Dear Devs: Fix the lag because it's out of control.

[Noelemahc]

Once again today doing raids and the lag was just out of control. EVERYONE in the party in two different raids experience debilitating lag. When lag is to the point it makes the game unplayable it is unacceptable. This needs to be fixed. Please stop everything and fix the lag now. I don't care if this game gets new content. I don't care if you increase spell points by 2 for level 4 paladins. I don't care about the meaningless bug fixes that come out. What I do care about is the fact that the game is unplayable because of this insane lag that is getting worse with every patch/update.

another thread on lag (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=342302)

Apparently I'm going to have to go out and buy fraps or something to record all the lag sessions because nothing is getting done about it and you guys seem to have no idea how bad it really is. It's not just isolated cases, or me, or one other individual. It's everyone that's getting hit by it. I'm beyond frustrated and to the point where I'm considering dropping DDO and playing WoW or something, and I hate WoW with a passion. Seriously, this should be the #1 priority and nothing else should be done in the game until it's fixed.

[Qhualor]

every update it seems to be getting worse. i am in the minority and turbine needs to make money, but i would rather have lag and other fixes in the game instead of new content and classes. we dont need new things every 3 months. the game itself really needs to be fixed before adding more problems to it. i wonder if they know about the countless people who get so frustrated with the lag that they log off and take a break, when they would have stayed on and played longer. or the countless times people restart their computer to get rid of some of it for just a couple hours. a business is supposed to keep customers happy, not frustrate them by not fixing problems, or just putting a band aid on it.

[Musouka]

But that means no money if they stop everything else to just fix lag... sigh... it is terribad.

I literally have cut my DDO playtime in half, namely due to lag. I cannot stand wiping twice in a row at the dragon, because the lag holds the entire group out in the open when Velah breathes fire.

It's not fun anymore, because of this.

See you at TOR?

[Candela90]

Yup. its unplayable. I already changed my graphics to very low, cause on medium i cant play - still the same graphic card and all... O.O

On today eChrono we wiped. why?
Seplls were 6 seconds late. SIX SECONDS!
I was on my fvs , i look ,theyre fighting. ok. red bars full. Great, going great. Next second
Ding
Ding
Ding
Ding
Ding
Ding
...
We were in 3 healers. All had the same issue. Arcanes and melees too.
How can i heal, when iu dont see red bars dropping? Or how can i do anything if i cant MOVE? what can i do if everything is late 6 or more seconds.
What happened? O.O
even yesterday it was better,

[Dragavon]

Lag has never been as bad in DDO as it is now.

It absolutely needs to be fixed.

[biggin]

Had two separate instances of lag in eDQ2 that wiped us. Same deal, 3 healers, all spamming, entire party dies anyway.

Also had an issue with Titan and loading screen (got into the raid once, the other it kicked me and someone else in front of the preraid, couldn't complete). I'm not a huge fan of Titan to begin with, nothing short of prepaying me epic scrolls is going to get me there now.

[anto_capone]

Yea it's the worst I've seen since I started playing. :(

The lag is making certain quest objectives unobtainable (Suulo got stuck in the wall the other day. Amusing, but annoying in the end). The lag is causing deaths and rubber banding all over the place, and it seems to get worse when I play on my casters. Even solo farming, mobs that are 40 feet away appear to run in place for 3 seconds, and then bam they hit me three times and are standing right next to me.

There was always a lag spike here and there, but it seems after U11 the lag is everywhere and prevalent.


I've gotten 50+ people to try out this game, and if this isn't fixed soon I'm going to have think about not recommending this game that I love to my friends. :(

[djsonar919]

You all are crazy! There is no lag in this game! Remember, Turbine fixed that when they changed the two weapon fighting feats to have a percentage based system for extra attacks.

[xSeverinax]

We had a major lag issue while running Von 5 and 6 on leet yesterday (at level). Everything was going great, only death was the rogue )who had never done the quest before), in the lightning/spining blade taps. Got all the bases down first time in von6 went in to face the dragon and one moment I was healing, the next the whole party was dead. None off us saw any of the dragon animations or even the fire breath on our screens. It really sucked. At least we didn't go on timer so went straight back in and completed.

[Reivaxx]

Signed, lag is the worst thing in the game it can destroy ones will to play by itself...so please please NERF LAG

[paraplegic]

ohh c'mon dont be like that devs made a new raid "lord of lag" its quite hard.

[moops]

Signed

Every update the lag gets worse, but this is by far the worst I've seen it outside of Shroud pre "twf lag fix." In fact I'd gladly take the shroud lag back, because back then that was the only place I lagged--now it happens everywhere at every level-the game no longer runs smooth.

I took my settings off of High ( which I was able to run with just fine pre u11 except rare spikes) and changed them to medium and low, and already had the big processes turned off, and I still get lag.

[Ehllie]

Don't let the game die turbine. People are more & more fed up with the unplayable lag.

[Edyit76]

lag is terrible, utterly terrible. the game is unplayable in the state it is in. and its not just me. when 12 people are all screaming lag i know its not isolated to my computer. and its not just certain areas its game wide.

I don't know if its due to the cove event or if its because the game servers need a serious upgrade but the game sucks right now. it sucks that you fail not due to player negligence but from something that is completly out of your control. a 6-12 second delay when you cast a spell till you see the effect is totally unacceptable.

fixing this lag needs to be bumped up to priority #1. upgrade the servers, move events to a seperate server, something anything that will make this game enjoyable again because right now it sucks bad and its entirely due to lag.

[Airgeadlam]

/Signed.

VoN5 elite the other day, on my splash monk/fighter. I timed the lightning trap, crossed, noticed a lag spike but no biggy. The trap hit me, so I stopped right in the middle, between the 2 lightnining traps, grabbed a wand and suddenly bam! Second lightning hit fried me to death.

And it didnt get better this days healing the Shroud.

[FreDDyoShIie]

Once again today doing raids and the lag was just out of control. EVERYONE in the party in two different raids experience debilitating lag. When lag is to the point it makes the game unplayable it is unacceptable. This needs to be fixed. Please stop everything and fix the lag now. I don't care if this game gets new content. I don't care if you increase spell points by 2 for level 4 paladins. I don't care about the meaningless bug fixes that come out. What I do care about is the fact that the game is unplayable because of this insane lag that is getting worse with every patch/update.

another thread on lag (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=342302)

Apparently I'm going to have to go out and buy fraps or something to record all the lag sessions because nothing is getting done about it and you guys seem to have no idea how bad it really is. It's not just isolated cases, or me, or one other individual. It's everyone that's getting hit by it. I'm beyond frustrated and to the point where I'm considering dropping DDO and playing WoW or something, and I hate WoW with a passion. Seriously, this should be the #1 priority and nothing else should be done in the game until it's fixed.

/This (!!!)
/Signed 100%

Thats exactly what Turbine have to do as #1 priority: fix once and for all the Game, this game is building up bugs after bugs with all the new contents and releases without the previous ones are fixed. Servers have no structure to hold all new releases Turbine does and i signed the idea of stoping the game until everything is fixed if not it will be a snowball growing each time more. But... there is allways a second option, and that one will be very bad to Turbine, most of us will drop the game to play some other one and sure losses will be much larger than close the game for a day or two to fix the lag issue as well as other real problems that we report every day but apparently has no echo in the hosts of Turbine. This is a very serious issue Devs, we pay real money and we are not getting what we pay for, so all we ask (actualy we dont have to ask...) you is that we are offered the services for which we pay.

[AestorTheKnight]

Don't let the game die turbine. People are more & more fed up with the unplayable lag.

This.

Today, I got together a 12 person party for VON 5 - Elite - At level so a 10-12 group.

We had just killed the Rust Emporer and restored the 3 Conduits when the server crashed. Booted all 12 Players
from the world.

When we all logged back on 2 minutes later, the instance had reset.

Complete and total waste of 1 hour for 12 people.

[Memnir]

There can't possibly be lag... DA fixed all lag. Right, Turbine? :rolleyes:

[Ultimaetus]

Turning down yor settings isnt gonna do any good against server side lag

[Chantelune]

Will sign this one again cause i'm tired logging out because i can't play due to lag .
fix it , please.

[Captain_Wizbang]

It is getting real bad.

Doing loot runs in sub t, it was so bad, 3 people were at named, while everyone else was just past first gate!

[MsEricka]

Why is this posted in General? This is not happening to everyone on every server so please do not speak for "everyone".

It would be much more helpful for Turbine if you said what server you're on instead of (as above) making a blanket statement.

This could also be cove related, as events are known to cause issues for some.

[Musouka]

Why is this posted in General? This is not happening to everyone on every server so please do not speak for "everyone".

It would be much more helpful for Turbine if you said what server you're on instead of (as above) making a blanket statement.

This could also be cove related, as events are known to cause issues for some.

It's more that is has been going unnoticed on the server forums, since before the event even started.

Also, it seems people are chiming in from different servers.

[UltraMonk2]

It's not just isolated cases, or me, or one other individual. It's everyone that's getting hit by it.

The only time I experience lag nowadays is when destroying the crystals in Master Artificer, and I know its my graphics card having trouble keeping up. Everything else has been perfectly fine.

So not everyone is being hit by it, maybe it might be worth going over your computer with a fine toothcomb and making sure your connection is fine.

[Musouka]

The only time I experience lag nowadays is when destroying the crystals in Master Artificer, and I know its my graphics card having trouble keeping up. Everything else has been perfectly fine.

So not everyone is being hit by it, maybe it might be worth going over your computer with a fine toothcomb and making sure your connection is fine.

You're going to tell that to a raid group of 12 people and say it is all of their computers?

[Falco_Easts]

It's not just isolated cases, or me, or one other individual. It's everyone that's getting hit by it.

No, it's not. Making statements that aren't true to build your case makes it look weaker not stronger.

I inderstand people are getting lag, you would have to be blind reading the forums not to see that. But it is not everyone, and it is not all the time. I have no doubt Turbine are aware of people complaining but a rant that does not include quest, server or time isn't overly helpful. Try nailing down the time, server and where it happens and you might get somewhere.

[esheep]

So not everyone is being hit by it, maybe it might be worth going over your computer with a fine toothcomb and making sure your connection is fine.


Why is this posted in General? This is not happening to everyone on every server so please do not speak for "everyone".

It would be much more helpful for Turbine if you said what server you're on instead of (as above) making a blanket statement.

It pretty much is happening to everyone on Cannith in waves... and it is being posted here because the server forums thread has been pretty much ignored by Turbine. (Which you would know if you read the link in the OP)

If you're on Cannith and haven't been hit by it, you're lucky -- it is very widespread as you will notice if you read most of the two threads... suggesting that there are tons of people not experiencing this lag is just as silly as you claim the OP to be.

[UltraMonk2]

You're going to tell that to a raid group of 12 people and say it is all of their computers?

Yes, I used to be a Network Admin for an ISP and I also fix people's computers for a living. 20+ years experience I have and I learnt to check over a persons computer thoroughly before blaming a server.

[~jradnut]

It took me 30 whole seconds to run across the Vale today, so, yes, lag is bad, very very bad, yes is bad...

[rayworks]

Why is this posted in General? This is not happening to everyone on every server so please do not speak for "everyone".

It would be much more helpful for Turbine if you said what server you're on instead of (as above) making a blanket statement.

This could also be cove related, as events are known to cause issues for some.

OK. I'm on Cannith, and pre U11 lag was less than it is now. And it started BEFORE the CC event. I'm not an expert, but it sure looks like U11 is the problem.

[GermanicusMaximus]

I'm beyond frustrated and to the point where I'm considering dropping DDO and playing WoW.

I'm running most of the standard endgame raids on Cannith: Shroud, VoD, HoX, ToD, eVon6, eDQ2 (no eChrono, MA, or LoB lately -- too busy finishing the summer ToDo list). Not seeing any real lag at all, except the standard Shroud lag you get when you appoach chests/shrines.

Maybe WoW is more your speed. DDO is for the best of the best. Screaming lag when you are just failing is kind of ridiculous.

[ferrite]

Yes, I used to be a Network Admin for an ISP and I also fix people's computers for a living. 20+ years experience I have and I learnt to check over a persons computer thoroughly before blaming a server.

Well you may be checking a few hundred thousand computers then, as most of us seem to be experiencing lag.

I'd be more inclined to blame Turbine's C64 'chat server' as the culprit.

[Falco_Easts]

Well you may be checking a few hundred thousand computers then, as most of us seem to be experiencing lag.

I'd be more inclined to blame Turbine's C64 'chat server' as the culprit.

At least this is only "most" and not "everyone". How do you quantify this?

Again, not saying there is not lag and indeed it may happen to most although I doubt it.

[Savvannis]

I've spent the last month playing with the lag thinking that it was my computer (am on a netbook not designed for games, but still playing because I love the game), but after reading this and various other threads regarding the lag, I am now even more frustrated than ever with DDO. As I've been reading the forums this evening, I'm seeing a "Known Issue" posting for the black screen problem... Well, the forum admin needs to add a "Known Issus" notice for the LAG!!!! "Known Issue: The servers are very laggy and you will most probably die in a dungeon if you play. The Developers are aware of this issue but would rather bring you more new content and updates rather than fix the lag issue."

When I started playing DDO, I would spend 16-18 hours a day, 4-6 days a week (for the first month) playing (no, I have no life!). I got a bit of lag, not so much that I couldn't join groups for adventures, though. After the last update, however, it seems that I do nothing BUT lag. I have a party of friends that I play with on the Khyber server... My load time from area to area is so long that by the time I load into most of the low level, quick dungeons (the level 2-4 dungeons, mostly) the party has completed it. I get into the dungeon just in time to collect the end XP then finish out. These are dungeons that take them (my friends) on average 10-15 minutes to run through, on elite, with just 2-3 of them, at level or just a level above. I even went so far as to switch computers that I play on (one designed for gaming, that the owner usually plays League of Legends, Left for Dead, WoW and many other online, graphic intense MMORPGs on), and was still lagging, just not as bad; I actually got to load into the dungeon, but they were still half way through the dungeon before I caught up to them!

Now, I know that some would say "Woohoo! easy XP, easy favor!" But not me. I'm the type that I -LIKE- to be able to play and help the party, and when I can't do that because of lag so bad then I don't enjoy the game. When a game frustrates me so badly that I'm in tears (yes, I was crying one evening because the lag was so bad I couldn't do anything), I don't enjoy the game. When I don't enjoy the game, I don't play. And obviously, from the amount of people complaining about the lag, I'm not the only one not enjoying the game.

So... I would seriously think about that if I were you, Dev's and Exec's... No more updates, no more new stuff, no more anything until you FIX THE LAG!!!! Once more, so that I make my point clearly: NO MORE UPDATES UNTIL YOU FIX THE CURRENT LAG PROBLEMS! I'm sure, after reading all the posts about lag, that there is quite probably at least half the community here that agrees with me. Sure, we enjoy having new content to play, but not at the cost of having so much lag! PLEASE!!! Fix the lag!

And for the 4th time in this post: FIX THE LAG!!!! Is that clear enough for you, Mr and/or Mrs Developer and Executive?

[~Glimrac]

signed

[morticianjohn]

There are two things that could cause me to leave the game. One would be RL issues, the other is lag. Making this a priority above everything else is important.

[Qhualor]

ok, ill say it like this than since we have people who are being technical about the wording. there is some lag in the game that is not always on my end. there is lag coming from the server side that especially seems to hit when there are events going on, which still doesnt make it acceptable, there have been reports from people from all servers, but not all people, that the lag is just too unplayable. sometimes the lag spikes hit some people in my group who are also experiencing it. these people are not using the same computer as me, so i know it isnt just my computer. my settings are as low as possible, brand new with top of the line memory card, etc. my signal strength is excellent. it appears that sometimes the lag hits at certain times of the day, events, aoe spells, zoning and at random times and places. it appears the lag is increasingly getting worse, but im not a technical expert and never went to school for computer maintenance, so im not qualified to give an expert opinion on the lag matter. all i know is, some of us got lag and we dont like it.

[Alex301]

I've experienced some awful lag recently as did everyone else i was with at the time. While it may not be constant, it does make the game practically unplayable during that time.

And i appreciate that not every is experiencing this lag, but it is happening to enough people to be a real problem and it is something they should focus on fixing.

[FastTaco]

Not sure how much longer I can put up with it myself. Epic raiding in primetime seems to be hit or miss at best, eADQ only requires a short hiccup to wipe the whole raid. Same with evon6, only takes one lag spike to wipe 3/4 the raid or more which takes considerable effort to recover from, if possible.

[ferrite]

At least this is only "most" and not "everyone". How do you quantify this?

You may quantify it by reading, then re-reading, these posts. You may then take an informal percentage of yea's vs. nay's to reach an informal conclusion. Seems fairly obvious.

However if you're looking for scientific data or facts and figures you won't find them here, since we do not have access to that data. All we can do, is listen to what others have to say, then weigh the conclusion with the data we have available.

If 99 people say they have lag vs. 1 that dissents, I'm more inclined to believe the majority, myself included. The actual counting of sheep I defer to you if you so desire.

[Falco_Easts]

ok, ill say it like this than since we have people who are being technical about the wording. there is some lag in the game that is not always on my end. there is lag coming from the server side that especially seems to hit when there are events going on, which still doesnt make it acceptable, there have been reports from people from all servers, but not all people, that the lag is just too unplayable. sometimes the lag spikes hit some people in my group who are also experiencing it. these people are not using the same computer as me, so i know it isnt just my computer. my settings are as low as possible, brand new with top of the line memory card, etc. my signal strength is excellent. it appears that sometimes the lag hits at certain times of the day, events, aoe spells, zoning and at random times and places. it appears the lag is increasingly getting worse, but im not a technical expert and never went to school for computer maintenance, so im not qualified to give an expert opinion on the lag matter. all i know is, some of us got lag and we dont like it.

