Battle Engineer II & III (Speculation/Wish)

[Zansobar]

Battle Engineer I - A workshop is not for you - you prefer to provide logical and technological support on the front lines. you gain 10 hit points, reduce arcane spell failure from armor by 10%, and have a +2 to both confirm critical hits and critical damage (before multipliers). Any weapon you wield in your main hand gains a +2 enhancement bonus (which stacks with the Enchant Weapon spell), and you gain the ability to enchant your crossbow to instantly reload itself, allowing you to lay down incredible amounts of fire for a short period of time.

Special Ability: Endless Fusillade

What I would like to see is 2 more levels of BE at level 12 and 18 with something like the following additions

Battle Engineer II - you gain 5 additional hit points, reduce arcane spell failure from armor by 20%, and have a +4 to both confirm critical hits and critical damage (before multipliers). Any crossbow you wield gains a +4 enhancement bonus (which stacks with the Enchant Weapon spell), and you gain Insightful Strikes as an innate ability while wielding any crossbow.

Battle Engineer III - you gain 5 additional hit points (total of 20), reduce arcane spell failure from armor by 30%, and have a +5 to both confirm critical hits and critical damage (before multipliers). Any crossbow you wield gains a +5 enhancement bonus (which stacks with the Enchant Weapon spell), you gain Insightful Damage as an innate ability while wielding any crossbow, and your Base Attack Bonus equals your level while wielding any crossbow.


Yeah I know it sounds pretty strong...I just think to make ranged combat viable they need to stop screwing around with splitting the to hit and to damage stats unlike melee who get it all in just one stat. Of course going this method would free up some weapon enhancements by not having to use insightful damage or strikes on one.

[DragonTroy]

i dont play an artificer, may not ever play one, and i think these are good ideas

just one person's opinion, but its a good idea, and fits the theme of the build

EDIT: maybe you could add on there that with each tier you get more uses of your manyshot-like ability

[Zansobar]

i dont play an artificer, may not ever play one, and i think these are good ideas

just one person's opinion, but its a good idea, and fits the theme of the build

EDIT: maybe you could add on there that with each tier you get more uses of your manyshot-like ability

I would like more uses of Endless Fusillade or maybe with level II and III each you gain +2 secs to the duration so it lasts a total of 10 secs each use with level III.

[Victor_1]

I would like more uses of Endless Fusillade or maybe with level II and III each you gain +2 secs to the duration so it lasts a total of 10 secs each use with level III.
In addition to that, I'd like to see 25% reduction on activation time per tier.
It's taking too long to bother activating to me other than beginning of boss fights.

[djsonar919]

In addition to that, I'd like to see 25% reduction on activation time per tier.
It's taking too long to bother activating to me other than beginning of boss fights.

It takes 3 seconds to activate Endless Fusillade. During that time frame you can run, jump, and even throw a rune arm blast. Reducing it to 1 second at the final tier makes it faster to activate than most non-instant spells. I feel it's fine the way it is. Besides most people that I group with will see my arti do the animations and will know 6 seconds of pure hell is on the way.

[Reykko]

A good bet would be making the bolts made by conjure bolt spell returning 50% on the first tier 75% on second and 100% on the last tier

[BlackSteel]

I'd like to see an increased duration on the machine gun clicky for each tier.

then toss on something else unique at tier3. just increasing the enhancement bonus is too vanilla. personally I favor an increase in bolts fired. make ALL xbows fire one additional bolt on every animation. So repeaters would do 4 per volley instead of 3, and regular xbows and great xbows would do 2. this would also help great xbows out a bit, as 4:2 is a better ratio than 3:1. I highly doubt it would do enough to make them a serious consideration, but atleast it helps out their situation somewhat.

this might sound like a large jump in power, but its right up there with the third tier of frenzied berzerker, which gains up to 30% more damage when they hit 18 between the critical profile increase and the str/vicious damage.

[Meretrix]

Well looking at a repeater they do have 4 bolts in the clip, it's strange it only shoots 3 of them.

