Being judged based on kill tally is wrong.

[Jemaniya]

I wish there was not a kill tally (keypad x). Then I would not hear Braggarts about how much better they are. Usually the tank (fighter) or sometimes the monk holds the highest kill ratio. I play support roles. Sometimes I'm typing answers to, "which way do we go?", "what I am I suppose to do?", and "my spot isn't high - where is the box?". I am not going to have the highest kill count if I was jumping in front of the box so the multiclassed rogue could find it. It is what I gave to the team that counted. Or what about the BYOH team where I was the only pally with mod heal wands and guess what, the team didn't bring their own heals. Or today, I got balled out by a zerging monk for a low kill tally when I was playing a ranger because I "sneak to much." Ahh, he left me behind with more than half the dungeon on alert. Yeah, I was in sneak mode.

Doesn't anyone get it, this is about team work???

[Asketes]

yup, i do 98% of the damage and some tempest or monk comes in and snipes the kill.

I don't care really, but those that are all about the kill count are tards

[Chai]

Puggers brag, right up to and until I show them that I can snipe kill count on my arcane archer by getting the last hit alot.

Then the bragging topic shifts to damage dealt.

[ezgoezit]

I do agree with your main point that being judged on kill count (alone) "is wrong", though I'm not sure if I agree with all of your reasoning.

When I play my monk, especially on raids and what little epic I do, I often utilize a "stun and move" strategy. This often sets up others for the kill and leaves my total lower than if I stunned and stayed for the kill.

Ez

[stainer]

I wish there was not a kill tally (keypad x). Then I would not hear Braggarts about how much better they are. Usually the tank (fighter) or sometimes the monk holds the highest kill ratio. I play support roles. Sometimes I'm typing answers to, "which way do we go?", "what I am I suppose to do?", and "my spot isn't high - where is the box?". I am not going to have the highest kill count if I was jumping in front of the box so the multiclassed rogue could find it. It is what I gave to the team that counted. Or what about the BYOH team where I was the only pally with mod heal wands and guess what, the team didn't bring their own heals. Or today, I got balled out by a zerging monk for a low kill tally when I was playing a ranger because I "sneak to much." Ahh, he left me behind with more than half the dungeon on alert. Yeah, I was in sneak mode.

Doesn't anyone get it, this is about team work???

It changes as you level and with the quality of players you group with. Now the only time I care about kill count is when I am playing with my friends and we are talking smack. Even then it doesn't matter. I wouldn't worry about it at all.

[Chai]

I wish there was not a kill tally (keypad x). Then I would not hear Braggarts about how much better they are. Usually the tank (fighter) or sometimes the monk holds the highest kill ratio. I play support roles. Sometimes I'm typing answers to, "which way do we go?", "what I am I suppose to do?", and "my spot isn't high - where is the box?". I am not going to have the highest kill count if I was jumping in front of the box so the multiclassed rogue could find it. It is what I gave to the team that counted. Or what about the BYOH team where I was the only pally with mod heal wands and guess what, the team didn't bring their own heals. Or today, I got balled out by a zerging monk for a low kill tally when I was playing a ranger because I "sneak to much." Ahh, he left me behind with more than half the dungeon on alert. Yeah, I was in sneak mode.

Doesn't anyone get it, this is about team work???

/sarcasm on

Team work cant be measured with vacuum calcs and spreadsheets. Move along.

/sarcasm off

It sounds like you have the right concept, and just need to find some like minded people to play with.

[MalakRevan]

I wish there was not a kill tally (keypad x). Then I would not hear Braggarts about how much better they are. Usually the tank (fighter) or sometimes the monk holds the highest kill ratio. I play support roles. Sometimes I'm typing answers to, "which way do we go?", "what I am I suppose to do?", and "my spot isn't high - where is the box?". I am not going to have the highest kill count if I was jumping in front of the box so the multiclassed rogue could find it. It is what I gave to the team that counted. Or what about the BYOH team where I was the only pally with mod heal wands and guess what, the team didn't bring their own heals. Or today, I got balled out by a zerging monk for a low kill tally when I was playing a ranger because I "sneak to much." Ahh, he left me behind with more than half the dungeon on alert. Yeah, I was in sneak mode.

Doesn't anyone get it, this is about team work???

