Dps Monk?

[kittysnap]

I was wondering if an STR based monk could have 15 dex just for the TWF, Though he'll be always using strom stance for strong hits cause of the str and fast cause of the strom stance?


thanks.

[Cetus]

You need an 18 base dex for wind IV

[kittysnap]

You need an 18 base dex for wind IV

getting dex up by three points wouldnt be that hard, or you mean that i have to start with 18 dex or have like permanet bonuses to dex?

[Arkat]

Permanent Dex points (from starting stats, Tomes, and Level ups)

[kittysnap]

wind IV is at what lvl?

[Mobeius]

IRCC all level 4 stances require

*Level 18

*Cost 4 AP's

*64 AP's spent

*Natural (tomes included) 18 Stat for the appropiate stance.

[kittysnap]

IRCC all level 4 stances require

*Level 18

*Cost 4 AP's

*64 AP's spent

*Natural (tomes included) 18 Stat for the appropiate stance.

thanks :)

[gott_ist_tot]

getting dex up by three points wouldnt be that hard, or you mean that i have to start with 18 dex or have like permanet bonuses to dex?

Base is what you give to it at creation + tome + level up points. So 16dex minimum if you plan to do it cheap (just a +2 tome). Or 15 for 1 lvl up point & tome.

If you decide to put 1 level up into dex:
You either need to go for both litany and +3 exceptional starting with even str, or drop litany and you can start with odd str score. If you somehow don't plan on either, start with even strength. (all this because by giving 1 lvl up pt. on dex you're left with an even pool of 4 lvl ups for str).

P.S. And yea, str based windstance monks are not unusual. Consider update 5 changes before going this way though.

[kittysnap]

Base is what you give to it at creation + tome + level up points. So 16dex minimum if you plan to do it cheap (just a +2 tome). Or 15 for 1 lvl up point & tome.

If you decide to put 1 level up into dex:
You either need to go for both litany and +3 exceptional starting with even str, or drop litany and you can start with odd str score. If you somehow don't plan on either, start with even strength. (all this because by giving 1 lvl up pt. on dex you're left with an even pool of 4 lvl ups for str).

P.S. And yea, str based windstance monks are not unusual. Consider update 5 changes before going this way though.

thanks for making it clear :) oh and if its not to of a bother can you link the page of the changes there gonna make for monks? (Although str based windstance monks arent unusual are they good dpsers?)


thanks.

[gott_ist_tot]

thanks for making it clear :) oh and if its not to of a bother can you link the page of the changes there gonna make for monks? (Although str based windstance monks arent unusual are they good dpsers?)
thanks.

I dare say they're (were) the best dpsers of the monk lot. The problem is, in U5 windstance won't make you faster anymore. Wind stance powered speed boost consist of 2 parts one stacks with haste (insight bonus, smaller one), the other, bigger one, doe doesn't. In U5 speed boost is gone replaced by a chance for doublestrike - repeating one o your main hand attacks in sequence. I'm not sure if the non-stacking boost stays, the stacking one is gone for sure.

Right now lot of people are considering fire stance for pure monks.

There are many threads discussing this, google 'site:forums.ddo.com update 5'

Cheers

[kittysnap]

I dare say they're (were) the best dpsers of the monk lot. The problem is, in U5 windstance won't make you faster anymore. Wind stance powered speed boost consist of 2 parts one stacks with haste (insight bonus, smaller one), the other, bigger one, doe doesn't. In U5 speed boost is gone replaced by a chance for doublestrike - repeating one o your main hand attacks in sequence. I'm not sure if the non-stacking boost stays, the stacking one is gone for sure.

Right now lot of people are considering fire stance for pure monks.

There are many threads discussing this, google 'site:forums.ddo.com update 5'

Cheers

Thanks.:D but i just opned my monk planned to be a str based windstance monk with 18 base str and 15 base dex and was planning to get the dex up to 18 with a 2 dex tome and 1 lvl thingy. but since U5 is gonna change that i can always stay with that same build just put all points in str cause 15 dex is always nice right?

[Atoro87]

I'm just about to hit 11 with my STR WF dark path. I min/maxed him like a barb for all intensive purposes, using int wis and cha as dumps and jacking up str dex and con. I think I ate a +1 dex and a +2 con tome around level 7. I can take main tanking if I need to, thanks to Brute Fighting and having comparable HP to most barbs I run with not to mention better DR, or main DPS spaming Strike of the Enduring while still pumping out enough ki to throw touch of death regularly, which ain't to shabby for a lowbie dark path.

The only real downside is that compared to some other monk builds his AC is still a little low, but that being said with a wis and dex item on it's still better than most other TWF.

