Double or Triple Ranged DPS

[h4x0r1f1c]

Hi guys. I have 2 very well DPS oriented built ranger friends.

Like.. one is a 12ftr,6ranger,2monk elf AA with 53str + some ranged alacrity ToD set.

The other is a 18ftr,1bard,1barb elf AA + Black Dragonscale Armor.

Anyway, I told them both to Manyshot me at the same time with no stat damage/slayer arrows/lightning strike, right?

They did and they both used Force Burst and I didn't even come close to dying!!! It was so easy!

That said, Slayer Arrows are OP. Why not double or triple ranged DPS but nerf stat damage and Slayer Arrows?

As far as I know it's only there to instakill properly built, high-HP toons in PvP.

Also, it's giving a free pass to all those silly capped rangers who proc 0s on me. That ain't right!

Currently I have a Docent of Defiance and Bramble-Casters, which do not stack, but do well enough.

I have 2 healing spells and you know what? If they can have Pale Lavender Ioun Stones they don't need Slayer Arrows!

So make your choice devs. Fix ranged DPS in PvE and PvP or there might forever be bickering on the subject.

[asphodeli]

Hmmm....no thanks.

[t0r012]

I have 2 very well DPS oriented built ranger friends.
oxy moron?


Anyway, I told them both to Manyshot me at the same time with no stat damage/slayer arrows/lightning strike, right? ummm... sure Mr Sorcerer hit me for all you got just no insta kills and you can't use max or empow.
just seems kinda silly that when you take away all their good options then complain that their damage sucks.

[DrNuegebauer]

fail.

People only bicker because 'dps' is simply a part of the equation when it comes to ranged combat.

The other part is running around kiting stuff and not getting hit while taking it down from a distance.

And then the OTHER part is shouting 'pew pew pew' over voice chat while doing it!

[callforkills]

Umm your ranger friends may be well built, but definately dont have good gear if they cant take you down quickly
with manyshot.

[t0r012]

Umm your ranger friends may be well built, but definately dont have good gear if they cant take you down quickly
with manyshot.

except he won't let them use it for the "test" even if they had it, just like he didn't with this "test".

[JDCrowell]

Hi guys. I have 2 very well DPS oriented built ranger friends.

Like.. one is a 12ftr,6ranger,2monk elf AA with 53str + some ranged alacrity ToD set.

The other is a 18ftr,1bard,1barb elf AA + Black Dragonscale Armor.

Anyway, I told them both to Manyshot me at the same time with no stat damage/slayer arrows/lightning strike, right?

They did and they both used Force Burst and I didn't even come close to dying!!! It was so easy!

That said, Slayer Arrows are OP. Why not double or triple ranged DPS but nerf stat damage and Slayer Arrows?

As far as I know it's only there to instakill properly built, high-HP toons in PvP.

Also, it's giving a free pass to all those silly capped rangers who proc 0s on me. That ain't right!

Currently I have a Docent of Defiance and Bramble-Casters, which do not stack, but do well enough.

I have 2 healing spells and you know what? If they can have Pale Lavender Ioun Stones they don't need Slayer Arrows!

So make your choice devs. Fix ranged DPS in PvE and PvP or there might forever be bickering on the subject.

First off.... slayer arrows were (as well as everything else in this game) were meant for PvE. Nothing was meant for PvP, and if it was, this game would be an epic fail on several levels.

I do however feel ranged DPS needs to be changed, but for the better. If slayer arrows are OP, then what do you think of vorpals?

You have no sense of logic in your ideas.

Wise man once said: Think first, speak later.

[Blank_Zero]

You just got reset, you gained a little bit of green...and now this again? h4x, you gotta stop it.... you wonder why you were sitting at ~4000 negs? This kinda posting is why.

[Spoprockel]

Why not double or triple ranged DPS but nerf stat damage and Slayer Arrows?

As far as I know it's only there to instakill properly built, high-HP toons in PvP.


In how many threads have you asked for that nerf now? I'm sure you keep track somewhere.

Some people actually don't care about PVP. AAs are using slayer arrows and stat damagers in quests to kill monsters.

True story.


Nobody will nerf anything just to allow your arcane to become the god of the pvp pits, with nobody left to ever beat him.