Kill count is worthless. Like has been said in other posts most don't really care about it, I only care about it when I am running with my guild and I try to out do another DPSer in the party. It becomes a contest for us, especially in higher level quests like Sins, Genesis Point, and other Amrath quests.

As far as I am concerned the only thing that should really count for anything is deaths......but if everyone is working together like they should be to finish the quest, you shouldn't have any deaths or at least very many (unlike this one squishy Wizard I know.....my caster Senor).

[Severak]

It sounds like you have the right concept, and just need to find some like minded people to play with.

Agreed. Finding people you like to play with constantly and then do so reduces stress levels and frustration. Not to mention you learn more than in a PUG where you know no one.

[dsebutchr]

I wish there was not a kill tally (keypad x). Then I would not hear Braggarts about how much better they are. Usually the tank (fighter) or sometimes the monk holds the highest kill ratio. I play support roles. Sometimes I'm typing answers to, "which way do we go?", "what I am I suppose to do?", and "my spot isn't high - where is the box?". I am not going to have the highest kill count if I was jumping in front of the box so the multiclassed rogue could find it. It is what I gave to the team that counted. Or what about the BYOH team where I was the only pally with mod heal wands and guess what, the team didn't bring their own heals. Or today, I got balled out by a zerging monk for a low kill tally when I was playing a ranger because I "sneak to much." Ahh, he left me behind with more than half the dungeon on alert. Yeah, I was in sneak mode.

Doesn't anyone get it, this is about team work???



Remember that a little bit later, these same people will be riding in your backpack while you solo the remainder of the quest. Let them brag and whine all they want. That long boring azz ride in a backpack teaches years worth of explanations.

[Monsoon28]

Do people still even bother looking at kill counts for bragging rights? I thought only noobs still did that.

[k1ngp1n]

My kill count is higher than yours.

My kid is an honor student at Kill Count High.

It's not the DPS that matters, it's how you snipe it.

Etc, etc, etc

[Club'in]

Don't get bothered by the occasional braggart. You can also use your friends list and a quick note to keep track of the ******s.

And yes, my tempest ranger and other dual wielders do quite often lead the kill counts. I have no qualms about running up to a monster that you've been beating on for the last 10 seconds and finishing them off. In my mind, they need to die ASAP. I've often played the healer, and that extra second alive might equate to a crit attack on the rogue, or some such. So, fighter or barbarian did 1200 point of damage, but my monk gets the kill. So what? My guildies (mainly my brother and I), also love to chime in with a "kill steal!" in those situations. My rangers, monks and rogues (almost always dual wielding), are moving around in combat a lot, firing off a higher number of strikes, and hitting multiple opponents. This equates to a lot of kills. But I guarantee you my DPS is lower than the THF barbs, fighters, and what nots.

Continue to play your team game. I love playing support characters, and always appreciate what they bring to the table.

[MalakRevan]

Do people still even bother looking at kill counts for bragging rights? I thought only noobs still did that.

It's almost all I hear in Shroud from half the melee's that I end up running it with.

[Eladiun]

It changes as you level and with the quality of players you group with. Now the only time I care about kill count is when I am playing with my friends and we are talking smack. Even then it doesn't matter. I wouldn't worry about it at all.


Yep... my Sorc buddy lays it on when we are flagging guildies in Coal Chamber. A 20 Sorc rack up quite the kill count in there.

[Club'in]

It's almost all I hear in Shroud from half the melee's that I end up running it with.

In the Shroud? Really? Usually the arcane is leading the kill count in there, due to their usual designated job in part 1.

[Kadriel]

Seens to me that the OP is somewhat new from the post, so just to add something...

Kill count as stated above doesn't matter at all. It is just foolish to brag about it. But some hardcore ppl will be really strict about dps. Dps is not the same as kill count. Say a bard with his song, hasting and casting great heroism, will greatly raise the party dps, while he might not get any kill himself. Or even a healer keeping dpsers alive and avoiding them to have to stop hiting to back up and heal, is def contributing to dps.That will please those more hardcore players, and if you are not doing an considerable dps directly or indirectly you might not be well seen by those. Seens to me that that might (or might not) have been the reason that monk would drop someone.
That is not by far the only way to play DDO though. There are roleplayers, people who likes to take it slow and enjoy the quest, who like to use tatics even if it means to take longer to finish a quest. So even you if play a weirdball sub-optimal build you have fun with there is still place for you in DDO, just find the right crowd to walk with, and don't take hard if someone don't like you. Doubt anyone in the whole game can please all kinds of players.

