What builds are WF good at?

[Kumorijin]

i'm leveling a WF wiz/rog so other than the caster types and i don't have FvS, what other builds are WF good at?

[Symar-FangofLloth]

Everything.

[Spisey]

Everything.

/signed

[biggin]

Yep, WF have tons of upsides and very few downsides. Unless you are going for pure min/max on a Sorc/Bard, there are very few instances where it couldn't be argued that WF outshine most other races. It comes down to playstyle for most, but blanket immunities, con, etc are hard to argue against.

[supp3nhuhn]

Wf make pretty sucky clerics, apart from that anything goes though.

[Kumorijin]

well since WF can't heal themselves very well unless they're a caster, melee builds should be min/maxed for optimal DPS or AC/tankage above all else right? that being said, my assumptions are that human/halflings are better at ranger or pally builds due to their ability to heal fleshies but WF are better at fighter, barb, and monk builds ?

please correct my assumptions if i'm wrong or add some different thoughts if i'm missing something

[Kumorijin]

another thought was a WF rogue/xxx build to max out DPS, rogue skills, and especial;y UMD for arcane healing scrolls for more survivabilty. if theres a builds out there like this, could someone link it for me. i also heard something about a "west side" rogue build but i can't find that either.....

[supp3nhuhn]

Well all wf can (and should) take the healers friend enhancements to decrease the malus heal spells get on them.
Paladin LoH isn't discriminating against warforged, the low charisma might be a bit counterproductive though.

Healing wise the main benefit that wf have above fleshie races is that arcanes can heal them as well effectively doubling the number of healers available to wf.

In a party noone will expect rangers and paladins to be self healing, so it doesn't matter all that much and again healers friend ups the amount here as well.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Wf make pretty sucky clerics, apart from that anything goes though.

WF make fine clerics.


Well all wf can (and should) take the healers friend enhancements to decrease the malus heal spells get on them.
Paladin LoH isn't discriminating against warforged, the low charisma might be a bit counterproductive though.

Healing wise the main benefit that wf have above fleshie races is that arcanes can heal them as well effectively doubling the number of healers available to wf.

In a party noone will expect rangers and paladins to be self healing, so it doesn't matter all that much and again healers friend ups the amount here as well.

Do you mean during combat or between? Because I'd certainly expect rangers and palis to top themselves up between fights.

As for HF, the first level is pretty much a must have. It's debatable if the value for AP is there at the higher levels of HF, depends what you have to give up in your build for it.

[biggin]

Wf make pretty sucky clerics, apart from that anything goes though.

And why is that?

[Lorien_the_First_One]

well since WF can't heal themselves very well unless they're a caster, melee builds should be min/maxed for optimal DPS or AC/tankage above all else right? that being said, my assumptions are that human/halflings are better at ranger or pally builds due to their ability to heal fleshies but WF are better at fighter, barb, and monk builds ?

please correct my assumptions if i'm wrong or add some different thoughts if i'm missing something

WF have the same ability to heal themselves as any other race. They just use repair potions and wands/scrolls (if caster or if they have UMD) instead of cure potions and wands/scrolls. Actually they have increased ability to heal given that they can also use the cure stuff, its just less effective.

[Rusty_Can]

i also heard something about a "west side" rogue build but i can't find that either.....

Westside (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=174696&highlight=westside). Anyway, this build is pre-Update 5 and combat system changed a bit since then.

[spartin]

Wf are only good for a few builds. They do make excelant high dps, ac, dr, or hp toons. They also excel as arcane self healing casters. Or extreamly Hardy divine casters. Especially as fvs. But that's all they are good at.

[supp3nhuhn]

WF make fine clerics.



Ok warforged make awesome clerics.
They have the worst wisdom of any race making them the worst offensive casters with lowest sp.
They share the worst charisma with dwarves which means they can't get divine might for a cheap damage boost if they melee and are a turn behind for the auras or dv if they don't and suck at turning.
They have the weakest self healing of any divine casters.
Most of their immunities are a non issue for divine casters.
Their racial faith simply sucks, while it gives nice boosts it also prevents self healing which outweighs the gains.
They can improve their powerattack which is not necessarily all that great on a class with no to hit bonuses whatsoever.

Oh and i expect anyone to be able to top off themselves.

[JollySwagMan]

I haven't seen many WF Clerics in game, though the few that I've run with knew what they were doing.

To date I still don't have Warforged as an account option so my opinion is based on other folks' WF.

Aside from WF Wizard-Rogues and Sorcerors, my favourite are WF Monks, followed by Fighters. Not especially keen on WF Barbarians, but that is just due to running with a lot of badly played ones.

