Skills Craziness

[Smelt92]

OK I have two class skills that bug me in DDO, they really need to be swapped around.

Paladin: class skill Diplomacy, not intimidate!
Rogue: Class skill intimidate!

Ok I realise that these are probably taken directly from the 3.5 rule set, and they make sense in the PnP game. A paladin with high diplomacy talking people out of attacking is a right and proper thing for a paladin to do, whereas a paladin calling someones mum a slapper and saying he's gonna do unspeakable things to your corpse not so much.

And a rogue threatening to "send da boys rawnd if you don't cough up da protection money" is fair enough.

But in DDO I can only think of two places that intimidate can be used in that manner and one for diplomacy. Intimidate can be used on the king in relic and one of the guards in crucible and diplomacy on another guard in crucible. The main use for diplomacy is to talk monsters into attacking other people in your group! Very paladin like i must say! Whereas intimidate gets em to attack you, surely a more Paladin like thing, and since when has a rogue wanted the aggro....I thought that was the last thing they wanted as it prevents their biggest hope in melee...sneak attack damage.

Ok rogues having intimidate as a class skill isn't a particular problem, as they have everything they need anyway....but come on...isn't it time paladins got intimidate instead of diplomacy!?!?!?!!

Please feel free to add any other class skill anomilies you know of!

[Mister_Peace]

/signed

[Bladecutter563]

Paladins have a very intimidating air about them. I sure wouldn't like to be around one. He'd be telling me about all of my sins in minute detail and how I must repent or he'll smack me with his weapon.

I can't really see one being diplomatic with evil outsiders, either.

[Rusty_Can]

Ok rogues having intimidate as a class skill isn't a particular problem, as they have everything they need anyway....but come on...isn't it time paladins got intimidate instead of diplomacy!?!?!?!!


No.

- Flavor-wise: Paladins don't threaten people, Barbarians, Rogues and Fighters do.
- Game mechanics-wise: Intimidate as class skill for paladins would be bad for game balance; lvl 20 pure paladin with capstone and full ranks in Intimidate skill?

Imo, it's fine as it is.

[Valindria]

It bothers me more that Tumble is not a class skill for Rangers.

[Slink]

Where is King of Cheese at?

Everyone knows listen is the one skill that needs to be nerfed.
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=202290&highlight=nerf+listen

[LordDamax]

Read OP wrong, replied wrong, cant delete it.

[SaneDitto]

I've complained that Intimidate should also operate off of Strength (or the higher value between STR and CHA). I don't know about you, but a horde of raging goblinoids would find a sweaty, ripped veteran warrior smugly flexing his muscles quite intimidating. :P

[ReaperAlexEU]

rusty does raise a good point, the raw numbers pally's would hit if it was a class skill combined with their cha would be a little unbalancing.

having said that the PnP player inside still thinks the paladin has his skills backwards. paladins are never supposed to attack from behind, diplo makes that happen. paladins are supposed to look out for their fellow party members, diplo directly puts fellows in harms way. any DM worth his salt would instantly declare a paladin as fallen if he used DDO's mechanic for diplo in battle.

mind you, if a fighter or barb did invest heavily in char just for intimidate they could get more than a paly with full ranks. palys get an enhancement bonus to charisma worth a few points of intimi, however barbs and fighters get intimi bonuses from direct enhancements, worth more to intimi than the cha bonus.

so i say go for the swap!

also intimi doesnt just have to be about whats going to happen to various mums, a paly would be looking to put the fear of their god up the monsters instead of insulting their parents.

[IronClan]

/Signed Intim makes sense on a Pali, he doesn't have to be verbally insulting... He's a Palidin his "righteousness" is intimidating to "heretics" or "infidels".

[GhoulsTouch]

Or intimidating you so you wont tell your mom about him laying his hands on you

[cpito]

It bothers me more that Tumble is not a class skill for Rangers.

this

[techknowannie]

I've complained that Intimidate should also operate off of Strength (or the higher value between STR and CHA). I don't know about you, but a horde of raging goblinoids would find a sweaty, ripped veteran warrior smugly flexing his muscles quite intimidating. :P

at the very least they would be grossed out :D

[Brennie]

"Repent heathen, the time of judgement is upon you, and my sword shall be its executioner!"

"Foul demon, your time of malevolence is over! Back to the pit with you!"

"Face me with honor, if you have any! Our steel shall decide who is most righteous!"

"If you want to fight someone, fight me! By the oaths of my calling, i shall not let you hurt my friends. *I* am you opponent now! Have at thee!"

"Yo' momma is so blasphemous...!"


Paladins are *constantly* saying stuff like this! Their job description is to strike the fear of righteousness into the hearts of ne'er-do-wells. And basically be pompous arrogant self-righteous jerks who rough up baddies.

Being intimidating doesn't have to involve insults and taunts, but can simply be the typical self-righteous proclomation of divine justice that is the paladin staple. Think about it... a sneaky little halfliing skukling through the shadows, an elf with a staff wearing a dress, a hippie with a bow standing back in the doorway, a guy with a club whos busy putting bandaids on peoples scrapes, and a shining, fullplate wearing, righteously indignatious, sword weilding guy who is proclaiming divine wrath on you and your cohorts burst into your hideout... which one do YOU find most imtimidating >_<?

tl:dr version: Paladins have no sensible RP reason *not* to have intimidate. And who cares if paladin intimidate gets "too high" (by a couple of points... without intimidate enhancements)? Enemies will be drawn to attack the paladin. Not really gamebreaking :P

[abrownbear9108]

Being intimidating doesn't have to involve insults and taunts, but can simply be the typical self-righteous proclomation of divine justice that is the paladin staple. Think about it... a sneaky little halfliing skukling through the shadows, an elf with a staff wearing a dress, a hippie with a bow standing back in the doorway, a guy with a club whos busy putting bandaids on peoples scrapes, and a shining, fullplate wearing, righteously indignatious, sword weilding guy who is proclaiming divine wrath on you and your cohorts burst into your hideout... which one do YOU find most imtimidating >_<?


personally i'd go for the hippie.......it the most likely to be a pacifist and therefore least likely to attackthe others who get in the way of my great cleaves can all be smitten by the paladins i have behind me :p

[ExarKun77]

To the OP:
My paladin felt it was his duty to max diplomacy, but he forgives himself to use it in combat to send a creature on someone else ;)