New to game; Need advice on multiclassing?

[lewis26794]

I'm currently a Lvl 6 Fighter and I'm a bit curious about multi-classing.
I've been thinking of going Fighter/Cleric so I can heal but I have no idea if this would work or if there's a better option to multiclass into.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

P.S Please don't use technical game speak and/or big acronyms as I'm new to the game and won't know what you're saying. ;D

-Lew

[Tharlak]

The best advice I can give you, as you are new to the game, is don't multiclass... yet.

Multiclassing is powerful and fun but it has to be done right, for the right purpose and is best when planned out before you take even the first level of your character. Otherwise you will probably just gimp your character and be dissatisfied.

Play a pure class character for a while. See what you like, and don't. Figure out what you want to be able to do. Then come back to the forums with a view of what you want to build and folks will help you put something together.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

The best advice I can give you, as you are new to the game, is don't multiclass... yet.

Multiclassing is powerful and fun but it has to be done right, for the right purpose and is best when planned out before you take even the first level of your character. Otherwise you will probably just gimp your character and be dissatisfied.

Play a pure class character for a while. See what you like, and don't. Figure out what you want to be able to do. Then come back to the forums with a view of what you want to build and folks will help you put something together.

What he said.

A good MC is incredibly useful. A bad one... sucks the big one. Its a lot easier to make a bad one. In generally, if you didn't plan a character as MC and figure out how the various aspects and needs of the classes will interact before you even rolled the character, don't do it.

[MithrilSoul]

Another vote here for... "no!"

Like the others said, if you haven't planned exactly what classes you want to combine from the beginning, the odds on being able to pull it off mid-stream are pretty low.

Better to keep your fighter pure for now, and instead look at using another character slot to make up a multiclass character.

[Angelus_dead]

I'm currently a Lvl 6 Fighter and I'm a bit curious about multi-classing.
The key thing to understand about multiclassing is that it means permanently giving up levels in your regular class to get a few levels in another class.


I've been thinking of going Fighter/Cleric so I can heal but I have no idea if this would work
It would not work. If you did it at low level you might temporarily get the illusion that it works, but it really doesn't.

Look at it like this: a level 1-2 Cleric's healing will be useful in level 2-4 dungeons, so something like Fighter2/Cleric2 could work in lev4 quests. But although a Fighter18 may be useful in level 20 dungeons, a the healing spells of a Cleric2 would be insignificant by that point, so Fight18/Cleric2 makes no sense.

The only cases where multiclassing is a reasonable idea is when the lowest few levels of a class grant an ability that remains useful at higher levels. Those are:
Rogue: UMD, Disarm, Evasion, Haste Boost
Monk: Evasion, Unarmed, Bonus Feat, Element Stance
Fighter: Bonus Feat, Haste Boost, Martial
Ranger: Martial, Favored Enemy, Bow Strength, Sprint Boost, sp
Barbarian: Martial, Run speed, PA AP
Paladin: Martial, Charisma Saves, sp
Bard: UMD, Inspire Courage, AA prereq

Notice that Cleric, Wizard, Sorcerer, and Favored Soul do not appear on that list. They grant nothing that remains useful from their first few levels, so you should only take levels in those classes if you're going to have most of your levels in that class.

[Dawnsfire]

I'm currently a Lvl 6 Fighter and I'm a bit curious about multi-classing.
I've been thinking of going Fighter/Cleric so I can heal but I have no idea if this would work or if there's a better option to multiclass into.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

P.S Please don't use technical game speak and/or big acronyms as I'm new to the game and won't know what you're saying. ;D

-Lew

The best advice I can give for multiclassing is to know what you are gaining/losing from each class while planning. I suggest reading this guide (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=203587) before you try. It lays the pros and cons of multiclassing each individual class in detail.

[Ystradmynach]

If you want to be a fighter that heals, best bet is to start out as a halfling and take their healing dragonmark feats. Otherwise, the only multiclass I can think of that could work for a fighter who hasn't planned to multiclassing from the beginning is taking a couple of levels in barbarian, which wouldn't allow you to heal obviously.

As a general rule btw, you should always plan on taking the class with most skill points at first level in a multiclass character (especially if it is rogue). You should also almost never multiclass a full spellcaster like wizards, sorcerers, favored souls or clerics. The only exception you usually see is a rogue 2/wizard 18, and even that is giving up a lot of spell power to be a competent trapsmith with evasion.

