Headshots: A suggestion

[vettkinn]

Headshot

If a ranged weapon is manually aimed at a target's head and scores a critical hit, the multiplier is increased by 1. This works with bows, crossbows and throwing weapons.

This is totally fix the "Ranged DPS" issue, right comrades? :D





What do you think? :D
(You can also improve my version of the headshot mechanics)

[Visty]

would mean they would have to create hitboxes, so highly doubtable

nice suggestion but doubtable

[Symar-FangofLloth]

In Soviet Stormreach
Head Shoots You!
http://www.ravenmimura.com/images/full/EyeOfFlameBeholder.jpg

[Memnir]

In Soviet Stormreach
Head Shoots You!
http://www.ravenmimura.com/images/full/EyeOfFlameBeholder.jpg
Beat me to it. :)
+ Rep.

Although it would not suprise me if something along these lines - with a ranged-vorpal effect - were to crop up in the Deepwood Sniper line at some point down the line.

[Jendrak]

Sorry but "called shots" were done away with in 3rd edition for good reason.

/not signed

[Xionanx]

Beat me to it. :)
+ Rep.

Although it would not suprise me if something along these lines - with a ranged-vorpal effect - were to crop up in the Deepwood Sniper line at some point down the line.

Aren't they supposed to have a "Heart Seeker" arrow or some such, instantly slaying any "Living" target. Dont own the source books with the Prestige class anymore, but I vaguely recall some archer prestige getting something along those lines.

[Symar-FangofLloth]

No, Deepwood Snipers just wound up with some insanely massive range increment and a True Strike ability. Maybe a couple other things, but that was most of it.

You could hit over a mile away, with the right bow.

[Lorz]

I've been shot across the orchard and also across the desert ... Now that is range! :)

[prowessss]

this is silly. range DPS is fine. it's not supposed to be comparable to melee damage. if anything i think arcane archers have gotten enough love. If archers want to be taken seriously by groups they need to learn their role. Pull things to the tanks. don't kite things away from the DPS. Don't make people chase you. don't over extend your party. Shoot things, if you dont kill it by the time it gets to you, block and take the hits like a man and the melees will thank you. the healers will thank you too. Stop drawing aggro. The only time a ranger is supposed to kite is when the party has wiped and they're carrying all the stones to the shrine. Archers aren't meant to be the DPS. they're not line backers, they're safeties.

I know you've got unlimited arrows but try to hold onto them anyway. Rangers are most useful when they're supplimenting buffs and being there just in case. If you give archers more damage it'll encourage them to kite things and annoy parties.

[DANTEIL]

From the thread title, I though that the OP was going to be about a different kind of headshot:

http://media.ebaumsworld.com/picture/phantomjester/glamourshots.png

[Symar-FangofLloth]

it's not supposed to be comparable to melee damage.

Why not?
I had a friend with an archer in tabletop that, on a good shot, did as much or more damage than the barbarian getting a good round in.

[Waukeen]

no.

http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/2371/yugof.jpg

Its not 1985, no one is buying it anymore.

[prowessss]

Why not?
I had a friend with an archer in tabletop that, on a good shot, did as much or more damage than the barbarian getting a good round in.

Tabletop is always subject to house rules. and DDO's house contains real time combat... if you think archer DPS is broken, go to the pit and try to fight an arcane archer. Fact is an archer gets a lot more free shots than a melee. a melee has to take em to give em. an archer doesn't need to. even spell casters who have multiple ways to 1-shot any character has to resort to power word stun or a Light and Darkness. Close this thread as it has no baring on reality.

[vettkinn]

In Soviet Stormreach
Head Shoots You!
http://www.ravenmimura.com/images/full/EyeOfFlameBeholder.jpg

Lol I never thought of em beholders :D

[Verengor]

A bad idea imo. (Almost) all end game bosses stay more or less at the same position during the fights. Aiming at the head therefore wouldn't really require any skill.

[zealous]

Why stop at the head!
Could have whatever appendix is under your reticule "highlighted" in some non-intrusive way. Then when you launch your attacks it will be aimed att that appendix. Or taking it even further how about being able to target smaller things like eyes or for e.g. monks pressure points.