[Uska]

all though on some it really helps to have 32pt builds unlocked and even more so if you have the 34 or 36

[Uska]

Wf make pretty sucky clerics, apart from that anything goes though.

totaly incorrect.

[FlyingTurtle]

One of the reasons why I decided not to get Warforged was because it just looked like Easy mode for all the classes.

If I'm spending more money, I want to get more game, not less. ;)

[voodoogroves]

The biggest advantage of a WF in any build is that the built-in immunities free up slots to use for other things; this includes clerics.

[khaldan]

WF don't do great in healing amp builds, and I'll go halfling for a khopesh rogue, but aside from that..

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Ok warforged make awesome clerics.
They have the worst wisdom of any race making them the worst offensive casters with lowest sp.
They share the worst charisma with dwarves which means they can't get divine might for a cheap damage boost if they melee and are a turn behind for the auras or dv if they don't and suck at turning.
They have the weakest self healing of any divine casters.
Most of their immunities are a non issue for divine casters.
Their racial faith simply sucks, while it gives nice boosts it also prevents self healing which outweighs the gains.
They can improve their powerattack which is not necessarily all that great on a class with no to hit bonuses whatsoever.

Oh and i expect anyone to be able to top off themselves.

Your argument against them is they get -2 to chr and wis? So then you think they make bad sorcs too since they get that same penalty to a combat sat? You are aware most people consider WF among the best race for sorcs?

Do you have any idea how little difference in SP 2 WIS makes? And 1DC, no big deal. Turing? Who does that past low level if at all? I guess the extra HP from the con bonus don't help at all eh? Immunity from hold? How is their healing "weaker". A WF heal spell hits just the same as one from a fleshie caster.

Are they the best race for a cleric? No, that's probably human or dwarf (which you also don't like), but they can still make a very good one.
Stick around for a while, play the game to L20, try a few different classes and races, you may learn.

[supp3nhuhn]

Your argument against them is they get -2 to chr and wis? So then you think they make bad sorcs too since they get that same penalty to a combat sat? You are aware most people consider WF among the best race for sorcs?
Nice try, now quote me saying wf sorcs suck.



Do you have any idea how little difference in SP 2 WIS makes? And 1DC, no big deal.
Less sp is less sp, period.
DC are two lower compared to humans, one to everyone else.


Turing? Who does that past low level if at all?
Turning works better then the cha dumpers think, theres no faster way of clearing undead trash and melee with 8 strength doesn't work too well either.


I guess the extra HP from the con bonus don't help at all eh?
Dwarves get the same con bonus plus racial enhancements to raise sp and 2 higher starting wis.


Immunity from hold?
Fom gives immunity from hold as well which is available to lvl 7 clerics hence i said non issue.


How is their healing "weaker". A WF heal spell hits just the same as one from a fleshie caster.
A wf SELF healing is weaker because he's a warforged.



Are they the best race for a cleric? No, that's probably human or dwarf (which you also don't like), but they can still make a very good one.
Stick around for a while, play the game to L20, try a few different classes and races, you may learn.

Assumptions about what i don't like and basically that the worst race for a class is a fine choice when op asks what warforged are not good at.

Now to all those that say i'm incorrect, please state the advantages of making a wf cleric if you are able to instead of just stating completely unfounded opinions.

[k1ngp1n]

Nice try, now quote me saying wf sorcs suck.


Less sp is less sp, period.
DC are two lower compared to humans, one to everyone else.


Turning works better then the cha dumpers think, theres no faster way of clearing undead trash and melee with 8 strength doesn't work too well either.


Dwarves get the same con bonus plus racial enhancements to raise sp and 2 higher starting wis.


Fom gives immunity from hold as well which is available to lvl 7 clerics hence i said non issue.


A wf SELF healing is weaker because he's a warforged.



So your argument revolves around you not having a point, A$$umptions about what i don't like and basically that the worst race for a class is a fine choice when op asks what warforged are not good at.

Boy i should really hurry to leave korthos to attain your level of enlightenment about not only this game but also the universe as a whole.

Now to all those 'vets' that say i'm incorrect, please state the advantages of making a wf cleric if you are able to instead of just stating completely unfounded opinions.

/edit

haha and i even got neg repped for simply stating the disadvantages of a race/class combo.
Really classy especially considering the vast amount of stuff that speaks for warforged clerics as you 'vets' have so eloquently stated.

Totally worth my time to read....

*sigh*

[FuzzyDuck81]

despite the wisdom & charisma penalties, WF make great 2hander pallies since their high saves combined with innate immunities make them very resilient

[protokon]

Everything.