If that is not the reason you keep asking for the same things over and over again, please, enlighten me.

[h4x0r1f1c]

Umm your ranger friends may be well built, but definately dont have good gear if they cant take you down quickly
with manyshot.

Not everyone is poorly built/geared.

The 12ftr,6ranger,2monk AA was using a tier 3 GS bow. (his non-lightning strike one)

I also have Sorcerer casting speed and Reconstruct + Repair Critical.

Thing is, I still get caught on my heals by Slayer Arrows. (20% or 1/5 the time during Manyshot)

[Senshock]

You just got reset, you gained a little bit of green...and now this again? h4x, you gotta stop it.... you wonder why you were sitting at ~4000 negs? This kinda posting is why.


In how many threads have you asked for that nerf now? I'm sure you keep track somewhere.

Some people actually don't care about PVP. AAs are using slayer arrows and stat damagers in quests to kill monsters.

True story.


Nobody will nerf anything just to allow your arcane to become the god of the pvp pits, with nobody left to ever beat him.

If that is not the reason you keep asking for the same things over and over again, please, enlighten me.

/QFT


/notsigned
/IbtL

[Cam_Neely]

Wise man once said: Think first, speak later.

This one works here as well
"Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt"

/not signed
/ibtl

[kernal42]

Hi guys. I have 2 very well DPS oriented built ranger friends.

Like.. one is a 12ftr,6ranger,2monk elf AA with 53str + some ranged alacrity ToD set.

The other is a 18ftr,1bard,1barb elf AA + Black Dragonscale Armor.

Anyway, I told them both to Manyshot me at the same time with no stat damage/slayer arrows/lightning strike, right?

They did and they both used Force Burst and I didn't even come close to dying!!! It was so easy!

That said, Slayer Arrows are OP. Why not double or triple ranged DPS but nerf stat damage and Slayer Arrows?

As far as I know it's only there to instakill properly built, high-HP toons in PvP.

Also, it's giving a free pass to all those silly capped rangers who proc 0s on me. That ain't right!

Currently I have a Docent of Defiance and Bramble-Casters, which do not stack, but do well enough.

I have 2 healing spells and you know what? If they can have Pale Lavender Ioun Stones they don't need Slayer Arrows!

So make your choice devs. Fix ranged DPS in PvE and PvP or there might forever be bickering on the subject.

It is true that slayer arrows contribute a disproportionately large amount of dps to ranged characters. I would support shifting some of this dps into ranged combat in general and out of the AA PRE.

Cheers,
Kernal

[eonfreon]

Devs can you please just give h4x a button to just "win" pvp?
He obviously needs it because everything that kills him is overpowered.

[smithtj3]

H4x, I have a special place in my heart for you but your lack of understanding for this game beyond PvP is alarming.

[cpito]

As far as I know it's only there to instakill properly built, high-HP toons in PvP.

Nothing in this game is designed for pvp except the pvp pits (the exception that proves the rule?).

[Farayon]

Another day, another thread started by Dispel calling for a ranger nerf. *yawn*

[Fishcatch22]

Devs can you please just give h4x a button to just "win" pvp?
He obviously needs it because everything that kills him is overpowered.Anything that kills anything is overpowered. Hasn't H4x taught you that by now?

[krackythehoodedone]

Properly geared and built ranged toon at endgame is gonna do 60 points of damage per arrow. (I know several that can do more) No slayer, no crits or burst,blast damage or stat damagers or lightnning stike or any other nasty proc. That is all extra.
Decentish ROF is about 8 arrows per second during manyshot which means your gonna be on the floor in about five or six seconds from start from just one toon unless you got over a thousand hit points. That includes the prot your DoD provides. You might manage to glug a silver flame pot or two which might keep you alive a little longer but down you are gonna go. Were you blocking up with loads of extra blocking DR ?
Bit silly for you to be allowed to use all your special gear when the rangers couldnt use any of theirs?

[Recovery]

Tho' he keeps searching for an answer
He never seems to find what he's looking for.
Oh Lord, he prays to give him strength to carry on
'cos he knows what it means to walk along the lonely street of dreams.

Here he goes again on his own....

[krud]

If anything all it shows is that everything concerning ranged combat, except slaying arrows, needs to be seriously BUFFED. Leave slaying arrows alone and buff up everything else. That would take care it.

