My thoughts on post U5 "apocalypse"

[vVAnjilaVv]

OK, here it is.....

As much as things have changed over the years in DDO, this game is still far and away probably the most unique MMO out there. Regardless of what many may say, this game has little to no grind unless you "choose" to do so.

Questing is much more fun than kill X amount of things.

You do not have to grind literally on the same 4 mobs for days or weeks to get a level.

The game loot and player abilities are VERY generous compared to other f2p games.

In-game voice is nice.

The ability to get everything for free by earning favor if you have that kind of patience is again...EXTREMELY generous.

I'm sorry, you guys want an MMO that is different from all the others, that requires experimentation.....and things don't always go perfectly. This game is cutting edge as far as gameplay IMO, and that is called pioneering....and that requires time and persistence to perfect.

**EDIT** snip

[FluffyCalico]

OK, here it is.....

Questing is much more fun than kill X amount of things.
Ever head of slayer? Guess not
You do not have to grind literally on the same 4 mobs for days or weeks to get a level.
Never seen an MMO that took longer to get a level than from 19-20 double TR in DDO care to try again?
The game loot and player abilities are VERY generous compared to other f2p games.
Overpowered loot combined with power creep making the origional game it was based on barly even there YAY
In-game voice is nice.
What guild in a MMO doesn't have a vent server?
The ability to get everything for free by earning favor if you have that kind of patience is again...EXTREMELY generous.
Its called bait and switch
This game is cutting edge.
Not even the day it released




In red

[valharan01]

The flavor of this board reminds me of the release of Dark & Light. They ignored the players, released a buggy mess of a game and almost instantly alienated even their staunchest supporters. Those self same fanboys turned around and destroyed that game scaring away potential players by the thousands. The only bright spot for them was they were promptly sued by one of the developers.... wait nevermind.

[Dendrix]

Never seen an MMO that took longer to get a level than from 19-20 double TR in DDO care to try again?

Everquest. level 59 to level 60, it took weeks and weeks. The ultimate hell level.

of course, that's all changed now.

[Kriogen]

...
Seriously...deal with it of get the F out!
While I can agree with that many exagurate, I do not agree with this totaly.

Have seen this in a couple of other games. Problem is, people did went away. Those games are now on life support or dead.

Be carefull what you wish for.

Funny thing is, have seen more new players being scared away by fans then by haters.

[varsh]

In red

yet you are still here Fluffy despite all your beefs with the game. I have not been here for years like you...but I have been reading the forums every day...and at least a month before I became a VIP. I just find it funny how many peeps complain but stay. Personally if I do not like a game....I stop playing. Kinda simple logic when you stop whining for a few minutes and actually think about it.

[FluffyCalico]

yet you are still here Fluffy despite all your beefs with the game. I have not been here for years like you...but I have been reading the forums every day...and at least a month before I became a VIP. I just find it funny how many peeps complain but stay. Personally if I do not like a game....I stop playing. Kinda simple logic when you stop whining for a few minutes and actually think about it.

Did not say I didn't like the game or that there was nothing good about it. Just pointed out that most of the points listed were not true.
And as far as still here as someone who was here on day 1 I can tell you the game was better, more immersing, less buggy, less laggy, and more DnD like the 1st day it released.

Right now I am biding my time til Diablo 3 comes out because...as much as this game has gone downhill...it's still more fun than AoC/WoW/Warhammer

[Modinator0]

Did not say I didn't like the game or that there was nothing good about it. Just pointed out that most of the points listed were not true.
And as far as still here as someone who was here on day 1 I can tell you the game was better, more immersing, less buggy, less laggy, and more DnD like the 1st day it released.

Right now I am biding my time til Diablo 3 comes out because...as much as this game has gone downhill...it's still more fun than AoC/WoW/Warhammer

LOL good luck with Activision/Blizzard. You think Turbine is bad? You ain't seen nothin yet :D

[Rice]

LOL good luck with Activision/Blizzard. You think Turbine is bad? You ain't seen nothin yet :D

I disagree. When patches are rolled out, they actually work as intended. Very rarely do they have to disable new features because they, unlike Turbine, actually fix bugs before release.

