Level 16 (Paladin)


Level 17 (Paladin)


Level 18 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons


Level 19 (Paladin)


Level 20 (Paladin)
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Acid Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Explosive Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Burst Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Slaying Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Terror Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Attack II
Enhancement: Paladin Item Defense I
Enhancement: Way of the Patient Tortoise I
Enhancement: Paladin Courage of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands II
Enhancement: Paladin Defender of Siberys II
Enhancement: Paladin Redemption I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +2 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +3 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +4 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +5 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer I
Enhancement: Paladin Energy of the Templar II

[wax_on_wax_off]

Without looking at the build I can tell you off the bat one important thing; ranged combat and paladin don't really mix.

Maybe one day you'll be able to apply skiffs and sacrifices to ranged weapons but until then I wouldn't touch this unless I was looking for a PL paladin on an archer build (but then I'd probably go 8/6/6 or something).

[Clemeit]

Without looking at the build I can tell you off the bat one important thing; ranged combat and paladin don't really mix.

Maybe one day you'll be able to apply skiffs and sacrifices to ranged weapons but until then I wouldn't touch this unless I was looking for a PL paladin on an archer build (but then I'd probably go 8/6/6 or something).


Without playing the build, I can see were you are coming from. But I've played the build quite far and its plenty better then most rangers I ever quest with. More HP, higher saves, able to dual wield and imbues where many rangers can only do one sufficiently. Hits harder, higher to-hit, ect. And this is with so far very minimal gear. I would never make a ranger over this probably as long as a play DDO because its turned out to be much much better and has much greater level of survivability (LoH & heals)


Without looking at the build I can tell you off the bat one important thing; ranged combat and paladin don't really mix.

"Without looking at the build" - don't judge a book by its cover.

[maddmatt70]

First lose lightning reflexes OP. 12 pally 6 ranger 2 monk has some promise someday toward being something interesting, I actually think that 12 pally 6 monk 2 ranger is better right now. 12 pally hunter of the dead 6 monk 2 ranger Half elf with massive healing amp, decent hp, and incredible saves would be virtually indestructible and would have both 10k stars and manyshot for pretty solid ranged dps as well as unarmed dps..

[wax_on_wax_off]

Without playing the build, I can see were you are coming from. But I've played the build quite far and its plenty better then most rangers I ever quest with. More HP, higher saves, able to dual wield and imbues where many rangers can only do one sufficiently. Hits harder, higher to-hit, ect. And this is with so far very minimal gear. I would never make a ranger over this probably as long as a play DDO because its turned out to be much much better and has much greater level of survivability (LoH & heals)

Prior to level 20 a tempest ranger probably has as-strong ranged power as your build as nothing that paladin offers adds to your ranged capability (except for divine might but DMII isn't worthwhile, imo) while a tempest ranger adds quite considerable FE/rams might damage to quite a lot of foes and can benefit from haste boost (on, for instance, an exploiter build).

When it comes to melee damage you're going to get left behind by a tempest ranger who has +20% offhand proc and +5% doublestrike. Perhaps while leveling you'll have a bit of leniency as paladin abilities are less reliant on gear but overall it's not very strong. You've also given up zeal which is one of the best thing that paladin offers. These contributions with tempest are really being overly generous, tempest is a less than optimal choice at the moment in comparative gear situations but comparing the build to the DPS that a barbarian or fighter puts out (even one built for survivability) isn't going to end well (for your build).

DoS is also a questionable choice. DoS stance adds hate to ranged as well so you're going to get a disproportionate amount of attention even when your actual DPS contribution isn't up to scratch. Do you think that you can tank on this build? Maybe with AC while leveling but I don't see it as being viable at cap. Ranged builds get more than their fair share of hate anyway so you really are just going to be exacerbating the problem.

Your strength and other stats are going to be worse compared to a ranger who doesn't need dexterity to qualify for ranged feats. This won't be as noticeable while you level but in elite content and at end game you'll develop AB issues which is already an issue for paladins without the extra issues that you've added.


