I'm having trouble with cone of cold, need help

[redoubt]

Hi,

I've been having issues getting cone of cold to work right, or at least what I think its supposed to do. AOE at short range in front of me, correct?

Anyway, running purge the fallen shrine on normal with my level 12 wizard. I had on heighten, quicken and maximize and a superior freeze 5 clickie.

I'd gather up several mobs and back myself into a corner then I'd cast, only it wouldn't cast. The combat log would say "you begin casting cone of cold at level 13" and my spell points would drop, but nothing would happen. Sometimes the cone animation would show and sometimes not, but nothing was taking damage. Then, like once out of six casts it would go off and the mobs would take damage.

Maybe quicken is broke and not cone of cold, but i did not notice any messages saying I was interrupted, so I think quicken is working.

Ideas?

[wigthemaster]

arcane spell failure?

~wig

[Rdonaccount]

first guess, you were targeting a mephit and it slid behind you during the cast. second guess, cone has always been a bit touchy when targeted on a mob anyway, best to target yourself when casting it and just face the direction you want.

[AbyssalMage]

Hi,

I've been having issues getting cone of cold to work right, or at least what I think its supposed to do. AOE at short range in front of me, correct?

Anyway, running purge the fallen shrine on normal with my level 12 wizard. I had on heighten, quicken and maximize and a superior freeze 5 clickie.

I'd gather up several mobs and back myself into a corner then I'd cast, only it wouldn't cast. The combat log would say "you begin casting cone of cold at level 13" and my spell points would drop, but nothing would happen. Sometimes the cone animation would show and sometimes not, but nothing was taking damage. Then, like once out of six casts it would go off and the mobs would take damage.

Maybe quicken is broke and not cone of cold, but i did not notice any messages saying I was interrupted, so I think quicken is working.

Ideas?

My guess is its a bug. I am in no way an expert but I repeatedly have the same trouble with my ranged level 1 & 2 spells. I have to use a "touch" range spell then switch back to the spell I was wanting to cast. (At my level I usually cast Shocking Grasp (Actually, the PB AoE Fire but forgot the name atm and I could remember Shocking Grasp's name) or similar level 1 spell.

Not sure how much this helps when you have lots of angry "friends" coming after you but I have had to repeatedly cast a "touch" spell before I freeze something to death (assuming he doesn't save). I notice the bug alot when casting on an elevated "Z?" axis and it wont reset until I cast the above mentioned "style" of spells. (But happens even on flat terrain also just not as often)

[lhidda]

edit:

[redoubt]

arcane spell failure?

~wig

great question. Should not be. The character is WF, but has the enhancement to reduce it to zero. That should also show up in the combat log, correct?

Also, I did some more testing.

I ran over to kobold assault because i wanted to see about large groups of mobs.

When I put my back to the wall I could get the problem to reproduce it self with reasonable reliablity. I.e. I could get a kobold to stand right in front of me and yet be missed by the cone of cold.

I tried changing the camera angle left, right, up and down and no change. Still would miss the one right in front of me.

Something new from kobold assault was I could kill other mobs, just not the one in front of me. In "purge" I was not hitting any of the mobs. That happened sometimes here, but just as often I would hit mobs left, right, and even behind me on occasion, but not the one in front. If the mob moved back or sideways, it died. I.e. it had to run into me and be right in front of me and I'd get the error.

I got the error to happen standing in the gateway as well. I think it pushed my camera in closer to my character.

Farther out into the open area, but not under trees, I had a harder time forcing the error. Camera related?

For this test in kobold assault I turned all metas off and did not activate the clickie. I also switched what I was holding a couple times and that did not seem to change the results.

[redoubt]

My guess is its a bug. I am in no way an expert but I repeatedly have the same trouble with my ranged level 1 & 2 spells. I have to use a "touch" range spell then switch back to the spell I was wanting to cast. (At my level I usually cast Shocking Grasp (Actually, the PB AoE Fire but forgot the name atm and I could remember Shocking Grasp's name) or similar level 1 spell.

Not sure how much this helps when you have lots of angry "friends" coming after you but I have had to repeatedly cast a "touch" spell before I freeze something to death (assuming he doesn't save). I notice the bug alot when casting on an elevated "Z?" axis and it wont reset until I cast the above mentioned "style" of spells. (But happens even on flat terrain also just not as often)

About the Z axis, do you me putting the camera above you and looking down at the top of your head?

I did trying multiple camera angles, but was not able to fix it.

I did not try switching spells to see if anything "reset", I had not thought of that.

I tried targeted and untargeted. I did not target myself.

[Junts]

Cone isnt short range damage and its extremely ineffective at very short ranges. Like other projectile spells, if your hand is inside a mob when the projectile appears, it won't do anything.

You want to be a significant distance from a mob pack so that the wide part of the cone will hit htem. If you cast it at short range, you will miss monsters even 30 degrees from straight ahead of you because the cone is very long and widens slowly. Try casting the spell from a haste radius away. The cone is even longer than the animation! You want to use it from a comfortable distance to hit a large pack.

For pointblank aoeing, use explosive spells like fireball/ball lightning/otilukes freezing sphere, and jump when you cast them so that you can't have them appear inside a monster. casting them straight down into a mob's head makes them extremely effective, because the explosion will be in midair and will consequently hit a wider range, just like how atomic bombs are detonated in freefall and not by impacting the ground - the explosion will hit a wider area if it's elevated than if it's triggered at groundlevel.

[redoubt]

Cone isnt short range damage and its extremely ineffective at very short ranges. Like other projectile spells, if your hand is inside a mob when the projectile appears, it won't do anything.

