Update 5 KILLING the builds I like playing (I need help)

[Airzlyn]

So from what I've heard and read about update 5 they are basically killing the TWF builds unless you go 18 ranger to get (tempest 3) I liked playing an assassin build consisting of 13 rogue, 6 ranger, 1 fighter... so I was thinking of what build I would enjoy playing as much as I liked the assassin build and I came up with a THF spell using build of sorts probably a mix of either (Bard, Fighter) or (Bard, Barbarian) or even (Bard, Barbarian, Fighter) I figure bard because they can use armor and still cast spells


P.S. if anyone actually plays classic pen and paper D&D 3.5 I am kinda going for a similar to the (Dusk Blade class)

[7-day_Trial_Monkey]

I wouldn't worry so much about the doomsayers. Actually play your twf after the update then decide.

To think twf builds will be killed by the update is just completely absurd.

[xanvar]

History does repeat itself. There was a time when you could use evasion in medium armor, which helped to make the batman build such a powerful and popular build. Turbine made a change and poof no more batman builds. Sure the change was really more of a fix, but the bug had been very well known and in the game for a long time before the devs fixed it. At one time you could spin in circles while shrining....that was changed thus making my shrine time boring and really annoying me. Now they change attack speeds and we will just have to see how the player base adapts to this. Not the end of the world or doom, but you will likely see some new builds that take advantage of the change. Any way you look at it, play the characters you like and have fun. As long as you can do that then it is good.

[MrWizard]

So from what I've heard and read about update 5 they are basically killing the TWF builds unless you go 18 ranger to get (tempest 3) I liked playing an assassin build consisting of 13 rogue, 6 ranger, 1 fighter... so I was thinking of what build I would enjoy playing as much as I liked the assassin build and I came up with a THF spell using build of sorts probably a mix of either (Bard, Fighter) or (Bard, Barbarian) or even (Bard, Barbarian, Fighter) I figure bard because they can use armor and still cast spells


P.S. if anyone actually plays classic pen and paper D&D 3.5 I am kinda going for a similar to the (Dusk Blade class)

you'll be fine. it is not that bad. Wait and test it out before the 'sky is falling' people freak you out.

[Chai]

My rogue on lammania was still killing it for DPS.

This kind of gloom and doom knee jerk reaction happens right before each and every major proposed change. Dont be fooled, your favorite concept builds will still work after the update.

[kingfisher]

they are not really killing any particular build, but all of them, the combat speed, and the game itself.

[DarkAlchemist]

they are not really killing any particular build, but all of them, the combat speed, and the game itself.
Agree, but I must say the game will continue and the players will adapt as it has always been. The thing is you will either reroll or lay out the 12-15 dollars (or equiv in VIP points) to make your character playable again (stat redistribution). No, the char will never be what they once were pre "adjustment" *cough*nerf*cough* and many will start another char type while some will leave the game to never come back.

It is the life cycle of these types of games.

Do I personally like what Turbine is doing? No, because it effects every single char I play so I have my 3 choices on which path I take unless, magically, Turbine gets off of their butts and listen to us but, of course, if the past is indicative of what they will do then they will not.

I personally think this is a money grabbing scheme from them that we will continue to see for the rest of this game's life.

[Stuttrboy]

Most people I've spoken with who've actually tested out the nerf says it isn't that bad. Doomsayers are throwing out numbers they have no idea about and don't bother seeing what the actual changes will be like before foreseeing death doom.

[FarOutFish]

Virtually all my characters are TWF. :eek:There is no reason to worry until the upgrade comes out. We won't know until then. I'd suggest doing an Alfred E. Newman, "What me worry":confused:

[Yagi]

I just hope the changes come about soon, I almost have everything I need for a few t3 gs weapons for my twf and I'd like to see how the cards fall so I can decide on an optimal weapon set. (not seeking advice on this, no offense to anyone)

In a perfect world I'd prefer they just fix code and upgrade hardware but thats probably alot harder to do then to say. I'm more curious about the changes then worrried. I'm sure I've rolled with far worse punches in my mmo career (in fact I know I have, for I am a former SOE customer)

[manfredshw]

Its better to experience yourself, not only based on what you heard.

As a lama tester myself, I think update5 is not that bad.
But combat system change haven't do much about the dps lag.
This is the only one thing that I can't stand for.

Nerfed too much, but gain less. It isn't a sound deal to me.

Dev really should leave the combat system alone, and work harder on the other sides of the game.
This game is not all about lag.
And for most of us, dps lag is able to control, and to stand.

But make us feel less fun when combat is sick.

[kingfisher]

Nerfed too much, but gain less. It isn't a sound deal to me.

Dev really should leave the combat system alone, and work harder on the other sides of the game.
This game is not all about lag.
And for most of us, dps lag is able to control, and to stand.

But make us feel less fun when combat is sick.

perfect

[Airzlyn]

I have never even heard of DPS lag until they mentioned it on update 5 I've even talked to my friends and they didn't know about it either so I think its just an excuse for rangers being amazing with TWF

[Yagi]

I have never even heard of DPS lag until they mentioned it on update 5 I've even talked to my friends and they didn't know about it either so I think its just an excuse for rangers being amazing with TWF

oh its real imo, I have an absolute beast of a machine that is well configured and maintained, a great connection with a solid route and I still feel it in a good run with well-geared people...as far as I can tell it actually lags the instance.

[ddoer]

So from what I've heard and read about update 5 they are basically killing the TWF builds unless you go 18 ranger to get (tempest 3) I liked playing an assassin build consisting of 13 rogue, 6 ranger, 1 fighter...

i think it won't kill your build, just make it sub-optimal. it's just a game and you could have fun without running a maxer build. Just LR or TR it if you want it to be better. You could grind for turbine points if you don't want to spend real money in DDO store.