"Without looking at the build" - don't judge a book by its cover.

If I look closer at the build, these are the problems that I see:
1. No IPS. You've skipped one of 2 primary opportunities that you have to make your ranged investment worthwhile: AoE DPS (the other being burst DPS from manyshot). With everything being as marginal as it is I simply can't imagine skipping IPS if you want to maintain any measure of usefulness at end game.

2. Elf. Half-elf is vastly superior for survivability, general DPS and versatility. The only advantage that Elf has for melee DPS (which this build has to rely on a majority of the time lacking 10k stars) is scimitars/rapiers which you've skipped by picking up khopesh proficiency.

3. No Improved Critical: Slashing. This is a massive shortfall in DPS considering that you've chosen to go with Khopesh as your weapon.

4. You've chosen to go for weapons rather than handwraps. Khopesh will do more damage on 0-50% fort enemies but handwraps are much more versatile with a moderate investment in wisdom and stunning fist.

5. Lightning Reflexes feat, what were you thinking?

6. No UMD, what were you thinking?

7. Jump, looks like you have too much, reallocate some to Move Silently to open up more tactical options (when coupled with invisibility scroll from UMD, see above).

8. Favoured Enemy: Human? What the hell? There is only 1 way to do FE's. Favoured Enemy: Undead for first which you swap to FE: Evil Outsider after you finish in Necropolis 4 pack. Favoured Enemy: Construct with your second pick (assuming that you have access to U11: Secrets of the Artificers pack).

On balance, all the assumptions that I made when I glanced at the cover were born out.

Suggestions:
You can swap EWP: Khopesh and Lightning Reflexes for PS/IPS. You can swap the second toughness feat for Improved Critical: Slashing (or stunning fist if you get more wisdom).

I'd look at what Paladin 12 actually gives. I quite like Paladin 6 for DoS1, divine righteousness and so forth but the next sweet spot for me for paladin is up near 14 (for zeal), 15 (for DMIII) or 18 (for DoS/KotCIII).

Swap from Arcane Archer to Tempest I. You'll still have decent ranged damage with manyshot but your melee damage will go from being truly marginal to reasonable on the strength of the additional 10% offhand proc (which is 5.56% additional DPS). On this build you really can't justify ranging while manyshot is on cooldown so you need to focus on what you can do well as a paladin icon character: melee DPS.

Finally, realise that paladin as a class is pretty marginal in terms of overall DPS and usefulness as it is (outside of tank roles) and what you've done with this build is to become worse at the only thing that you're trying to do: DPS. I realise you're not trying to make a "ZOMG THE BEST!!!" kind of character but there are so many better ways to do it than what you've chosen ...

[unbongwah]

nothing that paladin offers adds to your ranged capability (except for divine might but DMII isn't worthwhile, imo)
So does Divine Favor, so the two together provide +3/+7 to-hit/dmg.

You've also given up zeal which is one of the best thing that paladin offers.Which is melee-only.

1. No IPS.Agreed - and easily fixed by swapping Lighting Reflexes and the second Toughness for Prec Shot & IPS (though not cheap at lvl 18).

Not having any Imp Crit Ranged kinda sucks, though.

2. Elf. Half-elf is vastly superior for survivability, general DPS and versatility.Perhaps the OP either (A) doesn't have HEs unlocked or (B) can't stand being so f'ugly? :p And one advantage to elves is it's a little easier to hit DEX 17, although since the OP put 10 pts into CON, it's kind of a wash.

*shrug* It's a flavor build and suboptimal in a number of ways, but if it's working out for the OP, who is already lvl 18, why not? If nothing else, he can TR into a Helves Angel and get it "right" next time. ;)

[Clemeit]

First lose lightning reflexes OP. 12 pally 6 ranger 2 monk has some promise someday toward being something interesting, I actually think that 12 pally 6 monk 2 ranger is better right now. 12 pally hunter of the dead 6 monk 2 ranger Half elf with massive healing amp, decent hp, and incredible saves would be virtually indestructible and would have both 10k stars and manyshot for pretty solid ranged dps as well as unarmed dps..

