knightgf
07-11-2010, 09:45 PM
Guild Vendors: The 'rush' job!
Introduction
There are still 2 more guild vendors I have no tried out: The potion and the Wand vendor. But from what I've experienced, there is no redemption or hopes coming from these two vendors, so I am not holding my breath.
Anyways, onto my discussion. As you no doubt will know, I am very dissapointed with the guild vendors in this game. Not all of them, but 95% of them. And you might be wondering, "What's so dissapointing about the guild vendors?" Although if you have experienced what I have, you won't be wondering in the slightest.
Prologue
The first argument I can make before I even address the vendors is their location. They seem so out of place! It reminds me of the marketplace incident where all the vendors had to move to the Rusty Nail tavern because the marketplace tent got blown down. Is that what happened to these guys? Did they get banished from their former shops and had to scvange around here? It's an eyesore for House Kundrak. There's no reason why these guys should be here. If you want these guys to be put in a better place, why not have a entrance inside the airship store that leads to these guys? It would make sense, since they are guild vendors. It would make the House Kundrak ward look much nicer without the guild vendors standing there out of place.
The Vendors
Now, about the vendors...my god did they mess those up greatly. First, I'll talk about the guild general vendor. This vendor is actually ok, although there's not much to talk about him. He sells the usual stuff, and will actually buy your stuff better than the vendors. Isn't that nice? Rather than having to go around from one pawn broker to another, you can just visit one vendor and he'll take care of your items better than the pawn brokers. However, the only beef I have with him is that he doesn't show up in the guild reward list as a level 4 vendor.
On the other vendors, well, I really don't have much in the way of positive to say about them. As most people know, the component vendors dont work, which is kind of a shame. Im surprised they haven't done a hotfix to actually get the vendors to work, but oh well. But what really bugs me is they don't sell components for bards, rangers and paladins! How did they mess up the vendors so bad that they forgot to add components for bards, rangers and paladins? And I know its not because they 'dont have room in the store', since if that was the case, the House J divine regent vendor wouldn't be able to carry all the divine components that divine casters needed! If Turbine fixed up the vendors so that the components worked and they included the bard, ranger and paladin as well, then I would like it.
The hireling vendors are just a slap in the face for guilds. Especially big ones, who probably do not use them at all. To be fair, I think Turbine was REALLY running out of ideas when they decided to put these vendors in. My first gripe is that each vendor has its own guild level at which it can be unlocked. I mean seriously? What's wrong with putting them into levels? It seems like such a waste of guild rewards...these hireling vendors are a great way to demotivate guilds into leveling their guild and getting better rewards. Second off is that, for some reason, the melee hireling vendors go up to only level 16, like they didnt have enough room to put level 17-20 hirelings. And third(Which could possibly support the 1st) is that the clerics have their own vendor. Why do that? What a waste.
I know I'm getting more and more onto guild hirelings, but its such a discrace to the game. I'll admit, I probably would complain about hirelings any way, but if Turbine was going to be smart with it, why not just add a option to unlock all hirelings at level 12, and then add 5 vendors that sell hirelings by level, just like the marketplace? Granted, the gap between 12 and 18 would be painful, but at least there aren't worthless achievements to unlock between that time period. Or, better yet, if they wanted to put something in there, how about adding a guild tavern at level 14 with a spirit binder and adding a unique vendor of some type at level 16? While it might be a bit awkward to see a tavern vendor, and while the unique vendor may or may not be good, it's much better than what is currently provided.
The guild augment vendors are flawed, BUT unlike the other vendors, they have at least a tiny bit of use. Now, while I can go off-topic about the slots themselves, I'm going to limit it by saying that the extremely limited options for putting guild bonuses for skills are unacceptable. Now, I can understand if diplomacy items ONLY appeared on cloaks, or haggle items ONLY appeared on necklaces, but they don't. They vary from item to item. Personally, I think they wasted time coding these guild bonuses to skills to only be attuned to specific items. Why do that? Why not just let us choose what we want to augment in our guild augment slots for our items and weapons?