You want to be a significant distance from a mob pack so that the wide part of the cone will hit htem. If you cast it at short range, you will miss monsters even 30 degrees from straight ahead of you because the cone is very long and widens slowly. Try casting the spell from a haste radius away. The cone is even longer than the animation! You want to use it from a comfortable distance to hit a large pack.

For pointblank aoeing, use explosive spells like fireball/ball lightning/otilukes freezing sphere, and jump when you cast them so that you can't have them appear inside a monster. casting them straight down into a mob's head makes them extremely effective, because the explosion will be in midair and will consequently hit a wider range, just like how atomic bombs are detonated in freefall and not by impacting the ground - the explosion will hit a wider area if it's elevated than if it's triggered at groundlevel.


Okay, I was wondering if camera/animation was a factor here. At the very close range I was working, it is highly likely that my hands would overlap with one or more of the mobs. I'll try some more from a greater distance and see what happens.

I'll try the sphere as well as it sounds better for an up close pack as I was waiting for them all to get to me and group up before I cast.

Thanks!

[Junts]

Okay, I was wondering if camera/animation was a factor here. At the very close range I was working, it is highly likely that my hands would overlap with one or more of the mobs. I'll try some more from a greater distance and see what happens.

I'll try the sphere as well as it sounds better for an up close pack as I was waiting for them all to get to me and group up before I cast.

Thanks!

If you want to use cone for that purpose (and the wide end of cone is much wider than all the spells I listed but delayedblats fb), drop a web and get them stuck in it, then take about 8 steps away and turn around and throw your cone.

You can easily hit 12-15 mobs that way.

Another good option is otto's dancing sphere: mobs that are dancing take a -10 reflex save penalty, so it both clumps them and makes them take more damage. Later, mass hold monster does the same and guarantees they will fail their save (imp evasion mobs still take 1/2 damage), in addition to the 50% damage bonus from them being helpless.

[redoubt]

If you want to use cone for that purpose (and the wide end of cone is much wider than all the spells I listed but delayedblats fb), drop a web and get them stuck in it, then take about 8 steps away and turn around and throw your cone.

You can easily hit 12-15 mobs that way.

Another good option is otto's dancing sphere: mobs that are dancing take a -10 reflex save penalty, so it both clumps them and makes them take more damage. Later, mass hold monster does the same and guarantees they will fail their save (imp evasion mobs still take 1/2 damage), in addition to the 50% damage bonus from them being helpless.

I went back and gave this a whirl. Worked much better knowing that animation clipping would screw up the spell (can't believe thats still an issue). I could not use web on them, as they were all fire critters, but I just ran a bit, spun around and threw a cone of cold.

Also the tip on freezing sphere was gold. I had not tried that one yet. Thanks again.

+1 coming your way for knowing not only why I was having a problem, but offering a solution AND an additional techinique to help out.

edit: Figures, can't find enough people posting good stuff and can't give you more rep yet. Lame rep system...

[Junts]

I went back and gave this a whirl. Worked much better knowing that animation clipping would screw up the spell (can't believe thats still an issue). I could not use web on them, as they were all fire critters, but I just ran a bit, spun around and threw a cone of cold.

Also the tip on freezing sphere was gold. I had not tried that one yet. Thanks again.

+1 coming your way for knowing not only why I was having a problem, but offering a solution AND an additional techinique to help out.

edit: Figures, can't find enough people posting good stuff and can't give you more rep yet. Lame rep system...

My final Caster Tips #1 and #2, the one that inadvertantly leads to shooting down into their heads:

1: Never stand still
2: Never cast a spell while your feat are touching the ground unless you're buffing. JUMP.

The collision detection for all projectile spells in DDO, from enervations/energy drains to polar rays to lightning bolts, fireballs, etc, are all better when they are shot diagonally. Its much easier to hit a moving target with a spell that's being shot at a downward angle. Further, moving will naturally avoid a great deal of damage -and- jumping will ensure that casting never slows you down when you cast. You can even learn when to time your jumps for longer-casting spells like dancing sphere/clouds/etc that have the big windup to spend most of their animation in the air and consequently moving forward at full speed. This really limits the amount of exposure you have to moving slowly.

Those things + displacement + stoneskin + protection from the elements = living casters.

Stoneskin and pr otection give you ablative damage protection you can recast when they're removed so that you can't be 2 shot by chainlightning or fireball spam with your horrific saves. Stoneskin does the same for melee, protects you when knocked down, and essentially gives you +10 concentration by reducing the size of melee hits by 10.

[Kaldais]

I have noticed some oddities with Cone of Cold since update 9, specifically when mouse look targeted, my spell failed to hit a single target even tho having the spell visual effect passing over 5-6 creatures. Possible problem with the spell horizonal collision check. I have noticed the spell was bugging when I was standing on uneven ground level.

[LolWutRoflstomped]

CoC has awful targeting. Swap it for a DoT and pick up Otiluke's for better and farther targeting along with more damage.

[Aeolwind]

Couple with the fact that quicken doesnt guarantee a spell will fire when under attack. Ive had quickened mass heals interrupted before both a meteor swarm from Harry and one in elite sins from 4 orthons beating on me. Not to mention air & earth elementals.

[Cyr]

As others have commented CoC really is most effective at a short distance. If you could use a touch spell on the mob you probably are going to have trouble hitting them with CoC or might not even have it cast if you are targetting them. I've gotten to the point that I will not carry it any longer as it really is frustrating to target and otiluke's is much easier to use.

[Tuney]

But Quicken should , its primary job is 2 parted. Faster casting animation and negating the need to roll for concentration checks.

[Cauthey]

CoC has awful targeting. Swap it for a DoT and pick up Otiluke's for better and farther targeting along with more damage.

+1 for the forum name. :D