[Nezichiend]

The only cases where multiclassing is a reasonable idea is when the lowest few levels of a class grant an ability that remains useful at higher levels. Those are:
Rogue: UMD, Disarm, Evasion, Haste Boost
Monk: Evasion, Unarmed, Bonus Feat, Element Stance
Fighter: Bonus Feat, Haste Boost, Martial
Ranger: Martial, Favored Enemy, Bow Strength, Sprint Boost, sp
Barbarian: Martial, Run speed, PA AP
Paladin: Martial, Charisma Saves, sp
Bard: UMD, Inspire Courage, AA prereq

Notice that Cleric, Wizard, Sorcerer, and Favored Soul do not appear on that list. They grant nothing that remains useful from their first few levels, so you should only take levels in those classes if you're going to have most of your levels in that class.

Fighters also get +1 str at lvl 2.

My cleric took a lvl of Sorcerer and Favoured Soul. 18/1/1. I have some charisma so I get cha -> sp twice, which gives me quite a bit and I only lose on some lvl 9 spells and that wonderful capstone. I would agree mostly with your assessment of multiclassing, but there are times when you could do things you mention do not work.

[Strik3r]

I'm currently a Lvl 6 Fighter and I'm a bit curious about multi-classing.
I've been thinking of going Fighter/Cleric so I can heal but I have no idea if this would work or if there's a better option to multiclass into.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

P.S Please don't use technical game speak and/or big acronyms as I'm new to the game and won't know what you're saying. ;D

-Lew


trust me when i say this....i was a new player once also...when i played my 1st toon i was always imaginig a melee casting arcane spells or self healing melee and all that shiit..bottom line i wanted to role play wit my toon wit crazy ideas...
but on my bro's advice i jus kept on playin pure and now im 20 who does shroud runs regularly and doin other raids when i get the chance..in the end you wil be happy that u didnt mc and gimp ur toon...

mc after u play atleast once to lvl 20 and understand the game then u will be unstopable!!..

[karl_k0ch]

As said before: MC after having started the character is not the best choice in general.

But I want to add something regarding your needs:
Fighter is not the only class where you get useful melee fighters.

A ranger is an extremely versatile combattant. You can play him as a two-weapon-fighting melee who can switch to bows if nessecary. He can use Healing wands from level 1, has some spells (self-buffing from level 4 and healing later on) and can spot hidden doors and traps with spot and search. DPS-wise he is worse than Paladin, Fighter and Barb, but you can use Two Weapon Fighting without the need for 17 Dex, so that you have more points for Str (Damage) and Con (HP).

And: the revisited beginner's path for a Tempest Ranger is already a nice multiclass since there are almost no benefits in taking Ranger 20 in favor to Ranger 18 and two other class levels.

tl;dr: You can have versality without multiclassing.

[sly_1]

The main problem is the way new players approach multiclassing. Thy think, like the op, hmm, it would be swell if i could self heal, so I'll take some cleric with my fighter... Not realizing that 1 cleric lvl adds a tiny bit of sp and a low lvl cure light wounds spell. Nothing that can remotely heal the kind of damage that you will take as you advance in lvls. So yeah, you can heal yourself, even use wands, but endgame, unless you have 18+ cleric lvls, you won't be self healing yourself in raids or endgame quests with your couple of cleric lvls, wands, and a little scrap of sp.

At the end of the day, the only type of noobie friendly multiclassing is melee only multiclassing. so combining fighter, paladin, ranger, rogue, barb, even monk to some degree. Those classes can be mixed and matched in many, many different ways and generally a lot harder to screw up a build with those classes. Only real limitation with those builds is alignment (barb/pally)

Caster classes like cleric, wiz, sorc, and fs, bout 98% of the time you are better off going 18+ levels or none at all. Adding only a level or 2 of any of those classes is a waste, and adding less than 18 lvls is also usually a waste.

If you want to self heal there's a lot of choices beyond screwing up your toon by dipping a couple lvls in cleric on a fighter. for self healing:

paladin
halfling with dragonmarks
cleric
fs
bard
warforged wiz
warforged sorc
any class with massive umd for heal scrolls.

etc.

[lewis26794]

Hey guys, thanks for the all the responses, it's been a great help.