/signed

[BlackSteel]

WF don't do great in healing amp builds, and I'll go halfling for a khopesh rogue, but aside from that..

this is the ONLY negative WF post that makes any valid sense. the rest of the posts in this thread are absolute nonsense, aside from those trying to discourage the troll advice obviously

[gott_ist_tot]

Wf are rocking on about any class.

WF are the only race which can reach a passive DR of 15 (on a FvS). And if you can afford it, it rocks.

Self healing as sorc/wizard rocks, as it allows for a very aggresive style of play in groups and solo power.

Power attack enhancements rock on any dps melee.

Fast-swapping different kinda of docents (e.g. Elemental prot, DW) is great for any class. So is level drain immunity, let me tell you something, this particular immunity rocks.

Additional threat generation for tanks, or these times you want to grab monster aggro from pew pewers.

Constitution enhancements are good for any class.

WF's are good for any class. For casters, FvS and melees they're uber.

[AaronB]

I think WF are easily the best for wizard (whether pure or multi) because it all comes together. The CHA and WIS penalties don't mean much, you can self-heal, the immunities and hp are welcome, the free metamagic feats make it less necessary to take human, and on and on. WF are also arguably the best for sorc and fvs. They are well-suited for barb also (personally I'd take human for the feat, but it's a tough choice). The PA and brute fighting enhancements are great for hate-tanking. Basically I'd take human on feat-starved or healing amp builds, and halflings for sneak attacking (rogue or monk), but WF are good for everything else.

My dream-build is a WF fvs with past life-wizard (preferably more than one). That gives you inherent spell pen (+2 per past life, equal to a free feat) and taking the active feat gives +1 to all dc's, making up for the WF wis penalty.

[flynnjsw]

despite the wisdom & charisma penalties, WF make great 2hander pallies since their high saves combined with innate immunities make them very resilient

^^ This. Wis is a dump stat for pallies anyway. The hit to Cha means you may not be able to hit DM4, but with the extra HP it is a bit easier to take.

[Alavatar]

Nice try, now quote me saying wf sorcs suck.

He doesn't need to find a quote on it because you are implying it with your arguments against WF clerics.


Less sp is less sp, period.
DC are two lower compared to humans, one to everyone else.
-30sp, or so, actually. The DC difference is negligible in a d20 system.



Turning works better then the cha dumpers think, theres no faster way of clearing undead trash and melee with 8 strength doesn't work too well either.
Turning is useless past L10-ish. BB is better for upper levels.

And who builds clerics with just 8 strength anymore?


Dwarves get the same con bonus plus racial enhancements to raise sp and 2 higher starting wis.
True. This does not mean that WF make sucky clerics, though, per your original assertion.


Fom gives immunity from hold as well which is available to lvl 7 clerics hence i said non issue.
Doesn't help against a beholder, though. Nor does that 8 strength you seem to have ...


A wf SELF healing is weaker because he's a warforged.
So, WF clerics are sucky because ... they suffer a penalty to healing themselves? Not much of an issue healing yourself when there are plenty of different ways to heal yourself. Especially when you get to L9 for Heal spell from scrolls, L11 with access to casting the Heal spell and with Radiant Servant Aura/Burst.


So your argument revolves around you not having a point, A$$umptions about what i don't like and basically that the worst race for a class is a fine choice when op asks what warforged are not good at.
Try posting more valid arguments then ill-conceived thoughts based on biased or incomplete information. Your statement is that WF make sucky clerics when, in fact, they make awesome clerics. They may not be the best in terms of building a cleric, but they are by no means "sucky".



Now to all those 'vets' that say i'm incorrect, please state the advantages of making a wf cleric if you are able to instead of just stating completely unfounded opinions.

Innate immunity to all paralysis effects (Hold Person, Hold Monster, Flesh to Stone, etc).
Innate immunity to level drain (Enervation and Energy Drain)
Innate immunity to Fatigue and Exhaustion.
Innate immunity to Poison and Disease
Innate immunity to Sleep
(All of the above help save item slots and are not dispellable, as opposed to a fleshy cleric that requires either having an item or casting a spell that could be dispelled.)
Reduction in Negative Energy damage
Hot-swappable docents as opposed to armor taking time to switch
Healed by both Arcane and Divine, so a sorcerer or wizard can help keep the cleric up while the cleric helps keep the melees.

Off the top of my head...


/edit

haha and i even got neg repped for simply stating the disadvantages of a race/class combo.
Really classy especially considering the vast amount of stuff that speaks for warforged clerics as you 'vets' have so eloquently stated.
Learn to present your arguments better.

[MalakRevan]

Nice try, now quote me saying wf sorcs suck.