This makes a lot better argument then the hyperbole. +1


You may quantify it by reading, then re-reading, these posts. You may then take an informal percentage of yea's vs. nay's to reach an informal conclusion. Seems fairly obvious.

However if you're looking for scientific data or facts and figures you won't find them here, since we do not have access to that data. All we can do, is listen to what others have to say, then weigh the conclusion with the data we have available.

If 99 people say they have lag vs. 1 that dissents, I'm more inclined to believe the majority, myself included. The actual counting of sheep I defer to you if you so desire.

People rarely complain about a problem they are not having.
10 people in a group. 3 complain they have a headache, one says they don't but the remaining 6 say nothing. Does that mean "everyone" has a headache, "most" have a headache or some have a headache?

[ferrite]

People rarely complain about a problem they are not having.

How do you quantify this?

[Musouka]

How do you quantify this?

I had to LOL at that.

Reminds me of the joke of words you'll never hear a man say. "Not tonight honey, I have a headache."



10 people in a group. 3 complain they have a headache, one says they don't but the remaining 6 say nothing. Does that mean "everyone" has a headache, "most" have a headache or some have a headache?

How about 4 out of 5 people suffer from Diarrhea, does that mean the 5th enjoys it?

[Darsith]

I am the first to place blame on my bad connection if things go wrong lag wise. However, when it is an entire raid describing the same issue, and ventrilo isn't lagging I know something is happening server side. Either that or the internet is failing across the world.

[peetrs]

You all are crazy! There is no lag in this game! Remember, Turbine fixed that when they changed the two weapon fighting feats to have a percentage based system for extra attacks.

QFT! Yay, servers have to do 10 calculations per attacks instead of 11, that's gonna fix the lag. Sure. *Walks away mumbling something about incompetent developers.*

/signed

But I'm experiencing these lags too, but I do experience them only if I group. When I solo, there are no problems at all (ok, occasional higher latency, but that's probably my ISP). The more people in group, the bigger lag problems...

Anyway, not sure on what could cause this, because in CC I experienced kind of "lag" ... I was throwing ball lightnings like mad man all around, my SPs got consumed, I did even see the effect of spell, but nothing else happened for more then 45s (no damage whatsoever). All while monster were moving without problems, were hiting me (killed me in the end), were casting spells on me and ofc chat / voice worked as usual.

[mystafyi]

How about 4 out of 5 people suffer from Diarrhea, does that mean the 5th enjoys it?

ROFL. thanks for the laugh.

chiming in on this topic. alot of lag issues are during heavy load times, combined with raids and some quests. the server has started doing instance shutdowns and rollbacks since u11. This is a direct result of server overload, either crappy LSA from internap(i say this since internap is a good service, but if turbine cut costs on this front...) or horrible code.

if i run solo or low level quests i see little server lag even at peak times. this does not mean there is not a problem. It just means even if the server throttles my bandwidth I wont notice much if at all.

[Lavek]

they will fix it...very soon

http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p=3461091&postcount=22

just example of how soon really is

[Caliban]

I've noticed some severe lag spikes lately myself, although not nearly as bad as some of the people here have reported.

I play on Khyber, but usually not during peak times.

One thing I've wondered about - could all the abandoned Artificer pets be having an impact (presumably left behind when the artificer logs out, or due to some sort of glitch)?

I doubt there is a huge amount of them, but that is a significant number of additional objects that the servers now have to keep track of, that didn't exist before.

[UltraMonk2]

If 99 people say they have lag vs. 1 that dissents, I'm more inclined to believe the majority, myself included. The actual counting of sheep I defer to you if you so desire.

The majority may believe what they are saying is true, but that doesn't mean it is true. :-)

I used to schedule server upgrades at the ISP I worked at and actually never do the upgrade.

The next day we used to get heaps of calls from people blaming their problems on our server upgrade, which never took place.

I'm not saying that there is no lag for some people, the problem becomes that there are many issues at the players end that can cause lag. So when you do get 100 people complaining, what amount of those are really experiencing lag because of a server problem or is there something wrong with their computer instead?

So here is a list of free tools for people to do a general maintenance on their computer:

Auslogics Disk Defrag (Choose Defrag and Optimize)
Advanced System Care Free (Do Deep Scan)
Spybot Search & Destroy
Hitman Pro (Run once)
Upgrade Drivers for your devices

Also check your CPU usage in Windows when the computer is sitting idle. If it is constantly above 20% then you have a problem. (Yes I know that it should only be around 5% but I'm allowing for some leeway)

Check your pagefile settings, your hard disk free space and your ram size. There are other things you can do but most of that is the basics.

[mystafyi]

The majority may believe what they are saying is true, but that doesn't mean it is true. :-)

ofc thats true, but instance shutdowns/throttling and rollbacks are server side methods of preventing a total failure from overloaded servers. these are last ditch efforts by the server to prevent total database corruption and/or hardware failures. I cannot blame the clients for this, nor can i blame internap(a quality provider). This is a problem with turbines code or they downgraded(or refused to upgrade) the service they receive via their SLA.

[donblas]

Game is not unplayable (I play it all the time) and I've not really noticed lag at all.

[pHo3nix]

Why is this posted in General? This is not happening to everyone on every server so please do not speak for "everyone".

It would be much more helpful for Turbine if you said what server you're on instead of (as above) making a blanket statement.

This could also be cove related, as events are known to cause issues for some.

You are right, i personally don't know the situation on the other servers, but on Cannith, after u11, lag is making the game unplayable.

Pre u11 i've never complained about lag: sure, you got some lag spikes here and there but the game was mostly going smooth. Then u11 went live, and lag became terrible: yesterday it was impossible to play.

Stop saying that it is our computers or networks fault; it's not that hard to understand the difference between your pc/net deficiencies and the deficiencies of the servers, expecially when most people on the server are complaining about lag problems.

So plz, fix lag on Cannith or give us free tokens to move our toons to other "non-laggy" servers.

[Forzah]

There is some occassional lag. Usually I only have it in shroud when climbing the stairs at the end of part 1. And a few days ago the whole server seemed to lag, when I was just walking around in harbor. For the rest I haven't had extreme problems lately.

[pHo3nix]

There is some occassional lag. Usually I only have it in shroud when climbing the stairs at the end of part 1. And a few days ago the whole server seemed to lag, when I was just walking around in harbor. For the rest I haven't had extreme problems lately.

The end of part 1 has always been laggy, but it has never been a big problem, you cannot wipe against 2 chests, 2 altars and 2 shrines ;)

[Razcar]

Might very well be server related. Seems to me that the many people that report lag play on Cannith.

I play on Ghallanda and while lag is for me more noticable after U11 than before (Cove? Arti pets? Devs just adding features on same old servers?) it is not at all as bad as many posters make out here, and I haven't heard other G-landers complain that much about server lag either.

And I compare that to when I played on Thelanis a while back and lag was particularily bad on that server for a period, but not on others.

So it seems to me that something might be broken on Cannith, and U11 made it worse.

[Moltier]

Im not sure its U11. I felt the lag since U10 and before that, but it wasnt really bad.
One thing i noticed, the lag is worse after each week. Its slowly growing, and now on Cannith it kills the prime play time. It wasnt the cove, it really didnt add any more lag.

Now our spells can late 30 seconds (happened yesterday in a group, not even in a raid...). I was in chrono where my attacks late 10 seconds.
Or ToD part 2 yesterday... couldnt move as kiter, and couldnt cast spells (so tanking wasnt possible as well). 2nd kiter's spell land 10sec after casting... wipe.

If everyone in the actual party/raid notice the huge lagg spikes, for hours, i bet its not a client computer problem.

Till a year ago, i played on Thelanis where the Laggmonster was born.
Seems like he found a new home, Cannith... with more damage, hp and fort... :P

[fn_Chopper]

So here is a list of free tools for people to do a general maintenance on their computer:

Auslogics Disk Defrag (Choose Defrag and Optimize)
Advanced System Care Free (Do Deep Scan)
Spybot Search & Destroy
Hitman Pro (Run once)
Upgrade Drivers for your devices


My computer was well tuned before the update, and it didn't change for the update, and now I'm experiencing consistently more minor lag than prior to the update. There's an approximate 1/2 second of additional lag which wasn't there before. I know this, because the first thing I'd throw (since forever) when entering combat was fists of light. It always (95+%) used to work. Now, it never works.

Similarly, I'm experiencing random rubber-banding. Soloing, in parties etc. I'll lose 3-5 seconds of action approximately once every 3 days. Just after the udpate, myself and a fighter died simultaneously in the shroud. From full hp (me = 19 Monk ~450 hp and 18 fighter ~560 hp) to nothing without seeing a thing .. healers spamming all the way (I've never seen this before). I also used to alt around an awful lot.. from toon to toon running up slayers. Now, after alting the 2nd time (toon 1 -> toon 2 -> toon 3) the lag becomes particularly noticable, so I can't alt around anymore.

The consistent lag (1/2 second) leads me to believe that there's additional processing being consistently undertaken .. on the client or server, unsure which.. but this isn't a big deal at all. The alt-ing issues feel like a client-side memory consumption (or possibly processing) problem and the slingshot positionals (imo) could only be caused server side because this is a positional re-synchronisation based on failed client -> server updates.

I generally play during v.off hours, my internet connection is flawless (in over 8 years I could only complaign about 2 incidents .. 1 was caused by the hard failure of a backbone switch, the second by a farmer putting a shovel through the optic fibre running across his property). I do realise how hard these problems can be to diagnose, and if the devs read this, I'm proficient with computers and would be happy to offer my assistance.

[Eme]

ive noticed since the last update there is a new massive amount of game 'refreshing' going on that was not present before ,,
- quest objectives menu flashes and updates all the time,

-Things like runes/designs on puzzle wheels flash every few seconds to different pictures and then refresh to where they should be,

-lots of quirky graphics bugs, especially with walls and cameras not behaving properly

- Teleporting mobs dont teleport anymore,, they slide really fast !

[BadBuy]

Can't really say much about others (other than hearing lots of complains and curses about that in game), but from my personal experience I can say that it really has gotten much worse with many spells not landing and such. I play with two different machines in two different locations using two different ISPs so it would be really hard to say that something happened to both of them at the same time.

[darksol23]

Cannith was near unplayable during prime times this weekend and occasionally during the last work week too. It is NOT an issue of people needing to optimize or clean-up their machines. You can be cruising along at 100+ FPS and the Cannith Lag will still affect you when you get in a lagging instance... You get Micheal Jordan hang times of 5+ seconds when you jump... You get to chase mobs like a dog chases it's tail....If you're a healer, you have to use your innate ability to predict the future to decide who will need to be healed 15 seconds from now... Time to break out the crystal balls!

[Vanquishedfo]

I guess I am lucky, or its cus I rarely get into big chaotic groups where its like a pack of pirahnna on a bloody bit of meat. Lag is a by product of a bad sloppy playstyle that is very much the opposite of the spirit of the game and its actual design. I suspect they dont fix it in an effort to kill raid player base so they can then rebuild it from the ground up without all the whiny hard cores *****ing at them. Try playing the game solo sometime its not only smooth as silk but actually makes your character feel alot more succesful then in a group depending on buffs, heals, meat shields etc.

[mutilador]

New Anti-lag pots on DDO Store soon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[chance2000]

Turbine has already said they know about it and are attempting to fix it. We have U11 and the Cove and Mabar coming up so expect it. The Cove is ending, after Mabar I hope it will be a little better. The game is playable. One issue is character switching and game memory leak. Switch between a few then run some quests and then a raid and you will get massive lag. Me I close the program after a couple of hours to let my memory buffers clear. It seems to help a bunch.

[Chauncey1]

Me I close the program after a couple of hours to let my memory buffers clear. It seems to help a bunch.

^this
I've also recently discovered (noob alert) that changing instances, when possible, can help reduce lag as well.
It's still frustrating to have to do that though. And inconvenient, especially when you have a group waiting at the entrance to a quest.
And while the Cove was up and running, a lot of my guildies were complaining about the lag spikes elsewhere in the game every time the cove opened.
There wasn't a lot of lag in the cove until the last few days...then it was Texas Two Steppin time.
And maybe it's just me, but EVERY time I'm goin up the stairs in harbor, near the CC pirate guy, I get massive lag near the top.

[Vengeance777]

/signed

The lag has made Epic content pretty much unplayable. Most Raids ran at over normal are wiping as well do to spells and heals no longer landing and the rubberbanding. I've had to drink Mnem pots on my healer do to 1/3 of my spell point bar dissapearing to heals that are not landing.

I've pretty much stopped playing the game. Its not fun anymore.

And Cove and Mabar aren't the main culprits. Lags been bad since before U11 hit when the cove wasn't up.



I guess I am lucky, or its cus I rarely get into big chaotic groups where its like a pack of pirahnna on a bloody bit of meat. Lag is a by product of a bad sloppy playstyle that is very much the opposite of the spirit of the game and its actual design. I suspect they dont fix it in an effort to kill raid player base so they can then rebuild it from the ground up without all the whiny hard cores *****ing at them. Try playing the game solo sometime its not only smooth as silk but actually makes your character feel alot more succesful then in a group depending on buffs, heals, meat shields etc.


I've had the rubberbanding/ spells wont land lag while running in Harbor. Soloing Irestone Inlet, Desert Rare runs, favor farming, even in solo epic scroll farms (all with no dungeon alert). Party size and tactics aren't always the cause of the lag.

[dragonofsteel2]

There is no lag in ddo.. All lies. Vicous lies.

[smatt]

New Anti-lag pots on DDO Store soon!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


But but.. They PROMISED they would never..... Wait... :D

[konexion]

After the epic lag beatdowns I've been through the last couple of weeks I'm so fed up that I'm on the verge of walking away from the game too. Definitely cancelling my sub. I have enough points To keep all my toons and enough space on each for my bank items. No sweat off my back. Will find another non lagging game to spend my money on

[Qhualor]

/signed

The lag has made Epic content pretty much unplayable. Most Raids ran at over normal are wiping as well do to spells and heals no longer landing and the rubberbanding. I've had to drink Mnem pots on my healer do to 1/3 of my spell point bar dissapearing to heals that are not landing.

I've pretty much stopped playing the game. Its not fun anymore.

And Cove and Mabar aren't the main culprits. Lags been bad since before U11 hit when the cove wasn't up.





I've had the rubberbanding/ spells wont land lag while running in Harbor. Soloing Irestone Inlet, Desert Rare runs, favor farming, even in solo epic scroll farms (all with no dungeon alert). Party size and tactics aren't always the cause of the lag.

ive had the same problem and ive heard from other people as well they have problems like that when they solo. unfortunately, not all of us can solo raids like some people to help reduce lag.

[cdemeritt]

Well, cove is over, Mabar hasn't started yet... and it took my 5 minutes to cross the room to loot the chests in Party Crashers... Cyan beat me to the final room, and I couldn't hit anything, as by the time I swung, the mob was out of range...


Something far more than just events are causing massive problems ATM.

[Xyrus]

I guess I am lucky, or its cus I rarely get into big chaotic groups where its like a pack of pirahnna on a bloody bit of meat. Lag is a by product of a bad sloppy playstyle that is very much the opposite of the spirit of the game and its actual design. I suspect they dont fix it in an effort to kill raid player base so they can then rebuild it from the ground up without all the whiny hard cores *****ing at them. Try playing the game solo sometime its not only smooth as silk but actually makes your character feel alot more succesful then in a group depending on buffs, heals, meat shields etc.

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not, but playstyle has jack **** to do with lag. Lag is a result of the server attempting to resolve latencies in communication, synchronization, and load balancing. Turning your graphics down won't help (that will only help your rendering framerate). Running solo won't help (unless there is some sort of communication logic bug causing message multiplication or something similar).

I have seen lag running solo in Vale, and I'm not doing anything fancy (barbarian). I've seen lag in solo Kobold Assault (farming for doubloons and map pieces). I've seen lag soloing in the Desert. That has nothing to do with playstyle and everything to do with how the server is managing its latency and load.

Another possibility is some hardware along the chain could be dying (a switch, router, etc.). If a network check comes back clean, then it is either the server logic or they somehow managed to get the clients to DDoS their servers.

[DragonMageT]

I posted something last week exactly pointing out what the OP stated and got little to no response from anyone.

Lag has also cut my game time down. Tried as others have done, cut graphics down to low setting, which sucks, and I still get lag.

MA just blows for lag, been in there many times and experienced massive lag for the entire party.
I just love the debuff/buff design gem they put in.

LOB yesterday, whirlwind attacks starts, I move away...DING! I wasn't even standing near LOB (which was confirmed by another party member) and my stone was near the middle. But I still died from the attack.

DCs have increased for players and watch out if someone dc's at the wrong time.

Someone needs to look into this. It's not just Cove related, was happening before cove started.

[Ebonta]

I guess I am lucky, or its cus I rarely get into big chaotic groups where its like a pack of pirahnna on a bloody bit of meat. Lag is a by product of a bad sloppy playstyle that is very much the opposite of the spirit of the game and its actual design. I suspect they dont fix it in an effort to kill raid player base so they can then rebuild it from the ground up without all the whiny hard cores *****ing at them. Try playing the game solo sometime its not only smooth as silk but actually makes your character feel alot more succesful then in a group depending on buffs, heals, meat shields etc.