[Dandonk]

No.

Fix ranged's missing shots. Fix the aggro from ranged attacks.

But don't randomly change basic mechanics just because someone plays PvP (which is a silly concept in a D&D based game) and thinks only of PvP, with no regard for PvE (which is the core of this game).

[KreepyKritter]

Y'know what, H4x is right... I mean, lets just go ahead and nerf slayer arrows and stat damage, throw out vorpal weapons, while we're at it we'll throw out paralyzers and nerf the Hold and Flesh to Stone spells, get rid of finger of death. And since we're doing all this, we'll also nerf Power Attack, shorten the duration of Rage, may as well get rid of Haste as well, and... y'know what, no more armor either. Everyone will just have to wear robes and outfits from now on, no matter their level or Dex bonus.

Wait... what?

Oh! You mean this isn't a thread meant for sarcastically making requests that would absolutely ruin the game?

My bad. Mock on.

[Daggaz]

Hi guys. I have 2 very well DPS oriented built ranger friends.

Like.. one is a 12ftr,6ranger,2monk elf AA with 53str + some ranged alacrity ToD set.

The other is a 18ftr,1bard,1barb elf AA + Black Dragonscale Armor.

Anyway, I told them both to Manyshot me at the same time with no stat damage/slayer arrows/lightning strike, right?

They did and they both used Force Burst and I didn't even come close to dying!!! It was so easy!

That said, Slayer Arrows are OP. Why not double or triple ranged DPS but nerf stat damage and Slayer Arrows?

As far as I know it's only there to instakill properly built, high-HP toons in PvP.

Also, it's giving a free pass to all those silly capped rangers who proc 0s on me. That ain't right!

Currently I have a Docent of Defiance and Bramble-Casters, which do not stack, but do well enough.

I have 2 healing spells and you know what? If they can have Pale Lavender Ioun Stones they don't need Slayer Arrows!

So make your choice devs. Fix ranged DPS in PvE and PvP or there might forever be bickering on the subject.

One of the most important advances in grammar was the invention of the paragraph. As a method for organising one's thoughts in a clear and concise manner with the ultimate aim of ease of reading for another party, the paragraph is unparalleled. The idea is simple; start with one paragraph, and when you have covered one subject, switch to a new one! In fact, the idea is so good, it is widespread in languages across the globe. From the latin languages, to the germanics, and even cryllic and far-eastern realms, everybody is using paragraphs!

It is not just a simple idea in concept, it is incredibly easy to put into actual use. When you have covered a topic, more or less, and are going to change subject slightly, simply start a new paragraph! Ta-da! This cues the reader that a change in topic, however slight, is taking place. It also makes reading easier on the eyes, as the text is seperated into small, maneagable sections, each with their own purpose. All in all, paragraphs are a great thing for every burgeoning writer.

Unfortunately, the paragraph is in decline. The advent of the internet has seen wide-spread abuses of the convention. Perhaps it is the anonymity or ease of the media, maybe it is the informal feel of emails, it might even be a product of quick-firing, venemous online message boards, nobody knows the true reason for this disturbing trend. It might not even be the internet at all, but instead the rather troubling lowering of standards in public education which is to blame. One thing is certain; the paragraph, as a standard of good grammar and excellence in communication, should be upheld!

Also, to get back on topic, what is the point of consistently posting threads which, infalliably, attempt to force PvP views on the game as a whole? You know they will be shot down, and you know exactly why, so it is obviously not because you are trying to get the overall opinion of other players, or even garner support. Is it just to troll, or simply posting because you can, or have you truly not understood the difference between PvP and DDO? Enlighten me, please.

[LordPiglet]

Anything that kills H4x is overpowered. Hasn't H4x taught you that by now?

fix it for you ;)

hmmm, maybe someone should jump into the pit with a Vac II bow.

I'd so do this if I had the spare larges.

[Ironforge_Clan]

oxy moron?

ummm... sure Mr Sorcerer hit me for all you got just no insta kills and you can't use max or empow.
just seems kinda silly that when you take away all their good options then complain that their damage sucks.

I'm just surprised at the 2 friends comment.

[Aethene]

Let me see if I'm understanding what you are saying....