[AndyD47]

personally I favor an increase in bolts fired. make ALL xbows fire one additional bolt on every animation.

Please?

Pretty please?

[Teharahma]

Battle Engineer I - A workshop is not for you - you prefer to provide logical and technological support on the front lines. you gain 10 hit points, reduce arcane spell failure from armor by 10%, and have a +2 to both confirm critical hits and critical damage (before multipliers). Any weapon you wield in your main hand gains a +2 enhancement bonus (which stacks with the Enchant Weapon spell), and you gain the ability to enchant your crossbow to instantly reload itself, allowing you to lay down incredible amounts of fire for a short period of time.

Special Ability: Endless Fusillade

What I would like to see is 2 more levels of BE at level 12 and 18 with something like the following additions

Battle Engineer II - you gain 5 additional hit points, reduce arcane spell failure from armor by 20%, and have a +4 to both confirm critical hits and critical damage (before multipliers). Any crossbow you wield gains a +4 enhancement bonus (which stacks with the Enchant Weapon spell), and you gain Insightful Strikes as an innate ability while wielding any crossbow.

Battle Engineer III - you gain 5 additional hit points (total of 20), reduce arcane spell failure from armor by 30%, and have a +5 to both confirm critical hits and critical damage (before multipliers). Any crossbow you wield gains a +5 enhancement bonus (which stacks with the Enchant Weapon spell), you gain Insightful Damage as an innate ability while wielding any crossbow, and your Base Attack Bonus equals your level while wielding any crossbow.


Yeah I know it sounds pretty strong...I just think to make ranged combat viable they need to stop screwing around with splitting the to hit and to damage stats unlike melee who get it all in just one stat. Of course going this method would free up some weapon enhancements by not having to use insightful damage or strikes on one.

I'd go with not restricting the bonuses to Crossbows, but to main-hands, as the first tier.



BE2 - You gain 5 additional hit points, reduce arcane spell failure when wearing armors by an additional 10% (for a total bonus of 20%) and have +3 to both confirm critical hits and critical damage (before multipliers). Any weapon held in your main-hand automatically gains an additional +1 to its enhancement modifier (for a total of +3). You also gain the ability to expend a Damage Boost to make all of your beneficial infusions (such as Cold Iron weapons) become Area of Effect. Affecting multiple players at once.


BE3 - You gain 5 additional hit points (for a total of 20), reduce arcane spell failure when wearing armors an additional 10% (for a total bonus of 30%) and have +4 to both confirm critical hits and critical damage (before multipliers). Any weapon held in your main-hand automatically gains an additional +1 to its enhancement modifier (for a total of +4). You also gain Smiting ability on any attack you make (dealing 4d6 damage per hit, and on a natural 20, with confirmation, deals an additional 100 damage or destroys the construct outright) and natural 20s reduce the fortification of the target by 4%, stacks 5 times, lasts 10 seconds)

[Calonderial]

I kind of like the idea of having returning bolts, like the AA who gets +2,+3 etc and they are returning. So perhaps at tier2 along with maybe +5% ranged alacrity you get +2 conjured bolt with 50-75% returning and at tier3 +10% ranged alacrity with 75-100% returning.

I get really tired of either running to house D to get 1000's of +3 75% returning or conjuring up a mediocre +1 bolt that doesnt go into
the quiver anyway (eventually at some point in a long quest with inventory full you have to a: stop and dump stuff to make room for bolts or b: rely on runearm and spells alone)

the + to critical also sounds nice, too many things that could go with BE to make it up there with FB or PM type PrE's. Personally though the endless fusilade I tend to only use on Boss fights as the animation takes too long for the 6sec of walloping, seems like one has just finished the flipping and flailing of the xbow (cocktail bartender here we come) before it's over

[Requiro]

My personal choice is mix of your proposal :)

Battle Engineer II:

+5 HP (total +15HP)
Additional –5 ASF (-15 ASF total)
Additional bonus for weapon in Main Hand:

+1 Stacking Seeker ability (Total +3)
+1 Stacking Enhancement bonus (Total +3)

Unique Abilities:

You can have two Personal Infusion on weapon instead Personal and Normal.
You can have two Different Infusion on Items and Armors.
Endless Fusillade: Additional +1 second in duration (Total 7 sec)
Endless Fusillade: You have additional use per rest (Total 6 uses/rest)



Battle Engineer III:

+5 HP (total +20HP)
Additional –5 ASF (-20 ASF total)
Additional bonus for weapon in Main Hand:

+1 Stacking Seeker ability (Total +4)
+1 Stacking Enhancement bonus (Total +4)

Unique Abilities:

You can have two Normal Infusion and one Personal Infusion on Weapon. This ability stack with Battle Engineer II. So you can still exchange one Normal Infusion for Personal one.
Endless Fusillade: Additional +1 second in duration (Total 8 sec)
Endless Fusillade: You have additional use per rest (Total 7 uses/rest)
Crossbow Mastery: You can shoot one additional bolt with all Crossbows (4 for Repeaters, 2 for rest)



And what will be nice is more Infusion that will enchant our gear, especially one:

Level 5 Infusion:
Name: Returning Ammo
Duration: Infinitive
SP Cost: 20 SP
Description: This Infusion add +75% Returning property to your Ammo. Works on all kind of Ammo. This property disappear after zoning.

[Waycool17]

I had been thinking a lot about this myself (wish I had seen this thread sooner) and I came up with an idea for the second or third tier:

Metamagic weapons: for every metamagic feat you posses you gain the ability to apply it to your crossbow
Empower: you attacks deal 50% extra damage.
Maximize: your attacks will deal full damage.
Extend: you shot extra bolts.
Quicken: you shoot and reload your crossbow faster.
Heighten: your BAB becomes your level.
Enlarge: increased range.
Eschew materials: you do not need bolts to fire
This all comes at a cost though, for every bolt shot you loose 1 SP, so if using a repeater with empower and maximize it will cost 6 SP every time you shot and that would increase 8 if you were using extend as well.

Also all of this is only affecting the weapons an artificer is using, but what about something that boosts his rune arm?

[scottmike0]

I had been thinking a lot about this myself (wish I had seen this thread sooner) and I came up with an idea for the second or third tier:

Metamagic weapons: for every metamagic feat you posses you gain the ability to apply it to your crossbow
Empower: you attacks deal 50% extra damage.
Maximize: your attacks will deal full damage.
Extend: you shot extra bolts.
Quicken: you shoot and reload your crossbow faster.
Heighten: your BAB becomes your level.
Enlarge: increased range.
Eschew materials: you do not need bolts to fire
This all comes at a cost though, for every bolt shot you loose 1 SP, so if using a repeater with empower and maximize it will cost 6 SP every time you shot and that would increase 8 if you were using extend as well.

Also all of this is only affecting the weapons an artificer is using, but what about something that boosts his rune arm?
looks a bit way to overpowered if you ask me, artificers can already do incredible damage without teir 2-3
there is probably a reason why teir 2-3 is not in :)

[Pank]

I think giving Insightful Strikes or Damage for free is with PREs is too much, but i admit i still have to run end game with my arty (currently 13).
A little OT: Insightful Damage and Elemental weapons can be simultaneously applied to your x-bow, and both seem to work.
So giving ID or IS for free would mean you can have both AND ele weapons at the same time. And you could use Endless Fusillade on top of that... seems just too much for a non pure DPS class.

[voodoogroves]

My personal choice is mix of your proposal :)

Battle Engineer II:

+5 HP (total +15HP)
Additional –5 ASF (-15 ASF total)
Additional bonus for weapon in Main Hand:

+1 Stacking Seeker ability (Total +3)
+1 Stacking Enhancement bonus (Total +3)

Unique Abilities:

You can have two Personal Infusion on weapon instead Personal and Normal.
You can have two Different Infusion on Items and Armors.
Endless Fusillade: Additional +1 second in duration (Total 7 sec)
Endless Fusillade: You have additional use per rest (Total 6 uses/rest)



Battle Engineer III:

+5 HP (total +20HP)
Additional –5 ASF (-20 ASF total)
Additional bonus for weapon in Main Hand:

+1 Stacking Seeker ability (Total +4)
+1 Stacking Enhancement bonus (Total +4)

Unique Abilities:

You can have two Normal Infusion and one Personal Infusion on Weapon. This ability stack with Battle Engineer II. So you can still exchange one Normal Infusion for Personal one.
Endless Fusillade: Additional +1 second in duration (Total 8 sec)
Endless Fusillade: You have additional use per rest (Total 7 uses/rest)
Crossbow Mastery: You can shoot one additional bolt with all Crossbows (4 for Repeaters, 2 for rest)



And what will be nice is more Infusion that will enchant our gear, especially one:

Level 5 Infusion:
Name: Returning Ammo
Duration: Infinitive
SP Cost: 20 SP
Description: This Infusion add +75% Returning property to your Ammo. Works on all kind of Ammo. This property disappear after zoning.

I suspect the "additional infusions" bits is more the area of the runic champion (which to me sounds like non-race-dependent spellcarved soldier)

[RedDragonScale]

I would like more uses of Endless Fusillade or maybe with level II and III each you gain +2 secs to the duration so it lasts a total of 10 secs each use with level III.

I have 9 uses of Endless Fusilade. How many do you have?

I do like your idea of extending the duration at higher levels though.

[Redicular]

I would like to see endless fusillade moved to tier 2 :eek:

put down the torches and pitchforks ;)

in trade-off, I'd like to see innate insightful strike moved to tier 1

two reasons:

one, that change will greatly improve the usefulness of a "deep splash" into arti. currently arti levels add very little that isn't covered by the dilettante feats of half-elves. having 6 arti levels give insightful strike to mechanics, assasins and wizards could create some very interesting builds. this is also why I propose a trade of fusillade for insightful, giving fusillade AND insightful AND runearm use(arti level 1) to a wiz13/arti6 would come quite close to marginalizing the arti class itself.

two, I loathe mid/late life abilities that change the stat focus of a class. its a personal thing but i feel if an ability is going to make a large change like that, it should be done as soon as possible to lower the instances of, "yeah my xxx sucks now, but next level everything changes since I finally get yyy". remember a tier 2 ability can easily be delayed to level 14 by, for instance, an evasion splash. level 14 is after the desert, and in the middle of gianthold. and as more things are added into the game, that tier 2 ability can be pushed later and later. my current rogue won't get acrobat 2 until level 20(monk and fighter levels)

---
as mentioned, effects need to be any single-wield weapon and crossbows, not just crossbows

not a big fan of giving innate insightful damage at all, really not a fan of innate ID, full BAB, and the bonus to crits. one of those has to go, and I vote the insightful damage(adds a penalty for blowing all your SP).

love ASF getting up to 30% since that means Battle engineers have access to the full suite of medium armors easily, and can even use full plate if they're willing to eat a prefix in some slot(or the 5% fail chance).

[FooWonk]

Battle Engineer II
° Cost: 2 AP
° Requires one of: Improved Sunder, Precision
° Requires all of: Battle Engineer I, Wrack Construct I

° You gain an additional 5 hit points, reduce ASF from armor by an addition 5%, and +2 DC to Sunder & Improved Sunder attacks. You gain special attack, Find Weak Spot.

° Find Weak Spot - This is a ranged or melee sundering attack. Constructs & living constructs normally immune to sunder are not immune to sunder effect from this attack. (DC 14 + INT mod). Cooldown: 10 seconds.


Battle Engineer III
° Cost: 2 AP
° Requires all of: Battle Engineer II

° You gain an additional 5 hit points, reduce ASF from armor by an additional 5%, have an additional +1 DC to Sunder & Improve Sunder attacks. Any weapon you wield in your main hand gains +3 enhancement bonus (which stacks with the Enchant Weapon spell). You gain special attack, Guided Attack.

° Guided Attack - Performs an attack at +4 to-hit that bypasses targets DR & fortification. Cooldown: 6 seconds.