After reading the posts, I have decided I'm gonna keep my fighter pure and I'll keep playing as a pure fighter until I get bored so I can learn more about the game. :D

Quite interested now in maybe looking into a Tempest Ranger and something related to Halflings, but like I said earlier, I don't have a whole lot of experience with the game (about a week and a half! :p) so I'm gonna keep playing on my Fighter for now.

Again, thanks for the help and thanks for stopping me messing up my character (toon?)!

-Lew

[Timjc86]

The best multiclassing advice that I can give is to not do it unless it's thoroughly planned out before the character is even created.

If you just pick and choose levels as you're coming up to grab a benefit you think might be nice, you'll almost always end up with a weak character. I learned this the hard way.

[cdemeritt]

I kinda wished they'd lock multi-classing until you earn 1000 favor.... So many people new to the game want to multi-class, just because they can....

Multi-classing in DDO requires a good understanding of the game mechanics, that take months to learn... Not all classes build together well... very few (even the best multi-class builds) work well when built on a whim... They usually take careful planning to put together properly in order to get the best results.... Whim multiclassing usually ends up with an inferior build, no matter how well the classes blend.... A fighter/Cleric for example, it is unlikely you put the proper amount of Wisdom into your fighter for the cleric levels to be of any use, and if you did, your strength, dex, and con are probably too low for the fighter levels to work well... The downside to multiclassing is that it often takes many levels for the problems to show... My first multi-class experiment was a sorc/fighter... for the low levels, it worked well, but by lvl 8 issues were starting to show, and by lvl 10 it was clear this build was a fail...


The best advice anyone new to the game can get when considering multiclassing is DON'T. If you must do a multiclass build, find one in the forums, these have usually have been built, tried, tweaked, and follow the build exactly... at least until you can "use technical game speak and/or big acronyms as I'm new to the game and... know what you're saying. "

[MithrilSoul]

And for the future, if you want to play a melee character that heals, among the options you could consider:

* pure paladin. They can't heal a lot, but the heals they have (Lay on Hands) are very big, take no SP, and are instant cast.
* pure melee-focused cleric ("battle cleric"). Not uber melee damage but combined with heals & some offensive spells, very effective overall.
* pure favored soul. Never played one but a friend called them "clerics on steroids." Still not exactly sure what that means...
* pure monk. Yes, I know, surprised? Monks can put a debuff on mobs that causes them (the monk) to get healed with every blow they land. Given the speed with which an unarmed monk attacks, this can potentially be extremely powerful. At level 7 they can also go into a meditative stance (Wholeness of Body) which will regen virtually their whole hp bar, as long as they have at least 10 Ki to trigger the ability. Not something they can do in-battle but it's a great way to heal up between battles.

[lord_of_rage]

And for the future, if you want to play a melee character that heals, among the options you could consider:

* pure paladin. They can't heal a lot, but the heals they have (Lay on Hands) are very big, take no SP, and are instant cast.
* pure melee-focused cleric ("battle cleric"). Not uber melee damage but combined with heals & some offensive spells, very effective overall.
* pure favored soul. Never played one but a friend called them "clerics on steroids." Still not exactly sure what that means...
* pure monk. Yes, I know, surprised? Monks can put a debuff on mobs that causes them (the monk) to get healed with every blow they land. Given the speed with which an unarmed monk attacks, this can potentially be extremely powerful. At level 7 they can also go into a meditative stance (Wholeness of Body) which will regen virtually their whole hp bar, as long as they have at least 10 Ki to trigger the ability. Not something they can do in-battle but it's a great way to heal up between battles.

Pure Paladin is good for some self healing via loh but I wouldnt recomend them on the basis of a melee that heals.

What your friend probobly means about FVS is they have huge sp pools. Think of it as a cleric has wizzy like sp and an FVS has sorc like sp. They make great battle healers aswell. Melee based FVS's are awesome if played right but it takes work.

[DoctorWhofan]

If you want to multiclass, play the classes you want to mix as a PURE CLASS for a few levels. use the prebuilt but it is easier to see what you need if you go custom. NEVER DO IT FIRST. Unlike other games where there is a big bandaid over the stats so you have fudging room and can mix it up whatever, you don't have it here. Multiclassing is best PLANNED FROM THE BEGINNING. Realise you are sacrificing something to get something from another class. Understand you MAY be gimpy for awhile (twinking offsets this).

