DDO third most played MMO of January 2010? [Archive] - Dungeons & Dragons Online Forums

Dylos_Moon

05-14-2010, 02:53 PM

Still #70 according to xfire (however xfire tracks all games not just mmos)
http://www.xfire.com/games/ddo/Dungeons_Dragons_Online_Eberron_Unlimited/

EDIT:
For mmos only, ddo is at #19 on xfire, behind World of Warcraft, Aion, Guild Wars, Silkroad Online, Eve Online, Runes of Magic, Age of Conan: Hyborian Adventures, The Lord of the Rings Online, Cabal Online: The Revolution of Action, Battle of the Immortals, MapleStory, Metin 2, Atlantica Online, Allods Online, Perfect World, AirRivals, Mabinogi, and Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning. Keep in mind however xfire tracks hours spent in game, not total players.

Symar-FangofLloth

05-14-2010, 02:53 PM

Well, if 10% is third, and 30% are in warcraft... that leaves like 50% left. If there were only 6 other MMOs evenly split, that's still less than 10% each.

But anyway; yeah, there's dozens of MMOs out there. Most of them are grind-fest asian cash-shop games with one race and three classes or thereabouts.

AZgreentea

05-14-2010, 02:54 PM

Not too shabby. I would expect DDO to continue to rise as the subscription method becomes less popular. It would take an epic blunder or a very long time for WoW to fall out of the #1 spot, but still. As the old Snapple commercial put it:

Threedom is Freedom!

KKDragonLord

05-14-2010, 02:57 PM

Ethias

05-14-2010, 02:57 PM

I'd trust the NPD group survey more than I would Xfire... but both are useful statistics for sure, and #70 on any game played is still pretty decent.

I think that we will continue to see DDO's market share grow, especially if update 5 starts getting pushed around with any serious marketing attention soon. It sounds like it'll have a ton in it, and newer players like myself aren't yet bitter by having had to effectively wait years for some of the content in it.

DDO is also one of the few MMOs I've played that doesn't just feel like the same basic gameplay as WoW... It feels different on a fundamental level to me, which I like.

Symar-FangofLloth

05-14-2010, 02:59 PM

i never even heard of Toontown Online before...

I have relatives that play it :/ Like, middle-aged relatives.

But looking at the link in the OP, I wouldn't call DDO 3rd most popular or played. Just 2nd most popular among WoW players that got sick of WoW.

KKDragonLord

05-14-2010, 03:04 PM

EDIT:
For mmos only, ddo is at #19 on xfire, behind World of Warcraft, Aion, Guild Wars, Silkroad Online, Eve Online, Runes of Magic, Age of Conan: Hyborian Adventures, The Lord of the Rings Online, Cabal Online: The Revolution of Action, Battle of the Immortals, MapleStory, Metin 2, Atlantica Online, Allods Online, Perfect World, AirRivals, Mabinogi, and Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning. Keep in mind however xfire tracks hours spent in game, not total players.

I don't use xfire and never used it, doesn't it only tracks people who do use it?
Steam would be more reliable for games like counterstrike but how many people acltually use Xfire?

i too would trust a statistical survey more than a launcher program...

Tinrae

05-14-2010, 03:04 PM

That's amazing news, OP! Thanks for sharing.

I'm happy to see this game get love - it's a really good game that more players should try out. ;)

Dylos_Moon

05-14-2010, 03:05 PM

I don't use xfire and never used it, doesn't it only tracks people who do use it?
Steam would be more reliable for games like counterstrike but how many people acltually use Xfire?

i too would trust a statistical survey more than a launcher program...

correct, xfire only tracks those who use xfire, and a big portion of the ddo community does not use xfire.

Memnir

05-14-2010, 03:05 PM

Excellent news. :)

And in scanning the headlines above the Massively article... Conan is putting in offline leveling? /facepalm

ddaedelus

05-14-2010, 03:12 PM

I'd trust the NPD group survey more than I would Xfire...

Agreed. I doubt many DDO players use Xfire or Steam.

KualaBangoDango

05-14-2010, 03:16 PM

Excellent news. :)

And in scanning the headlines above the Massively article... Conan is putting in offline leveling? /facepalmThat's what EVE Online uses and it seems to work well for them so who knows.

ddaedelus

05-14-2010, 03:18 PM

Excellent news. :)

And in scanning the headlines above the Massively article... Conan is putting in offline leveling? /facepalm

It's not "leveling" per se. You aren't going to create a new character, walk away for two years, then login and have him at 80th level. It's an alternate advancement track -- abilities, that sort of thing. It's very slow and more or less a way to reward long term subscribers. Several games do something similar (Eve, as someone else mentioned).