I was getting a lot of lag while soloing yesterday.

[GrampaBill]

I don't believe it's too difficult to draw a connection between the increase in lag related playability problems and Crafting. While I'm impressed that when I go to either deconstruct or construct, the game will completely scan my bag contents and display what is necessary when I click on a recipe, I think about the processing behind this activity and it all makes sense that it's going to cause problems. You get a bunch of people with Large or Humongous Bags at the crafting machines and there's going to be some serious database searches going on. The bag scans along with the recipe searches that are activated with any keystroke instead of a straightforward "Search" button will kill the machine when activated by countless crafters.

I don't know how the "servers" are configured, but it seems to me that all the crafting should be farmed out to a special server and away from the gameplay servers so they are insulated from each other.

[charmor]

Just right now there is a yellow connection icon on my UI showing "Latency 1,042.0 ms". ***

[Whitehairguy]

Is there any chance the lag (even some) might have anything to do with all the dogs running around?

Edit: Also, I'm from Cannith. The lag is god awful.

[Ebonta]

I don't believe it's too difficult to draw a connection between the increase in lag related playability problems and Crafting. While I'm impressed that when I go to either deconstruct or construct, the game will completely scan my bag contents and display what is necessary when I click on a recipe, I think about the processing behind this activity and it all makes sense that it's going to cause problems. You get a bunch of people with Large or Humongous Bags at the crafting machines and there's going to be some serious database searches going on. The bag scans along with the recipe searches that are activated with any keystroke instead of a straightforward "Search" button will kill the machine when activated by countless crafters.

I don't know how the "servers" are configured, but it seems to me that all the crafting should be farmed out to a special server and away from the gameplay servers so they are insulated from each other.

I dis notice when they shut down crafting most of pyr lag had subsided.

[Postumus]

I'll throw my hat into the "I've noticed more lag" ring.


Since the update, even running through the market or harbor is much choppier than it used to be. Timing traps is a special treat since the animation doesn't seem to be at all connected to when the damage is applied.


I used to be able to time the traps fairly consistently, but now I can run through an acid trap, mid stream and be unscathed, yet take full damage while running through the trap while there is no animation whatsoever.


I also used to have time to react after taking some noticeable damage- move out of the way, heal, whatever - but not anymore. Now it's all "oh looks like I'm taking some damage I better.. DING!"


I've also noticed guildies and pug members logging off and on to 'reset' their connection about 30-50% more than in the past.


And the new Weapons Shipment? Ran it four times last week, and each time experienced worse lag than a 12 Water Savant Shroud with everyone spamming ice storm. Seriously, I was trying to follow our cleric around, and it was like chasing Nightcrawler from X-men. I'd get to the spot he was at and he'd suddenly teleport ten feet away in a random direction.

I felt like I wasn't playing a video game so much as I was watching a 4th grader's flip book animation.

[Falco_Easts]

How do you quantify this?

Touche

:)

[mystafyi]

Just right now there is a yellow connection icon on my UI showing "Latency 1,042.0 ms". ***

sad to say, but this sounds like an issue with your connection/route to turbine.

[Mellkor]

There is no lag.

Dungeon Alert fixed the lag


:D:D:D:D


:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

[DragonMageT]

Is there any chance the lag (even some) might have anything to do with all the dogs running around?

Edit: Also, I'm from Cannith. The lag is god awful.

Maybe, there was an issue year + back with hirelings causing massive lag on the servers.

If I remember correctly, I think it was Bard hirelings so maybe they reused the same code for the
dogs.

[Stitch78]

/signed to OP.

Lag is THE most important issue to my continued enjoyment of the game. It should be prioritized over new content, upgrades, etc.

Orien player.

[Musouka]

logged in for about an hour today, lag was horrendous, running through the Pit and then suddenly falling down the shaft slowly... or several misses on the pipes in the furnaces due to the game literally just pausing for moments every few seconds. Solid green connection, no recorded packet loss.

[smatt]

No No No, you all have it wrong it's YOUR systems or YOUR ISP.. In any case all this NEW lag we have since U-11 , and even worse since U-11.1 has nothing to do with SERVER side lag from Turbine central.... None at all.... :cool:

It's pretty darned bad right now....

[Produktion_Malphunktion]

Yes we play. No I do not have ' lag'. BUT I suspect what you guys call lag, I call other things. I can say I see no traditional Lag as in Latency issues. I'm not rubber-banding, or being halted and having to catch up with the world. Yes I'm playing from home. I have witnessed with my own two eyeballs some of what is being complained about. There is something, odd, going on, some strange database call or something going on. It is being investigated, and it is a top priority of QA/DEV. I know it stinks.

[sammael666]

Does any of the people responsible for adding/changing/fixing the game content actually PLAY this game or do they just change few lines in script, look at it and deem it fixed?

If those people are really playing the game, maybe you could try hiring someone that's not blind or braindead, because there is no way in hell they could not notice the staggering amount of bugs (some of them with history longer than my subscription) that's present in game. Don't get me started on the lag since last 2 updates.

Let's take the recent hireling changes as an example (any of your favourite bugs would work be it broken metamagic, unusable arti pets, butchering of the ui, crashing on the zone-in,...)

Seriously, it's beyond my ability to comprehend how could anyone from the dev team put the patch notes about hireling "improvements" in the 10.1 notes and not feel ashamed of himself. Do you not log into game and buy a hireling and go actually test the changes you made? If so, could you explain to me how could you not notice that the changes you made to the already largely unusable hirelings made things only worse? How? I can't wrap my mind around it, how can you "fix" something and not test it in game if it really works ? Because from the state of the things it's apparent you didn't bother testing it. You couldn't have, because noone in their right mind could think the hirelings work "better" now.

So that's my question. Whats the point of making changes that aren't tested? Get it in your thick skulls dear Turbine developers. We are NOT your betatesters. We are your paying customers so I'd suggest you get your act together.

[Glenalth]

Yes we play. No I do not have ' lag'. BUT I suspect what you guys call lag, I call other things. I can say I see no traditional Lag as in Latency issues. I'm not rubber-banding, or being halted and having to catch up with the world. Yes I'm playing from home. I have witnessed with my own two eyeballs some of what is being complained about. There is something, odd, going on, some strange database call or something going on. It is being investigated, and it is a top priority of QA/DEV. I know it stinks.

I haven't seen much of that fun rubber-banding recently, except during lag-o-clock. That special time of night where all the banks/vendors lock up and you can get stuck for extended periods at a loading screen.

[stainer]

No I do not have ' lag'. BUT I suspect what you guys call lag, I call other things.

What do you call it when you rubberband, stop, run in place, freeze, unable to enter quests, crash when you enter explorer zones, and have your spells land 30 secs after you cast them?

I call it Monday.

[smatt]

Yes we play. No I do not have ' lag'. BUT I suspect what you guys call lag, I call other things. I can say I see no traditional Lag as in Latency issues. I'm not rubber-banding, or being halted and having to catch up with the world. Yes I'm playing from home. I have witnessed with my own two eyeballs some of what is being complained about. There is something, odd, going on, some strange database call or something going on. It is being investigated, and it is a top priority of QA/DEV. I know it stinks.


OK, so what you call it, in laymans terms is some kind of Database dohicky not going as fast as it should.... Yep, that seems like about what I'm seeing...... Just overall slow performance, very choppy gameplay, no rubber banding, just choppy, with spells going of at times 7-10 seconds late, and even sometimes not at all. I also have a feeling an old issue has resurfaced. where lag (latency) is spreading through the party, due to how the various information regarding party buffs are being transmitted through-out the party. It may very well be the NEW party UI, and how it's sharing information that brought that back...

[DagazUlf]

There is something, odd, going on, some strange database call or something going on.

Someone said "choppy". Yeah, that's it, the whole game is "choppy".

Can you give a quick rundown (I know, again) of the various terms bandied about QA & Dev there at Turbine that we might adopt as our own while describing these things that are not quite right?

So far, it seems "lag" refers specifically to latency issues. What other terms and defined circumstances do we have?

[Produktion_Malphunktion]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

[LolWutRoflstomped]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

I'll do it for you.

[Produktion_Malphunktion]

Someone said "choppy". Yeah, that's it, the whole game is "choppy".

Can you give a quick rundown (I know, again) of the various terms bandied about QA & Dev there at Turbine that we might adopt as our own while describing these things that are not quite right?

So far, it seems "lag" refers specifically to latency issues. What other terms and defined circumstances do we have?

Choppy is good, 'hitches' , delay, pausing. More the symptom than a single term. QA does not pretend we know what is going on under the hood, more like this is what we see/hear and data points. So, you have pausing, but your connection is green, audio is ok, but spells are firing off 10 seconds late...that tells us a ton. I even listen to how my video cards fans and HDD are responding.Everything is a clue. I have hunches and theories of what it may be, but I leave it to the crazy coders to figure out the reality.

[smatt]

Choppy is good, 'hitches' , delay, pausing. More the symptom than a single term. QA does not pretend we know what is going on under the hood, more like this is what we see/hear and data points. So, you have pausing, but your connection is green, audio is ok, but spells are firing off 10 seconds late...that tells us a ton. I even listen to how my video cards fans and HDD are responding.Everything is a clue. I have hunches and theories of what it may be, but I leave it to the crazy coders to figure out the reality. You pretty much hit it , it's kind of a whole game play issue, of course it does get worse in som esituations, but even when I'm soloing off peak hours it can be bad. Far worse than it was pre-U11. My HD doesn't seem to be working any harder than before. In fact I havent's een it this bad since around Mod 6 or 7, when there were some serious issues like this as well. Another note..... I Dl'd a fresh client install yesterday.

[JarvisW]

I 'just' (less than 2 weeks ago) Installed the HQ version on a clean partition on the first part of the drive. I then defragged it.. its all alone on its own, with 2x more space empty than it takes up...

I have the choppy stuttering "lag".

And tonight I had yellow connection twice. which was new to me.. (tho I cant rule out my connection, but I could load web pages, including the forum during that time)

:confused:

[QuantumFX]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

Can we get a newer installer on FilePlanet (http://www.fileplanet.com/202160/200000/fileinfo/Dungeons-&-Dragons-Online:-Eberron-Unlimited-Client) then? The current version appears to be Update 8 patch 3.

[Munkenmo]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

I did a complete reinstall 2 days ago. before update 11.1 i never had "lag" issues so to speak (infact this is probably pay back cause i used to laugh at those who did)

Now i'm randomly noticing that my cpu usage will be spiking to the point it makes the client completely unresponsive.

Places where i know i can replicate this and crash every time.

Tower of despair cave entrance.

Epic devil assault - fine during the quest, once we've completed though and the chests are being looted I've watched my cpu usage spike, client hang, then i'll close it, log back in loot and get out, cause it's a laggy unresponsive watch me crash again if i don't leave quickly zone.

incase it helps, win 7 x64, core 2 quad q9400 4g ram, and an amd 5850, solid state drive.

[dougnugget]

Don't know if anyone else has had this but a few days ago, I was farming Tomb of the Shadow Knight E/H/N in a party on my TR Monk. We'd just completed the normal run and I commented that I'd already hit Rank 50 (mention this so you know I had checked my XP bar before the bug happened).

I then got stuck in the loading screen going out of catcombs lower explorer area (*not* the dungeon area). Had to shut down the DDO application and log back in.

When I logged back in, I wasn't Rank 50 anymore... I was Rank 49. It looked as though I'd lost all of my completion XP for the last run.

I'm not saying this to moan... with the new Bravery bonuses this isn't such a big deal... but I think that's got to be something other than just "lag".

- doug

[Riggs]

Monday night - elite big top, about midnight cst on Ghallanda.

Everyone dc'ed - at different times, over the course of 15 minutes. Several people dc'ed multiple times (me included).

Not sure if it is a 'lag related' issue - but it was pretty annoying.

[peetrs]

Choppy is good, 'hitches' , delay, pausing. More the symptom than a single term. QA does not pretend we know what is going on under the hood, more like this is what we see/hear and data points. So, you have pausing, but your connection is green, audio is ok, but spells are firing off 10 seconds late...that tells us a ton. I even listen to how my video cards fans and HDD are responding.Everything is a clue. I have hunches and theories of what it may be, but I leave it to the crazy coders to figure out the reality.

Ok, yesterday I did Tangleroot with full group. The run itself was just a nightmare, not that we couldn't do it, but each and every one of us got these hitches, most of time. In the end, we were there almost 3 hours and only approx. 30 minutes of that time was less laggy. In these 30 mins we could see our movements as fluent, but all actions took 2-3s delay.

What was happening:
- I wasn't able to run in straight line, was like 3 steps forward, pause, 3 steps forward, pause, etc.
- Some unknown Hobo run at me and start slashing my barb into pieces (I could see miss / hit messages), but when I attacked back nothing happened, sometimes nothing happened whole fight, sometime it got OK after few seconds.
- Few fight were completely without any numbers at all, but after few seconds (usual 15s+) all of sudden all numbers just popped all at once and I was dead, or hobs were.
- I pulled lever, I saw animation, but progress bar appeared 5s after animation finished.
- I recalled out of finished quest, progress bar popped 5-10s after I pressed RC button, when progress bar finished nothing happened, I have to wait another 10s to actually begun instance change (few guys got booted with Failed teleport messages).
- Everyone in group was warping through the quests, looked more like chess game, then fast pace fluent action.
- Most of time, chat seemed OK, but were few occasions when even the chat had 15s delay.
- One of Arties stood in traps in 7th part, but for 20s (he was trying to find the box) it didn't do anything to him, after that he was suddenly dead.

Before this run I did Siegebreaker on my Sorc and I experienced basically the same, everyone warping around and my favorite part of these lags... I could spam spell like a mad man, but everythingI got back was mana spent, no damage, no hits (even AoEs), just nothing.

This definitely wasn't network lag, because Mumble chat worked just fine and friend of mine who has different ISP said he experience exactly the same kind of hickups (we're talking about 2 biggest Czech ISPs here). More looked like overloaded server (or server running crappy code, chose yourself) which is not able to properly handle all requests and thus it causes delays.

Anyway, in current state, the game is unplayable so I guess was my mistake to subscribe in 1st place :( I'm asking myself why I'm always comming back to DDO just to see nothing has changed (in term of technical state of game)... aka VERY disappointed customer here.

[quijenoth]

Yesterday I was doing orchard slayers with a group and I noticed the "choppy" lag as well as the entire group. I reset and ported to Meridia to sell/repair. Meridia totally froze and I was running on the spot next to potion vendor for approximately 30 seconds. When I could move it was "choppy" for the next few minutes. In the end I teleported out of meridia to rejoin my group in orchard.

Cannith Server.

For the record someone mentioned the issue with swaping characters.

I often switched toons to craft/store specific items and found that the wheel on my mouse would stop responding (i couldnt zoom in and out on my character)after a few swaps (normally 4-5). I have been having PC issues lately and since memory is so **** cheap atm I upgraded from 4gig DDR3 to 8gig DDR3. I havent seen any improvements on the game or my PC (figuring it might be an issue with my chipset since it was pulled from the shelves in under a year) but I did notice I could now switch to more characters before the mouse wheel stopped responding (9-10). DDOs memory useage is huge btw - more than most modern games by a factor of 4 (tested with Portal 2 which was using 370MB while DDO would sit at 1.49 GIG!)

[Dragavon]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

A friend of mine says he got a lot better performance in DDO when he bought an SSD and installed the game on that.

Considering the nature of SSD in that fragmentation is not an issue on them then that might help you too?

[dunklezhan]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

I will do that for you, if you can do this for me:

Bang some heads together until there is a way to save the whole download CAB so that when I need to reinstall I don't have to pull down 5GB over my 2Mbps connection. That way, I don't have to wait two days before playing again. Alternatively/also, get the work done on the Dat defragger that exists for LOTRO, and convert it for DDO use. That way what I could do is just take a copy of the game before each update, defrag it, and be good to go if I need to replace my game files all of a sudden.

You arrange that for us Maj, and I will reinstall the game daily to keep you happy, ok?

Just an option when you first download that says 'create back up copy of install files Y/N?' and if Y, after you choose a location then from that point on, the full download files and all subsequent update files get copied off to that location before applying themselves to the main game.

That would be superawesome. While you're at it - same on Lammania. Thanks!


In other news - even playing from the UK, the only 'lag' I see with any regularity is DPS lag in raids, where when the raid boss drops the damage numbers continue scrolling for 30 seconds or so. I do get other kinds - latency, a little rubber banding, spells firing late/not at all etc- but they're not a massive issue, and they're not every day by any means.

So given my crappy ADSL line speed, I would tend to agree with the Major that this isn't network lag in the traditional sense, and something else is going on.

But I still want a way to reinstall without downloading everything again please!

[Targonis]

For SOME issues, it can be caused by your video card not having enough memory on it. This is something that some people just don't seem to understand, the NEED for enough memory on your video card. If you have integrated video, in many cases you are using main system memory, which is not nearly as fast as the memory on a video card.

Now, how this applies to DDO...DDO you may have noticed has quite a bit of detail in many environments. Loading the textures for these objects can take some time, and if you are using too high a graphics quality setting, it CAN cause some issues. DirectX 10 or 11 mode will make it worse.

One problem that DDO has is how many things are packaged in the files. Those huge files, most notably client_surface.dat and client_sound.dat are HUGE, and it can take some time to recover the required information out of them for what you happen to be doing. For years, I felt that these files should have been broken up into smaller pieces. If you have less than four gigs of RAM in your machine and you are still using a 32 bit version of Windows, that may be the main issue that is causing the problems.