READ the important stats for the classes you are trying out. Synergy is the key to a good mulitclass toon.

READ the forums.

UNDERSTAND how each class works pure first. Understand what is expected and what you can do with the classes BEFORE diving in.

Finally, all us vets have multiclassed with mixed results. We understand the fustration. Please take the good advice people are giving you here and apply it.

[GhoulsTouch]

If you went 18 fighter 1 cleric 1 wizard, you could use every wand in the game almost lol
Self buff your way to freedom.

Or do a pally 18 FS 1 Sorc 1, Heavy sp and the same effect...plus they all share a common stat.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

If you went 18 fighter 1 cleric 1 wizard, you could use every wand in the game almost lol

Or you could go full fighter, not lose bab, and just put skill points into UMD and use every wand in the game.

[GhoulsTouch]

Or you could go full fighter, not lose bab, and just put skill points into UMD and use every wand in the game.

Yeah without intimidate or jump...sounds like a plan, unless you are going to sacrifice attack bonus with melee and range dropping str and dex for int and charisma?

Now that I am thinking about Pal 18/ FS 1/ Sorc 1, I am thinking about making one. I think the perks would outweigh any real loss from it.

[DoctorWhofan]

Yeah without intimidate or jump...sounds like a plan, unless you are going to sacrifice attack bonus with melee and range dropping str and dex for int and charisma?

Now that I am thinking about Pal 18/ FS 1/ Sorc 1, I am thinking about making one. I think the perks would outweigh any real loss from it.

Fighters don't need Intimidate. With only STR and CON to worry about, you can invest a little in INT and maybe CHA to 10 or even 12. Lorien is right about that.

[cdemeritt]

Fighters don't need Intimidate. With only STR and CON to worry about, you can invest a little in INT and maybe CHA to 10 or even 12. Lorien is right about that.


And with a amarth jump clickie, they don't need jump either... for that matter, they rarely need jump in the first place.... Casters often carry it, and if not, a pot works for those rare times it is really needed...

[DoctorWhofan]

And with a amarth jump clickie, they don't need jump either... for that matter, they rarely need jump in the first place....

playing clerics, I value Jump a little more than others...:p Regardless, unless you are turtle up to itimitanking, you don't need it. In fact, it can be bad for DPS's health when trying to manage aggro vs. damage being dealt out.

[GhoulsTouch]

Fighters don't need Intimidate. With only STR and CON to worry about, you can invest a little in INT and maybe CHA to 10 or even 12. Lorien is right about that.

And Dex if they are TWF, or want to be able to range at all.

[DoctorWhofan]

And Dex if they are TWF, or want to be able to range at all.

Why would DEX needed for ranged?

[GhoulsTouch]

playing clerics, I value Jump a little more than others...:p Regardless, unless you are turtle up to itimitanking, you don't need it. In fact, it can be bad for DPS's health when trying to manage aggro vs. damage being dealt out.
Playing a cleric you should know what its like when intimidate isn't being used. You have to juggle your heals, you got people running every which way etc...it makes for more deaths and wipes imo

[GhoulsTouch]

Why would DEX needed for ranged?
Dex contributes your to hit bonus to ranged combat

[DoctorWhofan]

Playing a cleric you should know what its like when intimidate isn't being used. You have to juggle your heals, you got people running every which way etc...it makes for more deaths and wipes imo

Not really. Many people don't use itiminate. What you are discribing is poor playing.


Dex contributes your to hit bonus to ranged combat

True what would a fighter need of that? THey are designed for melee. Sacrifice the ranged bonus and get the CHA for self healing without losing any of the benefits of being a Fighter.

[GhoulsTouch]

Not really. Many people don't use itiminate. What you are discribing is poor playing.



True what would a fighter need of that? THey are designed for melee. Sacrifice the ranged bonus and get the CHA for self healing without losing any of the benefits of being a Fighter.

Some fighters primarily elven and halfling go finesse fighters, others go twf...unless you are going THF or intimitank dex is your friend.

You are missing out on balance,intimidate, jump, etc.

