First GS item does it have to be a MIN2?

[NaturalHazard]

Hi i was wondering for your first greensteel item, do you have to make a min2? Im playing a tempest ranger. I have holyburst silver weapons of maiming, do the min 2's work so much better on harry/suulo that i have to make them or can I wait and use those larges to make something else like a hp sp item or even a lit2? before i make those min2s?

[Srozbun]

Hi i was wondering for your first greensteel item, do you have to make a min2? Im playing a tempest ranger. I have holyburst silver weapons of maiming, do the min 2's work so much better on harry/suulo that i have to make them or can I wait and use those larges to make something else like a hp sp item or even a lit2? before i make those min2s?

If you have a DR bypasser, then no you do not need a min2. I've made 5 tier 3 GS items and none of them have been a min2. Granted my melees were pally and monk, but still, for any class there are generally better DPS options than min2.

[JustWinBaby]

Min II's do work better on Raid bosses - they have Holy (or Goodburst) and Metalline on them. The Silver of Maiming will not break the DR since it is Silver AND Good.

I'd create a Lit II before a Min II. Lit will work on everything, including Raid Bosses.

[Srozbun]

Min II's do work better on Raid bosses - they have Holy (or Goodburst) and Metalline on them. The Silver of Maiming will not break the DR since it is Silver AND Good.

I'd create a Lit II before a Min II. Lit will work on everything, including Raid Bosses.

I think his is a holy burst silver of maiming

[JustWinBaby]

I think his is a holy burst silver of maiming

Sorry I'm a tard.

Yes that would bypass the DR. Won't do as much damage as a Min II...but would still be effective. I'd still craft a Lit II first.

[NaturalHazard]

Min II's do work better on Raid bosses - they have Holy (or Goodburst) and Metalline on them. The Silver of Maiming will not break the DR since it is Silver AND Good.

I'd create a Lit II before a Min II. Lit will work on everything, including Raid Bosses.

Its holyburst silver. whoops didnt read down, ok lit 2, I will think about it, but does lit 2 bypass dr?

[JustWinBaby]

Its holyburst silver.

lol thanks...see above :)

[Glenalth]

I have holyburst silver weapons of maiming

Those are going to be pretty close to Min II vs Devil bosses.

I would only suggest a Min II for you if you need DR breakers for Demons or you can't fit Improved Crit into your build.


Lightning II does not bypass Devil bosses DR, but it does enough damage that on normal it does not matter. It is also much more effective vs enemies that only have DR/Good, such as a lot of Devil "trash mobs".

[Duke-H-]

Its holyburst silver. whoops didnt read down, ok lit 2, I will think about it, but does lit 2 bypass dr?

Lit II does not bypass pit fiend/horned devil dr, it is missing the silver property. It will bypass trash devil dr though.


Edit: Beaten to it :(

[NaturalHazard]

ok thanks, um vs trash devils I normally vorp, i have improved crit, I guess where lit 2 will really come in handy is vs the orthons in vod? also are there similar vorp immune trash in amarath quests?

[Matuse]

Yes that would bypass the DR. Won't do as much damage as a Min II...but would still be effective. I'd still craft a Lit II first.

Erm?

Min II ... weapon damage (slightly boosted for being greensteel), holy, and slicing.

Holy Burst Silver of Maiming ... weapon damage, holy, and then burst and maim on a crit, which we can presume happens about 1/4 of the time.

Harry and Suulo laugh at acid damage. So where exactly is the extra damage from the min2 coming from?

[ArkoHighStar]

Erm?

Min II ... weapon damage (slightly boosted for being greensteel), holy, and slicing.

Holy Burst Silver of Maiming ... weapon damage, holy, and then burst and maim on a crit, which we can presume happens about 1/4 of the time.

Harry and Suulo laugh at acid damage. So where exactly is the extra damage from the min2 coming from?

base damage on gs weapons are higher

[Duke-H-]

Over 20 swings.