[MalakRevan]

In the Shroud? Really? Usually the arcane is leading the kill count in there, due to their usual designated job in part 1.

The usual comment is that Arcane's don't count because of part 1 lol.

[jwdaniels]

Kill count only matters for one thing - getting enough kills to achieve the conquest bonus. Beyond that, it's meaningless.

The people that care about who killed the most are destined to find themselves spamming general chat over and over with how great they are for killing characters 10 levels lower than they are in PvP.

[Krag]

Kill count is a good indicator when you know what to look for.

[Yajerman01]

Kill count only matters for one thing - getting enough kills to achieve the conquest bonus. Beyond that, it's meaningless.

The people that care about who killed the most are destined to find themselves spamming general chat over and over with how great they are for killing characters 10 levels lower than they are in PvP.


I like to be at or near the top of the kill count simply because thats a reflection that I am making an effort and playing and doing what my class is supposed to do. The only time I actually care is when I am playing around with a buddy and smack talking with one another.

Aside that, I would agree with you in part because some of the biggests pains in pvp are the braggerts killing all the lowbies and are under the assumption that kill counts represents skill. Unfortunately skill is somethign they lack.

[Gkar]

If you are a support and don't lead the kill count, so what?

But if you are melee you should be competitive in the kill count. If everyone is at 60 and you have 10 then you have a problem. If everyone is close, it doesn't matter who has the most.

[Dandonk]

I look at kill count all the time. I love it, it's awesome.

Sadly, this leads to me not noticing the party staying behind while I'm in autorun mode, and so I run off and die a lot. And get yelled at.

But I love looking at my kill count!

Especially if it's higher than my death count, by some miracle.

:)

[Sir_Chonas]

I'm a stun specced monk (28 str 26 wis stunning blow stunning fist 5% weighteds). That means I spam the two over and over setting up kills for the other people in the party.

If I'm in a group with a barbarian and a tempest ranger, I'm stunning, and I have the highest kill count by far then I know something is amiss. If they are keeping up with, or are higher than me then all is right with the world.

The kill count shouldn't be used for bragging, but in straightforward quests like Madstone Crater, Kobold Assault or something it does let you know if you're going to be carrying your party members or if you're the one getting carried.

I'm a support-based monk . . I support the kill count meter.

Side-note if you ever hear me in game talking about how I'm going to beat someone then you can be assured that I'm joking and am on friendly terms with my target. I never say anything about it out loud unless there's a person who should be leading the count, not leading it, talking down to any other player (especially myself).

[Missing_Minds]

love to chime in with a "kill steal!" in those situations.

The wife does that as well... or calls me on such.

As for those that wave kill count.. While they hold that score up so high, I'd wish they'd care about hefting their brain cells that high as well.

[abull74]

HAHAHAHAHA......people that have crappy builds cry about kill counts not meaning anything.

I am sorry for you all that agree with the OP, but when I run a SC(thats Stormcleave for anyone unfamiliar with DDO acronyms) and I have 90-120 kills and the closest one to me has 15 kills, then that absolutely means that My build is superior to the other tanks/DPS in the party.

REROLL!!!

I AM THE FPOON

[clkpacker]

When I'm on my cleric, running with a group that's breezing through the quest with little healing needed from me, I love sniping kills. It's so amusing to have more kills than the DPSers, even if the only thing kill count indicates is that I managed to knock those last 4 pesky hitpoints off a monster.

[Gnorbert]

Leading Kill count in shroud means you're a caster or are getting lucky with vorpals on trash.

[Khurse]

If you are a support and don't lead the kill count, so what?

But if you are melee you should be competitive in the kill count. If everyone is at 60 and you have 10 then you have a problem. If everyone is close, it doesn't matter who has the most.

This

It doesn't matter if you're #1 on the kill count, or if you have a bad night and aren't near the top.
If you are a DPS build though, and are constantly outkilled by others, you may wish to look at your build.

[ellamonster]

Kill count is worthless. Like has been said in other posts most don't really care about it, I only care about it when I am running with my guild and I try to out do another DPSer in the party. It becomes a contest for us, especially in higher level quests like Sins, Genesis Point, and other Amrath quests.