[tihocan]

Well, it's true the Tempest I splash is pointless now.

[grodon9999]

Most people I've spoken with who've actually tested out the nerf says it isn't that bad. Doomsayers are throwing out numbers they have no idea about and don't bother seeing what the actual changes will be like before foreseeing death doom.

It's not game-breaking on Lamaland where the mobs have reduced HP, we'll see what happens when they actually release it.

Combat's just a little more dull, I'm going to chill in lower-level content where it doesn't matter for a few months until Turbine realizes this is a mistake and changes it back..

[grodon9999]

I have never even heard of DPS lag until they mentioned it on update 5 I've even talked to my friends and they didn't know about it either so I think its just an excuse for rangers being amazing with TWF

it's real in 2-3 raids, that's about it.

[sacredtheory]

it's real in 2-3 raids, that's about it.

One of them being one of the most popular and most-run raids in the game

[JPDefault]

It may take one or two more seconds to kill stuff with two weapons. If that "KILLS your build", something's wrong... :D

[jkm]

So from what I've heard and read about update 5 they are basically killing the TWF builds unless you go 18 ranger to get (tempest 3) I liked playing an assassin build consisting of 13 rogue, 6 ranger, 1 fighter... so I was thinking of what build I would enjoy playing as much as I liked the assassin build and I came up with a THF spell using build of sorts probably a mix of either (Bard, Fighter) or (Bard, Barbarian) or even (Bard, Barbarian, Fighter) I figure bard because they can use armor and still cast spells


P.S. if anyone actually plays classic pen and paper D&D 3.5 I am kinda going for a similar to the (Dusk Blade class)

i think you are overreacting. you are losing 10% off hand attacks (so instead of 8 attacks you are going to get 7.6) and GAINING 2d6 of sneak attack damage.

so previously you were 7d6+20 (44.5) (356 per chain) now you are 9d6+20 (51.5) (391.4 per chain)

[kingfisher]

Well, it's true the Tempest I splash is pointless now.

maybe it wont be as optimal as it was, but i dont think it will be pointless. still has all the same other benefits its had before. loses some speed and that will hurt for sure, and not really offset by the 10% meh they tried to offset it with, but in some builds it will still fit well imo. some might be better with 6 fighter now, but some wont.

on the other hand 12 ranger is nice again, and can provide a nice twf base from which you could go tank, dps, aa (elf), trapmonkey, etc depending on what you do with the other 8 levels.

like i said earlier, no class is really getting a supernerf, more the game itself. which is superdumb.

[Asketes]

The thing is, remember mod 8?

When the ranger or rangermonk splash was all that and EVERYONE and their mom played a sweet str build ranger?

they want it back. haha


THF lost more than twf :p

[Deathseeker]

So from what I've heard and read about update 5 they are basically killing the TWF builds unless you go 18 ranger to get (tempest 3) I liked playing an assassin build consisting of 13 rogue, 6 ranger, 1 fighter... so I was thinking of what build I would enjoy playing as much as I liked the assassin build and I came up with a THF spell using build of sorts probably a mix of either (Bard, Fighter) or (Bard, Barbarian) or even (Bard, Barbarian, Fighter) I figure bard because they can use armor and still cast spells


P.S. if anyone actually plays classic pen and paper D&D 3.5 I am kinda going for a similar to the (Dusk Blade class)

Seriously, don't rely on the pre-update forum chatter for build advice right now. Let it settle out a bit before making any big decisions. And really, unless you are in the top 1% of players that truly have max dps due to equipment/build/twitch skill/etc, the nerfs are across the board and won't effect you in particular enough to matter which build you go with.

The fact that the forums can't even agree on which builds are being hurt more/less is evidence that it's somewhat spread fairly evenly (ie Im of the opinion the build you quoted as being the best, a TWF rgr 18, is actually getting hammered more than just about any other build by this nerf. Even if that's so, it will still be very playable).

Play the build that sounds fun. If the build wasnt broken before U5, it's not going to be unplayable after. It may rank one or two spots higher or lower on the dps "uberness" scale, but in reality very few players have the knowledge, gear, time and understanding to even have those differences matter in-game. For those that do, yeah, it can be a big deal.

And max single target dps is still very likely on a TWF. I wouldn't go switching to THF because of hysteria you are reading. In fact, you'll see much hysteria saying THF got hammered worse. It's all in perspective.

[Deathseeker]

Well, it's true the Tempest I splash is pointless now.

An overstatement I think...it defnitely got hurt by moving some of it's benefit from Tempest 1 to Tempest 2, but it was so far out in front of the other Tier 1 PrE's it just brought it more in line.

Ranger 6 still gets a lot of perks and has free feats that offset some of the cost of Tempest I. For example, Kensai I used to be inferior, now I think it's a reasonable alternative.

I'd say it went from being an obvious choice to a real debate as to which to choose...

[ArichValtrahn]

History does repeat itself. There was a time when you could use evasion in medium armor, which helped to make the batman build such a powerful and popular build. Turbine made a change and poof no more batman builds. Sure the change was really more of a fix, but the bug had been very well known and in the game for a long time before the devs fixed it.

If builds were easier to respec I dont think this would be such a big issue. IMO of course.

[DarkAlchemist]

If builds were easier to respec I dont think this would be such a big issue. IMO of course.
Hit the nail on the head.

[Cyr]

Kill no. Make sub-optimal yes for sure. Tempest 1 is taking a punch to the gut with this update.

It's alot harder to justify the six ranger splash with the nerfed version of tempest and twf overall is getting hit with a nerf so that hardly helps either.