And with all of this, a SSD drive will help because the time it takes to access the data is much lower. I have not noticed too many issues, but I am running a system with an AMD Phenom 2 955(quad core 3.2GHz processor) with 6GB of RAM(only DDR2 and not even great DDR2 memory), and a Radeon 4890 video card with 1GB on it(Thanks again Turbine), under Windows 7 64 bit. Yes, these specs are not amazing by any means these days, but if I don't run into most of the problems that some are reporting, it may be that your specs are well below what I have. One thing that is fairly unusual about my setup is that I am using a RAID 5 setup, with four 250GB drives using the RAID built into the motherboard. This DOES help on hard drive read performance and it isn't even GOOD RAID.


So, I hope that some of this helps. If you have an older machine running 32 bit Windows, going to 64 bit Windows alone might help, though it would require a clean Windows install to get there, and buying a new computer might make more sense than buying a 64 bit version of Windows 7 to install. Quad core does help over dual core, and a video card with at least 1GB of memory on it is clearly a good idea for any game playing. Lack of memory will mean you want to scale back on your graphics settings.

[SirShen]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

So r you saying each time we get an update we have to reinstall the game, just WOW i dont have todo that with other online games i play, like AoC, Rift, Guildwars. So why is it that we have todo it with this game?

[Victor_1]

Just had massive DC in Thelanis, so thought report about it.

Was playing The maze of Madness quest, 4-man group with 2 hireling.
Other than single player we lost connection to the server at same time, and everyone went back after 5-7min or so.

From what I could see in the chat channel, where Japanese players hang in, also reported massive disconnection.
Before this occur, I thought there were 60-70 player in that channel, after I coming back, there were only 25 people were left there.
Everyone talked about massive disconnection of players and people who DC'd couldn't able to re-connect for while.
I am not sure if this was connection route or server side problem. But I had similar disconnection in this time zone yesterday as well.
Hopefully you guys can track down the cause of this problem, if problem are on turbine side.

[parvo]

Once again today doing raids and the lag was just out of control. EVERYONE in the party in two different raids experience debilitating lag. When lag is to the point it makes the game unplayable it is unacceptable. This needs to be fixed. Please stop everything and fix the lag now. I don't care if this game gets new content. I don't care if you increase spell points by 2 for level 4 paladins. I don't care about the meaningless bug fixes that come out. What I do care about is the fact that the game is unplayable because of this insane lag that is getting worse with every patch/update.

another thread on lag (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=342302)

Apparently I'm going to have to go out and buy fraps or something to record all the lag sessions because nothing is getting done about it and you guys seem to have no idea how bad it really is. It's not just isolated cases, or me, or one other individual. It's everyone that's getting hit by it. I'm beyond frustrated and to the point where I'm considering dropping DDO and playing WoW or something, and I hate WoW with a passion. Seriously, this should be the #1 priority and nothing else should be done in the game until it's fixed.

I completely agree except, "When lag is to the point it makes the game unplayable it is unacceptable. This needs to be fixed." That should be, "When lag is to the point where it is noticeable, it is unacceptable. This needs to be fixed."

Server loads should be capped at a point before lag is noticeable. Free players should be booted to make room for those that pay. "Premium" players should be booted to make room for subscribers.

[Jaken]

DDO has always refused to listen to players' feedback. You guys better stop complaining before they either ban you or give you an infraction to keep you away from showing the truth to everyone else.

I am using Intel® HM67 Express Chipset (Intel® Core™ i7-2620M Processor 2.70 GHz), 8 GB DDR3 SDRAM, AMD Radeon™ HD 6650M*19 (1 GB DDR3) on a 200Mbps (fibre) internet speed, I still get dc and have to redo my quests all over again.

FYI, this piece of "junk" (if DDO insist my machine is a junk, just like everyone else) took me less than 8 seconds after selecting a server to load and start playing (moving around) on extreme maximum high graphics.

I have also just reinstalled DDO on that "junk" laptop running on low graphics now and its still the same.

There is definately no lag.

Its always the player fault.
You got to learn to swollow that in this game.
Get used to it. :p

[mystafyi]

Server loads should be capped at a point before lag is noticeable. Free players should be booted to make room for those that pay. "Premium" players should be booted to make room for subscribers.

hehe are you serious?

Fixing server side lag issues cost money and does not generate any short term cash influx. Likewise, fixing bugs does not generate short term income.

Turbine will focus on anything that generates income. ie, new content and ddostore items. Sorry folks, but this is the reality.

[stripe1001]

/signed

Yep. Lag has never been this bad. Love the game but how much money would you pay to be frustrated all the time. If anyone at Turbine is wondering about lagging VIP subs just point out this thread. I think it might be a good idea to have a QA dev run this game on a computer that matches the recommended specs from a Starbucks and not release the new content until he can run for at least 4 hrs without lag issues when testing. That is an honest test that will keep things like this from happening. It isn't that there is lag that irritates. It is that Turbine CREATES the lag when they release new content. I hate to say it but I dread update days because I know something will get screwed up(usually massive lag and a few conflicts) when they drop something new. The occasional oopsie is understandable and reasonable but this is happening everytime now. Some changes need to be made if mistakes show up everytime you do something. I restate that this is worst it has ever been. I can not run raids because it appear to be a suicide pact. Shame to love the game and still hate playing it isnt it

[DrDetroit]

While I melee with the Abbot the game turns into a slide show. Usually starts when the potato chips start flying off of him. Sometimes it is worse, others its better. I did not notice this in early September.

Last night in the Shroud the entire party would be attackig, the game would stop registering damage, then would have a spike and catch up. This was pretty consistent throughout the raid including the typical stop for chest looting.

[leadhead]

Choppy is good, 'hitches' , delay, pausing. More the symptom than a single term. QA does not pretend we know what is going on under the hood, more like this is what we see/hear and data points. So, you have pausing, but your connection is green, audio is ok, but spells are firing off 10 seconds late...that tells us a ton. I even listen to how my video cards fans and HDD are responding.Everything is a clue. I have hunches and theories of what it may be, but I leave it to the crazy coders to figure out the reality.

Perhaps this will help also...

I play with two accounts so my kid and I were playing yesterday. Partied up. The problem only happened in quests, but there would be several second pauses then everything would be fine for several seconds. In combat, our weapons would not swing or shoot and no damage was being applied. The odd thing is that NPC enemies would still come at you and swing their weapons but no damage was being done.

In contrast to other times playing this game where every once in a while you get a small patch of actual lag where your character actually swings a weapon several times and no damage is applied for 1 to 2 seconds then the floaty number come spewing out the top of an NPC character's head very rapidly to "catch up" with real time.

In this situation yesterday, when your character came out of the "pause" weapon damage was being applied as if you just swung your weapon. Meaning there was no damage number catchup like in usual lag situations.


The first time I have seen this happen like this was yesterday and never at any other time.

We play on Cannith. the timeframe we played last night was 7:00 to 9:00 pm EST. Our two characters are named Tripillian and Drolmn if you need to pick it out of a log or something. We were doing the coin lords quests in the Market place saving the two brothers on elite...it happened big time in that quest. Then we went to do that other quest in the market place...the level 5 timed mission to beat the hobgoblin invasion force...I forget the names of the quests.

[Produktion_Malphunktion]

I did a complete reinstall 2 days ago. before update 11.1 i never had "lag" issues so to speak (infact this is probably pay back cause i used to laugh at those who did)

Now i'm randomly noticing that my cpu usage will be spiking to the point it makes the client completely unresponsive.

Places where i know i can replicate this and crash every time.

Tower of despair cave entrance.

Epic devil assault - fine during the quest, once we've completed though and the chests are being looted I've watched my cpu usage spike, client hang, then i'll close it, log back in loot and get out, cause it's a laggy unresponsive watch me crash again if i don't leave quickly zone.

incase it helps, win 7 x64, core 2 quad q9400 4g ram, and an amd 5850, solid state drive.

Awesome thanks.

[mystafyi]

I am using Intel® HM67 Express Chipset (Intel® Core™ i7-2620M Processor 2.70 GHz), 8 GB DDR3 SDRAM, AMD Radeon™ HD 6650M*19 (1 GB DDR3) on a 200Mbps (fibre) internet speed, I still get dc and have to redo my quests all over again.

FYI, this piece of "junk" (if DDO insist my machine is a junk, just like everyone else) took me less than 8 seconds after selecting a server to load and start playing (moving around) on extreme maximum high graphics.


Nonono, you need to reinstall ddo everytime you play. :)

[Produktion_Malphunktion]

I will do that for you, if you can do this for me:

Bang some heads together until there is a way to save the whole download CAB so that when I need to reinstall I don't have to pull down 5GB over my 2Mbps connection. That way, I don't have to wait two days before playing again. Alternatively/also, get the work done on the Dat defragger that exists for LOTRO, and convert it for DDO use. That way what I could do is just take a copy of the game before each update, defrag it, and be good to go if I need to replace my game files all of a sudden.

You arrange that for us Maj, and I will reinstall the game daily to keep you happy, ok?

Just an option when you first download that says 'create back up copy of install files Y/N?' and if Y, after you choose a location then from that point on, the full download files and all subsequent update files get copied off to that location before applying themselves to the main game.

That would be superawesome. While you're at it - same on Lammania. Thanks!





We wish for that too, and there is something in it's infancy at work.

[Produktion_Malphunktion]

I completely agree except, "When lag is to the point it makes the game unplayable it is unacceptable. This needs to be fixed." That should be, "When lag is to the point where it is noticeable, it is unacceptable. This needs to be fixed."

Server loads should be capped at a point before lag is noticeable. Free players should be booted to make room for those that pay. "Premium" players should be booted to make room for subscribers.

Server loads ARE capped at a point before latency lag is noticeable. <snark response about how long we have been running services removed> Server load is NOT the issue here.

[The_Rev09]

I've done guild raids and pugs, but this was my first experience with lag death. I was on Sarlona, doing Cannith slayers, all by my lonesome facing three constructs, and lagged to death.... same PC, same settings, same everything I've had for the past year with no issues whatsoever. Weird, man..... :confused:

[mystafyi]

get the work done on the Dat defragger that exists for LOTRO, and convert it for DDO use. That way what I could do is just take a copy of the game before each update, defrag it, and be good to go if I need to replace my game files all of a sudden.

the lotro datdefrag tool works fine for ddo if you swap the datexport.dll file with the one from lotro. a year ago it worked fine without having to swap the datexport file, but someone at turbine fiddled around with ddo so it no longer works with the new dll.

[Produktion_Malphunktion]

So r you saying each time we get an update we have to reinstall the game, just WOW i dont have todo that with other online games i play, like AoC, Rift, Guildwars. So why is it that we have todo it with this game?

No shen, I'm looking for data points to help me nail down the issue, I'm not telling you to do anything.

[stockwizard5]

All I have to do is active MaelsWraith's Vile Blasphemy Clicky (My standard gloves are GS SP/CHA, F/P, SP/CHA) to bring the game to halt for around 5 seconds every time. The situation makes no difference (quest, market, party, solo, raid, mobs, no mobs, new client, old client)!

[smatt]

No shen, I'm looking for data points to help me nail down the issue, I'm not telling you to do anything.

As I said, I preemptively DL'd a new client install on Sunday morning. BTW, I couldn't get the fileshare zip to work right, it came through corrupt. So I fell into the Pando abyss :(.... In any case... It didn't help in my case.

I've been watching to see if I can pin point triggering actions. At this poitn it seems to be very uneven... It can get really bad even when solo in a quest with no active mobs, summons or anything else. As others have noted, anythign to do with the UMD skill, any chage that effects that skill, such as changing an item, or a buff that changes your UMD skill modifier, definately causes a huge spike. I've noticed having Arti-dogs in party causes some stutter, as well as summoned Air ellies. Although, my experience with the summons is limited since I despise them most of the time for so many obvious reasons ;) We need a required "Summons licensing quest", I'm tellin' ya... It's like drving in Cali when it rains around these servers with all these people using summons that don't have a clue about how they affect mob actions etc.
Another thing I've noticed that causes this stutter to be more pronounced, are aura type spells. These are a couple of the things I can say, at least on my side that have been more pronounced since U 11.

[ckorik]

The only thing that I've been able to replicate with any reliability is in the shroud. Long ago (in DDO terms) when you finished a section of the Shroud you got major lag when everyone ran to the chest to loot.

You guys made changes (around the same time you opened up the bandwidth cap) and that lag went away.

That lag is back - ran the shroud 6 times over the past week ... and in every case as soon as the party ran to the chests you got lag. Real lag as in 'green network... everything fine - but rubberbanding and standing in place'

Once people got to the chest and opened it - things go back to normal until the next chest.

This had gone away and is now back.

[mystafyi]

as well as summoned Air ellies.

I to have noticed something strange with air ele summons since the update. Sadly I cant be fekked to troubleshoot this issue for turbine. since U11 I have lost the desire to play as much. Vent chatter is full of "whats the next game we should all migrate too"

[smatt]

I to have noticed something strange with air ele summons since the update. Sadly I cant be fekked to troubleshoot this issue for turbine. since U11 I have lost the desire to play as much. Vent chatter is full of "whats the next game we should all migrate too"


I'm in the same boat... U 11 ME took the wind out of my DDO sails to some extent... The UI changes, the extreme increase in LAG, or whatever the techies want to call it. The oft ignored VERY long list of extreme bugs that make it through or manifest on the live servers with the *We might or might not fix it *Soon tag. The idea in the PRODUCERS heads, that somehow things like the "Cool underwater combat" will placate the masses over the above issues. Heck, I may fall over from a epileptic seizure any minute from the flash of new and oh so fricken awesome global cool down flash, and I'm not even an epileptic... I don't even want to get into my issues with the Arti class.

[BurnerD]

We appreciate your efforts Major. This type of communication is a big positive in getting issues fixed.

Thank You

[Pape_27]

I would like to chime in about the lag, and the fact that something needs to be done about it.

two major instances within the past week. The first being in VoD. Like always it centers on the spawning of the orthons. The first time they came, it was just massive. I was frozen in place for about 15 seconds, moved a little bit then was frozen again until the group was able to kill about half of them. Same thing at the next spawn, but this time the lag delay was even worse, closer to 30 seconds of frozen screen.

The second was in VoN 5. It wasnt a spawn related issue. It just seemed like everything was playing about 5 seconds behind. Trying to turn the puzzle pieces was aggravating at best.

Anyone care to share as to how to make a video of a quest? It would be nice to film the lag incidents so the devs could have an idea of how bad it actually can be.

and please turbine, make fixing the lag a priority. Please.


edit: this occurred on the Cannith Server fwiw

[smatt]

Server loads ARE capped at a point before latency lag is noticeable. <snark response about how long we have been running services removed> Server load is NOT the issue here.


Are you sure? OK, so I'm nto a techie... Nor do I have a clue how your system splits instances to various individual servers..... But it seems, that if I'm in say an Epic DQ and I see a few other gorups at the quest entrance going in at the same time, there is a very notiable spike in the amount of lag, or lag like issues within the raid group I'm in.

[dredre9987]

Had this happen to me a few updates back. Had reinstalled and ended up using Pando. ( weird lag ) Closed everything on my comp, uninstalled Pando media booster, and "lag" went away. Also stopped cpu spikes.

[smatt]

Had this happen to me a few updates back. Had reinstalled and ended up using Pando. ( weird lag ) Closed everything on my comp, uninstalled Pando media booster, and "lag" went away. Also stopped cpu spikes.


Oh Pando goes as soon as DL is done... I hate file sharing for oh so many reasons... I also hate useless **** such as Pando like programs on my "puter"...

[Darkrok]

This is an...odd...data point but since you're asking for it I'll toss it out there.

I'm getting, for lack of a better term, jump lag. When I jump the game will stutter badly. If I do the same quest without jumping the client runs completely smoothly. Add in one jump, and it stutters again. Tested this in many quests - doesn't seem to be related to which quest at all. Sometimes the stuttering is less noticeable but it's always there.

This is definitely not an ideal rig. Not terrible but not my main computer either (that one's in the shop atm). I wouldn't mention it except that I haven't really seen anyone else bring it up and thought that maybe there's something to it.

[Cauthey]

Last night, from about 9PM-11:30PM Eastern on Orien:

Got loaded up and partied with guild. Ran Relic of the Soverign Past, and it ran as smooth as a purring kitten. After that, we made our way to Diplomatic Impunity (probably 10PMish?). Loaded into the quest. Buffed. As soon as we saw the scorpions there at the start, the lag (rubberbanding, staggering around, mob hits rolling all at once with no time to respond or heal) was unplayable.

My going theory is that you guys run all of these dungeon instances on virtual servers. Sometimes you load into a quest, and you're just fine. Other times, you get "stuck" on one of the sour virtual servers, and you're totally hosed. The reasoning for this theory is the whole "fine in one quest, and completely unplayable in the next."

Since this is my going theory, we all recalled out of Diplomatic Impunity, broke party, formed back up, and tried the quest again (hoping to get assigned to a virtual server that wasn't limping like a chunked up leper).

The lag (rubberbanding, staggering around, mob hits rolling all at once with no time to respond or heal) was a little better, but still unplayable. So, we abandoned Diplomatic Impunity all together.

This "lag" seemed to persist into the The Twelve, and into The Marketplace. From there, we went to the Demon Sands, and ran Maraud The Mines. No "lag" problems out in the desert slayer area or in the quest.