[FluffyCalico]

LOL good luck with Activision/Blizzard. You think Turbine is bad? You ain't seen nothin yet :D

Actually diablo 1-2 were very good for there time. And Wow was good in the beginning, the only true issue they had was more people than they could handel.

[Modinator0]

Actually diablo 1-2 were very good for there time. And Wow was good in the beginning, the only true issue they had was more people than they could handel.

Yes, they were. But they were not tainted by the evil that is Activision.

[Beherit_Baphomar]

OP you make a lot of noise but don't really say anything.

Spamming the boards with 'deal with it' threads is just as annoying as people whining.

You don't like the whiners? Deal with it or GTFO.

[Rice]

I was honestly one of the few who actually liked U5 on paper... until I actually got around to playing it. More broken things than fixed things.

PS: WHY OH WHY did you change the chain lightning sound effects from an awesome screeching electric zap to a lame ass star wars blaster? It sounds like garbage.

[vVAnjilaVv]

I'd like to take a moment to rescind the end of my OP and apologize for it's harshness.

While I know when to stick to my guns...I also know when I have said something over the top.....sometimes I forget just how much RL time and money people invest in this game....and they do most certainly have the right to be upset when things go wrong or change in not such a graceful manner.

I think I will do the wise thing and take a step back from posting too much in the forums in it's currrent state as the game is pretty much in a state of chaos right now, and any statement whether it's meant to be positive or just meant to bash another person is not going to help here.

So yeah....hopefully things will work out soon.....like another has said......just try to enjoy the things that are working ATM....that's how I am getting by.

[vVAnjilaVv]

OP you make a lot of noise but don't really say anything.

Spamming the boards with 'deal with it' threads is just as annoying as people whining.

You don't like the whiners? Deal with it or GTFO.

Just trying to balance things out a little I guess, all I have seen all day is whining threads with very few if any positive ones.

[sugrcain]

I'm expecting to see a lot of whining threads. I can only speak for what I heard in my guild chat. One sole voice of happiness about the patch from a monk, while everyone else spoke in disappointed (a generous term) voice regarding the combat changes. I don't find the sentiment hard to understand either. The pacing of combat was a big contributing factor to the fun of this game, now the pace is slower. I don't personally think it has been drastically slowed, however it is certainly noticeable. Slower pace equates to slightly less fun for anyone who enjoyed that aspect of the game, which was a lot people in my guild. People can get pretty passionate about their hobbies and pastimes, whatever they may be. Is it really so hard to understand why some DDO players might not be in the highest of spirits right now?

[KelticKing]

Just fix the guild renown first this way peeps will be to busy grinding renown to notice all the other glitches.

[Mav145]

I'm expecting to see a lot of whining threads. I can only speak for what I heard in my guild chat. One sole voice of happiness about the patch from a monk, while everyone else spoke in disappointed (a generous term) voice regarding the combat changes. I don't find the sentiment hard to understand either. The pacing of combat was a big contributing factor to the fun of this game, now the pace is slower. I don't personally think it has been drastically slowed, however it is certainly noticeable. Slower pace equates to slightly less fun for anyone who enjoyed that aspect of the game, which was a lot people in my guild. People can get pretty passionate about their hobbies and pastimes, whatever they may be. Is it really so hard to understand why some DDO players might not be in the highest of spirits right now?

Don't know if it is much slower at all. Friday night, we ran a guild shroud in 24 minutes. Last night, we ran a guild shroud in 24 minutes. Now, honestly, the portals seemed to drop faster so they may have messed with some hp to compensate.

[sugrcain]

Perhaps pace isn't quite the correct word. I agree overall time to completion isn't that much different, but combat just feels a little slower paced overall now. Maybe it's stream of numbers flowing overhead, or the missing 5% from madstone, or missing hastes from enhancements, whatever it is, combat does feel a bit slower now. I personally don't mind it much and will adjust to the new pace, I'm still having fun here. All I'm trying to say is I can understand why some people are not happy about these changes.