Thank you very much for your feedback, as I need something to TR into and what you suggested seems promising. +1

[Clemeit]

So does Divine Favor, so the two together provide +3/+7 to-hit/dmg.
Which is melee-only.
Agreed - and easily fixed by swapping Lighting Reflexes and the second Toughness for Prec Shot & IPS (though not cheap at lvl 18).

Not having any Imp Crit Ranged kinda sucks, though.
Perhaps the OP either (A) doesn't have HEs unlocked or (B) can't stand being so f'ugly? :p And one advantage to elves is it's a little easier to hit DEX 17, although since the OP put 10 pts into CON, it's kind of a wash.

*shrug* It's a flavor build and suboptimal in a number of ways, but if it's working out for the OP, who is already lvl 18, why not? If nothing else, he can TR into a Helves Angel and get it "right" next time. ;)

Thanks for your defence and criticism, its very much appreciated and I'm still new to multiclassing. I do in fact need something to TR into and don't currently have H-Elf unlocked, so I'll consider greatly buying it before TRing. :)

And didn't even think of IPS when I made the build, so I'll consider seeking out fred.

[Clemeit]

Prior to level 20 a tempest ranger probably has as-strong ranged power as your build as nothing that paladin offers adds to your ranged capability (except for divine might but DMII isn't worthwhile, imo) while a tempest ranger adds quite considerable FE/rams might damage to quite a lot of foes and can benefit from haste boost (on, for instance, an exploiter build).

When it comes to melee damage you're going to get left behind by a tempest ranger who has +20% offhand proc and +5% doublestrike. Perhaps while leveling you'll have a bit of leniency as paladin abilities are less reliant on gear but overall it's not very strong. You've also given up zeal which is one of the best thing that paladin offers. These contributions with tempest are really being overly generous, tempest is a less than optimal choice at the moment in comparative gear situations but comparing the build to the DPS that a barbarian or fighter puts out (even one built for survivability) isn't going to end well (for your build).

DoS is also a questionable choice. DoS stance adds hate to ranged as well so you're going to get a disproportionate amount of attention even when your actual DPS contribution isn't up to scratch. Do you think that you can tank on this build? Maybe with AC while leveling but I don't see it as being viable at cap. Ranged builds get more than their fair share of hate anyway so you really are just going to be exacerbating the problem.

Your strength and other stats are going to be worse compared to a ranger who doesn't need dexterity to qualify for ranged feats. This won't be as noticeable while you level but in elite content and at end game you'll develop AB issues which is already an issue for paladins without the extra issues that you've added.



If I look closer at the build, these are the problems that I see:
1. No IPS. You've skipped one of 2 primary opportunities that you have to make your ranged investment worthwhile: AoE DPS (the other being burst DPS from manyshot). With everything being as marginal as it is I simply can't imagine skipping IPS if you want to maintain any measure of usefulness at end game.

2. Elf. Half-elf is vastly superior for survivability, general DPS and versatility. The only advantage that Elf has for melee DPS (which this build has to rely on a majority of the time lacking 10k stars) is scimitars/rapiers which you've skipped by picking up khopesh proficiency.

3. No Improved Critical: Slashing. This is a massive shortfall in DPS considering that you've chosen to go with Khopesh as your weapon.

4. You've chosen to go for weapons rather than handwraps. Khopesh will do more damage on 0-50% fort enemies but handwraps are much more versatile with a moderate investment in wisdom and stunning fist.

5. Lightning Reflexes feat, what were you thinking?

6. No UMD, what were you thinking?

7. Jump, looks like you have too much, reallocate some to Move Silently to open up more tactical options (when coupled with invisibility scroll from UMD, see above).