For what it's worth, we also saw something EXTREMELY ODD just as we were getting started. Two in the guild party ended up getting lagged (couldn't move or tumble) really bad - I believe that one was stuck in the loading screen. For the rest of the party, it appeared that they had lost connection or logged off. Their names on the UI went gray, messages in the chat log showing both friend and guildie had logged off. BUT - THE TWO WERE STILL CHATTING WITH US. Their names turned green when they keyed their mics, and we heard them clear as a bell. Eventually, their connections were forced closed, much in the fashion described by Green/Yellow/Red with the Zone-Out Bug (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=337672).

Later, after "Guild Night" was over, a couple of us joined a Shroud (11:30PM, or so). The lag (rubberbanding, pausing, mobs teleporting around and spells not firing) was absolutely crippling. Arguably, it was unplayable. However, we were able to complete the raid. Someone actually died in Part 1 as a result of about a 10 second pause that prevented movement, heals, spells, etc.

Maj, thanks for taking this info and making the Devs fix this!! :D

[LeslieWest_GuitarGod]

I always ignore these lag threads since I think they are always exaggerated, or unique to just the person posted (because he doesn't know how to make proper adjustments).

However, last night for the first time, I had to drop my setting from very high to medium just to run a few desert quests. It would freeze every 3 secs rendering it impossible to play.

I will test again on very high tonight to see if it was just that occasion.

[Cauthey]

Server loads ARE capped at a point before latency lag is noticeable. <snark response about how long we have been running services removed> Server load is NOT the issue here.

You're ABSOLUTELY certain?

Whatever the environment - is it possible to measure instance count and hardware load metrics from one server to the next? Because the off-again on-again nature of this lag (staggering around rubberbanding, spells not landing, etc.) makes me think of something in the environment that is not congruent.

[sammael666]

People, please don't let the devs influence you into believeing the lag is caused on your end. This; dear Turbine; say what you may is lag on your end, on your servers. I'm not a total idiot and I know limits of my HW and if I have game running at stable 40-60fps, with green latency display around 100ms and everything is just rubberbanding and happening 5-10seconds later (or not happening at all, but using sp of course) you are NOT gonna convince me the lag is on my end no matter what you say.

Regarding last suggestion, I did clean installs of DDO so many times I can safely tell you it will NOT solve the lag on YOUR servers. If you provide an reliable installation method without forcing me to install malware (because thats what pando is, it installs ddo and then it sits in memory sucking on my bandwidth) I might give it another reinstall but I can already tell you nothing I do on my computer will solve problems on your computers, get it ?

[Cauthey]

I always ignore these lag threads since I think they are always exaggerated, or unique to just the person posted (because he doesn't know how to make proper adjustments).

However, last night for the first time, I had to drop my setting from very high to medium just to run a few desert quests. It would freeze every 3 secs rendering it impossible to play.

I will test again on very high tonight to see if it was just that occasion.

See? You have trouble in the Demon Sands. Me and my guildies don't. It's dramatically hit and miss. I get virtual server A, and it's okay. You get virtual server B, and everything is poo poo. Maybe there's someone crafting on your virtual server B, or running up some Dungeon Alert - but gameplay experiences here are dramatically incongruent.

[darksol23]

I would like to chime in about the lag, and the fact that something needs to be done about it.

two major instances within the past week. The first being in VoD. Like always it centers on the spawning of the orthons. The first time they came, it was just massive. I was frozen in place for about 15 seconds, moved a little bit then was frozen again until the group was able to kill about half of them. Same thing at the next spawn, but this time the lag delay was even worse, closer to 30 seconds of frozen screen.

The second was in VoN 5. It wasnt a spawn related issue. It just seemed like everything was playing about 5 seconds behind. Trying to turn the puzzle pieces was aggravating at best.

Anyone care to share as to how to make a video of a quest? It would be nice to film the lag incidents so the devs could have an idea of how bad it actually can be.

and please turbine, make fixing the lag a priority. Please.


edit: this occurred on the Cannith Server fwiw


I made a 1080p video of "Cannith Lag 2011: The ToD Edition" with FRAPS last night. As soon as I figure out how to merge the parts and post them somewhere I will. I'm not exactly part of the "youtube generation", so that might take a day to so...

At one point you can literally count to three or four slowly between the time my character drinks a potion (is player activated) and the time the game applies the affect (curse goes away) and the same of Lay on Hands, which once upon a time was an instant use ability not a five second cast time. Likewise for all ability activations, spells, potions, item swaps, etc etc... It was also fun to pretend your an astronaut last night and just jump and see how long you could hang in the air. :)

CPU: Core 2 Quad Q9550
RAM: 8GB
Video: Dual nVidia GTX460's
Sound: Asus Xonar
Drive Layout: 2 x 1TB Mirrored SATA OS & Program Files etc, 2 x 2 TB Mirrored SATA - Storage drives, including FRAPS write directory, 500GB SATA Primary DDO Install, 500GB SATA Secondary DDO Installs & Other Game Files
Connection: 18mbps AT&T Uverse, Typically < 50msec latency 0% loss in DDO according to the green connection icon, even during the lagging instances.
OS: Windows 7 x64

[katz]

have no idea if this means anything, or if it's coincidence, or what...but... post U11 horrible horrible lag... rubberbanding, wading thru pudding, several second delay on spells... etc. you get the picture. same symptoms complained about by everyone in group. actually failed a shroud due to nothing more than lag. i shelf the healer and slog thru lowbie quests.

the forums go down. a day or so later i realize "hey, there's not much lag at all :eek: " there's still occasional spikes, and minimal rubberbanding, but gameplay is mostly smooth.

last night, i take the healer out of mothballs and run a reavers fate. all of a sudden, mid raid, BOOM. UBEROMGWT*BBQLAG. whole raid wipes (everyone experienced lag, i completely froze. took a full minute from the time someone else said "FAIL" marking when we all died, for me to register that i (and everyone else) died). lag sorta clears and we go again, and are successful. there is intermittent thick rubbery lag all the rest of the evening. husband jokes "forums must be back up"

i check this morning, and sure enough....

:confused: :eek: :(


if you need to know, my rig is a 2.4G AMD Phenom quad-core with 4gigs RAM with an ATI Radeon HD 4300 series (i forget exact model, but i know it has at least a full gig of it's own onboard RAM) running windows 7 32 bit.

[Caliban]

This is an...odd...data point but since you're asking for it I'll toss it out there.

I'm getting, for lack of a better term, jump lag. When I jump the game will stutter badly. If I do the same quest without jumping the client runs completely smoothly. Add in one jump, and it stutters again. Tested this in many quests - doesn't seem to be related to which quest at all. Sometimes the stuttering is less noticeable but it's always there.

This is definitely not an ideal rig. Not terrible but not my main computer either (that one's in the shop atm). I wouldn't mention it except that I haven't really seen anyone else bring it up and thought that maybe there's something to it.

I experience this same thing - the game stutters mid-jump almost every time, especially when I'm trying to jump up or down on something. Makes it hard to time jumps properly.

[AnYtHiNg23]

I'd just like to throw in my 2pence worth here - I play from Viet Nam (I am English though and have played MMO's since Ultima Online) - I have occasional minor Lag - nothing that really stands out...apart from at the following times.

1. Using the Cannith Crafting - either of the 5 machines will lag me 10-15 seconds.

2. PUGing with people in the US - I have many friends that play from the UK (and many friends that play here in Asia) but I only seem to get Lag when grouping from people in the US (not mini lag - major Lag as in 2-3minute lag)

So, in order for MY gaming experience to be as Lag-less as possible I take the following steps...

1. No more Cannith Crafting

2. and No more PUGing with people in the States.

...and my game play is pretty much Lag-free.

I have noticed an issue which i don't believe has been bought up before and that is WINDOWS 7.

Up until a few weeks ago, I was playing on an XP Home Laptop and never had any problems with it at all (lag or otherwise).
Now I have a new laptop running WIN7 (and DX11) and DDO looks awesome, apart from it just crashes every now and then.
My aforementioned friends that play from the UK and Asia mostly use WIN7 'pooters and they too occasionally just drop out of the game, usually whilst zoning.

I know that DDO was developed before WIN7, perhaps that could be an unexpected issue (as someone has mentioned an extremely high CPU usage) or maybe its the High Definition version that's causing problems.

Either way, there is an issue somewhere and it needs to be looked at.

(If it matters I am running AMD Phenom II Quad Core N970 32Bit, ATI Radeon HD5650 2Gb, 4GB DDR Ram with a 15.6 16:9 High Def LCD with Windows 7 and DX11)

[LeslieWest_GuitarGod]

See? You have trouble in the Demon Sands. Me and my guildies don't. It's dramatically hit and miss. I get virtual server A, and it's okay. You get virtual server B, and everything is poo poo. Maybe there's someone crafting on your virtual server B, or running up some Dungeon Alert - but gameplay experiences here are dramatically incongruent.

Im quite aware of that. My concern wasnt only because of my lag, but the number of different people I know, and read online that have been having trouble the last few days. As an original beta tester for DDO, I thank you for your concern (and neg rep). :cool:

[Cauthey]

Not me, Mississippee! :D

[Synnestar35791]

is severely effected by this.
Lower end is mildly effected, but WOW is it nuts.
Ran Lordsmarch chain yesterday, first quest was fine, second quest behaved like the whole world had just logged on, the third (Eyes of Stone) , this one was sadly comical, during the palace cleansing portion-second floor, we'd step to a doorway, and were moving in that choppy stop/start style (like freeway traffic at peak rush hour) with severe delays in action sequences, and when game catches up to computer in-home it's a party wipe.....
Droaam & Windlasher casters had cast us to death b4 the data even made to our homes......

I'd type (What The Hell) here, but I already know, LAGG Monster again, I'm about sick of it really, and there is no fix to it as the Internet traffic & server communication speed pertain directly to the capabilities of SERVICE PROVIDERS bandwidth and the amount of traffic, I'm of the opinion DDO/Turbine are NOT going to be able to address THAT...

[somenewnoob]

Last couple elite DQ's I've run have been complete lag cluster effs on Cannith. Virtually unplayable, only completed with a combination of luck, dots and overgeared toons.

Just a complete mess.

[PestWulf]

Yes we play. No I do not have ' lag'. BUT I suspect what you guys call lag, I call other things. I can say I see no traditional Lag as in Latency issues. I'm not rubber-banding, or being halted and having to catch up with the world. Yes I'm playing from home. I have witnessed with my own two eyeballs some of what is being complained about. There is something, odd, going on, some strange database call or something going on. It is being investigated, and it is a top priority of QA/DEV. I know it stinks.

What do you call that pause every 4 seconds in the Necropolis part 2, Shadow Crypt? I know it's not lag as it happens every 4 seconds methodically and has done it for years.

Just curious what QA speak is for that.

[GoldyGopher]

I have three computers I play DDO on in my house, a laptop (Intel Core Duo 3.1Ghz, 4 GB RAM, 125 GB Solid State Drive, Windows 7 – 64 bit, Symantec End-point Anti-Virus, and Ventrillo), a Workstation (Intel Quad Core 3.2 GHz, 4 GB RAM, 150GB Solid State Drive (plus a SATA drive), 2GB Video Memory, Windows 7 – 64 bit, Symantec End-point Anti-Virus and Ventrillo), and a high end game station that is better than five 9s of people on the list with an intel i5 2.6 GHz, 8 GB RAM, RAID 0+1 solid state Drive 100 GB, 3 GB of Video Memory, Windows 7 – 64 Bit, Norton Anti-Virus Gamers Edition, and Ventrillo).

On all three computers I regularly uninstall the game and reinstall from scratch, defrag the hard-drives at least once a week, and make sure all drivers and software are patched and current.

At home I have a 50Mbps down and 10Mbps up Cable modem connection (there has been some issues with people driving over the local point of presence (the mini green obelisk at the corner, behind a tree, hidden by bushes) but that was over last winter and my issues have occurred since basically launch.
My latency is generally less than 35 ms and I have yet to see packets lost.

My characters where or use a variety of gear including random loot drops, raid gear, raid crafted items and cannith crafted items.

On all three computers I see what I can only call lag and what is surprising I see virtually the same types of symptoms on all three computers.

On both the workstation and high end game station my first 8 or so load screens are painful, I mean up to three minutes long. This is a constant issue, makes no difference where my characters are going and which zones I am entering. If I change characters I see the same issue usually it affects fewer load screens.

On all three workstations I see unplayable response time in the Sands of Menechtarun as long as I am in a group. Solo the problem is close to non-existent, there is the occasional stutter during movement however when you add players with questionable connectivity I am constantly rubber-banding, spells take 10 or more seconds to go off, players tell me I am dead 30 seconds or MORE in Ventrillo before I see it on screen. This problem only affects my gameplay constantly in the Sands of Menechtarun Adventure Area and occasionally in the quests within that same Adventure Pack (did everyone get that deathward?). As I have said it this particular zone, others complain about similar issues with Gianthold and occasionally I hear rumblings about the Vale of Twilight and the Subterrain, but I have NEVER (bolded for emphasis) seen anything like what I see in the Sands. What gets me is I see it on all three of my current computers and every computer I have played upon since launch of that Module. The joke was you had to carry my stones to the quest and rez my characters at the entrance because there was no way to make it out there. Now I either run solo before hand or after in an effort to keep ship buffs.

I see stuttering (or herky jerk movement) of my characters in Raid Zones IF another player has connectivity issues, and since we have a guildie with said connectivity issues. The big problem is when you are casting something (Cure/Heal) spell that affects their characters you better have 10 seconds to spare and heaven help you if it is a mass heal. On a similar note when people disconnect or reconnect I see huge lag spikes where my characters may be unplayable up to 15 seconds right after the event.

I see stop motion movement when someone opens a chest, and occasionally I know when someone is equipping an item that changes their UMD skill. I fall through or see characters fall through the bridge to the left in second part of Waterworks and the bridge in Vault of Night.

[ushram]

Monday night - elite big top, about midnight cst on Ghallanda.

Everyone dc'ed - at different times, over the course of 15 minutes. Several people dc'ed multiple times (me included).

Not sure if it is a 'lag related' issue - but it was pretty annoying.

Big top right now is a whole other story, crazy crashes / dc since U11, this was happening around U9 iirc, its totally broken atm. I was farming the base items for epic about 25 runs or so and prob crashed a total of 50 times (est) , other guild members that i would pull in for the chests would crash an avg of 2 times on the way to the chest, made me feel like throwing on some 3 stooge music while i watched their dots on the map.


[QUOTE=MajMalphunktion;4131451]So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.[/QUOTE

Sadly this is what i have had to do for the past 5 updates in DDO, each time there is an update, i will DL DDO again.

Around U8 it was so bad, whenever i went to the MP or Sands or Sub i would crash or lag like crazy. I used to use Teleport to avoid MP at all costs. Right before U8 i had used the original CD for DDO I got when it launched and it was just unbearable. So after U8 I reinstalled using DDO DL'd directly from Turbine. The game worked flawlessly.

Reinstall, seems the only way to fix the lag / crashes after each update. Even after reinstalling for U11 I am still getting some lag issues though.

Edit, a lot of the lag i get now seems to be when switching weapons, using SLA, switching gear or anything from the shortcut bar. Every time I cast the PM SLAs I will pause while in auto run then it will skip to where i "should" be.

[LordPiglet]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

I used that unapproved dat file defragment tool. It gave a serious improvement to my swapping in items I was going to UMD, use clickies, etc. I only see the stutter if I've swapped toons a bunch, but the first or second toon I load has a lot fewer issues.

[Musouka]

What do you call that pause every 4 seconds in the Necropolis part 2, Shadow Crypt? I know it's not lag as it happens every 4 seconds methodically and has done it for years.

Just curious what QA speak is for that.

Probably a load issue. Much like before multi-core processors came out for PCs, certain processes would just dominate the processor for a while, and freezes up everything else.

[GoldyGopher]

I have had a pugger comment "I only see Lag when I am running with a bunch of TRs or min maxed geared to the hilt characters."

So I wonder if the varying level of DPS in party make a difference?

[cdr]

What do you call that pause every 4 seconds in the Necropolis part 2, Shadow Crypt? I know it's not lag as it happens every 4 seconds methodically and has done it for years.

Just curious what QA speak is for that.

Not everyone has this issue (I never have), but a lot of people do.

There's a graphics setting that you can disable that resolves the issue for most if not all people that have it - I believe it's "Advanced Graphics" -> "Stencil Shadows" -> "Disabled", but I can't remember for sure.

[PestWulf]

Probably a load issue. Much like before multi-core processors came out for PCs, certain processes would just dominate the processor for a while, and freezes up everything else.

I'm wondering why it is specific to this dungeon. Everyone I have ever played with has the exact same issue in that dungeon. From the time you step in to the time you leave, the game pauses for 1 second out of every 4 seconds on the dot. I am wondering since this has been happening since this dungeon came online, if perhaps it may hold a clue as to what is popping up everywhere else. It is something they should be able to reproduce 100% of the time. I say that because I have never met anyone in game that has played that dungeon and not experienced the 4 second stutter issue.

A load issue is something I attribute to an individual machine or setup, unless you are meaning that the load module of that particular dungeon is just bugged?

I'm guessing QA calls this a "pause" but I'm not sure anymore when they tell me lag isn't lag..maybe pausing isn't pausing. If speaking more clearly to them assists in any way possible to resolve the degradation of game play that has happened in the last couple of months...I'll be happy to learn how to speak differently to them.

[Missing_Minds]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

So please tell us what Executive producer you need ______ so we players can get a tool that will defragment the files.

[noneill]

I see lag in TOD, the cannith crafting station, shroud.

I used to have frequent crashing on zone in, the desert, orchard a lot.