[Darkrok]

I play one of the builds most affected by the patch - a light monk that does not have stunning fist, dumped wisdom, and relied on weighted handwraps to create crits for my dps when solo/short-manning stuff. Don't really want to LR because I plan on TR eventually so I'm pretty much stuck in a less than ideal build.

My take-away:

The sky hasn't fallen. The patch was buggy as hell. Once the bugs are fixed we'll all be fine.

I ran a ToD last night and we dropped part 2 faster than I'd ever done it pre-U5. Probably the result of a better group but the sky DEFINITELY has not fallen. And I'm not a fanboy or anything close. My build IS gutted, I'm extremely ticked that unlike every single other MMO I've ever played (5+ games in this comparison) if they changed a build they gave a free respec for people to fix it. Turbine? KACHING! And the update was an epic fail in quality control. Seriously, things that we specifically asked about pre-patch were said to be working and then when the patch came out worked differently. To put it bluntly I was extremely disappointed.

They rushed this patch, ignored their player base, acted shocked that people didn't think the **** they were spewing smelled like roses, and then completely dropped the ball on even getting their poorly thought out update right. But you know what? It's still a great game. It's still playable and some of the screw-ups favor the players and wouldn't be considered an exploit (don't think they can ban you for exploiting for using a certain weapon that you already used on a regular basis) so it's probably more playable than before for the time being. But more than playable the game is still FUN! The sky hasn't fallen...well, maybe it has, but the players have picked up all the pieces in a dust bin and used duct tape to put them back up. :)

[Raiderone]

I dont have any problems with U5. I feel U5 has been very ambious from the start.

Three PrE's to 2nd Tier...WOW. If we can get that many PRE's all the time, that would be great. Although Shintao Monk isn't that good yet, the Devs have acknowledge that fact and will be totally revamping (and who says they dont listen).

Improvements on PaleMaster and Mechanic PrE (New Neg Energy Spells to resurrect PM). I havent Tried Trapmaking yet.

Radient Servant is a great PrE. I hear nothing but good words.

Guild Renown which is interesting to say the least. It's just something else to strive for! I have pride in my Guild... Too bad it's turned off for now ( I was getting into it).

As far as the nerfs go, they come and they go. We've all been nerf'd at one time or another. No hidden agenda!

In TOD lag was better although we had Lag or something in Part4 of Shroud...
All well spamming heals (at will) and blades came in and then bamm all dead!!!
except three outside blades (two clerics and caster)...

Hey we even got 4 new quests! Low end but oh well.

[exactor_mortis]

Never seen an MMO that took longer to get a level than from 19-20 double TR in DDO care to try again?

Level 59 in EQ when it was a Hell level. Add to that the fact that, when you died, you had to run naked (or, if you were smart, in corpse-recovery gear) back to loot most of your stuff and ask/beg/bribe a cleric to res you or you lost a good chunk of the experience you were able to eek out. My first time through 59 took a month of grinding, killing the same old mobs over and over every six minutes.

[vVAnjilaVv]

Never seen an MMO that took longer to get a level than from 19-20 double TR in DDO care to try again?

Ever played Shaiya.....once you access Ultimate Mode and get to a certain point it takes days and/or weeks depending on how much you play just to get your XP bar up a tiny bit.......and you have to buy experiences stones and grind on the same four monsters as they have the best xp to do it. Heck I was on a normal mode character in that game up to level 56 out of 60 total levels and I figured it was going to take me about a month of at least 6 hour days just to hit my next level. The kicker was that for the best XP/minute I had to fight the same exact monster type, just one kind.....that whole time.

Even a double TR leveling is a joke compared to many other MMO's.....sorry, in terms of leveling I find DDO is one of the fastest and easiest there is. Plus you don't have to compete for kills, private instances make DDO far easier than any PvP based game where all instances are public.