Hambo

05-14-2010, 03:39 PM

The part i kinda liked the most of the report, although its a bit embarrassing, was when it said "while previously DDO languished somewhere below Disney's Toontown Online at 4%", which kinda proves we are on the rise, but at the same time, shows how neglected our MMO has been... i never even heard of Toontown Online before...

Disney actually advertised toontown on all their cable channels. Mercilessly. It was advertised as a "Safe on-line place for your children", if I remember correctly.

[Edit for clarity: I used to watch several animated shows on Disney, and also the vintage shows they used to play... relived my childhood when most people only dreamed of color tv. Saw way too many of these commercials.]

Missing_Minds

05-14-2010, 03:55 PM

The part i kinda liked the most of the report, although its a bit embarrassing, was when it said "while previously DDO languished somewhere below Disney's Toontown Online at 4%", which kinda proves we are on the rise, but at the same time, shows how neglected our MMO has been... i never even heard of Toontown Online before...

It had one tv advertisement... that played over... and over... and over... and over... Long before WoW got a twinkle of T.

Agreed. I doubt many DDO players use Xfire or Steam.

I use both. Xfire REALLY needs to update itself however. And... ugh. over 5.5k hours in ddo alone. sense I started to use xfire.

Jakarr

05-14-2010, 03:57 PM

Third most played MMO of Jan?

No this is a survey on the 3rd most played mmo by ex-wow players.........

Jay203

05-14-2010, 04:04 PM

most played MMO of all time
Facebook!!! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Ranmaru2

05-14-2010, 04:44 PM

I don't use xfire and never used it, doesn't it only tracks people who do use it?
Steam would be more reliable for games like counterstrike but how many people acltually use Xfire?

i too would trust a statistical survey more than a launcher program...

Xfire tracks what games you play and how long you play it as long as you're logged into xfire while playing it, and Xfire is quite useful for ingame communications with friends/clan members. I've used it a couple of times and its pretty nice.

Hafeal

05-14-2010, 04:54 PM

... i never even heard of Toontown Online before...

Ah, no kids, eh? :D

The children of my household love ToonTown - it was mostly the replacement for WebKinz.

They have now also started with Free Realms.

Memnir

05-14-2010, 05:17 PM

That's what EVE Online uses and it seems to work well for them so who knows.
It's not "leveling" per se. You aren't going to create a new character, walk away for two years, then login and have him at 80th level. It's an alternate advancement track -- abilities, that sort of thing. It's very slow and more or less a way to reward long term subscribers. Several games do something similar (Eve, as someone else mentioned).Ah, okay...

I saw it as a desperate attempt at getting people to play AoC. Perhaps I should have tried reading the article as opposed to just knee-jerk reacting to the headline... but nah! What fun would that be? :D

Still seems like a hinky idea to me, but if it works in other games I can see why they'd give 'er a go.

KKDragonLord

05-14-2010, 06:11 PM

Third most played MMO of Jan?

No this is a survey on the 3rd most played mmo by ex-wow players.........

Not really, if you read the thing DDO is the third most played MMO with 8% and the second most played by ex-wow players with 11% of that audience.

btw i did get it wrong, its not for just January 2010 its for the period of jan 2009 to jan 2010.

And Jay203 is right, Farmville has got 70 million players, if we count that social grind as an MMO its certainly the number 1

UndyingLord

05-14-2010, 06:23 PM

Xeraphim

05-14-2010, 07:34 PM

Still #70 according to xfire (however xfire tracks all games not just mmos)
http://www.xfire.com/games/ddo/Dungeons_Dragons_Online_Eberron_Unlimited/

You need to also note that XFire is extremely heavily biased and logs only the reports of Xfire users LOGGED IN, not actual gameplay time between companies. Therefore, your information is not useful as a basis of comparison, sorry :(

Xeraphim

05-14-2010, 07:35 PM

And Jay203 is right, Farmville has got 70 million players, if we count that social grind as an MMO its certainly the number 1

...which tells me that we have a very serious problem with online social networks as a society. It may be as serious as terrorism, but in a clearly different and more long-term damaging way.