Archers are using an enhancement and it's killing you, and you are upset and want the game changed so that archers don't kill you in PvP? Furthermore you want to kill them, and as a caster, you presumably use maximize and empower?
Here is an idea... get a second computer and a free to play account, then log that account in, put him in a PvP pit and kill him without worrying about dying.

I was not aware that the game revolved around you.


/ not signed

[flynnjsw]

Tho' he keeps searching for an answer
He never seems to find what he's looking for.
Oh Lord, he prays to give him strength to carry on
'cos he knows what it means to walk along the lonely street of dreams.

Here he goes again on his own....

I really don't know whether Whitesnake lyrics showing the /fail of the OP is /fail or/win. The jury is out on that one.

[Thornton]

Yet another thread that could have been avoided by the removal of PvP from the game.

[unionyes]

What is this 'PvP' you speak of? Is it one of he new quests from the last mod?

And, if we are using lyrics today.........

I walk these streets
A loaded longbow in my hands
I play for keeps
Cuz I might not make it back
I've been every where
And I'm still standing tall
I've seen a million PVP pits
And I've rocked them all.

Cuz I'm a ranger
On manyshot I rely
And I'm wanted
Nerfed or Alive.

[samthedagger]

Hi guys. I have 2 very well DPS oriented built ranger friends.

Like.. one is a 12ftr,6ranger,2monk elf AA with 53str + some ranged alacrity ToD set.

The other is a 18ftr,1bard,1barb elf AA + Black Dragonscale Armor.

Anyway, I told them both to Manyshot me at the same time with no stat damage/slayer arrows/lightning strike, right?

They did and they both used Force Burst and I didn't even come close to dying!!! It was so easy!

That said, Slayer Arrows are OP. Why not double or triple ranged DPS but nerf stat damage and Slayer Arrows?

As far as I know it's only there to instakill properly built, high-HP toons in PvP.

Also, it's giving a free pass to all those silly capped rangers who proc 0s on me. That ain't right!

Currently I have a Docent of Defiance and Bramble-Casters, which do not stack, but do well enough.

I have 2 healing spells and you know what? If they can have Pale Lavender Ioun Stones they don't need Slayer Arrows!

So make your choice devs. Fix ranged DPS in PvE and PvP or there might forever be bickering on the subject.

http://nextmusiconline.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/Beat_Dead_Horse.jpg

[KreepyKritter]

Really... did this thread really need a new rendition of a bad Bon Jovi song?

[Cam_Neely]

Really... did this thread really need a new rendition of a bad Bon Jovi song?

yes,
yes it did

[unionyes]

Really... did this thread really need a new rendition of a bad Bon Jovi song?

But the movie Young Guns was good, back in the day.

[Fishcatch22]

http://nextmusiconline.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/Beat_Dead_Horse.jpghttp://members.arstechnica.com/x/helpless_will/deadhorse.jpg

[Shaamis]

Devs can you please just give h4x a button to just "win" pvp?
He obviously needs it because everything that kills him is overpowered.

This is just a behavior he has learned to work in his past: When his own abilty/reflexes/skill fails him, to come at a different "angle" in order to level the playing field in his favor.

This is part of a larger problem in society, when someone gets lazy, or unable to rise to the level of achievement they feel entitled to, they have to try by any means necessary to get to that level, whether its by lying, cheating, stealing, altering the rules, or **GASP** working harder for it (VERY RARE)

Me, I don't give a ^&*(, call me what you want in game, i log out every night and go to bed with my wife, so I can go to work the next morning.

[lazylaz]

I had to check the date on this thread to make sure it wsn't something necro'ed.

H4x, are you trying to get the devs to differentiate between what AA can do in pvp vs what they can do in pve? Same abilities with different outcomes depending on circumstances?

And while I'm surprised you actually know two people who have AA characters well enough to call them friends I'm glad you have a theme song now.

[unionyes]

This is just a behavior he has learned to work in his past: When his own abilty/reflexes/skill fails him, to come at a different "angle" in order to level the playing field in his favor.

This is part of a larger problem in society, when someone gets lazy, or unable to rise to the level of achievement they feel entitled to, they have to try by any means necessary to get to that level, whether its by lying, cheating, stealing, altering the rules, or **GASP** working harder for it (VERY RARE)

Me, I don't give a ^&*(, call me what you want in game, i log out every night and go to bed with my wife, so I can go to work the next morning.