Min II
095,0 = 19*5 (+5, 2-20)
082,5 = 15*5,5 = 15d10 (base damage, 2-16)
066,0 = 12*5,5 = 12d10 (critical base damage, 17-20)
133,0 = 38*3,5 = 38d6 (holy, 2-20)
047,5 = 19*2,5 = 20d4 (bleeding, 2-20)
---
424,0
+
066,5 = 19*3,5 = 19d6 (acid, 2-20)
044,0 = 8*5,5 = 8d10 (acid burst, 2d10, 17-20)
044,0 = 8*5,5 = 8d10 (acid blast, 2d10, 17-20)
014,0 = 4*3,5 = 4d6 (acid blast, 4d6, 20)
---
592,5

Holy Burst Silver of Maiming
095,0 = 19*5 (assumed +5, otherwise compensate, 2-20)
067,5 = 15*4,5 = 15d8 (base damage, 2-16)
054,0 = 12*4,5 = 12d8 (critical base damage, 17-20)
133,0 = 38*3,5 = 38d6 (holy, 2-20)
056,0 = 16*3,5 = 16d6 (holy burst, 4d6 on 17-20)
028,0 = 8*3,5 = 8d6 (maiming, 2d6, 17-20)
---
433,5

If this is correct (I seldom do these calculations) you have 424 vs 433,5 damage over 20 swings against Harry and the likes, that is assuming that all the acid damage is blocked (acid resist 30 on normal (http://ddowiki.com/page/Arraetrikos)) and you always roll average damage etc.
Note also that i did not account for fortification, should not change the numbers too much.

Forgot to mention, calculations done for Khopesh which favors burst effects. Not sure why i assumed that weapon type.

[jkm]

Lit will work on everything, including Raid Bosses.

queen lailat would like a word with you

[jkm]

Hi i was wondering for your first greensteel item, do you have to make a min2? Im playing a tempest ranger. I have holyburst silver weapons of maiming, do the min 2's work so much better on harry/suulo that i have to make them or can I wait and use those larges to make something else like a hp sp item or even a lit2? before i make those min2s?

it really depends on the character, but you'll get much more use out of that hit point item than the min 2 in your situation. where the min 2/lightning 2 etc shine is that they are ML12 weapons and just rock during TRs.

[NaturalHazard]

the only demons i really fight now is the demon queen? i use the silver bow and cold iron arrows for her, and have holyburst cold iron weapons if i ever need to melee her.

[Slink]

forget the nonsense.
Sounds like you have raid bosses covered.

make lit2 when you can afford it.
It is superior to min II in every way except elite raids and epic DQ.
Until then, make something in tri earth for epic trashmobs if epics are on your agenda.
Tri pos (sometimes only to tier 2) blunts for skellie beaters are nice + youll have rez clickies.
I do like incineration (tri fire) and tri neg and/or trap the soul for some mobs (elementals/animal type or anything that is not evil).
Making soulgems in epics is way sexy.

Only thing I have yet to make on any alt is crushing waves.
There simply are not enough fire eles around for me to warrant crafting such a thing.

Level more alts depending on how many high lvl chars you have.
The more chars you have looting ingreds, the easier it is to get your crafting done. ;)

[NaturalHazard]

um epics are not on my agenda atm I play one of those gimped things called a tempest ranger, worse hes an elf with no stunning blow, would earth grab picks make him able to be of some use in epics?

[Zilta]

earthgrab picks proc earthgrab on mobs which makes them autocrit. he suggests picks because they have a X4 crit since your planning on hitting autocrit earthgrabbed enemies anyway

[NaturalHazard]

even with the earth grab would I still be able to be of use in epics with no stunning blow ect?

[Zilta]

Well yes, in most quests in epic I have experienced (mainly vons and house P) the main strategy seems to be mass hold and kill. so long as you can do decent dps and dont have terrible hp you should be fine

[Hadrian]

even with the earth grab would I still be able to be of use in epics with no stunning blow ect?

Don't be afraid to run epics with a ranger.

The earthgrab picks allow you to hold your target with a similar effect to stunning blow. They will be auto-crit for a few seconds, and picks take best advantage of auto-crits with a x4 crit multiplier.