Angelus_dead

05-14-2010, 07:57 PM

It's not "leveling" per se. You aren't going to create a new character, walk away for two years, then login and have him at 80th level. It's an alternate advancement track
Wrong. It is exactly "leveling".

You log in, advance to 30 manually, then log off and it precedes to auto-level your character once per four days, which would bring you to 80 in half a year of inaction (as long as you keep the account alive)

Borror0

05-14-2010, 08:05 PM

I saw it as a desperate attempt at getting people to play AoC. Perhaps I should have tried reading the article as opposed to just knee-jerk reacting to the headline... but nah! What fun would that be? :D

Still seems like a hinky idea to me, but if it works in other games I can see why they'd give 'er a go.
You're not the only one. A few people in the blogopshere had a bit of fun with it (http://biobreak.wordpress.com/2010/04/27/age-of-conan-the-future-of-mmorpgs/).

At the beginning, it gives you four level that you give to any of your post-30 characters. Then, every four days for which your account is active it gives you an extra level that you can give to any of your post-30 characters. If you don't use them, they pile up infinitively until you eventually spend them.

It's a weird feature. A lot of people say this is alike EVE's offline skill training, but that is untrue. In EVE, that feature is built so that gaining XP is a consequence to playing rather than the driving goal. That's not what AoC's offline training accomplish. You'll still gain more XP while playing. Also, EVE does not have level or gated content which makes the meaning of gaining levels completely different from in games like DDO, WoW, LOTRO or AoC. And it's not like EVE's skill system is free of criticism (http://tobolds.blogspot.com/2010/04/trying-to-understand-eve-skill-system.html).

KKDragonLord

05-14-2010, 10:48 PM

You're not the only one. A few people in the blogopshere had a bit of fun with it (http://biobreak.wordpress.com/2010/04/27/age-of-conan-the-future-of-mmorpgs/).

At the beginning, it gives you four level that you give to any of your post-30 characters. Then, every four days for which your account is active it gives you an extra level that you can give to any of your post-30 characters. If you don't use them, they pile up infinitively until you eventually spend them.

It's a weird feature. A lot of people say this is alike EVE's offline skill training, but that is untrue. In EVE, that feature is built so that gaining XP is a consequence to playing rather than the driving goal. That's not what AoC's offline training accomplish. You'll still gain more XP while playing. Also, EVE does not have level or gated content which makes the meaning of gaining levels completely different from in games like DDO, WoW, LOTRO or AoC. And it's not like EVE's skill system is free of criticism (http://tobolds.blogspot.com/2010/04/trying-to-understand-eve-skill-system.html).

That was an interesting yet extremely biased rant you pointed to Borror... one of the coments kinda made a bit more sense of it than the even the Massively report where the guy basically just spew forth his opinion on how he hates grinding without actually effectively countering the concerns on the thing...

Funcom basically just figured out a way to make subscribing whether you play only weekends or every night worth it.

It means the more casual players can actually reach max level.

So it’s ironic how everyone and every blog have a topic about “weekend warriors” and how EQ2s latest attempt is not solving any issues for those types of players then Funcom comes with a solution that first BOTH the casual player -and- their own profit margins…and suddenly it’s bad?

I kinda see it that way now, and before i was of the same idea of how absurd this feature seemed to be.
And as another one pointed out, its nothing but a different way of assigning an XP bonus to a character after a downtime, but on a more broad scale and giving you the option on where and how to use that bonus as an instant benefit.

I hardly have the time to play the DDO atm and if VIPs had this feature i could even consider subscribing.... erhm... not. I dont really like skipping any level content, but i see how other people might like it. The point is, since you obviously get more XP by playing, whenever you can play, you will do so, and whenever you can't you will get some points to assign to whatever character you want.

either way, i havent really formed an opinion on this, but it actually might not be as bad as it sounds, xp bonuses and auto levelling with veteran status are already as common as kobolds in the DDO store, they might be on to something with that thing at AoC, who knows? It needs some time and we need the full facts of it to get somewhere on the discussion, simple rants wont cut it.

Dylos_Moon

05-14-2010, 10:55 PM

You need to also note that XFire is extremely heavily biased and logs only the reports of Xfire users LOGGED IN, not actual gameplay time between companies. Therefore, your information is not useful as a basis of comparison, sorry :(

Getting information from the companies themselves, or running any sort of survey is just as biased.