I totally agree with this one! I swear one of my buddies knows when my monk is gonna throw the 500 point hit, and nails the mob with destruction or something! He just likes to hear me go "AWWWW MAN!" hehe

[MrCow]

There is only 1 quests I care about any form of kill count and that is the amount of breakables in Stop Hazadill's Shipment.

I must be the box crushing champion! :p

[Mr_Ed7]

Kill count of course is on barometer to meausre success.

I would like to see a "TOTAL DAMAGE" count.

or a "TOTAL DAMAGE HEALED" count.

I think it is fun to look at the kill count.

Last time someone bragged about there kill count while on my Paladin, I started adding up all the hit-points I healed on said bragger.

[Club'in]

This

It doesn't matter if you're #1 on the kill count, or if you have a bad night and aren't near the top.
If you are a DPS build though, and are constantly outkilled by others, you may wish to look at your build.

If you're a "dps build", then build probably has little to do with it. Gear, and skill (and experience), are gonna trump build every time. If the other DPS'er you're rolling with has a +4 Frost Burst Flaming Burst Great Axe of Maiming, and you're using the best weapon you've found so far (a +4 Shock Great Axe of Pure Good), nothing wrong with your build. Or, your first or second time through Tear (or less than 10, anyway), and the other guy is on his 373rd, he's gonna know where every mob is, beat you to it, and beat it down before you even get there. You're standing there at the top of a fall, waiting for the cleric to catch up, and this other dude has jumped in the water, swam a short bit, and proceeded to kill 10 mobs while you were being courteous. Nothing wrong with your build. Or, though four years of experience, the other guys is better at anticipating mob movement, lag effects, and proper positioning, so is getting off twice as many effective swings as you are. Nothing wrong with your build there...

[DoctorWhofan]

The only person (or people) who judge via the Kill Count is WRONG. It's a tool, nothing more. Everytime People do that in a PuG, I start judging the death count. Noting everyone who died (or not died). ALso, I make a running commentary on how I cannot heal those major kill count complainers or buff them for XYZ reason.

THe more thay brag/complain, the more I become a healbot, and a very incapable one at that. Or I go direct damage and forgo healing and buffing all together (well to the braggarts...great mana save)

[GhoulsTouch]

Puggers brag, right up to and until I show them that I can snipe kill count on my arcane archer by getting the last hit alot.

Then the bragging topic shifts to damage dealt.

^ This is the neverending circle of brag no joke...someone tries to get the spin on it no matter

[Llewndyn]

To the OP:

Next time don't bother helping and just work on killing things, and then when they ask why you didn't help find boxes/ disable traps/ open doors/ pick up that soul stone you threw into the lava pit tell them that **** doesn't count - only the kill total does.

As a pure rogue I almost always (unless in a TERRIBLE party) am near the bottom in the kill column, and for the most part (see proof is in the partykick post) am genuinely loved by the rest of the group for that.

All that being said yeah kill count means almost nothing, especially since if it is a halfway decent group no one kills anything by theirselves anyway.

[Khurse]

If you're a "dps build", then build probably has little to do with it. Gear, and skill (and experience), are gonna trump build every time. If the other DPS'er you're rolling with has a +4 Frost Burst Flaming Burst Great Axe of Maiming, and you're using the best weapon you've found so far (a +4 Shock Great Axe of Pure Good), nothing wrong with your build. Or, your first or second time through Tear (or less than 10, anyway), and the other guy is on his 373rd, he's gonna know where every mob is, beat you to it, and beat it down before you even get there. You're standing there at the top of a fall, waiting for the cleric to catch up, and this other dude has jumped in the water, swam a short bit, and proceeded to kill 10 mobs while you were being courteous. Nothing wrong with your build. Or, though four years of experience, the other guys is better at anticipating mob movement, lag effects, and proper positioning, so is getting off twice as many effective swings as you are. Nothing wrong with your build there...

Yes, but reading the original post I quoted, if every mission you go into with your DPS build the kills (amongst melee) are 60/58/32/10/5
And you always have the 5, chances are it's something that could be (not saying should be) corrected with a different build.

I freely admit, if I'm in or I run a "Bastion Looting Blood till ransacked group" and you ask for a DPS spot, and end up having 3 kills in each of 5 or 6 missions through I might not invite you back. Of course there's far more to it than that, if you get no kills on your DPS and are fun to play with, I will, if you kill everything but are a jerk, probably not.