I honestly doubt I'm taking any of the advanced wind stances though. When you're reliably hasted like everybody else the benefit is neglibable compared to better to-hit (from str bump) and faster ki regen from flame and the extra HP and good DR from earth. Yea by end game if you take the time to grind out your ToD gear ki regen in wind 4 is acceptable, but it'd still be better in flame, which means touch of death way more along with strike of the enduring as much as I can throw it out basically.

The only thing I'm working out now is if I want ninja spy and personally I'm leaning towards nope.

[gott_ist_tot]

Thanks.:D but i just opned my monk planned to be a str based windstance monk with 18 base str and 15 base dex and was planning to get the dex up to 18 with a 2 dex tome and 1 lvl thingy. but since U5 is gonna change that i can always stay with that same build just put all points in str cause 15 dex is always nice right?

Depends. I'd say if you decide to forgo wind stance, drop dex and up wisdom. Since you're a monk you get an AC increase either way and wis enhances your monk strikes and will save as opposed to just reflex save for dex. So I'd keep dex at the very minimum required for any feats you might want to take and ref save to małe evasion worthwile.

What exactly is this bare minimum, maybe some expert would like to elaborate on. Up until now there were not dex/evasion related issues as everyone upped their dex score to qualify for windstance.

P.S. Even if you go dark monk route, wisdom raises your stunning fist DC. Given your high strength you can easily afford stunning blow too. Stunning blow + stunning fist + weighted wraps + U5 mob save reduction = win :)

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=251070

[Atoro87]

Depends. I'd say if you decide to forgo wind stance, drop dex and up wisdom. Since you're a monk you get an AC increase either way and wis enhances your monk strikes and will save as opposed to just reflex save for dex. So I'd keep dex at the very minimum required for any feats you might want to take and ref save to małe evasion worthwile.

What exactly is this bare minimum, maybe some expert would like to elaborate on. Up until now there were not dex/evasion related issues as everyone upped their dex score to qualify for windstance.

P.S. Even if you go dark monk route, wisdom raises your stunning fist DC. Given your high strength you can easily afford stunning blow too. Stunning blow + stunning fist + weighted wraps + U5 mob save reduction = win :)

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=251070

I'm think I personally am foregoing stunning fist/blow on my STR build but this is subject to change. I took dodge as a pre-req for Ninja Spy but I may just re-spec for stunning blow down the line since NS is kinda meh IMO. If you do go this way, which I'm doing on my light monk (stunning fist since he's centered on dex/wis/con), you may want to take crane path since it'll give you extra ki from crits. As a strength spec it shouldn't screw up your fort saves to much and if you go WF you can take the hardiness enhancement to counteract this.

As far as wis vs dex, like I said I dump stated wis and have 18 base dex since I ate a tome. My AC is low for a monk but is still better than the average non-S&B melee. With tome and a +6 item I'd be happy and maybe down the line after his first TR I might re-think dex and wis stats a bit. I will say though that dumping dex doesn' really seem like an option since your dex mod still counts towards your AC, wis mod is just an added benefit from the class.

The real benfit from having some decent wis on an str build, besides the mentioned AC buff is what Gott alluded to, you can offset Stunning Blow and Stunning Fist pretty reliably. I don;t remember whether Quivering Palm works with a wis mod or not, I hardly ever use it myself, but if it does that would be another bonus, a better instakill.

[Quijonsith]

quivering palm indeed uses wisdom, as do the dark monk finisher debuffs (if you choose to use them).

[kittysnap]

Depends. I'd say if you decide to forgo wind stance, drop dex and up wisdom. Since you're a monk you get an AC increase either way and wis enhances your monk strikes and will save as opposed to just reflex save for dex. So I'd keep dex at the very minimum required for any feats you might want to take and ref save to małe evasion worthwile.

What exactly is this bare minimum, maybe some expert would like to elaborate on. Up until now there were not dex/evasion related issues as everyone upped their dex score to qualify for windstance.

P.S. Even if you go dark monk route, wisdom raises your stunning fist DC. Given your high strength you can easily afford stunning blow too. Stunning blow + stunning fist + weighted wraps + U5 mob save reduction = win :)

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=251070

A 15 dex base for TWF.. : O oh and why did the change the windstance attacking speed anyways? whats gonna be the points of it now? just 2 more dex and -2 con?

[Quijonsith]

A 15 dex base for TWF.. : O oh and why did the change the windstance attacking speed anyways? whats gonna be the points of it now? just 2 more dex and -2 con?

