With Monk's Touch of Death proccing twice or thrice are they the new DPS Kings?

[Ginetti]

I'm a Rogue.

Rogue Assassin III. I'm a strength based, halfling.

I have no innate self heal ability. I do one thing well, kill mobs that are not focused on me.

I'm an opportunist. I don't just attack, I pick a target, one that's distracted. Once I meed those conditions, I strike.

However, now with Monk's touch of death multipule proccing ability, should I re-roll and make a monk instead if i want to be the top melee damage dealer?

I'm not making this thread to point out that i'm annoyed - i'm making it because if there's a new king of dps, that's exciting, and i'll jump to that class, instead.

I like dps - it makes things fun.

[Arel]

I'm hardly a number cruncher, but my gut says no unless you're talking purely about one-hit-KO attacks on trash mobs. For that matter, I don't think rogues are highest DPS (over long periods) either: that title belongs to Barbarians if I remember correctly.

The ToD attack has two sticking points -- It's expensive without the right equipment/build, and it's a one-hit strike. 50 ki is a lot if you're in wind stance and throwing elemental strikes out, so it's not always available. And even if it is, we only get one chance. Miss (either by position or by roll), and we've wasted the ki AND have a fairly long cooldown before we can activate it again (assuming we have enough ki).

All that being said, 500-1500 damage (2000 in very rare cases, though I think that's supposed to be a bug) will kill most trash outright, and those that it doesn't won't be standing for much longer afterwards. But against bosses, that burst damage smooths us back down to average DPS since our normal attacks are much weaker on average than other classes due to no greensteel weapons.

[Delacroix21]

Monk DPS has risen for sure with multiple ToD procs, yet it is still behind many other builds according to the DPS calculators.


Even then Pure rogue DPS has never been on top, its high to be sure, but not the best.

[Sithias]

<snip>

The ToD attack has two sticking points -- It's expensive without the right equipment/build, and it's a one-hit strike. 50 ki is a lot if you're in wind stance and throwing elemental strikes out, so it's not always available. And even if it is, we only get one chance. Miss (either by position or by roll), and we've wasted the ki AND have a fairly long cooldown before we can activate it again (assuming we have enough ki).

All that being said, 500-1500 damage (2000 in very rare cases, though I think that's supposed to be a bug) will kill most trash outright, and those that it doesn't won't be standing for much longer afterwards. But against bosses, that burst damage smooths us back down to average DPS since our normal attacks are much weaker on average than other classes due to no greensteel weapons.

I agree with Arel on this, double or even triple proccing ToD is nice, but not being positioned correctly and/or missing with the ToD strike hurts as it costs you 50 ki+the cooldown timer on the strike, especially without the right equipment/build.

[yuerong89]

Regarding the ki consumption, it sldn't be a problem on a pure monk with capstone and elegant crane (max) and imp C. blud. i throw off lightning strikes and TOD everytime its available on harry and my ki is still sustaining w/o a concentration item.

[Hydro]

I dont know if any class can compete with an extra 100ish SA a swing... Monks are good though in the fact that they dont require SA to get most of their damage. Up to you I made both and they are both great DPS choices.

[sephiroth1084]

Last I read, pure rogue assassins with the capstone were pretty close to the top of the DPS mountain.

[bunitchu]

Last I read, pure rogue assassins with the capstone were pretty close to the top of the DPS mountain.

got to agree ^^, rogue assassin 3 with radiance wep + new capstone = utter dps per swing...problem is when u go against undeads, or constructs, or high fort enemies, then his dps is reduced to ash....but every class must have a weakness =3

[Arel]

Rogues excel against mobs without fortification due to SA/assassinate

Monks excel in moderate length fights (such as most 6-man quest bosses) with decent lead-up times, due to ToD. Doubly so at mid-levels when they first get the Touch.

THF characters excel against medium-large groups of trash mobs due to Glancing Blows.

TWF characters excel against most everything else.

Feel free to disagree, but I think that's the basic scheme of melee DPS currently, given equivalent gear. All well built characters do good DPS, but some do better in certain situations.

[hockeyrama]

I have seen many different discussions about dps. I have only seen once an actual chart that someone posted and it showed damage against various situations (heavy fort mob, undead, no fort, optimum conditions....). In this calcualtion fomr my memory it showed rogues as the highest in extremely optimum conditions. The barbarians where the best in almost every other condition. HOwever, that was an old calculation and would not have the changes for monk and rogue taken into full consideration.


So without the full calculations done by someone with more time and skill in that area then me I would say it has not changed that much. I still see rogue assassin 3 fully geared as the king in fully oprimized situations but they are not the king the rest of the time and sometimes they are one of the lowest. Barbrians are usually the best all around dps but then they not as cool to play as other designs (IMO) as they pretty basic style for me. However, they are a good consistent option. With the changes to monk I still put them behind an optimal situated rogue or a barbarian but they are now closer. The problem is that it is a hard thing to add to a calculator. SA can be situationally done basically all the time (given an intimi toon around or held mobs). Barbarians damage again can be calculated easily. The monk tuch is like trying to calculate assassinations form an assassin rogue. Sometimes, they move out of reach unexpectedly and you waste the touch. Also, the ki drain needs to be added into the formula as well but if setup properly this should not be much of an issue as the timer is.

I would stay an assassin and keep enjoying kiling everything and remember all these calculations about dps are not taking into account your ability to one shot kill many things with assassination so really in many situations you are the highest dps.