Less sp is less sp, period.
DC are two lower compared to humans, one to everyone else.

This ends up being about 25-30 SP, I forget which it is; not even a empowered/empower heal/quicked cure light mass.



Turning works better then the cha dumpers think, theres no faster way of clearing undead trash and melee with 8 strength doesn't work too well either.


Turning only works up to Delera's and then it's worthless. There aren't enough undead end game to make it viable.




Dwarves get the same con bonus plus racial enhancements to raise sp and 2 higher starting wis.


Dwarves are ugly.




Fom gives immunity from hold as well which is available to lvl 7 clerics hence i said non issue.


WF are also immune to negative levels and not having to cast FoM saves you some SP :P



A wf SELF healing is weaker because he's a warforged.


So he takes the first level of healer's friend. Acceptable cost of 2 AP.





So your argument revolves around you not having a point, A$$umptions about what i don't like and basically that the worst race for a class is a fine choice when op asks what warforged are not good at.

Boy i should really hurry to leave korthos to attain your level of enlightenment about not only this game but also the universe as a whole.

Now to all those 'vets' that say i'm incorrect, please state the advantages of making a wf cleric if you are able to instead of just stating completely unfounded opinions.

/edit

haha and i even got neg repped for simply stating the disadvantages of a race/class combo.
Really classy especially considering the vast amount of stuff that speaks for warforged clerics as you 'vets' have so eloquently stated.

With the exception of the -2 Wis and -2 Cha which aren't really hinderances, the WF are supreme and better looking in every way. Blanket immunities which means you never have to cast neutralize poison, remove disease and very rarely will have to cast restore onto a WF. In addition to the immunity to neg levels and hold. Get a fear immunity item and you got yourself one unstoppable character. So what they may be a little harder to heal themselves but their spells will hit you fleshies for the same amount no matter what.

Your arguements are easily overcome and make it obvious that you have never played a WF. I started playing a WF with my monk and I haven't made another character that isn't WF. The only fleshie I have is my TR'd Human Paladin.


/edit: nah got beaten to it but my points still stand alongside everyone eleses.

[AnderlornLOTR]

/signed for all those who voted in favor of WF being the best race.

Boo to those that say it is easy mode. I solo play a lot and I can tell you it isn't easy. I spend a lot of time running (sometimes yelling at the computer - lol) and backing up into corners. Of course, it helps that you know DnD, played MMOs, PvP, and you know the gaming system since DDO is slightly different from PnP DnD - aka things stack better in DnD than DDO. I took a long sabbatical from DDO to play LOTRO and I finally became really sick of the obsessive grinding that LOTRO has to offer and came back. I must have learned something while I was away because my new Warforge - Wizard\Fighter\Rogue is coming along nicely. So nicely, I am considering putting some money back into the game. I have soloed most of the way to 7th level, earning good coin along the way and purchasing quality items when deals are offered in the AH. So all of you crazies posting items for 400%+ over the suggested cost of the item will never make any coin from me no matter how good the item is. I only purchase quality items if the price is a good deal or at least reasonable. I also do this when I post items into the auction hall. Not one of my items has failed to sale thus far. Sure it is possible that I could have made more and it is also possible that it may have never sold if I marked up my items like some of you have.

There is no doubt in my mind that you can play any class with a Warforge. Sure it helps that you can make 32+ point toons, however you can still get by with 28 point toons. You just need to know where to properly allocate your points and what spells you use.

And I don't know about you all but inert healing has saved my butt a few times especially when playing solo... :-)

[Norean]

I've been working on trying to find the best rogue build and as a result I've made many rogues. One of my rogues that I'm having particular fun with is my warforge rogue. He's level 6 and he just took mechanic. As a mechanic he gets a boost to his repair skill and he can use charges of his skill boost ability to heal himself. Skill boost has 5 charges per rest and there are enhancements that rogues get later on that increase that amount. Rogue extra action boost 1 and 2. Also since umd is a rogue class skill warforge rogues can use repair wands. Rogues have the option of taking a class feat called slippery mind which makes having the low will save that comes with 6 starting wis less unpleasant. Warforges make good rogues.

On a side note, does anyone know if warforges are immune to those 3 poisons rogue assassins get at assassin 1?

[dimster28]

this is the fact.

any race is good for any class, how good or bad is depend on how you build them, thats all.

[dragonlo]

IMHO if you arent used to wf builds your first should be either a wf caster (wiz, or sorc) no mulitclass until your used to there down sides, or for a melee barb or fighter dps build. once you have 32 unlocked or you can TR for 34/36 wf really start to shine in almost any class... once again IMHO