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Phidius
08-18-2010, 11:35 AM
I admit it - I'm totally addicted to wizard melee builds. I absolutely love Gemstone (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=214937), but he has room for improvement.

Specifically, bypassing Spell Resistance on raid bosses for scrolls of Waves of Exhaustion. The only way I know to fix this without abandoning the build is to TR a few times. But instead of just leveling him up exactly the same, I thought I'd take this opportunity to try out some other wizard melee splashes.

When you're reading the following build, please keep in mind that I already know all about build discrimination, and how hard it will be to find groups, yadda yadda yadda.

However, I'd love to get some feedback regarding the feats/enhancements.

The build will be played as a front-line melee (some would say a skirmish), dealing out damage and absorbing/repairing damage in return. Granted, most of the times no one will be behind the front line, but whatever :D

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.5.1
DDO Character Planner Home Page (http://www.rjcyberware.com/DDO)

Dark Intellect
Level 20 Lawful Good Warforged Male
(9 Monk \ 11 Wizard)
Hit Points: 528 = 72(monk) +44(wizard) +20(heroic) +10(draconic) +30(GFL) +20(minos legens) +45(GS) + 200(con) +22(toughness) + 40(toughness enhancements) + 5 (Tortoise) + 20 (Yugo)
Spell Points: ~895 = 545 (planner) + 200 (archmagi) + 150 (spell power)
BAB: 11\11\16\21
Fortitude: 25/29 = 6 (monk) + 3 (wizard) + 8 (con) + 3 (night shield) + 1 (alchemical) + 4 (GH) = 25 + 2 (boots) + 2 (HoGF) = 29
Reflex: 25/29 = 6 (monk) + 3 (wizard) + 6 (dex) + 3 (night shield) + 1 (alchemical) + 2 (occult slayer) + 4 (GH) = 25 + 2 (boots) + 2 (HoGF) = 29
Will: 28/32 = 6 (monk) + 7 (wizard) + 3 (wis) + 3 (night shield) + 1 (alchemical) + 2 (occult slayer) + 4 (GH) + 1 (rage) = 28 + 2 (boots) + 2 (HoGF) = 32

Abilities (34 Point)

Strength 38 = 16 (base) + 5 (levels) + 8 (ring2) + 3 (tome) + 2 (fire stance) + 2 (rage)
Dexterity 22 = 15 (base) + 2 (tome) + 5 (gloves)
Constitution 30 = 16 (base) + 1 (tome) + 2 (ap) + 6 (belt) + 1 (ring2) + 2 (rage) + 2 (yugo)
Intelligence 16 = 14 (base) + 2 (tome)
Wisdom 16 = 10 (base) + 2 (tome) + 6 (cloak) - 2 (fire stance)
Charisma 8 = 6 (base) + 2 (tome)


Tomes Used

+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7 (skills)
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 11 (iTWF & gTWF)

The following tomes are banked, but won't use them unless the build turns out to be more fun than the current Ranger version.

+3 Tome of Strength used at level 11
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7


Gear

Head: Minos Legens
Necklace: Torc
Trinket: Bloodstone/Head of Good Fortune
Cloak: GS Concordant Opposition (Wisdom+6, Wizardry VI, Spell Power +50, Spell Power +100)
Belt: Vorne's Belt (Con +6, GFL, Occult Slayer)/Amrath Archmagi Belt (the one with a possible lvl12 Barkskin)
Ring1: Ring of Resonance/Chattering Ring/Ring of Shadows
Ring2: Gnawed Ring (Str +6, Occult Slayer, Exceptional Con +1, Exceptional Str +2)
Gloves: Spectral Gloves (+5 Dex, Ghost Touch, +2 Attack Bonus)
Boots: Boots of the Innocent/Hobnail Boots/Kundarak Delving Boots
Bracers: GS HP+45 (Corrosive Salt Guard)/Chaosguard
Docent: Docent of Defiance/DT Docent (Feather Fall, Protect +5, Insight +4) Still need the +4 Insight
Goggles: Tharne's Goggles/Visor of Concentration