I agree. Someone, somewhere, has rewarded this behavior in the past, so we are seeing it in the present.

It's commendable to try to better yourself. It's horrible to try to do so by changing the rules to give yourself an advantage. Figure out what the rules are, work within them, and succeed. Or don't.

I suck at PvP. I accidentally wandered in there back in 2007 when I started playing, not knowing what it was, and got creamed. I went back once, in 2009, to see what I might be missing and it was pretty meh.

But, if it would help the current situation, I would commit to letting my 6 year old take my bard into the PvP pit once a week so 'someone' could kill him a few times so they could feel better about the world. Heck, my kid would love it. He mostly just runs around in the harbor anyhow, drowning or accidentally running into Durks and breaking my stuff on the oozes, so PvP would be right up his alley. I wouldn't even post a screenshot if he happened to win :)

[Chai]

So make your choice devs. Fix ranged DPS in PvE and PvP or there might forever be bickering on the subject.

The only way there would forever be bickering on this subject is if ranged was changed to pass up melee in DPS. Let me know if this is going to happen in advance please, because I will have to stock the shop with extra pitch forks, kerosene, and fire up the popcorn maker.

[eonfreon]

The only way there would forever be bickering on this subject is if ranged was changed to pass up melee in DPS. Let me know if this is going to happen in advance please, because I will have to stock the shop with extra pitch forks, kerosene, and fire up the popcorn maker.

Not necessarily. It would just mean that (most) everyone would switch to Ranged characters (after all the uproar died down) and kite Mobs all over the place while taking far less damage than one would who's doing toe-to-toe melee.
I believe this is what happened in Beta, which is why Ranged combat was weakened so much.
The Devs are not likely to go this route without requiring a major amount of "dedication" in Feat and gear to make Ranged that powerful.

[Fenrisulven6]

You need to get your head around the fact that PvP is an optional.

Look, I know how you feel. I had the same problem when MS dropped their support of CTF in Mechwarrior when Mercs came out. We had to make all kinds of house rules to keep our niche alive, because we knew the devs would not consider any kind of patch that would take away from the core of the Mechwarrior game.

What you might try is asking for some kind of customizable PVP map, where you can ban certain weapons.

[Chai]

Not necessarily. It would just mean that (most) everyone would switch to Ranged characters (after all the uproar died down) and kite Mobs all over the place while taking far less damage than one would who's doing toe-to-toe melee.
I believe this is what happened in Beta, which is why Ranged combat was weakened so much.
The Devs are not likely to go this route without requiring a major amount of "dedication" in Feat and gear to make Ranged that powerful.

The amount of power that melee has gained since those days -vs- the amount of power ranged has gained since then is not even an apples to apples comparison. Everybody just seems to accept this, just as they accepted that sorcs were more powerful than wizards for 4+ years (oh, look at those sorcs moan nowdays, lol)

If ranged was made anywhere near as powerful as melee, the hilarity would ensue to the point that would make the U5 combat nerf update seem like another quiet day at the office.

There are other games where ranged does have as much if not more DPS power than melee, and everyone doesnt just flock over to ranged toons. Hunters in WOW deal out more DPS in raids than other melee toons, and bear less risk due to not having to stand next to raid mobs that radiate AOE damage away from themselves. This is before you count their pet, who is a separate entry in the DPS meter, heh.

Right now ranged in DDO does damage ~ to TWF +5 longswords without improved crit, with no effects on them, but in order to do so, they have to get the same level of crazy epic gear and spend the same build points / enhancement points as the 80 str melees have who are crushing 700+ point crits and auto crit that takes 4000 HP trash down in a few seconds. Ranged is getting the same treatment nowdays as monks were getting 18 months ago or so. I think there is still "enough room for improvement" without risking ranged being OP due to giving it more love.

[eonfreon]

The amount of power that melee has gained since those days -vs- the amount of power ranged has gained since then is not even an apples to apples comparison. Everybody just seems to accept this, just as they accepted that sorcs were more powerful than wizards for 4+ years (oh, look at those sorcs moan nowdays, lol)

If ranged was made anywhere near as powerful as melee, the hilarity would ensue to the point that would make the U5 combat nerf update seem like another quiet day at the office.

