Warforged AC/Intimtank Vs. others

[fervidsea]

Just wanted to know, can a WF Pure lvl 20 Fighter match AC/Intimtank against other races.

Im sure I already know the answer, based purely on the fact that I cant find any recent, up to date, WF AC/intim builds. But is that also because of the negative healer WF get?

[Trillea]

Just wanted to know, can a WF Pure lvl 20 Fighter match AC/Intimtank against other races.

Im sure I already know the answer, based purely on the fact that I cant find any recent, up to date, WF AC/intim builds. But is that also because of the negative healer WF get?

Most Intimitank builds are human for a few reasons:

1st, they are the only race that can get the house D dragonmark that gives the bonus to intim

2nd, they can get Human Versatility skill boost for up to a +5 intim for the harder-to-get guys.

3rd, humans not only do not have the healing penalty, but get a line that enhances their healing

4th, humans get an extra general feat that can be spent on skill focus:intimidate

5th, humans can reach tier 3 of racial toughness, only ones better here are dwarf and warforged.

6th, humans get no CHA penalty which hurts intim builds.

7th, humans get extra skill points per level so they can spend them on intim.

That's all I can think of, but isn't that enough? ;)

[fervidsea]

Ummm yep, I would say that would do it.

I was just really interested in making a pure WF melee, tank type build, that is truly viable in end game raids and epics...

[xanvar]

The question is: How high do you need your intimidate skill to be? It is pretty obvious that human will be able to get a higher intimidate skill than a warforged but is it really necessary?

Second question: Does warforged dr make up for the healing difference between human and warfoged?

[Jendrak]

Most Intimitank builds are human for a few reasons:

1st, they are the only race that can get the house D dragonmark that gives the bonus to intim
2nd, they can get Human Versatility skill boost for up to a +5 intim for the harder-to-get guys.

3rd, humans not only do not have the healing penalty, but get a line that enhances their healing

4th, humans get an extra general feat that can be spent on skill focus:intimidate

5th, humans can reach tier 3 of racial toughness, only ones better here are dwarf and warforged.

6th, humans get no CHA penalty which hurts intim builds.

7th, humans get extra skill points per level so they can spend them on intim.

That's all I can think of, but isn't that enough? ;)

Honestly, your info is only about 1/2 true. While I do agree on some points (in red above) the reast of them aren't as impressive as you make it sound. All it takes is a little (very little) planning and a WF will have the same. My barb was retro-fitted to do intim duty and was able to pull a 56 at lvl18 and preformed perfectly with a 6 base cha and a 8 int and not all the gear most intims run.

As for the extar feat....you on a ftr how many more freaking feats do you need:D

[Jendrak]

The question is: How high do you need your intimidate skill to be? It is pretty obvious that human will be able to get a higher intimidate skill than a warforged but is it really necessary?

Second question: Does warforged dr make up for the healing difference between human and warfoged? No. However, if you work at negating the penatly to healing then yes it helps alot.

answers in red

[Trillea]

The question is: How high do you need your intimidate skill to be? It is pretty obvious that human will be able to get a higher intimidate skill than a warforged but is it really necessary?

Second question: Does warforged dr make up for the healing difference between human and warfoged?

Even a maxed-out human intimitank cannot hold endgame raid bosses like Horoth on elite is my understanding, so as it is right now the higher the better. As for WF DR, on norm yes and maybe hard, but elite probably not. Raid bosses hit slow(er) and hard, DR is more for getting hit many times for less damage. If you want to focus on trash mobs intimitanking then yes, WF is GREAT. Especially if you get the Docent of Defiance. But for holding attention of elite raid bosses, I would say human all the way.

Edit: Dang good questions however.

[Trillea]

Honestly, your info is only about 1/2 true. While I do agree on some points (in red above) the reast of them aren't as impressive as you make it sound. All it takes is a little (very little) planning and a WF will have the same. My barb was retro-fitted to do intim duty and was able to pull a 56 at lvl18 and preformed perfectly with a 6 base cha and a 8 int and not all the gear most intims run.

As for the extar feat....you on a ftr how many more freaking feats do you need:D

While I see where you are coming from, I'll have to disagree. Taken individually, each one of my points may seem like a little thing, but I believe (and I may be wrong) that the whole is more than the sum of its parts, when you are trying to talk about intimming on hard and/or elite.