Armor Class
Base: 10
Composite: 2
Monk: 2
Dex: 6
Wisdom: 3
DT Docent: 7
Alchemical: 1
Insight: 4
Deflection: 5
Dodge (chattering): 3
Dodge (chaosguard): 2
Dodge (feat): 1
Rage: -2

Standard: 44

Shield (Spell): 4
Barkskin Pot: 3
Haste: 1

Buffed: 52

Wind Stance: 2 (+2 Dex, +2 Wis from leaving Fire Stance)
Defensive Fighting: 2
No Rage: 2

Trying Hard: 58

Paladin Aura: 5
Level 12 Barkskin: 2
Bard Song: 4
Recitation: 2

Center of attention: 71

For those times when the AC just won't cut it, switch the AC items for guard/DR type items.

Skills

Balance 28/43 = 16 (ranks) + 6 (dex) + 2 (spy) + 4 (GH) = 28 + 15 (boots) = 43
Concentration 36/46 = 23 (ranks) + 8 (con) + 1 (tortoise) + 4 (GH) = 35 + 10 (goggles) = 45
Hide 47 = 23 (ranks) + 6 (dex) + 2 (spy) + 4 (GH) + 10 (ring) + 2 (HoGF)
Jump 40 = 0 (ranks) + 13 (str) + 2 (AP) + 4 (GH) + 30 (spell) = 49 (capped at 40)
Move Silently 47 = 23 (ranks) + 6 (dex) + 2 (spy) + 4 (GH) + 10 (ring) + 2 (HoGF)
Spot 45/47 = 23 (ranks) + 3 (wis) + 4 (GH) + 15 (goggles) = 45 + 2 (HoGF)
Swim 20 = 3 (ranks) + 13 (str) + 4 (GH)
Tumble 13 = 1 (ranks) + 6 (dex) + 2 (AP) + 4 (GH)


Level 1 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Concentration (+4)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Swim (+3)
Skill: Tumble (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 2 (Wizard)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+0.5)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Extend Spell


Level 3 (Wizard)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Stunning Blow


Level 4 (Wizard)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+0.5)


Level 5 (Wizard)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Hide (+0.5)


Level 6 (Wizard)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Spot (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Maximize Spell


Level 7 (Wizard)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Spot (+0.5)


Level 8 (Wizard)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)


Level 9 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+5)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Power Attack
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Bludgeoning Weapons


Level 10 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Hide (+3)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+2)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light
Swap to Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Inevitable Dominion: Fists of Darkness @ Level 20


Level 11 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+6)


Level 12 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Hide (+3)
Skill: Move Silently (+2)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting


Level 13 (Monk)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Hide (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Dodge


Level 14 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+5)


Level 15 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Spot (+1.5)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons


Level 16 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+1)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Quicken Spell


Level 17 (Monk)
Skill: Hide (+5)
Skill: Move Silently (+2)


Level 18 (Monk)
Skill: Hide (+1)
Skill: Move Silently (+2)
Skill: Spot (+3)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting


Level 19 (Wizard)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Spot (+1.5)


Level 20 (Monk)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Hide (+2)
Skill: Move Silently (+2)
Skill: Spot (+1)
Enhancement: Static Charge
Enhancement: Way of the Patient Tortoise I
Enhancement: Monk Ninja Spy I
Enhancement: Touch of Death
Enhancement: Porous Soul
Enhancement: All-Consuming Flame
Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Winter's Touch
Enhancement: Adept of Flame
Enhancement: Racial Toughness IV
Enhancement: Monk Jump II
Enhancement: Monk Tumble II
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Elements III
Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Deadly Elements II
Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation IV
Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation II
Enhancement: Wizard Wand Mastery III
Enhancement: Warforged Constitution II
Enhancement: Warforged Healer's Friend I
Enhancement: Warforged Inscribed Armor I
Enhancement: Warforged Power Attack III

soloman
08-18-2010, 11:46 AM
I like it !! :D

Dialis
08-18-2010, 12:02 PM
I have also thought about a build like this, but I would go 12 monk, 8 wiz, to get better dices for monk as well as Ninja II, and that cool fly ability, while you have enough wizard levels to get displacement and haste. I would still use fists though, but its nice to be able to use shortsword instead of kamas with Ninja anyway. I figure damage spells will be near useless due to DCs for low wizard level, so I would stick to buffs only.