Again it doesn't matter who has the most kills, but I maintain if you are DPS, and are always at a fraction of the rest of the groups kills, it's probably your build or playstyle that might need improving.

[Club'in]

Again it doesn't matter who has the most kills, but I maintain if you are DPS, and are always at a fraction of the rest of the groups kills, it's probably your build or playstyle that might need improving.

Again, context. It took a couple months for me to get movement down in this game. Unlike most other MMO's, positioning is very important in this game. I play with my brother every Tuesday night (or so). I have 20x's the amount of time invested into this game as he does. I constantly see him overrunning mobs, or swinging at air. That has nothing to do with build. Now, yeah, if you built your barbarian with 8 strength, bad build. But if you are using even moderate common sense, it's tough to make a truly terrible build. I'd say anyone with less than three or four months in the game will be under-performing on the kill count solely because of the gear/skill/experience factors, rather than build.

(I'm mainly trying to let new players know that just because they're being out performed, doesn't necessarily mean reroll)

[Khurse]

(I'm mainly trying to let new players know that just because they're being out performed, doesn't necessarily mean reroll)

+1.
It's what I meant by "improving", but your way sounds nicer.


Put it this way, if you're with a group (on a DPS toon) and are constantly being outkilled,always feel free to ask for advice as to why.
If you're told "well you can use a banisher against these guys, disrupters against these guys, smiters against these guys.." as well as other tips, listen and learn.
If you get a link showing you his +22 weapon of uberness as the only response, ignore him.

If you're a buffer/healer/intimi/ doing something else useful, who cares? If someone gives you grief about your kills, don't play with them.
It's a game, why play with people who aren't fun?

[toughguyjoe]

Kill count of course is on barometer to meausre success.

I would like to see a "TOTAL DAMAGE" count.

or a "TOTAL DAMAGE HEALED" count.

I think it is fun to look at the kill count.

Last time someone bragged about there kill count while on my Paladin, I started adding up all the hit-points I healed on said bragger.

Yeah! Screw melee! Build your Pally to be as cruddy as you want! Its your 15 bucks!

[Gunga]

Yeah! Screw melee! Build your Pally to be as cruddy as you want! Its your 15 bucks!

Rude.

[xAlistairx]

Kill count is only useful in certain situations, and bragging isn't one of them.

On my barbarian I mentioned right before a big fight that I was fatigued and someone chimed in "because he rages for no reason all the time." Now I feel this is a proper time to point out that my kills are literally more than double the closest melee behind me, so it wasn't for no reason.

If someone gives you ****, it can be useful to show them kills and watch them clam up :D

[Xeraphim]

yup, i do 98% of the damage and some tempest or monk comes in and snipes the kill.

I don't care really, but those that are all about the kill count are tards

Yep, that's about how it works.

Those whose only concern is the kill tally really "are 'tards".

[Xeraphim]

Kill count is only useful in certain situations, and bragging isn't one of them.

If someone gives you ****, it can be useful to show them kills and watch them clam up :D

In a Quest, yep... that's about how it works. Situational only, and only with "'tards" in group.

In a Raid. the only important kill count is the Total.

[Creeper]

I have found that the player who kills the most mobs always gets the highest kill count—but I am sure it is only a coincidence that the player who, mathematically, has the most DPS also, somehow, gets the most kills; and in 4+ years I have never noticed anyone "kill stealing"; honest. Isn’t it funny how everyone’s experience is so different?

I have noticed that THFs with SOS and TWFs with dual Khopesh tend to get higher kill counts than THF with Great Clubs and TWFs with dual Daggers. However, I am sure that kill count is not an accurate gauge of DPS vs. the rest of your party. The players who consistently get the most kills don’t do more DPS than you they are just really, really lucky… it's true... those dirty Khopesh-wielding kill stealers!

So, keep on wielding those +1 daggers!!! Kill count is totally useless. Daggers are just as good as Khopesh. Khopeshz are just a holez lot more luckier weapons.

:D

[samthedagger]

Kill count is not a measure by which everyone's characters are measured, but a consistently high kill count is something anyone on the front lines should aspire to unless they are intimitanking (and even then, they ought to be getting a decent kill count or they really aren't helping much).