There are other games where ranged does have as much if not more DPS power than melee, and everyone doesnt just flock over to ranged toons. Hunters in WOW deal out more DPS in raids than other melee toons, and bear less risk due to not having to stand next to raid mobs that radiate AOE damage away from themselves. This is before you count their pet, who is a separate entry in the DPS meter, heh.

Right now ranged in DDO does damage ~ to TWF +5 longswords without improved crit, with no effects on them, but in order to do so, they have to get the same level of crazy epic gear and spend the same build points / enhancement points as the 80 str melees have who are crushing 700+ point crits and auto crit that takes 4000 HP trash down in a few seconds. Ranged is getting the same treatment nowdays as monks were getting 18 months ago or so. I think there is still "enough room for improvement" without risking ranged being OP due to giving it more love.


Why would "hilarity" ensue? People have been asking for Ranged to be buffed for a long time now. The biggest opposition I've ever seen to a Ranged character in a party is that he generaly takes so much longer to kill a foe. So all the melees kill their foes then wind up trying to help the Ranged character and quickly get frustrated trying to swing at a Mob that's being kited everywhere.
Many times the melees will just give up and tell the Ranged character to catch up when he finally kills the Mob. Of course this gets incredibly frustrating when it's a Mob that has to die to advance the quest along.

If Ranged Characters were made to be about equal in killing power the melees wouldn't really complain much. If Ranged charcaters became much more powerful quite a lot would gravitate to Ranged, if all else stayed equal. You can't really compare other games; the mechanics are different.

In this game, at one point in Beta, Ranged was overpowered so everyone created Ranged characters and had a very easy time with the content.

there was no apple to apple comparison in melee power gain vs ranged power gain because Ranged was deliberately nerfed.

I think if the Devs "accidentally" buffed Ranged to be equal to melee damage, the Devs would be more up in arms about it then the players would. Buffing Ranged would be no where near the same outcry as the TWF nerfs.

[Llewndyn]

*backdrop of a well groomed older gentleman sitting in a dimly lit bar, buxom beauties at his side. His hair is silver mottled with black, to show not only his experience but the virility that gained that experience. Casual suit, open throated shirt, not because he is too lazy to wear a tie but because nothing can hold all of the awesome bursting forth. He gently picks up a wineglass of H4x0r1f1c's post, swirls it around, and looks knowingly at the camera*

"I don't always read forums, but when I do, I prefer nerf threads. Stay classy, PVP"

Fade to black.

[Quarterling]

See my opinion below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Nx1DCGDScw&feature=related

[Bracosius]

Play a different game. DDO is not for PvP. Warhammer has a free endless trial up to level 10. Go play PvP there and come back here when you want to quest.

Problem solved.

[KillEveryone]

You just got reset, you gained a little bit of green...and now this again? h4x, you gotta stop it.... you wonder why you were sitting at ~4000 negs? This kinda posting is why.

Look for a rep button for his name and you will not find it.

He has been opted out of the system much like the devs are out of the system.

/not signed.

Quit asking for nerfs.

Learn how to play the game.

[NinjaCereal]

As far as I know it's only there to instakill properly built, high-HP toons in PvP.


<sarcasm>

Wow, really?! Silly me, I had no idea!!
And to think, all this time I've been using slayer arrows in quests because they helped a ton! Now someone finally tells me that they're only for pvp?!
How could I be so ignorant?!

</sarcasm>

With your vendetta against arcane archers, I am still baffled. How the heck did my main character end up on your friends list?

/not signed

[Chai]

Why would "hilarity" ensue? People have been asking for Ranged to be buffed for a long time now. The biggest opposition I've ever seen to a Ranged character in a party is that he generaly takes so much longer to kill a foe. So all the melees kill their foes then wind up trying to help the Ranged character and quickly get frustrated trying to swing at a Mob that's being kited everywhere.
Many times the melees will just give up and tell the Ranged character to catch up when he finally kills the Mob. Of course this gets incredibly frustrating when it's a Mob that has to die to advance the quest along. .