8. Favoured Enemy: Human? What the hell? There is only 1 way to do FE's. Favoured Enemy: Undead for first which you swap to FE: Evil Outsider after you finish in Necropolis 4 pack. Favoured Enemy: Construct with your second pick (assuming that you have access to U11: Secrets of the Artificers pack).

On balance, all the assumptions that I made when I glanced at the cover were born out.

Suggestions:
You can swap EWP: Khopesh and Lightning Reflexes for PS/IPS. You can swap the second toughness feat for Improved Critical: Slashing (or stunning fist if you get more wisdom).

I'd look at what Paladin 12 actually gives. I quite like Paladin 6 for DoS1, divine righteousness and so forth but the next sweet spot for me for paladin is up near 14 (for zeal), 15 (for DMIII) or 18 (for DoS/KotCIII).

Swap from Arcane Archer to Tempest I. You'll still have decent ranged damage with manyshot but your melee damage will go from being truly marginal to reasonable on the strength of the additional 10% offhand proc (which is 5.56% additional DPS). On this build you really can't justify ranging while manyshot is on cooldown so you need to focus on what you can do well as a paladin icon character: melee DPS.

Finally, realise that paladin as a class is pretty marginal in terms of overall DPS and usefulness as it is (outside of tank roles) and what you've done with this build is to become worse at the only thing that you're trying to do: DPS. I realise you're not trying to make a "ZOMG THE BEST!!!" kind of character but there are so many better ways to do it than what you've chosen ...

Thanks for being more specific, and I agree you have made some very valuable points that I overlooked originally. As I stated in OP, I'm still very new to multiclassing and have never played a ranger, monk, nor paladin prior to this build, so it has been for the most part a 'learn-from-my-mistakes' build.

I changed some feats to incorporate IPS, and I never took Irov Crit: Ranged because I figured most of the time I would be using Min II anyways. Never been a fan of UMD (other than on my sorc for heal scrolls) because its an all or nothing skill. I'll consider taking point from jump/concentration and putting them into UMD next life. I also don't have H-Elf so that wasn't an option. I'll also consider buying that before next life as well.

Thanks for your time and patience and all your help on the build, I look forward to next life.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Thanks for being more specific, and I agree you have made some very valuable points that I overlooked originally. As I stated in OP, I'm still very new to multiclassing and have never played a ranger, monk, nor paladin prior to this build, so it has been for the most part a 'learn-from-my-mistakes' build.

I changed some feats to incorporate IPS, and I never took Irov Crit: Ranged because I figured most of the time I would be using Min II anyways. Never been a fan of UMD (other than on my sorc for heal scrolls) because its an all or nothing skill. I'll consider taking point from jump/concentration and putting them into UMD next life. I also don't have H-Elf so that wasn't an option. I'll also consider buying that before next life as well.

Thanks for your time and patience and all your help on the build, I look forward to next life.

MinII is a horrible choice for a bow. LitII, alchemic, epic thornlord or epic bow of earth would be what I'd look at.

UMD is useful at any amount. Even with 11 cross class ranks you can get up to 30 or 40 with gear to use scrolls like invisibility, fireshield, displacement, raise dead, heal and many more. Getting 100% is needed; even 25% on raise dead (20 UMD I think) is enough to save a quest or raid at times.

[Clemeit]

MinII is a horrible choice for a bow. LitII, alchemic, epic thornlord or epic bow of earth would be what I'd look at.

UMD is useful at any amount. Even with 11 cross class ranks you can get up to 30 or 40 with gear to use scrolls like invisibility, fireshield, displacement, raise dead, heal and many more. Getting 100% is needed; even 25% on raise dead (20 UMD I think) is enough to save a quest or raid at times.