I reformatted my second HD and put Windows 7 64 on it. On drive 1 I downloaded a new high res client. Then rebooted into the frest OS on drive 2. I installed DDO there along with my logitech drivers, video drivers etc. No antivirus, nothing else. I just boot to that to play DDO, never open a browser (for real or ingame). I have not crashed once since I did this on July 27th. Still have lag at the above places though.

Playing on a dedicated DDO OS/HD has made it much better and more enjoyable but it did not totally cure lag problem and I should not have to go to such extreme lengths.

I have a ridiculously fast FIOS connection and am only about 30 miles from Turbine's HQ. I see they moved to Needham now, I went to High School practically around the corner from them.

Anyway Maj, this is not the most detailed technical information, I am at work and don't have all the specs on my rig handy but the bottom line is the clean install and dedicated OS cured my crashes but not the "lag".

Oh, and go Pats :D

[stainer]

Maj,

Is the client that you guys (Devs, QA) use on your personal machines any different from our client? Does it have any features, and I mean any at all, that are different than ours?

I hear you when you say that you don't experience the same issues as we do, but there should be a reason for that.

[GrampaBill]

Server loads ARE capped at a point before latency lag is noticeable. <snark response about how long we have been running services removed> Server load is NOT the issue here.

But which type of server load are you referring to here? There are at least 3 types of load that are involved with serving a game such as this:

1) CPU. My guess is that this is what you are referring to, but not sure. This can easily be measured and that's why I think you can be so sure.
2) Bandwidth load. This could likely be measured as well at least at the NIC level but likely at the switch level as well.
3) Disk load. This is my guess as the problem and since I don't know what O/S the servers run, I can't opine as to how well you can measure the load. In the higher mid-range machines I earn a living working with, they have a screen that shows disk load.

As I stated previously in this chain, my bet is that you are disk load/activity constrained and can't keep up with all of the db scan activity necessary to run the game. If the justification were an attempt to narrow down the response problems many are having, I'd think it'd be agreeable to shut down Cannith crafting for a day to gauge the effect on the populous.

[smatt]

Maj,

Is the client that you guys (Devs, QA) use on your personal machines any different from our client? Does it have any features, and I mean any at all, that are different than ours?

I hear you when you say that you don't experience the same issues as we do, but there should be a reason for that.


I would hope that he would DL a normal everyday client, just like we all do, have it update to the current live build just as we do.

[stainer]

I would hope that he would DL a normal everyday client, just like we all do, have it update to the current live build just as we do.

It wouldn't bother me if they did use a different client. What does bother me is they (QA, Devs) do not see the same issues as we do some of time. There hasn't been a reasonable explanation for this.

[Jastron]

I'm with Grampabill on this one. I had difficulty moving items into my shared bank yesterday around 10:30 PM EDT on Sarlona, otherwise the game was fine. It's as if the database servers or SAN are I/O constrained in some way. That could even be the connectivity to the SAN is saturated, although the disks themselves might not be taxed. It appeared to be a similar issue to what occurs around 7 AM EDT daily on Sarlona with using banks or mail. That might be different from the stop and go lag folks have in quests. In any event, hopefully SIG is looking into it :-)

[SirValentine]

Server loads ARE capped at a point before latency lag is noticeable. <snark response about how long we have been running services removed> Server load is NOT the issue here.


Well, I don't know about "latency lag" per se, but bad lag (or "unresponsiveness", or whatever) in Epic Zawabi's Revenge seems (subjectively, to me) much worse during prime time than mid-day. I've had plenty of easy completions lately on mid-day runs, but with evening runs wiping or near-wiping due to mass cures just not going off (or going off 10+ seconds too late to be helpful). I was blaming server load. If I'm wrong, I'd be happy to have a better explanation.

[smatt]

It wouldn't bother me if they did. What does bother me is they (QA, Devs) do not see the same issues as we do some of time. There hasn't been a reasonable explanation for this.


Maj has said he's noticed some things playing at home that appear to be what some of us are talking about. But I agree, it's strange that often times they don't see what so many players with systems all up and down the scale see.... Example, back when the Shroud DPS debate was going on..... There of course many more as you know/

Heck, I'm still confused as to why they refuse to test updates on a REAL live server, with no fancy stuff like Lama or their in house servers, of course the load wouldn't be the same, but at least the software on both sides would be.... But I'm not a Game Dev so....


I know there's server side borkage, over and above my own and others system/connection limitations. It seems to be more than 1 particular thing, but could be a bunch of symptoms tied to one thing. The idea that it's possible how the instancing system is assigning the individual instances, and there's something going on more often on those particular machines that's causing it to be more prevailant seems to be a good shot. Or perhaps the quests like DQ, Shroud, Sins of Attrition which seem to have huge problems, have some common mechanic in the scripting that's getting caught up. I also go back to what I've said for the past few weeks about the party members in your group sharing their lag. Goldy's post above shows and example of this.... For some reason the individual clients are sharing more information again, and waiting for shared responses. Remember this has been an off and on problem for a long time since mass buffs and heals became more frequint, and POSSIBLY could have something to do with the new UI and how that information is being shared back and forth with aura's such as the clerics healing aura... Which I most certainly notice to play a part in a more lag , for lack of a better term, type enviroment. I bring up the new UI because that is something that has changed and is new, and that client comm was most certainly a problem in the past. But it doesn't explain why I get this odd new performance issue when soloing, although never as bad as it is when in party.

In any case.... I'm not a computer tech...... Push on button.. Work darn it... That's how it should be :D

Just throwing darts at the wall.... :o

[PestWulf]

Not everyone has this issue (I never have), but a lot of people do.

There's a graphics setting that you can disable that resolves the issue for most if not all people that have it - I believe it's "Advanced Graphics" -> "Stencil Shadows" -> "Disabled", but I can't remember for sure.

Interesting. This is the first I've heard or read about there being any way to avoid this lag/pause/whatever thing.

[smatt]

Well, I don't know about "latency lag" per se, but bad lag (or "unresponsiveness", or whatever) in Epic Zawabi's Revenge seems (subjectively, to me) much worse during prime time than mid-day. I've had plenty of easy completions lately on mid-day runs, but with evening runs wiping or near-wiping due to mass cures just not going off (or going off 10+ seconds too late to be helpful). I was blaming server load. If I'm wrong, I'd be happy to have a better explanation.


Life in DDO has ALWAYS been a problem at U.S. primetime, at least since I started in late 2006... 7-12PM EST.... No matter what they say, load IS a problem.... Either that or the hamsters are rotating in and out for dinner breaks... :eek::o

[Noelemahc]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

I've done this already as well as full maintenance on my pc, etc. I run DDO on 2 different pcs. I've run it on separate networks. I had my isp come out and redo all the lines in my house, got new modem, router, and everything else they can possible do. I experience lag every day in DDO ONLY. I do not have issues with anything else I run at all, just DDO. So I find it hard to believe that it's always my PC or it's my network, especially when everyone I know is experiencing the same thing I am on a daily basis.

Yesterday was by far the WORST day of playing this game since I started over 2 years ago. It was lag constantly all day long. Some points in the day were completely unplayable. It wasn't just me either. Everyone was commenting in the CannithTrade chat channel about it. Everyone in my guild experienced it, my tr experienced it, etc.

I couldn't swap items because I'd click them and nothing would happen. All spells were on a 6 second delay or longer. Abilities were put on cool down but not actually going off. I was being rubber banded back, running in place, unable to move, get stuck in the air all while mobs were attacking me. There were points where I was completely helpless because I could not move but obviously mobs still can. I would swing at mobs who were straight in front of me and they would not get hit because attacks just weren't registering. I would use a bow at a distance and point blank and those hits would not land either.

I know people keep saying DDO is 100% free of lag, our pcs are the suxxors, our isps are lolzors, etc. but it's not. There is no way everyone on Cannith can all have bad pcs and bad installs of the game. The entire server experiences lag all at the same time, and very, very frequently. It's to the point where the game is starting to become unplayable. Instead of placing the blame on users this really needs to get looked in to seriously. It HAS to be the servers or the game itself.

Another issue I was having yesterday (well basically since the update), and I'm not sure if it was lag related or not, was landing hits with a bow. I've never had issues with bows before, but ever since I started my tr post update 11 bows are not working right. How are they b0rked? Well it seems like a good portion of hits just aren't connecting. I get no attack rolls for them. I'm firing at mobs, some times point blank in their face and they do not get hit at all. It's the same if they are making a straight line for me, or if I'm kiting around.

This is a frustrating issue and I've never had it before until the whole reload/firing stuff was messed with for update 11. It would be great if this would be looked in to as well.

Anyway, I hope you guys find a fix soon. I and several others are losing patience with this quick and starting to look for new games to go to.

[DogstarPhotography]

Just wanted to add that I'm getting terrible lag that makes the game unplayable too, even simple stuff like picking an item up from mail is taking minutes to complete. I'm not being negative though because I still think this is a great game.

I'm hoping that the devs/support are onto this. Fingers crossed

[darksol23]

Yesterday was by far the WORST day of playing this game since I started over 2 years ago. It was lag constantly all day long. Some points in the day were completely unplayable. It wasn't just me either. Everyone was commenting in the CannithTrade chat channel about it. Everyone in my guild experienced it, my tr experienced it, etc.


This.

[Cauthey]

The idea that it's possible how the instancing system is assigning the individual instances, and there's something going on more often on those particular machines that's causing it to be more prevailant seems to be a good shot. Or perhaps the quests like DQ, Shroud, Sins of Attrition which seem to have huge problems, have some common mechanic in the scripting that's getting caught up.


This made me wonder...

Devs: what is all of the information that is conferred in a /loc (location) hash? I imagine it includes the obvious stuff like the zone and the X, Y, Z coordinates. If it does not do so already, perhaps you can add other information to the /loc hash:


Instance ID
Virtual server ID (if this is in fact how the game architecture is - I'm making presumptions here, and do not expect confirmation/denial)
Active instances / instance types (crafting instance, raid instance, slayer instance, public instance) also running on current virtual server
Various other related hardware and I/O specs


Perhaps these are different enough to be added to a different kind of hash signature that can be generated by command or bug report. If you knew this kind of information when a lag spike went through, you might be able to better pinpoint the cause of the problem.

Heck - you might already be doing all of this. If so... GOOD JOB! :D :D :D

[TBot1234]

Signed

[Sarezar]

Since U11, my client will crash (DDO has stopped working, blah blah message) at random times. Looking closer to this revealed that the CPU useage is sky high just before this happens. Very rarely, I freeze for a few seconds and recover, CPU usage dropping again, so sometimes this spike can be overcome by the CPU.

My concern is that I have a core i7, OCed @ 3.75GHz, I got 6GB memory, RAID0 disks, and a 5870. I do wonder though if it has anything to do with the card not being able to process some of the DX11 graphics, and shooting all the need on the CPU, which eventually can't cope with it. I noticed another post by someone here who has the same problem and uses a 5850 card. Maybe a radeon driver issue (or a bad DX11 implementation by Turbine? Just wondering, not accusing anyone...). I did update my drives since U11, but this hasn't helped.

I haven't tested DX9 or DX10 since U11. I will actually do this now and play for a few days without DX11, then post back here (if any devs are still reading).

[Cauthey]

Yesterday was by far the WORST day of playing this game since I started over 2 years ago. It was lag constantly all day long. Some points in the day were completely unplayable. It wasn't just me either. Everyone was commenting in the CannithTrade chat channel about it. Everyone in my guild experienced it, my tr experienced it, etc.

This.

Please remember that "this" doesn't help the QA and the Devs get a bigger picture idea of what's going on.

I agree with your "this," Darksol23. :) Yesterday was, by far, one of the worst days to attempt to play. But - give as many specific details as you can about your experiences as Noelemahc did. That what times, experiences, and data can be tied together to hopefully shine some light on the 6 year mess of code they have to battle. :D

[darksol23]

Please remember that "this" doesn't help the QA and the Devs get a bigger picture idea of what's going on.

I agree with your "this," Darksol23. :) Yesterday was, by far, one of the worst days to attempt to play. But - give as many specific details as you can about your experiences as Noelemahc did. That what times, experiences, and data can be tied together to hopefully shine some light on the 6 year mess of code they have to battle. :D

Thanks for your concern... I already did many pages back. Emphasis was just being added to his specific point.

[Cyr]

It wouldn't bother me if they did use a different client. What does bother me is they (QA, Devs) do not see the same issues as we do some of time. There hasn't been a reasonable explanation for this.

1) They may see 'lag' reports and characterize them based upon their own particular definition of lag like Maj noted his 'latency lag'. Of course, to a player anything that causes a noticable slow down, mismatch between players, or other abnormality of this general trend could be called 'lag'. In these cases the developers may not be critically reading the reports of lag and dismissing it because it does not fit their more restrictive definition.

2) The developers may on average have much higher end machines then the average user leading to less noticable effects from user described 'lag'.

3) The developers live closer to Turbine then the average user.

4) The developers DO NOT play the game in a hardcore fashion. This is of course not true of all the developers, but is certainly true on the averages. This matters because it means that most developers will not have an account full of capped alts and multiple TRs that they switch from during a single logon, are less likely to be running raids (where multiple peoples connnections and timing are more critical), and are much less likely to be playing end game content (see raids...oh forgot more item effects, more character powers, and more item swapping going on also). Of course, this makes the game feel completely differently. Most lag types I would never notice if I was running my guys levels 1-15...also I probably would not notice less severe lag occurances on my capped guys unless I was very in tune with how the game normally plays.

5) The developers may be far too quick to make these types of statements and may in fact make them based upon no data being gathered or an incredibly small sample size.

6) As in all things 'lag' related this can be highly situational user to user and time to time. That means that a random sample by a random user only is likely to catch the most egregiously wide spread problems. This comes back to point five, but leaves more room for a developer taking more data points. Note, most developers are probably not playing the game much from their home pcs during the work day for example or at 3 AM on a work day...

7) Different client being used as suggested by the quoted poster.

8) Different login type based upon them being employees of Turbine and possibly having adminstrative priveleges.

9) Better internet connections then the average user has.

[Failedlegend]

I play primarily on Thelanis and Orien and so do my firends although we have one or two characters on other servers as well. When I first started me and one of the people I play with had horrible lag but about a year ago I updated my PC and almost all traces of lag disapeared but she still has lag because her PC is ancient...my other friends who have always had the latest and greatest stuff for their PCs(im more of a console gamer) and they've never had lag

What does this tell us: 90% of Lag is NOT turbine's fault...I get the occasional lag still but its rare & short-lived and in an online environment you cant completely eliminate lag which is why I don't understand the people who are salivating over the over-the-cloud gaming.

TL;DR - It's not Turbine's fault if your getting lag it's because your PC is outdated or your net is slow (I know the pain of this one when I first moved out of my parents place when I was 19 I couldn't afford anything more than just basic net speeds and online gaming was out of the question).

[smatt]

I play primarily on Thelanis and Orien and so do my firends although we have one or two characters on other servers as well. When I first started me and one of the people I play with had horrible lag but about a year ago I updated my PC and almost all traces of lag disapeared but she still has lag because her PC is ancient...my other friends who have always had the latest and greatest stuff for their PCs(im more of a console gamer) and they've never had lag

What does this tell us: 90% of Lag is NOT turbine's fault...I get the occasional lag still but its rare & short-lived and in an online environment you cant completely eliminate lag which is why I don't understand the people who are salivating over the over-the-cloud gaming.

TL;DR - It's not Turbine's fault if your getting lag it's because your PC is outdated or your net is slow (I know the pain of this one when I first moved out of my parents place when I was 19 I couldn't afford anything more than just basic net speeds and online gaming was out of the question).


If you had actually bothered to read the many responses in this thread you would know that in many cases you are plane wrong.... Yes, lag or whatever you want to call the various things that are known as lag DO have to do with ones computer, vid card, connection, server to client latency etc... But if you had bothered to READ before your sermon, you would see that you are in fact wrong in this case. :o Since many people with nice rigs, and nice connections ARE having issues that have gotten worse EXACTLY at the time that Cannith crafting came into being, and then again with U-11 and then again with U-11.1 ;)

[stainer]

TL;DR - It's not Turbine's fault if your getting lag it's because your PC is outdated or your net is slow (I know the pain of this one when I first moved out of my parents place when I was 19 I couldn't afford anything more than just basic net speeds and online gaming was out of the question).

If this was the case I would expect the lag (or whatever we term it) to be consistent. It isn't. I may run 7 ToDs without issue and then have horrible lag. So while I might say that my rig could contribute to lag, I am not sure the blame can be put totally on it. My computer for the most part is static. I know what is open on it, and I know what my connection is. I would expect that any issues I had would be somewhat predictable. That is not the case. Since there appears to be a large number of people having these issues, it would appear that there is something happening.

[anubhait]

I wrote something about memory usage and need to fix things instead of adding new problems quite a few updates ago. I was mocked by many and ignored by rest. So lets try again now when things went as expected.

-Cannith crafting issue. As it searches your bags/recipes it blocks you or your inventory. You cannot do anything for a while. This is now better after u11. But it still needs to be fixed. I should be able to close interface and walk away without getting stuck for 30 seconds.
-Lag postU11 went much worse. I am on Orien. Most of the time people fail epics because of lag. EDQ specially is very very bad. Personally i dont have it as bad as some others but its still UNPLAYBLE for quite many. I gave up most of the raids because of this thats how badly it affects my game experience.
-Sharing lag with other members of party. There seems to be some truth about this. When playing with certain ppl from certain countries i witnessed increase in lag.One person with virus/some issue should not be able to affect others so much. I just hope DDO is using nonblocking network sockets with somewhat low timeout. I hope their servers are using some reasonable load balancing and traffic shaping(not RED). That their IP protocol ACKs have higher priority then other packets. And some other things. Because hope is all i can.
-Memory usage. After i exit game it can take up to minute before it unloads from memory depending on number of relogs i did.(windows 7).Application should keep it tidy. Not grow like bamboo forest.
-Aggregating requests could be good idea when things get overloaded. Making from three messages from client about dealt dmg one in some small frames of time could be good.