Phidius
08-18-2010, 12:02 PM
I like it !! :D

The one thing I don't like about it is the lack of ranged weapons - on the plus side, Gemstone already has the Torc so he doesn't need to go into the DQ.

I was thinking about trying to work in Brutal Throw with the 10,000 stars...

Phidius
08-18-2010, 12:06 PM
I have also thought about a build like this, but I would go 12 monk, 8 wiz, to get better dices for monk as well as Ninja II, and that cool fly ability, while you have enough wizard levels to get displacement and haste. I would still use fists though, but its nice to be able to use shortsword instead of kamas with Ninja anyway. I figure damage spells will be near useless due to DCs for low wizard level, so I would stick to buffs only.

11 Wizard is more for Reconstruct and Quicken. Damage spells like Scorching Ray, Cone of Cold, and Wall of Fire have their place, though. Oh, and to get the additional +2 Spell Pen when I TR him back into the 12/6/2.

I could do a LR+3 to swap levels around, but I'd rather save the TP for buying the content that isn't riddled with bugs.

I'll use short swords for smiting/banishing, but mostly will just use handwraps - I love the punching and flipping.

Abundant step is tempting, though.

Tobril
08-18-2010, 05:06 PM
Looks neat.


A few notes/observations:

The shuriken speed boost enhancement really sucks. You probably mentioned this as a joke, but just to warn you it’s pretty bogus.

The update 6 quests have some pretty tight min level BtC equipment you may want to acquire before taking the plunge.

Switching to dark at 6th monk might be interesting if you think you won’t need FoL or the water finisher at that point.


Finally, Tobril and Samius will be TRing sometime late this week, so if you need someone to keep you greased and red-skulled keep a lookout for us. :D

Phidius
08-18-2010, 05:21 PM
Looks neat.


A few notes/observations:

The shuriken speed boost enhancement really sucks. You probably mentioned this as a joke, but just to warn you it’s pretty bogus...



I figured it was, I just never got a monk high enough to try it out. I'll just have to do without the Manyshot with Bow Strength until I switch back.


...

The update 6 quests have some pretty tight min level BtC equipment you may want to acquire before taking the plunge.

...

Too late - my account went premium today, and I have other uses for my TP than low level quests.


...
Switching to dark at 6th monk might be interesting if you think you won’t need FoL or the water finisher at that point.
...

Elaborate on this if you would - I was only going to go Dark for the Touch of Death.

The Fists of Light would mainly be for the benefit of people who group with me - I just didn't see much reason to go Dark until Monk9.


...

Finally, Tobril and Samius will be TRing sometime late this week, so if you need someone to keep you greased and red-skulled keep a lookout for us. :D

I've got a head-start!

quickbunnie
08-18-2010, 05:36 PM
I'm crafting basically the exact same build - currently at lvl 15.
http://my.ddo.com/character/thelanis/shadowbunnie/ Created 6-29-10

I wanted to playtest him at some higher level content before posting, but since you've already posted it, I'll give you my build. Minimal differences.

"Mind and Body" Arcane Monk build
Lawful Neutral Warforged Wiz 11/Monk 9
TRx1, Past life Monk

Stats
STR 16 (10) +5(lvl) +3(tome) +7(item) +1(exceptional) +2(stance) 34 36(rage) 42(rage + glove clicky)
DEX 14 (6) +3 (tome) +7 (item) 24
CON 17 (8) +2 (tome) +2(enh) +6(item) +1(exceptional) 28 30(rage)
INT 12 (4) +2 (tome) +2(enh) 16
WIS 12 (6) +2(tome) +2(enh) +6(item) -2(stance) 20
CHA 6

Feats
1 Stunning Blow
3 Toughness
6 Past life Monk
9 Power Attack
12 ITWF
15 Imp Crit: Blud
18 GTWF
1 Monk TWF
2 Monk Dodge (ninja spy pre-req)
6 Monk Combat expertise
1 Wiz Extend
5 Wiz Maximize
10 Wiz Quicken

Notable abilities:
Quickened Reconstruct
2:12 self-haste, displace
Touch of Death
Ninja Spy Fade
Improved evasion
Stunning blow DC 36 (mediocre)

DEFENSE:
Ninja spy fade is a 25% incorporeality miss chance that stacks with displacement. This results in a 62.5% miss chance, mitigating a lot of damage.

