Sneaking through Sins of Attrition

[brian14]

Devil statues line the corridors in Sins of Attrition, but here and there they stand in a row completely blocking a passage. How can anyone sneak through THAT?

[thegreatneil]

Devil statues line the corridors in Sins of Attrition, but here and there they stand in a row completely blocking a passage. How can anyone sneak through THAT?

Ive never tried, but, perhaps timing, maybe some noise makers.

[junior_w]

If you have Bluff skill trained you can use it to "lure" one enemy, if you succeed the skill check the monster will leave his position and start to look for you.

Another alternative is to use Noisemakers, but I never tested it to be sure if it works.

[Alintalkin]

Haven't tried it but perhaps you could take off your move silently item, get close enough that multiple hear you (not see you) and pull them via the noise. Once you sound-pull them more to one side of the wall you could switch your move silently item back on and sneak past them?

[Kadran]

Use invisibility and let them hear you (not sneak mode) they will wander over, sneaking around. Success!

[Calebro]

Haven't tried it but perhaps you could take off your move silently item, get close enough that multiple hear you (not see you) and pull them via the noise. Once you sound-pull them more to one side of the wall you could switch your move silently item back on and sneak past them?

This is exactly how you do it. Sneak up to them and lower your MS skill (by changing gear), take one step, and raise it again. They will follow the noise. Keep swapping that gear slot to lower and raise it and you will herd them back.
Sometimes you can use the little "walls" and move them to one side of the hallway so that there is enough room for you to get through. Sometimes you will have to herd them all the way back to the previous open space.

* a Chattering Ring is perfect for this

[brian14]

This is exactly how you do it. Sneak up to them and lower your MS skill (by changing gear), take one step, and raise it again. They will follow the noise. Keep swapping that gear slot to lower and raise it and you will herd them back.
Sometimes you can use the little "walls" and move them to one side of the hallway so that there is enough room for you to get through. Sometimes you will have to herd them all the way back to the previous open space.

* a Chattering Ring is perfect for this
You have actually done it? Don't devils teleport right on top of the noise, rather than "follow" it?

[Darknark]

You have actually done it? Don't devils teleport right on top of the noise, rather than "follow" it?

With extremely careful jumping and invisibility you can avoid getting their aggro. However, they will try and find you when you land due to the noise. But they won't know exactly were you are.

[Calebro]

They teleport to you if they know where you are. If they don't know where you are, they are simply investigating the sound they heard. Investigating a sound isn't a "I need to teleport there right NOW" moment.
They won't teleport at all if you do it right.

[TheDearLeader]

Sort of on Topic...

There are mobs that you *have* to kill in Sins to progress, yes? Both Cinderspawn and the Efreeti? And the "Table Room" - those barriers drop eventually, yes? That's what I've heard.

[Sarisa]

Sort of on Topic...

There are mobs that you *have* to kill in Sins to progress, yes? Both Cinderspawn and the Efreeti? And the "Table Room" - those barriers drop eventually, yes? That's what I've heard.

Correct.

The barriers drop in around 30-40 seconds or so. I used to spend a lot of time kiting/melee'ing Saligia (especially before Divine Punishment came out) but now I just bring him along with me when fighting all the rest of the trash.

You also have to kill Saligia in order to progress the quest. Normally, I would damage him until the barriers drop, then drag him along as I kite/kill/etc the rest of the trash. If you're trying for a full stealth run, that would be a lot more difficult, especially with the rest of the trash that pops up in Saligia's room.

Note that the Orthon version of Saligia is a pushover, and doesn't dish out too much damage if you keep at range. The Barbazu version dishes out much faster damage, gets very "teleport" happy, and has Evasion.

MrCow's Diary of a true reincarnate (Arcane) has a fairly good example (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn8xWIkJHeg) of a speed run where he remains unseen by a lot of the trash. It's not a true "stealth" run (ie Hide/Move Silently based), but he makes ample use of invisibility, mobility, and trying to remain unseen.

[MrCow]

If you want a visual, I did toss up a stealth clip for Sins of Attrition (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEuBtYUL7mA) about 2 years ago.

[Calebro]

And here's (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykEtfLqi7PU) part one of a three part vid of an elite run by a solo rogue, by Shiz, unless I'm mistaken.

[TheDearLeader]

This is a good, Rogue-y thread. So then, other than the Chattering Ring, anything else convenient for lowering one's Move Silently score? I think even without my item, it's a 45.

Also, watching the videos, I have to wonder if there's a way to pull the two Cinderspawns and the Efreeti to kill them without killing the others. I'm going to probably play with this, and see if I can get at least a Normal run down to 4 player kills. (Cinderspawn x2, Efreeti, and Gula. Use the Trap-gather method to Misadventure kill Saligia.)

[Calebro]

This is a good, Rogue-y thread. So then, other than the Chattering Ring, anything else convenient for lowering one's Move Silently score? I think even without my item, it's a 45.

Also, watching the videos, I have to wonder if there's a way to pull the two Cinderspawns and the Efreeti to kill them without killing the others. I'm going to probably play with this, and see if I can get at least a Normal run down to 4 player kills. (Cinderspawn x2, Efreeti, and Gula. Use the Trap-gather method to Misadventure kill Saligia.)

Tower shields work well as an alternative, but they also lower your Hide, so they're much more risky. If used in conjunction with Invis, they work exactly the same way.
If you have different gear slots devoted to Hide and Move Silently (rather than a single slot like Dustless Boots or the like) then you could simply remove your MS item for a brief moment with the same results.

[MrCow]

So then, other than the Chattering Ring, anything else convenient for lowering one's Move Silently score?

Shatterbow (which stacks with the Chattering Ring if you don't have the Epic version).

Removing an STR item if it puts you into medium encumbrance.