Companies only divulge the information they want to, and random surveys are never truly random. Even if you ask every person who walks into a building - some people will refuse to take the survey, and others will give information you cannot use, others still may lie completely due to their biases.

KKDragonLord

05-14-2010, 11:11 PM

Getting information from the companies themselves, or running any sort of survey is just as biased.

Companies only divulge the information they want to, and random surveys are never truly random. Even if you ask every person who walks into a building - some people will refuse to take the survey, and others will give information you cannot use, others still may lie completely due to their biases.

i wouldnt go that far.

statistical analysis is a very hard thing to do and a pretty evolved methodology, companies all over the world are guided by information such as these and thats why independent research companies like NPD do their best to be acccurate, to sell that information at a premium...

as i said before the Xfire thing would be more reliable if it was something naturally attached to the game instead of an optional manager used by a selective group of players. In counterstrike running Steam is a part of the game if turbine had an integrated manager on installalation of the same sort for its MMOs that tracked that info, then we could take it as fairly reliable but thats just not the case of Xfire.

I'd trust it for Warhammer: Dawn of War measurements but on DDO thats too far a stretch...

TechNoFear

05-15-2010, 01:27 AM

You need to also note that XFire is extremely heavily biased and logs only the reports of Xfire users LOGGED IN, not actual gameplay time between companies. Therefore, your information is not useful as a basis of comparison, sorry :(

Unless XFire offers an advantage to one game over the others (ie more incentive for WoW players to log in than DDO players) then it is a valid source of data. That XFire only samples logged in users is not a statistically significant bias.

XFire also offers a consistent sample of a fairly stable user base.

Statistically I would be more concerned with sample size errors from a survey of 19,000, in comparison to XFire's average of 3,300,000 distinct viewers each month (not page views).

Even if only one percent are of these people use and log in to XFire (and so are recorded), you are still getting nearly twice the sample size of that survey.

I would be interested in exactly (statistical mathematics speaking) why XFire is biased.

Ethias

05-15-2010, 02:04 AM

A couple things:
1) 19,000 is a large sample size and considering this is a professional research firm I wouldn't doubt their findings, but it may only be applicable to the North American gaming market, whereas other methods (aka Xfire) may be worldwide.
2) Xfire likely demonstrates some selection bias as a source, since it requires individuals to keep the client open in order to record information which may favor certain games or gamer types over others. Not saying it does, but it might.

EDIT: also, are the only 2 statistics that Xfire tracks time played per day among all users and number of users that play it per day? Because that is not, as far as I know, what the NPD survey was looking at.

Borror0

05-15-2010, 02:40 AM

Statistically I would be more concerned with sample size errors from a survey of 19,000, in comparison to XFire's average of 3,300,000 distinct viewers each month (not page views).
The margin of error for a sample of 19,000 is statically irrelevant, for as long as the sampling is done properly. As a result, having a sample of 3 million does not represent a greater accuracy. The chances that the poll is accurate are practically equivalent, for as long as the sampling was done properly.

I would be interested in exactly (statistical mathematics speaking) why XFire is biased.
Certain demographics might be more attracted to XFire than others. As a result, the sample might not be a random sample of gamers.

For example, it would be reasonable to assume that XFire contains an unusually high concentration of hardcore gamers and a lesser amount of casual gamer than what would be representative of the population. Since certain games attract more a hardcore audience while other are aimed at casual players, those games' popularity would not be correctly represented by XFire's metrics.

Then, there is the problem of what XFire actually measures: users playing per day and time played per day.

Again, those metrics are slanted toward hardcore gamers. If the game's audience is more casual and play once a week for a few hours, that game will perform more poorly than another game who might have a lower population who play several times a week, several hours per day.

TechNoFear

05-16-2010, 12:06 AM

The margin of error for a sample of 19,000 is statically irrelevant, for as long as the sampling is done properly. As a result, having a sample of 3 million does not represent a greater accuracy. The chances that the poll is accurate are practically equivalent, for as long as the sampling was done properly.

Actually the size of the sample directly relates to statistical 'confidence' (and so a larger sample will typically give more reliable results).

19,000 is a very small percentage of the number of online gamers aged 2+.