AC calculation:
10 base
7 wis (water stance)
7 dex (water stance)
11 armor (epic red dragonscale docent)
2 chaosgaurde
5 deflection
3 Chattering Ring
5 CE
4 shield spell
1 haste
2 monk centered AC
1 ritual
4 insight
1 dodge feat
63 Standard self buff (DPS loss, spell cost x2)

5 ranger bark
6 paladin DoS aura
4 Bard AC song
78 Max AC

This build has good - but not superb - saves. Thus improved evasion should also mitigate a lot of damage.

Saves:
Fort Ref Will
monk 6 6 6
wiz 3 3 7
stats 9 7 5
res 5 5 5
GH 4 4 4
rit 1 1 1
dodg 0 1 0
Luck 2 2 2
Fire 30 29 30
Wat 33 32 35

HPs:
20 heroic
44 11 wiz
72 9 monk
40 WF toughness
180 Con
10 Draconic
30 GFL
45 Shroud
20 Minos
23 Toughness
484
20 rage
504 Self buffed

OFFENSE:
One issue that many battle casters have is their to-hit. The BAB of this build at lvl 20 is a measly 11. But since its using handwraps, the attack roll is still a +14 - not far behind a 3/4 BAB progression. Compared to a TWF battle caster, this build will have a much easier time with to-hit. Of note, unarmed attacks do not suffer from the -2 TWF penalty, and do not need an OTWF feat to keep it from becoming a -4 penalty.
14 (base) + 13 (str) + 5 (enh) + 4 (GH) + 1 (haste) = 37 first swing, 29 with PA. With Divine power, 43 first swing, 35 with PA (self buffed)
Full Inspire courage: 47 first swing, 39 with PA (inc Divine Power)

DPS:
I've run through projected DPS calculations using Absolute Omniscient and Yargore's U5 DPS calc, and against heavy fort the build will surpass classic melee DPS. 50% fort results in DPS close to many melee builds, but a little behind most, and at 0% fort this build does fall behind. This assumes ToD bursting rings (holy, shock), greater bane handwraps. Hopefully, Stunning Blow will offset some of the DPS lost against 0% fort. The DPS Calcs also assume Touch of Death every 15 sec. (currently 60 DPS, preU5 was 33.333)

Phidius
08-18-2010, 06:34 PM
I'm crafting basically the exact same build - currently at lvl 15.
http://my.ddo.com/character/thelanis/shadowbunnie/ Created 6-29-10

I wanted to playtest him at some higher level content before posting, but since you've already posted it, I'll give you my build. I believe the biggest difference is that I took Dodge, and the Ninja Spy prestige class for 25% incorp. Given that I'm in fire stance, Ki builds quickly, and the 25% chance to miss stacking with displacement was too sexy to pass up.
...

I have Dodge (@13), but just didn't plan on taking Ninja Spy until 20th level for the Touch of Death benefit.

I tried to look up the 25% incorporeal you mentioned, but my search-fu is weak...

quickbunnie
08-18-2010, 07:10 PM
I have Dodge (@13), but just didn't plan on taking Ninja Spy until 20th level for the Touch of Death benefit.

I tried to look up the 25% incorporeal you mentioned, but my search-fu is weak...

Ah, sorry missed that you had dodge. Only differences are CE for WF: bludg, and Empower for monk past life (on my 1st life I have mental toughness instead). I'll need to do a +3 LR immediately before TR to get the monk past life benefits (+1 to-hit and damage, feat: damage die progression --> 1d10 to 2d6 at lvl 9)
Wiki: You focus your Ki and draw shadows around you, becoming invisible and partially insubstantial. 25% miss chance due to incorporeality. Counts as a dark move
http://ddowiki.com/page/Ninja_Spy_enhancements

I've tested it and when displaced + faded mobs miss from both incorporeal and displaced (although never both on the same hit). Queen Lailat (and other mobs w/ some form of true seeing) do not miss from displacement/blur, but incorp still causes 25% misses. Gives me something to do with my Ki until touch of death.