I was wondering how people get UMD so **** high. The most I've gotten is 34 geared, and that's with skill boost of +3. Took Imp Crit Ranged at 18, and IPS will be there soon, when I use another heart. Going to make a Lit II and as you said, hopefully eventually farm for Thornlord. But is it REALLY THAT good? I heard is about the ranged equivalent of eSoS.

Also swapped out a Favored Enemy for undead, what else do you suggest?

[xslasherz]

at lvl 6 u cant take ips because u started with a 17 dex and u need 19 dex and also need a +11 bab

[voodoogroves]

I'm going to echo maddmatt70 on the Monk 6 split ... that's where you want to go I think - 10k stars really is that cool.

[stricq]

*sigh*

[jandhaer]

I have a Helf (cleric dilly for self sufficiency) AA currently of the same class split 12 pali (DoS) 6 ranger 2 monk. I wanted to try AA and wanted to get a pali past life for both the feats it comes with. Shes pretty awesome multi shot slayer arrows with an Epic Thornlord is pretty beast, high saves, over 700hp (plenty to get in the fray for 2wf), DM II, D Sacrifice II, 170% threat when tanking up is needed.

Lots of fun and she can take care of herself which is a must for me. BUT the dps would be better on a fighter with ALOT more feats to throw around. Haste Boost IV is king.

The 10k stars is awesome if you wanna range almost full time (85'ish% of the time) Probs going 11 ranger 9 monk for the ranger past lives I want to get eventually. Sounds fun :D

[Missing_Minds]

6. No UMD, what were you thinking?

Why bother? he'll be able to self heal, and if he so desires, lay on hands for a res as later on, his loh isn't worth much at end game.

Going half elf he can choose lots of healing amp via monk or go sorc and skip UMD completely that way. Cleric if you want the raise dead 100%.

Require one to do a lot of buffign and grinding of gear and then gear swap to use stuff, or blow AA and get it and not worry. Take your pick, OP.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Why bother? he'll be able to self heal, and if he so desires, lay on hands for a res as later on, his loh isn't worth much at end game.

Going half elf he can choose lots of healing amp via monk or go sorc and skip UMD completely that way. Cleric if you want the raise dead 100%.

Require one to do a lot of buffign and grinding of gear and then gear swap to use stuff, or blow AA and get it and not worry. Take your pick, OP.

If all you use UMD for is invisibility scrolls then it's worth it, everything else is gravy. Fireshield, displacement, raise dead and more come to mind. Put in that context it's worth, what, 10.5 damage/shot to take UMD and hence not have to take cleric dilettante? (Though cleric dilettante is great while leveling until a decent amount of UMD is acquired).

Next life I'd suggest if the OP wants to stick with AA then I'd suggest a build with 2 or 3 artificer levels like 11 ranger/6 monk/3 artificer or 12 monk/6 ranger/2 artificer. This way you can get max ranks in UMD to wand and scroll heal along with Wand and Scroll Mastery I, +2 UMD with scrolls and +1 caster level on scrolls.

This life for UMD you can look at:
11 ranks
3 charisma (8 base+2 tome+6 item)
4 GH
3 cartouche/flame warden/cannith crafted persuasion
1 big top
1 house phiarlan entertainer buff/voice of the master
=23 (this gets you invisibility scrolls and a decent chance on displacement and fireshield)
1 +2 charisma ship shrine
1 +2 GL item (Head of Good Fortune, Epic Buccaneers Ring, Epic blue augment slot, cannith crafted)
2 epic flamewarden/7 fingered gloves
2 epic big top/epic treasure hunters spyglass
1 yugoloth charisma pot
3 skill boost
6 GS Charisma skills item
=39 (100% on heal scrolls)
2 bard competence song
2 walk of the sun (light path monk buff)
5 moment of clarity (light path monk buff)
=48 (so don't need everything listed above)

[Hajutze]

If he goes monk doesn't that mean he'll have to concentrate ot 4-5 stats (the 5th one being CON) in other words everything except int ? Kind of stat intence xD Unless he drops the charisma but then the whole point of being paladin goes out the window.