I hope someone starts doing something because i am already seeing decreased numbers of LFMs up compared to before. Guess some people just gave up.

Oh and its not my computer, not my connection and not my other software's fault.

[Ebonta]

<Snip>
TL;DR - It's not Turbine's fault if your getting lag it's because your PC is outdated or your net is slow (I know the pain of this one when I first moved out of my parents place when I was 19 I couldn't afford anything more than just basic net speeds and online gaming was out of the question).


It's our fault when all twelve people in a raid start lagging out too, right?

[HAL]

If you had actually bothered to read the many responses in this thread you would know that in many cases you are plane wrong.... Yes, lag or whatever you want to call the various things that are known as lag DO have to do with ones computer, vid card, connection, server to client latency etc... But if you had bothered to READ before your sermon, you would see that you are in fact wrong in this case. :o Since many people with nice rigs, and nice connections ARE having issues that have gotten worse EXACTLY at the time that Cannith crafting came into being, and then again with U-11 and then again with U-11.1 ;)

Reading this thread might lead all the posters to believe that everyone has this lag, so I guess I'll speak up to represent those who don't. One would think that if it was server-side, EVERYONE would be affected. The fact that some people aren't would seem to indicate otherwise. Sure, I do get some lag occasionally, but it's brief and certainly isn't this crippling lag everyone else is talking about. Crystal Cove was probably the worst for lag but even that wasn't crippling and wipe-causing for me or the people I play with.


-Cannith crafting issue. As it searches your bags/recipes it blocks you or your inventory. You cannot do anything for a while. This is now better after u11. But it still needs to be fixed. I should be able to close interface and walk away without getting stuck for 30 seconds.

Not to discount your experience, but I craft all the time and this has never happened to me (not even before U11). Again I have to ask, if this is server-side, why not?

[smatt]

Reading this thread might lead all the posters to believe that everyone has this lag, so I guess I'll speak up to represent those who don't. One would think that if it was server-side, EVERYONE would be affected. The fact that some people aren't would seem to indicate otherwise. Sure, I do get some lag occasionally, but it's brief and certainly isn't this crippling lag everyone else is talking about. Crystal Cove was probably the worst for lag but even that wasn't crippling and wipe-causing for me or the people I play with.


You do realise this is an instance based game right? Soooo..... It's very possible that you are on a different server virtual or actual than other people not in your party when in quest... I could go on and on about this made up myth that the current problems are all tied to individuals machines or connections.

Nobody has said anywhere I can find that ALL people are int his situation, perhaps you have the perfect calm of not having the gear, using the spells, running the quests, etc that are the main cause of the current issues. There have been a few coming in saying all is fine.... Just as there has always been the many times lag or lag like issues have been VERY pronounced for many over the last 5 years, and many of those times it WAS a Turbine side problem, they fixed it and cleared things up to some extent, and even admitted as much.

As Stainer said above... My machine is static, I watch my connection and it's latency, I knwo what's going on here... Explain why all of the sudden after the addition of Cannith crafting I starting having major issues, which they somewhat patched up as ADMITTED by Dev staff, and then it got worse again with U-11, and yet again with U-11.1? With yet again Turbine staff, namely Majmalfunction coming in and saying that he's seeing something that WE as players might be calling lag, but he calls it something else from his non-layman type point of view?

Your lack of this issue seems to be the exception rather than the norm.....

[HAL]

You do realise this is an instance based game right? Soooo..... It's very possible that you are on a different server virtual or actual
<snip>
Your lack of this issue seems to be the exception rather than the norm.....


However, a player doesn't stay on the same virtual server forever, right? And I never have had this problem. I've been playing on and off since the beginning.

Sure, I might just have a lucky combination. But your comment about me being the exception is shortsighted. Surely you must understand that those who post on the forums is an even tinier percentage than those who read them, which is already a tiny percentage of the player base. And of course you must understand that hardly anyone posts to say that they are NOT having a problem. I really don't see how you can say that I am an exception (except to be posting that I don't have this problem LOL). If DDO's player base is made up of every single person who has posted about lag in the last few weeks, this game would be dead already ;)

[Beethoven]

TL;DR - It's not Turbine's fault if your getting lag it's because your PC is outdated or your net is slow (I know the pain of this one when I first moved out of my parents place when I was 19 I couldn't afford anything more than just basic net speeds and online gaming was out of the question).

There are a lot more culprits than just outdated hardware or slow internet. You can have very sophisticated hardware and still issues since many pieces handle things differently. So, even if your hardware should be able to handle things well, there may be some software/hardware conflict which prevents DDO running smoothly.

It's one of the challenges the gaming industry faces, it is impossible for their developers to purchase every single piece of hardware and software a user potentially uses (and has actively running_ and test their code with every conceivable hardware and software combination. It's how it can happen for someone to experience issues with one game only even if the game is not necessarily more complex than others.

Similarly it is not only internet speed which can affect games but also the way a specific providers handles their data management. There is the whole conspiracy theory going on about ISP providers slowing down data transfer speeds (or employing other means to slow down upload/download speeds) to encourage their customers by more expansive packages. Lots of people often forget we are effectively shooting huge amounts of data streams across half a continent through several computer networks, servers and sometimes even ISP providers. Data can only be transferred as fast as the slowest part of the path allows (weakest link and all).

Turbine already admitted they have issues with lag and are trying several things to address the various causes of potential lag but something that is only a minor issue on their side (causing a barely noticeable or not even noticeable delay) could be aggravated by any of the things mentioned above and end up being far more severe on the user end.

The only way to remove all potential causes of lag would be:
* Streamline their code (it's 6 years old, so here already we are talking about something /far/ more complex than it sounds.
* Publish soft- and hardware specs the code is tested on (and insist users use only these specific types of hard- and software, which - y'know - is not going to happen)
* Take the game off the internet as they cannot control the dozens (or hundreds) of servers between them and their users and how ISP providers manage their data transfer (shy of laying their own cables also not doable for an MMORPG).

I don't think there is anything wrong with reporting if lag gets worse. It's a good thing because it gives Turbine an idea how many of their users are affected by it and how large an issue we are talking about (whether or not they can do something about it is another matter though). It is also important to keep in mind though that not everything necessarily can exist only on their end.

[PsiGuy]

One more point to look at.

On several different occasions, I have noticed that players that are in the process of getting disconnected will lag out everything around them. As soon as the player is "officially" disconnected, everything starts to stabilize and pick back up.

[WolfSpirit]

Choppy is good, 'hitches' , delay, pausing. More the symptom than a single term. QA does not pretend we know what is going on under the hood, more like this is what we see/hear and data points. So, you have pausing, but your connection is green, audio is ok, but spells are firing off 10 seconds late...that tells us a ton. I even listen to how my video cards fans and HDD are responding.Everything is a clue. I have hunches and theories of what it may be, but I leave it to the crazy coders to figure out the reality.
~
This is good info Maj.
I also pay attention to the speed of my Card Fans. Actually, only the primary one gets heated up to kick the fan over 80% speed.
I run dual card. 5770 Rads actually which are good but far from exceptional.
I7 940 OCed to 3.06 Ghz.
6GB high speed RAM
Win 7 64bit
connection speed only 100.0 Mbps
I hardly EVER feel the "lag" that many complain of.
During those times (always at least one in party complaining" I simply KNOW its all his connection or his rig unable to cope with the settings he's wishing for.
And Oh GOD dont tell him to turn down his settings no matter how carefully you choose your words! WOW some people are sentisive about it! But those few that have listened nearly without fail have shown VERY improved "lag".
I call it Graphical "lag"
But something darker is among us.
Lately it has come often. Its not the same, its getting us all.
But there are MANY times lately when it hits. Like a storm over the server (Orien in this case) Drop it into guild chat, Everyones hit no matter their location.
THAT is case one. The other, what I call Quest lag. This hits mostly in Raids (infamous Shroud pt 1 approach to chests/shrine) but also strikes at other times in other quests. This too has gotten worse, and I'm not talking about Shroud specifically.
Into the deeps last night. About 10:30PM. Full guild group doing elite getting that happy streak we all love. Enter the water all bubbled up, debilitating "lag" strikes. I say debilitating because its BAD, for us all. Unable to walk, standing there or inching forward. Took 10 mins to cross to first cave, not exaggerating.
No excessive fan noice, no CPU spikes. (but I will watch in the future more carefully)
Enter out of the water, the "lag" lessens noticeably but still persists.
After being in quest a half hour (We are a very patient Guild being all family people with children) the lag finally lessens to tolerable and laughable levels. But still persists to the very end. We get out of that quest, every things fine again. (for me)
I can def feel the devs pain, its a multiheaded creature with hundreds of evil heads and slaying all the heads is the only way to get it all. I know every head slain helps but sadly, they are ALL semi Invisible heads and require much searching...

[karl_k0ch]

Being TGWHTPTDWNRGG

You win this thread.

[Ebuddy]

Well....I ran a Shroud the other day on my netbook running off of my cell phone's 3G data (via wifi tether). Lag was minimal.

:-O

[Desonde]

Yes we play. No I do not have ' lag'. BUT I suspect what you guys call lag, I call other things. I can say I see no traditional Lag as in Latency issues. I'm not rubber-banding, or being halted and having to catch up with the world. Yes I'm playing from home. I have witnessed with my own two eyeballs some of what is being complained about. There is something, odd, going on, some strange database call or something going on. It is being investigated, and it is a top priority of QA/DEV. I know it stinks.

Uhm, "Lag: Fall behind in movement, progress, or development; not keep pace with another or others."

Lag is a perfectly apt term for what we are seeing, if I swing my sword, send a heal, or try and move, and the server doesn't register any of it, than it doesn't matter what the latency is (and yes, last night was horrendous and unplayable, and yes I checked my latency, it was an average of 42 which is normal) fact is the server isn't keeping pace with the players, which is by definition lag.

[smatt]

~
This is good info Maj.
I also pay attention to the speed of my Card Fans. Actually, only the primary one gets heated up to kick the fan over 80% speed.
I run dual card. 5770 Rads actually which are good but far from exceptional.
I7 940 OCed to 3.06 Ghz.
6GB high speed RAM
Win 7 64bit
connection speed only 100.0 Mbps
I hardly EVER feel the "lag" that many complain of.
During those times (always at least one in party complaining" I simply KNOW its all his connection or his rig unable to cope with the settings he's wishing for.
And Oh GOD dont tell him to turn down his settings no matter how carefully you choose your words! WOW some people are sentisive about it! But those few that have listened nearly without fail have shown VERY improved "lag".
I call it Graphical "lag"
But something darker is among us.
Lately it has come often. Its not the same, its getting us all.
But there are MANY times lately when it hits. Like a storm over the server (Orien in this case) Drop it into guild chat, Everyones hit no matter their location.
THAT is case one. The other, what I call Quest lag. This hits mostly in Raids (infamous Shroud pt 1 approach to chests/shrine) but also strikes at other times in other quests. This too has gotten worse, and I'm not talking about Shroud specifically.
Into the deeps last night. About 10:30PM. Full guild group doing elite getting that happy streak we all love. Enter the water all bubbled up, debilitating "lag" strikes. I say debilitating because its BAD, for us all. Unable to walk, standing there or inching forward. Took 10 mins to cross to first cave, not exaggerating.
No excessive fan noice, no CPU spikes. (but I will watch in the future more carefully)
Enter out of the water, the "lag" lessens noticeably but still persists.
After being in quest a half hour (We are a very patient Guild being all family people with children) the lag finally lessens to tolerable and laughable levels. But still persists to the very end. We get out of that quest, every things fine again. (for me)
I can def feel the devs pain, its a multiheaded creature with hundreds of evil heads and slaying all the heads is the only way to get it all. I know every head slain helps but sadly, they are ALL semi Invisible heads and require much searching...

Sorry according to HAL your rig is ****, your connection is **** and therefore you are inferior... There is no lag server side.. You sir should reroll! ;)

[smatt]

However, a player doesn't stay on the same virtual server forever, right? And I never have had this problem. I've been playing on and off since the beginning.

Sure, I might just have a lucky combination. But your comment about me being the exception is shortsighted. Surely you must understand that those who post on the forums is an even tinier percentage than those who read them, which is already a tiny percentage of the player base. And of course you must understand that hardly anyone posts to say that they are NOT having a problem. I really don't see how you can say that I am an exception (except to be posting that I don't have this problem LOL). If DDO's player base is made up of every single person who has posted about lag in the last few weeks, this game would be dead already ;)

Of course only a tiny percentage post on the forums.. You might notice I've been around a bit myself... I'm tryign to figure out why people like you make up things like you did. Nobody has said that all peopel that play are on the fourms. Most people in game SEEM to just accept it and play through it. DDO has always been some what laggy, and msot dont' bother to complain since it rarely does any good anyway.... Until times liek this when LOTS of new peopel show up complaining, I wonder why THAT is? At least for the non-big red S on the shirt types it seems to be a NEW problem that cropped up recently. Why is that my guildies all complain some with VERY high end systems, every PuG I join the vast majority complain about it. And I play at varying times of the day, the onb;y time I rarely ever play at all is 12AM-6AM PST.

I feel comfortable saying that more people are having serious issues with poor game performance than aren't, but that's jsut MY guess form a very small but rather random sample in game, as well as here. And just the posts in this thread with NON forum regulars tells me even more. You might consider going back to Maj's post in this thread earlier today.... Something about an "Odd data call" so the game is looking for data that it doesn't need or is looping into that action over and over a few times. Of course you may not notice that ...

[leadhead]

Of course only a tiny percentage post on the forums.. You might notice I've been around a bit myself... I'm tryign to figure out why people like you make up things like you did. Nobody has said that all peopel that play are on the fourms. Most people in game SEEM to just accept it and play through it. DDO has always been some what laggy, and msot dont' bother to complain since it rarely does any good anyway.... Until times liek this when LOTS of new peopel show up complaining, I wonder why THAT is? At least for the non-big red S on the shirt types it seems to be a NEW problem that cropped up recently. Why is that my guildies all complain some with VERY high end systems, every PuG I join the vast majority complain about it. And I play at varying times of the day, the onb;y time I rarely ever play at all is 12AM-6AM PST.

I feel comfortable saying that more people are having serious issues with poor game performance than aren't, but that's jsut MY guess form a very small but rather random sample in game, as well as here. And just the posts in this thread with NON forum regulars tells me even more. You might consider going back to Maj's post in this thread earlier today.... Something about an "Odd data call" so the game is looking for data that it doesn't need or is looping into that action over and over a few times. Of course you may not notice that ...


Agreed, in the case that I posted a couple pages back with the off and on pausing but not rubber banding...there were lots of people on the chat channels talking about it in game. I think in that case, it is probably an issue with the patch or something on DDOs side. But I am certain that there are people having problems for a whole host of reasons..they have a bot.net hosting dell with a disk full of corrupted indexes and file tables because their computer as survived a couple power outages etc...

Overall I think it is a pretty ambiguous subject talking about "lag" when there are actually an handfull of separate and different technological problems going on. The symptoms are even different, but if you dont work on computers for a living, it all looks like the same yiddish.

[HAL]

Sorry according to HAL your rig is ****, your connection is **** and therefore you are inferior... There is no lag server side.. You sir should reroll! ;)

Please don't put words in my mouth. If you're going to attribute an opinion to me, please quote where I said it. I'm very disappointed that this is the best you can do...

[HAL]

Of course only a tiny percentage post on the forums.. You might notice I've been around a bit myself... I'm tryign to figure out why people like you make up things like you did.

"Make up things"? Please be specific - what did I make up?


Nobody has said that all peopel that play are on the fourms. Most people in game SEEM to just accept it and play through it. DDO has always been some what laggy, and msot dont' bother to complain since it rarely does any good anyway....

Again you are claiming to know what "most people in game" think. And again I would like to know how you know this.


I feel comfortable saying that more people are having serious issues with poor game performance than aren't, but that's jsut MY guess form a very small but rather random sample in game, as well as here.

So you admit that this is just a guess - then why do you present it as fact?

[Produktion_Malphunktion]

Read it all. Helpful guys. Stay tuned.


gonna sleep.

[smatt]

"Make up things"? Please be specific - what did I make up?



Again you are claiming to know what "most people in game" think. And again I would like to know how you know this.



So you admit that this is just a guess - then why do you present it as fact?


Read them again.... I said the people I've talked to not only in guild but in many PuGs, as well as seeing MANY not only old vets but new faces posting here. And I've only noticed 10 or so that say everything is fine, so again I say as far as I can tell. I didn't state anything as fact. The only fact I can state is that I KNOW something is wrong on their (Turbines) end. I don't claim anything, but You did saying that 90% of lag is all player side... A good portion of it likely is.. 90% not likely... And this thing that's happening certainly isn't. But your small world of lag, latency, skip, hop, delay free DDO is fine and Im happy for you.

[smatt]

Read it all. Helpful guys. Stay tuned.


gonna sleep.

Thanks for taking a serious look at this Maj!

[Ruphus]

Well, as you guys have talked about, a very very small portion of DDO's player base visit AND post on the forums.

And I would say less than 10% (not an exact figure, just a guess, don't quote me on it) of those that DO post on ther forums, would actually post if they are NOT having lag issues.