All you need to be useful in epic quests is enough to hit to make contact and enough common sense not to get into needless trouble. Most of the time, casters, bards and clerics will be doing what is necessary to prevent you from gaining aggro easily and to allow you to attack safely. All you need to do is be cautious and to attack whatever your other melee group members are hitting.

[DasLurch]

Call me crazy, but I'd reccomend a Min 2 item almost as much as a Min 2 weapon. GS weapons are nice but the items are where it's at. That's why the clenser you can take on your 20th completion is always an awesome reward. More so that most of the tomes you are offered.

As far as weapons go, I love Rad 2's. Trip earth and Pos are also sweet. Min 2 I put way ahead of Lit 2, because Lit 2 is more of a luxury item to me than anything else. Just my 2cp's but I hope it helps some.

[Wrendd]

I faced the same choice when I made my first GS weapon. I already had Metalline of PG for boss beating and wanted something new. I decided to go with a Lit 2 (holy, shocking burst, shocking blast) and have found it to be an excellent weapon in just about all situations. The lightning strike looks great and always gives me a nice warm feeling when it procs. Many Devils and Demons are not immune to lightning so the damage tends to be close to a Min2 untill you run the missions on elite.

On elite the bosses DR is high enough that you NEED silver+good to do effective damage and the lightning weapon falls behind.

I would suggest first making a Lit 2, then make your Min2. Since you are tempest you can wield both of them at the same timme in most quests and if you feel that the Lit 2 is falling behind you can switch out for the holy/silver/maiming weapon you already have.

Once you play with your 2 new GS items for a while and are ready to make some more (they are addictive) I would suggest making a double positive weapon, a warhammer might work for you. Double positive gives you a raise dead clicky and will do excelent damage against most things in the game, and is also wonderful for skelly bashing. You do not really need to make it tier 3 though. The Holy Blast and Greater Disruption is not worth the cost in large ingredients (IMO) because it will not be a primary weapon for you. I made my double positive a throwing hammer (just for grins and giggles) and I use it more for the clicky than anything else.

As someone else has said, a triple earth (Earthgrab) weapon is an excellent choice. It is cheap on the larges (no dual tier 3 shard needed), the earthgrab works well in just about every mission, and when not up against demons/devils the acid damage does well. If you can afford it, make 2. I like my Earthgrab so much that I added the adamantine Ritual (2nd tier) to it so it would last longer in the tougher epics like Wiz King, I have not been disappointed. Heavy Picks are a nice way to go with earthgrab, but if you are a khopesh user then I would think earthgrab khopeshes would be fine for you to use (hmm... I forget if you have bonuses that are weapon type specific, if all your combat bonuses work equally on any weapon then go heavy pick, if you have extra bonuses when using khopeshes then stay with them).

Then I made a Balance of land and Sky tier 3..... but I do not like to talk about that. Really, forget I mentioned it. Please.

Once I recovered ffrom that mistake, I made a Steam2 weapon and I have been pretty happy with it. Steam2 does not get a lot of attention, but it is a solid weapon. Holy/Ice burst/+4 Insight AC (for more DPS, obviously you would do Ice Blast here) with a solid fog clicky and 12-22 untyped damage on 20% of hits. Not exactly a great weapon for demons and devils, but it was mainly for my TR to a sword and board Pally.

As for GS clothing items... Min 2 is very nice. You can make it your HP item (+45 stacking HP), it will also add +6 to CON skills (meaning concentration) and will further add +5 protection and Heavy Fort. The only reason you would not want this is if you plan on having something else give you the heavy fort. If you are planning on having some epic Bracers and Gloves of the Claw, then you might not want it (there are other epics that could give you heavy fort as well, especially anything with a blue slot). I am also partial to triple air items, the haste/knockdown guard is pretty handy (IMO, others are less thrilled with it) and I made mine with Greater Lightning resist and 2 tiers of Lightning guard (I am a tank and have several guards running at most times, it worked for me).

[LookingForABentoBox]

Also worth keeping in mind than on normal Lightning II has a slightly higher dps than Mineral II on Harry, Sally, and Horoth