[wax_on_wax_off]

If he goes monk doesn't that mean he'll have to concentrate ot 4-5 stats (the 5th one being CON) in other words everything except int ? Kind of stat intence xD Unless he drops the charisma but then the whole point of being paladin goes out the window.

This is a big reason to avoid paladin on an AA build :P

[mrszabo]

It seems Clemeit has the same style of gameplay as me: i like melee style but would like to try the archer style too switching them, and playing solo but to be usefull member of end-game raid party. The meaning of the Paladin splash of mine toon is: saves, Mental toughness to be AA, Unyielding Sovereignty for solo (against lvl drains and fast way gaining 1000hp), Paladin Hunter of the Dead I (ghost touched, restoration), Lay of Hands.

My "batman" version plan is (currently lvl12):


Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.12.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 20 Lawful Good Elf Female
(6 Paladin \ 12 Monk \ 2 Ranger)
Hit Points: 292
Spell Points: 279
BAB: 17\17\22\27\27
Fortitude: 22
Reflex: 22
Will: 17

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(36 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 16 22
Dexterity 16 22
Constitution 14 16
Intelligence 8 10
Wisdom 14 18
Charisma 12 14

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 3
+2 Tomes of abilities

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Base Skills Modified Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 20)
Balance 5 30
Bluff 1 2
Concentration 6 25
Jump 7 14
Move Silently 5 11
Tumble 4 9
Use Magic Device 3 13

Level 1 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Construct
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Barbarian
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Monk
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot
Feat: (Automatic) Attack
Feat: (Automatic) Bow Strength
Feat: (Automatic) Defensive Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Elven Keen Senses
Feat: (Automatic) Enchantment Save Bonus
Feat: (Automatic) Heroic Durability
Feat: (Automatic) Immunity to Sleep
Feat: (Automatic) Light Armor Proficiency
Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency (ALL)
Feat: (Automatic) Shield Proficiency (General)
Feat: (Automatic) Simple Weapon Proficiency
Feat: (Automatic) Sneak
Feat: (Automatic) Sunder
Feat: (Automatic) Trip
Feat: (Automatic) Wild Empathy
Enhancement: Improved Jump I

Level 2 (Ranger)
Feat: (Automatic) Rapid Shot
Feat: (Automatic) Two Weapon Fighting

Level 3 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Berserker's Fury
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Zen Archery
Feat: (Automatic) AC Bonus
Feat: (Automatic) Disciple of Breezes
Feat: (Automatic) Disciple of Candles
Feat: (Automatic) Disciple of Pebbles
Feat: (Automatic) Disciple of Puddles
Feat: (Automatic) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Kama
Feat: (Automatic) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Shuriken
Feat: (Automatic) Finishing Moves
Feat: (Automatic) Flurry of Blows
Feat: (Automatic) Unarmed Strike
Enhancement: Improved Tumble I
Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I

Level 4 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Stunning Fist
Feat: (Automatic) Evasion
Feat: (Automatic) Meditation
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom I

Level 5 (Paladin)
Feat: (Automatic) Aura of Good
Feat: (Automatic) Heavy Armor Proficiency
Feat: (Automatic) Medium Armor Proficiency
Feat: (Automatic) Smite Evil
Enhancement: Follower of the Sovereign Host
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I

Level 6 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons
Feat: (Automatic) Divine Grace
Feat: (Automatic) Lay on Hands

Level 7 (Paladin)
Feat: (Automatic) Aura of Courage
Feat: (Automatic) Divine Health
Feat: (Automatic) Fear Immunity
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I

Level 8 (Paladin)
Feat: (Automatic) Turn Undead
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Turning I

Level 9 (Paladin)
Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Sacrifice I
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Might I
Enhancement: Paladin Improved Turning I

Level 10 (Paladin)
Feat: (Automatic) Remove Disease
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Unyielding Sovereignty
Enhancement: Paladin Hunter of the Dead I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer I