XFire has a sample size 170 times that of the survey and has data for each day, not a one off survey including children too young to play many of the games reported on.

Certain demographics might be more attracted to XFire than others. As a result, the sample might not be a random sample of gamers.

The survey was of 18,872 people aged 2+ who played an online game via PC or console in Jan 2010.

The ages sampled in this survey would be a bias, as some gamers are unable to play some games due to age restrictions.

The data was then 'corrected' and weighted to US populations (not world populations).

XFire does not suffer from these biases.

Massively reports an average of 20 hours per week when the actual survey reports 8 hours (up from 7.3 last year). Massively is using parts of the data (selected based on the respondant's age, further reducing the sample size and so increasing the margin of error).

Runescape is reported as the second most popular game (with 1/3 the population of WOW). I did not know 3-4 million people played Runescape (asuming WOW's >10 mill players is accurate). What about Eve or Aion?

Then, there is the problem of what XFire actually measures: users playing per day and time played per day.

Ummm...

The survey was into the number of hours of games played per week on average (and where games were purchased).

Massively interpreted/selectivly sampled other data to get the numbers in their report.

http://www.npd.com/press/releases/press_100302.html

Also check out the demographics for XFire, can you see a bias?

http://www.quantcast.com/xfire.com

Borror0

05-16-2010, 01:03 AM

Actually the size of the sample directly relates to statistical 'confidence' (and so a larger sample will typically give more reliable results).

19,000 is a very small percentage of the number of online gamers aged 2+.
A sample size of 19,000 is actually quite large. Notice that pollsters usually use a sample of "only" 1,000 people for nationwide polls with a total population over 2000 millions (such as approval ratings) and end up with a margin of error of approximatively 4% and the population is smaller in this case.

An increased sample size would increase the accuracy of 0.2% or less, which is significant enough.

The ages sampled in this survey would be a bias, as some gamers are unable to play some games due to age restrictions.
Children are part of the population who can play games. While they can't play all of them, they can (and will) be playing certain games. Excluding them from the survey would be a mistake, as you would discard a part of the population (Americans who play online games).

(not world populations)
NPD's survey is representative of US online gamers, but it's not representative of worldwide online gamers. It never claimed to be either. It's stated very clearly what the population is. On the other XFire is not representative of us nor of worldwide online gamers; it's sample is not done randomly.

Runescape is reported as the second most popular game (with 1/3 the population of WOW). I did not know 3-4 million people played Runescape (asuming WOW's >10 mill players is accurate).
Runescape last reported having over one million subscriber several months ago. It also has a sizable number of F2P players, which is not included in that number. Meanwhile, World of Warcraft had around had 11 million worldwide players at one time (I would assume the number has gone down since WoW is now shut down in China), but only around half of those are in the Western world. Since the survey was US-based, WoW most likely suffers from a relative loss of subscriber since I suspect a percentage part of Runescape's playerbase is US-based.

When you put all of those factors together, it's easy to image how Runescape could end up with one third of WoW's population.

The survey was into the number of hours of games played per week on average (and where games were purchased).
NDP's survey covers more than one gaming-related question each year.

Also check out the demographics for XFire, can you see a bias?

http://www.quantcast.com/xfire.com
That would be hard to say. The only source I know who might have done surveys about gamers' demographics in such depth is NDP, and you're questioning the validity of their surveys! Perhaps certain person ethnicities or age groups are underrepresented. Perhaps certain types of players are underrepresented, too. Who knows.

Look, it's not that hard to understand: the sampling is not random, so it's not reliable.

TechNoFear

05-16-2010, 04:49 AM

An increased sample size would increase the accuracy of 0.2% or less, which is significant enough.

In the US (with a population of 307 mil) we need a sample size of 239,912 to get a 0.2% margin of error (with a confidence level of 95%).

19,000 is 0.65% and 3,300,000 is 0.05% (with a confidence level of 95%).

0.65% appears to be a small error margin but we are dealing with low percentages (multiple MMOs with ~5% +/- 0.65%) which means it is a signifigant enough percentage to possibly change the results.

Also note that you do not have to play an online game to be included in the study (as it was also about buying offline games via a digital DL) further reducing the sample size.

NPD's survey is representative of US online gamers, but it's not representative of worldwide online gamers. It never claimed to be either. It's stated very clearly what the population is.

The Massively article at no point mentions the survey was US or America only.
The Massively article does use 'MMO world' and 'MMO industry' to describe what the survey covers.