When I play my assassin I don't brag to clerics and wizards about my kill count, but I will definitely rub it in to a barbarian if I outkill him by a 2 to 1 ratio and he's #2. A little bit of good rubbing is okay. It promotes the grudge factor, which encourages people to build their characters better so that they can best you the next time.

The other day, I was really on my game. I was kill leader in a run of six quests in a row with the same group, even outkilling a TR monk by a wide margin every time. A couple days later I ran with pretty much the same group for about five or six quests and only got the #1 spot one time. But I still had a good kill count each time. So the kill leader is not necessarily the highest DPS. But the fact remains that if you consistently score a high kill count with a melee build, you are doing something right. And there is nothing wrong with that. If you are playing a character who's primary role is healing or something else that doesn't involve being on the front lines and someone brags about their kill count, chances are they are not bragging to you, but to the other people who were on the front lines with them. A little bit of competitive spirit is good for the game as long as people realize kill count in one short quest is not the be-all-end-all.

[JohnWarlock]

The reason why we look at kill counts is to mock the cleric if he managed to kill something and give him grief for going out and killing stuff instead of healing.... even if there wasn't any need for healing :P

But then again we are mean and fun in the guild, if you don't play a cleric.

[Kwyjibo]

Meh, don't sweat it.

Personally I've never cared much about kill count unless I'm bustin the chops of one of my guildies.

[KillEveryone]

I only lead the kill count when my character is gimped. :)

Never believed in the kill count. I only use it to talk smak but I don't believe in it.

I can be helping by hitting things with my paralizer and letting others kill things. I'm just helping the healer save SP then.

[Gkar]

The reason why we look at kill counts is to mock the cleric if he managed to kill something and give him grief for going out and killing stuff instead of healing.... even if there wasn't any need for healing :P

But then again we are mean and fun in the guild, if you don't play a cleric.

Why would you mock a cleric for killing? That's part of their job. Healing? They do that when not killing. Do you mean that you mock them for NOT having a kill count or did you mean you were a crappy guild who doesn't understand this game?

[Frodo_Lives]

Kill counts are pretty inaccurate when trying to determine usefulness/viability of a character or as a measuring stick against others in your party.

If you have 100 kills and the next guy has 80 it's not such a huge margin to worry about, if the next guy has 20 then you have to look a little closer.

Is there other DPS type characters in the party? If yes, are they using DPS weapons or are they using stat damagers, paralyzers, stunners? Things that make the quest easy but do not give them kills.

Over a single quest, or even a night of questing it really doesn't tell you much even if you are leading the kill count consistantly. Sometimes you are questing with a group that is filled with characters that aren't all about kill counts, but about making things easy to kill. Sometimes you get lucky. Sometimes you don't.

As an internal measuring stick over the course of a characters life when you level then it might mean something, but it's only one piece of the puzzle when running a character. After all I'd rather run a character that kills 80 mobs vs. 100 but also needs a fraction of the healing and can take care of themselves.

[Cyr]

Or today, I got balled out by a zerging monk for a low kill tally when I was playing a ranger because I "sneak to much." Ahh, he left me behind with more than half the dungeon on alert. Yeah, I was in sneak mode.


Kill counts are not the end all and be all of a players contribution.

However, I pulled this part out of the OP on purpose. They were right to call you out. Sneaking on your ranger performs very little purpose in ddo. It means you do less dps by a large margin. It's a sign of a new player or a noob when you see someone sneaking around as a standard thing on a toon. Lot's of new players do not understand this as they come from pnp where sneaking is very useful. In DDO it's 100 times more effective to just have your high ac or dps run a step or two ahead of you into a room and for you to follow on your off tanks with sneak attack. On a ranger you should only be sneaking in very rare cases in groups.

[PopeJual]

I like having kill count available as a sanity check. If I'm in a group and I'm one of 4 melee types, I should probably have a kill count that is similar to the other melee types' kill counts. If my kill count is three times the kill count of any of the others, I have to ask why. If my kill count is one third of another character's kill count, I have to ask why again.

It is not a good way of measuring melee effectiveness. Still, a bad measurement is still better than no measurement at all.

[lazyninja81]

As far as I am concerned the only thing that should really count for anything is deaths......

+1 rep!