[TheDearLeader]

Tower shields work well as an alternative, but they also lower your Hide, so they're much more risky. If used in conjunction with Invis, they work exactly the same way.
If you have different gear slots devoted to Hide and Move Silently (rather than a single slot like Dustless Boots or the like) then you could simply remove your MS item for a brief moment with the same results.

Epic Dustless Boots :)

But my concern here is that I think even then, I'm going to be too high... with the GH buff from being on Shav, my Hide/Move will be a base 44. I think that's too high.

[Calebro]

Epic Dustless Boots :)

But my concern here is that I think even then, I'm going to be too high... with the GH buff from being on Shav, my Hide/Move will be a base 44. I think that's too high.

If you don't want to grind a Chatt, use Invis scrolls (Ninja neck would actually be a lot easier for some of the longer portions) and swap a tower shield. You'll be good to go for the most part.
Or, as Cow said, a Shatterbow could work, but it only subtracts 5, so it will be more dependent upon how closely you surpass the threshold.

[TheDearLeader]

If you don't want to grind a Chatt, use Invis scrolls and swap a tower shield. You'll be good to go for the most part.

Probably be what I do, then. Well, pots rather than Scrolls, since scrolls break sneak, and I have 200+ pots.

[Calebro]

Probably be what I do, then. Well, pots rather than Scrolls, since scrolls break sneak, and I have 200+ pots.

Edit above that you missed.
Grab the Ninja necklace.... whatever it's called.... Nyoko's maybe?.... for a few long lasting Invis' to help with some of the longer portions.

[Milfeulle]

invis then jump jump jump, if you do it right, you won't get more than a yellow alert, but the sad thing is there's no brick for your head to break and no hidden 1-up mushroom. This is only good for solo, if you have more than 1 people playing around, alert level would rise.

[ShadRan]

And here's (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykEtfLqi7PU) part one of a three part vid of an elite run by a solo rogue, by Shiz, unless I'm mistaken.

Dont know who is Shiz, but that video is made by me, long time ago on EU Keeper Server :)

And yes you can lower ya sneak move a tick and put it back on, as long you not to close to the mobs.

[Calebro]

invis then jump jump jump, if you do it right, you won't get more than a yellow alert, but the sad thing is there's no brick for your head to break and no hidden 1-up mushroom. This is only good for solo, if you have more than 1 people playing around, alert level would rise.

This is the cheesy way to do it. This requires zero skill. This is about skillfully threading the needle in Sins, not zerging it with Invis.
I'm not saying the zerg isn't fun, but any rogue that can work a spacebar can do it.


Dont know who is Shiz, but that video is made by me, long time ago on EU Keeper Server :)

And yes you can lower ya sneak move a tick and put it back on, as long you not to close to the mobs.

TY for the correction.

@TheDearLeader:
I would try the Shatterbow first, and possibly save a bunch of pots/headache. If you're close to the mark, it's all you'll need. If you're still too high, Invis/Tower combo.

[die]

If you want a visual, I did toss up a stealth clip for Sins of Attrition (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEuBtYUL7mA) about 2 years ago.

cool!!

[TheDearLeader]

@TheDearLeader:
I would try the Shatterbow first, and possibly save a bunch of pots/headache. If you're close to the mark, it's all you'll need. If you're still too high, Invis/Tower combo.

Don't have a Shatterbow. >.> The headache would be me farming for one. Pots will probably be fine - after all, I don't plan on breaking invis often. Or maybe I'll just use the Mass Scrolls for 13 mins.. /shrug.

[TheDearLeader]

All right, it's late, and I ended up playing around with this a little more than I'd planned on. What I've found:

Noisemakers work on stationary mobs with no other AI in the same way we see people using the Chattering Ring - Temporary Lowering Move Silently effect. Mobs move to that area, then stop. Of course, it's slower, but it did seem to work.

Noisemakers *sort of* work on Patrol-AI mobs. Those Tiefling soldiers in the beginning who wander up and down the halls? They'll get attracted by the Noisemaker, stop for a brief moment, return to the position where they "left off" their patrolling, and get right back to patrolling.

The Cinderspawn is fast - Notably, it means it gets to the Noisemaker before the casters do. With enough time/care, you can separate the Cinderspawn from the casters. Basically, for Cinderspawn 1, I used Noisemakers to pull it up to the ramp, and after the Tiefling patrolmen had passed by, I used a in-sneak-Bluff to single-pull him, utilizing the natural curve of the ramp to prevent getting hit. Doing this, I pulled him back to the entrance of the quest, and killed him there. I was in on Normal, so easy-peasy.

The Efreeti I did in a similar way - I used the Noisemakers to pull the Tieflings back in the hallway between the Cinderspawn and Efreeti, and then in-sneak-Bluff pulled the Efreeti back to the platform on which he spawns, and killed him there.

I played a little bit in the Saligia room to get a feeling for the Devils and Orthons, and a bit after that, but I didn't really get much farther. Using these methods, though, I'm thinking one can complete the quest regardless of difficulty with 4 player kills (the two Cinderspawn, the Efreeti, and End Boss of choice), and some Misadventure kills (I had 4 somehow; I hadn't encountered traps yet, so I'm not sure what those are. However, Saligia can be killed with traps later, as has been shown.)

So yeah, seems interesting. Maybe late tonight I'll give it a go on Elite. It'll be slower than other runs due to Noisemaker usage, but it should be fun.

[Angelus_dead]

This is the cheesy way to do it. This requires zero skill. This is about skillfully threading the needle in Sins, not zerging it with Invis.
I'm not saying the zerg isn't fun, but any rogue that can work a spacebar can do it.
It's an unfortunate game design if jumping around making noise leads to superior and faster results than being actually sneaky and unheard.