Instead of the current 10% insight bonus to attack speed it will have 10% insight bonus to double attack chance in wind 4. Also, both now and after U5 wind 4 will have 15% enhancement bonus to attack speed, the same as haste. So it is still just as useful, but won't be so dramatic compared to the other stances as to make it the end-all be-all only stance to have.

[Jamma]

As others have stated Wind IV is still a worthwhile goal. You'll have 15% haste bonus. While you may be led to believe somebody will keep haste boost on your butt 24/7, the reality for most players is quite different. And the 10% proc-rate for double strike is going to mean your ToD's are going to occassionally hit x2.

[Xeriphim]

I wouldn't completly dump dex to 15 either ... you still need that base 17 dex to qualify for improved two weapon fighting and greater two weapon fighting feats .... If your not going with the two weapon fighting chain then by all means dump dex .

[Quijonsith]

As others have stated Wind IV is still a worthwhile goal. You'll have 15% haste bonus. While you may be led to believe somebody will keep haste boost on your butt 24/7, the reality for most players is quite different. And the 10% proc-rate for double strike is going to mean your ToD's are going to occassionally hit x2.

Actually those rings, our strikes, and even touch of death will have a chance to proc x3 with the main hand procing an offhand hit and a double strike. So far on lammania the double strike can also proc an offhand, so possibility of x4. Don't know if the double strike procing offhand is supposed to work that way or not.

[Hydro]

On live the 18 base dex is required for Wind Stance and 18 Con is required for earth strikes, both of which are required for a "Max DPS" monk.

Next patch it is looking like fire stance will pull ahead but I have been unable to test it since Fire stance is bugged on Lammania. Currently I reccomend starting with a 16 Dex and eating a +2 tome, but next patch you might be able to get away with a 15 dex and a +2 tome.

Also on Lammania in windstance my Max DPS monk destroys my max geared barbarian for damage. I am talking 30% more dps roughly on a fortified target so if things stay the same next patch monks will be top DPS if people build them for max damage.

Max Str, Tier 4 Earth Strikes, Wind 4 or Fire 4 Stance...

Here is my monks MyDDO link:

http://my.ddo.com/character/khyber/metaru/

And here is my soon to be semi retired Barb:

http://my.ddo.com/character/khyber/hydro/

[Quijonsith]

Also on Lammania in windstance my Max DPS monk destroys my max geared barbarian for damage. I am talking 30% more dps roughly on a fortified target so if things stay the same next patch monks will be top DPS if people build them for max damage.


Interesting. Is this because of the doublestrikes with ToD? Does your barb still win out on zero fort enemies or is it really close?

[Hydro]

Interesting. Is this because of the doublestrikes with ToD? Does your barb still win out on zero fort enemies or is it really close?

80% chance of a 1000 point strike is huge and definitly helps allot. Also THF and especially Barbarians got nerfed into the ground on Lammania. No Twitch so thats a bunch of lost attacks, no 10% alacrity from bugged capstone, Epic SoS nerf, and Madstone nerf means THF Barbarians are one of the lower DPS classes next patch. I truly hope Turbine will fix this but currently they have been quiet about the barbarian situation.

Basically my tests were done on how long it took to destroy a training dummy that is on the guild airship, the times were:

Barbarian: 39 seconds
Tempest 18/1/1 "Exploiter" Ranger: 36 Seconds
Monk: 32 Seconds

So yeah going to be a good patch for DPS monks, the funny part is all the 12 base STR monks will still be screaming about low dps lol.

[Sweyn]

Barbarian: 39 seconds
Tempest 18/1/1 "Exploiter" Ranger: 36 Seconds
Monk: 32 Seconds



This is embarrasing... a monk being one of the, if not THE highest dps class???

[Hydro]

This is embarrasing... a monk being one of the, if not THE highest dps class???

Hey your ranger didnt do that bad...

Our barbarians on the other hand lol....

It was about the same speed for Sowans ranger to use his bare fists on the training vs. my Barbarian with an epic SoS twitch attacking the target.

[Xeraphim]

I was wondering if an STR based monk could have 15 dex just for the TWF, Though he'll be always using strom stance for strong hits cause of the str and fast cause of the strom stance?


thanks.

Yes. (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=186754)

[Sweyn]

It was about the same speed for Sowans ranger to use his bare fists on the training vs. my Barbarian with an epic SoS twitch attacking the target.

This is disturbing... a toon with only 1 level of monk (Lowest hit die unarmed fighting) using NO weapons took only ~20 seconds longer than a FULL TWINKED WF barbarian with an epic SoS.... Keep in mind the SoS shines from it's crits, however Hydro was doing i believe 10d6+12 more damage per swing, NOT INCLUDING WF power attack, and the high STR he was at..