Also, counts as a 1 min invis clicky - but the invis goes away once you interact with something. The 25% incorp miss, however, does not.

Phidius
08-18-2010, 08:38 PM
The DDOWiki has better (and faster) information than the compendium - I should start using it instead :)

The Monk past life feats (passive and active) are indeed mighty tasty, just not sure if I'm willing to earn the XP for them.

As far as CE goes, Gemstone rarely used his AC as monsters that couldn't hit him with his AC gear on couldn't hurt him with it off. I only listed the AC because most of the calculations were done before I learned that.

Once he got to the areas where the monsters blows were hurting him, his AC didn't do him any good. Still, it was handy to keep the gear to switch to when it was important to not deal damage with guards.

quickbunnie
08-18-2010, 08:56 PM
The DDOWiki has better (and faster) information than the compendium - I should start using it instead :)

The Monk past life feats (passive and active) are indeed mighty tasty, just not sure if I'm willing to earn the XP for them.

As far as CE goes, Gemstone rarely used his AC as monsters that couldn't hit him with his AC gear on couldn't hurt him with it off. I only listed the AC because most of the calculations were done before I learned that.

Once he got to the areas where the monsters blows were hurting him, his AC didn't do him any good. Still, it was handy to keep the gear to switch to when it was important to not deal damage with guards.

I totally agree with you. I've been playing more or less casually for about a year, and as such, I don't really have some of the nicer gear that you can get from lower lvl content (twink mostly, some end-game). I find myself farming low-mid level content with some consistency. Since I can self-buff past 60, going into AC mode does make a lot of things go easier. But you're right, CE is +3 vs DF to AC, unlikely to really make a difference. I'll probably swap it to empower. At the time, since my BAB didn't qualify me for later feats, it was the only thing I was interested in.

Phidius
08-19-2010, 09:02 AM
...

Feats
1 Stunning Blow
3 Toughness
6 Past life Monk
9 Power Attack
12 ITWF
15 Imp Crit: Blud
18 GTWF (swap at 20)
1 Monk Dodge (ninja spy pre-req)
2 Monk TWF
6 Monk Combat expertise
1 Wiz Extend
5 Wiz Maximize
10 Wiz Quicken
...

I updated my build 'cause I took Stunning Blow at level 3 - I think that swapping with Toughness (like you've done) would be even better, but what's done is done.

Just saw that you're taking GTWF @18, but swapping it @20 - what are you taking in its place?

quickbunnie
08-19-2010, 01:30 PM
I updated my build 'cause I took Stunning Blow at level 3 - I think that swapping with Toughness (like you've done) would be even better, but what's done is done.

Just saw that you're taking GTWF @18, but swapping it @20 - what are you taking in its place?

My level progression is a little different from yours and I won't qualify for GTWF until 20 - what I meant was I would have a filler feat at 18 and swap it for GTWF at 20. Actually I'd qualify at lvl 19 - but still would require a feat swap. I think I will change around my progression though and just take GTWF at 18.

Phidius
08-19-2010, 01:33 PM
... I think I will change around my progression though and just take GTWF at 18.

I highly recommend doing this - if you don't qualify for the feat at level 18, you won't be able to swap it in when you're 20.

That's where most of my builds get their stress - I have to take levels when I'd rather not just to qualify for specific feats.

quickbunnie
08-19-2010, 01:40 PM
I highly recommend doing this - if you don't qualify for the feat at level 18, you won't be able to swap it in when you're 20.

That's where most of my builds get their stress - I have to take levels when I'd rather not just to qualify for specific feats.

Really? I didn't know that. Then I will definitely change around my progression. I had figured I'd be able to take it at 19/20 once my BAB was 11. Thanks.
EDIT: Now my progression is the exact same as yours, heh.
1 monk
2-8 wizard (wall of fire)
9-13 monk (ninja spy)
14-16 wizard
17-18 monk (to get to BAB 11 for GTWF)
19 wizard (6th lvl spells)
20 monk (touch of death)

Hurak
08-20-2010, 12:27 AM
If you use the handwarps with the backstab effect, you can gain up to +5 to hit on flanking positions. Will help your BAB immensely.

TiranBlade
08-20-2010, 12:36 AM
What would make this nice, is if say the developement team added in the enlightened Fist Prestige, then i would consider it myself.