The NPD press release does not mention US or America* and NPD sells its services as a global reasearch company in the advertising blurb at the bottom. [*except that the results are scaled to a US average in the fine print].

Nor does it state that it is only US respondents to the online survey.

On the other XFire is not representative of us nor of worldwide online gamers; it's sample is not done randomly.

NPD selects the respondents from 'NPD Consumer Panel members ages 2+' and relies on the accuracy of online surveys.
XFire 'respondents' are from people who have downloaded and continue to use a free app.
Both sets are filtered for online game playing in the required time period, so niether is 'random'.

Either seems a fairly random sample, with differing biases. ie Those responding under parental supervision (2-12) may have reasons not to accurately report data.

However XFire's method of collecting the raw data is much more accurate as it is a empirical measure recorded as it happens, not an estimate from a respondents memory (of the number of hours/week they played each game).

XFire data must be viewed carefully. The resolution in the data is high, due to the realtime sampling. You must be carefule to examine it for other influences (ie downtimes, new content etc). A good example is STO data. It is not valid currently due to a bug/conflict between the game client and XFire (which has only recently been fixed and so has not yet been fully rolled out).

These fluctuations have convinced me (over the last 2-3 years) that XFire is as accurate measure of MMO population as you can find on the 'net.

cupajoe

05-16-2010, 06:54 AM

I agree that xfire has a much larger pool of data. Problem is who uses xfire? I would suggest that a game that doesn't have native voice chat would find many more of its players using an add on like xfire. Because not all players are using it you can't make an informed decision. Now if I knew how many people played each game and then how many of those players used xFire, then I could use the data to make a statement regarding .... but you see if I knew how many players play each game I wouldn't need the xFire data!

Just my 2cp. It is interesting data but its not gonna tell me what players who leave WoW play.

Borror0

05-16-2010, 11:40 AM

Also note that you do not have to play an online game to be included in the study (as it was also about buying offline games via a digital DL) further reducing the sample size.
About 55% of gamers (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6252699.html?sid=6252699&part=rss&subj=6252699) played online games, which brings the margin of error to around 1%.

The NPD press release does not mention US or America
It does so in the methodology. It does not mention it in the press release, but I blame that on American-centrism. The advertising (http://www.npd.com/lps/PDF_SpecialReports/Online_Gaming_2010.pdf) for the survey does so, very clearly, and most likely does so in the survey also. And even if it didn't, that would not render obsolete the accuracy of the poll in regards to the American population.

NPD selects the respondents from 'NPD Consumer Panel members ages 2+' and relies on the accuracy of online surveys.
You're going to say that the methodology chosen by a professional firm is biased, really? It designed to purposefully reduce the amount of bias and be an as accurate representation of the American population as possible. You're stating that, not only it fails at its purpose, but that it creates a new bias. You have no knowledge of their methodology, so how did you conclude they were inexplicably incompetent?

Uska

05-16-2010, 11:49 AM

TechNoFear

05-17-2010, 12:48 AM

You're going to say that the methodology chosen by a professional firm is biased, really? It designed to purposefully reduce the amount of bias and be an as accurate representation of the American population as possible. You're stating that, not only it fails at its purpose, but that it creates a new bias. You have no knowledge of their methodology, so how did you conclude they were inexplicably incompetent?

No I did not. This was in response to your assertion that XFire was not 'random' (and so not valid).

I pointed out that the NPD sample was not 'random' but selected from a limited pool of pre-qualified respondents, that met certain criteria, filtered based on response and scaled to US demographics.

It is still a valid sample, but not 'random' (just as is XFire's). IMO XFire gains accuracy due to the huge sample size (100,000's data points / day).

Sleepingcap

05-17-2010, 01:15 AM

Ethias

05-17-2010, 01:51 AM

Xifre's data collection method is not the end all and be all of reliable "empirical" ranking of MMOs. As has been previously stated, it will favor certain games and certain gamer types. Any survey of "rankings" will have some sort of selection bias, and so too will the NPD survey... but the numbers it reports make sense for my experiences among my group of MMO friends in the US. It's good to see DDO gain more traction, though.

One thing this thread has made me want to do is DL xfire and run it just so DDO will get a bump up when I'm on it. :P Unfortunately, it will never compete with some games just because of the client. Oh well.