Level 11 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Inevitable Dominion: Fists of Darkness
Feat: (Automatic) Fast Movement
Feat: (Automatic) Finishing Moves: Path of Harmonious Balance (ALL)
Feat: (Automatic) Finishing Moves: Path of Inevitable Dominion (ALL)
Feat: (Automatic) Still Mind
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II

Level 12 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Manyshot
Feat: (Automatic) Ki Strike: Magic
Feat: (Automatic) Slow Fall
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Acid Arrows
Enhancement: Static Charge
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +2 Arrows
Enhancement: Improved Jump II
Enhancement: Improved Tumble II

Level 13 (Monk)
Feat: (Automatic) Ki Strike: Damage
Feat: (Automatic) Purity of Body
Enhancement: Porous Soul

Level 14 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Dodge
Enhancement: Ten Thousand Stars
Enhancement: Monk Ninja Spy I
Enhancement: Winter's Touch
Enhancement: Adept of Wind
Enhancement: Adept of Rock

Level 15 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Wholeness of Body
Enhancement: All-Consuming Flame
Enhancement: Adept of Flame

Level 16 (Monk)
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom II

Level 17 (Monk)
Feat: (Automatic) Improved Evasion
Enhancement: Touch of Death

Level 18 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Curse of the Void
Feat: (Automatic) Ki Strike: Lawful
Feat: (Automatic) Moment of Clarity
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Explosive Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Burst Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +3 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +4 Arrows

Level 19 (Monk)
Feat: (Automatic) Diamond Body

Level 20 (Monk)
Feat: (Automatic) Abundant Step
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Slaying Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Terror Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage I
Enhancement: Master of Stone
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +5 Arrows

[elg582]

MinII is a horrible choice for a bow. LitII, alchemic, epic thornlord or epic bow of earth would be what I'd look at.


A Lit2 bow is amazing; about the only time I switch off is if the enemy is completely immune to lightning.

[Hajutze]

I wanted to make a divine archer as well, my first though was a cleric but for some reason I changed to paladin.
Here is my version of the 12 Paladin/6 Ranger/2 Monk (barbarian dilletante)


Level 20 Lawful Good Half-Elf Male
(12 Paladin / 2 Monk / 6 Ranger)
Hit Points: 371
Spell Points: 387

BAB: 19/19/24/29/29
Fortitude: 28
Reflex: 27
Will: 19

Starting Ending Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20) (Level 20)
Strength 14 16 16
Dexterity 14 21 24
Constitution 16 18 20
Intelligence 8 8 8
Wisdom 12 14 14
Charisma 14 16 18

Tomes Used
+2 Tomes used at level 7

Selected Feats:
Generic - PBS, WS:R, Mental Toughness, PS, IPS, GTWF, Stunning Fist
Monk - Toughness, Power Attack
Ranger Favored Enemies - Undead and Elementals

Selected Enhancements:
(6) Improved Damage Reduction II
(3) Paladin Divine Might II
(1) Armor Class Boost I
(1) Paladin Courage of Good I
(3) Paladin Bulwark of Good II
(1) Paladin Focus of Good I
(6) Paladin Resistance of Good III
(6) Paladin Defender of Siberys II
(1) Follower of the Silver Flame
(4) EAA: Conjure Arrows +1
(1) EAA: Imbue Force Arrows
(6) Ranger Dextirity II
(6) Paladin Charisma II
(2) Half-Elf Barbarian Constitution I
(2) Human Adaptility Dextirity I
(4) Human Greater Adaptility Constitution I
(10) Human Versatility IV
(1) Way of the Patient Tortoise I
(6) Racial Toughness III
(6) Paladin Toughness III
(3) Ranger Favored Damage II