I can understand elemental damage bonuses being only applied to weapons, because we know how bugged unarmed combat is and all, but shouldn't we be able to put whatever non-damaging bonuses we want on any item with a appropriate guild augment slot? Let me recite a quote from the reward regarding this matter:
Grants all guild members the ability to equip items with tiny guild augment slots. These items can be augmented with various additional effects and YOU DECIDE what to augment them with. The augment guild vendors can be found in House Kundarak.
Did you see what I bolded? I understand that taking away the ability to put elemental damage on items so they work with your weapons shouldn't be an option due to game mechanics, but don't you think that limiting tiny gems of haggling to only be a option for necklaces with guild slots defeats the purpose of YOU deciding what to augment them with? Pretty deciving, I must say. But, I can end on a positive note with these vendors: The HP and SP bonuses are fairly nice.
And last, we have the scroll vendors. They're the REAL deal...they stink. Oh god, do they stink. To begin with, they have one problem in common with the guild vendors: They couldn't add NPCS for specific levels because of the lack of space with the area they were in, so they had to limit their inventory. And that's great, right? On top of that, the scrolls are BOUND TO CHARACTER. That's right, once you buy them, you can't trade them, they won't go into any existing stack you already have, and most of all, you can't sell them back either! Thats right, unless you want to take up more inventory space, you either gotta sell the stack you already have or destroy the stack you baught at the guild general vendors.
You know, why are they bound to character in the first place? Its not like the guild vendors are going to drive the other normal vendors out of business, anyone can still buy from them, and sometimes it might be convienent for the player. The principal of a 'convience' vendor is still in effect here, because you can still teleport to the House J shop or the Portable Hole directly for scrolls, anyone in the right place that needs scrolls quickly can still buy them from the vendor, and the scrolls drop from dungeons anyways. What is the big deal? If Turbine's worried that players could sell them at AH for a profit, then lets look at it: Say a player could buy scrolls of healing for, I dunno, 65% of base value? Then they put it in the AH, 3% is used to post, then it somehow sells for base value, and 30% is taken away. While it is a mere 2% profit, and while it can add up, let's ask these questions:
1. If a bunch of other players are doing the same thing, do you think they might buyout YOUR stack of 100 healing scrolls?
2. Can you still make a profit if your item doesn't sell in the time specified?
3. If a player just wants to refill their stock of 100 healing scrolls, do you think they're going to destroy that stack and get another in the AH or will they go to the vendor?
Maybe if Turbine answered these questions, in addition to looking at the reasons why binding these items to character is a bad idea, they may not have done this at all. They would have realized it would be an inconvience to players already carrying scrolls, and not to mention some players like carrying scrolls for others to give in case they need them.
Conclusion
I still have not tried out the potion and wand vendors yet, but as I stated earlier, there is probably NO redeeming factors from them whatsoever with the current design that's in place. The vendors have rush-job written all over them, and thats no joke. That's not to say that the guild vendors should be removed from game. Matter of fact, they still have great potental, and can be redeemed if:
- The vendors are all neatly organized under one guild shop, and don't look like they got kicked out of their old joint.
- There are more NPCS for the various types of vendors so that more of the unlocked rewards can be offered.
- The items offered WORK and are NOT bound in any way(Unless under special circumstances, but for now, just stick to no bound items.)
- The hirelings are either eliminated or all combined into one reward, in which the previous levels at which specific classes are unlocked are substitued for better rewards.
- The limitations for guild gems are removed, except for any technical cases, such as weapon damage on items. Better yet, if such a effect is placed on a item, why not turn it into a 'guard'?
Please Turbine: I am BEGGING you: Look at these suggestions. Understand my reasoning. Communicate. Know that the vendors are horrible but that they can be improved. I will appreciate any Dev's feedback to my suggestions, because it can really improve the guild vendor functions in so many ways.