Ofc, targeting smaller stuff should incur a tohit penalty while keeping it under the reticule for a longer period of time would make for a increased tohit.

Then make mob AC dependant on how varied your attacks are, i.e. if you keep swinging for the head the mob will notice and have a easier time deflecting/avoiding the attack.

Then you could have custom effects attached to different attack points, e.g. piercing to eye=>blindness, blunt to hip=>crippled etc.

Might need some reworking of combat animations to cover the variety of attacks made possible to get matching visuals.

If balanced correctly you could do away with delays between attacks, since you would wan't to aim for at least a while to be able to hit. The attack progression and tohit as well as AC would become more important. Not to mention that you would get true player+build importance being important!

Would it be worth the dev time though?

[vettkinn]

Why stop at the head!
Could have whatever appendix is under your reticule "highlighted" in some non-intrusive way. Then when you launch your attacks it will be aimed att that appendix. Or taking it even further how about being able to target smaller things like eyes or for e.g. monks pressure points.

Ofc, targeting smaller stuff should incur a tohit penalty while keeping it under the reticule for a longer period of time would make for a increased tohit.

Then make mob AC dependant on how varied your attacks are, i.e. if you keep swinging for the head the mob will notice and have a easier time deflecting/avoiding the attack.

Then you could have custom effects attached to different attack points, e.g. piercing to eye=>blindness, blunt to hip=>crippled etc.

Might need some reworking of combat animations to cover the variety of attacks made possible to get matching visuals.

If balanced correctly you could do away with delays between attacks, since you would wan't to aim for at least a while to be able to hit. The attack progression and tohit as well as AC would become more important. Not to mention that you would get true player+build importance being important!

Would it be worth the dev time though?

This will be quite time consuming, comrade, but it will make the game more interesting. But it kinda sounds like Vagrant Story :D

[Aurora1979]

/not signed

Im afraid i dont agree with this my little ruskie antagonist. Bow users should NOT have comparable DPS to melee due to the fact that they stay away from returning damage. A melee has to trade blows to achieve their dps.

Also, if you have called shots for arrows, why not for swords, or axes etc. Then you would be back to square one with both ranged and non being equal.

[Shaftronics]

What, slaying arrow aren't enough?

[Aesop]

While I'm not in favor of this suggestion as is the arguments that Ranged DPS is "more than enough" and "shouldn't equal Melee" and my favorite "aren't in Harms way" are falacious to an extreme.

1. Archers RoA (Rate of Attack for those playing at home) is lower than any other combat form. RoA has a serious and direct impact on DPS.

2. PvP has no place in this discussion as the game is not balanced (and should not be balanced) for PvP.

3. Archers do not stay out of the way of damage nearly to the degree that people seem to assume, especially at high levels where teleporting mobs and high damage casters are involved. The only safety Archers have is against Mobs that have no ranged attaks and those should be fewer in my opinion... likely only animals. Make mobs use their ranged attacks more against Kiting archers or anyone at range in general and you's remove much of the kiting advantage.

4. Ranged combat requires more feat than any other style just to be marginally competative with S&B fighting... which also needs a boost btw, and is less effective in more of the game than S&B is.



Now as for the suggestion, instead I'd perfer some Ranged Tactical abilities.


Ranged Pin: Nail your opponents foot to the ground acting as a single target Web effect.

This holds a target in place and helps reduce the need of Kiting, which seems to be a sticking point still for people out there and makes Archers less than group friendly, so reduce the effectiveness of Kiting by putting a RoA penalty and movement penalty assigned to attacking while moving... Logic behind it would be that it takes concentration to walk and chew bubble gum... er load a bow at the same time and take aim and all that jazz.


Distracting Shot: Imposes a RoA penalty to the target for a short period of time (like 3-6 sec). Against a caster this ability stops them from casting for a short time (like 3-6 sec).

These abilities would have a cool down and DC similar to other tactical abilities that melee have access to.


Aesop

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Sure, as long as its -40 to hit to recognize the rediculously small chance you have of hitting a small target like a head, and a part the body that tends to be in relatively high motion at that, in the middle of combat.