[Drfirewater79]

Ever played Shaiya.....once you access Ultimate Mode and get to a certain point it takes days and/or weeks depending on how much you play just to get your XP bar up a tiny bit.......and you have to buy experiences stones and grind on the same four monsters as they have the best xp to do it. Heck I was on a normal mode character in that game up to level 56 out of 60 total levels and I figured it was going to take me about a month of at least 6 hour days just to hit my next level. The kicker was that for the best XP/minute I had to fight the same exact monster type, just one kind.....that whole time.

Even a double TR leveling is a joke compared to many other MMO's.....sorry, in terms of leveling I find DDO is one of the fastest and easiest there is. Plus you don't have to compete for kills, private instances make DDO far easier than any PvP based game where all instances are public.

unless your a exp farmer ... in which case your OP statements about grinding are completely off base

this game is extreamly hard to level and still have fun ... especially after lvl 15

there is less high level content then anywhere else in the game ...

with the highest need for content

more missions come out at lvl 1-10 then anything and that has been increased in the last few updates and again in next update ...

the slogan for turbine shouldn't be powered by there fans

it should be Clueless to there fans

cause they are clueless as to what the general player base really wants out of this game ...

[Soni]

I don't usually voice my opinion in the past, because I felt the game was fun and kept the D&D feel pretty good. However... update 5 changed some of those, but first thing first, I would like to say thanks to the Turbine team for putting up an update and I am sure when the bugs are fixed the update will be quite nice.

What I consider not D&D like:

1.) whats up with the 2-20 damage description? Where is my 2d10? It is simple math!!! Bring it back and keep the D&D feel plz.

2.) TWF is all mess up!!! I appreciate the attempt at tuning down TWF, but the way it was done was NOT D&D like. I say do the extra animation (its not that much more money and work) so that the time to complete all of the TWF attacks would be slightly longer than a set of regular attacks without TWF. I know this isn't totally D&D either but at least the combat calculation/sysytem is D&D and none of those 40%, 80% triggering an offhand attack. As for the animation, good reference would be Dynasty or Samurai Warriors.

TWF has always been powerful in D&D, it is not Turbine's fault, it was just built that way. I like what Turbine has done to improve Sword and Shield, keep it up.

[Thrudh]

I disagree. When patches are rolled out, they actually work as intended. Very rarely do they have to disable new features because they, unlike Turbine, actually fix bugs before release.

WOW has had multiple buggy updates... and they have 10 billion-gajillion dollars.

[bandyman1]

WOW has had multiple buggy updates... and they have 10 billion-gajillion dollars.

Posts like this tickle the **** outta me.

So, I should just accept ****-poor QA from a company, and a broken product that they are charging me for, because another company has had similar issues.

Great logic there, lmao :rolleyes:

[ikkle.D]

It seems that a lot of people are unhappy with the changed to the game that is now present in update five. I hear complaining about renown and TWF nerf etc. Of course I have a lot of frustrations myself because of TWF nerf as mostly my toons are TWF. I dont really understand why the TWF has been implemented though, I suppose it is a different way of making fights longer than just giving the mobs more HP, this is has been the solution that Turbine have used in the past and I suppose they say - lets just make it harder for one type of toon. :D

So I have been here before in this area of making a choice, play or leave. I remember last time I was in this position was with Star Wars Galaxies. I stay after CU because I had grinded more than a few Jedi to cap and thought it is bad but I will play still with fun. Then they make NGE and I feel betray because they give Jedi away when I had grind and grind even when the holocron say Weapon Smith - meep!

This point I make is at the moment I am say, ok I will play on and enjoy because I think I can enjoy this. I think though if I spend a lot more time remake all my toons so they are not TWF gimps any more and I am victim of another nerf I will not be enjoying the game any more.

Finally for all the people that think that because they leave the game it will fade and die. For you I will tell you to look at Star Wars Galaxies, still going - yes, it's full of 10 year old kids with no brains who use levelling services and the game is full of people who cheat and hack but the "bottom line" is that the producers of the game are still getting paid and for a business that is all that is important (sadly)

[Thrudh]

Posts like this tickle the **** outta me.