Couldn't agree more. Death count is much more informative than kill count. Everyone is allowed a misstep here and there (God knows I've wondered aimlessly into a trap or two). But if your death count is 2x-3x more than the rest of the party than maybe you shouldn't be bragging about kill counts.

[Rubiconn]

The only thing I ever use the kill count for is giving my guildies **** when we run together. It means nothing. When I run my cleric / healer I only want one kill per dungeon.

If you are playing a cleric you can let a couple of those puggers die and tell them you had a couple of kills by not healing, that should keep them quiet hehehe.

[Bracosius]

My brother was leveling a barbarian. He was with a pug group in Stormcleave when a fighter would just not shut up about kill count. My brother stated that although the fighter led the kill count his barbarian did 78% of the damage in the quest. The fighter balked and said how would you know that? My brother told him its on the damage report. "Access the damage report by pressing alt+f4 and you will see the barbarian leads in damage dealt".

4 re-connects later, they continued the quest and the fighter did not say another word about the kill count.

[Stormwine]

I pretty much ignore the kill counts being a Healbot with a base strength of 8. And only once did somone say "Pinot you haven't gotten one kill on the count yet you need to contribute more". As I was buffing, healing, getting rid of poisons and yes using a few offensive heals and swinging my mace I decided to contribute less and quit healing that particular person. So I just ignore kill counts completely

[LordPiglet]

yup, i do 98% of the damage and some tempest or monk comes in and snipes the kill.

I don't care really, but those that are all about the kill count are tards

Generally it's I've done 98% of the damage when my buddy uses finger on it.

though I get payback when he's about to finger and I roll the 20 with my Vorpal.


However, the lvl 17 wizard who went through Coal Chamber and ended with a Kill count of 7, you bet your ass he was piking and not "being in a support role".

[Rydin_Dirtay]

Being judged on the kill count is LAME. Period end of sentence. I'd think a lot more of the guy who sacrifices his kill count, just so he can paralyze for everyone else. THAT'S the player I'd want in my party man.

[Creeper]

Does anyone else here find that several of the people arguing that kill count doesn’t mean anything are also mentioning that they, instead, contribute to the group by using paralyzing weapons, funny?

If you don’t see why it is funny, don’t worry, it’s just an inside joke.

[PopeJual]

Does anyone else here find that several of the people arguing that kill count doesn’t mean anything are also mentioning that they, instead, contribute to the group by using paralyzing weapons, funny?

If you don’t see why it is funny, don’t worry, it’s just an inside joke.

I know that I'm ignoring the joke here, but I always figure that people weilding paralyzing weapons (especially paralyzing bows) are not really melee/dps anymore, but are just crowd control casters with really weird looking spells that don't cost spell points. :)

[Rydin_Dirtay]

it’s just an inside joke.

Must be.

[LawstCawz]

Leave the kill count. Add more stats so people can stop complaining that kill count doesn't matter and get hard numbers on the correlation. This would truly shut up the naysayers.

Harsh bragging is the sign of a tool. They don't need a kill count to egg them on. They'd hurt your feelings regardless, you delicate flower.

[Ollathir]

In a perfect setting 'ctrl x' would actually be worth something. Possibly show a value for damage output. Cause when you get a barb goin after a trog when theres an orthon or devil around, sad as it may be, you know its for kill count.

Offtrack a bit but maybe even heal output or a bonus for bringing a character from near death back to health again. Give a healer something to gauge other than death count.

Of course in both situations the calculations would be limited to its effect. You cant do damage to a mob thats dead, nor heal someone above their max HP.

Currently 'ctrl x' isnt worth much other than a gauge for did you get max XP when leveling.

[wax_on_wax_off]

I think the only time I can remember someone mentioning the kill count in a pug that ive been in has been me. I'll take the time to notice any accomplishments that players make and compliment them on good spellcasting/healing/killing and kill count is an indicator about what a player is doing.

The kill count is valuable for a person who is supposed to be killing lots to give themselves an idea of how they are getting along as it can possibly highlight problems or strengths if they look at the kill count over a period of quests. What I'd really like to see is some stats on my characters over their careers, that would be fun :)

Mind you, id love to see some sort of tally on "Hit points healed: #" and "Seconds enemies immobilised: #" i think that would be valuable too.

[Stormwine]

Since I am somewhat new I do have a question about this thing. Ok was this thing part of the game from launch? If not what was the motivation behind it.

I know thats two questions.