The idea is to shoot them and draw them to you
(preferably the opponent mage-based monsters^)
and then finish them off with wraps + power attack + stunning fist.
The build should have some decent damage with both ranged (MS)
and melee (GTWF should make you kind of fast):
(STR from damage-wise point of view)
* STR after tomes - 16.
* STR after SoD II - 20
* STR after Fire Stance - 22
* STR after +6 item - 28
* STR after Ram's Might - 30
* STR after DMII (4 damage ~ 8 STR) - 38
* STR after Human Versatility (5 damage ~10 STR) - 48 (or 50 if you picked Fighter Dilly)

The Power Attack should compensate the lack of higher monk levels:
Level 1 monk wraps: 1-6, average of 3.5
Level 20 monk wraps: 2-20, average of 11
Level 1 monk wraps with Power Attack: 1-6 + 2x5 (since the wraps are double-hand weapon, no ?) = 11-16, average of 13.5

Notes:
^I am not good with numbers (especially due to lack of end game gear experience)
but the saves should be good enough so you can draw the attention
of the opposite mages from the party members and avoid taking a lot of damage.

The HP should be nice as well - when needed you can switch to CON stance and + SoD
(and no items what'so'ever) you will have 470 HP. As I said I am lacking exp. In high end content
but I think after all the boosts and such it can go up to 830+ HP.
Even without Barb Dilly and Earth Stance you should have ~790 HP.

The build should have a decent AC as well having 2 monk and concentrating on dex and stuff :D.

- I didn't want to go to Monk 6 because of the feats I needed (6 Ranger was a better idea).
- I didn't want to use rogue dilletante because it will become useless with all the hate,
1 hit with sneak attack and after that - nothing, they will be after you. With the barb dilly you get
3DR or alternatively you can use Fighter Dilly for the +2 STR (when you swap the human greater adaptility)
- I am sure that finding a +5 bow isn't an issue later so the AA up to +5 seemed like a waste of AP.
I don't like the other imbue arrows as well. One can easily remove the DR and the
Ranger Favored Damage enhanements and use the AP to go up to Slayer arrow.

In short the build is kind of high HP/Saves with some self healing, decent melee and ranged DPS with the main role of taking the attention of the mage opponents from your team.

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Personally I would go 15 paladin/2 monk/3 ranger and drop the whole AA thing (to fit all the feats from the above build, while removing WS:R and MT)



Level 20 Lawful Good Half-Elf Male
(15 Paladin / 2 Monk / 3 Ranger)
Hit Points: 347
Spell Points: 257

BAB: 19/19/24/2929
Fortitude: 27
Reflex: 26
Will: 20

Starting Feat/Enhancement
Abilities Base Stats Modified Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 14 18
Dexterity 14 22
Constitution 14 16
Intelligence 8 8
Wisdom 12 16
Charisma 16 20

Tomes Used
+2 Tomes used at level 7

Selected Feats:
Generic - PBS, PS, IPS, GTWF, Stunning Fist
Monk - Toughness, Power Attack
Ranger Favored Enemies - Undead (I REALLY REALLY hate them xD)

Selected Enhancements:
Paladin Armor Class Boost I
Follower of the Silver Flame
Human Adaptability Strength I
Human Greater Adaptility Wisdom I
Human Versatility IV
Way of the Patient Tortoise I
Paladin Courage of Good I
Paladin Bulwark of Good II
Paladin Focus of Good I
Paladin Resistance of Good III
Paladin Extra Lay on Hands II
Paladin Defender of Siberys II
Paladin Redemption II
Racial Toughness II
Paladin Devotion III
Paladin Charisma II
Ranger Dexterity I
Monk Wisdom I
Half-Elf Fighter Strength I
Paladin Toughness III
Paladin Divine Might III

(STR from damage-wise point of view)
* STR after tomes - 16.
* STR after enhancements - 18
* STR after SoD II - 22
* STR after Fire Stance - 24
* STR after +6 item - 30
* STR after DMIII (6 damage ~ 12 STR) - 42
* STR after Human Versatility (5 damage ~10 STR) - 52