[vyvy3369]

Even a maxed-out human intimitank cannot hold endgame raid bosses like Horoth on elite is my understanding, so as it is right now the higher the better. As for WF DR, on norm yes and maybe hard, but elite probably not. Raid bosses hit slow(er) and hard, DR is more for getting hit many times for less damage. If you want to focus on trash mobs intimitanking then yes, WF is GREAT. Especially if you get the Docent of Defiance. But for holding attention of elite raid bosses, I would say human all the way.

Edit: Dang good questions however.
Anything in this game that can be intimidated, can be intimidated on a 1 by a non-Human with enough work.

[Jendrak]

While I see where you are coming from, I'll have to disagree. Taken individually, each one of my points may seem like a little thing, but I believe (and I may be wrong) that the whole is more than the sum of its parts, when you are trying to talk about intimming on hard and/or elite.

Well and if the question had been what can get the higher skill then yes I would agree. However, after a certain point the "extra" intim is just useless because it falls in that no-mans-land of either too much or not enough. My point isn't that WF are better, just that with a little work they are just as good.

[Trillea]

Anything in this game that can be intimidated, can be intimidated on a 1 by a non-Human with enough work.

What is the intim DC for Horoth Elite? I thought that it was so high that even a human couldn't hit it without TRing for the extra intim.

[Jendrak]

What is the intim DC for Horoth Elite? I thought that it was so high that even a human couldn't hit it without TRing for the extra intim.

I think his point was that there is no "Master Race" when it comes to intim. It's all about the build.




I may be wrong though.

[Trillea]

I think his point was that there is no "Master Race" when it comes to intim. It's all about the build.




I may be wrong though.

I realize that's what he was saying, and he's correct, if WF can hit an intim high enough to intim Horoth on elite on a 1. Otherwise the higher the better, and there's no such thing as "extra" intim.

Edit: My previous question was indeed that: a question. I was not being sarcastic. I would like to know if a WF intim can guarantee Horoth elite without TRing.

[vyvy3369]

I realize that's what he was saying, and he's correct, if WF can hit an intim high enough to intim Horoth on elite on a 1. Otherwise the higher the better, and there's no such thing as "extra" intim.

Edit: My previous question was indeed that: a question. I was not being sarcastic. I would like to know if a WF intim can guarantee Horoth elite without TRing.
I forget what elite Horoth DC is, but it's low compared to the high benchmarks you should be aiming for - from what I recall, it was somewhere in the low 70s. I was able to do it on my 6 base cha Dwarf before TRing when ToD first came out. The highest meaningful DC I'm aware of is Hound Elite @ DC81, which I can get on a TRd Dwarf with some buffs. The other common target is DC80 for Epic DQ (edit: which I'll actually be able to hit with limited buffs as soon as I get a +4 cha tome - for now I use +1 alchemical skill pots unless there's both a bard & monk willing to throw the fire skill buff all the time. Admittedly it's easier to hit on a Human, but for the small number of fights where it's actually useful, I don't mind using a few alchemical pots on occasion).

[tkneip1874]

i apologize that i dont know how to link another post and am not going to learn tonight but there is a post named big rock candy or something like that that has a intimi wf build. go check that out

[fervidsea]

i apologize that i dont know how to link another post and am not going to learn tonight but there is a post named big rock candy or something like that that has a intimi wf build. go check that out

Thanks, I have looked over Big Rock, and although it seems it holds everything needed, can it be accomplished staying pure? Why the rogue lvls, just for UMD, evasion?

For the above posts, so, with grinding, sweat and tears the Intim can get high, but will it be high enough?

Also, what about the AC portion, I see Big rock uses Mithral body and later also mentions Mithral Fluidity for the dex bonus? Is there a better break down? What about adamantine body?

I'm working on the build currently, and have played a few fighters, human, to around lvl 10, and not that they are bad, just looking at doing a WF instead.

Mentioning the healing difference, I don't know the numbers but I do know humans can get a substantial boost, how far behind would the WF be. Properly geared, I'm assuming they can get back to normal if not above correct?

Sorry for the rash of, maybe stupid, questions. I have only played healers so far to cap and TR and frankly I want to get into the fray, but understand that there are a lot of factors into making a solid raid/epic tank, and I just want them all ironed out.

Thanks again.

[Quikster]

There is nothing in this game currently that a wfd couldnt intimidate as well as a human. A human can get higher ultimately, but its not necessary. Elite hound is currently the highest dc of the raids that matter.

As far as ac, you should be able to get a meaningful ac going sd, but last I heard some of the dex bonuses werent applying to wf'd the same as they are to fp. That may cost you a few points. You should still be able to get enough ac to matter however.