But your build is really nice, I like the concept, keep it up!

Deaths_ward
08-20-2010, 01:27 AM
Just an odd thought, why not go Monk 8/Wizard 12, and use the Pale Master shrouds for their touch attack effects, heck by that level you can also maintain a Death Aura for semi-permanent self healing as well.

Phidius
08-20-2010, 08:19 AM
If you use the handwarps with the backstab effect, you can gain up to +5 to hit on flanking positions. Will help your BAB immensely.

Yeah, especially while standing in my Extended Sleetstorm :D I get my Kundarak boots at level 9...


What would make this nice, is if say the developement team added in the enlightened Fist Prestige, then i would consider it myself.

But your build is really nice, I like the concept, keep it up!

Hmmm - never heard of this PrE... don't think it's going to happen, though, as they've already got the 3 planned out.


Just an odd thought, why not go Monk 8/Wizard 12, and use the Pale Master shrouds for their touch attack effects, heck by that level you can also maintain a Death Aura for semi-permanent self healing as well.

1. Touch of Death
2. Improved Evasion
3. Strong aversion to dying. Quickened reconstruct is pretty hard to beat, unless it doesn't work on you.

I must confess to having a very strong aversion to Pale Master even though I've never tried it. Perhaps I will someday, but not until after they announce that they're done messing with it - it's a bad idea to make a toon around a concept that is still in development.

k1ngp1n
08-20-2010, 08:29 AM
This strikes me as a very 'Phidius' build.

Therefore I like it. :P

Cyr
08-20-2010, 08:35 AM
Fascinating build Gem. You know my aversion to arcane sword builds, but this particular take is very promising. Let me read over it some more and see if I have any suggestions for tweaks.

Phidius
08-20-2010, 10:16 AM
This strikes me as a very 'Phidius' build.

Therefore I like it. :P

The sad thing is that Phidius wasn't one of the 4 I chose when I went Premium... maybe someday I'll pay the TP to unlock him again.

Gotta buy some content first...


Fascinating build Gem. You know my aversion to arcane sword builds, but this particular take is very promising. Let me read over it some more and see if I have any suggestions for tweaks.

I do know, and I'd appreciate it - he's level 3 now, but I'm hoping to get 4 today at lunch.

Not expecting great DPS, but it would be interesting to see how the Monk9 + ToD compare to old Ranger6 + Khopeshes. I'm OK at figuring out basic damage, but when it comes to damage over a time period with strikes on timers, I give up pretty quick.

But everyone loves big numbers, even if you don't get them very often :D

quickbunnie
08-20-2010, 06:38 PM
The sad thing is that Phidius wasn't one of the 4 I chose when I went Premium... maybe someday I'll pay the TP to unlock him again.

Gotta buy some content first...



I do know, and I'd appreciate it - he's level 3 now, but I'm hoping to get 4 today at lunch.

Not expecting great DPS, but it would be interesting to see how the Monk9 + ToD compare to old Ranger6 + Khopeshes. I'm OK at figuring out basic damage, but when it comes to damage over a time period with strikes on timers, I give up pretty quick.

But everyone loves big numbers, even if you don't get them very often :D

Remember, a fair portion of Monk DPS comes from Ki strikes, ToD bursting rings, and base damage die. This build won't get too far on the base damage die, but a good set of handwraps and good management of your ki strikes will help DPS at lower lvls. Not sure if you will spend enough time to craft burst rings (no reason to if you are gonna TR back to 12/6/2).

My main pair is a +4 icy burst, force handwraps of pure good ML:10, which is great overall - very little is immune to force or good damage. Other wraps I use: +1 holy handwraps of greater undead bane, and Devouts for any metal DR I can't bypass. I have a few more pairs that are situational. I run a lot with a guildie who is a pure FvS WF greatsword melee build and currently I am fairly consistently out-pacing him on the kill counts. Of course, he has a lot more mana than I do and heals me when I run out of mana (no regen yet).