Introduction
There are still 2 more guild vendors I have no tried out: The potion and the Wand vendor. But from what I've experienced, there is no redemption or hopes coming from these two vendors, so I am not holding my breath.
Anyways, onto my discussion. As you no doubt will know, I am very dissapointed with the guild vendors in this game. Not all of them, but 95% of them. And you might be wondering, "What's so dissapointing about the guild vendors?" Although if you have experienced what I have, you won't be wondering in the slightest.
Prologue
The first argument I can make before I even address the vendors is their location. They seem so out of place! It reminds me of the marketplace incident where all the vendors had to move to the Rusty Nail tavern because the marketplace tent got blown down. Is that what happened to these guys? Did they get banished from their former shops and had to scvange around here? It's an eyesore for House Kundrak. There's no reason why these guys should be here. If you want these guys to be put in a better place, why not have a entrance inside the airship store that leads to these guys? It would make sense, since they are guild vendors. It would make the House Kundrak ward look much nicer without the guild vendors standing there out of place.
The Vendors
Now, about the vendors...my god did they mess those up greatly. First, I'll talk about the guild general vendor. This vendor is actually ok, although there's not much to talk about him. He sells the usual stuff, and will actually buy your stuff better than the vendors. Isn't that nice? Rather than having to go around from one pawn broker to another, you can just visit one vendor and he'll take care of your items better than the pawn brokers. However, the only beef I have with him is that he doesn't show up in the guild reward list as a level 4 vendor.
On the other vendors, well, I really don't have much in the way of positive to say about them. As most people know, the component vendors dont work, which is kind of a shame. Im surprised they haven't done a hotfix to actually get the vendors to work, but oh well. But what really bugs me is they don't sell components for bards, rangers and paladins! How did they mess up the vendors so bad that they forgot to add components for bards, rangers and paladins? And I know its not because they 'dont have room in the store', since if that was the case, the House J divine regent vendor wouldn't be able to carry all the divine components that divine casters needed! If Turbine fixed up the vendors so that the components worked and they included the bard, ranger and paladin as well, then I would like it.
The hireling vendors are just a slap in the face for guilds. Especially big ones, who probably do not use them at all. To be fair, I think Turbine was REALLY running out of ideas when they decided to put these vendors in. My first gripe is that each vendor has its own guild level at which it can be unlocked. I mean seriously? What's wrong with putting them into levels? It seems like such a waste of guild rewards...these hireling vendors are a great way to demotivate guilds into leveling their guild and getting better rewards. Second off is that, for some reason, the melee hireling vendors go up to only level 16, like they didnt have enough room to put level 17-20 hirelings. And third(Which could possibly support the 1st) is that the clerics have their own vendor. Why do that? What a waste.
I know I'm getting more and more onto guild hirelings, but its such a discrace to the game. I'll admit, I probably would complain about hirelings any way, but if Turbine was going to be smart with it, why not just add a option to unlock all hirelings at level 12, and then add 5 vendors that sell hirelings by level, just like the marketplace? Granted, the gap between 12 and 18 would be painful, but at least there aren't worthless achievements to unlock between that time period. Or, better yet, if they wanted to put something in there, how about adding a guild tavern at level 14 with a spirit binder and adding a unique vendor of some type at level 16? While it might be a bit awkward to see a tavern vendor, and while the unique vendor may or may not be good, it's much better than what is currently provided.
The guild augment vendors are flawed, BUT unlike the other vendors, they have at least a tiny bit of use. Now, while I can go off-topic about the slots themselves, I'm going to limit it by saying that the extremely limited options for putting guild bonuses for skills are unacceptable. Now, I can understand if diplomacy items ONLY appeared on cloaks, or haggle items ONLY appeared on necklaces, but they don't. They vary from item to item. Personally, I think they wasted time coding these guild bonuses to skills to only be attuned to specific items. Why do that? Why not just let us choose what we want to augment in our guild augment slots for our items and weapons?