So, I should just accept ****-poor QA from a company, and a broken product that they are charging me for, because another company has had similar issues.

Great logic there, lmao :rolleyes:

Have you ever written software with zero bugs?? Even in a controlled environment like a corporation where you control all the client hardware, server hardware, network hardware, and OS/software builds?

How about an MMO where you have to deal with various client PCs, all configured differently with various hardware specs, widely varient network connections, with dozens (hundreds?) of different ISPs...

Then the part you do control, the software is 4 years old, millions of lines of code, written by guys long gone...

My point is... all software is buggy... All MMOs have problems.... Even the biggest one of all with economies of scale, tons of money, has bugs...

Get your expectations in line with reality and you'll be much happier...

My opinion only...

[bandyman1]

Have you ever written software with zero bugs?? Even in a controlled environment like a corporation where you control all the client hardware, server hardware, network hardware, and OS/software builds?

How about an MMO where you have to deal with various client PCs, all configured differently with various hardware specs, widely varient network connections, with dozens (hundreds?) of different ISPs...

Then the part you do control, the software is 4 years old, millions of lines of code, written by guys long gone...

My point is... all software is buggy... All MMOs have problems.... Even the biggest one of all with economies of scale, tons of money, has bugs...

Get your expectations in line with reality and you'll be much happier...

My opinion only...

The problem Thrudh, is that this was tested on Mornlands.

It was tested on Lam.

Turbine knew about the bugs.

They released them anyway.

No I haven't done code. Guess what??? I'm not a programmer.

I also don't get payed to be one. And my employer's success doesn't depend on me being a good one.

How would you feel if one of your loved ones died as a result of ****-poor performance on my part, in a field that I actually DO do. After all, I could just say " Yeah, well. It happens. We lose patients everyday. Every hospital, even the biggest ones do. There's always going to be the human error factor ".

What Blizzard or other companies have, or have not done, doesn't concern me one iota. Why??? Because I don't pay for their services.

[Drfirewater79]

The problem Thrudh, is that this was tested on Mornlands.

It was tested on Lam.

Turbine knew about the bugs.

They released them anyway.

No I haven't done code. Guess what??? I'm not a programmer.

I also don't get payed to be one. And my employer's success doesn't depend on me being a good one.

How would you feel if one of your loved ones died as a result of ****-poor performance on my part, in a field that I actually DO do. After all, I could just say " Yeah, well. It happens. We lose patients everyday. Every hospital, even the biggest ones do. There's always going to be the human error factor ".

What Blizzard or other companies have, or have not done, doesn't concern me one iota. Why??? Because I don't pay for their services.

I agree 100%

unfortunately with this game they could have 1000000 test servers and it still would be wanky on launch.

the problem is they dont know when or how to take feedback from the people

they dont listen to important issues till its too late ... they give release dates before the product is finished then are pressured to rush it out that day ..

I would rather they not even release it to lama till its ready to launch ... lama is suppost to be a preview server not a test server ...

then if something has to be changed in lama ... you dont give a release date ... you wait until no more changes are needed ... you tell people when changes are no longer possible (this allows people to understand that lama = live from here on out) then give a release date...

I dont work as a programmer either ... and i dont work in a hospital ... but i have worked in customer service and sales all my life ... and i can tell you ... if you want to keep a customer happy ... you make him/her feel like they are right ...

if you have to give a date ... to save face .... you give a late date that way they are happy when it comes early ... you work out all bugs and issues way before the deadline and you always look good when your early ... even if the job deadline was stupidly longer then needed.

it reminds me of a STNG eppisode when data and laforge are in engineering and jean luke asks laforge how long it will take and he says three hours and after ending his conversation with jean data tells him it should only take about 1 hour and asks why he said three ... and laforge said something along the lines of "he will be happier when i tell him its done in one hour if he thinks it will take 3 hours ..." (not word for word)