How many times have the forumites asked for something to change, and when it did, moaned even harder after the change than they previously did? Dont get me started on this. There have been quite a few times where I have said we need to be careful what we wish for, heh.

The hilarity would ensue because people have made toons for years with the knowledge and complete acceptance of the fact that ranged is hugely gimped in this game to the point where changing that after all this time would cause mass moaning on the level of a 70s zombie flick.


If Ranged Characters were made to be about equal in killing power the melees wouldn't really complain much. If Ranged charcaters became much more powerful quite a lot would gravitate to Ranged, if all else stayed equal. You can't really compare other games; the mechanics are different.

We can compare other games, because things that work in other games like EQ are not made to work here, but not for the reasons we think they wont work for. The U5 combat nerf borrowed the entire concept of dual wield, double attack, and off hand proc from that_very_game, and was made to work here. So why would their ranged mechanic not work here as well? DDO also only balances for one aspect, where the example I highlighted balances for two. PVP, and PVE. We can compare players reactions to what happens in other games when we make statements saying there would be a mass gravitation to ranged if it was improved to be more powerful than melee. All we need to do is look at examples where this is the case and see there is no mass exodus. Hunter is a popular class for sure, but WOW raids arent 5 healers 2 tanks and 18 hunters, heh.


In this game, at one point in Beta, Ranged was overpowered so everyone created Ranged characters and had a very easy time with the content.

I remember those times, however, since then the level of power the melee have gained compared to the level of power range gained isnt even comparable. It would be like putting a ******** 4th grader in the ring with Mike Tyson in his prime. Also, the level of content power compared to melee and ranged power gain is another ratio that supports my stance here. Back then even after the ROF nerf, ranged toons who never put the bow down were still viable when 10 was the level cap. When 16 became the cap, this went downhill and now that 20 is the cap, fully specced AA are manyshotting, then meleeing, heh. That sends a pretty strong signal.


there was no apple to apple comparison in melee power gain vs ranged power gain because Ranged was deliberately nerfed.

And melee wasnt? remember spaz attack? Yeap, both melee AND ranged took a ROF hit, big time.


I think if the Devs "accidentally" buffed Ranged to be equal to melee damage, the Devs would be more up in arms about it then the players would. Buffing Ranged would be no where near the same outcry as the TWF nerfs.

Because ranged hasnt had a taste of power melee has yet. Its worse to give and then taketh away than it is to not give at all.

That being said, I still believe that if ranged toons suddenly began soloing epics or something crazy, those people who were satisfied and merely accepted ranged being as gimped as it is, would be up in arms, because they would feel entitled to, and have been entitled to, doing WAY more damage with melee, for the same investment in build points, action points, and gear grinding.

[Llewndyn]

1. Mike Tyson IS a ******** 4th grader.
2. All these song lyrics don't even come close to the original "You will dance when the bard makes you" and I stand behind that statement, but since we are playing:

(Jitterbug)

You put the slayer arrow into my heart (yeah yeah)
Makes me go *ding* *Ding* *ding* with your manyshot
you put the caper spell into my brain (ooh yeah)
and though I whine for nerfs you continue the same

But soon I'll win
you know that's right
because I started
another nerf thread last night

I can't fight back
because I'm dead
instead of learning the game
I'm gonna beg for nerfs instead!

PVP! It is a yo-yo
bards make me caper; AAs make me ghost ghost
PVP! It is a yo-yo
and it makes nerf threads alriiiiiight!

OK singing this out loud just made someone outside my office spit up their coffee so I know it's good :P

[Talon_Moonshadow]

You're not on Argonesson by any chance are you? I'd be interested in trying that with my archer. Both to satisfy my ego with my own build (which is not the build others think is the best) and to get some idea of the honesty/accuracy of your story.

[cdbd3rd]

It's horrible to try to do so by changing the rules to give yourself an advantage....:)


Only Kirk may access the Kobayashi Maru files... ;)





*backdrop of a well groomed older gentleman sitting in a dimly lit bar, buxom beauties at his side. His hair is silver mottled with black, to show not only his experience but the virility that gained that experience. Casual suit, open throated shirt, not because he is too lazy to wear a tie but because nothing can hold all of the awesome bursting forth. He gently picks up a wineglass of H4x0r1f1c's post, swirls it around, and looks knowingly at the camera*

"I don't always read forums, but when I do, I prefer nerf threads. Stay classy, PVP"

Fade to black.


http://i621.photobucket.com/albums/tt291/cdbd3rd/cdemotes/drool.gif

Hey, who's the weird guy sitting next to those bodaciousnesses? :D

[Falco_Easts]

This is not a suggestion thread. You are deliberately opening an old topic you know will start flaming.
Ending with a threat is never a good idea.

