TWF on a Stalwart Defender?

[Astraghal]

I want to try out TWF on my dwarf fighter to see if it's significantly better than THF. So I want to LR my THF stalwart defender and test it out, along with a few other things like kensai III. I have a couple of questions that maybe someone who has tried these things out can help me find answers to.

1. Is OTWF worth getting for the +2 to attack on the off hand?

3. Is the loss of DR 6/- from not taking the two shield mastery feats a big deal on a leviks defender using stalwart III?

3. Is iron will really that important?

This is what I'm considering going with. I will be carrying over a +2 tome of supreme ability. Feats taken in no particular order, as it's an LR.

Feel free to criticise.



Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.5.1
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Level 20 Lawful Good Dwarf Male
(20 Fighter)
Hit Points: 392
Spell Points: 0
BAB: 20\20\25\30\30
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 9
Will: 11

Starting Ending
Abilities Base Stats Base Stats
(32 Point) (Level 1) (Level 20)
Strength 16 22
Dexterity 14 17
Constitution 16 18
Intelligence 12 14
Wisdom 8 10
Charisma 12 14

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 3
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 3
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 3
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 3
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

Starting Ending
Base Skills Base Skills
Skills (Level 1) (Level 20)
Balance 4 14
Bluff 1 2
Concentration 3 4
Diplomacy 1 2
Disable Device n/a n/a
Haggle 1 2
Heal -1 0
Hide 2 3
Intimidate 5 25
Jump 3 18
Listen -1 0
Move Silently 2 3
Open Lock n/a n/a
Perform n/a n/a
Repair 1 2
Search 1 2
Spot -1 0
Swim 3 7
Tumble n/a 5
Use Magic Device 3 13

Level 1 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Dodge
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons


Level 3 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Bullheaded


Level 4 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: DEX
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Combat Expertise


Level 5 (Fighter)


Level 6 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Iron Will
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons


Level 7 (Fighter)


Level 8 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons


Level 9 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Force of Personality


Level 10 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack


Level 11 (Fighter)


Level 12 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Intimidate


Level 13 (Fighter)


Level 14 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons


Level 15 (Fighter)
Feat: (Selected) Skill Focus: Use Magic Device


Level 16 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 17 (Fighter)


Level 18 (Fighter)
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting


Level 19 (Fighter)


Level 20 (Fighter)
Ability Raise: STR
Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Superior Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Class Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Class Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Class Boost III
Enhancement: Fighter Extra Action Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost III
Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost IV
Enhancement: Fighter Weapon Alacrity
Enhancement: Dwarven Armor Mastery I
Enhancement: Dwarven Armor Mastery II
Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution I
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Mastery I
Enhancement: Fighter Armor Mastery II
Enhancement: Fighter Stalwart Defender I
Enhancement: Fighter Stalwart Defender II
Enhancement: Fighter Stalwart Defender III
Enhancement: Fighter Dwarven Waraxe Specialization I
Enhancement: Fighter Dwarven Waraxe Specialization II
Enhancement: Fighter Item Defense I
Enhancement: Fighter Item Defense II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
Enhancement: Fighter Intimidate I
Enhancement: Fighter Intimidate II
Enhancement: Fighter Intimidate III
Enhancement: Fighter Intimidate IV
Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness III
Enhancement: Fighter Toughness IV





This is the equipment I'll be using.

head: intimidate +15
eyes: gs goggles (+6 CHA skills, air guard)/tharnes goggles
neck: stalwart necklace (+6 CON)/silver flame talisman/bluefire necklace
trinket: head of good fortune/bloodstone/pale lavender ioun stone
cloak: gs cloak (+45 hp, +5 deflection, heavy fortification)/cloak of ice
armor: dragon touched plate (+5 resistance, +6 CHA, +3 dodge)
wrists: chaosgarde/leviks bracers
hands: spectral gloves/titans grip
ring1: cinders band (+6 STR, +1 ex CON, +2 ex STR)
ring2: conners band (+6 DEX, + ex DEX, +2 ex CHA)
belt: disease immunity of greater false life/CON +6 of greater false life
boots: striding 30%/featherfalling/firestorm greaves/kundarak delving/madstone/anchoring
weapon1: gs dwarven axe (holy, acid, +4 insight)
weapon2: gs dwarven waraxe (holy, acid, +2 ex CON)/leviks defender


Ending stats

STR: 32 (36 in stance)
DEX: 24
CON: 28 (32 in stance)
INT: 14
WIS: 10
CHA: 22

HP: 577 (617 in stance)


AC breakdown

10: base
15: dragon touched plate
09: leviks defender
07: DEX
02: alchemical ritual
05: deflection
04: insight
02: chaosgarde
04: stalwart defender III
01: dodge feat
02: stalwart set
03: dodge sovereign rune
05: combat expertise
----------

68 unbuffed S&B AC (72 in stance)

58 unbuffed TWF AC (62 in stance)

Blocking DR 33


Intimidate breakdown

23 base
03 skill focus feat
15 competence item
06 CHA skills
06 CHA
02 luck
06 stalwart III
02 bullheaded feat
04 fighter intimidate IV
----------
67 unbuffed

04 gh
02 bard
01 yugoloth potion
----------
74 buffed


UMD breakdown

11 base
06 CHA
06 CHA skills
02 luck
03 skill focus feat
05 seven fingered gloves
----------
33 unbuffed

04 gh
02 bard
01 yugoloth potion
----------
40 buffed


I'm not sure how to work out the saves or I'd show those too.

[rendet]

1. OTWF is -2/-2 instead of -4/-4 without which i find really useful on my intimitank. SD's have a low attack bonus and depending on the content your doing I find it extremely important. I say depending on the content because in non-epic content I don't know of anything you will miss on but in epics your attack bonus is really important.