The finishers can also help DPS some - try grabbing the fernian wraps from Threnal (BTA). It makes the Breath of the Fire Dragon finisher pretty potent, if you are in sun stance and have a combustion item on (50% insight bonus to fire finishers and lvl 1 fire spells). The mechanism may be broken however, since BotFD is currently 1d6 per character level rather 1d4 per 2 monk levels like the description. Still, doesn't cost any mana, and until you get touch of death, not much to spend ki on. I don't do this too much, but its pretty funny against mummies and icy mobs.

Touch of Death in its current implementation is 60 DPS by itself. Ki strikes will add on to that - depending on how much ki you have. 500 dmg with an 80% chance to double proc every 15 seconds = 60 DPS. I use this as a baseline for estimating dark monk DPS. According to my numbers, against 50% fort, its okay DPS, slightly behind most melees. Against 0% fort, its actually pretty bad, falling 20-30% behind most melees. But does very well against heavy fort mobs - surpassing most non-monk builds.

Phidius
11-18-2010, 01:56 PM
Finally have an update on this build - I ended up taking Monk9 at level 19 so I could play around with Touch of Death before I hit 20. I've not been impressed by this build, so I've been planning on TR-ing to the new and improved version (linked at the very top - a modification of the original build).

Now that I've got ToD, I thought I'd share a discovery that many people probably already knew - the Touch of Death is not improved in any way by Pale Master 1's 25% bonus to negative energy spells (nor by any other boost to negative energy spells).

I didn't really expect it to, as it's not a finisher, but it was worth checking out :D

Getting 250 - 1000 damage every 15 seconds is a nice toy, but still on track to TR once he hits 20.

Fecerak
11-21-2010, 03:12 AM
Well, since I am considering making one of these gimps I am currently doing dps calculations on all kinds of battlemages :P

Ill let you know what I discover if you want :)

For this build, its dps is actually lower than your gemstone build, even without tempest I and when we also start to consider the fact that you cant make GS handwraps and so on this build is falling behind a bit. The dpscalc I am using may not be working for U7 however :P

Its made preU7, so yeah.

Fecerak
11-21-2010, 03:56 AM
Well, now I have gone through all the combos I could think of with 12 wizard levels (bar barbarian stuff as I don't think that would be very playable even if it were better dps)

Here is the numbers I got: (Number 1 is 0% fort, number 2 is 50% and number 3 is 100%)(All numbers are assuming fighting against evil outsiders)(And all THF numbers are assuming eSoS)

Wiz 11/Mnk 9, TWF Unarmed: 262, 221, 192 (However these numbers are without ki strikes and ToD)
Wiz 12/Rgr 6/Mnk 2, TWF: 315, 245, 193
Wiz 12/Pala 6/Mnk 2, TWF: 319, 241, 193
Wiz 12/Ftr 6/Mnk 2, TWF: 326, 239, 189
Wiz 12/Rog 7/Ftr 1, TWF: 376, 265, 178
Wiz 12/Rgr 6/Mnk 2, THF: 292, 238, 184
Wiz 12/Pala 6/Mnk 2, THF: 315, 259, 200
Wiz 12/Ftr 6/Mnk 2, THF: 297, 241, 184
Wiz 12/Rog 7/Ftr 1, THF: 325, 251, 178

EDIT:
Decided to do barb versions as well, just to be done with it lol :P

Wiz 12/Barb 6/Rog 2, THF: 320, 262, 203
Wiz 12/Barb 6/Rog 2, TWF: 351, 260, 204

But keep in mind that while barbarian perhaps may be the highest dps of these, this is assuming rage, death frenzy and so on. Another problem with it is the fact that all these builds assumed dps over 5 minutes, which favor things that have haste boosts and such that wouldn't be possible to sustain indefinitely, so the dps numbers would be more in favor of things like ranger and paladin with longer amount of times (assuming they are able to keep up their buffs and divine sacrifice spamming, ofc)

Personally I wish it was possible to go with more than 3 classes in DDO lol

Then I would probably go 11 wiz/6 pala/2 monk/1 rgr for the sprint boost and such

Tobril
11-29-2010, 10:37 AM
Did you manage to finish capping yesterday?

Phidius
11-29-2010, 10:44 AM
Yup, hit 20 right after running the Reaver for the 19th time... so I'm going to wait until Thursday to TR, giving me one more chance to not pull a +3 tome.

Then it's off to Korthos!