[Kaeldur]

So make your choice devs. Fix ranged DPS in PvE and PvP or there might forever be bickering on the subject.
What a joke.

Could you please, for the sake of your own reputation, stop these suggestions? Play the game and learn it, stop trying to make DDO adapt to you, you are the one who needs to adapt to DDO...

And in response to your signature, I don't know how to be interviewed by DDO, but if your ideas are these that you're posting, then no, you don't have a bunch of great ideas, I'm sorry...

[Seamonkeysix]

Only by the power of the "Thread Gods" do I not neg rep you for doing the same old trolling, flame attracting, Howard Coselling, posts again. Apparently I need to spread some rep, or I would so love to re-infect your greenis with the red ache.

You gotta stop.

Really...stop. :mad:

[Seamonkeysix]

<sarcasm>

How the heck did my main character end up on your friends list?

/not signed

Just go into the lobster and kill him once or twice with a Greater Construct Bane bow with slayer arrows on and manyshot. You'll be off his friends list lickity-split! :D

[Kaeldur]

Only by the power of the "Thread Gods" do I not neg rep you for doing the same old trolling, flame attracting, Howard Coselling, posts again. Apparently I need to spread some rep, or I would so love to re-infect your greenis with the red ache.

You gotta stop.

Really...stop. :mad:

Me? I'm not trying to... I'm actually trying to help him realize he should think more about what he's "suggesting"... I have seen tons of suggestions I don't agree with, but if they're well founded, explained and make a minimal sense, I can debate about them. But this OP is starting to make me think he's just doing this as a prank...

[Seamonkeysix]

Me? I'm not trying to... I'm actually trying to help him realize he should think more about what he's "suggesting"... I have seen tons of suggestions I don't agree with, but if they're well founded, explained and make a minimal sense, I can debate about them. But this OP is starting to make me think he's just doing this as a prank...

No...Not you. Him. This is the bajillionth time he has tried to figure out a way to bring up the same tired subject of nerfing manyshot and slaying arrow. First time was a "not a good suggestion post". Then he did a variant of the same idea within the next 24 hours. I think the folks that follow the forums can confirm this is approximately his 10th time to try to suggest the same thing by "word smithing" the same idea with different lingo.

At one point the kid had -4000ish rep. The sad thing is that in-game, he actually has some ability to play a decent caster. In the forums, he is a nuisance that just gets my goat because I actually find myself suckered into reading his post...only to find it's the same old BS.

[96th_Malice]

One of the most important advances in grammar was the invention of the paragraph. As a method for organising one's thoughts in a clear and concise manner with the ultimate aim of ease of reading for another party, the paragraph is unparalleled. The idea is simple; start with one paragraph, and when you have covered one subject, switch to a new one! In fact, the idea is so good, it is widespread in languages across the globe. From the latin languages, to the germanics, and even cryllic and far-eastern realms, everybody is using paragraphs!

It is not just a simple idea in concept, it is incredibly easy to put into actual use. When you have covered a topic, more or less, and are going to change subject slightly, simply start a new paragraph! Ta-da! This cues the reader that a change in topic, however slight, is taking place. It also makes reading easier on the eyes, as the text is seperated into small, maneagable sections, each with their own purpose. All in all, paragraphs are a great thing for every burgeoning writer.

Unfortunately, the paragraph is in decline. The advent of the internet has seen wide-spread abuses of the convention. Perhaps it is the anonymity or ease of the media, maybe it is the informal feel of emails, it might even be a product of quick-firing, venemous online message boards, nobody knows the true reason for this disturbing trend. It might not even be the internet at all, but instead the rather troubling lowering of standards in public education which is to blame. One thing is certain; the paragraph, as a standard of good grammar and excellence in communication, should be upheld!
.

Awesome !!! + 1 for you