If you wanted to use wands to heal yourself, or get a jump on your UMD because its not cross classed anymore when you MC but your casting levels are lower for scrolls so to use them you do need UMD but less. Taking one level of each arcane and divine will allow you to spend less on UMD in order to use the devices if you even decided to take UMD at all. Plus it allows you to use any arcane or divine wand regardless if you invested into UMD or not.

[cdemeritt]

DoctorWhofan: Don't waste your breath.... Ghoul seems to like arguing with People who have played for a very long time, telling them that everything they have done for years is wrong, and he has the best way.... no matter how many people tell him otherwise... best to just ignore him and move on.

[GhoulsTouch]

DoctorWhofan: Don't waste your breath.... Ghoul seems to like arguing with People who have played for a very long time, telling them that everything they have done for years is wrong, and he has the best way.... no matter how many people tell him otherwise... best to just ignore him and move on.

Who told me otherwise? If you want to use scrolls and wands but dont have enough skillpoints then take an arcane and divine class. Less UMD then goes alot further....true or false? Say you take wizard, how much UMD to cast a 7th level scroll then with one level of wizard?
You can use wands from both without any UMD invested...true or false?
You cant get an old dog to learn new tricks true or false?
?

[DoctorWhofan]

Some fighters primarily elven and halfling go finesse fighters, others go twf...unless you are going THF or intimitank dex is your friend.

You are missing out on balance,intimidate, jump, etc.

If you wanted to use wands to heal yourself, or get a jump on your UMD because its not cross classed anymore when you MC but your casting levels are lower for scrolls so to use them you do need UMD but less. Taking one level of each arcane and divine will allow you to spend less on UMD in order to use the devices if you even decided to take UMD at all. Plus it allows you to use any arcane or divine wand regardless if you invested into UMD or not.

Capstone? It really depends what you can do. There is nothing wrong with having a UMD fighter. THey are not hurting themselves or not missing out anything from the fighter side if they multiclass.

WHile I'll give you Cleric, really if you are going DEX based TWF, take two levels of Ranger. There's your TWF and some bow bonuses. AND your wand whipping. Heck Bard would be awesome too, with the skill points, healing, and song bonus. BUt really, at th end, I have seen many Fighters that are UMD based and they have sacrificed little to gain alot.

[GhoulsTouch]

Having no dex you have no balance...and you want to dump all your skillpoints in UMD?

Here is the thing, if you have some points to throw in UMD but you want to take them further so you can use scrolls etc. taking a level in a caster class will help you.

That is all.

[DoctorWhofan]

DoctorWhofan: Don't waste your breath.... Ghoul seems to like arguing with People who have played for a very long time, telling them that everything they have done for years is wrong, and he has the best way.... no matter how many people tell him otherwise... best to just ignore him and move on.

I see that. While he makes some valid points but he refuses to see the other side. I guess we have no clue.

[DoctorWhofan]

Having no dex you have no balance...and you want to dump all your skillpoints in UMD?

...


...

nevermind.

[Shinigami70601]

The main problem is the way new players approach multiclassing. Thy think, like the op, hmm, it would be swell if i could self heal, so I'll take some cleric with my fighter... Not realizing that 1 cleric lvl adds a tiny bit of sp and a low lvl cure light wounds spell. Nothing that can remotely heal the kind of damage that you will take as you advance in lvls. So yeah, you can heal yourself, even use wands, but endgame, unless you have 18+ cleric lvls, you won't be self healing yourself in raids or endgame quests with your couple of cleric lvls, wands, and a little scrap of sp.

At the end of the day, the only type of noobie friendly multiclassing is melee only multiclassing. so combining fighter, paladin, ranger, rogue, barb, even monk to some degree. Those classes can be mixed and matched in many, many different ways and generally a lot harder to screw up a build with those classes. Only real limitation with those builds is alignment (barb/pally)

Caster classes like cleric, wiz, sorc, and fs, bout 98% of the time you are better off going 18+ levels or none at all. Adding only a level or 2 of any of those classes is a waste, and adding less than 18 lvls is also usually a waste.

If you want to self heal there's a lot of choices beyond screwing up your toon by dipping a couple lvls in cleric on a fighter. for self healing:

paladin
halfling with dragonmarks
cleric
fs
bard
warforged wiz
warforged sorc
any class with massive umd for heal scrolls.

etc.

as a noob im glad i was plannin on 1 maybe 2 lvls of rouge and doing the rest as a fighter then