Example?

I haven't posted about having lag issues because... I am not seeing anything out of the ordinary.

Does that mean I am completely, 100% lag-free? No, every so often I see a hiccup, or something that may cause my character to pause, bounce back a couple feet, and so forth, but it does not happen enough for me to worry about it, and it could very well be my cable-internet provider having a momentary hiccup as much as it could be DDO's. I have also yet (knock-on-wood) to have an issue severe enough to cause a whipe, or death that was related to lag.

Now, where I DO see lag, that is always there and can be reproduced every time are the same places and times it has been for the 2ish years I have been playing

Shroud - Pt 1 on the way to the chests after the encounters are over.
Shroud - Pt 4 During the Harry fight.
Shroud - Random/Any same type of stop/go lag as the above mentioned, but can happen anywhere/time, sometimes doesn't happen, sometimes it can be bad. But, again, this has been happening to Shroud as far back as I can remember.

4:30 - 5am eastern time, Mail, Auctioneer, Banker all clog up, and it is difficult to log out during this time, again been happening repeatedly since I started playing, and is very easy to reproduce, it's almost like a time when Turbines 'net provider does maintenance, or Turbine itself does maintenance.

By the way, nothing special about my comp, heck it's a couple years old now, and I don't even remember all of it's specs, other than 4 gigs of ddr2 ram, radeon card (not sure on model) 1gig of ddr3 ram, dual core intel 2.3ghz? standard cable internet, lol, like i said, nothing special and it's been so long that I have forgotten everything about it, would have to dig for all the receipts and paperwork on it.

[Dendrix]

I think that a lag issue affecting one player often ends up affecting all players.
The DDO clients end up waiting on a response from another member of the group

So while my connection and pc have no problems playing DDO, once someone else in the raid/group has problems it spreads from one person to another as they are waitong on each other to respond.

[Xufang]

Whoa whoa, hold on.

Player side lag? Absolutely not. I've been playing DDO for years and encountered none. Recently myself and entire groups have had simultaneous lag spikes, the whole freekin lot of us at the exact moment. That is NOT player lag.

I've assumed, since this began happening around the time of update 11, it was due to a massive influx of players returning coupled with some new content putting some strain on the servers.

I can bet that if some people aren't experiencing lag and the rest of us are its purely to do with proximity.

Either way, NOT player lag.

[mystafyi]

Have you all tried running ddo under winxp with no directx10/11?

sure the game looks crappier then with the bells and whistles, but i dont have these cpu/disk/zone out bug usage issues now. in fact, I rarely get DC'd unless its happening to alot of folks. Yes, I am talking about server protocol's that start mass kicking folks when servers become overloaded, or they shut down instances and force character rollbacks.

disclaimer: I do get server lag occasionaly when raiding, although i think it has to do with time of play. prime time US this game is utter garbage if you try to raid. sometimes its fine and othertimes... well ya'll know :)

I am of the impression that turbine changed their lsa with internap to a lower teir of service for cost savings. Or, their code is so borked there will never be a fix. see windows me ;)

[SirShen]

No shen, I'm looking for data points to help me nail down the issue, I'm not telling you to do anything.

Sorry Maj it just sounded that way. I did a full ddo install. Still getting stop and start lag in raids, i did notice that i get the lag stop when i hit Recv: 5000.0 Bps and yes my net connection is over that speed. My latency is about 120.0 ms to 130.0 ms but at one point the other day in shroud it was at 1700.00 ms. No idea whats going on and thanks for looking into to this Maj.

[PestWulf]

I've been playing nightly before and since the patch. My experience has been different these last several days.

Last Tuesday, my group had to pretty much give up and quit right at 9pm EST because the ...freezing... made it impossible to play. I would see my friends running in place, a flurry of activity, then more running in place, etc.

This happened again to me the next night and I pretty much gave up playing for 3 days and switched to Civ to give the devs time to figure something out as it was supremely frustrating.

So I played again on Saturday, pretty much the entire day and had zero issues like I was having the previous week. Since Saturday, I've encountered a few patches of ...freezing... (trying really hard to appease the man with patience..but I so want to say lag). Anyway, it was spotty, but cleared up enough to continue playing. NOTHING like it was a week before.

My character ranges that I played that week were in the lvl 5 to lvl 12 range. I usually play my 5 range on Tuesdays and switch between 12 range and 8ish range the rest of the week. (they are leveling so it's not constant what i'm playing).

So as far as the ...freezing... goes, something has changed recently for my playing experience. It's less than it was before for me.

[ckorik]

Whoa whoa, hold on.

Player side lag? Absolutely not. I've been playing DDO for years and encountered none. Recently myself and entire groups have had simultaneous lag spikes, the whole freekin lot of us at the exact moment. That is NOT player lag.

I've assumed, since this began happening around the time of update 11, it was due to a massive influx of players returning coupled with some new content putting some strain on the servers.

I can bet that if some people aren't experiencing lag and the rest of us are its purely to do with proximity.

Either way, NOT player lag.

There is a simpler explanation - one that you can arrive at after watching bugs get fixed and finding their way back to the game.

They (Turbine) seem to have a bad time managing the patch schedule. It's understandable - but something they should fix.

What we have now:

Live - current build
Lam - 'next update build'
Secret update (Mourn) - 'update after next build'
Presumably another update or two after (as the devs have stated they are usually working 2 updates ahead at least)

So you have a situation where stuff hits Lam - gets bugged - gets fixed - patch is made - game is updated - and goes to Live - great you think...

Except those patches don't seem to always make it back into the 'other' builds - so when they hit Lam - you see stuff that had previously been fixed - get broken again - and then the fixes are applied - and sometimes this causes bugs because the update was based on old code - and then it makes it live - and old problems have to be fixed... again...

So I understand how this could happen - a bug fix from 3-4 updates ago didn't get rolled up correctly - and then makes it back out. It's a massive job - managing all the different code and releases - especially with patches and hotfixes that are applied to the live game.

At least that's my theory on why this stuff seems to happen.

[zpfpzps]

deleted

[Maetrim]

I got a new PC last saturday. 2.9 Ghz quad core processor, 8 gb ram, Windows 7. GT 530 gpx card with 1gb ram

My previous PC which died friday was 6 years old, had 2 gb ram and maybe a 1ghz processor. Both machine have seen the same lag issues.

The new machine has a complete fresh install. Typical symptoms are:

Spells take 5-10 seconds to land.

Spells animate correctly on my machine, are seen to hit the target (scorching ray). No damage is done, and I am charged for the sp. In worst case scenarios on a sorc with 800sp I have had to spend in excess of 600sp before ANY spell would land and do damage to my target. This happens solo or in groups. More common in groups. When I have the problem, all members in the group also indicate they are having the same issues.

I do not get running in spot problem

Just today running elite von3, at the first trap door which you can run through as it opens to avoid the force traps. Did so with my entire group, spend ~5 seconds inside the room attacking targets with spells that did not land, then I get hit and killed by the trap, when I am standing close to where the optional chest spawns if the named is present. During all this time I was able to see the mobs and my party members move.


This is Cannith server.

[smatt]

F'in Mabar Dragon is now causing REAL serious lag... Not the type that's been going on with spells not going off, skipping, hoping etc... But massive lag when the dragon is up in Mabar instance..

Turbine.... Put some more resources to get the game running in a decent fashion before you put more stuff on top of the stuff... :mad:

[mystafyi]

Turbine.... Put some more resources to get the game running in a decent fashion before you put more stuff on top of the stuff... :mad:

the fact turbine wont spend money on server upgrades should speak volumes to the player base.

[smatt]

the fact turbine wont spend money on server upgrades should speak volumes to the player base. It's not sever upgrades.. It's code related... Take the F'in useless dogs and hirelings out... I bet it clears up.. Somewhat...It seems there's far fewer peopel playing right now than were active back in the May/June time frame. If it was a lack of hardware, well there you go... They have something or actually likely many things borked big time code wise somewhere in that mess.

[mystafyi]

It's not sever upgrades.. It's code related...

I agree, but they cant fix the horrible coding now, and cant remove pets and hirelings either. the only way to compensate is to run the software on overpowered computers.

accounting and TW wont allow resources spent on fixing this. they want new content pushed out to generate revenue in the ddostore. nothing else matters to them. you know its true :/

[smatt]

I agree, but they cant fix the horrible coding now, and cant remove pets and hirelings either. the only way to compensate is to run the software on overpowered computers.

accounting and TW wont allow resources spent on fixing this. they want new content pushed out to generate revenue in the ddostore. nothing else matters to them. you know its true :/
Oh come now... Even a nuub like me knows throwing a bunch of hardware at software bottlenecks solves next to nothing... Yes, the engine is old, the game code has been patched together for a longtime.. But it works reasonably well when they actually spend time getting the additions and new stuff right. That's not happening now...... All hands on deck for U-12 "The total DDO-ME transoformation" I have no words for the fact that they have U-12 startign on Lama, with the game running the way it is now, and little hope of it getting fixed before U-12 hits with a whole new boatload of garbage...

There have been plenty of times where the game has run fairly smoothly over the years..... Recognizing he various limitations of users connections and computers. And then there are times when it's been horrid... Now is one of the latter... And the way things are looking it's not going to get any better with the pace they're stacking new trash on top of the stinking pile they have now.

I don't put this on QA nor the Devs.. But right on the backs of the Producers... The decision making process surrounding the priorities is totally borked..... Having fancy new stuff to advertise in an attempt to keep the stream of new players flowing is great and all, the problem is the new players get here and just leave when they stutter across Korthos..... :o

[xxHazexx]

So i haven't been in game for awhile but i do plan on returning, however with all of the lag fix posts can't say that i'm too enthusiastic, do something about it turbine, i enjoy the game and don't mind spending the money on it as long as the QUALITY & ASSURANCE is their. were not asking anymore, we are demanding that something be done, a devs response would be nice with some TLC.

[mwgarn]

I won't spend any more cash on DDO until something is done about the lag, U5 screwed over Twf to supposedly fix it... The problem is with AI, personally lag dosnt seem to happen for me until groups of mobs spawn or a complex mob spawns..

Granted last night in house j pub it was so laggy it took me 15 min to get out...

Something needs to be done (back to call of duty for me til it's done)

[Cauthey]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.

I've performed a full reinstall. I will report comparisons on lag type issuses (delays, spells not landing, rubber banding, etc.) as I get the chance to.

[Storms9124]

LAG
LAG
LAG

But atleast we get new content in update 12! Patch with no improvement regarding lag = FAIL UPDATE

[Ebonta]

I won't spend any more cash on DDO until something is done about the lag, U5 screwed over Twf to supposedly fix it... The problem is with AI, personally lag dosnt seem to happen for me until groups of mobs spawn or a complex mob spawns..

Granted last night in house j pub it was so laggy it took me 15 min to get out...

Something needs to be done (back to call of duty for me til it's done)

AI? You mean the one that let's mob's stand in Wall of Fire?

[Smudge202]

Same complaint - lag is unworkable. I'm sure Turbine are working on the issue, but like it has been suggested here, stop adding meaningless content and tweaking meaningless figures and make the game playable.

2 VIP accounts terminated with immediate effect.

You have to understand Turbine, there are other games out there. I'm not willing to pay money for game I can't play and can't enjoy.

""You have successfully canceled your Dungeons and Dragons Online™ subscription. We are sad to see you go, but you may resume it at any time. We hope to see you back soon!""

EDIT:

I took the "Exit Survey" to try and provide feedback for my decision to cancel my subscriptions. There are several questions in the survey that read a little like (don't quote these) "What are the reasons for you terminating your subscription?", from which it provides multiple choices; things like "Not enough game content", "Not enough Raids", etc. Not ONCE throughout the ENTIRE survey did it say ANYTHING about Lag.

Pull your thumb out turbine. How can you DENY lag? How can you OMIT lag as being both an issue with your game, and a reason for losing players? Incompetence?

[Demeron]

Nothing has been done on LAG. New stuff is good but as long as it is impossible to play...................... my sub runs out in 2 month`s and then i will stop pay for a Game i cant play or enjoy.

Btw Turbin no its is not my Mashine and not my Connection that is just stupid each time LAG comes u blame the Players stuff for it......

Get rid of the shop, myddo and the other **** no one needs..........



But still there is hope http://www.playneverwinter.com/ and bann me if u like I do not care any more at all

[FrancisP.Fancypants]

Yep. Last night on Argo, from when I logged on at 11:20 to about midnight Eastern:

When you start making bets with your guildies over how many seconds (10! No, 12!) it'll take for a cure spell to land, the lag issue really needs to be prioritized.


*edit*
Had a thought- maybe there should be a sort of standard form for reporting lag, maybe in a thread, but with whatever specific questions would be useful for pinpointing the issues.

[Synnestar35791]

So, who wants to do me a favor? If you are in serious bad 'lag' mode all the time...try a full reinstall. I know it is painful, but if you suddenly have a better experience, this really helps narrow down the issues. This is a hard one for us, we do new builds daily, so any fragmentation over time, we are just not going to see. I don't think this is the full issue, but I do think this may be contributing to it.



------------------
System Information
------------------
Time of this report: 10/22/2011, 13:28:22
Machine name: ********
Operating System: Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit (6.1, Build 7601) Service Pack 1 (7601.win7sp1_gdr.110622-1506)
Language: English (Regional Setting: English)
System Manufacturer: System manufacturer
System Model: System Product Name
BIOS: BIOS Date: 04/28/10 16:53:56 Ver: 00.25
Processor: AMD Phenom(tm) II X4 955 Processor (4 CPUs), ~3.2GHz
Memory: 4096MB RAM
Available OS Memory: 4096MB RAM
Page File: 1308MB used, 6879MB available
Windows Dir: C:\Windows
DirectX Version: DirectX 11
DX Setup Parameters: None
User DPI Setting: Using System DPI
System DPI Setting: 96 DPI (100 percent)
DWM DPI Scaling: Disabled
DxDiag Version: 6.01.7601.17514 32bit Unicode

------------
DxDiag Notes
------------
Display Tab 1: No problems found.
Sound Tab 1: No problems found.
Sound Tab 2: No problems found.
Input Tab: No problems found.

--------------------
DirectX Debug Levels
--------------------
Direct3D: 0/4 (retail)
DirectDraw: 0/4 (retail)
DirectInput: 0/5 (retail)
DirectMusic: 0/5 (retail)
DirectPlay: 0/9 (retail)
DirectSound: 0/5 (retail)
DirectShow: 0/6 (retail)


---------------
Display Devices
---------------
Card name: ATI Radeon HD 4600 Series
Manufacturer: ATI Technologies Inc.
Chip type: ATI display adapter (0x9498)
DAC type: Internal DAC(400MHz)
Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_9498&SUBSYS_9498174B&REV_00
Display Memory: 2808 MB
Dedicated Memory: 1016 MB
Shared Memory: 1791 MB
Current Mode: 1024 x 768 (32 bit) (85Hz)
Monitor Name: Generic PnP Monitor
Monitor Model: NEC FE770
Monitor Id: NEC61D5
Native Mode: 1024 x 768(p) (84.997Hz)
Output Type: HD15
Driver Name: aticfx64.dll,aticfx64.dll,aticfx32,aticfx32,atiumd 64.dll,atidxx64.dll,atiumdag,atidxx32,atiumdva,ati umd6a.cap,atitmm64.dll
Driver File Version: 8.17.0010.1077 (English)
Driver Version: 8.850.0.0
DDI Version: 10.1
Driver Model: WDDM 1.1
Driver Attributes: Final Retail
Driver Date/Size: 4/20/2011 02:07:48, 795648 bytes
WHQL Logo'd: n/a
WHQL Date Stamp: n/a
Device Identifier: {D7B71EE2-D7D8-11CF-CE70-92B4BEC2C535}
Vendor ID: 0x1002
Device ID: 0x9498
SubSys ID: 0x9498174B
Revision ID: 0x0000

Based on your re-install request - I'll do this.
I'd be willing to help solve the issue anyway I can.
^^^ My Machine statistics^^^
Fresh install will get accomplished today.

[Xeraphim]

Network Latency. Desync.

Graphics have nothing to do with this lag.

Players having 14 seconds of sync time in 0.4 second bursts across 3 minutes is unacceptable.

[Chanteur]

If you feel that fragmentation is the issue of this lag... Why not continue to work on the DDO .Dat De-fragment tool thats posted here: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=290143

There was even a dev that said it was going to be released "Soon" and that was like 2yrs ago... So there should be some old code or something that can speed that project up. Least of all it will get rid of the Fragmentation you believe is the cause of the lag.

[ShotByBothSides]

No doubt about it that the lag has got bad for me recently and I have never suffered much from lag ever before.

I am playing on a fairly fresh install (less than 2 months) and I can’t see that fragmentation could be the issue.

What I have noticed, is that in the past few days the launcher seems to stick on “Examine Programs” sometimes 30+ seconds, and sometimes it seems to get stuck permanently. For over 6 years my various DDO implementations have never exhibited this behaviour at all, the launcher has always whizzed through the checks. I doubt it is related, but odd nonetheless

PS And what is this double login to the forums nonsense? Is Turbine trying to put us off using them?

[Cauthey]

NEW lag/hitching/latency related observation:

In a Shroud on Orien last night, crippling lag set in. It seemed to be affecting every person in the raid. On a whim, I Alt-Tabbed out of the game, and then Alt-Tabbed back in. BAM!! Lag was gone. Just like effing magic. Something to consider as a workaround to try out.

Also, I invite everyone (those that lag and those that don't) to post their hardware details in the hardware survey thread I opened here (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=347729).