I can understand elemental damage bonuses being only applied to weapons, because we know how bugged unarmed combat is and all, but shouldn't we be able to put whatever non-damaging bonuses we want on any item with a appropriate guild augment slot? Let me recite a quote from the reward regarding this matter:
Grants all guild members the ability to equip items with tiny guild augment slots. These items can be augmented with various additional effects and YOU DECIDE what to augment them with. The augment guild vendors can be found in House Kundarak.
Did you see what I bolded? I understand that taking away the ability to put elemental damage on items so they work with your weapons shouldn't be an option due to game mechanics, but don't you think that limiting tiny gems of haggling to only be a option for necklaces with guild slots defeats the purpose of YOU deciding what to augment them with? Pretty deciving, I must say. But, I can end on a positive note with these vendors: The HP and SP bonuses are fairly nice.
And last, we have the scroll vendors. They're the REAL deal...they stink. Oh god, do they stink. To begin with, they have one problem in common with the guild vendors: They couldn't add NPCS for specific levels because of the lack of space with the area they were in, so they had to limit their inventory. And that's great, right? On top of that, the scrolls are BOUND TO CHARACTER. That's right, once you buy them, you can't trade them, they won't go into any existing stack you already have, and most of all, you can't sell them back either! Thats right, unless you want to take up more inventory space, you either gotta sell the stack you already have or destroy the stack you baught at the guild general vendors.
You know, why are they bound to character in the first place? Its not like the guild vendors are going to drive the other normal vendors out of business, anyone can still buy from them, and sometimes it might be convienent for the player. The principal of a 'convience' vendor is still in effect here, because you can still teleport to the House J shop or the Portable Hole directly for scrolls, anyone in the right place that needs scrolls quickly can still buy them from the vendor, and the scrolls drop from dungeons anyways. What is the big deal? If Turbine's worried that players could sell them at AH for a profit, then lets look at it: Say a player could buy scrolls of healing for, I dunno, 65% of base value? Then they put it in the AH, 3% is used to post, then it somehow sells for base value, and 30% is taken away. While it is a mere 2% profit, and while it can add up, let's ask these questions:
1. If a bunch of other players are doing the same thing, do you think they might buyout YOUR stack of 100 healing scrolls?
2. Can you still make a profit if your item doesn't sell in the time specified?
3. If a player just wants to refill their stock of 100 healing scrolls, do you think they're going to destroy that stack and get another in the AH or will they go to the vendor?
Maybe if Turbine answered these questions, in addition to looking at the reasons why binding these items to character is a bad idea, they may not have done this at all. They would have realized it would be an inconvience to players already carrying scrolls, and not to mention some players like carrying scrolls for others to give in case they need them.
Conclusion
I still have not tried out the potion and wand vendors yet, but as I stated earlier, there is probably NO redeeming factors from them whatsoever with the current design that's in place. The vendors have rush-job written all over them, and thats no joke. That's not to say that the guild vendors should be removed from game. Matter of fact, they still have great potental, and can be redeemed if:
- The vendors are all neatly organized under one guild shop, and don't look like they got kicked out of their old joint.
- There are more NPCS for the various types of vendors so that more of the unlocked rewards can be offered.
- The items offered WORK and are NOT bound in any way(Unless under special circumstances, but for now, just stick to no bound items.)
- The hirelings are either eliminated or all combined into one reward, in which the previous levels at which specific classes are unlocked are substitued for better rewards.
- The limitations for guild gems are removed, except for any technical cases, such as weapon damage on items. Better yet, if such a effect is placed on a item, why not turn it into a 'guard'?
Please Turbine: I am BEGGING you: Look at these suggestions. Understand my reasoning. Communicate. Know that the vendors are horrible but that they can be improved. I will appreciate any Dev's feedback to my suggestions, because it can really improve the guild vendor functions in so many ways.