2. The DR6 from the 2 shield mastery feats isn't going to make or break your build. It's nice to have if you can afford it but it is also one of the first things to go if you can't. Kinda like mental toughness feats.

3. End game Iron will can be replaced with something more useful. I'd get rid of iron will before you got rid of anything else. 2 suggestions to replace it with are a 2nd toughness feat or quickdraw. Quickdraw shortens the downtime that occurs after using a skill or boost so you can start attacking again faster.

[Quikster]

1. OTWF is -2/-2 instead of -4/-4 without which i find really useful on my intimitank. SD's have a low attack bonus and depending on the content your doing I find it extremely important. I say depending on the content because in non-epic content I don't know of anything you will miss on but in epics your attack bonus is really important.

2. The DR6 from the 2 shield mastery feats isn't going to make or break your build. It's nice to have if you can afford it but it is also one of the first things to go if you can't. Kinda like mental toughness feats.

3. End game Iron will can be replaced with something more useful. I'd get rid of iron will before you got rid of anything else. 2 suggestions to replace it with are a 2nd toughness feat or quickdraw. Quickdraw shortens the downtime that occurs after using a skill or boost so you can start attacking again faster.

I think quickdraw would add more to the build than a second toughness.

Rend is correct, attack bonus becomes a larger issue in epic content. That said as a defender you can still have a good attack bonus. Not the same as a kensai or max str bezerker, but better than a paly or ranger prolly. If you can fit in the daxe enhancements, combined with the fighter enhancements and some gear your to hit should be fine.

I use the shintao set and epic spectral gloves on mine to boost my to hit against hard to hit enemies and usually can leave PA on.

As far as the dr, i agree its not make or break, the problem you run into with a build like this is trying to do a lot of different things well. Unless you run the tr gauntlet and have some great gear something usually has to give a bit. Not saying you cant do several things, but you may have to turn off PA or drop your ac by a few points or something to make it work.

I like the concept however as you can fill many roles, youre not going to be the biggest dps but you certainly can lay out some damage.

[Astraghal]

1. OTWF is -2/-2 instead of -4/-4 without which i find really useful on my intimitank. SD's have a low attack bonus and depending on the content your doing I find it extremely important. I say depending on the content because in non-epic content I don't know of anything you will miss on but in epics your attack bonus is really important.

With the low STR that I have I'm missing quite a bit on the higher AC mobs in epic with PA on. If I can drop another feat, this would probably be worth picking up for this build.


2. The DR6 from the 2 shield mastery feats isn't going to make or break your build. It's nice to have if you can afford it but it is also one of the first things to go if you can't. Kinda like mental toughness feats.

This is what I was thinking too. These feats would have to grant a lot more DR to be worthwhile taking. The three tiers of dwarven shield mastery only adds DR 3/- too, which is terribly low.


3. End game Iron will can be replaced with something more useful. I'd get rid of iron will before you got rid of anything else. 2 suggestions to replace it with are a 2nd toughness feat or quickdraw. Quickdraw shortens the downtime that occurs after using a skill or boost so you can start attacking again faster.

I rarely notice a failed WILL save now, although on the build I posted I'd be down -3 to WILL saves from what I am currently. I would really like to drop this feat in favor of OTWF.



I think quickdraw would add more to the build than a second toughness.

Rend is correct, attack bonus becomes a larger issue in epic content. That said as a defender you can still have a good attack bonus. Not the same as a kensai or max str bezerker, but better than a paly or ranger prolly. If you can fit in the daxe enhancements, combined with the fighter enhancements and some gear your to hit should be fine.

I use the shintao set and epic spectral gloves on mine to boost my to hit against hard to hit enemies and usually can leave PA on.

As far as the dr, i agree its not make or break, the problem you run into with a build like this is trying to do a lot of different things well. Unless you run the tr gauntlet and have some great gear something usually has to give a bit. Not saying you cant do several things, but you may have to turn off PA or drop your ac by a few points or something to make it work.

I like the concept however as you can fill many roles, youre not going to be the biggest dps but you certainly can lay out some damage.

I've been considering quickdraw but I'm not sure I can fit it in. Like you said the problem is trying to do too much on a 32 point build. I can always respec to kensai III and see how I'm hitting then. The kensai ring from tod will help, when I eventually get lucky enough to pull one. I've done 20 odd runs and still no good DPS rings (including 20th list).

[Quikster]

With the low STR that I have I'm missing quite a bit on the higher AC mobs in epic with PA on. If I can drop another feat, this would probably be worth picking up for this build.



This is what I was thinking too. These feats would have to grant a lot more DR to be worthwhile taking. The three tiers of dwarven shield mastery only adds DR 3/- too, which is terribly low.



I rarely notice a failed WILL save now, although on the build I posted I'd be down -3 to WILL saves from what I am currently. I would really like to drop this feat in favor of OTWF.




I've been considering quickdraw but I'm not sure I can fit it in. Like you said the problem is trying to do too much on a 32 point build. I can always respec to kensai III and see how I'm hitting then. The kensai ring from tod will help, when I eventually get lucky enough to pull one. I've done 20 odd runs and still no good DPS rings (including 20th list).

Took me around 30 to get the ones I wanted on my defender, then again, my paly had the ones he wanted in 3 :/

[Astraghal]

After LR'ing and replacing THF with TWF, I have to say that I'm going to miss glancing blows. They hardly show up at all now using a dwarven axe and tower shield.

It makes those fights when you're swamped in orthons and devils go on that much longer.

Dual wielding vorpals is nice though.